Redskins... a mammoth disaster in the making

[TOOMBS]

I am so glad that this organization is my most hated. It is so easy to laugh at their every move, and rationalize my extreme dislike.

Let's start off with this joke of a coach. Zorn....... A QB coach hired to be offensive coordinator who is now the head coach because the real desired head coach refused to work for that d-bag Snyder. But wait, wasn't Zorn really the guy they were eyeballing all along?.....sure. This guy knows he has no freaking buisness coaching a pro-football team, but can you blame him for taking the job? It was given to him by defacto........there was simply no one else and the clock was ticking. How good do you think this chump is going to perform in such a dysfunctional organization as his FIRST TIME EVER CALLING PLAYS. DOOM~!

Now let's move to their giant collection of overpaid, no-talent sock-cuckers. It's a shame that the most talented player on their roster died, but that is the kind of dark cloud that tends to hang over this organization. I mean FINALLY they use their first round pick to draft a stud.....finally at long last they have an absolute stud and they actually are getting more than their money's worth for him and he up and dies.

Their line is injury prone, their running back is injury prone, their receivers are WAY below average, their d-line cannot rush the QB other than Carter who is only the 2nd or 3rd best pass-rusher on any other team, their linebackers are
average. Has Springs ever finished a season? Smoot is ... pathetic. Carlos Rodgers is .. kinda a bust. Landry is now the most talented person on defense by far, and on offense the most talented person is?????? Portis is a shell of what he was in Denver and injury prone. I suppose Portis is their best offensive player, but that is pretty sad.

Seriously, am I biased or is this team less talented than other NFC duds such as the Lions, Cardinals, Bucs? Please, someone name me one NFC team with less young talent than the Skins. I would love to know.

What about the draft.....that should turn this ship around! No. Their top 3 picks were 2 receivers, which are historically the biggest gamble and longest payoff in the draft, and a backup tight-end. Sadly, this draft will do absolutely nothing to help them this year.

My prediction........ skins 6 wins on a prayer. Most likely 4 though.

p.s. Don't even get me started on thier borderline retarded QB that got outplayed by a career backup *Collins*

[sonnyboy]

I hear you. That franchise is a train wreck. I started an interesting thread on what its like to be a redsucks fan. But it was a little too close to the Rogers tragedy and some of our more sensitive members got their panties in a bunch and had it removed.

[sago1]

They maybe all the things you call them. But the reality is they played us tough in both games last year. We barely beat them in the game in Dallas & lost to them in a "don't care" game cause we had nothing on the line. Having said all that, sure would love if they the wheels came off of their wagon. If you read their ExtremeSkins blog, most believe they have a very talented team & if Al Saunders had not been brought to score up their magnificant offense they think the would have added another Lombardi Trophy. Don't know what world these guys live in. When the Cowboys are bad, we know and say they are bad. I guess being a Redskins fans means you have no sense of reality.

[2much2soon]

Here, here :bow:

10pts extra credit for creative evasion of the language filter :lmao2:

[VCDefectors]

The Redskins will be a lot better than 4-12. I can promise you that much. They just might be one of those teams that end up surprising a lot of people. It's way too early to write them off.

That being said, I think it's safe to say that they probably do have more holes (or less overall talent) than the other NFC East teams. To me, they are about a .500 team but will probably swing a couple of games one way or the other (6-10 or 10-6).

[TOOMBS]

The Redskins will be a lot better than 4-12. I can promise you that much. They just might be one of those teams that end up surprising a lot of people. It's way too early to write them off.

That being said, I think it's safe to say that they probably do have more holes (or less overall talent) than the other NFC East teams. To me, they are about a .500 team but will probably swing a couple of games one way or the other (6-10 or 10-6).

Thanks for another viewpoint! I was just wondering if you could please name a team in the NFC with less young talent than the Redskins. I've been thinking about it for a while and I just can't seem to figure it out.

thanks :)

p.s. Maybe 49ers? Bears? ..... that still doesn't sound right

[DawnOfANewD]

You probably also ridiculed the Giants last year before the season started. How'd that work out?

[dwarecwby311]

TOOMBS for president

[dozin_theknick]

I am so glad that this organization is my most hated. It is so easy to laugh at their every move, and rationalize my extreme dislike.

Let's start off with this joke of a coach. Zorn....... A QB coach hired to be offensive coordinator who is now the head coach because the real desired head coach refused to work for that d-bag Snyder. But wait, wasn't Zorn really the guy they were eyeballing all along?.....sure. This guy knows he has no freaking buisness coaching a pro-football team, but can you blame him for taking the job? It was given to him by defacto........there was simply no one else and the clock was ticking. How good do you think this chump is going to perform in such a dysfunctional organization as his FIRST TIME EVER CALLING PLAYS. DOOM~!

Now let's move to their giant collection of overpaid, no-talent sock-cuckers. It's a shame that the most talented player on their roster died, but that is the kind of dark cloud that tends to hang over this organization. I mean FINALLY they use their first round pick to draft a stud.....finally at long last they have an absolute stud and they actually are getting more than their money's worth for him and he up and dies.

Their line is injury prone, their running back is injury prone, their receivers are WAY below average, their d-line cannot rush the QB other than Carter who is only the 2nd or 3rd best pass-rusher on any other team, their linebackers are
average. Has Springs ever finished a season? Smoot is ... pathetic. Carlos Rodgers is .. kinda a bust. Landry is now the most talented person on defense by far, and on offense the most talented person is?????? Portis is a shell of what he was in Denver and injury prone. I suppose Portis is their best offensive player, but that is pretty sad.

Seriously, am I biased or is this team less talented than other NFC duds such as the Lions, Cardinals, Bucs? Please, someone name me one NFC team with less young talent than the Skins. I would love to know.

What about the draft.....that should turn this ship around! No. Their top 3 picks were 2 receivers, which are historically the biggest gamble and longest payoff in the draft, and a backup tight-end. Sadly, this draft will do absolutely nothing to help them this year.

My prediction........ skins 6 wins on a prayer. Most likely 4 though.

p.s. Don't even get me started on thier borderline retarded QB that got outplayed by a career backup *Collins*

Come on, tell us what you really think. Stop *****-footing....

[BAZ]

People would of said the same about Wade Phillips before the start of last season. I think the coaching change will help the team, the game had just passed Gibbs by. Giving Portis 500 touches a year was too much. The WC system coming in will help JC and Cooley is a legitimate threat.

The Skins have been playing hard the last few years, I think that and the Giants having a Superbowl hangover, the Eagles going through a big transition period and the rest of the NFC being terrible, they have a good chance to get into the playoffs.

[TOOMBS]

You probably also ridiculed the Giants last year before the season started. How'd that work out?

Still waiting for one team with less young talent in the NFC.

[KD]

:dissskin:

[Boysboy]

The Skins aren't great, obviously, but they're not as bad as they look either.

If anything-Gibbs himself costed them a number of games during his 2nd stint-and yes, hiring Saunders, someone who has a completely different philosophy than him, was also a big mistake.

Saunders, IMHO, would be a perfect fit here b/c our biggest strength is the passing game, but he just didn't mesh with someone who plays old-school offense.

[CrazyCowboy]

love to hear neg about the skins

[LeonDixson]

Atlanta's cupboard is pretty threadbare. Regardless of what the Skins' overall record is, they always play us pretty tough. I've said it a hundred times; when it comes to the Cowboys/Redskins games you can throw records, team talent and everything else out the window. I don't know if there is a rivalry in football that includes more upset victories between the two teams than this one.

[Boysboy]

Atlanta's cupboard is pretty threadbare. Regardless of what the Skins' overall record is, they always play us pretty tough. I've said it a hundred times; when it comes to the Cowboys/Redskins games you can throw records, team talent and everything else out the window. I don't know if there is a rivalry in football that includes more upset victories between the two teams than this one.

Every NFCE matchup will be a barnburner 99% of the time. Even though we beat the Giants twice in the 2 reg season meetings-in all reality, both were alot closer than the double digit scores indicated. In both meetings, they actually botched a number of opportunities that could have blown the games wide open for them.

And if you remember in '05 when McNabb/Westbrook/Tra Thomas went down, and TO got kicked off, the Eagles, despite having puny-armed Mike McMahon under center and some 4th round bust by the name of Ryan Motes carrying the load, they nonetheless played their NFCE opponents tough, despite the losses.

[VCDefectors]

Thanks for another viewpoint! I was just wondering if you could please name a team in the NFC with less young talent than the Redskins. I've been thinking about it for a while and I just can't seem to figure it out.

thanks :)

p.s. Maybe 49ers? Bears? ..... that still doesn't sound right

A team worse than the Redskins in the NFC? Did you see the Falcons play at all last season by chance? What about the Rams?

Listen, I know you are probably just going off on a Redskins hater rant like every Cowboys fan should, right? The tone of your original post came off like that.

Just to be fair, I am a regular over at Extremeskins.com and I have to listen to many idiotic comments from Redskins fans about how our team is overrated and that we won't ever win a playoff game and all kinds of other nonsense. Being in an environment like that causes you to take a look in your own backyard, so to speak. There seems to be a lot of smack and so little gold between the fans of two teams who have basically had the same lack of success since the last Cowboys SB.

I just wanted to share that perspective so you know where I'm coming from.

[LeonDixson]

Every NFCE matchup will be a barnburner 99% of the time. Even though we beat the Giants twice in the 2 reg season meetings-in all reality, both were alot closer than the double digit scores indicated. In both meetings, they actually botched a number of opportunities that could have blown the games wide open for them.

And if you remember in '05 when McNabb/Westbrook/Tra Thomas went down, and TO got kicked off, the Eagles, despite having puny-armed Mike McMahon under center and some 4th round bust by the name of Ryan Motes carrying the load, they nonetheless played their NFCE opponents tough, despite the losses.
I agree with that, but I don't think it contradicts what I posted.

[Boysboy]

A team worse than the Redskins in the NFC? Did you see the Falcons play at all last season by chance? What about the Rams?

Listen, I know you are probably just going off on a Redskins hater rant like every Cowboys fan should, right? The tone of your original post came off like that.

Just to be fair, I am a regular over at Extremeskins.com and I have to listen to many idiotic comments from Redskins fans about how our team is overrated and that we won't ever win a playoff game and all kinds of other nonsense. Being in an environment like that causes you to take a look in your own backyard, so to speak. There seems to be a lot of smack and so little gold between the fans of two teams who have basically had the same lack of success since the last Cowboys SB.

I just wanted to share that perspective so you know where I'm coming from.

Just FWIW-the Skins will likely start out slow, not bad, but slow, for the reason being that entire team will be adapting to a completely new coaching philosophy for the first time in 4 years. Then afterwards, they should get better and finish the season strongly.

As for Zorn-he comes off as a potentially good coach. And promoting Gregg Williams? Actually-that would have been GOOD for us and the rest of the NFCE? Why? B/c the guy's hardly a decent communicator. We saw this in Buffalo, and he was also the same guy who started that post-ST game by putting only 10 D members on the field, on the first play, WITHOUT telling Gibbs.

As for their draft-yeah, drafting 2 wideouts in a span of 5 or so minutes was a big reach-but you gotta remember the draft is ultimately about getting the best players AVAILABLE, not so much as filling VOIDS immediately.(I believe a number of Zoners here agreed on that)

[Eddie]

I bet there's the exact same thread, except titled "Cowboys ... a mammoth disaster in the making" on ES.

[BraveHeartFan]

I'm with everyone on how bad they might be but I also have this sort of sick feeling that they might wind up being good just because everyone is expecting them to be terrible.

Last year it was the GMen who were suppose to be terrible cause of all their Coaching issues and their defense fighting with one another from the year before and early in the year, no one buying into Toms coaching, and yadda yadda. Then all they did was go on and win it all.

I doubt the Skins will win it all, regardless, cause they don't have a good enough defense, but none the less I'm less than thrilled at the idea of just totally leaving them for dead.

[dbair1967]

The Redskins will be a lot better than 4-12. I can promise you that much. They just might be one of those teams that end up surprising a lot of people. It's way too early to write them off.

That being said, I think it's safe to say that they probably do have more holes (or less overall talent) than the other NFC East teams. To me, they are about a .500 team but will probably swing a couple of games one way or the other (6-10 or 10-6).

I think its doubtful they are alot better than 4-12, though I guess what amounts to "alot" is debatable. If they won more than 6 or 7 I'll be surprised though

David

[dbair1967]

I bet there's the exact same thread, except titled "Cowboys ... a mammoth disaster in the making" on ES.

only in the bizarro world of ES would anyone actually believe that though

our team is absolutely loaded and clearly one of the 2 or 3 most talented teams from man one to man fifty-three in the league...only a rash of serious injuries or an early season injury to Romo could derail us from winning at least 11 or 12 games, and IMO we'll win 13 or 14 if we stay fairly healthy

David

[followthestar]

only in the bizarro world of ES would anyone actually believe that though

our team is absolutely loaded and clearly one of the 2 or 3 most talented teams from man one to man fifty-three in the league...only a rash of serious injuries or an early season injury to Romo could derail us from winning at least 11 or 12 games, and IMO we'll win 13 or 14 if we stay fairly healthy

David

anyone who remotely follows football or even the gossip mags or golf or whatever is aware of the Cowboys being a successful franchise - a Contender to win it all. One glance at the ProBowl roster would tell you the same thing. But the Skins on the other hand, I have to agree there aren't too many teams with inferior talent, coaching, and front office (read Snyder). If they go 10-6 in this decade I'll be amazed, and that would have to be with two wins vs. the Eagles...

The Skins are our most hated rivals, though not our most feared. Those have been mostly the Eagles, now lately the Giants again. The Skins? They do manage to pull out a few wins each year and I always underestimate them, it seems. But maybe this year I'll be right. 5-11 for the Skins. Cya.

[Bizwah]

I would love to see the Redskins go 4-12, then trade the pick away for an over-the-hill vet.

But it won't happen.

There's still quite a bit of talent on that team....Not YOUNG talent...but talent.

The OL is talented. Samuels is one of the best LTs in the NFC. Randy Thomas is a very good OG. If Jansen returns healthy, then he's one of the best RTs in the NFC. Rabach is a solid center.

Portis and Betts may be the most talented one-two punch at RB in the NFC. Cooley is a very good TE. Moss and ARE don't scare too many teams, but they aren't slouches either.

Their main weakness on offense is at QB. Campbell is very raw. He showed some flashes last year. A lot of QBs flash......some continue to improve...some continue to flash. Time will tell with Campbell.

I feel their defense really overachieves. Their lack of talent on the DL is masked by their continuous blitzing.

Griffin, Washington, Fletcher, Springs, and Landry are all very good players. McIntosh, Rogers, and Carter all are solid.

The fact is, there's just too much talent for them to go 4-12...even with a new coaching staff. I think they're pretty much an 8-8 team. A couple of bad breaks will put them under .500, a couple of good breaks will have them above .500.

All that being said, I believe they're probably the fourth-best team in our division.

But they're nowhere near being the worst team in the NFC.

[DallasDomination]

I am so glad that this organization is my most hated. It is so easy to laugh at their every move, and rationalize my extreme dislike.

