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View Full Version : McCain won "protodebate"


Bach
08-19-2008, 11:41 AM
No Contest

http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=303952351194789

Election '08: Last weekend's McCain-Obama protodebate made it clear why Obama won't keep his promise to debate McCain "anywhere, anytime." McCain, with a robust resume and details at his fingertips, won big.

It was only in May that Sen. Barack Obama cockily proclaimed he would debate Sen. John McCain "anywhere, anytime." But in June, Obama said no to McCain's challenge to have 10 one-on-one town hall meetings.
After what happened at Lake Forest, Calif.'s evangelical Saddleback megachurch Saturday evening, we may have found that debating is Obama's Achilles' heel. Whether or not you like the idea of such events being held in religious venues, the plain-and-simple method of questioning used by Saddleback pastor and best-selling author Rick Warren revealed fundamental differences between these two men.
"It's one of those situations where the devil is in the details," Obama said at one point. He could have been referring to his own oratorical shortcomings when a teleprompter is unavailable. We learned a lot more about the real Obama at Saddleback than we will next week as he delivers his acceptance speech in Denver before a massive stadium crowd.
The stark differences between the two came through the most on the question of whether there is evil in the world. Obama spoke of evil within America, "in parents who have viciously abused their children." According to the Democrat, we can't really erase evil in the world because "that is God's task." And we have to "have some humility in how we approach the issue of confronting evil."
For McCain, with a global war on terror raging, there was no equivocating: We must "defeat" evil. If al-Qaida's placing of suicide vests on mentally-disabled women and then blowing them up by remote control in a Baghdad market isn't evil, he asked: "You have to tell me what is."
Asked to name figures he would rely on for advice, Obama gave the stock answer of family members. McCain pointed to Gen. David Petraeus, Iraq's scourge of the surge; Democratic Rep. John Lewis, who "had his skull fractured" by white racists while protesting for civil rights in the 60s; plus Internet entrepreneur Meg Whitman, the innovative former CEO of eBay.
When Warren inquired into changes of mind on big issues, Obama fretted about welfare reform; McCain unashamedly said "drilling" — for reasons of national security and economic need.
On taxes, Obama waxed political: "What I'm trying to do is create a sense of balance and fairness in our tax code." McCain showed an understanding of what drives a free economy: "I don't want to take any money from the rich. I want everybody to get rich. I don't believe in class warfare or redistribution of the wealth."
To any honest observer, the differences between John McCain and Barack Obama have been evident all along. What we saw last weekend was Obama's shallowness juxtaposed with McCain's depth, the product of his extraordinary life experience.
It may not have been a debate, but it was one of the most lopsided political contests in memory. No wonder Obama wants to keep debate formats boring and predictable.

Angus
08-19-2008, 11:59 AM
The most telling indication of McCain's triumph at Saddleback has been the reaction of liberal blogs and their readers who were almost in panic as a result of their perception that Obama got creamed.

:D

Bach
08-19-2008, 12:03 PM
The most telling indication of McCain's triumph at Saddleback has been the reaction of liberal blogs and their readers who were almost in panic as a result of their perception that Obama got creamed.

:D


Tell me more.

:D

utrunner07
08-19-2008, 12:27 PM
oh there is no doubt that Obama is going to get ripped to shreds when it comes time for the debates...his ideas are based on promoting himself to the ignorant masses...anyone with any political sense will destroy him in any debate...I only wish it was Ron Paul he was debating...that would be a comedy/tragedy all in one!

Angus
08-19-2008, 12:34 PM
Tell me more.

:D

Ask, and ye shall receive:


Leftwing Blogosphere Disappointed in Obama Saddleback Forum Performance
By P.J. Gladnick (Bio | Archive)
August 17, 2008 - 14:24 ET

So just how bad was Barack Obama's performance at the Saddleback Church faith-based forum last night? To read the cautious mainstream media reports, such as CNN, on the event you would think that Obama was merely "thoughtful" as reported by Michael M. Bates here on NewsBusters today. However, in a few media outlets a much blunter appraisal of Obama's performance can be found such as in the U.K. Telegraph. The very title of their article, "Barack Obama fails to shine alongside John McCain," gives a good idea of writer Alex Spillius' opinion of the event (emphasis mine):

As a regular church-goer comfortable talking about his faith, Mr Obama is ostensibly better placed than most recent Democratic candidates to win over evangelicals.

But his support of abortion, a non-negotiable issue for many conservative Christians, remains a considerable obstacle, and he drew disapproving noises from the 2,800 audience at Saddleback in Lake Forest, California when he gave an evasive response to the question of when human rights begin for a baby.

"Whether you are looking at it from a theological perspective or a scientific perspective, answering that question with specificity, you know, is above my pay grade," said Mr Obama.

Spillius contrasted what he called an "evasive answer" with John McCain's response:

Mr McCain, who has always been against abortion, in contrast gave a swift response: "At the moment of conception", drawing a loud round of applause.

Perhaps the best measure of Obama's performance can be seen among a group that normally includes his strongest supporters, the leftwing blogosphere. Despite some brave attempts by some in that arena to put a happy face on Obama's appearance at Pastor Rick Warren's forum, even they were forced to express disappointment as you can see in both the Democratic Underground and the Daily Kos. The very title of the DU thread, "I won't win cool points for this, but McCain is doing excellent so far, better than Obama," expresses something less than a vote of confidence for Obama. Here are a few examples of just how disappointed the DUers were in Obama last night:

...I honestly can't remember hardly any of Senator Obama's answers to the questions that were asked, while McCain has had at least SOME memorable answers.

