Ufc 111

[dalboy]

WIth UFC 111 a week away I thought I check out everyone's opinion. Im taking Alves over Fitch, Carwin over Mir, and GSP over Hardy(and hopefully get Hardy to shut up). Just wondering if yal agree and who yal think will win

[MarionBarberThe4th]

I should go to this

Carwin and GSP

[Ren]

GSP vs Hardy is a total non event GSP is the only good fighter in his weight class

[dalboy]

GSP vs Hardy is a total non event GSP is the only good fighter in his weight class
I have to disagree even though I hate Hardy he is a great fighter but GSP who is in the top 3 for the worlds best pound for pound fighters in that class. You could say the same about the middle weight with spider but you cant it dominated by spider yes but they do have great fighters in that class

[Rampage]

I have to disagree even though I hate Hardy he is a great fighter but GSP who is in the top 3 for the worlds best pound for pound fighters in that class. You could say the same about the middle weight with spider but you cant it dominated by spider yes but they do have great fighters in that class
bull! just like the middleweight division the welterweight division is extremely weak.

[dalboy]

bull! just like the middleweight division the welterweight division is extremely weak.
how is GSP not in the top 3 of the worlds best pound for pound fighters

[Rampage]

how is GSP not in the top 3 of the worlds best pound for pound fighters
Fedor,Machida,Shogun,Anderson, Big Nog etc. not to mention every time gsp fights he's the bigger fighter. seriously gsp is so overrated it's not even funny anymore.

[rkell87]

Fedor,Machida,Shogun,Anderson, Big Nog etc. not to mention every time gsp fights he's the bigger fighter. seriously gsp is so overrated it's not even funny anymore.
you can make an arguement for GSP not being top 3 pfp but shogun, and nog are not in that arguement.

[Rampage]

you can make an arguement for GSP not being top 3 pfp but shogun, and nog are not in that arguement.
Shogun and Nog have beaten way more credible fighters than an over the hill Matt hughes, a natural lw in BJ Penn and a never was in Matt Serra.

[dalboy]

Ill give you Fedor as 1 and Anderson as 2 but Machida is not over gsp and no one else you listed is

[Rampage]

"and that's where we defer" Jay-Z (Lost One):D

[Dash28]

Fedor,Machida,Shogun,Anderson, Big Nog etc. not to mention every time gsp fights he's the bigger fighter. seriously gsp is so overrated it's not even funny anymore.
:lmao2:

[rkell87]

Shogun and Nog have beaten way more credible fighters than an over the hill Matt hughes, a natural lw in BJ Penn and a never was in Matt Serra.
credible yes because their division is stronger im not arguing them vs gsp im saying them nowhere near top 5 pfp

[BigWillie]

bull! just like the middleweight division the welterweight division is extremely weak.

So is the lightweight division just the same?

When good fighters make others look a notch below them, it doesn't mean the division is 'weak'. I mean, GSP holds wins over Fitch, Alves, Mayhem, Trigg (from years ago), Karo (the in-shape and sane version), Kos and others. GSP has fought legit competition, but only continues to raise the bar that no one can match when he fights.

Anderson encounters a much larger problem at MW, but no one would leave him off of a P4P list and they have not done so for years.

Competition should factor in, but how you handle any competition factors in much more.

But basically, any MMA fan should write down ..

Fedor
Anderson
GSP

.. let them put these three in any order they want, and no one should argue against it unless they are just that nitpicky.

[the kid 05]

the next UFC event i'm lookin forward too is 113. One of my favorites returns (so glad to see Cote back), I was soo irked when he went down during that Silva fight

[TheCount]

I have to disagree even though I hate Hardy he is a great fighter but GSP who is in the top 3 for the worlds best pound for pound fighters in that class. You could say the same about the middle weight with spider but you cant it dominated by spider yes but they do have great fighters in that class

Hardy is a "great fighter"? I don't know about that.

