Vinny & Eddie G.--where else would they start?

[MichaelWinicki]

To me this is problem with our offense.

Riddle me this... what others teams in the league could Vinny and Eddie George start for?

Perhaps they could both start for the 0-6 Dolphins but that's about it. I couldn't see either of them starting for Arizona or Tampa Bay or the Raiders. Maybe Vinny could start for Chicago. But the point is we're at the bottom of the barrel when it comes to talent at the two most important positions on the offense and this is where the problem exists.

Yeah Vinny has passed for 40,000+ yards and Eddie has rushed for over 10,000+ yards but what other teams could they start on?

[Portland Fanatic]

To me this is problem with our offense.

Riddle me this... what others teams in the league could Vinny and Eddie George start for?

Perhaps they could both start for the 0-6 Dolphins but that's about it. I couldn't see either of them starting for Arizona or Tampa Bay or the Raiders. Maybe Vinny could start for Chicago. But the point is we're at the bottom of the barrel when it comes to talent at the two most important positions on the offense and this is where the problem exists.

Yeah Vinny has passed for 40,000+ yards and Eddie has rushed for over 10,000+ yards but what other teams could they start on?

Hmmmm...thinking....thinking....I'll get back to ya on that....~finger on chin pondering~...ohhh wait....ahh never mind...~finger back on chin~

[LaTunaNostra]

Agreed, Mikey.

We were just flat out unlucky that our top draft pick got injured, and our starting QB got high again.

Neither of these guys wre expected to start.

Major PROPS to Jerry, Stephen, and Bill for seeing to it we had something plausible behind Julius and Quincy this year.

[Chuck 54]

To me this is problem with our offense.

Riddle me this... what others teams in the league could Vinny and Eddie George start for?

Perhaps they could both start for the 0-6 Dolphins but that's about it. I couldn't see either of them starting for Arizona or Tampa Bay or the Raiders. Maybe Vinny could start for Chicago. But the point is we're at the bottom of the barrel when it comes to talent at the two most important positions on the offense and this is where the problem exists.

Yeah Vinny has passed for 40,000+ yards and Eddie has rushed for over 10,000+ yards but what other teams could they start on?
EG might start somewhere else, probably Miami. Testeverde could start in Chicago, only because of injury (down to Jonathan Quinn)...otherwise they should both be retired or backups by now.

Vinny played like a backup even when he was a starter....he's never been more than an average QB with an above average arm, imo.

[Danny White]

To me this is problem with our offense.

Riddle me this... what others teams in the league could Vinny and Eddie George start for?

Perhaps they could both start for the 0-6 Dolphins but that's about it. I couldn't see either of them starting for Arizona or Tampa Bay or the Raiders. Maybe Vinny could start for Chicago. But the point is we're at the bottom of the barrel when it comes to talent at the two most important positions on the offense and this is where the problem exists.

Yeah Vinny has passed for 40,000+ yards and Eddie has rushed for over 10,000+ yards but what other teams could they start on?

Vinny could start several places... Eddie, not so much.

Vinny might not start in some places due to politics, but I think he's as good or better than the QBs in: Washington, Oakland, Cleveland, Miami, Chicago, Detroit, Arizona, San Fran, Denver, Baltimore. There's probably one or two more.

[Skeptic]

Philadelphia....neither westbrook or Levens are better.

Chicago........I'd say better than the A-train at this point, certainly more consistent.

Tampa Bay

Arizona....toss up, but I would say that Eddie and Emmitt would have a hell of a competition for the starting job.

Miami.....duh.

Cincinatti...Rudi hasn't done squat...Eddie might be starting.

Houston

Oakland

-----He's really not that bad. I think we need to be giving him more carries, honestly. Eddie gets better as the game goes on and Bill apparently doesn't want to play Lee for whatever reason.

[MichaelWinicki]

Vinny could start several places... Eddie, not so much.

Vinny might not start in some places due to politics, but I think he's as good or better than the QBs in: Washington, Oakland, Cleveland, Miami, Chicago, Detroit, Arizona, San Fran, Denver, Baltimore. There's probably one or two more.


No way does Vinny beat out Collins in Oakland, Brunnell/Ramsey in Washington, Garcia in Cleveland, Harrington in Detroit, Rattay in SF, Plummer in Denver. No way.