Let's start off with this joke of a coach. Zorn....... A QB coach hired to be offensive coordinator who is now the head coach because the real desired head coach refused to work for that d-bag Snyder. But wait, wasn't Zorn really the guy they were eyeballing all along?.....sure. This guy knows he has no freaking buisness coaching a pro-football team, but can you blame him for taking the job? It was given to him by defacto........there was simply no one else and the clock was ticking. How good do you think this chump is going to perform in such a dysfunctional organization as his FIRST TIME EVER CALLING PLAYS. DOOM~!

Now let's move to their giant collection of overpaid, no-talent sock-cuckers. It's a shame that the most talented player on their roster died, but that is the kind of dark cloud that tends to hang over this organization. I mean FINALLY they use their first round pick to draft a stud.....finally at long last they have an absolute stud and they actually are getting more than their money's worth for him and he up and dies.

Their line is injury prone, their running back is injury prone, their receivers are WAY below average, their d-line cannot rush the QB other than Carter who is only the 2nd or 3rd best pass-rusher on any other team, their linebackers are
average. Has Springs ever finished a season? Smoot is ... pathetic. Carlos Rodgers is .. kinda a bust. Landry is now the most talented person on defense by far, and on offense the most talented person is?????? Portis is a shell of what he was in Denver and injury prone. I suppose Portis is their best offensive player, but that is pretty sad.

Seriously, am I biased or is this team less talented than other NFC duds such as the Lions, Cardinals, Bucs? Please, someone name me one NFC team with less young talent than the Skins. I would love to know.

What about the draft.....that should turn this ship around! No. Their top 3 picks were 2 receivers, which are historically the biggest gamble and longest payoff in the draft, and a backup tight-end. Sadly, this draft will do absolutely nothing to help them this year.

My prediction........ skins 6 wins on a prayer. Most likely 4 though.

p.s. Don't even get me started on thier borderline retarded QB that got outplayed by a career backup *Collins*


I like this guy...+ rep for you:lmao2:

[dfense]

The Redskins will be a lot better than 4-12. I can promise you that much. They just might be one of those teams that end up surprising a lot of people. It's way too early to write them off.

That being said, I think it's safe to say that they probably do have more holes (or less overall talent) than the other NFC East teams. To me, they are about a .500 team but will probably swing a couple of games one way or the other (6-10 or 10-6). having a rookie-ish QB who now has to learn a completely different offense will be the rise or fall of that team.

[dogunwo]

I've said it a hundred times; when it comes to the Cowboys/Redskins games you can throw records, team talent and everything else out the window.


I don't think I ever heard that before. Great quote there!

[TOOMBS]

Atlanta's cupboard is pretty threadbare. Regardless of what the Skins' overall record is, they always play us pretty tough. I've said it a hundred times; when it comes to the Cowboys/Redskins games you can throw records, team talent and everything else out the window. I don't know if there is a rivalry in football that includes more upset victories between the two teams than this one.


Thank you. I conceed that Atlanta is a tiny bit worse than the Skins on young talent.

I care not about how they play us.....that is rivalry . I mean if we beat them with our only win of a season proves that team strength means nothing when we play each other.

[Canada180]

The Redskins are an insult to sock cuckers everywhere

:lmao2:

[dooomsday]

I dont understand their direction TOOMBS. Thrown together with spit and gum, long with $ but still have no superstars! Joke. If you are going to spend get some hucking felp!

Last year they ranked 27th in ave. age.

[Chuck 54]

Let's start off with this joke of a coach. A QB coach hired to be offensive coordinator who is now the head coach

Ummmm....I hope you see the irony in this statement since that also would describe Jason Garrett who went from Quarterback Coach to Offensive Coordinator in big D, with even less coaching experience than Zorn...yet many fans wanted him as the Head Coach over Wade.

I'm not saying that Zorn and the REdskins won't suck...just pointing out the irony, the pot calling the kettle black thing.

[CowboyWay]

I have to agree with the OP. That team is headed for a downward spiral big time.
1. You go as your qb goes. Campbell stinks and has shown very little. Quincy 2.0 with the only difference being that Q-Car Spoke better English.

2. Offensive line is really getting up there in age. They have talent there sure, but can they stay healthy is the big question. I don't believe they can.

3. The recievers are painfully average. Santana was their best, but he's only a #2. ARE would be a decent #3. As far as the two rookie WR's they drafted, they certainly won't help them this year, and I believe both are busts. There is a reason they both dropped out of the 2nd round.

4. Portis is a little injury prone, but you have to like the kids heart. I can't say anything bad about him. Same goes for Cooley. Hard not to like that kid.

Defense.
Smoot. Awful
Carlos rodgers God Awful
Shawn Springs. Can still play if he's healthy. But getting up there in age.

Linebackers. Serviceable

Dline. Decrepid. Poor, poor, poor. Some are also collecting Social Security

Coaching. They have more turnover than the 3rd shift at Waffle House. Zorn is way over his head. He doesn't even know the colors of own team. How do you go from QB coach to Head Coach? Nobody in the league wanted that job, and lil Danny knew it. Gibbs left that team in shambles. Traded away draft picks like they were baseball cards and never infused any young talent on an aging and expensive roster. If a coach had done what he Gibbs did in Dallas, I'd be pissed. He will destroy that team for the next 5 years until they rebuild through the draft.

Laughing at the stinks isn't even a challenge anymore. Their franchise is so pathetically run it boggles the mind. The best thing to ever happen to that team (besides strike years) is lil danny buying it. He will destroy that team like he has destroyed so many other things he's touched.

[CowboyWay]

Ummmm....I hope you see the irony in this statement since that also would describe Jason Garrett who went from Quarterback Coach to Offensive Coordinator in big D, with even less coaching experience than Zorn...yet many fans wanted him as the Head Coach over Wade.

I'm not saying that Zorn and the REdskins won't suck...just pointing out the irony, the pot calling the kettle black thing.

Two different situations I think.

Zorn was a qb coach for how many years??? Never once advanced in his coaching career. He was basically given a job in seattle because of his history as a player there. Kinda like that nephew of the boss you work with who makes good money, but is never asked to do anything.

Then all of a sudden someone hires him to be an offensive coordinator. Ok, great, no problem there, but then BOOM, OMG, nobody on earth will take the head coaching position so he immedietly gets brought up to be head coach.

So you have a guy who a few months back was a qb coach who never once called a play to a head coach.

Compared to Garrett who was qb coach for 1 or 2 years upon starting his coaching career, then made assistant O coordinator behind Sparano for a year, then spagnola moves on so Garret takes over for him.

Seems to me thats a much more natural order of things than March 1st your a qb coach, and April 1st your head coach of another team.

[Sonny#9]

The Redskins will be a lot better than 4-12. I can promise you that much. They just might be one of those teams that end up surprising a lot of people. It's way too early to write them off.

That being said, I think it's safe to say that they probably do have more holes (or less overall talent) than the other NFC East teams. To me, they are about a .500 team but will probably swing a couple of games one way or the other (6-10 or 10-6).

That's a very fair assessment. I really cannot get a feel for this team. Ignoring the OP's rant, the Skins have drafted faily well the past couple of years -- despite their paucity of picks I think 6 of 12 picks have become solid starters.

I think they did a great job this year in the draft -- although I would have preferred Calais Campbell over Fred Davis at that slot, but so be it. Kelly and Thomas give them two large targets for the WCO, and Davis is another weapon. If one pans out this year -- the Skins offense could be very, very good. I think the O-line has some decent depth -- hopefully they will sign Bentley -- that would be outstanding.

We have two key players coming back from injury: McIntosh and Rogers. I really like Rocky, and Rogers was playing well before going down. Fletcher is 33 -- but still a rock. Washington is starting to show some age.

I am a big, big fan of Landry and Doughty. I like Smoot and Springs -- Rogers can take his time coming back. They also have a solid rookie in Tryon, I think.

Pass rush is a concern. Carter would be a lot more then a 3rd DE on any team. Anyone other then Pete Prisco knows that. Montgomery is a monster in the middle. Griffin is solid, Golston is the blue-collar, high-energy guy. Daniels is old and done. But no starter other then Carter has shown any pass rush ability. Hoping James can stay healthy, I also like Chris Wilson as a pass rush specialist (4 sacks as a rookie last year), but nothing to really hang one's hat on.

New coach, rookies hopefully playing prominent positions, too many questions to really say.

[CowboyWay]

That's a very fair assessment. I really cannot get a feel for this team. Ignoring the OP's rant, the Skins have drafted faily well the past couple of years -- despite their paucity of picks I think 6 of 12 picks have become solid starters.

I think they did a great job this year in the draft -- although I would have preferred Calais Campbell over Fred Davis at that slot, but so be it. Kelly and Thomas give them two large targets for the WCO, and Davis is another weapon. If one pans out this year -- the Skins offense could be very, very good. I think the O-line has some decent depth -- hopefully they will sign Bentley -- that would be outstanding.

We have two key players coming back from injury: McIntosh and Rogers. I really like Rocky, and Rogers was playing well before going down. Fletcher is 33 -- but still a rock. Washington is starting to show some age.

I am a big, big fan of Landry and Doughty. I like Smoot and Springs -- Rogers can take his time coming back. They also have a solid rookie in Tryon, I think.

Pass rush is a concern. Carter would be a lot more then a 3rd DE on any team. Anyone other then Pete Prisco knows that. Montgomery is a monster in the middle. Griffin is solid, Golston is the blue-collar, high-energy guy. Daniels is old and done. But no starter other then Carter has shown any pass rush ability. Hoping James can stay healthy, I also like Chris Wilson as a pass rush specialist (4 sacks as a rookie last year), but nothing to really hang one's hat on.

New coach, rookies hopefully playing prominent positions, too many questions to really say.

I noticed you didn't mention anything about your pathetic qb situation.

How many weeks into the season do you see the fans screaming for Collins? I'm guessing week 3.

[dest]

March 1st your a qb coach, and April 1st your head coach of another team.


I always forget how funny that is, lol.

[Sonny#9]

I noticed you didn't mention anything about your pathetic qb situation.

How many weeks into the season do you see the fans screaming for Collins? I'm guessing week 3.

What, so you can make more idiotic comparisons to Quincy Carter? No thanks.

[TOOMBS]

That's a very fair assessment. I really cannot get a feel for this team. Ignoring the OP's rant, the Skins have drafted faily well the past couple of years -- despite their paucity of picks I think 6 of 12 picks have become solid starters.

I think they did a great job this year in the draft -- although I would have preferred Calais Campbell over Fred Davis at that slot, but so be it. Kelly and Thomas give them two large targets for the WCO, and Davis is another weapon. If one pans out this year -- the Skins offense could be very, very good. I think the O-line has some decent depth -- hopefully they will sign Bentley -- that would be outstanding.

We have two key players coming back from injury: McIntosh and Rogers. I really like Rocky, and Rogers was playing well before going down. Fletcher is 33 -- but still a rock. Washington is starting to show some age.

I am a big, big fan of Landry and Doughty. I like Smoot and Springs -- Rogers can take his time coming back. They also have a solid rookie in Tryon, I think.

Pass rush is a concern. Carter would be a lot more then a 3rd DE on any team. Anyone other then Pete Prisco knows that. Montgomery is a monster in the middle. Griffin is solid, Golston is the blue-collar, high-energy guy. Daniels is old and done. But no starter other then Carter has shown any pass rush ability. Hoping James can stay healthy, I also like Chris Wilson as a pass rush specialist (4 sacks as a rookie last year), but nothing to really hang one's hat on.

New coach, rookies hopefully playing prominent positions, too many questions to really say.

I love how every Redskin fan is now magically some kind of expert on the WCO. "The WCO is going to fix everything!" Six year ago it was, "The FUN AND GUN is going to fix everything".

How is it that drafting two rookies that will contribute next to nothing this year going to help your team because you are running the magical WCO? Your QB is exactly the opposite of what you want from a WCO quarterback. Campbell has a slow-wind up, I think we can all agree on that. He is slow to pick his target, and then slow to wind up, and then throws these inaccurate lazer beams with no touch at all so your tiny little midget receivers have no time to adjust to it and can't always jump the five feet in the air necessary to actually catch the damn thing. Oh god, this is going to be fun to watch.

Yes, you drafted two tall receivers that COULD work in the WCO, and you will be lucky if just one of them actually contributes in thrid receiver capacity in the next couple years...... yeah, you guys are so close to pulling this all together :laugh2:

[BehindEnemyLinez]

That's a very fair assessment. I really cannot get a feel for this team. Ignoring the OP's rant, the Skins have drafted faily well the past couple of years -- despite their paucity of picks I think 6 of 12 picks have become solid starters.

I think they did a great job this year in the draft -- although I would have preferred Calais Campbell over Fred Davis at that slot, but so be it. Kelly and Thomas give them two large targets for the WCO, and Davis is another weapon. If one pans out this year -- the Skins offense could be very, very good. I think the O-line has some decent depth -- hopefully they will sign Bentley -- that would be outstanding.

We have two key players coming back from injury: McIntosh and Rogers. I really like Rocky, and Rogers was playing well before going down. Fletcher is 33 -- but still a rock. Washington is starting to show some age.

I am a big, big fan of Landry and Doughty. I like Smoot and Springs -- Rogers can take his time coming back. They also have a solid rookie in Tryon, I think.

Pass rush is a concern. Carter would be a lot more then a 3rd DE on any team. Anyone other then Pete Prisco knows that. Montgomery is a monster in the middle. Griffin is solid, Golston is the blue-collar, high-energy guy. Daniels is old and done. But no starter other then Carter has shown any pass rush ability. Hoping James can stay healthy, I also like Chris Wilson as a pass rush specialist (4 sacks as a rookie last year), but nothing to really hang one's hat on.

New coach, rookies hopefully playing prominent positions, too many questions to really say.

I have to agree with the OP. That team is headed for a downward spiral big time.
1. You go as your qb goes. Campbell stinks and has shown very little. Quincy 2.0 with the only difference being that Q-Car Spoke better English.

2. Offensive line is really getting up there in age. They have talent there sure, but can they stay healthy is the big question. I don't believe they can.

3. The recievers are painfully average. Santana was their best, but he's only a #2. ARE would be a decent #3. As far as the two rookie WR's they drafted, they certainly won't help them this year, and I believe both are busts. There is a reason they both dropped out of the 2nd round.

4. Portis is a little injury prone, but you have to like the kids heart. I can't say anything bad about him. Same goes for Cooley. Hard not to like that kid.

Defense.
Smoot. Awful
Carlos rodgers God Awful
Shawn Springs. Can still play if he's healthy. But getting up there in age.

Linebackers. Serviceable

Dline. Decrepid. Poor, poor, poor. Some are also collecting Social Security

Coaching. They have more turnover than the 3rd shift at Waffle House. Zorn is way over his head. He doesn't even know the colors of own team. How do you go from QB coach to Head Coach? Nobody in the league wanted that job, and lil Danny knew it. Gibbs left that team in shambles. Traded away draft picks like they were baseball cards and never infused any young talent on an aging and expensive roster. If a coach had done what he Gibbs did in Dallas, I'd be pissed. He will destroy that team for the next 5 years until they rebuild through the draft.

Laughing at the stinks isn't even a challenge anymore. Their franchise is so pathetically run it boggles the mind. The best thing to ever happen to that team (besides strike years) is lil danny buying it. He will destroy that team like he has destroyed so many other things he's touched.