[Ren]

the next UFC event i'm lookin forward too is 113. One of my favorites returns (so glad to see Cote back), I was soo irked when he went down during that Silva fight

I'm looking forward to 113 as well, Shogun vs Machida 2 need i say more...?

[Cover 2]

So is the lightweight division just the same?

When good fighters make others look a notch below them, it doesn't mean the division is 'weak'. I mean, GSP holds wins over Fitch, Alves, Mayhem, Trigg (from years ago), Karo (the in-shape and sane version), Kos and others. GSP has fought legit competition, but only continues to raise the bar that no one can match when he fights.

Anderson encounters a much larger problem at MW, but no one would leave him off of a P4P list and they have not done so for years.

Competition should factor in, but how you handle any competition factors in much more.

But basically, any MMA fan should write down ..

Fedor
Anderson
GSP

.. let them put these three in any order they want, and no one should argue against it unless they are just that nitpicky.
BJ could be argued over GSP.

[Rowdy]

http://www.mmanews.com/rankings

GSP is rated top pound for pound on the most recent rankings that were released.


Pound-For-Pound

1. Georges St. Pierre
2. Fedor Emelianenko
3. Anderson Silva
4. Lyoto Machida
5. B.J. Penn
6. Jose Aldo
7. Mike Thomas Brown
8. Jon Fitch
9. Thiago Alves
10. Brian Bowles

[MarionBarberThe4th]

http://www.mmanews.com/rankings

GSP is rated top pound for pound on the most recent rankings that were released.


Pound-For-Pound

1. Georges St. Pierre
2. Fedor Emelianenko
3. Anderson Silva
4. Lyoto Machida
5. B.J. Penn
6. Jose Aldo
7. Mike Thomas Brown
8. Jon Fitch
9. Thiago Alves
10. Brian Bowles

Jon Jones elbows should be on here somewhere

[Rampage]

http://www.mmanews.com/rankings

GSP is rated top pound for pound on the most recent rankings that were released.


Pound-For-Pound

1. Georges St. Pierre
2. Fedor Emelianenko
3. Anderson Silva
4. Lyoto Machida
5. B.J. Penn
6. Jose Aldo
7. Mike Thomas Brown
8. Jon Fitch
9. Thiago Alves
10. Brian Bowles

:laugh2: @ Jon Fitch and Thiago Alves even being on that list.
p4p is an opinion

guess you just skipped over the 1st few links till you found one with gsp ranked #1
http://www.google.com/#hl=en&source=hp&q=mma+pound+for+pound+rankings&aq=0&aqi=g10&aql=&oq=mma+po&gs_rfai=&fp=d53639546d3e9460

[Dash28]

:laugh2: @ Jon Fitch and Thiago Alves even being on that list.
p4p is an opinion

guess you just skipped over the 1st few links till you found one with gsp ranked #1
http://www.google.com/#hl=en&source=hp&q=mma+pound+for+pound+rankings&aq=0&aqi=g10&aql=&oq=mma+po&gs_rfai=&fp=d53639546d3e9460
What is your point? He's basically in the top 3 on all of them.

[Rowdy]

guess you just skipped over the 1st few links till you found one with gsp ranked #1
http://www.google.com/#hl=en&source=hp&q=mma+pound+for+pound+rankings&aq=0&aqi=g10&aql=&oq=mma+po&gs_rfai=&fp=d53639546d3e9460

Wrong. I go to mmanews.com regardless of who is listed. Most sites don't rank exactly the same. Your listing is old from last month.

[Ren]

GSP should put on a few lbs and go fight middle weight then at least there would be 2 good fighters in one of those weak *** divisions.

Funny how you UFC fanboys ***** and whine about Fedor not fighting anyone yet you're all to happy to celebrate the greatness that is GPS every time he beats up some bum in his joke of a weight class.

Wanna be great GSP? go fight Silva in MW or at catch weight, if he actually wanted this Dana would have made it happen by now

[TheCount]

Jon Jones elbows should be on here somewhere

Bones is a beast. Looking forward to seeing more from him.