[wileedog]

Both could have started on our team last season.

I feel very sad all of a sudden.....

[Chuck 54]

Vinny could start several places... Eddie, not so much.

Vinny might not start in some places due to politics, but I think he's as good or better than the QBs in: Washington, Oakland, Cleveland, Miami, Chicago, Detroit, Arizona, San Fran, Denver, Baltimore. There's probably one or two more.
omg...huge difference of opinion here....I'd take the QB's in every city on that list except for Chicago, and that's only because Grossman is injured.

Vinny would never start over Brunell or Ramsey if they were here, Garcia? Harrington? McCown? Ratae is a great promising young player putting up big numbers on a lousy team? Plummer???? Boller????

Wow....I'm shocked that anyone has that high an opinion of Vinny...doesn't make me right or you wrong, but I'd trade Vinny and a draft pick for Boller, Ramsey, or Ratae (sp)....we have a decent OL, great WR's who are playing well, and a good TE, yet Vinny isn't even smelling the top eschellon of the NFC QB ratings....he's awful, even for an old guy.

[MichaelWinicki]

Both could have started on our team last season.

I feel very sad all of a sudden.....


LOL!

:D

[Chuck 54]

No way does Vinny beat out Collins in Oakland, Brunnell/Ramsey in Washington, Garcia in Cleveland, Harrington in Detroit, Rattay in SF, Plummer in Denver. No way.
I"m with you MW>...absolutely shocking that anyone could rate Vinny that highly.

[Chuck 54]

Philadelphia....neither westbrook or Levens are better.

.
:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:
<speechless>

[Skeptic]

I"m with you MW>...absolutely shocking that anyone could rate Vinny that highly.
He could probably beat out Rattay.

[MichaelWinicki]

He could probably beat out Rattay.

And even if he does what does that change? We're still in the out-house as far as talent goes at our two most critial offensive positions. It's difficult enough to compete if you are substandard in one of those spots but to be so poor at both and you've pretty much sealed your fate IMHO.

[Chuck 54]

He could probably beat out Rattay.
Have you seen what Rattay is doing in SF????

I don't think they'd trade him right now for more than 5-6 QB's in the league...this guy is playing like a star.

[MichaelWinicki]

Have you seen what Rattay is doing in SF????

I don't think they'd trade him right now for more than 5-6 QB's in the league...this guy is playing like a star.


Wayne, I don't think some folks can take off the rose-colored glasses to see what we really have here. And as Jerruh says, "This dog won't hunt".

[Dye]

vinny can probably start for a local high school here, while george has the making for a good fullback. i hear the city of los angeles is forming a team and are accepting applications. actually, there's a local deli here that needs a runner and...

in all seriousness, vinny and george are good serviceable backups. in the starting lineup capacity, i doubt they'd be able to make much contribution. closest team that could use these guys would be miami.

[LaTunaNostra]

Gee, a thread proving that two guys slated to be our backups, but who are starting because of the physical injury and moral turpitude of JJ and Q, couldn't start many places.

Congratulations.

[MichaelWinicki]

Gee, a thread proving that two guys slated to be our backups, but who are starting because of the physical injury and moral turpitude of JJ and Q, couldn't start many places.

Congratulations.

You're more than welcome for that kick to my groin B.! LOL!

I know what you're saying Barb and point of me starting this thread wasn't to prove the obvious at least to those like yourself that already know the obvious but to those that wonder "why" we are struggling on offense and hoping some magic elixir is spilled on the team and it magically cranks out 30ppg. The fact is it won't. It's not capable.

But I'm still surprised at the folks that don't realize how bad of shape we are at this point.

[wileedog]

You're more than welcome for that kick to my groin B.! LOL!

But I'm still surprised at the folks that don't realize how bad of shape we are at this point.

When's the last time we were in good shape offensively?

Seriously, I really do think there is reason for hope here. Glenn, Key and Whitten are some of the best targets we've had to throw to in ages. The O-line is playing better - heck I'l go so far as to say much better than the last 3 injury plagued years. Those two areas alone make us a better offensive team.

Vinny isn't doing anything wrong that Quincy wouldn't have, and doing some things better.

So it comes down to RB. Richie has looked pretty good. Lee has looked pretty good. George has looked nothing worse than T-Ham last year (ok, not saying much).