I guess it's all about perspective, huh? Skins' fans see the cup half-full while others see it as empty, dry, and cracked w/ no hope of holding water! :D

[Hostile]

I love how every Redskin fan is now magically some kind of expert on the WCO. "The WCO is going to fix everything!" Six year ago it was, "The FUN AND GUN is going to fix everything".

How is it that drafting two rookies that will contribute next to nothing this year going to help your team because you are running the magical WCO? Your QB is exactly the opposite of what you want from a WCO quarterback. Campbell has a slow-wind up, I think we can all agree on that. He is slow to pick his target, and then slow to wind up, and then throws these inaccurate lazer beams with no touch at all so your tiny little midget receivers have no time to adjust to it and can't always jump the five feet in the air necessary to actually catch the damn thing. Oh god, this is going to be fun to watch.

Yes, you drafted two tall receivers that COULD work in the WCO, and you will be lucky if just one of them actually contributes in thrid receiver capacity in the next couple years...... yeah, you guys are so close to pulling this all together :laugh2:You forgot to mention Al Saunders' 700 page playbook which would revoltionize Offense.

[superpunk]

The Skins aren't great, obviously, but they're not as bad as they look either.

If anything-Gibbs himself costed them a number of games during his 2nd stint-and yes, hiring Saunders, someone who has a completely different philosophy than him, was also a big mistake.

Saunders, IMHO, would be a perfect fit here b/c our biggest strength is the passing game, but he just didn't mesh with someone who plays old-school offense.
They may have had different thoughts on how to call plays, but their offensive philosophies were both derived from the same Coryell tree.

[bbgun]

Saw this in today's Wash Times. Maybe we could use it as a template and do something similar for the Boys.

Redskins depth chart analysis: Part I
Redskins 360
BY Ryan O'Halloran


Camp is a month away for the Washington Redskins, a time when the serious roster competition will pick up. But after a bunch of boring OTAs (thank goodness I won't have to use that acronym the rest of the summer), here's my take on the roster.

First up is the offense.

Quarterback (3)

Set: Jason Campbell and Todd Collins

Competition: Sam Hollenbach vs. Colt Brennan for the No. 3 job. Brennan starts at a disadvantage because of his hip surgery but in his favor is that he's a Zorn draft pick and that does carry weight.

Prediction: Ultimately, Hollenbach makes the team and Brennan goes to the practice squad.

Running back (4)

Set: Clinton Portis, Ladell Betts, Mike Sellers and Rock Cartwright.

Competition: None. Each of the four players have specific roles. Young players like Marcus Mason, Pete Schmitt and Nehemiah Broughton make the team only if there are injury issues.

Prediction: Betts had 114 combined touches last year (carries and receptions). If Portis plays 16 games, that number will be significantly less.

Tight end (3)

Set: Chris Cooley, Fred Davis and Todd Yoder.

Competition: None. Cooley is a Pro Bowler who plays every offensive snap and Yoder has become a valuable blocker and occasional receiver. Davis' challenge will be to show Zorn enough in camp to warrant being a regular part of the passing game.

Prediction: Brian Kozlowski will return in Week 13. Just kidding. I think, finally, ol' Koz may be done. Also, Redskin Park Media Room Folk Hero Tyler Ecker won't be around.

Receivers (6)

Set: Santana Moss, Antwaan Randle El, Devin Thomas and Malcolm Kelly.

Competition: Who is the fifth receiver -- James Thrash or Anthony Mix? Zorn spoke highly of Thrash during OTAs and he is valuable on special teams; Mix is in the 6-foot-5 range and gives Zorn red zone options.

Prediction: Both will probably make the team but it's unlikely the Redskins will have six receivers active on game day.

Offensive line (9)

Set: Chris Samuels, Randy Thomas, Casey Rabach, Pete Kendall, Jon Jansen and Stephon Heyer.

Competition: I think Jason Fabini is pretty safe as a reserve guard but veteran tackle Todd Wade could be in trouble. Rookies Andrew Crummey and Chad Rinehart will get good looks in camp. (I didn't include Lorenzo Alexander because he worked mostly on defense this month).

Prediction: It's important for the Redskins to develop a couple young linemen. But these are still the Redskins and the old guy usually gets the nod. The final three linemen will be Fabini, Wade and Rinehart.

[wileedog]

The WC system coming in will help JC and Cooley is a legitimate threat. .

Maybe he'll prove me wrong, but to me putting Campbell in a WCO is one of the worst 'on paper' decisions I have seen in a long time.

The new receivers will help, but absolutely nothing in his game I have seen to date screams to me "Joe Montana."

More like Jim Plunkett.

[REDVOLUTION]

Redskins... a mammoth disaster in the making


I take great offense to the association with the great long lost mammoth( to Redskins). Why do we have to lower the extinct creature.... is nothing sacred. They are dead and gone... why talk bad about the dead?!?!










:laugh2:

[TheSkaven]

Boy, I hate to be the contrarian here, but I actually think they are moving in the right direction. I like the pick at head coach, I think he will be very successful in Washington. I really like their quarterback, who I think will be very good in the coming years. Their defense is solid, and their offensive line is above average.

This is a 9-7 Redskins squad.

*ducks*

[REDVOLUTION]

Boy, I hate to be the contrarian here, but I actually think they are moving in the right direction. I like the pick at head coach, I think he will be very successful in Washington. I really like their quarterback, who I think will be very good in the coming years. Their defense is solid, and their offensive line is above average.

This is a 9-7 Redskins squad.

*ducks*

The team did well.... well with the old guy QBing... not Campbell. It took him 7 or 8 games to throw a TD pass to a WR.

[CowboyWay]

Boy, I hate to be the contrarian here, but I actually think they are moving in the right direction. I like the pick at head coach, I think he will be very successful in Washington. I really like their quarterback, who I think will be very good in the coming years. Their defense is solid, and their offensive line is above average.

This is a 9-7 Redskins squad.

*ducks*

9-7 is possible with some luck and if Todd Collins starts.

No way does that team sniff 9 wins with JC at the helm.

[Sonny#9]

The team did well.... well with the old guy QBing... not Campbell. It took him 7 or 8 games to throw a TD pass to a WR.

Oh right, right. Collins lit it up and should certainly start. There's no way Campbell could have done that against some of the worst pass defenses in the league.

[TOOMBS]

Oh right, right. Collins lit it up and should certainly start. There's no way Campbell could have done that against some of the worst pass defenses in the league.

Wow, someone is living in denial. Face it, bro.... your team was much better the moment Campbell stepped off the field.

[BraveHeartFan]

I don't think the Skins will be as bad as some Cowboys fans seems so sure they will be but there is no doubt, at all, that the team was much more effective, offensively, the moment Campbell went out and Collins stepped in.

[firehawk350]

Not to be too mean or inflammatory here, but there's a reason why nobody can take this rant seriously...

I have to agree with the OP. That team is headed for a downward spiral big time.
1. You go as your qb goes. Campbell stinks and has shown very little. Quincy 2.0 with the only difference being that Q-Car Spoke better English.

Except there are extremely clear differences between the two. Take a look at their statistics if you don't believe me. Regardless, I can post the plethora of differences between the two and you would respond with a half coherent rant like, but they both throw inaccurately, if you don't believe me, look at the games (as if you have all of the old QC games saved on your DVR and regularly review them). Either way, nobody can definitively evaluate a QB at JC's stage and anyone who pretends to is either delusional or a lying fool.

2. Offensive line is really getting up there in age. They have talent there sure, but can they stay healthy is the big question. I don't believe they can.

Based on what? Jansen had the first season ending injury that wasn't a complete accident this year. You believe he can't come back from one injury? Same goes with Thomas. His early exit in 05 was a freak accident that could have happened to anyone.

3. The recievers are painfully average. Santana was their best, but he's only a #2. ARE would be a decent #3. As far as the two rookie WR's they drafted, they certainly won't help them this year, and I believe both are busts. There is a reason they both dropped out of the 2nd round.

You believe they are both busts, before they ever strap on the cleats??? They didn't slip out of the 2nd round, they were taken in the second round. Either way, TO and Chad Johnson were both slipped out of the second round, I guess they are hopeless as well.

4. Portis is a little injury prone, but you have to like the kids heart. I can't say anything bad about him. Same goes for Cooley. Hard not to like that kid.

Portis had one career ending injury in his career and is two years removed from that. It's like calling Colombo injury prone, it's grasping at straws. Sure, he had an injury, but I think having gone two seasons relatively injury free, we can assume he's past that.

Defense.
Smoot. Awful
Carlos rodgers God Awful
Shawn Springs. Can still play if he's healthy. But getting up there in age.

Linebackers. Serviceable

Dline. Decrepid. Poor, poor, poor. Some are also collecting Social Security

How can I argue with that scintilating analysis? Yet, somehow with that horrible defense, we managed to post a defense ranked 8th in the league (the Cowboys were ranked 9th BTW). Throw in another year of progression for Montgomery, Wilson and Rocky McIntosh, we should be a bit better...

Coaching. They have more turnover than the 3rd shift at Waffle House. Zorn is way over his head. He doesn't even know the colors of own team. How do you go from QB coach to Head Coach? Nobody in the league wanted that job, and lil Danny knew it. Gibbs left that team in shambles. Traded away draft picks like they were baseball cards and never infused any young talent on an aging and expensive roster. If a coach had done what he Gibbs did in Dallas, I'd be pissed. He will destroy that team for the next 5 years until they rebuild through the draft.

The last QB coach to head coach convert I can remember is Andy Reid. I'm pretty sure he's done okay with his team... The Eagles or something... Nobody wanted the job? Are you kidding me? The Cards didn't have a problem finding a coach that "wanted the job" nor did the Raiders. Snyder is an awesome owner compared to those two franchises.

Either way, if you avoided the absurd hyperbole and actually came close to acknowledging reality, everyone could take you more seriously. If you would have said, I don't think JC is the answer, he just doesn't seem to have it and I don't like their receivers, they just don't project well to the NFL because of X, Y and Z and Moss is inconsistent, I think you'd have some points and credibility.

Instead, it came across like a bizarro ES post.

[TOOMBS]

I love how every Redskin fan is now magically some kind of expert on the WCO. "The WCO is going to fix everything!" Six year ago it was, "The FUN AND GUN is going to fix everything".

How is it that drafting two rookies that will contribute next to nothing this year going to help your team because you are running the magical WCO? Your QB is exactly the opposite of what you want from a WCO quarterback. Campbell has a slow-wind up, I think we can all agree on that. He is slow to pick his target, and then slow to wind up, and then throws these inaccurate lazer beams with no touch at all so your tiny little midget receivers have no time to adjust to it and can't always jump the five feet in the air necessary to actually catch the damn thing. Oh god, this is going to be fun to watch.

Yes, you drafted two tall receivers that COULD work in the WCO, and you will be lucky if just one of them actually contributes in thrid receiver capacity in the next couple years...... yeah, you guys are so close to pulling this all together :laugh2:


Wow, the Sporting News Pro Football 08' that I just now bought while getting toilet paper and beer seems to agree with my assessment of Jason Campbell..... they are just a little nicer about it.

The book on Jason Campbell:

"Jason Campbell has a number of strong points. He has a strong arm, and he's tall. *Randy Johnson would have been the best QB in history then* His height enbles him to see the field. He does a good job of not forcing things. He has the ability to make plays. One thing I really like is his willingness to stay within the system. A lot of times when a quarterback has Campbell's athletic ability and speed, he'll try to make more plays on his own or take more chances. He doesn't do that. *not smart enough to improvise* He makes plays when everything else breaks down, but he's not looking to run at the first sign of trouble. He gives the plays a chance to develop. *slow to commit to target*

He does need to do a better job of protecting the ball when he's hit. *wait, I thought Romo was the one with the fumble problem* He needs to improve his touch and accuracy on the shorter passes. That's a problem you see with a lot of tall quarterbacks who have the kind of long, full windup, which is another reason he needs to get rid of the ball quicker. *told ya*"



LOL, good luck running a successful WCO with a QB that can't accurately throw a screen pass.

Just accept it bud, time to move on and go in another direction with QB.

[firehawk350]

That's an easy enough answer... Saunders finally let go of the reins. The offensive system he runs is very complex and he didn't trust anybody but his little pets to run it. He handicapped the system for Mark Brunell too, just in a different way. The few times Campbell got free rein (by calling his own plays), he did pretty well. That's not to say he doesn't have areas he needs to improve on, but the offensive system wasn't what Collins got to run.

[firehawk350]

Wow, the Sporting News Pro Football 08' that I just now bought while getting toilet paper and beer seems to agree with my assessment of Jason Campbell..... they are just a little nicer about it.

The book on Jason Campbell:

"Jason Campbell has a number of strong points. He has a strong arm, and he's tall. *Randy Johnson would have been the best QB in history then* His height enbles him to see the field. He does a good job of not forcing things. He has the ability to make plays. One thing I really like is his willingness to stay within the system. A lot of times when a quarterback has Campbell's athletic ability and speed, he'll try to make more plays on his own or take more chances. He doesn't do that. *not smart enough to improvise* He makes plays when everything else breaks down, but he's not looking to run at the first sign of trouble. He gives the plays a chance to develop. *slow to commit to target*

He does need to do a better job of protecting the ball when he's hit. *wait, I thought Romo was the one with the fumble problem* He needs to improve his touch and accuracy on the shorter passes. That's a problem you see with a lot of tall quarterbacks who have the kind of long, full windup, which is another reason he needs to get rid of the ball quicker. *told ya*"



LOL, good luck running a successful WCO with a QB that can't accurately throw a screen pass.

Just accept it bud, time to move on and go in another direction with QB.
Do you really believe this??? I mean, really? You believe that Campbell has no high points? I mean, there is nothing good about Campbell's game and sporting news just lists some of his weaknesses as strengths because they don't want to hurt his feelings?

[TOOMBS]

Do you really believe this??? I mean, really? You believe that Campbell has no high points? I mean, there is nothing good about Campbell's game and sporting news just lists some of his weaknesses as strengths because they don't want to hurt his feelings?


Hey, I am just telling the truth. Most football fans who are not Redskins fans know how inaccurate and indecisive JC is, and the fact that the only thing he even remotely stands out for *long bombs* will be ignored in favor of highlighting his weakest part of the game *short touch passes*. JC will not make it to bye week in a WCO.

[REDVOLUTION]

Oh right, right. Collins lit it up and should certainly start. There's no way Campbell could have done that against some of the worst pass defenses in the league.

Collins didnt lose games.... Campbell would have.

Also... Collins didnt lose that playoff game... the slackers that surrounded him did..... My hats off to the guy... he had an opportunity and seized... too bad the team mailed it in.

Campbell will be a career backup after this season... maybe mid season

[firehawk350]

Hey, I am just telling the truth. Most football fans who are not Redskins fans know how inaccurate and indecisive JC is, and the fact that the only thing he even remotely stands out for *long bombs* will be ignored in favor of highlighting his weakest part of the game *short touch passes*. JC will not make it to bye week in a WCO.
Care to place your money where your mouth is then?

[firehawk350]

Collins didnt lose games.... Campbell would have.

Also... Collins didnt lose that playoff game... the slackers that surrounded him did..... My hats off to the guy... he had an opportunity and seized... too bad the team mailed it in.

