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ConcordCowboy
04-17-2008, 01:57 AM
Clinton emphatically says Obama can win White House

http://msnbcmedia3.msn.com/j/ap/c355ec3d-ffa4-440c-9301-a278f1c92a5f.hmedium.jpg
Democratic presidential hopefuls, Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, D-N.Y., right, and Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., arrive for a Democratic presidential debate at the National Constitution Center, Wednesday, April 16, 2008, in Philadelphia.



PHILADELPHIA - Hillary Rodham Clinton said emphatically Wednesday night that Barack Obama can win the White House this fall, undercutting her efforts to deny him the Democratic presidential nomination by suggesting he would lead the party to defeat.

"Yes, yes, yes," she said when pressed about Obama's electability during a campaign debate six days before the Pennsylvania primary.

Asked a similar question about Clinton, Obama said "Absolutely and I've said so before" _ a not-so-subtle dig at his rival who had previously declined to make a similar statement about him.

In a 90-minute debate, both rivals pledged not to raise taxes on individuals making less than $200,000, and said they would respond forcefully if Iran obtains nuclear weapons and uses them against Israel.

"An attack on Israel would incur massive retaliation by the United States," said Clinton.

Obama said, "The U.S. would take appropriate action."

They differed over Social Security when Obama said he favored raising payroll taxes on higher-income individuals. Clinton said she was opposed, her rival quickly cut in and countered that she had said earlier in the campaign she was open to the idea.

Under current law, workers must pay the payroll tax on their first $102,000 in wages. Obama generally has expressed support for a plan to reimpose the tax beginning at a level of $200,000 or more.

The debate was the 21st of the campaign for the nomination, an epic struggle that could last weeks or even months longer.

Pennsylvania, with 158 delegates at stake, is a must-win contest for Clinton, who leads in the polls and hopes for a strong victory to propel her through the other states that vote before the primary season ends on June 3.

Obama leads in the delegate chase, 1,643-1,504, with 2,025 needed for the nomination. And despite a recent gaffe, he picked up endorsements during the day from three superdelegates from a pair of states with primaries on May 6 _ Reps. Andre Carson of Indiana and Mel Watt and David Price of North Carolina.

After primaries and caucuses in 42 of the 50 states, Obama leads his rival in convention delegates, popular votes and states won. She is struggling to stop his drive on the nomination by appealing to party leaders who will attend the convention as superdelegates that he will preside over an electoral defeat at a moment of great opportunity after eight years of Republican rule.

The former first lady has never denied published reports that she once told New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson that Obama couldn't win when he called to tell her he would be endorsing the Illinois senator.

And at a news conference earlier this month in California, Clinton sidestepped when asked directly whether Obama would win if he were the Democratic nominee. "I am sure we will have a united Democratic Party. I will do everything possible to make sure we can win and I am confident we will have a Democrat in the White House next year," she said at the time.

Asked a similar question at the debate, she provided a similar answer at first. "I think we have to beat John McCain and I have every reason to believe we're going to have a Democratic president and it's going to be Barack or me."

Pressed by George Stephanopoulos of ABC News to answer the question directly, she said, "Yes, yes, yes ... Now I think I can do a better job."

In a debate that moved swiftly between politics and policy, Clinton issued a first-ever public apology for having claimed erroneously that she landed in Bosnia under sniper fire in 1996 as first lady.

"I may be a lot of things but I am not dumb," she said, adding that she had written in her book that there had been no gunfire during the episode. She said she was embarrassed by her error. "I'm sorry I said it," she added.

She previously had explained her incorrect comments by saying she had misspoken.

Obama later erred by saying he had never favored a ban on handguns even though as a state Senate candidate in 1996 he filled out a questionnaire from an Illinois voter group saying he would support such a ban.

"My writing wasn't on that particular questionnaire ... as I said, I have never favored an all-out ban on handguns," Obama said, even though his handwritten notes did appear on its front page. The reponse to the question about guns was typed.