Point is I think this team is further along offensively than we are giving credit. We are putting up 355 yds/game - 11th in the NFL. Not something to brag about, but not time to jump off a bridge either.

It all comes down to scoring points, and we haven't been doing that due to dumb penalties and turnovers. If we cut those down, this is a real honest to goodness middle of the pack offensive team for the first time in 6 or 7 years (notice I didn't say good).

Put Lee in for an extended look, cut down the penalties and mistakes and I think we would be surprised with the results. Maybe not 30ppg, but certainly a lot better than 17.

[LaTunaNostra]

But I'm still surprised at the folks that don't realize how bad of shape we are at this point.

We're in bad shape and we all know it.

But imo, Vinnie and Eddie aren't a whole lot more problematical than Quincy and Tham were last year.

[DipChit]

The simple answer is pretty much the same number of teams that Q and T-Ham could've/would've started for last year. As in none.

And I dont happen to wholeheartedly agree that the only reason these 2 here now are starting is because of injury and morality issues. Q is not a decidedly better QB than Vinny by any stretch. More elusive yes, but not better at somewhat important things like, oh I dont know, passing perhaps. I'm not saying it was a lock that VT would start, I'm just saying it could've went either way.

And I dont have any reason to believe that JJ would be starting over EG if he were healthy. Getting some PT sure, but starting.. not necessarily (just because of the way Bill sometimes "is").

The bottomline is while the first 2 were young they werent much good to begin with and the last 2 are simply over the hill. Either way we're totally mediocre on offense because of it. And when you're that way it simply comes down to the luck of the draw. Early on last year we played a number of teams that happened to be as lacklaster on O at the time we played them as we were. Actually even worse than us. The Jets, Zona, Buffalo, Skins, even the Eagles in that first game. Just so happens that this time around more O's than not that we're playing against happen to be clicking pretty good at the time we're playing them. If we could've held 3 or 4 teams to under 10 points like we did last year we wouldnt be under .500 this year either.

[Danny White]

No way does Vinny beat out Collins in Oakland, Brunnell/Ramsey in Washington, Garcia in Cleveland, Harrington in Detroit, Rattay in SF, Plummer in Denver. No way.

For the most part, I'm playing devil's advocate... and certainly trying to make the best out of our current situation.

But defending myself a little bit... I didn't say that I think he'd "beat out" any of those guys. To the contrary... I think in the reality of the NFL I doubt if he'd beat out any of them if he were traded to them today.

I also didn't say I wouldn't take any of these younger guys instead of Vinny. I would take him over Brunell in a second, however, without a doubt.

What I did say is that I thought now, in the present, not taking the future or potential into consideration, I thought he was "as good or better" than these quarterbacks. And for the most part I stand by that.

I'm not sure about Rattay... I haven't been following him that closely to be honest.

I think Plummer is a horrible quarterback, and I'd hate it if he was on the Cowboys. It's probably personal. But I never see him winning anything in his career.

I wanted Collins earlier this year, but he's playing terribly now, much worse than Vinny.

Brunell is gawd-awful... you can't honestly say you'd rather have him than Vinny. His only redeeming value is that he's possibly better than Ramsey.

I think Vinny and Garcia are equally average now at this point in their careers.

I might be off on Harrington... it isn't his fault he's in Detroit. He seems like a nice kid.

Bottom line, I don't think Vinny is the worst starting QB in the league. Given his age, I'd probably go with you on trading him for some of these younger QBs depending on how high of a draft pick you were thinking of including. But I don't think he deserves the abuse he's getting... now Eddie George on the other hand! :D

[TheHustler]

Agreed, Mikey.

We were just flat out unlucky that our top draft pick got injured, and our starting QB got high again.

Neither of these guys wre expected to start.

Major PROPS to Jerry, Stephen, and Bill for seeing to it we had something plausible behind Julius and Quincy this year.

Completely agree LTN. It's not like BP and JJ planned on going into year with Vinny and EG as the QB and RB. QC and Julius were supposed to fill those roles. But, people will continue to bash BP and JJ for QC getting high and Julius getting injured.

[TheHustler]

For the most part, I'm playing devil's advocate... and certainly trying to make the best out of our current situation.

