ESPN: Hank Steinbrenner says football has bigger steroid problem than baseball

[FuzzyLumpkins]

This guy is a blowhard and this may deserve the NFL zone but its slow and the offseason. There are always the quality RomoIsGod threads....

I can kinda see what Hank is saying though. I just think back to Stepnoski saying that he used to get baked after every game and they never caught him.

Hank Steinbrenner says football has bigger steroid problem than baseball

Associated Press

Updated: February 18, 2008, 11:25 PM ET

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TAMPA, Fla. -- Hank Steinbrenner insists baseball is being picked on for its trouble with performance-enhancing drugs, and claims the problem is bigger in football.

"I don't like baseball being singled out," the New York Yankees senior vice president said in a telephone interview with The Associated Press on Monday night.

Everybody that knows sports knows football is tailor-made for performance-enhancing drugs.

--Hank Steinbrenner

"Everybody that knows sports knows football is tailor-made for performance-enhancing drugs. I don't know how they managed to skate by. It irritates me. Don't tell me it's not more prevalent. The number in football is at least twice as many. Look at the speed and size of those players."

Answered NFL spokesman Greg Aiello: "We've had year-round random testing with immediate suspensions since 1990 and we conduct approximately 12,000 steroids tests a year."

Steinbrenner's comments came after Andy Pettitte met with reporters for the first time since the Yankees pitcher was named in the Mitchell report. Two days after the report was released in December, Pettitte confirmed he used human growth hormone in 2002; two weeks ago, he told congressional investigators he also used HGH for one day in 2004.

"A lot of baseball people thought that baseball would be the last sport that it would be a problem in and probably just ignored it too long," Steinbrenner said. "But the fact is it's been in football a long time and it's been in basketball, I'm sure. Why baseball is being singled out, I don't know. I don't know. I know all the excuses -- `Well, it's America's game and it's the statistics.'

"That's not an excuse. If a sport is riddled with it, it's riddled with it. Why aren't they looking at the NFL?" he said.

Steinbrenner said baseball will "clean up the game."

"We're going to do it," he said.

Copyright 2008 by The Associated Press

[Future]

I won't be surprised when the NFL, NHL, NBA, NASCAR, PGA, PBA, and billiards all have the same problem as baseball does now.

[Temo]

I'd agree that Football NOW has more of a steriod problem than baseball. But 3,4,5 years ago? No way.

[Big Dakota]

This guy is a blowhard and this may deserve the NFL zone but its slow and the offseason. There are always the quality RomoIsGod threads....

I can kinda see what Hank is saying though. I just think back to Stepnoski saying that he used to get baked after every game and they never caught him.

Hank Steinbrenner says football has bigger steroid problem than baseball

Associated Press

Updated: February 18, 2008, 11:25 PM ET

* Comment
* Email
* Print

TAMPA, Fla. -- Hank Steinbrenner insists baseball is being picked on for its trouble with performance-enhancing drugs, and claims the problem is bigger in football.

"I don't like baseball being singled out," the New York Yankees senior vice president said in a telephone interview with The Associated Press on Monday night.

Everybody that knows sports knows football is tailor-made for performance-enhancing drugs.

--Hank Steinbrenner

"Everybody that knows sports knows football is tailor-made for performance-enhancing drugs. I don't know how they managed to skate by. It irritates me. Don't tell me it's not more prevalent. The number in football is at least twice as many. Look at the speed and size of those players."

Answered NFL spokesman Greg Aiello: "We've had year-round random testing with immediate suspensions since 1990 and we conduct approximately 12,000 steroids tests a year."

Steinbrenner's comments came after Andy Pettitte met with reporters for the first time since the Yankees pitcher was named in the Mitchell report. Two days after the report was released in December, Pettitte confirmed he used human growth hormone in 2002; two weeks ago, he told congressional investigators he also used HGH for one day in 2004.

"A lot of baseball people thought that baseball would be the last sport that it would be a problem in and probably just ignored it too long," Steinbrenner said. "But the fact is it's been in football a long time and it's been in basketball, I'm sure. Why baseball is being singled out, I don't know. I don't know. I know all the excuses -- `Well, it's America's game and it's the statistics.'

