It's time to draft some franchise offensive players - Offense wins in parity!

[TruBlueCowboy]

I realize the defense lost the game today but frankly, I don't think this offense is much better than last year's offense. The only difference between a game like this one last year and this year was we probably would have been shut out 41-20 but had about 150 less yards. :rolleyes: Our "new offense" moves the ball but they still can't make the big plays and fall apart in the red zone. And we still can't run the freaking ball!

It's time to stop relying on our defense to win these games. Any team in the age of parity with a great offense can get in the Playoffs. Defenses are so crippled by the strict rules these days, that it's an offensive party in the NFL. Look what one great quarterback in Boston did. Look at offensively powered Minnesota with a great record even though it has a poor defense. Look what Indy does ever year with a questionable defense. Look at Kansas City last year and its turnaround to make a run for the Playoffs this year after a slow start even though their defense is absolutely horrible. Look at Green Bay turning around their season because of that high powered offense. Look what one spectacular receiver in Philly did even though they can't stop the run. The Rams are always a threat in this league even with big defensive problems almost every year. As long as they have that high powered passing game, they can beat you any day of the week.

It's an offensive game now! Offenses win championships now. A great defense helps but you can overcome a lot with a high powered offense. Jerry Jones is so intent on bargain shopping at our skilled offensive positions that he forgets where all the Triplets were originally picked. They were all first round picks with Aikman a #1 overall and Irvin pretty high as well.

While we've been trying to go the bargain route with baseball players at QB, we've missed Byron Leftwich and Ben Roethlisberger. Instead of grooming a replacement for Emmitt (guys like Clinton Portis, DeShaun Foster, and Travis Henry were all available after the 1st round in Emmitt's last years) we waited until the last minute and were stuck with Hambrick. We got cute in the draft his year instead of picking the best running back on the board and only because Buffalo is falling apart will that not bite us in the arse. We stuck with the steadier Greg Ellis instead of drafting Randy Moss.

It's time to rebuild this freaking offense! Every year this offense stinks and we have to count on our defense to save the day. There's no excuse for the way our defense has played this year but this team was never built to be a high scoring unit with older slower guys like Eddie George, Keyshawn Johnson and Vinny Testaverde. Parcells and Jones knew what might happen if the defense couldn't hold.

I say both of those first round picks next year go to offensive players. Forget Julius or Henson, if there is a great QB or RB on the board, pick him! And don't be bashful about Mike Williams or another top ten receiver even though we already have Glenn and Keyshawn. If you have a good offense in today's NFL, you are always in the game! Nuff said.

[Eskimo]

The Packers scored in 7 consecutive possessions. A rookie QB completed over 80% of his passes the week before that. Culpepper threw 5 TDs in the season opener.

This defense is horifically bad. They don't even give us a chance against a quality opponent. The sad part is there are no good young players on it. RoyW has been playing avg. TNew has been absolutely pathetic the last two weeks. All the others are just solid or below avg vets who give what they've got.

We've got some potential to get better on O with Henson, Jones, Lee and Witten. Even Morgan looked good before he pulled his hammy. Keyshawn and Glenn still are effective players in this leage. The OL is solid on the pass protection front and should improve as run blockers as the season goes on. I really think most of the pieces are in place. The one thing we do need is a true #1 WR.

The defense is another story. If T-New and RW don't get their heads in the game, we have no real building blocks for the future. Both have not looked like stars of the future lately. For all the flack TNew gets, when was the last time RW forced a turnover?

We need to spend the offseason upgrading the D big-time. At least two high profile front 7 players in FA (Rodgers and Abraham would be nice), and two of our first 3 draft picks need to be spent there. We also should part ways with Zimmer because he cannot get this D to take the next step and regularly gets abused by quality opponents. In fact, I think the whole defensive coaching staff should be let go at the end of the season.

[Hostile]

Both sides of the ball need addressing.

One more thing. If I hear anything about Special Teams in the late rounds in the 2005 draft and/or guys needing to contribute on them to make the team, I will need to be bailed out of jail.

[4lifecowboy]

While I fully back taking Mike Williams with our fist pick, I wouldn't be up set if the remainder of the picks were spend on the other side of the ball. Our D is woeful, our secondary is young and unproven, and more important then that the front seven aren't getting pressure nor are they effectively stopping the run.

If we could some how land Rodgers, Abraham, and a back-up plan at RB in free agency. Then Williams, Johnson, and a defensive back (corner or safety) in the second. We could possibly land at least five starters at crucial positions.

[CowboyChris]

I realize the defense lost the game today but frankly, I don't think this offense is much better than last year's offense. The only difference between a game like this one last year and this year was we probably would have been shut out 41-20 but had about 150 less yards. :rolleyes: Our "new offense" moves the ball but they still can't make the big plays and fall apart in the red zone. And we still can't run the freaking ball!

It's time to stop relying on our defense to win these games. Any team in the age of parity with a great offense can get in the Playoffs. Defenses are so crippled by the strict rules these days, that it's an offensive party in the NFL. Look what one great quarterback in Boston did. Look at offensively powered Minnesota with a great record even though it has a poor defense. Look what Indy does ever year with a questionable defense. Look at Kansas City last year and its turnaround to make a run for the Playoffs this year after a slow start even though their defense is absolutely horrible. Look at Green Bay turning around their season because of that high powered offense. Look what one spectacular receiver in Philly did even though they can't stop the run. The Rams are always a threat in this league even with big defensive problems almost every year. As long as they have that high powered passing game, they can beat you any day of the week.

It's an offensive game now! Offenses win championships now. A great defense helps but you can overcome a lot with a high powered offense. Jerry Jones is so intent on bargain shopping at our skilled offensive positions that he forgets where all the Triplets were originally picked. They were all first round picks with Aikman a #1 overall and Irvin pretty high as well.