Campbell will be a career backup after this season... maybe mid season
I could see you make a case for one of his INTs being Moss' fault, but the other two? He was throwing ducks all over the place that game...

[REDVOLUTION]

I could see you make a case for one of his INTs being Moss' fault, but the other two? He was throwing ducks all over the place that game...

I disagree.... at that point the O-line let the pressure through... MAILED IT IN!

Its a shame... I am not a skins fans by any means... but I felt bad for Collins....

[Bizwah]

Portis had one career ending injury in his career

:confused:

So, why's he still playing?

;)

[CowboyWay]

[quote=firehawk350;2119318]



Except there are extremely clear differences between the two. Take a look at their statistics if you don't believe me. Regardless, I can post the plethora of differences between the two and you would respond with a half coherent rant like, but they both throw inaccurately, if you don't believe me, look at the games (as if you have all of the old QC games saved on your DVR and regularly review them). Either way, nobody can definitively evaluate a QB at JC's stage and anyone who pretends to is either delusional or a lying fool.


I did look at the statistics. And they are shockingly similiar. But even more than that, watch them both. Both are indecisive, innaccurate, overdrafted and neither are too bright.



Based on what? Jansen had the first season ending injury that wasn't a complete accident this year. You believe he can't come back from one injury? Same goes with Thomas. His early exit in 05 was a freak accident that could have happened to anyone.

Janson is 32 and hasn't played football in 2 years. Do you really expect him to step right in like he did 2 years ago? Are you taking your meds?

Thomas is also 32 coming missing most of 07. The guy has basically played one year of football since the end of 2004.



You believe they are both busts, before they ever strap on the cleats??? They didn't slip out of the 2nd round, they were taken in the second round. Either way, TO and Chad Johnson were both slipped out of the second round, I guess they are hopeless as well.

Devin Thomas was a one year wonder in college. Reciever position is very difficult to evaluate prospects coming out. Perhaps none are more difficult than WR's. And you took one that every NFL team passed up at least once, and who only had one successful season.

Malcolm Kelly can run the 40 in just under a minute. That might be find when you're playing the Texas A&M's or the Nebraska's of the world, but it won't work in the NFL. And don't even get me started on his attitude.



Portis had one career ending injury in his career and is two years removed from that. It's like calling Colombo injury prone, it's grasping at straws. Sure, he had an injury, but I think having gone two seasons relatively injury free, we can assume he's past that.

I said a "little" injury prone cause the guy is always knicked up. He fights through it and is a warrior, but lets not pretend he is indestructable.



How can I argue with that scintilating analysis? Yet, somehow with that horrible defense, we managed to post a defense ranked 8th in the league (the Cowboys were ranked 9th BTW). Throw in another year of progression for Montgomery, Wilson and Rocky McIntosh, we should be a bit better...

Of course you ranked 8th in total defense. Because your offense was pathetic. When you play against teams who struggle offensively, notice how little the opposing offenses try to do to you. They play it close to the vest, very conservative, they want to control the clock, run the ball. If you had a high octane offense, that D of yours would have slipped into the mid 20's.

No different than us back in 03-04. Our O was pathetic, so teams didn't try to do too much offensively, all it does in the end is boost the defenses rating higher than it should be.



quote]

[jobberone]

I hear you. That franchise is a train wreck. I started an interesting thread on what its like to be a redsucks fan. But it was a little too close to the Rogers tragedy and some of our more sensitive members got their panties in a bunch and had it removed.

If they removed it then it was for a good reason. Your sensitivity is touching. But you are right about the franchise being a train wreck. It's at the top. But the Skins will win some games this year and should not be taken lightly. They will likely win 5-9 games this year.

[Biggems]

I hear you. That franchise is a train wreck. I started an interesting thread on what its like to be a redsucks fan. But it was a little too close to the Rogers tragedy and some of our more sensitive members got their panties in a bunch and had it removed.


Rogers tragedy? what happened to Rogers?

[firehawk350]

I disagree.... at that point the O-line let the pressure through... MAILED IT IN!

Its a shame... I am not a skins fans by any means... but I felt bad for Collins....
Heyer got dominated by Kearny. He did about as well as you can expect for a rookie UDFA tackle against a premiere DE. I expect a good amount of progression, but I think he'll take the biggest step in year 3.

[REDVOLUTION]

Heyer got dominated by Kearny. He did about as well as you can expect for a rookie UDFA tackle against a premiere DE. I expect a good amount of progression, but I think he'll take the biggest step in year 3.

You mean opposing defenses will be "stepping through"
http://www.tamiscorp.com/images/img_perimeter_turnstyle.jpg

:lmao2:

[Skinsmaniac]

The cupboard is definitely bare in terms of young talent. Notable players who have payed fewer than five seasons are: Cooley, Stephon Heyer our third OT, Campbell, Kedric Golston our third DT, Anthony Montgomery, Rocky McIntosh, Laron Landry, Carlos Rogers, Reed Doughty, and our rookies.

I don't think that Heyer has the footspeed to be successful, but Joe Bugel seems to like him. Rogers is a below average CB. Reed I thought played pretty well last year, but he'll be fighting for a starting job. I really like Montgomery, McIntosh, Cooley, and Landry. I think that Campbell will progress into a good QB, but I don't expect anyone on here to agree.

I really like Kelly. I'm not as high on Thomas, but the only thing I've seen of either of them have been highlight reels. I think that Chad Rinehart an OT who we picked in the 3rd will have to step up at some point this year, so I really hope we hit on him. Other than Rinehart and Kelly, there really aren't any other rookies who I think will have an impact this year, and I expect both of those guys to have a minimal impact. I'm happy we chose the punter in the 6th (insert your cheap jokes here).

There are other young players who see the field like Lorenzo Alexander, HB Blades, Demetric Evans, and Leigh Torrence, but I don't expect those guys to be anything but career backups. Of course there's Erasmus James too, but I'm not holding my breath. Still, I think we'll be competitive this year.

[firehawk350]

I did look at the statistics. And they are shockingly similiar. But even more than that, watch them both. Both are indecisive, innaccurate, overdrafted and neither are too bright.


Not too bright??? What makes you think that? Is it because he's country and from Mississippi? Either way, QC never posted a QB rating above what Campbell posted in his first year. Furthermore, Carter has never had more TDs than he had INTs (which Campbell accomplished in both years). Campbell also has a better completion percentage.

Either way, I stand by what I said, if you think you know how JC is going to turn out as a pro you're either lying to make yourself feel better or a farkin' delusional idiot... So do you know???


[/quote]Janson is 32 and hasn't played football in 2 years. Do you really expect him to step right in like he did 2 years ago? Are you taking your meds?

Thomas is also 32 coming missing most of 07. The guy has basically played one year of football since the end of 2004.[/quote]

Cmon, there's no way you are this dumb... Jansen played all of 2006 so he only missed one season... Thomas played all but 4 games of 2005, all of 2006 and missed 13 games of 2007. So he's a lot closer to playing two seasons since 2004. But hey, don't let facts stand in your way.


Devin Thomas was a one year wonder in college. Reciever position is very difficult to evaluate prospects coming out. Perhaps none are more difficult than WR's. And you took one that every NFL team passed up at least once, and who only had one successful season.

Malcolm Kelly can run the 40 in just under a minute. That might be find when you're playing the Texas A&M's or the Nebraska's of the world, but it won't work in the NFL. And don't even get me started on his attitude.

All the teams passed on TO, Chad Johnson, TJ Houshmanzadeh, Anquan Boldin and Marques Colston at least once (in most cases, twice). I guess they were all busts...

I can't believe you used the 40 to declare Kelly a bust... Jerry Rice ran a 4.7 40. TO ran a 4.5 40 (and I can remember he blew by 4.2 timed DeAngelo Hall last year). Of course, your football knowledge is really lacking given your whole defense of your stance that 2nd round receivers can't produce is because teams passed them up.


I said a "little" injury prone cause the guy is always knicked up. He fights through it and is a warrior, but lets not pretend he is indestructable.

He isn't any more injury prone than any other RB. Let's not pretend he misses a bunch of games a year.


Of course you ranked 8th in total defense. Because your offense was pathetic. When you play against teams who struggle offensively, notice how little the opposing offenses try to do to you. They play it close to the vest, very conservative, they want to control the clock, run the ball. If you had a high octane offense, that D of yours would have slipped into the mid 20's.

No different than us back in 03-04. Our O was pathetic, so teams didn't try to do too much offensively, all it does in the end is boost the defenses rating higher than it should be.

This may be the dumbest thing I have ever heard anyone say on this message board, and I've heard some dumb things here (Tom Brady vs. Tony Romo, search it and you'll see what I mean)... I have never heard anybody make this argument ever, and for good reason. It's retarded. Find one quote from somebody who doesn't just post on a message board (analyst, sports writer, GM, coach) who agrees with this and I'll re-engage from that point on. Until then, you are talking out your butt and sound like an ***

[Redskins2008]

The cupboard is definitely bare in terms of young talent. Notable players who have payed fewer than five seasons are: Cooley, Stephon Heyer our third OT, Campbell, Kedric Golston our third DT, Anthony Montgomery, Rocky McIntosh, Laron Landry, Carlos Rogers, Reed Doughty, and our rookies.

I don't think that Heyer has the footspeed to be successful, but Joe Bugel seems to like him. Rogers is a below average CB. Reed I thought played pretty well last year, but he'll be fighting for a starting job. I really like Montgomery, McIntosh, Cooley, and Landry. I think that Campbell will progress into a good QB, but I don't expect anyone on here to agree.

I really like Kelly. I'm not as high on Thomas, but the only thing I've seen of either of them have been highlight reels. I think that Chad Rinehart an OT who we picked in the 3rd will have to step up at some point this year, so I really hope we hit on him. Other than Rinehart and Kelly, there really aren't any other rookies who I think will have an impact this year, and I expect both of those guys to have a minimal impact. I'm happy we chose the punter in the 6th (insert your cheap jokes here).

There are other young players who see the field like Lorenzo Alexander, HB Blades, Demetric Evans, and Leigh Torrence, but I don't expect those guys to be anything but career backups. Of course there's Erasmus James too, but I'm not holding my breath. Still, I think we'll be competitive this year.

One pick everyone is sleeping on including Redskins fan. TE out of USC Fred Davis. One Area Redskins offense was having a hard time is red zone TD. Kelly and Davis will help our red zone out a great deal. We can use more 2 TE set in red zone or we can put Cooley in the slot and play Fred Davis in TE? We can also put Kelly as 1, Thomas as 2 and put Moss in the slot? or We might wanna go bigger Kelly as 1, Mix (6'5) as 2 and thomas in the slot, Cooley as TE. I think this year will be interesting year for nfl east. I love the fact noone giving us a chance.


Question for anybody to answer

If you are NY Giants Defense Coach how can you plan for Redskins Offense first game? All people know is our will be like seattle..... I think Jim Zorn will add his fav to it

[Bob Sacamano]

If you are NY Giants Defense Coach how can you plan for Redskins Offense first game? All people know is our will be like seattle..... I think Jim Zorn will add his fav to it

blitz Campbell into submission, strip him of the ball a few times

play alot of zone

[TOOMBS]

One pick everyone is sleeping on including Redskins fan. TE out of USC Fred Davis. One Area Redskins offense was having a hard time is red zone TD. Kelly and Davis will help our red zone out a great deal. We can use more 2 TE set in red zone or we can put Cooley in the slot and play Fred Davis in TE? We can also put Kelly as 1, Thomas as 2 and put Moss in the slot? or We might wanna go bigger Kelly as 1, Mix (6'5) as 2 and thomas in the slot, Cooley as TE. I think this year will be interesting year for nfl east. I love the fact noone giving us a chance.


Question for anybody to answer

If you are NY Giants Defense Coach how can you plan for Redskins Offense first game? All people know is our will be like seattle..... I think Jim Zorn will add his fav to it


LOL, I love it. A giants reject is now the new saviour of the Skins offense. The sentence after that is pure comedy........... typical Skins fan crud.

1st skins fan post, "OMG I CAN'T BELIEVE *whoever* IS IGNORING OUR POWERHOUSE TEAM YET AGAIN! I AM SO UPSET!"

2nd skins fan post, "I LOVE THAT THEY ALL IGNORE US...... THAT WAY WE SNEAK UNDER THE RADAR!" *lol that is Rucking Fidiculous*

I just wish I could put into words the amount of lame eminating from our nation's capitol.

[REDVOLUTION]

LOL, I love it. A giants reject is now the new saviour of the Skins offense. The sentence after that is pure comedy........... typical Skins fan crud.

1st skins fan post, "OMG I CAN'T BELIEVE *whoever* IS IGNORING OUR POWERHOUSE TEAM YET AGAIN! I AM SO UPSET!"

2nd skins fan post, "I LOVE THAT THEY ALL IGNORE US...... THAT WAY WE SNEAK UNDER THE RADAR!" *lol that is Rucking Fidiculous*

I just wish I could put into words the amount of lame eminating from our nation's capitol.


You forgot #3....

Yeah we lost 52-7 but we didnt get destroyed... we made them earn every yard, every TD.

:lmao:

[Disturbed]

You forgot #3....

Yeah we lost 52-7 but we didnt get destroyed... we made them earn every yard, every TD.

:lmao:


I hope they say that again this year after playing the Cowboys. That was classic...
:laugh2:

[firehawk350]

blitz Campbell into submission, strip him of the ball a few times

play alot of zone
Zone blitzes??? I would not zone blitz because I expect the Skins to use a lot of running plays to begin the season. Zorn said the running system is fully installed and the passing game is almost there (indicating the running game is further along). If you begin dropping DEs in the short zones and committing LBs to the gaps, you'll get scorched on the ground. I think that our system is going to look more like Seattle circa 05 than Walsh or the current Seattle system.

I'd press the receivers and crowd the box. Take your chances with Cooley in the flat and make Moss and the youngins' beat the press. I have less faith in their ability than Portis'.

[firehawk350]

LOL, I love it. A giants reject is now the new saviour of the Skins offense. The sentence after that is pure comedy........... typical Skins fan crud.

1st skins fan post, "OMG I CAN'T BELIEVE *whoever* IS IGNORING OUR POWERHOUSE TEAM YET AGAIN! I AM SO UPSET!"

2nd skins fan post, "I LOVE THAT THEY ALL IGNORE US...... THAT WAY WE SNEAK UNDER THE RADAR!" *lol that is Rucking Fidiculous*

I just wish I could put into words the amount of lame eminating from our nation's capitol.
I don't see where he said that Mix was the savior... If you think he can't be a contributor in the redzone, well I guess that's your opinion, there's no evidence one way or the other. But he's already proven to be a great ST guy and there's hope he can develop into a guy who can get the jump ball in the redzone. We'll see though.

[REDVOLUTION]

If you think he can't be a contributor in the redzone

I think he could be great in the redzone. If somehow he figured out how to throw it and catch it himself.



















:lmao:

[Kangaroo]

I hear you. That franchise is a train wreck. I started an interesting thread on what its like to be a redsucks fan. But it was a little too close to the Rogers tragedy and some of our more sensitive members got their panties in a bunch and had it removed.