[Dash28]

GSP should put on a few lbs and go fight middle weight then at least there would be 2 good fighters in one of those weak *** divisions.

Funny how you UFC fanboys ***** and whine about Fedor not fighting anyone yet you're all to happy to celebrate the greatness that is GPS every time he beats up some bum in his joke of a weight class.

Wanna be great GSP? go fight Silva in MW or at catch weight, if he actually wanted this Dana would have made it happen by now
Dana has said that he believes Silva is too big for GSP and didn't want that fight to happen. Also, GSP said he would take the fight and he has added on 8 lbs of lean muscle and is walking around at 195 now. His division has great competition and very good fighters, he just makes them look like bums. Just out of curiosity, who are your favorite fighters?

[BigWillie]

BJ could be argued over GSP.

No, he couldn't.

And this coming from the guy who has a pair of BJ Penn autographed fight gloves sitting in a glass case.

[dalboy]

GSP should put on a few lbs and go fight middle weight then at least there would be 2 good fighters in one of those weak *** divisions.
Other than spider who do you think would beat GSP in the middle weight class since you think he is overated(and you better not put Bisbing)

[Ren]

Dana has said that he believes Silva is too big for GSP and didn't want that fight to happen. Also, GSP said he would take the fight and he has added on 8 lbs of lean muscle and is walking around at 195 now. His division has great competition and very good fighters, he just makes them look like bums. Just out of curiosity, who are your favorite fighters?

pleas name these great welter weight fighters...

[Ren]

Other than spider who do you think would beat GSP in the middle weight class since you think he is overated(and you better not put Bisbing)


If you're going to quote me quote what i'm saying and not what you want me to say. I said if he jumps to MW there will be 2 good fighters in MW since there's only 1 now.

Wanderlei could probably take him though, take away GSPs size advantage in WW and he would to have to win on skill

MW is pretty sad right now too

Like i said, anyone wanna prove me wrong about WW feel free to list all these great fighters in that division....

[Dash28]

If you're going to quote me quote what i'm saying and not what you want me to say. I said if he jumps to MW there will be 2 good fighters in MW since there's only 1 now.

Wanderlei could probably take him though, take away GSPs size advantage in WW and he would to have to win on skill

MW is pretty sad right now too

Like i said, anyone wanna prove me wrong about WW feel free to list all these great fighters in that division....
I don't think it would be a problem if GSP had to win on "skill." Kos, Fitch, Alves, Daley and Hughes was one of the great WW champs and he ran through him twice. I never said the WW had "great" fighters but they're very good fighters and nothing to sneeze at. I guess this is just a hate for GSP more than anything. Few of the WW make the pound for pound rankings on some. And it's Dana that doesn't want the Silva vs GSP fight, GSP is putting on weight and he changed his diet so he could move up a weightclass. Who are a few of your favorite fighters Ren?

[Dash28]

Bones is a beast. Looking forward to seeing more from him.
Agree. I would like to see JDS vs Cain and really looking forward to the Rua/Machida rematch.

[BraveHeartFan]

GSP's problem is that he's so much better than everyone in his division that people have no become bored with him and they want to try and downgrade him for simply being great at what he does in his weight class.

It's a stupid thing that happens with a lot of fighters. They dominate people for too long and all the sudden they're over-rated cause everyone else in their division sucks.

Like with everything else sports related fans tend to decide to try and take away from people who are great at what they do by making up excuses for why they're great at what they do. Instead of simply nodding their head in respect to the fact that they're simply great at their sport.

BJ Penn is the unquestioned best LW fighter in the UFC. Does that mean everyone else in the LW division are simply bums who suck? To say that they are is a slap in the face at just how great BJ Penn is at 155.

Same thing goes for GSP at 170 and Anderson Silva at 185. I'd love to see those two divisions get even more people in them for those two to fight, and dominate, but I'll take nothing away from either of them, or Penn, or anyone who dominates their division.