While we've been trying to go the bargain route with baseball players at QB, we've missed Byron Leftwich and Ben Roethlisberger. Instead of grooming a replacement for Emmitt (guys like Clinton Portis, DeShaun Foster, and Travis Henry were all available after the 1st round in Emmitt's last years) we waited until the last minute and were stuck with Hambrick. We got cute in the draft his year instead of picking the best running back on the board and only because Buffalo is falling apart will that not bite us in the arse. We stuck with the steadier Greg Ellis instead of drafting Randy Moss.

It's time to rebuild this freaking offense! Every year this offense stinks and we have to count on our defense to save the day. There's no excuse for the way our defense has played this year but this team was never built to be a high scoring unit with older slower guys like Eddie George, Keyshawn Johnson and Vinny Testaverde. Parcells and Jones knew what might happen if the defense couldn't hold.

I say both of those first round picks next year go to offensive players. Forget Julius or Henson, if there is a great QB or RB on the board, pick him! And don't be bashful about Mike Williams or another top ten receiver even though we already have Glenn and Keyshawn. If you have a good offense in today's NFL, you are always in the game! Nuff said.


i couldnt agree with you anymore, im so sick and tired of lame offenses in Dallas, that it is very depressing, and we have had a lame offense since 96, i agree that we need to get a set of new triplets in here. real playmakers!!

a look at the future triplets

Henson- we have to at some point get him in there and see if we have the next coming of Tom Brady or Chad Hutchinson. imo i think Henson will be strike 3 in the baseball rotation of QB's in here, for the reasons that i dont like his akward throwing style, had short college Qb career in college, and has been removed from football for 4 years. i hope im wrong, but neverthless we need to findout.

Julius- i was never high on him in college, but i really liked what i saw in preseason from him, im hoping he isnt going to be an injury riddled back in this league. i hope we dont put him on IR before the season is over, hopefully he finishes out the season on a bright note.

WR- NONE- this is the position that we are no where near close, especially since we traded away AB. Key and Glenn arent the future here and Q. Morgan could be a 2nd WR but i doubt he will ever become the next TO or Moss in this league. and for sure we should address this in the first round next year with someone like M.Williams or B.Edwards.

[TruBlueCowboy]

The Packers scored in 7 consecutive possessions. A rookie QB completed over 80% of his passes the week before that. Culpepper threw 5 TDs in the season opener.

This defense is horifically bad. They don't even give us a chance against a quality opponent. The sad part is there are no good young players on it. RoyW has been playing avg. TNew has been absolutely pathetic the last two weeks. All the others are just solid or below avg vets who give what they've got.

We've got some potential to get better on O with Henson, Jones, Lee and Witten. Even Morgan looked good before he pulled his hammy. Keyshawn and Glenn still are effective players in this leage. The OL is solid on the pass protection front and should improve as run blockers as the season goes on. I really think most of the pieces are in place. The one thing we do need is a true #1 WR.

The defense is another story. If T-New and RW don't get their heads in the game, we have no real building blocks for the future. Both have not looked like stars of the future lately. For all the flack TNew gets, when was the last time RW forced a turnover?

We need to spend the offseason upgrading the D big-time. At least two high profile front 7 players in FA (Rodgers and Abraham would be nice), and two of our first 3 draft picks need to be spent there. We also should part ways with Zimmer because he cannot get this D to take the next step and regularly gets abused by quality opponents. In fact, I think the whole defensive coaching staff should be let go at the end of the season.

But Culpepper has been throwing 5 TDs a game against A LOT of opponents. It's just that some teams have an offense that can match Minnesota. Not ours. And Green Bay has also had some high scoring games before this one. I don't think we should abandon the defense, but rather, I think we should stop ignoring the offense. When was the last time we spent a first round pick on the offense? We try and gamble with guys in the later rounds or cheap free agents. You don't have to have a great defense to win anymore in this league. It's an offensive league now. Defenses have been gimped for years now. The league spoils its QBs and receivers.

And also, I think we're going the wrong direction on defense. Instead of spending all these picks on high first round defensive backs, we should be focusing on the defensive line. Carolina proved it last year that you can play just about anyone in the secondary as long as you have a great pass rush. The Cowboys didn't really have that many big names in the secondary in their first two Super Bowls. That 92-93 defensive line rotation was the envy of everyone though.

[AJM1613]

How exactly did you pass up on Roethlisberger?

[TruBlueCowboy]

How exactly did you pass up on Roethlisberger?

I never said we passed him up. He was drafted close enough to our position that we could have made a trade for him. My point is there have been plenty of QBs in the first round that we either had a legit draft pick for or were in trading range but the Cowboys continue to go with baseball projects.

[Hiero]

Agree, we need a superstar badly on the Offense. Field goals just arent cutting it. We've been living on field goals for hte past 5-6 years, and it's just downright disgusting. We need a real RB, not some ND 2nd round reject(J Jones). We need a real WR not some guy with a ton of potential whos a complete and will never live up to it(Bryant). we need a real QB not some "Parcells guy" who's a last resort of a last resort( vinny). Depending on whether or not morgan, J Jones, and Henson step up we need to draft accordingly. I'd be amazingly happy drafting an RB, WR, or QB with the bills pick next year, just to be able to score more than 9 points a game. Hell i'd be glad to draft all 7 ****ing rounds on offense, just to be able to put the ball in the endzone once in awhile.

[Hiero]

also you brought up a great point. We need to start preparing for the future, not just assuming some random guy will step up and make it huge. We killed ourselves by not preparing a future backup for Aikman, Smith, and Irvin, and our teams been horrible ever since those guys left. We need to start taking some actual picks on offense, not just hoping a random 2nd or 3rd rounder will randomly sprout into super stardom.