Easy think back to the Dave Campo Head Coaching circus and that is what Redskin fan is going through

[SkinsHokieFan]

The obsession of a Cowboys fan never lacks any bounds

Nice thread

Personally, I see the Redskins going 0-16, losing every game by 40 points or more, because the QB is black and wears number 17 and therefore is exactly like a QB that used to play in Dallas a few years ago

[TOOMBS]

I don't see where he said that Mix was the savior... If you think he can't be a contributor in the redzone, well I guess that's your opinion, there's no evidence one way or the other. But he's already proven to be a great ST guy and there's hope he can develop into a guy who can get the jump ball in the redzone. We'll see though.


Why on Earth would anyone, anywhere think he can be anything? He was not even good enough to make the Giants' roster.

I am 6'5" in real life....... does that mean I could contribute for the Redskins in the redzone? I mean Mix only has 3 more catches than me in the NFL.... we are basically even!

[5Stars]

The obsession of a Cowboys fan never lacks any bounds

Nice thread

Personally, I see the Redskins going 0-16, losing every game by 40 points or more, because the QB is black and wears number 17 and therefore is exactly like a QB that used to play in Dallas a few years ago


Sounds about right, coming from a RedSkin fan. :cool:

[5Stars]

Why on Earth would anyone, anywhere think he can be anything? He was not even good enough to make the Giants' roster.

I am 6'5" in real life....... does that mean I could contribute for the Redskins in the redzone? I mean Mix only has 3 more catches than me in the NFL.... we are basically even!


But you don't have the GREAT Campbell throwing you the ball...!!!


:laugh1:

[SkinsHokieFan]

But you don't have the GREAT Campbell throwing you the ball...!!!


:laugh1:

How funny will it be when he wins a playoff game before Romo :lmao2:

To add more nonsense to this thread, the last time the Cowboys won a playoff game, I was in 9th grade

Just got my Masters Degree in May :)

[TOOMBS]

How funny will it be when he wins a playoff game before Romo :lmao2:

To add more nonsense to this thread, the last time the Cowboys won a playoff game, I was in 9th grade

Just got my Masters Degree in May :)


Well, don't be shy..... tell us your opinion on the state of your fanchise. I would love to know.

[SkinsHokieFan]

Well, don't be shy..... tell us your opinion on the state of your fanchise. I would love to know.

Na not really. I have done that plenty on here, and if you are not lazy you can search for my thoughts

I like to only give well thought out responses on here to well thought out posts and topics

Your topic simply deserves a "its been 4,189 days since the Cowboys won a playoff game"

:)

[BehindEnemyLinez]

How funny will it be when he wins a playoff game before Romo :lmao2:

To add more nonsense to this thread, the last time the Cowboys won a playoff game, I was in 9th grade

Just got my Masters Degree in May :)
Then you were fresh outta preschool the last time the Deadskins won a Super Bowl, huh?!:rolleyes:

[Bob Sacamano]

The obsession of a Cowboys fan never lacks any bounds

Nice thread

Personally, I see the Redskins going 0-16, losing every game by 40 points or more, because the QB is black and wears number 17 and therefore is exactly like a QB that used to play in Dallas a few years ago

and yet where are you?

are you the obsession police?

[SkinsHokieFan]

Then you were fresh outta preschool the last time the Deadskins won a Super Bowl, huh?!:rolleyes:

Math clearly is not your strong suit is it?

[Bob Sacamano]

Zone blitzes??? I would not zone blitz because I expect the Skins to use a lot of running plays to begin the season. Zorn said the running system is fully installed and the passing game is almost there (indicating the running game is further along). If you begin dropping DEs in the short zones and committing LBs to the gaps, you'll get scorched on the ground. I think that our system is going to look more like Seattle circa 05 than Walsh or the current Seattle system.

I don't think your running game is that great, I say play zone because Campbell is inconsistent throwing short and medium passes, it's not like you guys are Jax and are going to run your way to victory, you're going to have to make some plays in the passing game, playing zone will prevent Campbell the inconsistent slob from doing that

I'd press the receivers and crowd the box. Take your chances with Cooley in the flat and make Moss and the youngins' beat the press. I have less faith in their ability than Portis'.

again, zone-blitz the hell out of Campbell, and you win

[BAZ]

You guys SHF doesn't have to come on here and defend his team because he has done it all before, and it doesn't matter what the Cowboys look like this year because they haven't won a playoff game for the last 4000 days, he is like totally above all this, DUH!!

God you guys are dumb.

[TOOMBS]

Na not really. I have done that plenty on here, and if you are not lazy you can search for my thoughts

I like to only give well thought out responses on here to well thought out posts and topics

Your topic simply deserves a "its been 4,189 days since the Cowboys won a playoff game"

:)

Oh I get it. You are either intimidated or just trolling.

You have come to a Cowboys website and object to my excellent post detailing how eff'd up you franchise is and yet will not offer your own thoughts on the matter. I am leaning toward troll.

[BehindEnemyLinez]

Math clearly is not your strong suit is it?

I would expect someone who just "earned" their Master's to pickup on sarcasm (:rolleyes: ) when they see/read it, but then again your a Skins' fan so...

[5Stars]

How funny will it be when he wins a playoff game before Romo


Care to make some sort of friendly wager, smart man? Put you money where your mouth is, or shut up.

Man up, what's the wager?

:cool:

Master's Degree...in what? BS?


:rolleyes:

[SkinsHokieFan]

You guys SHF doesn't have to come on here and defend his team because he has done it all before, and it doesn't matter what the Cowboys look like this year because they haven't won a playoff game for the last 4000 days, he is like totally above all this, DUH!!

God you guys are dumb.

Now there is a smart man

Oh I get it. You are either intimidated or just trolling.

You have come to a Cowboys website and object to my excellent post detailing how eff'd up you franchise is and yet will not offer your own thoughts on the matter. I am leaning toward troll.

Intimidated by TOOOMBS

I would expect someone who just "earned" their Master's to pickup on sarcasm (:rolleyes: ) when they see/read it, but then again your a Skins' fan so...

I was surprised you knew what sarcasm was. My apologies

Care to make some sort of friendly wager, smart man? Put you money where your mouth is, or shut up.

Man up, what's the wager?

:cool:

Master's Degree...in what? BS?


:rolleyes:

What else would it be?

As for a bet, propose something. Since I don't know you, have no clue who you are, and have no reason to trust you, I would think something benign like a sig bet, or banishment from this site forever. Let me know what you think

[BehindEnemyLinez]

I was surprised you knew what sarcasm was. My apologies

But it was obvious YOU didn't! You're welcome, that lesson was on the house...

[SkinsHokieFan]

But it was obvious YOU didn't! You're welcome, that lesson was on the house...

SHF=schooled

[5Stars]

Now there is a smart man



Intimidated by TOOOMBS



I was surprised you knew what sarcasm was. My apologies



What else would it be?

As for a bet, propose something. Since I don't know you, have no clue who you are, and have no reason to trust you, I would think something benign like a sig bet, or banishment from this site forever. Let me know what you think



Don't answer a question with a question, smart man! I asked YOU what you want to bet? Now you ask me? (more circular logic from a RedSkin fan)! :rolleyes:

[5Stars]

SHF=schooled by Cowboy fans

Fixed!

:laugh1:

The BS degree? What else does it mean? How about Bull-****-degree?

[SkinsHokieFan]

Don't answer a question with a question, smart man! I asked YOU what you want to bet? Now you ask me? (more circular logic from a RedSkin fan)! :rolleyes:

Thats the only way to answer a question.

But if you want a response, sig bet of the winner's choosing, and the loser has to sport it on www.cowboyszone.com (http://www.cowboyszone.com) for one year

And to make it a bit more clear, if the following scenario occurs

Romo wins wildcard game, but Campbell has a first round bye and doesn't play till the following week, but wins that game, it is a tie, and vice versa if the situation occurs

Another situation. Romo injured in the first quarter with the Cowboys down 3-0, whoever your backup is leads you to win. That won't cut it

So therefore, the QB MUST start, and must play into the 3rd quarter and if he goes down his team MUST have the lead. No backup coming in and winning the game will count

[BAZ]

SIG BETS ARE THE INTERNET ARE SERIOUS BUSINESS!!!!!!!!!

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1402/822327651_1efebd248a.jpg

[SkinsHokieFan]

SIG BETS ARE THE INTERNET ARE SERIOUS BUSINESS!!!!!!!!!




Very serious dude. I need to get a witness to this and a couple of signatures. I may want this bet notarized

[5Stars]

Thats the only way to answer a question.

But if you want a response, sig bet of the winner's choosing, and the loser has to sport it on www.cowboyszone.com (http://www.cowboyszone.com) for one year

And to make it a bit more clear, if the following scenario occurs

Romo wins wildcard game, but Campbell has a first round bye and doesn't play till the following week, but wins that game, it is a tie, and vice versa if the situation occurs

Another situation. Romo injured in the first quarter with the Cowboys down 3-0, whoever your backup is leads you to win. That won't cut it

So therefore, the QB MUST start, and must play into the 3rd quarter and if he goes down his team MUST have the lead. No backup coming in and winning the game will count




:lmao2: :laugh1: :lmao2:

Sure, why not?

I'll rely on a ProBowl QB while you rely on a can of Soup! And the bold part actually works against you! Why? Because your backup QB is BETTER than your starting QB...but then again, why am I not surprised you don't know that, being an Edumacated man.

[SkinsHokieFan]

:lmao2: :laugh1: :lmao2:

Sure, why not?

I'll rely on a ProBowl QB while you rely on a can of Soup! And the bold part actually works against you! Why? Because your backup QB is BETTER than your starting QB...but then again, why am I not surprised you don't know that, being an Edumacated man.

Beautiful. And seeing how your posts probably won't get deleted (mine tend to on this site) we have it on record

[5Stars]

Beautiful. And seeing how your posts probably won't get deleted (mine tend to on this site) we have it on record


Yeah, it's on record. Don't hurt me too bad, OK? (with the sig thing). :laugh1:


Your team is going to be lucky to make .500 this season!

[SkinsHokieFan]

Yeah, it's on record. Don't hurt me too bad, OK? (with the sig thing). :laugh1:


Your team is going to be lucky to make .500 this season!

Probably. Clearly that has nothing to do with if your team wins a playoff game, as we have seen in recent history (2003, 2006 seasons)

[Hostile]

Beautiful. And seeing how your posts probably won't get deleted (mine tend to on this site) we have it on recordI was curious.

2 years and 9 months on this site, 394 posts, 5 have been deleted. Each time for Guidelines violations here.

Maybe you should read them (the Guidelines). Just saying.

It certainly isn't a case of you being censored and can't say anything here as you made this sound.

[5Stars]

Probably. Clearly that has nothing to do with if your team wins a playoff game, as we have seen in recent history (2003, 2006 seasons)


You're cool, SkinsHokieFan!

Let's just make this simple without all the "rules" and stuff, OK? Remember, that KISS? (keep it simple, stupid).

Let's just go with which ever team, regardless of QB, who wins a playoff game, wildcard or what ever round, that you or I donate $20.00 to CowboyZone?

In other words, if both teams make it to the playoffs (:laugh1: ) the first team eliminated donates the coin. We don't need all the stinking "well if this or well if that, or well this has to happen or that has to happen" crap.

If the RedSkins win a playoff game and the Boyz don't...I donate 20 bones to CowboyZone. The same goes to you, OK?

To be fair, I made the same bet with a Pat's fan...and lost! I donated, end of story!

What you say?


;)

[TOOMBS]

aaaaaaaaaaand this thread is dead. I'm gonna miss it.

[BAZ]

I was curious.

2 years and 9 months on this site, 394 posts, 5 have been deleted. Each time for Guidelines violations here.

Maybe you should read them (the Guidelines). Just saying.

It certainly isn't a case of you being censored and can't say anything here as you made this sound.

He's just making noise without saying anything, let him have his fun.

[Bob Sacamano]

Oh I get it. You are either intimidated or just trolling.

You have come to a Cowboys website and object to my excellent post detailing how eff'd up you franchise is and yet will not offer your own thoughts on the matter. I am leaning toward troll.

he's the Obsession Police, he monitors team obsession on Internet message boards, Officer Dumbly Do-right

he's just doing his job

I mean, as a member of another team's forum, he wouldn't call us obsessed, that's just crazy

[Bob Sacamano]

Thats the only way to answer a question.

But if you want a response, sig bet of the winner's choosing, and the loser has to sport it on www.cowboyszone.com (http://www.cowboyszone.com) for one year

And to make it a bit more clear, if the following scenario occurs

Romo wins wildcard game, but Campbell has a first round bye and doesn't play till the following week, but wins that game, it is a tie, and vice versa if the situation occurs

Another situation. Romo injured in the first quarter with the Cowboys down 3-0, whoever your backup is leads you to win. That won't cut it

So therefore, the QB MUST start, and must play into the 3rd quarter and if he goes down his team MUST have the lead. No backup coming in and winning the game will count

can we have a serious bet here, please?

[Bob Sacamano]

Probably. Clearly that has nothing to do with if your team wins a playoff game, as we have seen in recent history (2003, 2006 seasons)

:laugh1:

[5Stars]

can we have a serious bet here, please?


I tried to make a simple bet, but...he ran away! I think his Masters Degree is starting to work!

:laugh1:

Ya know, Bob...if the RedSkins win a playoff game before the Boyz do...I pay!

If the Cowboys win first...the RedSkin runs away!!!!

That Masters Degree made him a pretty fart smeller, I tell ya...!!


;)



HELLO!!! SkinsHokieFan....are you out there?

:confused:

[Bob Sacamano]

I tried to make a simple bet, but...he ran away! I think his Masters Degree is starting to work!

:laugh1:

Ya know, Bob...if the RedSkins win a playoff game before the Boyz do...I pay!

If the Cowboys win first...the RedSkin runs away!!!!

That Masters Degree made him a pretty fart smeller, I tell ya...!!


;)



HELLO!!! SkinsHokieFan....are you our there?

:confused:

I'm just wondering what possessed him to try to include anything about the Skins being one of the top 2 NFL teams

guess he really did a get a Masters in BS

[SkinsHokieFan]

You're cool, SkinsHokieFan!

Let's just make this simple without all the "rules" and stuff, OK? Remember, that KISS? (keep it simple, stupid).

Let's just go with which ever team, regardless of QB, who wins a playoff game, wildcard or what ever round, that you or I donate $20.00 to CowboyZone?

In other words, if both teams make it to the playoffs (:laugh1: ) the first team eliminated donates the coin. We don't need all the stinking "well if this or well if that, or well this has to happen or that has to happen" crap.

If the RedSkins win a playoff game and the Boyz don't...I donate 20 bones to CowboyZone. The same goes to you, OK?

To be fair, I made the same bet with a Pat's fan...and lost! I donated, end of story!

What you say?


;)

Fair enough for me. Deal

Sorry for the late reply, had stuff to do :)

Edit: Don't know why I was being a cheapass. Lets make it 50.00

[UVAwahoos]

Fair enough for me. Deal

Sorry for the late reply, had stuff to do :)

Edit: Don't know why I was being a cheapass. Lets make it 50.00

I'll take that bet for $50 if he decides not to, babe.

[Vintage]

For 50, I aint betting on us.

Not after last year.