Also why does GSP get knocked for his 'competition' in the PNP catagory and then people turn right around and praise Fedor as the best PNP in the world. Who exactly has he fought in the last oh...3-4 years who would even be in a discussion for a top fighter 3 fighter in the HW division right now?

Glass Jaw Andre, average at best Silvia, and Brett 'I'm A Fat Mr. T' Rogers are not exactly impressive, awe inspiring, wins either. So shouldn't you be knocking Fedor as well given his lack of legit competition in...forever?

[BraveHeartFan]

Oh and as for the card...

I've got GSP over Hardy, Carwin over Mir, and Alves over Fitch.

[Cover 2]

No, he couldn't.

And this coming from the guy who has a pair of BJ Penn autographed fight gloves sitting in a glass case.
GSP had a huge size advantage over BJ in their fight, so I don't really take that fight into consideration. Before that fight even Bas thought BJ was p4p #1.

[Rampage]

GSP had a huge size advantage over BJ in their fight, so I don't really take that fight into consideration. Before that fight even Bas thought BJ was p4p #1.
gsp is bigger than everybody he fights. the only welterweight bigger than him is Anthony Johnson who will probably move to middleweight since he can never make 170.

[Cover 2]

gsp is bigger than everybody he fights. the only welterweight bigger than him is Anthony Johnson who will probably move to middleweight since he can never make 170.
And Thiago Alves. How him and Rumble can make weight is something I can't understand.

[BigWillie]

GSP had a huge size advantage over BJ in their fight, so I don't really take that fight into consideration. Before that fight even Bas thought BJ was p4p #1.

Bas also said Benji Radach could beat Anderson Silva. Bas was a terrific fighter and a great color commentator for the simple fact he knows how to make the average joe understand the sport. But as an analyst, he is the same as everyone else.

I did not mention GSP's win over BJ? But size is a discrepancy that will happen in a ton of fights. BJ was confident enough in himself to ask for that fight, and he was thoroughly manhandled. It happens.

Matt Hughes is no bigger than GSP, as Hughes walks about the same weight as GSP. BJ was able to defeat Matt once upon a time. :)

Plus, GSP has fought guys bigger than himself as well. Guys like Jon Fitch and Thiago Alves walk at over 200lbs while GSP usually walks around at 190lbs.

gsp is bigger than everybody he fights. the only welterweight bigger than him is Anthony Johnson who will probably move to middleweight since he can never make 170.

Misconception, simply due to size.

I could name off a laundry list of fighters who walk around much bigger than GSP. It's just that GSP has these huge hulking muscles, even when he weighs-in that people think he is a ginormous welterweight. Not true at all.

GSP is known to walk at around just over 190lbs, and has only gotten that big recently, when he is out of training. Normally, GSP cuts around 15lbs of water weight to make his fights. For example - he walked into the cage against BJ at only a weight of 186lbs. Not a huge WW by any means.

Guys like Jon Fitch, Rory Markham, Thiago Alves, Mike Swick, Paul Daley, Josh Koscheck, and even Dan Hardy. Yes, even Dan Hardy has said himself he has been known to walk around as much as 210 in between fights.

Alves and Rumble are the two biggest WWs, as both are known to walk around 220lbs, which is insane to think.

But as I was saying, GSP is not a ginormous welterweight, and not even close to being one of the biggest in his division.

[TheCount]

You guys watching online? Stupid channel surfing is down.

[SDogo]

You guys watching online? Stupid channel surfing is down.


I cant get anything to work:banghead:

[Cover 2]

I cant get anything to work:banghead:
At least you didn't have to suffer through the Jon Fitch fight. Every time a Jon Fitch fight comes up I know a terrible fight is about to happen.

[MarionBarberThe4th]

Yea, Mir isnt covering his head at all but let the fight go on.