[The Curly One]

Our offensive line is terrible, The defensive pass rush is virtually non existant.
We do not know about Jujo yet as a runningback. Vinny is too old to be the future of the Cowboys and we do not have a clue about Henson yet. Eddie George....... dont even get me started. Larry Allen has been totally useless for several years now and is not getting better. Ddi you see the move LA put on that guy to get out of the way and let him sack Vinny late in the game? At least his fat butt was still standing in the same spot when the ball fumbled out and he was able to fall on it.
There are a few bright spots with Witten and Roy Williams but over all we need help in most all areas.
I think our sorry offensive and defensive lines are the cause of most of our problems. On offense the Quarterback is not getting any protection or blocking for the runningbacks.
On defense our linebackers are having to come up to stop the run or pressure the Qb because our defensive line does nothing. This leaves Tnew and them out there on their own and they will eventually get burned like that.
We need help in so many areas now just where do you start? Curly

[SuspectCorner]

defense wins championships. always has - always will. and it doesn't even matter what sport you apply this to. name one where this axiom doesn't hold true and you are discussing a hobby not a sport.

[mr.jameswoods]

I think we just need to start drafting for talent instead of need. That's what has been killing us. The teams that are known to draft well do so on the basis of talent. We took this approach with Roy Williams and it paid off. I think that's why some of our drafts have stunk in the past. Ellis and Ekuban were marginal defensive ends but they happened to be the best DE's of their drafts. This is how we keep getting average players. I don't care what player is available but we need to draft someone that can make immediate impact as opposed to someone we need at a particular position.

[SuspectCorner]

I think we just need to start drafting for talent instead of need. That's what has been killing us. The teams that are known to draft well do so on the basis of talent. We took this approach with Roy Williams and it paid off. I think that's why some of our drafts have stunk in the past. Ellis and Ekuban were marginal defensive ends but they happened to be the best DE's of their drafts. This is how we keep getting average players. I don't care what player is available but we need to draft someone that can make immediate impact as opposed to someone we need at a particular position.
i take offense that you would mention Ellis and Ekuban in the same sentence (oops - i just did it). one's a plugger - the other a %$#@-plug.

[mr.jameswoods]

i take offense that you would mention Ellis and Ekuban in the same sentence. one's a plugger - the other a %$#@-plug.

Yeah, it's not fair that I used them in the same sentence. I will give you that but Ellis has not lived up to his draft status and despite his hustle, you can't ignore the fact that he has not had one season with double digit sacks. He may be a boyscout but he is no threat as a pass rusher and that's what DE's are supposed to do; rush the passer. I could care less about plugging the lane and being great at stopping the running game. That's what linebackers are for. I want a guy who can put some heat on the QB singlehandedly without needing LaRoi Glover to collapse the pocket or the QB to hold onto the ball for 10 seconds It seems like whenever Ellis gets a sack it's due to other aspects intervening like the ones already mentioned. It's not often that you see Ellis beat a tackle all by his lonesome and sack the QB from his blindside.

[SuspectCorner]

Yeah, it's not fair that I used them in the same sentence. I will give you that but Ellis has not lived up to his draft status and despite his hustle, you can't ignore the fact that he has not had one season with double digit sacks. He may be a boyscout but he is no threat as a pass rusher and that's what DE's are supposed to do; rush the passer. I could care less about plugging the lane and being great at stopping the running game. That's what linebackers are for. I want a guy who can put some heat on the QB singlehandedly without needing LaRoi Glover to collapse the pocket or the QB to hold onto the ball for 10 seconds
look at that line and figure "who is probably going to draw the double?". it's a no-brainer. and that's the problem. dallas can only bring it from Ellis and, occasionally, Glover unless they bring the blitz. and our secondary is easy pickings when we blitz. darned when you do - darned when you don't. i don't think it's zimmer. you can't win a gunfight without bullets.

[mr.jameswoods]

look at that line and figure "who is probably going to draw the double?". it's a no-brainer. and that's the problem. dallas can only bring it from Ellis and, occasionally, Glover unless they bring the blitz. and our secondary is easy pickings when we blitz. darned when you do - darned when you don't. i don't think it's zimmer. you can't win a gunfight without bullets.

Dude, what have you been smoking. Glover is way better than Ellis at rushing the passer and he is only a tackle. That's how sad Ellis is as a pass rusher. Overall Ellis is a pretty good DE because of the way he plays the run and fulfills assignments. But he is not a pass rusher at all. How often does he get doubled? I have seem many times when the tackle gets his hands on Ellis and he is done.Ellis isn't quick and that's his problem. He isn't bad but he could be better and he could definitely use more help especially from the other DE. I'm not blaming Zimmer but the only player on our DL that can generate a pass rush is LaRoi Glover and he is the freaking tackle.

[SuspectCorner]

Dude, what have you been smoking. Glover is way better than Ellis at rushing the passer and he is only a tackle. That's how sad Ellis is as a pass rusher. Overall Ellis is a pretty good DE because of the way he plays the run and fulfills assignments. But he is not a pass rusher at all. How often does he get doubled? I have seem many times when the tackle gets his hands on Ellis and he is done.Ellis isn't quick and that's his problem. He isn't bad but he could be better and he could definitely use more help especially from the other DE. I'm not blaming Zimmer but the only player on our DL that can generate a pass rush is LaRoi Glover and he is the freaking tackle.
well we disagree. Ellis isn't your garden variety speed rusher but he gets, with regularity, pressure on the QB. hence he IS a pass rusher. as for what i've been smoking - Doral lights. why? what do you have?

[AdamJT13]

It's not often that you see Ellis beat a tackle all by his lonesome and sack the QB from his blindside.

Yeah, it's not too often that our left end sacks a quarterback from his blindside. In fact, I don't think I've seen it happen one time since he sacked Mark Brunell twice a few weeks ago. Of course, that was probably just because Brunell is left-handed, so Ellis could actually sack him from his blindside.

[Chuck 54]

I realize the defense lost the game today but frankly, I don't think this offense is much better than last year's offense. The only difference between a game like this one last year and this year was we probably would have been shut out 41-20 but had about 150 less yards. :rolleyes: Our "new offense" moves the ball but they still can't make the big plays and fall apart in the red zone. And we still can't run the freaking ball!