But defending myself a little bit... I didn't say that I think he'd "beat out" any of those guys. To the contrary... I think in the reality of the NFL I doubt if he'd beat out any of them if he were traded to them today.

I also didn't say I wouldn't take any of these younger guys instead of Vinny. I would take him over Brunell in a second, however, without a doubt.

What I did say is that I thought now, in the present, not taking the future or potential into consideration, I thought he was "as good or better" than these quarterbacks. And for the most part I stand by that.

I'm not sure about Rattay... I haven't been following him that closely to be honest.

I think Plummer is a horrible quarterback, and I'd hate it if he was on the Cowboys. It's probably personal. But I never see him winning anything in his career.

I wanted Collins earlier this year, but he's playing terribly now, much worse than Vinny.

Brunell is gawd-awful... you can't honestly say you'd rather have him than Vinny. His only redeeming value is that he's possibly better than Ramsey.

I think Vinny and Garcia are equally average now at this point in their careers.

I might be off on Harrington... it isn't his fault he's in Detroit. He seems like a nice kid.

Bottom line, I don't think Vinny is the worst starting QB in the league. Given his age, I'd probably go with you on trading him for some of these younger QBs depending on how high of a draft pick you were thinking of including. But I don't think he deserves the abuse he's getting... now Eddie George on the other hand! :D

Rattay is playing well, as is Plummer (when he isn't trying to ambidextrous). Harrington is playing well too, he and Roy Williams are going to be a good tandem for the next 10 years.

[SkinsandTerps]

Vinny could probably start in Buffalo the way Bledsoe has been stinking up the joint for the past two years.

Tampa,

Chicago because of injury,

Miami because all of their QBs suck. But because of their terrible O-Line Vinny wouldnt look any better except on the hot routes. ,

And thats about it as far as I am concerned.

Eddie ? Miami, Tampa, Thats about it since Stephen Davis is back in Carolina.

[ibis]

To me this is problem with our offense.

Riddle me this... what others teams in the league could Vinny and Eddie George start for?

Perhaps they could both start for the 0-6 Dolphins but that's about it. I couldn't see either of them starting for Arizona or Tampa Bay or the Raiders. Maybe Vinny could start for Chicago. But the point is we're at the bottom of the barrel when it comes to talent at the two most important positions on the offense and this is where the problem exists.

Yeah Vinny has passed for 40,000+ yards and Eddie has rushed for over 10,000+ yards but what other teams could they start on?..one fluke play aside and Dallas is 3 & 2...George is washed up and Vinny's QB rating is 83...to put them in the same sentence is silly...listen,I'm from South Florida and I know next to nothing about Dallas...you guys had 15,000 Steeler fans at your stadium...you ain't Miami or LA where the transplants come to visit the team(s) of their youth...Vinny couldn't start anywhere because of his age...but,and this is a big but...he's given you 1301 yards thru 5 games...you want a fall guy............how about the guy with the muscrat on his head...the other JJ...the real one chills in the Keys...had put together a team that will come out of the season with 8 to 10 wins...my guess closeer to eight....and if you think Henson is the answer...8 collegiate starts and a couple of years flailing at curveballs...you're nuts...

[Chuck 54]

You're more than welcome for that kick to my groin B.! LOL!

I know what you're saying Barb and point of me starting this thread wasn't to prove the obvious at least to those like yourself that already know the obvious but to those that wonder "why" we are struggling on offense and hoping some magic elixir is spilled on the team and it magically cranks out 30ppg. The fact is it won't. It's not capable.

But I'm still surprised at the folks that don't realize how bad of shape we are at this point.
all she has to do is read a few replies before this one to see how crazy it is around here....EG better than westbrook? Vinny better than 1/2 the QB's in the nfc? insanity.

[Chuck 54]

We're in bad shape and we all know it.

But imo, Vinnie and Eddie aren't a whole lot more problematical than Quincy and Tham were last year.
and if that's true, why didn't BP do something about it?

[Chuck 54]

Vinny could probably start in Buffalo the way Bledsoe has been stinking up the joint for the past two years.

Tampa,

Chicago because of injury,

Miami because all of their QBs suck. But because of their terrible O-Line Vinny wouldnt look any better except on the hot routes. ,

And thats about it as far as I am concerned.