"That's not an excuse. If a sport is riddled with it, it's riddled with it. Why aren't they looking at the NFL?" he said.

Steinbrenner said baseball will "clean up the game."

"We're going to do it," he said.

Copyright 2008 by The Associated Press

Well there are what, about 1900 nfl players including PS players? That would be about 6 tests per player per year. I'd say old Hank doesn't know what the hell he's talking about.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Well there are what, abut 1900 nfl players including PS players? That would be about 6 tests per year per player. I'd say old Hank doesn't know what the hell he's talking about.

Their rigorous testing policy failed to catch people like Lehr who was juicing for years before he was caught. Stepnoski never got caught and he was a dopehead.

[Rampage]

just another reason to hate the yankees. but everyone already knows their's more steroids in football than anything else. they just know how not to get caught.

[Big Dakota]

Their rigorous testing policy failed to catch people like Lehr who was juicing for years before he was caught. Stepnoski never got caught and he was a dopehead.


Well with labor unions and privacy issues and the like, they are doing about all they can in todays climate, IMO.

[Big Dakota]

just another reason to hate the yankees. but everyone already knows their's more steroids in football than anything else. they just know how not to get caught.


I know next to nothing about masking agents, but one would think they work pretty well, but that's the way the ball bounces. Until science comes up with a fool proof test what ya gonna do?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Well with labor unions and privacy issues and the like, they are doing about all they can in todays climate, IMO.

I really believe that a good testing policy is a good thing for all parties invovled. Its just one more reason why I cannot stand Upshaw.

[Big Dakota]

I really believe that a good testing policy is a good thing for all parties invovled. Its just one more reason why I cannot stand Upshaw.


I agree, but if they keep coming up with agents to beat the tests(which i presume they are) then sports is fighting a losing battle.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I agree, but if they keep coming up with agents to beat the tests(which i presume they are) then sports is fighting a losing battle.

its a billion dollar industry. Im confident that they could use hair tests or blood tests that you cannot mask like a piss test.

[David276]

well. mr steinbrenner is a freaking genius.

[Bob Sacamano]

I agree that HGH may be prevalent

but I choose not to think about it, I love the sport too much and my Cowboys

[Bob Sacamano]

its a billion dollar industry. Im confident that they could use hair tests or blood tests that you cannot mask like a piss test.

I don't think hair tests would work here, as they use those to test weed that tends to stick to hair folicles long after you smoke, idk, maybe, arm-hair samples? I know HGH is a concoction that you rub on, maybe they rub it on their arms and legs, idk

but I see your point

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I don't think hair tests would work here, as they use those to test weed that tends to stick to hair folicles long after you smoke, idk, maybe, arm-hair samples? I know HGH is a concoction that you rub on, maybe they rub it on their arms and legs, idk

but I see your point

I dont know what technology is available but I know for example that parole and probation officials have very good testing methods that are very difficult to beat. You can test for masking agents easily because they dont only filter out foreign substances. They filter natural byproducts as well and you can tell.

[Bob Sacamano]

I dont know what technology is available but I know for example that parole and probation officials have very good testing methods that are very difficult to beat. You can test for masking agents easily because they dont only filter out foreign substances. They filter natural byproducts as well and you can tell.

don't worry, I'm sure they're working on the technology to unmask HGH as we speak

they're doing marvelous things w/ technology nowadays, hopefully players recognize that it's only a matter of time before that technology becomes available though, don't want my favorite past-time spoiled by some idiots

[CanadianCowboysFan]

in other news, the sun will rise tomorrow

[DaBoys4Life]

this is something mark cuban would say

[rguido]

Baseball is affected more by a player juicing than football could ever be...

[Big Dakota]

Baseball is affected more by a player juicing than football could ever be...


Not sure i buy that.