It's time to stop relying on our defense to win these games. Any team in the age of parity with a great offense can get in the Playoffs. Defenses are so crippled by the strict rules these days, that it's an offensive party in the NFL. Look what one great quarterback in Boston did. Look at offensively powered Minnesota with a great record even though it has a poor defense. Look what Indy does ever year with a questionable defense. Look at Kansas City last year and its turnaround to make a run for the Playoffs this year after a slow start even though their defense is absolutely horrible. Look at Green Bay turning around their season because of that high powered offense. Look what one spectacular receiver in Philly did even though they can't stop the run. The Rams are always a threat in this league even with big defensive problems almost every year. As long as they have that high powered passing game, they can beat you any day of the week.

It's an offensive game now! Offenses win championships now. A great defense helps but you can overcome a lot with a high powered offense. Jerry Jones is so intent on bargain shopping at our skilled offensive positions that he forgets where all the Triplets were originally picked. They were all first round picks with Aikman a #1 overall and Irvin pretty high as well.

While we've been trying to go the bargain route with baseball players at QB, we've missed Byron Leftwich and Ben Roethlisberger. Instead of grooming a replacement for Emmitt (guys like Clinton Portis, DeShaun Foster, and Travis Henry were all available after the 1st round in Emmitt's last years) we waited until the last minute and were stuck with Hambrick. We got cute in the draft his year instead of picking the best running back on the board and only because Buffalo is falling apart will that not bite us in the arse. We stuck with the steadier Greg Ellis instead of drafting Randy Moss.

It's time to rebuild this freaking offense! Every year this offense stinks and we have to count on our defense to save the day. There's no excuse for the way our defense has played this year but this team was never built to be a high scoring unit with older slower guys like Eddie George, Keyshawn Johnson and Vinny Testaverde. Parcells and Jones knew what might happen if the defense couldn't hold.

I say both of those first round picks next year go to offensive players. Forget Julius or Henson, if there is a great QB or RB on the board, pick him! And don't be bashful about Mike Williams or another top ten receiver even though we already have Glenn and Keyshawn. If you have a good offense in today's NFL, you are always in the game! Nuff said.
I"m with you 100%...hoping Henson isn't just another athletic baseball player, that Julius JOnes is more than a fragile 3rd down back, and would love to draft Mike Williams.

[mr.jameswoods]

I know that defense wins games just like pitching wins games in baseball. I won't argue what is more important.

But I also think that offense improves a defense. For one thing, an offense that is able to control the ball can keep their defense fresh instead of going three and out. I also think that a defense plays better when it has less pressure placed upon it. It's much easier for a defense to play with more confidence if they have a lead or they know their efforts will be fullfilled by their offense. A defense that plays looser often takes more risks which can often lead to bigger plays.

I think we need to focus on playmakers on offense if that means a stellar TE, WR, FB, RB whatever....a player that can cause a spark. The kind of player the media and fans of other teams actually respect and not ones that we have to convince ourselves is good. Everyone loved Stephen Jackson and Kevin Jones, but you don't hear the same praise regarding Julius Jones.

[Sarge]

While I fully back taking Mike Williams with our fist pick, I wouldn't be up set if the remainder of the picks were spend on the other side of the ball. Our D is woeful, our secondary is young and unproven, and more important then that the front seven aren't getting pressure nor are they effectively stopping the run.

If we could some how land Rodgers, Abraham, and a back-up plan at RB in free agency. Then Williams, Johnson, and a defensive back (corner or safety) in the second. We could possibly land at least five starters at crucial positions.

Both sides of the ball are SO bad we simply need to take the best player available. Sounds cliche - but it's really the thing to do as bad as we are.

[Clay_Allison]

Draft franchise offensive players? Why? Why should we want some of those? I say we can get by with Romo to Randall Williams for the next 5 years. This is pointless.

[Bach]

Draft franchise offensive players? Why? Why should we want some of those? I say we can get by with Romo to Randall Williams for the next 5 years. This is pointless.

http://www.websmileys.com/sm/happy/1428.gif

What we need is two more #1 picks in the secondary. 4 top 10 picks in 4 years...all on DB's....

Now that's how you build a team!

[Hollywood Henderson]

I agree we should pick best player available...But an offensive pick would not be wasted, like our talent is on D...

Getting rid of zimmy/squiggy WUSS would be like gettting 3 first round impact players on D!

The guy is the biggest fraud in the NFL...Until he goes, we will NEVER have a good defense...(Even last year we got SMOKED by every good team)

[Bach]

I agree we should pick best player available...But an offensive pick would not be wasted, like our talent is on D...

Getting rid of zimmy/squiggy WUSS would be like gettting 3 first round impact players on D!

The guy is the biggest fraud in the NFL...Until he goes, we will NEVER have a good defense...(Even last year we got SMOKED by every good team)


How or why we begged him not to take the Nebraska job is beyond me.

[BUSDRIV3RDH]

Couldn't agree more with the first post, we need offensive stars. It just blows my mind how Jerry hasn't took a stab at atleast one potential "franchise" qb after Aikman. Especially with the high picks we've had the last few years prior to this last. Same with RB after Emmitt. Heck, grade A running backs, wide outs and quarterbacks is what has built this legacy of the Cowboys.

Merideth>Staubach>Aikman Dorrsett>Walker>Smith Pearson>Hill>Irvin

It was like they saw how high the triplets had risen the "bar" and instead of trying, they just took easy way out and did nothing. Truth be told, I think Jerry is gunshy, he knows who was responsible for bringing in those three and it wasn't him but the other JJ.

It starts at QB and that's why I say we have to find out what we have in Henson THIS YEAR! This year while we are sitting with 2 quality #1's coming up next year. Lets see if we need to spend one on a QB or not, now.

Also not comfortable with Julius Jones. A 2nd round pick that's already missing time due to injury. There's nothing special here, time to move on already.