[kapolani]

Fair enough for me. Deal

Sorry for the late reply, had stuff to do :)

Edit: Don't know why I was being a cheapass. Lets make it 50.00

With a master's degree you should be able to afford more than a measly 50 dollars.

500 bones makes it worth something.

I'm down with that if you have the nuzzack...

5 > 3

[SkinsHokieFan]

With a master's degree you should be able to afford more than a measly 50 dollars.

500 bones makes it worth something.

I'm down with that if you have the nuzzack...

5 > 3

I don't want you to miss your mortgage payment my friend

Lets keep it reasonable for everyone, 50.00. Prevents people from going back on it, etc.

[kapolani]

I don't want you to miss your mortgage payment my friend

Lets keep it reasonable for everyone, 50.00. Prevents people from going back on it, etc.

Mortgage payment!?!

That's barely dinner out for my wife and I...

You have to make bets worth something - to make them exciting...

50 dollars barely fills the tank up in my commuter car.

[Vintage]

Mortgage payment!?!

That's barely dinner out for my wife and I...

You have to make bets worth something - to make them exciting...

50 dollars barely fills the tank up in my commuter car.

Hell, 500 is nothing either, if you think the Cowboys are going to win.

Why not make it real interesting? A couple of grand?


I mean, since you have the "nuzzacks" why not make it really interesting...? If you are so confident the Cowboys will win, you can clear a couple of grand easily. And if they don't, it should hurt you some....

[kapolani]

Hell, 500 is nothing either, if you think the Cowboys are going to win.

Why not make it real interesting? A couple of grand?


I mean, since you have the "nuzzacks" why not make it really interesting...? If you are so confident the Cowboys will win, you can clear a couple of grand easily. And if they don't, it should hurt you some....

If I did over a thousand it would be to some charity - not to a message board.

I actually think this is a good idea.

I'm sure both forums - extremeskins & cowboyszone could raise a nice amount of money for some worthwhile cause.

If someone can get this going I pledge $1000.

[firehawk350]

Hell, 500 is nothing either, if you think the Cowboys are going to win.

Why not make it real interesting? A couple of grand?


I mean, since you have the "nuzzacks" why not make it really interesting...? If you are so confident the Cowboys will win, you can clear a couple of grand easily. And if they don't, it should hurt you some....
It ain't nothing if you don't bet your soul.

*that was sarcasm for this is getting ridiculous*

[kapolani]

It ain't nothing if you don't bet your soul.

*that was sarcasm for this is getting ridiculous*

Hey.

If the money would go to a worthwhile cause it's a win/win situation.

Something along the lines of underprivileged youth football leagues etc.

I'm not saying that I throw money away, but the wife and I do donate to charities around our community...

The winners get to talk trash to the losers and a worthwhile cause benefits as well.

Nothing wrong with that...

[superpunk]

There was a funny exchange between James Washington and Deuce Staley this morning on Shemon and J-Dub's show. They were talking to Deuce about the Celtics, and J-Dub said something like this;

"Deuce, what are your thoughtson a team buying a championship? Kind of like the 49ers in 1994, bought a team to compete with the Dallas Cowboys, kind of strikes home with me?"

and Deuce said

"Kind of like Dan Snyder tried to do, only it never worked."

lol....respeck.

[SkinsHokieFan]

If I did over a thousand it would be to some charity - not to a message board.

I actually think this is a good idea.

I'm sure both forums - extremeskins & cowboyszone could raise a nice amount of money for some worthwhile cause.

If someone can get this going I pledge $1000.

Not a bad idea. Something the mods on both sites could try for

I think a worthwhile cause would be great

[Redskins2008]

LOL, I love it. A giants reject is now the new saviour of the Skins offense. The sentence after that is pure comedy........... typical Skins fan crud.

1st skins fan post, "OMG I CAN'T BELIEVE *whoever* IS IGNORING OUR POWERHOUSE TEAM YET AGAIN! I AM SO UPSET!"

2nd skins fan post, "I LOVE THAT THEY ALL IGNORE US...... THAT WAY WE SNEAK UNDER THE RADAR!" *lol that is Rucking Fidiculous*

I just wish I could put into words the amount of lame eminating from our nation's capitol.

Saviour of the offense? Never say he will be next Randy Moss or Chad Johnson but I did say he can help in the redzone. What I seen from him last season, he got good speed for his size and dont know if he can jump but maybe we see in preseason. I do feel he will be a match up problem in red zone for defense. I do like Mix chance in redzone with Mix vs Pacman. Football is all about match up. kelly, thomas and Davis will be hard to match up with talent we already had. If you fooling yourself redskins dont got talents on offense.

[kapolani]

Saviour of the offense? Never say he will be next Randy Moss or Chad Johnson but I did say he can help in the redzone. What I seen from him last season, he got good speed for his size and dont know if he can jump but maybe we see in preseason. I do feel he will be a match up problem in red zone for defense. I do like Mix chance in redzone with Mix vs Pacman. Football is all about match up. kelly, thomas and Davis will be hard to match up with talent we already had. If you fooling yourself redskins dont got talents on offense.

Holy crap...

Don't they teach diction and grammar in our school systems anymore?

[firehawk350]

Holy crap...

Don't they teach diction and grammar in our school systems anymore?
Diction: Degree of clarity and distinctness of pronunciation in speech or singing; enunciation

How in the world do you know if he has good diction by his writing???

[kapolani]

Diction: Degree of clarity and distinctness of pronunciation in speech or singing; enunciation

How in the world do you know if he has good diction by his writing???


Diction: choice of words especially with regard to correctness, clearness, or effectiveness


You really should make sure you're absolutely correct when you're going to try and correct someone, mkay?

L2checkyoursources noob...

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/diction

[Cowboysfan22]

I hear you. That franchise is a train wreck. I started an interesting thread on what its like to be a redsucks fan. But it was a little too close to the Rogers tragedy and some of our more sensitive members got their panties in a bunch and had it removed.
They are a wreck.:lmao2:

[5Stars]

Fair enough for me. Deal

Sorry for the late reply, had stuff to do :)

Edit: Don't know why I was being a cheapass. Lets make it 50.00

Ok, SkinsHokieFan...$50.00 it is, Reality can use the coin to help run this website, either from you or I...it's all good.

Now, you are on your own with all those other bets!! :eek:

:laugh2:



P.S. - Don't make Art pay your tab, sucker!!!

[thewireman]

The obsession of a Cowboys fan never lacks any bounds

http://picsorban.com/upload/moe-szyslak.thumb.gif Waaaaaaaaaa

Have you been on the ExtremeSkins site in the last I don't know, 15 mins? Just about every other post is a Cowboys related thread. Talk about obsession much

[firehawk350]

You really should make sure you're absolutely correct when you're going to try and correct someone, mkay?

L2checkyoursources noob...

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/diction
Says the pot to the kettle.

[kapolani]

Says the pot to the kettle.



Main Entry: dic·tion
Pronunciation: \ˈdik-shən\
Function: noun
Etymology: Latin diction-, dictio speaking, style, from dicere to say; akin to Old English tēon to accuse, Latin dicare to proclaim, dedicate, Greek deiknynai to show, dikē judgment, right
Date: 1581

1 obsolete : verbal description
2: choice of words especially with regard to correctness, clearness, or effectiveness
3 a: vocal expression : enunciation b: pronunciation and enunciation of words in singing


:rolleyes:

[Sonny#9]

http://picsorban.com/upload/moe-szyslak.thumb.gif Waaaaaaaaaa

Have you been on the ExtremeSkins site in the last I don't know, 15 mins? Just about every other post is a Cowboys related thread. Talk about obsession much

And how many of those threads mention how much CZ sucks, or someone was banned from CZ for "nothing"?

[Hostile]

And how many of those threads mention how much CZ sucks, or someone was banned from CZ for "nothing"?We don't ban for nothing and have never had that reputation.

If anything we've been castigated for allowing too much before we do ban.

[zrinkill]

The obsession of a Cowboys fan never lacks any bounds

Yet here you are ..... on our board for 3 years.

Who is obsessed with who?

[SkinsHokieFan]

Yet here you are ..... on our board for 3 years.

Who is obsessed with who?

Psst, its whom

And yea, I am a nerd. I just corrected your grammar

[Idgit]

Psst, its whom

And yea, I am a nerd. I just corrected your grammar

Psst. It's 'it's.'

[zrinkill]

Psst. It's 'it's.'

:lmao2:

[Star4Ever]

A team worse than the Redskins in the NFC? Did you see the Falcons play at all last season by chance? What about the Rams?

Listen, I know you are probably just going off on a Redskins hater rant like every Cowboys fan should, right? The tone of your original post came off like that.

Just to be fair, I am a regular over at Extremeskins.com and I have to listen to many idiotic comments from Redskins fans about how our team is overrated and that we won't ever win a playoff game and all kinds of other nonsense. Being in an environment like that causes you to take a look in your own backyard, so to speak. There seems to be a lot of smack and so little gold between the fans of two teams who have basically had the same lack of success since the last Cowboys SB.

I just wanted to share that perspective so you know where I'm coming from.

Glad you brought up the fact that you're a regular on ES. Just one word? WHY?????? That place is a cesspool and there are a couple of Cowboy fans that act like lapdogs on ES. I can't remember if you're one of them or not, but if so, grow a set and quit kissing their *****. No self-respecting Cowboy fan should post there. Not because it's a Skin's board, but because of the idiots that run it.

[Star4Ever]

Na not really. I have done that plenty on here, and if you are not lazy you can search for my thoughts

I like to only give well thought out responses on here to well thought out posts and topics

Your topic simply deserves a "its been 4,189 days since the Cowboys won a playoff game"

:)

Yea, and during that time span, the Foreskins have accomplished.........NOTHING. If you want to play that game, I'll just say we've won 3 Super Bowls since your boys even sniffed the big game. Look at it this way. Your boys do have some hope. The players may go on strike in a couple more years. :laugh2:

[Rampage]

http://picsorban.com/upload/moe-szyslak.thumb.gif Waaaaaaaaaa

Have you been on the ExtremeSkins site in the last I don't know, 15 mins? Just about every other post is a Cowboys related thread. Talk about obsession much
seriously! this is coming from a fan of a team that has "Dallas week" whenever they play us. talk about obsession.

[Brandon]

Quick Question.

Why do Redskin fans think they can stand with Cowboys fans? Let alone mention both teams in the same sentence? The Redskins and their fans have always been jealous of the Cowboys. They've been jealous of our players, fans, uniforms, owner and now, jealous of our soon to open 1-billion dollar stadium.

Face it, your team blows and will be a colossal disaster(if not it already is). I thought before the draft that the Eagles were going to be in the NFC East basement for years, and then after, watching your horrific drafting, horrific free agent signings and horrific coaching decisions I revoked my initial response and pegged the Redskins as the worst of the NFC East for the next 10 years. If I were a manager, I would take Kevin Kolb for the future of my team over Jason Campbell in a second.

The Cowboys have players who want to win and players who want to be players. Aren't you jealous that your running back isn't a monster, a player who breaks through 9 tackles on a single play, a player who wants to win it all and players who's hungry? Instead of Marion Barber, your stuck with Clinton Portis, a clown who would rather play dress-up on NFL Network then work his *** off in his home gym. That is always why you sad, sad, sad, Redskin fans, will always be #4, to the Dallas Cowboys.

[Sonny#9]

The Redskins and their fans have always been jealous of the Cowboys. They've been jealous of our players, fans, uniforms, owner and now, jealous of our soon to open 1-billion dollar stadium.

Face it, your team blows and will be a colossal disaster(if not it already is). I thought before the draft that the Eagles were going to be in the NFC East basement for years, and then after, watching your horrific drafting, horrific free agent signings and horrific coaching decisions I revoked my initial response and pegged the Redskins as the worst of the NFC East for the next 10 years. If I were a manager, I would take Kevin Kolb for the future of my team over Jason Campbell in a second.

The Cowboys have players who want to win and players who want to be players. Aren't you jealous that your running back isn't a monster, a player who breaks through 9 tackles on a single play, a player who wants to win it all and players who's hungry? Instead of Marion Barber, your stuck with Clinton Portis, a clown who would rather play dress-up on NFL Network then work his *** off in his home gym. That is always why you sad, sad, sad, Redskin fans, will always be #4, to the Dallas Cowboys.

Feel better?

[yeahyeah]

Quick Question.

Why do Redskin fans think they can stand with Cowboys fans? Let alone mention both teams in the same sentence? The Redskins and their fans have always been jealous of the Cowboys. They've been jealous of our players, fans, uniforms, owner and now, jealous of our soon to open 1-billion dollar stadium.

Face it, your team blows and will be a colossal disaster(if not it already is). I thought before the draft that the Eagles were going to be in the NFC East basement for years, and then after, watching your horrific drafting, horrific free agent signings and horrific coaching decisions I revoked my initial response and pegged the Redskins as the worst of the NFC East for the next 10 years. If I were a manager, I would take Kevin Kolb for the future of my team over Jason Campbell in a second.

The Cowboys have players who want to win and players who want to be players. Aren't you jealous that your running back isn't a monster, a player who breaks through 9 tackles on a single play, a player who wants to win it all and players who's hungry? Instead of Marion Barber, your stuck with Clinton Portis, a clown who would rather play dress-up on NFL Network then work his *** off in his home gym. That is always why you sad, sad, sad, Redskin fans, will always be #4, to the Dallas Cowboys.

I love it...:bow:

[Green28]

Didn't the Skins make the playoffs last season? Did they lose anything significant in the offseason? Did they improve their primary weakness, WR?

[Rowdy]

There's still a Redskins franchise?

[Hostile]

Didn't the Skins make the playoffs last season? Did they lose anything significant in the offseason? Did they improve their primary weakness, WR?Be honest, do you think making the playoffs one year guarantees making them the next year? Is it really that simplistic to you?

Do you believe your coaching staff is improved? That has no impact on expectations? I think your Defense is going to disappoint you. I had tremendous respect for Gregg Williams. He's gone.

WR may have been your weakness last year and you may have improved it. Does that mean that coaching can't trip you up? Does that mean your Defense couldn't struggle?

Do you agree with the Washington media that your team last year played on sheer emotion after the death of Sean Taylor? What's the rallying cry this year?

I think think the maroon, black, and yellow are in for a rough year. Not saying you can't surprise, but making the playoffs last year doesn't guarantee you squat.

[VCDefectors]

Glad you brought up the fact that you're a regular on ES. Just one word? WHY?????? That place is a cesspool and there are a couple of Cowboy fans that act like lapdogs on ES. I can't remember if you're one of them or not, but if so, grow a set and quit kissing their *****. No self-respecting Cowboy fan should post there. Not because it's a Skin's board, but because of the idiots that run it.

Yes, us Cowboys fans over at ES have to get creative with workarounds to get our point across, but its not so bad. I do it because it is really non-stop entertainment over there. A few really cool people and a whole bunch of ______ !!!!!

If the Cowboys end up having the season most of us think we are going to have, I want front-row seats to the flames, the hate, the excuses, all of the entertainment that comes with ES membership. It's good times!!

[AmishGangsta]

Do you agree with the Washington media that your team last year played on sheer emotion after the death of Sean Taylor? What's the rallying cry this year?

I'm just curious, do you think it benefits a team to have one of it's best players murdered?