[tunahelper]

don't worry, I'm sure they're working on the technology to unmask HGH as we speak

they're doing marvelous things w/ technology nowadays, hopefully players recognize that it's only a matter of time before that technology becomes available though, don't want my favorite past-time spoiled by some idiots


HGH can be detected through blood tests and not piss tests. Players union will not submit to blood testing.

I dont blame them either.

Would you want to be stuck with a needle at anytime and possibly several times a year?

[burmafrd]

Playing football is not a right. You have to obey the rules. So what if they have to have blood tests 3-4 times a year. There are several industries that mandate that.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

HGH can be detected through blood tests and not piss tests. Players union will not submit to blood testing.

I dont blame them either.

Would you want to be stuck with a needle at anytime and possibly several times a year?

They are poked and prodded by trainers all the time.

[big dog cowboy]

Hank Steinbrenner says football has bigger steroid problem than baseball
He probably thinks the same thing about "professional wrestling" as well.

[CrazyCowboy]

Say it ain't so........;-(

[Yeagermeister]

He probably thinks the same thing about "professional wrestling" as well.

Wrestling is REAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :laugh2:

[LatinMind]

all these athletes are grown men, i dont really care what they do to their bodies, they'll pay the price later in life.

but really whats up with the government riding the high horse in all this steroid stuff anyways? they're pumping that stuff into meat and milk like nobodies buisness anyways. talk about HGH, what about 12 yr olds now days eating regular foods being 6ft 200 lbs already?

[joseephuss]

This is a ridiculous notion that baseball is being picked on right now. The NFL is probably riddled with athletes that are using steroids or HGH. I don't doubt that. Even though the testing is not the best system, the NFL has been doing it for a long time. They took some initiative way before baseball even thought about doing something.

MLB waited until they were prodded and prodded before they ever decided to begin testing. And then when they did start testing it was a terrible system. Much worse and lenient than the NFL. It took more prodding to get to the point of where they are currently. Baseball is now just catching up and that is why it appears they are being picked on now.

If MLB had shown some initiative early on they could have avoided all of this. They had several opportunities to jump in and get control of things. Instead they let this thing fester and grow into this circus. They have only themselves to blame. To cry about the NFL is just stupid.

[Doomsday101]

Instead of accusation offer proof. I would not be surprised if football did have a problem but just to throw this out there with nothing to support is a bit unfair to those who play the game.

[WoodysGirl]

Was watching Mike and Mike this morning and Greeny and Golic were actually getting heated discussing this. Greeny sided with Steinbreiner and Golic sided with the NFL.

Greeny suggested that because of the nature of NFL that there were probably a ton of steroid users in the NFL and that they should bring some of the old guard to congress to testify that they used steroids.

Golic made the point that the NFL addressed the problem on their own over 20 years ago and that baseball had to be drug in front of congress before adequately addressing the problem.

Greeny pointed out that Merriman tested positive for steroids and still went to the pro bowl. Golic then said "And what did the NFL the next year? They closed the loophole"

As for HGH, the point is that until there is a test, there's no way to know...at least until they develop a urine test. The NFLPA isn't going to agree to blood testing.

[big dog cowboy]

Was watching Mike and Mike this morning.....
I was listening to this on the radio and was waiting for Golic to reach over and knock Greeny out at any moment. One big thud from Greeny hitting the floor would have made my day. Good recap BTW!

[WoodysGirl]

I was listening to this on the radio and was waiting for Golic to reach over and knock Greeny out at any moment. One big thud from Greeny hitting the floor would have made my day. Good recap BTW!
I love Mike and Mike in the morning. I watch it before switching to local news so I can get the local traffic and weather updates.

But yeah, Golic was very animated on the set. Bouncing around, raising his arms. It was actually quite funny.

[big dog cowboy]

But yeah, Golic was very animated on the set. Bouncing around, raising his arms. It was actually quite funny.
That is what I thought. You could hear it in his voice.

[REDVOLUTION]

Steinbrenner was clearly deflecting....

and in the process just telling the truth...

Steroids are everywhere.... Olympics, Bicycling, Baseball, Football... everywhere.


The only was to really attack this is to have independent agencies running the test... AND... the player can only take the vitamins/supplement on a preapproved list.