But if our #1a doesn't go to a QB, I want to see Mike Williams wearing a star. WR is just as good a spot to start as any. Key and MW next year with Henson and a good Free Agent RB pickup like S. Alexander. Atleast thank god that there is actually a light at the end of this tunel and it's named "TWONUM BERONES"

[Gah]

I am of the mind that we need defensive stars with our top two or maybe three picks next year. Why?

This team's anemic offense can be blamed mostly on QB play, injuries and playcalling. Our best Runningback is injured, and the playcalling is puzzling at times. The QB doesnt have what it takes to put an offense on his shoulders and score. Next year, when we have JJ and Henson both starting, two of those problems will be taken care of. Our OL is ok. Our recievers are a strength. Key may be aging, but the guy can still play - he goes over the middle and blocks downfield. Terry Glenn isn't that old and as we have seen this season, he's got a LOT left. He's a #1 reciever if we had a better QB. QMorgan has #1 reciever talent and he's young. Witten is young and will coming into his own. I see no need to spend high picks on Offense next season.

D is a whole other story. We DESPERATELY need another playmaker on the DL (not to mention some quality depth), our LBs are a JOKE and the secondary needs help BAD. Id like to see a CB and a DE with our top two picks in the first round next year.

[Chuck 54]

Both sides of the ball need addressing.

One more thing. If I hear anything about Special Teams in the late rounds in the 2005 draft and/or guys needing to contribute on them to make the team, I will need to be bailed out of jail.
I heard that, brother ^5.

Now, if suddenly the special teams start to contribute to the cause, maybe I'll reconsider, but for all the crap about parcells and special teams, ours are not doing a very good job, certainly not as good as under Avezzano, imo.

[Chuck 54]

defense wins championships. always has - always will. and it doesn't even matter what sport you apply this to. name one where this axiom doesn't hold true and you are discussing a hobby not a sport.
I'd have to say SF won most of its championships with offense. I'd have to say we won our last championship with offense; maybe the 2nd one in 90's too...only the first against Buffalo was clearly by the defense.

I'd certainly have to say the Rams won their title against the Titans with offense, and I'd give NE's offense every bit as much credit for their wins as the defense. Washington won its titles with offense as well...that win against Denver was an offensive explosion in the 2nd quarter. I'd have to say Elway won his two titles in Denver with offense.

Look at the favorites to get there this year, based on current records: Eagles, Patriots, Vikes, KC in preseason, Indy....almost all more on offense than defense.

Can defense win a title? only if the defense is totally dominating and scores itself. Unless the final score is 13-10, titles are now won by offenses that can score 24-30 points. It's hard to look at modern SB's and say defense won the game unless you go back to the Ravens, and even then Dilfer and company did a better job than expected....just my opinion.

[mr.jameswoods]

Couldn't agree more with the first post, we need offensive stars. It just blows my mind how Jerry hasn't took a stab at atleast one potential "franchise" qb after Aikman. Especially with the high picks we've had the last few years prior to this last. Same with RB after Emmitt. Heck, grade A running backs, wide outs and quarterbacks is what has built this legacy of the Cowboys.

I agree and the first thing we need to do is stop bargain shopping for offensive stars. We need to realize that offensive stars with some exceptions are found in the first round. If you want a quarterback then you draft one in the first round. If you want a great RB, then you draft him in the first round. If you want a great receiver then you draft him in the first round.

Sorry but Antonio Bryant was not the next coming of Michael Irvin. He was not a pesudo first round pick. He was a second roun pick aka questionmark for a reason. Julius Jones was not drafted in the first round for a reason. Quincy Carter was not going to be the next Michael Vick just because you took him earlier than everyone else.

Yeah, there are exceptions like the Terrel Davis etc. but for the most part offensive playmakers are taken in the first round. The overwhelming majority of star RB's, WR's and QB's are taken in the first round. So let's stop hoping to get a steal in later rounds and do the right thing by actually selecting a player in the first round that other teams actually covet. For once it would be nice to draft a player in the first round that the media and other teams fans actually respect. I hate having to defend our picks when deep down I agree with the media.

[mr.jameswoods]

Both sides of the ball are SO bad we simply need to take the best player available. Sounds cliche - but it's really the thing to do as bad as we are.

I agree Sarge. Take the playmaker whether they are an offensive or defensive star. Draft for talent and not need. The best teams draft according to this philosophy.

[shnagy]

We have a lot of holes to fill in FA and the Draft, so drafting for "Special teams" in the late rounds will not cut it this year. We need a QB (not sure about Henson yet), maybe some offensive line, a WR, DE, DT, a few LB's, a CB, and a true FS. Now whenever Bill takes care of all of those positions, then he can draft his special teams, but until then, focus on filling the holes.

[ABQCOWBOY]

I'd have to say SF won most of its championships with offense. I'd have to say we won our last championship with offense; maybe the 2nd one in 90's too...only the first against Buffalo was clearly by the defense.

I'd certainly have to say the Rams won their title against the Titans with offense, and I'd give NE's offense every bit as much credit for their wins as the defense. Washington won its titles with offense as well...that win against Denver was an offensive explosion in the 2nd quarter. I'd have to say Elway won his two titles in Denver with offense.

Look at the favorites to get there this year, based on current records: Eagles, Patriots, Vikes, KC in preseason, Indy....almost all more on offense than defense.

Can defense win a title? only if the defense is totally dominating and scores itself. Unless the final score is 13-10, titles are now won by offenses that can score 24-30 points. It's hard to look at modern SB's and say defense won the game unless you go back to the Ravens, and even then Dilfer and company did a better job than expected....just my opinion.

Man, I don't agree with this at all. When San Francisco beat us, they aquired Deion to do it.

Denver won with a strong running game and good defense.

The Rams won the Superbowl on a defensive stop at the goal line.

The Pats secondary is the strength of there team.

The Bucs and the Ravens won with defense.

I don't think I can agree with the whole offense wins thing.

[TruBlueCowboy]

I'd have to say SF won most of its championships with offense. I'd have to say we won our last championship with offense; maybe the 2nd one in 90's too...only the first against Buffalo was clearly by the defense.