Eddie ? Miami, Tampa, Thats about it since Stephen Davis is back in Carolina.
no way Vinny could start in Tampa...Chris Simms would be starting here right now, imo.

[AdamJT13]

If Vinny was a 27-year-old quarterback playing exactly the way he's been playing, he'd start for quite a few teams. The fact that he's 40 is why most teams wouldn't start him, but he has outplayed the quarterbacks in Cleveland, Tampa Bay, Arizona, Baltimore, Miami, Chicago, Washington, Tennessee, Oakland, Carolina and Cincinnati.

[LaTunaNostra]

and if that's true, why didn't BP do something about it?
He DID do something about it.

He drafted a running back, who later got hurt.

He expected like many of us, that the problematical Carter would be better the second year in the system, with a possession receiver in Key. He expected the greater depth and more expericene on the line to help Q too. And JJ to make it an easer bus to drive. He also signed Henson and brought in VT to push Carter. Then Q screwed up.

Now the backups aren't playing like starters. Wow, what a surprise.

I've seen HCs blasted before for not having experienced backups behind the starters, but NEVER seen so much crap thrown at an HC who had experienced backups in place, but lost his starters thru no fault of his wwn.

[Hostile]

If Vinny was a 27-year-old quarterback playing exactly the way he's been playing, he'd start for quite a few teams. The fact that he's 40 is why most teams wouldn't start him, but he has outplayed the quarterbacks in Cleveland, Tampa Bay, Arizona, Baltimore, Miami, Chicago, Washington, Tennessee, Oakland, Carolina and Cincinnati.
While I agree with you that he has outplayed those QBs I seriously doubt he'd start over a couple of them if he was 27. Steve McNair in particular.

[dbair1967]

To me this is problem with our offense.

Riddle me this... what others teams in the league could Vinny and Eddie George start for?

Perhaps they could both start for the 0-6 Dolphins but that's about it. I couldn't see either of them starting for Arizona or Tampa Bay or the Raiders. Maybe Vinny could start for Chicago. But the point is we're at the bottom of the barrel when it comes to talent at the two most important positions on the offense and this is where the problem exists.

Yeah Vinny has passed for 40,000+ yards and Eddie has rushed for over 10,000+ yards but what other teams could they start on?

not sure where George could start and he shouldnt be starting here either, but I think Vinny is playing better than a handful of NFL starters elsewhere...you mentioned Oakland, but Kerry Collins has been absolutely AWFUL...I'd think Norv would be beside himelf to trade Collins for Testaverde...Vinny would definitely be an upgrade in Miami...I think he'd be an upgrade in Baltimore...Vinny is clearly outplaying Bledsoe in Buffalo...Vinny is better right now than Garcia is....in the NFC Vinny would be better than Mark Brunell in Washington...Chicago would probably kill for Vinny over what they have now...arguably Vinny would start (if he had a fair shake) over 6 or 7 other QB's in the NFL right now...

David

[Danny White]

If Vinny was a 27-year-old quarterback playing exactly the way he's been playing, he'd start for quite a few teams. The fact that he's 40 is why most teams wouldn't start him, but he has outplayed the quarterbacks in Cleveland, Tampa Bay, Arizona, Baltimore, Miami, Chicago, Washington, Tennessee, Oakland, Carolina and Cincinnati.

That's all I was trying to say. :)

[The Major]

Hello All,

To begin with, I`ll point out that most of the Cowboys off. has come courtesy of VT`s arm!

He`s also playing on a Cowboy team which hasn`t played that well most of the season, although they`ve slowly been improving overall and probably had their best game so far against the Steelers. Thus, among other things, the coaching has been very questionable. For ex., against the Giants, they suddenly decided to almost stop passing early in the game, despite the fact VT was looking good up to that point! One reason the passing game was working is because the Cowboys had established a good mix of runs and passes. Even the announcers mentioned this before the Cowboys suddenly decided to almost run the ball all the time, ruining that great run/pass mix! There`s also been some very questionable calls on 4th downs, etc., etc., etc. All the STUPID penalties and mistakes are also a sign of the coaching.

VT`s also had no running game most of this season while the Cowboys have had a tough schedule, facing teams with a great combined W-L record. The def. has also been HORRIBLE too many times against both the run and pass, giving up HUGE plays at the absolute worst times.