Obama had more explaining to do moments later, when he was asked about his controversial comment that small town Americans become bitter because of economic adversity, and "cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them" as a result.

He said he was attempting to say that because voters feel ignored by government, "they end up being much more concerned about votes around things like guns where traditions have been passed on from generation to generation. And those are incredibly important to them."

"People don't cling to their traditions on hunting and guns" out of frustration with their government, Clinton said. She added that Obama had a fundamental misunderstanding on the role of religion and faith.

Both Obama and Clinton sidestepped when asked if they would place their rival on the ticket as vice presidential running mate in the fall.

"I think very highly of Senator Clinton's record, but I think it is premature at this point to talk about who the vice presidential candidates will be because we're still trying to determine who the nominee will be," Obama said.

Clinton was similarly noncommittal. "I'm going to do everything I possibly can to make sure that one of us takes the oath of office next January. I think that has to be the overriding goal," she said.

Neither rival was willing to say they would ask President Bush to serve in any capacity after he leaves office. Obama volunteered he would be "more likely to ask the advice of the current president's father. He said, that as president, George H. W. Bush had presided over a "wise foreign policy" at the time the Cold War was ending.

ABC News sponsored and televised the debate, with Charles Gibson and Stephanopoulos moderating.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23280236/

Heisenberg
04-17-2008, 03:03 AM
The only thing I took out of this debate is that it was by far the worst one of this election season.

That and Obama looked tired.

Jordan55
04-17-2008, 06:41 AM
Same old rhetoric, nothing new to the equation. Just more promises for more social programs, increased government spending yet nothing as to how were going to pay for it. Were cutting and running on Iraq, we have now done the dirty work for Iran. Yet nothing was addressed on the consequences of our pullout. Maybe we will send Jimmy Carter over there to talk to Iran.
Democratic leadership at it best, nothing has changed!
Tax increases during a recession, not a bright ideal.

heavyg
04-17-2008, 06:54 AM
I laughed at Obamas comment that "The appropriate action" would be taken if Israel were attacked :lmao:

What would that be. Sitting down with them and discussing their feelings on why they attacked Israel and singing kumbiya(sp)

BrAinPaiNt
04-17-2008, 07:21 AM
I laughed at Obamas comment that "The appropriate action" would be taken if Israel were attacked :lmao:

What would that be. Sitting down with them and discussing their feelings on why they attacked Israel and singing kumbiya(sp)

Know this Heavyg...there are very few things that the dems and republicans agree on...Israel is one of them.

ZeroClub
04-17-2008, 07:44 AM
The only thing I took out of this debate is that it was by far the worst one of this election season.

That and Obama looked tired.

Yeah, the debate was dull, tired, and, at times, petty.

But that's to be expected. This was the 21st debate. For the 21st time, a few hours were spent talking about the same basic stuff that was talked about 20 times before. I don't care who is talking for the 21st time, event 21 is hardly a recipe for excitement....

I don't have the link handy, but somewhere on the Time/CNN website it was observed that Obama's television makeup was inexplicably horrendous. I thought he looked kind of pasty and perhaps tired; maybe some of this was due to his makeup.

It is becoming clear that the longer this primary process continues, the more it hurts the Democrats' chances in the general election.

iceberg
04-17-2008, 08:18 AM
Know this Heavyg...there are very few things that the dems and republicans agree on...Israel is one of them.

then why wait till after they're attacked w/nukes?

-----
In a 90-minute debate, both rivals pledged not to raise taxes on individuals making less than $200,000, and said they would respond forcefully if Iran obtains nuclear weapons and uses them against Israel.

"An attack on Israel would incur massive retaliation by the United States," said Clinton.

Obama said, "The U.S. would take appropriate action."
-----

i guess what we've learned from bush is it's improper to head off an attack, you must wait till the dust settles before you do anything *after* the attack.

heavyg
04-17-2008, 08:56 AM
then why wait till after they're attacked w/nukes?