I'd certainly have to say the Rams won their title against the Titans with offense, and I'd give NE's offense every bit as much credit for their wins as the defense. Washington won its titles with offense as well...that win against Denver was an offensive explosion in the 2nd quarter. I'd have to say Elway won his two titles in Denver with offense.

Look at the favorites to get there this year, based on current records: Eagles, Patriots, Vikes, KC in preseason, Indy....almost all more on offense than defense.

Can defense win a title? only if the defense is totally dominating and scores itself. Unless the final score is 13-10, titles are now won by offenses that can score 24-30 points. It's hard to look at modern SB's and say defense won the game unless you go back to the Ravens, and even then Dilfer and company did a better job than expected....just my opinion.

Good points Wayne. :)

[TruBlueCowboy]

Man, I don't agree with this at all. When San Francisco beat us, they aquired Deion to do it.

Denver won with a strong running game and good defense.

The Rams won the Superbowl on a defensive stop at the goal line.

The Pats secondary is the strength of there team.

The Bucs and the Ravens won with defense.

I don't think I can agree with the whole offense wins thing.

I don't mean to say that defense is meaningless. I think the Pats proved that it still matters because their strong defense last year pulled them through the AFC Playoffs while teams like Indy and KC collapsed without the same benefit of a strong D. I would like to see the Cowboys though stop ignoring their offense and spend a lot more money and high draft picks to pick up the playmakers they have so desperately needed since the collapse of the Triplets. Corners can't do a damn thing anymore and quarterbacks are babied. Offenses have so many advantages now that a team with a poor defense and a good offense is almost always in Playoff contention throughout the year. I think once you create a great offense, you go from there. Both sides of the ball need attention but the Cowboys have just ignored our offense. Am I forgetting someone? Is David LaFleur our only 1st round pick in the offense over the last 10 years? That's sad.

[Chuck 54]

Man, I don't agree with this at all. When San Francisco beat us, they aquired Deion to do it.

Denver won with a strong running game and good defense.

The Rams won the Superbowl on a defensive stop at the goal line.

The Pats secondary is the strength of there team.

The Bucs and the Ravens won with defense.

I don't think I can agree with the whole offense wins thing.
SF...that's how they got there, not how they won the SB, which is the thread. Besides, I'm going back to MOntana days...The CATCH??? And if you talk about the one we lost in SF...early gift turnovers and a 21 point first quarter deficit hurt us, but we dominated that entire game from then on with our offense and fell just short...maybe the best game Aikman ever had.

Denver, you just mentioned the running game, but who was the MVP?
Rams stopped him at the goal line...does that mean defense won the championshiP??? look at the score...both teams moved up and down the field.
Pats, I'll admit was an iffy one because they do play good defense, but Brady is the man on that team....he is more responsible for their SB victories than any defensive player.

Ravens is your best shot....maybe Bucs, although the talk was all about the offense Gruden brought them.

I"m not saying defense isn't important....but you can build a dominating defense and I can have an offense with Aikman, Emmitt, and Irvin, and I don't think you'll beat me in the Super Bowl.

[ABQCOWBOY]

SF...that's how they got there, not how they won the SB, which is the thread. Besides, I'm going back to MOntana days...The CATCH??? And if you talk about the one we lost in SF...early gift turnovers and a 21 point first quarter deficit hurt us, but we dominated that entire game from then on with our offense and fell just short...maybe the best game Aikman ever had.

Denver, you just mentioned the running game, but who was the MVP?
Rams stopped him at the goal line...does that mean defense won the championshiP??? look at the score...both teams moved up and down the field.
Pats, I'll admit was an iffy one because they do play good defense, but Brady is the man on that team....he is more responsible for their SB victories than any defensive player.

Ravens is your best shot....maybe Bucs, although the talk was all about the offense Gruden brought them.

I"m not saying defense isn't important....but you can build a dominating defense and I can have an offense with Aikman, Emmitt, and Irvin, and I don't think you'll beat me in the Super Bowl.


If you look at what Denver did on offense during the season, I think you have to say that they were a strong defensive unit during there Superbowl runs. I know that Elway was the MVP but really, he only had something like an 84% QB rating in one of those seasons, the other was like in the 90s so there is room for speculation. Never the less, the defense was strong and the running game was off the charts. I think one year hommie rushed for like 1700 yards and the next it was like 2000. This was a balanced team. I don't think you can say that offensively, they were superior. I think you have to call them balanced.

As for San Fran, well, you have to excuse me. In my mind, the NFC championship was the SuperBowl that year. Still, your point is well taken. We hurt ourselves in that game. Having said that, can we really say that offense won it for them? I think that you have to chalk that one up to our own sorry mistakes. If you talk about the earlier San Fran teams, they weren't exactly chopped liver on defense. Ronnie Lott, Hacksaw Renalds, Mertain Hanks, Charles Haley, Fred Dean, Ryan Young, McKyer, Kenna Turner, Mike Carter, Pierce Holt, Matt Millan, Dana Stubblefield, Ken Norton, Gary Plummer, Eric Davis and lets not forget Deion. I mean, it's easy to say that offense won it for San Fran because they had a great offense but really, they had alot of real good defensive players too. These are just the guys I can remember. Interestingly enough, of the 5 rings San Fran has won, there defense gave up, 21, 16, 16, 10 and 26. You think of offense with San Fran but they really had some good defensive teams as well.

Brady is the man and really, he's the only constint on that offense. Defense wins games for the Pats. I agree with you if that's what you said.

The Rams are a tough call. I could be mistaken here but the year they won it, I believe they also lead the league in Sacks and TO ratio. They had an excellent offense. One of the best ever but they had good defense as well.

Bucs and Ravens are no brainers to me. They did it with defense. Really no question in my mind.

This might be one of those deals where we both agree to disagree here Wayne. I will admit that I look at things from a slightly skewed view point. I believe in defense so I kinda lean twords that. I just think the old adage is correct, even today. Defense wins championships.