Sure, they rallied after Taylor’s death, but you make it sound like that's the only reason they made the playoffs last year -- and I see that thrown around a lot on Cowboys forums.

I think such a tragedy does more harm than good to a team. Sure, they likely were playing on off of the emotion and trying to win for their fallen team mate, but they were also just as likely to be worn out and disturbed from the whole thing as well.

Do you agree?

[Idgit]

Didn't the Skins make the playoffs last season? Did they lose anything significant in the offseason? Did they improve their primary weakness, WR?

They lost Joe Gibbs. Given recent history, I would agree with you that they didn't lose anything significant. Then again, they picked up Zorn, so they didn't add anything of any significance, either.

[Ren]

Didn't the Skins make the playoffs last season? Did they lose anything significant in the offseason?

Gregg Williams...

[Hostile]

I'm just curious, do you think it benefits a team to have one of it's best players murdered? Just curious, did I say that it benefitted your team that he was murdered?

Sure, they rallied after Taylor’s death, but you make it sound like that's the only reason they made the playoffs last year -- and I see that thrown around a lot on Cowboys forums.No, I didn't. You just want to be ultra sensitive and are focusing on that. I think I also gave credit to your coaching staff and even singled out the DC.

I think such a tragedy does more harm than good to a team. Sure, they likely were playing on off of the emotion and trying to win for their fallen team mate, but they were also just as likely to be worn out and disturbed from the whole thing as well.I'm going off of comments by his teammates that they were feeding off of the emotions of his loss. You want to disagree with that, then disagree with them too. There's nothing at all wrong with the team rallying around a teammate's loss like that. Ever heard of "win one for the Gipper?"

I'm not at all sure why the idea that they did is a bit offensive to you.

Do you agree?My comments above would suggest a no.

[zrinkill]

you make it sound like that's the only reason they made the playoffs last year

The Redskins were 5-6 and ready to roll over for the rest of the season when Sean Taylor died ....

They won 4 in a row, only losing the game right after his death (probably because they were still in shock)

They showed a lot of pride and had a "win it for Sean" attitude.

Also the teams that played against them had to have a hard time getting "up" for the games because of the pity they felt for what happened.

Unfortunately when it came playoff time ..... the other teams stopped playing nice.

It was almost the exact opposite of what happened in Dallas ...... with regrettably the same conclusion.

[AmishGangsta]

Just curious, did I say that it benefitted your team that he was murdered? Well, that's certainly what it looked like you were implying. As if the Redskins needed another tragedy to get a rally cry going this year. -- not to mention the fact that, I just asked you if you thought a tragedy does more harm than good for a team; you disagreed.

Surely they rallied behind their player. I mean, what else is a team supposed to do in that situation? I think players of professional sports teams always have some sort of rallying cry -- ie "we're not respected", "we need to rebound", "we can't let our guard down etc..." But I think it takes more than a rally for a team to be successful; obviously, in a circumstance like the one last year, a team must be a strong group of players to make it through such a tragedy.

...and this one intertwines with the next:

I'm going off of comments by his teammates that they were feeding off of the emotions of his loss. You want to disagree with that, then disagree with them too. There's nothing at all wrong with the team rallying around a teammate's loss like that. Ever heard of "win one for the Gipper?"

No, I didn't. You just want to be ultra sensitive and are focusing on that. I think I also gave credit to your coaching staff and even singled out the DC.
If I were ultra sensitive about it, I wouldn't post at all. It's just an idea I see get tossed around a lot -- by Cowboys fans mostly, and I was curious as to where you were going with that.

You mentioned that this was an idea written by a member of the Washington media? Where is this article? Because I think if someone were to write something like that, they'd likely be thrown out of town.

[AmishGangsta]

The Redskins were 5-6 and ready to roll over for the rest of the season when Sean Taylor died ....

They won 4 in a row, only losing the game right after his death (probably because they were still in shock)

Also the teams that played against them had to have a hard time getting "up" for the games because of the pity they felt for what happened.

Unfortunately when it came playoff time ..... the other teams stopped playing nice.

So let me get this straight. The Skins win four games in a row because other teams felt bad for them? But then when the playoffs came around
they started playing again?

Come on bro. Certainly you don't actually believe that do you? :) Really?

[zrinkill]

So let me get this straight. The Skins win four games in a row because other teams felt bad for them? But then when the playoffs came around
they started playing again?

Come on bro. Certainly you don't actually believe that do you? :) Really?

A combination of other teams not getting "up" to play them and their "lets do it for Sean" attitude is why they won.

You really think its anything else? When they went from a 5-6 team to a 9-7 team without their best player?

[AmishGangsta]

A combination of other teams not getting "up" to play them and their "lets do it for Sean" attitude is why they won.

You really think its anything else? When they went from a 5-6 team to a 9-7 team without their best player?

3 out of the 4 teams the Skins beat in that rally were playoff teams (in the hunt). So I very seriously doubt that -- Minnisota for example -- would risk being eliminated from the playoffs so they wouldn't hurt the Redskins feelings.

Same with the Giants -- at that time, they weren't even guaranteed a playoff spot. The Skins game was a must win for them, because everyone assumed they would lose to the Patriots the following week.

The Skins went on a similar rally in 2005, without any notable tragedies (if I remember correctly).

That seemed to be a staple of Gibbs II, get in trouble early on, and then force yourself into winning out. Even before the tragedy there were talks about having to win the rest of their games.

In that time period, many other things happened. They were changing their offensive philosophy and letting their players play more, as opposed to being so conservative. Campbell was injured; Collins became the starter and out-performed him; they were getting some of their injured players back healthy.

Now, I'm not arguing that they didn't rally behind the tragedy -- that much is obvious -- I'm saying that, if you think the tragedy did the skins some kind of favor, you're kidding yourself.

[Hostile]

Well, that's certainly what it looked like you were implying. As if the Redskins needed another tragedy to get a rally cry going this year. -- not to mention the fact that, I just asked you if you thought a tragedy does more harm than good for a team; you disagreed.

Surely they rallied behind their player. I mean, what else is a team supposed to do in that situation? I think players of professional sports teams always have some sort of rallying cry -- ie "we're not respected", "we need to rebound", "we can't let our guard down etc..." But I think it takes more than a rally for a team to be successful; obviously, in a circumstance like the one last year, a team must be a strong group of players to make it through such a tragedy.

...and this one intertwines with the next:


If I were ultra sensitive about it, I wouldn't post at all. It's just an idea I see get tossed around a lot -- by Cowboys fans mostly, and I was curious as to where you were going with that.

You mentioned that this was an idea written by a member of the Washington media? Where is this article? Because I think if someone were to write something like that, they'd likely be thrown out of town.You didn't hear any of the Washington media praising your team for rallying behind the tragedy?

Seriously?

And you think if anyone did say something like that they would be thrown out of town?

Seriously?

You have a completely different perspective of sports than I do. I consider that a very noble thing, not a crutch. I have in no way dissed your team in the comments I have made. No way at all. I was giving them credit.

[AmishGangsta]

You didn't hear any of the Washington media praising your team for rallying behind the tragedy?

Seriously?

And you think if anyone did say something like that they would be thrown out of town?

Seriously?

You have a completely different perspective of sports than I do. I consider that a very noble thing, not a crutch. I have in no way dissed your team in the comments I have made. No way at all. I was giving them credit.

That's not the part I disagree with. I know the team rallied after the incident, that much is obvious.

What I disagree with, is the assertion that the tragedy did us some kind of favor, and in not having that kind of motivational factor, it will some how hinder the team this year. It's nothing personal -- as I've seen this argument thrown around a lot, but I like debating with you, as you are pretty reasonable; that's why I responded to you.

It's a position I strongly disagree with; that's what these types of places are for, to discuss things we disagree on. (obviously you know that).

I know people write things sometimes to get fans of rival teams rilled up, that they say things sometimes that they don't actually believe. That's why I was asking what you meant by that. But as you can see their are some others who do actually believe this as fact, and that's why I decided to touch on the subject.

As far as being thrown out of town, that's just a figure of speech. But it's likely something that could ruin the reputation of a writer or broadcaster, if it were worded the wrong way.

[Hostile]

That's not the part I disagree with. I know the team rallied after the incident, that much is obvious.

What I disagree with, is the assertion that the tragedy did us some kind of favor, and in not having that kind of motivational factor, it will some how hinder the team this year. It's nothing personal -- as I've seen this argument thrown around a lot, but I like debating with you, as you are pretty reasonable; that's why I responded to you. Could it hinder you? Of course it could. Is there a guarantee it will? Of course not. Could having Jason Campbell at QB instead of Todd Collins hinder you? Of course it could. Is there a guarantee it will? Of course not.

I said the coaching change is the factor I would look at. You lost some great coaches. Why deny that?

It's a position I strongly disagree with; that's what these types of places are for, to discuss things we disagree on. (obviously you know that).You disagree that Taylor's death rallied your team?

Why? Do you see that as some sort of weakness? I don't.

I know people write things sometimes to get fans of rival teams rilled up, that they didn't mean to say or that they don't actually believe.The Washington media writes to rile me (a rival fan) up?

Please ask these guys if you doubt me. The day Sean Taylor died I went to ES and sent PMs to Jumbo, Henry, and Om (3 guys I have tremendous respect for). In that PM I said that I hoped the Redskins would rally around Sean's memory and make the playoffs.

Clearly I have a more reverent feeling towards what your team lost than you do. I wasn't trying to rile anyone up.

As far as being thrown out of town, that's just a figure of speech. But it's likely something that could ruin the reputation of a writer or broadcaster, if it were worded the wrong way.I guess I am just not seeing why you find this objectionable. I really don't. If it was one of our players I would be proud as hell of how the team overcame that tragedy. You seem genuinely ashamed of it.

That's why I was asking what you meant by that. But as you can see their are some others who do actually believe this; that's why I decided to touch on the subject.I didn't think I was being cryptic. Making the playoffs in 2007 doesn't mean 2008 is guaranteed. You have big coaching changes, potential QB controversies if Campbell struggles, and the emotional high of the team rallying behind Taylor's loss will not be as powerful.

Does that mean you are doomed? Of course not. I responded to Green28's comments about you making the playoffs in 2007 as if that is some kind of guarantee. Whether it chaps your butt to hear it or not, 2007 is not a guarantee you are a playoff team in 2008. Sorry, that's just a fact of life.

Eventually you will probably ask me if I think you are a playoff team in 2008. No, I don't think you are. I say the same thing about most teams that make wholesale coaching changes to an inexperienced head coach.

[firehawk350]

I guess I am just not seeing why you find this objectionable. I really don't. If it was one of our players I would be proud as hell of how the team overcame that tragedy. You seem genuinely ashamed of it.

I didn't think I was being cryptic. Making the playoffs in 2007 doesn't mean 2008 is guaranteed. You have big coaching changes, potential QB controversies if Campbell struggles, and the emotional high of the team rallying behind Taylor's loss will not be as powerful.

Does that mean you are doomed? Of course not. I responded to Green28's comments about you making the playoffs in 2007 as if that is some kind of guarantee. Whether it chaps your butt to hear it or not, 2007 is not a guarantee you are a playoff team in 2008. Sorry, that's just a fact of life.

Eventually you will probably ask me if I think you are a playoff team in 2008. No, I don't think you are. I say the same thing about most teams that make wholesale coaching changes to an inexperienced head coach.

See, I think the disconnect is here. I don't think anybody could say that the Sean Taylor tragedy helped but nor could they disagree that the team rallied around it. Another thing nearly undebatable is that it showed character to turn it into a rally. What I think most Skins fans find inconceivable, and in some cases offensive, is the idea the "reason" we made the playoffs is Sean's death. Most of the time, it's used as a reason why we'll be 5-11 or something like that. It's usually followed by some comparison of Quincy Carter to Jason Campbell and how Gregg Williams leaving would destroy our defense (as if, last year, they weren't just telling us how horrible he was).

[Hostile]

See, I think the disconnect is here. I don't think anybody could say that the Sean Taylor tragedy helped but nor could they disagree that the team rallied around it. Another thing nearly undebatable is that it showed character to turn it into a rally. What I think most Skins fans find inconceivable, and in some cases offensive, is the idea the "reason" we made the playoffs is Sean's death. Most of the time, it's used as a reason why we'll be 5-11 or something like that. It's usually followed by some comparison of Quincy Carter to Jason Campbell and how Gregg Williams leaving would destroy our defense (as if, last year, they weren't just telling us how horrible he was).I guess I just don't get it. When a team rallies around a fallen teammate I am moved by that.

[Bob Sacamano]

Didn't the Skins make the playoffs last season?

because of your backup QB

Did they lose anything significant in the offseason?

you don't have much talent to begin w/

Did they improve their primary weakness, WR?

2 rookies? LOL

[Bob Sacamano]

Be honest, do you think making the playoffs one year guarantees making them the next year? Is it really that simplistic to you?

Do you believe your coaching staff is improved? That has no impact on expectations? I think your Defense is going to disappoint you. I had tremendous respect for Gregg Williams. He's gone.

WR may have been your weakness last year and you may have improved it. Does that mean that coaching can't trip you up? Does that mean your Defense couldn't struggle?

Do you agree with the Washington media that your team last year played on sheer emotion after the death of Sean Taylor? What's the rallying cry this year?

I think think the maroon, black, and yellow are in for a rough year. Not saying you can't surprise, but making the playoffs last year doesn't guarantee you squat.

good points, the Skins haven't made consecutive trips to the playoffs in awhile

[CowboyWay]

Skins won the last 4 because of one reason, and one reason only. JC wasn't quarterbacking that team.

He is bad. I know most skins fans can't accept that fact, but that doesn't make it untrue.

His loftiest goals are to one day be average. We will see if he ever makes it.

I give it until week 3 before the entire skin nation is screaming for Collins to be the starter.

[apickmans]

Skins won the last 4 because of one reason, and one reason only. JC wasn't quarterbacking that team.

He is bad. I know most skins fans can't accept that fact, but that doesn't make it untrue.

His loftiest goals are to one day be average. We will see if he ever makes it.

I give it until week 3 before the entire skin nation is screaming for Collins to be the starter.

Sir, I respect your Homerism.

[Brandon]

Sir, I respect your Homerism.

Glad to see your supporting vandalism.

[Sonny#9]

Skins won the last 4 because of one reason, and one reason only. JC wasn't quarterbacking that team.

He is bad. I know most skins fans can't accept that fact, but that doesn't make it untrue.

His loftiest goals are to one day be average. We will see if he ever makes it.

I give it until week 3 before the entire skin nation is screaming for Collins to be the starter.

What, no Quincy Carter reference? Take a look at the defense Collins faced. Easy to look good facing those teams.

[Bob Sacamano]

What, no Quincy Carter reference? Take a look at the defense Collins faced. Easy to look good facing those teams.

when has Campbell ever looked good?

[Sonny#9]

when has Campbell ever looked good?

He's played well at times, but I am not going to try and convince you otherwise...it'd be a waste of time.