If they find something new that they like and want to try... it has to pass independent research tests.

[WoodysGirl]

Steinbrenner was clearly deflecting....

and in the process just telling the truth...

Steroids are everywhere.... Olympics, Bicycling, Baseball, Football... everywhere.


The only was to really attack this is to have independent agencies running the test... AND... the player can only take the vitamins/supplement on a preapproved list.

If they find something new that they like and want to try... it has to pass independent research tests.
Not sure whether they have independent agencies proctoring the exams, but the NFL already gives the players a list of approved supplements. The onus is on the players not to take something that's not on the list.

[InmanRoshi]

Why can't we just accept the fact that they're all doping, the genie is out of the bottle and just move on? You're never going to be able to stop them from doing it. Nobody has more stringent and demanding drug testing and enforcement than cycling, and guess what ... they're all still doping. And they're competing for just a fraction of the incentives in fame and money that professional football and baseball players are.

[joseephuss]

Why can't we just accept the fact that they're all doping, the genie is out of the bottle and just move on? You're never going to be able to stop them from doing it. Nobody has more stringent and demanding drug testing and enforcement than cycling, and guess what ... they're all still doping. And they're competing for just a fraction of the incentives in fame and money that professional football and baseball players are.

I don't know about that. Fame maybe at least in the U.S., but the money is up there for the top cyclists.

[Doomsday101]

Why can't we just accept the fact that they're all doping, the genie is out of the bottle and just move on? You're never going to be able to stop them from doing it. Nobody has more stringent and demanding drug testing and enforcement than cycling, and guess what ... they're all still doping. And they're competing for just a fraction of the incentives in fame and money that professional football and baseball players are.

Because it puts the clean player in a position of doing it so that he does not lose his job. Sorry I don't think all players use not even in baseball. I think just looking the other way puts pressure on clean players to do the same and they should not be forced to put their health as risk because of it. If anything I think players should be kicked out of the league be it MLB or the NFL if caught using steroids. This would be the only way to stop it is by having a zero tolerance. Right now they get a suspension but not enough to deter

[InmanRoshi]

It already exists anyway. Sorry, if I'm someone like Sammy Sosa and I grew up in abject poverty in some shanty town in the Dominican and recruited at the age of 15 to start playing baseball and I start struggling my first few years in the big leagues ... If it comes down to taking steroids or flunking out of baseball, losing my work visa and going back to being poor in the DR with no education and no marketable skills other than playing baseball, I'm taking the needle. I don't care what the consequences are, nothing is worse than the alternative. The same could be said of any kind who grew up in some ghetto inner city in America.

[superpunk]

Why anyone would put any stock in unfounded speculation by a Steinbrenner is beyond me. At least football took big-time steps to attempt to prevent steroid use years ago. Baseball needed to have it's arse whipped by outside sources before they stopped reveling in the success steroids contributed to, and took some action against it.

[Doomsday101]

It already exists anyway. Sorry, if I'm someone like Sammy Sosa and I grew up in abject poverty in some shanty town in the Dominican and recruited at the age of 15 to start playing baseball and I start struggling my first few years in the big leagues ... If it comes down to taking steroids or flunking out of baseball, losing my work visa and going back to being poor in the DR with no education and no marketable skills other than playing baseball, I'm taking the needle. I don't care what the consequences are, nothing is worse than the alternative. The same could be said of any kind who grew up in some ghetto inner city in America.

As I said zero tolerance would deter if players knew they were banned from the sport for using steroids they would be less likely to do so. Right now a guy may miss a few games in baseball, so what a few games is worth the risk but being banned for life I think would wake some of these guys up. This game can be played clean and I do think many players do and should not be forced into a situation of using because some player choose to use

[InmanRoshi]

But here's the dirty little secret no one wants to admit ... fans would rather watch good players even if they are on steroids than watch a bunch of mediocre and horrible players play because all the good players have been kicked out of the league.

For all the steroid controversy and the fans feigning disgust, baseball attendance broke all records last year.