[ABQCOWBOY]

I don't mean to say that defense is meaningless. I think the Pats proved that it still matters because their strong defense last year pulled them through the AFC Playoffs while teams like Indy and KC collapsed without the same benefit of a strong D. I would like to see the Cowboys though stop ignoring their offense and spend a lot more money and high draft picks to pick up the playmakers they have so desperately needed since the collapse of the Triplets. Corners can't do a damn thing anymore and quarterbacks are babied. Offenses have so many advantages now that a team with a poor defense and a good offense is almost always in Playoff contention throughout the year. I think once you create a great offense, you go from there. Both sides of the ball need attention but the Cowboys have just ignored our offense. Am I forgetting someone? Is David LaFleur our only 1st round pick in the offense over the last 10 years? That's sad.

I think you bring up several good points here. I think the rules changes have really played a significant role in offense vs defense. To me though, a balanced offense with a strong defense is a sure winner. I'd even say that a strong running game, good defense and solid special teams can win you a championship. It has been some time since we used a 1st round pick on offense but then again, you look at it and you have to say that we used two 1st round picks on Galloway. Our first three picks last year were on offense. Normally, our big time FAs of late are usually on offense. I think it balances out. I guess I just think that our offense is in pretty good shape with the talent we have. In fact, the only two positions I feel need attention offensively are FB and a big time young WR. The rest I think is a matter of maturation process.

Defensively, on the other hand, is really lacking in the front seven, FS and perhaps RCB or 3rd CB.

Sorry man, I guess I'm just kinda old school where this is conerned.

[DipChit]

I've always thought the simple phrase "Defense wins championships" needed one caveat. That is, the best defense out of the Top 5 offensive teams wins championships. We werent capable of really holding the Niners down. But we *were* capable of holding them to less than we hung on them. As wayne said, whether it was us, or the Niners or the Rams or the Packers or the Broncos or the Bills (for at least getting there), those were all high power/scoring offenses.

But that was before free agency. Now just about anything goes in any given year. Now you can have something less than high scoring offenses and still get there. See Balt, T.B. even N.E (efficient would be a better word for them) and some other random one year wonders that got there and came up short.

[SuspectCorner]

I've always thought the simple phrase "Defense wins championships" needed one caveat. That is, the best defense out of the Top 5 offensive teams wins championships. We werent capable of really holding the Niners down. But we *were* capable of holding them to less than we hung on them. As wayne said, whether it was us, or the Niners or the Rams or the Packers or the Broncos or the Bills (for at least getting there), those were all high power/scoring offenses.

But that was before free agency. Now just about anything goes in any given year. Now you can have something less than high scoring offenses and still get there. See Balt, T.B. even N.E (efficient would be a better word for them) and some other random one year wonders that got there and came up short.
the baltimore ravens offense never sniffed the top ten when they won their title. check back as far as you care to go. championship teams have defense in common. lots of turnovers. lots of sacks. dearth of yards allowed. dearth of points allowed. pick a year, name the champs, and check the DEFENSIVE stats... it's really that simple.

[Clay_Allison]

Truth be told, I think Jerry is gunshy, he knows who was responsible for bringing in those three and it wasn't him but the other JJ.


Thank you for displaying your ignorance, 0 for 3. Irvin was drafted before Either JJ was with the Cowboys, Jimmy wanted Steve Walsh at QB, and he tried to trade out of the spot where Emmitt was drafted. He reportedly liked Blair Thomas better.

I will give you Jerry not being much responsible if you call it luck. Irvin certainly was luck, since he didn't even draft him.

Also, Jimmy Johnson proved he could draft defense like noone else, and couldn't find offense to save his life in Miami. Credit him for 2+ round guys like Leon Lett, Zach Thomas, Jason Taylor, Tony Tolbert, Brock Marion, Sam Madison, and Patrick Surtain, but the triplets fell in his lap.

[AdamJT13]

the baltimore ravens offense never sniffed the top ten when they won their title. check back as far as you care to go. championship teams have defense in common. lots of turnovers. lots of sacks. dearth of yards allowed. dearth of points allowed. pick a year, name the champs, and check the DEFENSIVE stats... it's really that simple.

Here's a defensive stat -- EVERY Super Bowl winner since 1983 has been among the top eight teams in fewest total points allowed. That's 20 consecutive years with the Super Bowl winner having one of the top defenses. In fact, the only franchise EVER to win the Super Bowl without being in the top eight is the Raiders, and they still were in the top half of the league in points allowed. If you want to win the Super Bowl, a good offense obviously helps, but you'd better have a top-notch defense, or you probably don't have a chance.

[Chuck 54]

If you look at what Denver did on offense during the season, I think you have to say that they were a strong defensive unit during there Superbowl runs. I know that Elway was the MVP but really, he only had something like an 84% QB rating in one of those seasons, the other was like in the 90s so there is room for speculation. Never the less, the defense was strong and the running game was off the charts. I think one year hommie rushed for like 1700 yards and the next it was like 2000. This was a balanced team. I don't think you can say that offensively, they were superior. I think you have to call them balanced.

As for San Fran, well, you have to excuse me. In my mind, the NFC championship was the SuperBowl that year. Still, your point is well taken. We hurt ourselves in that game. Having said that, can we really say that offense won it for them? I think that you have to chalk that one up to our own sorry mistakes. If you talk about the earlier San Fran teams, they weren't exactly chopped liver on defense. Ronnie Lott, Hacksaw Renalds, Mertain Hanks, Charles Haley, Fred Dean, Ryan Young, McKyer, Kenna Turner, Mike Carter, Pierce Holt, Matt Millan, Dana Stubblefield, Ken Norton, Gary Plummer, Eric Davis and lets not forget Deion. I mean, it's easy to say that offense won it for San Fran because they had a great offense but really, they had alot of real good defensive players too. These are just the guys I can remember. Interestingly enough, of the 5 rings San Fran has won, there defense gave up, 21, 16, 16, 10 and 26. You think of offense with San Fran but they really had some good defensive teams as well.