I think it was a mistake for Senator Obama to do this forum.

I've been shocked at how well McCain has done compared to what I was expecting. That very well could be it.

I don't know why Obama went there - he comes across as a poor second to our "McZero the hero".

Meanwhile, the Kossacks tried not too convincingly to believe that McCain didn't really win as you can see from this thread title, "Why McCain's 'win' wasn't really a win at the FBF." The author of the thread might be trying to convince the other Kossacks that McCain didn't win but many others weren't buying it as you can see:

McCain beat our a** tonight.

We have been here before. You don't bring Karate to a gun fight. You bring an Uzzi. McCain brought an Uzzi. Obama brought a pocket knife and got ambushed. It's time to stop this crap.

His answer "above my pay grade" will be in an ad tomorrow. He appeared to give non answers to me. And he must have said uh and um a hundred times!

OBAMA GOT CREAMED...NO OTHER WAY TO LOOK at it.

Try as the MSM can to avoid mentioning just how poorly Obama performed last night in comparison with McCain, many on the left, as you can see, are very upfront in expressing their disappointment. You can see an even larger sampling of leftwing depression over Obama's performance at the DUmmie Funnies.

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/p-j-gladnick/2008/08/17/leftwing-blogosphere-disappointed-obama-saddleback-forum-performance

BrAinPaiNt
08-19-2008, 12:51 PM
It helps when you know the questions beforehand.:D

ScipioCowboy
08-19-2008, 12:58 PM
Obama shouldn't be too disheartened. Bush was beaten soundly in his first debate against Kerry and performed only marginally better in the second one; yet Bush is in the oval office while Kerry remains in the Senate.

Bach
08-19-2008, 01:29 PM
Ask, and ye shall receive:


Leftwing Blogosphere Disappointed in Obama Saddleback Forum Performance
By P.J. Gladnick (Bio | Archive)
August 17, 2008 - 14:24 ET

So just how bad was Barack Obama's performance at the Saddleback Church faith-based forum last night? To read the cautious mainstream media reports, such as CNN, on the event you would think that Obama was merely "thoughtful" as reported by Michael M. Bates here on NewsBusters today. However, in a few media outlets a much blunter appraisal of Obama's performance can be found such as in the U.K. Telegraph. The very title of their article, "Barack Obama fails to shine alongside John McCain," gives a good idea of writer Alex Spillius' opinion of the event (emphasis mine):

As a regular church-goer comfortable talking about his faith, Mr Obama is ostensibly better placed than most recent Democratic candidates to win over evangelicals.

But his support of abortion, a non-negotiable issue for many conservative Christians, remains a considerable obstacle, and he drew disapproving noises from the 2,800 audience at Saddleback in Lake Forest, California when he gave an evasive response to the question of when human rights begin for a baby.

"Whether you are looking at it from a theological perspective or a scientific perspective, answering that question with specificity, you know, is above my pay grade," said Mr Obama.

Spillius contrasted what he called an "evasive answer" with John McCain's response:

Mr McCain, who has always been against abortion, in contrast gave a swift response: "At the moment of conception", drawing a loud round of applause.

Perhaps the best measure of Obama's performance can be seen among a group that normally includes his strongest supporters, the leftwing blogosphere. Despite some brave attempts by some in that arena to put a happy face on Obama's appearance at Pastor Rick Warren's forum, even they were forced to express disappointment as you can see in both the Democratic Underground and the Daily Kos. The very title of the DU thread, "I won't win cool points for this, but McCain is doing excellent so far, better than Obama," expresses something less than a vote of confidence for Obama. Here are a few examples of just how disappointed the DUers were in Obama last night:

...I honestly can't remember hardly any of Senator Obama's answers to the questions that were asked, while McCain has had at least SOME memorable answers.

I think it was a mistake for Senator Obama to do this forum.

I've been shocked at how well McCain has done compared to what I was expecting. That very well could be it.

I don't know why Obama went there - he comes across as a poor second to our "McZero the hero".

Meanwhile, the Kossacks tried not too convincingly to believe that McCain didn't really win as you can see from this thread title, "Why McCain's 'win' wasn't really a win at the FBF." The author of the thread might be trying to convince the other Kossacks that McCain didn't win but many others weren't buying it as you can see:

McCain beat our a** tonight.

We have been here before. You don't bring Karate to a gun fight. You bring an Uzzi. McCain brought an Uzzi. Obama brought a pocket knife and got ambushed. It's time to stop this crap.

His answer "above my pay grade" will be in an ad tomorrow. He appeared to give non answers to me. And he must have said uh and um a hundred times!

OBAMA GOT CREAMED...NO OTHER WAY TO LOOK at it.

Try as the MSM can to avoid mentioning just how poorly Obama performed last night in comparison with McCain, many on the left, as you can see, are very upfront in expressing their disappointment. You can see an even larger sampling of leftwing depression over Obama's performance at the DUmmie Funnies.

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/p-j-gladnick/2008/08/17/leftwing-blogosphere-disappointed-obama-saddleback-forum-performance

Thanks

:D