[Doomsday101]

But here's the dirty little secret no one wants to admit ... fans would rather watch good players even if they are on steroids than watch a bunch of mediocre and horrible players play because all the good players have been kicked out of the league.

For all the steroid controversy and the fans feigning disgust, baseball attendance broke all records last year.

Sometime you do what is right instead of what is popular. As I said I do think many players play the game clean and should not be forced to choose between their careers and using steroids.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Why can't we just accept the fact that they're all doping, the genie is out of the bottle and just move on? You're never going to be able to stop them from doing it. Nobody has more stringent and demanding drug testing and enforcement than cycling, and guess what ... they're all still doping. And they're competing for just a fraction of the incentives in fame and money that professional football and baseball players are.

Its a little something called the integrity of the game. If they took to your idea then it would soon become a joke like the WWE.

Its cheating plain and simple and players already risk enough as it is and compelling them to risk more serious health issues just to compete is plain wrong.

I just remember seeing Lyle Alzado before he died and there is no question in my mind that this is something that needs to be inhibited if not stopped.

I am very much so a proponent of you do what you want to do with you and your body but this is not the case here. If they allow doping then it suddenly becomes a necessity to compete which in essence forces athletes to shoot up. When your habits begin effecting other peoples lives is where the line is drawn. This clearly does and as such should be banned.

[Kangaroo]

HGH can be detected through blood tests and not piss tests. Players union will not submit to blood testing.

I dont blame them either.

Would you want to be stuck with a needle at anytime and possibly several times a year?
Do not join the Military because you are government property and have no say in it blood test for drugs if they wanted well guess what you are giving it up with no say.


The best part was people in training use to get money taken away from them for damaging government property for getting a sun burn :lmao:.

[dougonthebench]

great,thats allwe need,baseball interfering!

[InmanRoshi]

Its a little something called the integrity of the game. If they took to your idea then it would soon become a joke like the WWE.

Its cheating plain and simple and players already risk enough as it is and compelling them to risk more serious health issues just to compete is plain wrong.

I just remember seeing Lyle Alzado before he died and there is no question in my mind that this is something that needs to be inhibited if not stopped.


The WWE is a joke for reasons that go way beyond steroids. If everyone of of their performers stopped taking steroids, they're still a joke. Let's not be so naive again to pretend there isn't rampant use already. HGH can't be tested for without baseline samples, and even then that's unreliable as people's testosterone levels naturally fluctuate. The users will always be one step ahead of the testers, and the war on steroids will be about as effective as the war on drugs. This is just a matter of human nature and economics, and in this case the rewards are too high. There is no such thing as a level playing field and fairness, in nurture or nature. Someone always has some sort of advantage over someone else, whether it's genetics or the environment they were raised.

Lots of people die of glioblastomas just like Alzado, including my 20 year old niece. I don't suspsect she was using steroids, unless she was using it to ehance her high school choir performances. This is great example of the problem with this isssue ... people knee jerk and make these completely baseless correleary associastions, and now the word "steroids" has become such a bugaboo word and hot topic issue that scientists are having trouble finding funding for research for the thearpeutic benefits that could benefit you and me.

[Billy Bullocks]

As far as I know there is no blood test for HGH. And as far as I know none of the players unions are agreeing to allow blood testing.

I mean, I know their was steroid use in the NFL in the 1980's...but anyone who thinks guys are getting to where they are at without some HGH or whatever are totally kidding themselves.

The NFL has as big a problem as any league I think.

The biggest difference that I see:

In the NFL you don't have guys breaking Historic records season after season after season. I mean you got Emmitt breaking the rushing record, but that was more longevity than anything else. Tomlinson breaking the TD record. Brady throwing loads of TDs.

There were always guys who dominated the game in the NFL during their respective careers, but it hasn't reached a point where all of a sudden the most heralded records in the sport are being broken.