Brady is the man and really, he's the only constint on that offense. Defense wins games for the Pats. I agree with you if that's what you said.

The Rams are a tough call. I could be mistaken here but the year they won it, I believe they also lead the league in Sacks and TO ratio. They had an excellent offense. One of the best ever but they had good defense as well.

Bucs and Ravens are no brainers to me. They did it with defense. Really no question in my mind.

This might be one of those deals where we both agree to disagree here Wayne. I will admit that I look at things from a slightly skewed view point. I believe in defense so I kinda lean twords that. I just think the old adage is correct, even today. Defense wins championships.
We can agree on that....defense is important....teams with chopped liver on defense aren't going to get to the super bowl. My only point was that you are seldom going to win JUST because you have a good defense...when you get to the super bowl, you'd better have an offense that can score points and control the ball, even against the best defense in the league...also, that SB's are not typically low scoring, defensive affairs like they were in the early days of the league.

IF we have a great offense and a crappy defense, we'll be in a shootout every week, like Minny or GB. IF we have a great defense and lousy offense, we won't be much better off than we were last year. Maybe you'd like a GREAT defense and an offense that can score enough to win. I'd like a great offense, like we used to have, and two or three studs on defense so we can get enough stops to win games.

We'd both like a well-balanced team that could dominate, but that's hard to build and maintain in these days.

[Clay_Allison]

Maybe you can get by doing just enough of both O and D. The New England Patriots have won 2 Super Bowls out of the last 3 with good, dependable, consistent, but not spectacular numbers on offense and defense.

What they have done, both on offense and defense is keep things so the ofense doesn't have to bail out the D, and the D does not have to carry the load for bad offensive performance (turnovers, 3 and outs, bad field position). And they have played very good special teams, which is a HUGE but often forgotten part of the equation.

[DipChit]

the baltimore ravens offense never sniffed the top ten when they won their title. check back as far as you care to go. championship teams have defense in common. lots of turnovers. lots of sacks. dearth of yards allowed. dearth of points allowed. pick a year, name the champs, and check the DEFENSIVE stats... it's really that simple.

I understand that, that was my point about the Ravens (and about how teams nowadays can get to or win the SB made up all different sorts of ways). All defense and no offense as in the Ravens example. And that worked that particular year. But you think that team no matter how stout the defense was would have been able to beat the '93 Cowboys or '94 Niners in the SB too? I dont think so. Now it's N.E. with their wonderfully "balanced" attack. No mega Triplets and no Doomsday. Good thing they were capable of scoring 30+ last year in the SB though because their D gave up damn near that many.

Why is it that T.B., no matter how stout their defenses were under Dungy in the mid late 90's, they never sniffed the S.B? Because eventually there was a team that managed to score enough points to beat them cause their offense was no good.

Adam said:

If you want to win the Super Bowl, a good offense obviously helps, but you'd better have a top-notch defense, or you probably don't have a chance.
-------------------------------

I'm sure thats true but you also had to have a top notch offense or you would have never scored against the top notch defense. If it was mostly about defense how come when Doomsday played the Steel Curtain the scores were 21-17 and 35-31 instead of 10-7?

Or our games against the Niners in the 90's. Both teams were right up there with the best in points allowed on the season(s) but yet the points allowed in those games was in the 20's and 30's. No matter how good our defense was we werent gonna win unless we had the offense we had. Obviously there was no chance in hell we could've won those games 10-6. Nor could the Niners have won by only scoring 10 points.

In '92 lotta good being #3 in PA did the Niners. We hung 30 on em anyway. And there's no argument to be made that had they not been at least that good we would've hung 40 on em because that whole year we only scored 40+ (41) 1 time. More or less reverse that scenario when the Niners beat us.

Again I never said defense doesnt matter (of course you need one of the better defenses.. even if u score 30 every week you cant be giving up 31 just the same) but for a good long time before FA kicked in in full force if you didnt have the capability in a given game of scoring 30 just by showing up (you know, the thing we absolutely dont have these days and havent for years) it usually didnt really matter how good your defense was.. you werent gonna have a chance to win it all because somebody eventually was going to outscore you. Even if it was just 13-10 instead of 33-10.

[CowboyChris]

why do i get the feeling that this topic will be discussed over and over a million times between now and draft day. do we take offense or defense in round 1? do we trade down or up? its gonna be a long haul peeps.

its pretty simple why we went from 10-6, to begining this season 2-4, we absolutely did nothing in free agency and we traded away our 1st round pick last year. we knew our weaknesses going into last offseason and we simply didnt get the job done, and we are paying for it now.

[ABQCOWBOY]

I'll tell you what I believe a team needs to be able to do in order to win a championship today.

A team has to be able to create TOs. They have to be able to apply pressure to the QB at critical stagies in the game. They have to be able to control the clock with the run game late and they have to play penalty free football.

I don't think you have to be dominant all the time on defense but in key situations, you do. I don't think a team needs to be able to score on every posessin or even throw for 300 every game. You have to be able to take advantage of your opportunities in the redzone though. It's really an interesting flavor of football. I hate it. LOL!!!!!!!!

[DandyDon]

Everybody has a way to solve our problems....most of what I've read says we need skill players (positions)....my take is that the game is won in the trenches - on BOTH sides of the ball. That is where we need to focus our efforts in acquiring players. Now that is not to say let's forget about skilled players, lord, we need those, too. We DO need a hot receiver and a younger QB, but honestly, if you don't have the horses up front, it won't matter. The same especially goes for the D-line. I think Bill will address both trenches in the off season. Of course, this is just an opinion, as is everyone's. Sooooo, HOW 'BOUT THEM COWBOYS!!!!!!!

[DipChit]

...another Lions victory!



Yeah just like the one against Dallas last year!!!! Errrrr, oooops, wait a minute....