-----
In a 90-minute debate, both rivals pledged not to raise taxes on individuals making less than $200,000, and said they would respond forcefully if Iran obtains nuclear weapons and uses them against Israel.

"An attack on Israel would incur massive retaliation by the United States," said Clinton.

Obama said, "The U.S. would take appropriate action."
-----

i guess what we've learned from bush is it's improper to head off an attack, you must wait till the dust settles before you do anything *after* the attack.



LOL. This reminds of the parent telling a child to stop doing something. Saying im gonna count to 3. Start counting and when they get to 3 they do anything and start the counting over again......lol

Heisenberg
04-17-2008, 09:17 AM
then why wait till after they're attacked w/nukes?

-----
In a 90-minute debate, both rivals pledged not to raise taxes on individuals making less than $200,000, and said they would respond forcefully if Iran obtains nuclear weapons and uses them against Israel.

"An attack on Israel would incur massive retaliation by the United States," said Clinton.

Obama said, "The U.S. would take appropriate action."
-----

i guess what we've learned from bush is it's improper to head off an attack, you must wait till the dust settles before you do anything *after* the attack.

It's a poorly written story. Both of them said that priority number 1 is to make sure that Iran doesn't get nukes in the first place.

Then they were asked what would happen if Iran did attack Israel. Then you get these answers.

BrAinPaiNt
04-17-2008, 09:19 AM
then why wait till after they're attacked w/nukes?

-----
In a 90-minute debate, both rivals pledged not to raise taxes on individuals making less than $200,000, and said they would respond forcefully if Iran obtains nuclear weapons and uses them against Israel.

"An attack on Israel would incur massive retaliation by the United States," said Clinton.

Obama said, "The U.S. would take appropriate action."
-----

i guess what we've learned from bush is it's improper to head off an attack, you must wait till the dust settles before you do anything *after* the attack.



"I think that we should be looking to create an umbrella of deterrence that goes much further than just Israel," she said.

"We will let the Iranians know, that, yes, an attack on Israel would trigger massive retaliation, but so would an attack on those countries that are willing to go under the security umbrella and forswear their own nuclear ambitions." -The Wicked Witch

"I will take no options off the table when it comes to preventing them from using nuclear weapons or obtaining nuclear weapons," he said. "And that would include any threats directed at Israel, or any of our allies." - Manchurian Candidate

BrAinPaiNt
04-17-2008, 09:20 AM
It's a poorly written story. Both of them said that priority number 1 is to make sure that Iran doesn't get nukes in the first place.

Then they were asked what would happen if Iran did attack Israel. Then you get these answers.

Shhh...let the guy that does not like labels...label himself by cherry picking things.:D

Jordan55
04-17-2008, 09:23 AM
then why wait till after they're attacked w/nukes?

-----
In a 90-minute debate, both rivals pledged not to raise taxes on individuals making less than $200,000, and said they would respond forcefully if Iran obtains nuclear weapons and uses them against Israel.

"An attack on Israel would incur massive retaliation by the United States," said Clinton.

Obama said, "The U.S. would take appropriate action."
-----

i guess what we've learned from bush is it's improper to head off an attack, you must wait till the dust settles before you do anything *after* the attack.

Jimmy Carter, as secretary of state. I can see it now.
Raising taxes during a recession, great move.:thumbdo:

Doomsday101
04-17-2008, 09:28 AM
Jimmy Carter, as secretary of state. I can see it now.
Raising taxes during a recession, great move.:thumbdo:

I agree. Could be worse they could allow him to run foreign affairs. Under him we saw the Oil Embargo which created the long gas lines as well as only being able to buy gas on odd or even days depending on your license plate. We also saw Iran take our people hostage also the boycotting of the Olympics because of Russia going into Afghanistan as if making the athlete waste their talents was going to change anything and yet there are some out there that look at Carter as some world affair genius?

BrAinPaiNt
04-17-2008, 09:31 AM
Jimmy Carter, as secretary of state. I can see it now.
Raising taxes during a recession, great move.:thumbdo:

Carter was an all around idiot. Terrible president. I think he was a good man, but just a terrible president.