And, yet, playing in the middle of ALL this, VT and the Cowboys are just 1 FLUKISH, FREAKISH play away from being 3-2!!! For that matter, against the Giants, if the Cowboys hadn`t abandoned the good passing game and good mix of run/pass almost completely, which vaulted them to a 10-3 lead on VT`s perfectly-thrown TD pass, they could quite possibly be 4-1!!!

While playing a tough schedule with no running game and the team not playing well, etc., etc., etc., VT`s thrown 5 TD passes and 4 picks. He`s got a good QB rating in the low 80`s! But if not for only 1 HORRIBLE qt. where VT threw 3 picks, the nos. would be much more indicative of how he`s really played. In other words, for 19 out of 20 qts., VT has 5 TD passes and only 1 pick and a QB rating up around the 100 mark!!! He`s often resembled his 98 form in doing so! Thus, this shows that VT`s played very well most of this season!!!

The Cowboys would also be scoring much more except for ALL the STUPID penalties and mistakes, etc., stopping potential, promising scoring drives!

It`s clear that since VT`s playing well as shown above on a team with no running game, with a TERRIBLE injury-riddled def., with questionable play-calling, with questionable game-planning, with questionable adjustments, with questionable coaching overall, etc., etc., etc., much of the time, he could play well enough to start for at least half the teams in the NFL right now!!!

I`ll save my comments on EG for later.

[MichaelWinicki]

He DID do something about it.

He drafted a running back, who later got hurt.

He expected like many of us, that the problematical Carter would be better the second year in the system, with a possession receiver in Key. He expected the greater depth and more expericene on the line to help Q too. And JJ to make it an easer bus to drive. He also signed Henson and brought in VT to push Carter. Then Q screwed up.

Now the backups aren't playing like starters. Wow, what a surprise.

I've seen HCs blasted before for not having experienced backups behind the starters, but NEVER seen so much crap thrown at an HC who had experienced backups in place, but lost his starters thru no fault of his wwn.


B. I'll grant you the Vinny argument. That is legit. But Eddie George was treated as the defacto starter the moment his plane landed in Dallas. At no point were we given any indication that Julius Jones would be given the bulk of the carries, not to even mention being in the starting lineup.

[Clay_Allison]

OK, I want to make it clear that there is a big difference between COULD start and WOULD. What I mean by that is some places he would give the team the best chance to win on Sunday, but other teams have different situations. They want to evaluate, to give the young guy experience, etc.

Vinny:

OK, to start with I WOULD say Cincinatti, but I would put Kitna at least Equal to Vinny. So if all things were equal for going with your best guy, I can't say Vinny would definitely start over Kitna.

So:

Chicago. They seem to be a repository for former Cowboys anyway. Quinn, (remember him?), Hutch and the legendary Krentzel.

Arizona: McCown is an even split for TD/INT ratio, Vinny is one up with 2 more TDs with a passer rating in the low 80s rather than the high 70s.

Dolphins: DUH!

Ravens: Boller has performed abysmally, partially due to poor protection and few targets, Testaverde has performed far better without the benefit of a Jamal Lewis.

Redskins: Brunell has performed poorly, despite at least equal recievers and Clinton Portis. He has posted a QB rating just under 70, with awful yards per completion and completion percentage.

George:

Miami: maybe

To be fair here, I think if JJ were not hurt he would be starting by now.

[The Curly One]

They decided to go with Vinny as the starter, drugs and attitude may have played a part in that decision.
While I do not think Vinny is a big step in the wrong direction I do think it was a mistake.
Eddie George and Larry allen on the other hand will both be in the Hall of Fame but I do not think that any other team would pick them up or start them. You can rave about how great they were and nobody can argue that fact, but lets talk about their performance the last few years.
I think that Larry Allen, Viiny and Eddie Geoge could not be a starter on any other team in the league right now. Curly

[LaTunaNostra]

B. I'll grant you the Vinny argument. That is legit. But Eddie George was treated as the defacto starter the moment his plane landed in Dallas. At no point were we given any indication that Julius Jones would be given the bulk of the carries, not to even mention being in the starting lineup.
Mickey Spagnola just said on the radio that "Eddie George was brought in to be no more than an insurance policy, that unfortunately had to be cashed in when Jones got hurt".