[Bob Sacamano]

He's played well at times, but I am not going to try and convince you otherwise...it'd be a waste of time.

where's your badge, cop-out?

give me a break, Campbell is a mediocre player, he can't beat teams like Houston and Tennessee, don't give me, "it's so easy a caveman can do it", because Campbell hasn't consistently beat anyone in order for you to use that argument

[Yeagermeister]

Geez this thread is still alive? :geezer:

[Sonny#9]

where's your badge, cop-out?

give me a break, Campbell is a mediocre player, he can't beat teams like Houston and Tennessee, don't give me, "it's so easy a caveman can do it", because Campbell hasn't consistently beat anyone in order for you to use that argument

I've dealt with you enough times to know better...some people just need to be ignored.

[Bob Sacamano]

I've dealt with you enough times to know better...some people just need to be ignored.

you mean got dealt w/

[Star4Ever]

I continue to visit ES (not post, just read) just for laughs. Bubba, tr1, and some of the other idiots constantly ***** about how much the Cowboys are in the media, yet 99% of their posts are Cowboy-related. Do these guys not really know that they're making complete ***** out of themselves? The obsession level is really getting creepy. I suspect medications are in order. When we win the Super Bowl this year, there may just be mass suicides on ES, not that it would be a bad thing. Some people should simply not be allowed to reproduce.

[Star4Ever]

Let's just put this to rest. Barring catastrophoic injuries to several NFC teams, the Skins WILL NOT make the playoffs this year. They're simply not good enough. Every team in the East is more talented. Minnesota, Green Bay, Seattle, Carolina (with a healthy QB), New Orleans, and maybe even Tampa Bay are also more talented than the Skins. They simply won't make the playoffs. Period.

[Sonny#9]

you mean got dealt w/

However you want to word it to assuage your ego.

[Sonny#9]

Be honest, do you think making the playoffs one year guarantees making them the next year? Is it really that simplistic to you?

Absolutely not -- anyone who is banking on "well, we made the playoffs last year" is fooling themselves.

Do you believe your coaching staff is improved? That has no impact on expectations? I think your Defense is going to disappoint you. I had tremendous respect for Gregg Williams. He's gone.

WR may have been your weakness last year and you may have improved it. Does that mean that coaching can't trip you up? Does that mean your Defense couldn't struggle?

I don't think the defense is going to change too much. Blanche is no slouch, and the personnel is the same. McIntosh is getting healthy, and should be ready by camp. He was a playing very, very well when he went down. I do not like the way they handled Williams though. I thought he was treated poorly. Same system, with the same players.

Zorn however is a MAJOR X factor. I cannot get a grasp on him. I think he has the football knowledge (and Adam Schein doesn't like him, so that gives me hope :)). But then he has gaffes like "maroon, yellow and black"


Do you agree with the Washington media that your team last year played on sheer emotion after the death of Sean Taylor? What's the rallying cry this year?

I think think the maroon, black, and yellow are in for a rough year. Not saying you can't surprise, but making the playoffs last year doesn't guarantee you squat.

I agree -- we could be in for a long year, we could surprise the hell out of a lot of people. I think one of the facts that gets ignored is six starters were out for an extended period. Getting Randy Thomas back helps. He is our best lineman. I'd love to sit here and say with any amount of confidence that we're going to win 10 games. But I can't. I can't even say with confidence that we are going to win 8. We'll definitely win more then 6...I think.

We'll see. I cannot for the life of me get a grip on this team. I like what they did in the draft for the most part, except maybe passing on Calais Campbell for Fred Davis. But we'll see how that plays out.

Camp is right around the corner, and we'll have something more then speculation to discuss!

[Hostile]

Absolutely not -- anyone who is banking on "well, we made the playoffs last year" is fooling themselves.



I don't think the defense is going to change too much. Blanche is no slouch, and the personnel is the same. McIntosh is getting healthy, and should be ready by camp. He was a playing very, very well when he went down. I do not like the way they handled Williams though. I thought he was treated poorly. Same system, with the same players.

Zorn however is a MAJOR X factor. I cannot get a grasp on him. I think he has the football knowledge (and Adam Schein doesn't like him, so that gives me hope :)). But then he has gaffes like "maroon, yellow and black"




I agree -- we could be in for a long year, we could surprise the hell out of a lot of people. I think one of the facts that gets ignored is six starters were out for an extended period. Getting Randy Thomas back helps. He is our best lineman. I'd love to sit here and say with any amount of confidence that we're going to win 10 games. But I can't. I can't even say with confidence that we are going to win 8. We'll definitely win more then 6...I think.

We'll see. I cannot for the life of me get a grip on this team. I like what they did in the draft for the most part, except maybe passing on Calais Campbell for Fred Davis. But we'll see how that plays out.

Camp is right around the corner, and we'll have something more then speculation to discuss!Thank you for responding since he wouldn't.

I was shocked when you passed on Calais Campbell. Even moreso when you grabbed a TE.

[theebs]

Let's just put this to rest. Barring catastrophoic injuries to several NFC teams, the Skins WILL NOT make the playoffs this year. They're simply not good enough. Every team in the East is more talented. Minnesota, Green Bay, Seattle, Carolina (with a healthy QB), New Orleans, and maybe even Tampa Bay are also more talented than the Skins. They simply won't make the playoffs. Period.


I dont believe that at all.

I think all 4 nfc east teams are good enough to win the division and/or make the playoffs.

Tampa bay and Carolina are no where near as talented as Washington. Not even close.

Lot of talk about minnesota. When push comes to shove this season I am starting to wonder if the vikings will get shoved.

I personally think green bay is a wild card because of rogers. there is alot going on there right now. I think rodgers can play and I think he will thrive in that offense, now it will just be a matter of surviving the looming media at every turn. Will that secondary hold up?

I see the 4 nfc east teams and Seattle as the best teams in the nfc. As always happens one of the east teams will slip. Which one I have no idea.

The redskins schedule looks to me like it will allow them to win a bunch of games. Just like last year when they were rolling along with Campbell, a good player who is getting bagged on all the time on this site and I dont understand why.

The east will be crazy. I expect the eagles to be playing at a very high level from the start this year. that worries me. I expect the redskins to play well with an offense where the ball will come out quicker and the offensive line being healthy. And obviously the giants have all the tools to win the whole thing again. Same with us. the east is going to be crazy. I just hope it doesnt benefit seattle too much.

[Sonny#9]

Thank you for responding since he wouldn't.

I was shocked when you passed on Calais Campbell. Even moreso when you grabbed a TE.

While I applaud the idea of BPA and the Skins trying to take a different approach concerning the draft -- I don't understand passing on Campbell. I just hope he is the next Alan Branch.

[Star4Ever]

I dont believe that at all.

I think all 4 nfc east teams are good enough to win the division and/or make the playoffs.

Tampa bay and Carolina are no where near as talented as Washington. Not even close.

Lot of talk about minnesota. When push comes to shove this season I am starting to wonder if the vikings will get shoved.

I personally think green bay is a wild card because of rogers. there is alot going on there right now. I think rodgers can play and I think he will thrive in that offense, now it will just be a matter of surviving the looming media at every turn. Will that secondary hold up?

I see the 4 nfc east teams and Seattle as the best teams in the nfc. As always happens one of the east teams will slip. Which one I have no idea.

The redskins schedule looks to me like it will allow them to win a bunch of games. Just like last year when they were rolling along with Campbell, a good player who is getting bagged on all the time on this site and I dont understand why.

The east will be crazy. I expect the eagles to be playing at a very high level from the start this year. that worries me. I expect the redskins to play well with an offense where the ball will come out quicker and the offensive line being healthy. And obviously the giants have all the tools to win the whole thing again. Same with us. the east is going to be crazy. I just hope it doesnt benefit seattle too much.

Just my opinion. I think the Skins rode a wave of emotion last year and it took them to the playoffs. They now have a headcoach that has never even been a coordinator, along with new offensive and defensive coordinators. Their D line is very poor, their O line is injury-prone and aging, their QB is average at best, their secondary is average, and they're banking on two rookie WRs to make a difference. Pretty much anyone that follows the NFL knows that WRs almost never make an impact in their rookie year, especially those that fell to the second round of the draft (every team in the league passed on them for some reason). Their the 4th best team in the East and that won't get you in the playoffs, again, barring severe injuries for several teams.

[Star4Ever]

"I see the 4 nfc east teams and Seattle as the best teams in the nfc. As always happens one of the east teams will slip. Which one I have no idea".

Let me help you with this one. It's the team that wears burgundy and gold. Mark it down. :suxskins:

[AmishGangsta]

Thank you for responding since he wouldn't.

I didn't respond because I didn't disagree with those points, I responded to the point I disagreed with.

I'm pretty sure everybody and their mothers have the division playing out something like this:

Cowboys
Giants
Eagles
Redskins

That would be the obvious pick.

[zrinkill]

I didn't respond because I didn't disagree with those points.

I'm pretty sure everybody and their mothers have the division playing out something like this:

Cowboys
Giants
Eagles
Redskins

That would be the obvious pick.

We talking Fantasy Football or the real thing?

[AmishGangsta]

We talking Fantasy Football or the real thing?

He'll be here all night folks

[Hostile]

I didn't respond because I didn't disagree with those points, I responded to the point I disagreed with.

I'm pretty sure everybody and their mothers have the division playing out something like this:

Cowboys
Giants
Eagles
Redskins

That would be the obvious pick.My post that he quoted wasn't directed to you either, it was Green28. You aren't guilty either.

[AmishGangsta]

My post that he quoted wasn't directed to you either, it was Green28. You aren't guilty either.

oh, ok

[SkinsHokieFan]

With character guys like this, I feel pretty good about the future of the Redskins :)

http://www.emediaworld.com/press_release/release_detail.php?id=98555

Garden Valley, TX (eMediaWorld ) July 12, 2008 -- Recently returned from a week-long international humanitarian mission to support Mercy Ships, his charity of choice, Malcolm Kelly looks forward to his upcoming NFL training camp with an additional sense of purpose knowing that he's part of a much larger team as well.

Malcolm Kelly in front of the hospital ship Africa Mercy during his recent trip to Liberia to see first hand the work of Mercy Ships.
Malcolm Kelly in front of the hospital ship Africa Mercy during his recent trip to Liberia to see first hand the work of Mercy Ships.

The former standout receiver at the University of Oklahoma and 2nd Round draft pick of the Washington Redskins made the "Vision Trip" to Monrovia, Liberia as a way to shed light on the medical relief effort Mercy Ships has provided for the last four years to the people of the war-torn nation.

A highlight of the trip came as Malcolm and his father Moses Kelly were received by Liberian President Ellen Johnson Sirleaf, who personally thanked Malcolm for providing a positive role model for young people in Liberia.

"More than anything, our youth need someone to look up to who has excelled, not only in athletics, but in life. Understanding the importance of discipline, work-ethic and education, as well as nutrition and physical well-being is critical in our efforts to rebuild Liberia," noted President Sirleaf.

"Malcolm's willingness to come here to Liberia, a nation founded by freed American slaves, builds on the natural kinship between Americans and Liberians. Having a young African-American athlete who has achieved so much in life at such a young age reach out to our young people in this way is priceless. We need more of that. Our young people need that kind of encouragement at this critical time in our nation's history," Sirleaf stated.

Kelly was obviously moved by his experience in Liberia. "Everywhere we went, people ran up to me to shake my hand and hug me, saying 'Thank you! Thank you!' I was a hero, but not because I'm a football player; it was because I was wearing a Mercy Ships Crew shirt. I don't think I've ever been more humbled and honored than to be considered a part of the Mercy Ships team," he said.

Kelly stayed onboard the Africa Mercy during the trip, observing surgeries, and visiting with dozens of patients on the recovery wards. The group also visited a clinic under construction by a Mercy Ships Field Service Team some 20 miles inland in the rural community of Tenegar.

While also in Liberia, Kelly met with officials from the Ministry of Youth and Sports and Liberian Olympic Committee. Liberia's educational and sports initiatives were sidelined during the 14-year civil war and the nation struggles to make improvements to even the most basic health and living standards.

The 21-year-old rookie brought along his personal trainer, world-renowned sports performance coach Chip Smith from Competitive Edge Sports, based in Atlanta, Georgia. In addition to ensuring Malcolm's readiness for Redskins Training Camp, which begins July 20th, Smith held sessions for 35 Liberian coaches and athletes including members of the Olympic Team and Committee at the invitation of the National Minister of Youth and Sports. "Train the Trainer" sessions were held at the National Sports Complex which included teaching on sports theory and workout demonstrations and exercises.

"Chip has trained more professional athletes with this system than anyone else in the world," stated Kelly as he addressed the Liberian assembly of athletes and coaches before one of his workouts. "We are leaving the system and training equipment here for you as my gift, along with my promise that I will be back with other athletes to help encourage you to stay focused and keep working to fulfill your dreams."

In response, one Liberian Olympian spoke on behalf of his nation by saying, "We share the same history, the same ancestry, the same dreams and aspirations. Today, you leave this incredible tool with us. Tomorrow, when you go back to the NFL, you take a piece of our hearts. You are now our brother." The Liberians presented Kelly and Smith with Lone Star jerseys from the National Soccer Team and colorful traditional African clothing.

Kelly named Mercy Ships as his charity of choice earlier in 2008 soon after declaring himself eligible for the 2008 NFL Draft. Mercy Ships International Operations Center is located only 25 miles from Kelly's hometown of Longview, Texas.

Mercy Ships has operated hospital ships in developing nations since 1978 bringing hope and healing to the forgotten poor by mobilizing people and resources worldwide. A crew of both professional medical and non-medical volunteers serves all people without regard for race, gender, or religion. The Mercy Ships Crew are expected to perform more than 7000 medical procedures during their 2008 field service in Liberia.

For more information about this trip or to schedule an interview with Malcolm Kelly, contact:

Pauline Rick, US Media Liaison
Mercy Ships
Tel: (903) 939-7649
rickp @ mercyships.org
www.mercyships.org

[SkinsHokieFan]

Thank you for responding since he wouldn't.

I was shocked when you passed on Calais Campbell. Even moreso when you grabbed a TE.

Are you serious? Calais Campbell? I watched plenty of the kid when he was at Miami, classic classic underachiever. When guys like Ed Wang (Virginia Tech right tackle this year) and Brandon Frye (RT in 2006) handled him quite easily, well thats all I needed to know about CC.

All sorts of talent, no drive or motivation, relies on the fact that he is bigger then everyone else. No technique. Would have been a wasted pick

What has been the problem in DC this decade? Not the defense thats for damn sure, but the ability to put up points, in particular in the red zone. Whats funny is everyone around the NFL has the dumbest view of the Redskins, they COULD NOT SCORE POINTS IN THE RED ZONE (for example our game in November). The defense has been fine, the d-line is in good shape (no super studs, but they won't get pushed around). Again, the offense COULD NOT SCORE POINTS IN THE RED ZONE, and drafting a Calais Campbell underachiever would have done nothing to solve that problem

[Sonny#9]

Thank you for responding since he wouldn't.

I was shocked when you passed on Calais Campbell. Even moreso when you grabbed a TE.

Whats funny is everyone around the NFL has the dumbest view of the Redskins, they COULD NOT SCORE POINTS IN THE RED ZONE

That is the one thing that helped swallow that pill: Davis and Cooley with some combination of Kelly/Thomas/Mix gives the Redskins a lot of very large targets in the Red Zone. One of their MAJOR weaknesses.

However, I would not have been against the pick of Campbell there either. Perhaps at DT (a 6'9" DT would have been intriguing)...