Jordan55
04-17-2008, 09:47 AM
More support for Obama!

Hamas Endorses Obama

On Sunday, Aaron Klein and John Batchelor interviewed Ahmed Yousef, chief political adviser to the Prime Minister of Hamas, on WABC radio. The interview produced a scoop which, for some reason, has not been widely publicized: Hamas has endorsed Barack Obama for President. Yousef said, "We like Mr. Obama and we hope he will win the election." Why? "He has a vision to change America." Maybe Yousef has some insight into what Obama means by all these vague references to "change."

Of course, Hamas's taste in American presidents is suspect. Yousef also described Jimmy Carter, who was about to pay a call on Hamas when the interview was taped, as "this noble man" who "did an excellent job as President."

Yousef was asked about Obama's condemnation of Carter's visit with Hamas, but didn't seem troubled by it. Hamas, he says, understands American politics; this is the election season, and everyone wants to sound like a friend of Israel. Nevertheless, he hopes that the Democrats will change American policies when they take office.

iceberg
04-17-2008, 09:50 AM
Shhh...let the guy that does not like labels...label himself by cherry picking things.:D

heh, good shot bp. : )

sorry, was on my way into the office and doing some last minute reading and that just struck me funny. i would think by now everyone realizes if there's possible sarcasm in my tone, it's there. period. whether or not the smiley is there going HEY LOOK - SARCASM!!! : )

but duely noted on my use of cherry picking, bp. not my intent cause i read through it fast but it does read that way.

:)
:) :)
:) :p: :)
:) :)
:)

BrAinPaiNt
04-17-2008, 10:11 AM
heh, good shot bp. : )

sorry, was on my way into the office and doing some last minute reading and that just struck me funny. i would think by now everyone realizes if there's possible sarcasm in my tone, it's there. period. whether or not the smiley is there going HEY LOOK - SARCASM!!! : )

but duely noted on my use of cherry picking, bp. not my intent cause i read through it fast but it does read that way.

:)
:) :)
:) :p: :)
:) :)
:)

Well you bring up points that I don't think they would be as proactive in possible preemptive strikes. I think they would be more cautious.

However as I stated before, I really believe that is one of the areas that repubs and dems agree on. One of the very few...some of the others are power and money.:D

iceberg
04-17-2008, 10:18 AM
Well you bring up points that I don't think they would be as proactive in possible preemptive strikes. I think they would be more cautious.

However as I stated before, I really believe that is one of the areas that repubs and dems agree on. One of the very few...some of the others are power and money.:D

well i think they also both agree that if iran gets close israel will fully defend itself from the promise of iranian leadership.

BrAinPaiNt
04-17-2008, 10:25 AM
well i think they also both agree that if iran gets close israel will fully defend itself from the promise of iranian leadership.

Israel would blow the hades out of Iran. You don't live that long smack dab in the middle of the arab world without having some power to put a hurt on somebody.

In some ways Iran should be happy that the US has such a close relationship with Israel because I think if it were not for us keeping them calm or using logic with them they would have blown Iran off the map long ago.

That is why i would like to see Israel do a bulk of the work if we do indeed attack Iran down the road. It not only puts Iran in it's place but it sends a powerful message to others that Israel has power and to stop messing with it. I think this MAY...big may, disrupt Hamas and Huzzyboller with their operations.

Jordan55
04-17-2008, 02:51 PM
http://bp3.blogger.com/_ZTsdiIlN_8s/R8dIbecVkaI/AAAAAAAADWs/7t8JHxP5IS4/s400/republican-nowelfare.jpg

You have to like this slogan after last nights performance, was there anything Democratic canidates addressed, that would have broached some form of fiscal restraints.
Can we all say BIG GOVERNMENT!

I know some of you can :)

Jordan55
04-17-2008, 03:14 PM
My parting shot, till I return


http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IMAGES/CARTOONS/toon032608.gif