I disagree EG wa ever treated like a "defacto starter". As a proven vet he was treated with the respect his past performance earned him, but in no way was it ever promised or hinted he would be the feature back here, or that he would even be the chief component in the rb by committee. George himself made gracious gestures re "his role".

Bill was saying since last January he was probably going to have to go with the committee approach. But Jones was dratfed to be the FEATURE back. Was he annointed starter? No. But Curtis Martin in NE under Bill wasn't either. Rookies have to prove themselves, and Bill gave JJ the same "treatment" he did Cumar. The injuries (plural) got in JJ's way, not the performance. I have no doubt he'd be getting the lion's share of the carries by now were he healthy.

No way was Eddie brought in to start, no way. He was brought in to be insurance for JJ and fill the Bickerstaff role.

[Clay_Allison]

They decided to go with Vinny as the starter, drugs and attitude may have played a part in that decision.
While I do not think Vinny is a big step in the wrong direction I do think it was a mistake.
Eddie George and Larry allen on the other hand will both be in the Hall of Fame but I do not think that any other team would pick them up or start them. You can rave about how great they were and nobody can argue that fact, but lets talk about their performance the last few years.
I think that Larry Allen, Viiny and Eddie Geoge could not be a starter on any other team in the league right now. Curly

Larry Allen? Stop watching film of last year. He is better than the best single guard on 75% of the teams in the NFL, you want Linemen to blame, blame the still-crumbling right-side of the line. Gurode's been hurt on and off, and Tucker has not been stellar. I really want to see what Jacobs can do soon, if that means that Vollers will have to be inactive despite Parcells wish to have him as a backup at Talkle and guard, so be it.

[The Curly One]

We are not as good as last year any way you look at it. On offense or defense.
I do not feel that many of the changes made were improvements.
I stand by my statement that EG and LA will be Hall of Famers and niether one could start on any other team in the league right now.
I do agree with you on one point, the offensive line has some good young talent and I feel they could be a good line possibly as soon as next year. Curly

[AdamJT13]

While I agree with you that he has outplayed those QBs I seriously doubt he'd start over a couple of them if he was 27. Steve McNair in particular.

I didn't say that, I just said he was outplaying him/them so far this season. McNair is on pace for the worst year of his career.

[AdamJT13]

I stand by my statement that EG and LA will be Hall of Famers and niether one could start on any other team in the league right now.


It must be awfully lonely standing there all by yourself. Larry Allen would start for almost every other team, let alone ONE.

[BUSDRIV3RDH]

I thinik EG could very well start on many teams, but I don't think that about Vinny.

EG is going to get 1000 yards this season and probably finish in the top 10, atleast 15, backs, production wise this year. The guy is not as washed up as most of you think. Sure he's not going to bust the big one, but he's a good 50-75yd a game back for us {more if we wanted}.

Now the difference between Vinny and EG that separates them and allows one to start and one to sit the pine for every other team is "winning". Vinny is a chronic loser whereas Eddie is a RB from a long time winning team {Titans}.

Now the sad thing, the 2nd or 3rd losingest QB in NFL HISTORY, is the guy that is able to get the ball into the endzone the most for us. How many of yall want to stick that gun in your mouths now and pull the triggers?

THE DALLAS COWBOYS proud & established NFL Retirement home since 2004.

[LaTunaNostra]

team {Titans}.

Now the sad thing, the 2nd or 3rd losingest QB in NFL HISTORY, is the guy that is able to get the ball into the endzone the most for us. How many of yall want to stick that gun in your mouths now and pull the triggers?


I could :D be wrong, but I think VT recently passed Fran Tarkenton as the all time loss leader. That makes him THE losingest QB in NFL history.

You may now commence firing.

But I'll wait it out, once again, as a young QB gets ready to replace him, and VT goes back to mentoring/backing up. I'll also be thankful his brief tenure as starter was the usual hard-working and team-building act you can expect from this true professional.

[AJM1613]

Philadelphia....neither westbrook or Levens are better.


... :rolleyes:

Never actually saw a football game, did ya?

[TheSkaven]

Philadelphia....neither westbrook or Levens are better
Uh.. you will find no greater Eagles hater than I (note the avatar) but Westbrook is a top 10 back in this league and, well, Eddie isn't.