The playing field is just as even, wheras in baseball I think you saw alot more guys who achieved super human status because of steroids.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

The WWE is a joke for reasons that go way beyond steroids. If everyone of of their performers stopped taking steroids, they're still a joke. Let's not be so naive again to pretend there isn't rampant use already. HGH can't be tested for without baseline samples, and even then that's unreliable as people's testosterone levels naturally fluctuate. The users will always be one step ahead of the testers, and the war on steroids will be about as effective as the war on drugs. This is just a matter of human nature and economics, and in this case the rewards are too high. There is no such thing as a level playing field and fairness, in nurture or nature. Someone always has some sort of advantage over someone else, whether it's genetics or the environment they were raised.

Lots of people die of glioblastomas just like Alzado, including my 20 year old niece. I don't suspsect she was using steroids, unless she was using it to ehance her high school choir performances. This is great example of the problem with this isssue ... people knee jerk and make these completely baseless correleary associastions, and now the word "steroids" has become such a bugaboo word and hot topic issue that scientists are having trouble finding funding for research for the thearpeutic benefits that could benefit you and me.

Again when your habits begin to effect other peoples lives then it is something that needs to be curtailed. I am not some reactionary and my views on drug policy are akin to yours but this is different. If you want to hang out iin your backyard in a dumpster with several hookers and a bottle of draino, I do not care.

In this case, if steroids are given a free pass you are creating an environment where it is literally necessary to juice to compete. It at that point isnt in someones elses backyard anymore.

Lyle Alzado stated that his rampant steroid use in the 70s was key in his development of cancer. When you systematically speed the regrowth of tissue then you are going to increase the risks of cancer. They also wreak havoc on the renal system. That is not an ancillary correlation from anyone but the man himself.

Really though with your mindset you can justify just about anything. You cannot stop people from murdering other people its been going on for years and it will continue to go for years so we might as well just allow it, right? That is so obviously not a justification.

Oh and your fearmongering about the word is a bald faced lie. There are extensive testing involving steroids ranging from lupus and its kin to liung and other organ therapies. I know of these becaue of a condition that my mother has and there is no issue getting funding.

[InmanRoshi]

Lyle Alzado stated that his rampant steroid use in the 70s was key in his development of cancer. When you systematically speed the regrowth of tissue then you are going to increase the risks of cancer. They also wreak havoc on the renal system. That is not an ancillary correlation from anyone but the man himself.

Lyle Alzado was not a doctor or researcher of any kind and was simply trying to make sense of the fact that he was a tragic statistical anamoly. My niece believed that cellphones caused hers. If steroids caused glioblastoma, there would be former players dropping dead left and right. Just like if cellphones actually caused glioblastomas there would be teenagers dropping dead left and right. It's not happening. The baseless correlation has no basis in any type of scientific fact and is used by fear mongers.

[joseephuss]

Lyle Alzado was not a doctor or researcher of any kind and was simply trying to make sense of the fact that he was a statistical anamoly. My niece thought that cellphones caused hers. If steroids caused glioblastoma, there would be former players dropping dead of glioblastoma left and right. It's not happening. The correlation is used by fear mongers.

Steroids don't necessarily need to be considered dangerous. They are used quite a bit to help people, but there is still a lot we don't know about them when they are over used or abused. I don't think it is unreasonable to say that steroid use for athletes borders on steroid abuse. Those aren't normal doses these guys are taking. That may change the dynamic on how it affects a person's long term health, but how are we supposed to truly know. Steroids were not developed for that type of use. Are there extensive scientific studies on this type of use?

[jimmy40]

Well there are what, about 1900 nfl players including PS players? That would be about 6 tests per player per year. I'd say old Hank doesn't know what the hell he's talking about.So the NFL fixes games but can't fix tests? I'm not saying your one of the "the NFL is fixed" idiots but you can see where I'm going here.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Lyle Alzado was not a doctor or researcher of any kind and was simply trying to make sense of the fact that he was a tragic statistical anamoly. My niece believed that cellphones caused hers. If steroids caused glioblastoma, there would be former players dropping dead left and right. Just like if cellphones actually caused glioblastomas there would be teenagers dropping dead left and right. It's not happening. The baseless correlation has no basis in any type of scientific fact and is used by fear mongers.

Lyle Alzado wasnt an idiot and he also had some of the best medical help he could get at the time. Its not as if he wasnt in a position to make a informed decision. Youre crusade to try and paint anabolics as benign is pretty sad

I will repeat myself. Anything that accelerates cell growth tends towards cancer. There is no if ands or buts about it.

What do you think anabolic steroids do?

[mmillman]

Well there are what, about 1900 nfl players including PS players? That would be about 6 tests per player per year. I'd say old Hank doesn't know what the hell he's talking about.

I like the Sonny Six killer picture, but with all due respect you don't know what you are talking about.

Steroids are rampant in football. It is used in the NFL and has been since at least the early 70's. The vast majority of college guys use them. It is even becoming more and more prevalent in high school. Why? Because they work. If you want that college scholarship juice your indestructible. You want to make it into the pros juice you will get millions.

I know this because I have witnessed it first hand in football and track in college. It is naive to think that the premier sport for size, strength and speed is not using steroids. The NFL will tell you that they test but there are dozens of ways around those tests.

[superonyx]

Its a little something called the integrity of the game. If they took to your idea then it would soon become a joke like the WWE.

Its cheating plain and simple and players already risk enough as it is and compelling them to risk more serious health issues just to compete is plain wrong.

I just remember seeing Lyle Alzado before he died and there is no question in my mind that this is something that needs to be inhibited if not stopped.

I am very much so a proponent of you do what you want to do with you and your body but this is not the case here. If they allow doping then it suddenly becomes a necessity to compete which in essence forces athletes to shoot up. When your habits begin effecting other peoples lives is where the line is drawn. This clearly does and as such should be banned.

I really wanted to stay out of this debate. But the Lyle Alzado comments sucked me in. Please dont assume that Lyle dies due to steriods without some medical proof. The facts are the many media outlets tried to say his brain tumor was caused by steriods yet not a single medical organizations can tie steriod use to brain tumors. The facts actually show that testosterone and brain tumors have zero correlation. If they did dont you think Arnold and the early bodybuilders would have already started to die from tumors?
HGH can cause everything in your body to grow. Including a tumor. But the tumor has to already be their for this to happen. Steroids and HGH do not cause cells to mutate into cancer.

[superonyx]

Lyle Alzado wasnt an idiot and he also had some of the best medical help he could get at the time. Its not as if he wasnt in a position to make a informed decision. Youre crusade to try and paint anabolics as benign is pretty sad

I will repeat myself. Anything that accelerates cell growth tends towards cancer. There is no if ands or buts about it.

What do you think anabolic steroids do?

Please dont make the "no if ands or buts about it" comment on this topic.
So according to your comment accelerated cell growth causes cancer... hmm Shouldn't you look at the type of cell that the chemical has an effect on before you make this statement? So going with your "theory" being a man causes cancer? Since we have testosterone levels 600% over a womens. And being a black man is really a cause of cancer. Since they have a higher testosterone level than white or asian men. Now the goal isnt to make this about race. Just to point out the fact that anything that causes increased cell regrowth rates or reduced recovery time isnt tied to cancer. Especially when the chemical in question is shown not to have any effects on brain tumors. Now HGH is more dangerous if you have a hidden tumor. It can accelerate the growth of a tumor. However no medical researchers can show that HGH can CAUSE the tumor to form.

Please post us the info that says otherwise so we can go along with your "no if ands or buts" comment.

[JPM]

I really wanted to stay out of this debate. But the Lyle Alzado comments sucked me in. Please dont assume that Lyle dies due to steriods without some medical proof. The facts are the many media outlets tried to say his brain tumor was caused by steriods yet not a single medical organizations can tie steriod use to brain tumors. The facts actually show that testosterone and brain tumors have zero correlation. If they did dont you think Arnold and the early bodybuilders would have already started to die from tumors?
HGH can cause everything in your body to grow. Including a tumor. But the tumor has to already be their for this to happen. Steroids and HGH do not cause cells to mutate into cancer.
Great post. I have also heard that no long term studies have been done on the eefects of steroids.