Carwin V Lesnar UFC 116 lets do it

[SDogo]

Any GSP fight is better then NyQuil

[BraveHeartFan]

Any GSP fight is better then NyQuil


I guess you must have been one of those Dan Hardy fans who were absolutely certain he was going to be able to stop GSP from taking him down and dominating him and would simply knock GSP out.

I guess you would be pretty disappointed, again, then.

[Doomsday]

Really looking forward to Carwin v Lesner should be a good one. Would love to see Carwin knock him out.

[Rampage]

I guess you must have been one of those Dan Hardy fans who were absolutely certain he was going to be able to stop GSP from taking him down and dominating him and would simply knock GSP out.

I guess you would be pretty disappointed, again, then.
or he just knows ever since gsp got clipped by Serra he's become a very boring fighter. the most exciting parts of the fight was Dan Hardy getting out of that armbar and kimura.

[CATCH17]

GSP is great at what he does but he is a snoozefest to watch.

I think the UFC knows that if you put him on your main even you better have some really good undercards because his fights are so boring.

He'll keep that welterweight title as long as he wants to though if he continues to fight that way.

[Dash28]

I wasn't too happy that he didn't finish Hardy but Hardy showed some toughness not to tap to the armbar and kimura. GSP fights to his ultimate strength which is his takedowns. What fighter doesn't fight to his strengths? I believe that he could stand and strike with most and do a fine job, but why fight at another fighters strong point when he knows he can own just about anyone on the ground? I wish he would stand more and show off his striking a bit more but I can't argue with him following the gameplan of using his main strength. On the other hand, I can't argue with the people saying he is boring to watch because most people love a good standup war and I do too.

[Cover 2]

I wasn't too happy that he didn't finish Hardy but Hardy showed some toughness not to tap to the armbar and kimura. GSP fights to his ultimate strength which is his takedowns. What fighter doesn't fight to his strengths? I believe that he could stand and strike with most and do a fine job, but why fight at another fighters strong point when he knows he can own just about anyone on the ground? I wish he would stand more and show off his striking a bit more but I can't argue with him following the gameplan of using his main strength. On the other hand, I can't argue with the people saying he is boring to watch because most people love a good standup war and I do too.
And exciting ground fights such as the Bocek Miller fight. As boring as GSP can be he's infinitely more exciting than Fitch.

[SDogo]

I guess you must have been one of those Dan Hardy fans who were absolutely certain he was going to be able to stop GSP from taking him down and dominating him and would simply knock GSP out.

I guess you would be pretty disappointed, again, then.

No, not at all.

Just never watched a GSP fight where I was not put to sleep.

Way to try read too much into it though.

[SDogo]

or he just knows ever since gsp got clipped by Serra he's become a very boring fighter. the most exciting parts of the fight was Dan Hardy getting out of that armbar and kimura.

Exactly,

take your man down, play it safe, roll a couple switches, keep control and try to get a submission. Rinse, spit and repeat.

[TheCount]

Maybe it was just me, but I think GSP opted not to finish both the armbar and the kimura. He was dominating Hardy with no answers. If he truely believes he's a martial artist, then you aren't going to put a guy out for months or the rest of his career.

He may have also been rusty from leave. You don't exactly train that stuff to completion when you spar.

Exactly,

take your man down, play it safe, roll a couple switches, keep control and try to get a submission. Rinse, spit and repeat.

How was he playing it safe? Grappling is as much a part of the sport as anything else, I think. GSP has never been a stand up a box through the whole match kind of guy.

[Ren]

meh, another 25 min snooze fest from GSP

Was worth watching for Carwin shutting Mir up though

[BigWillie]

People get WAYYYY too caught up in having to finish fights.

Floyd Mayweather, arguably the greatest boxer alive today, is nothing more than a counter puncher. He is not a Shane Mosley or Manny Pacquiao in style, but yet no one has proved capable of touching him.

I actually heard one great comparison, in the sporting world at least, to GSP. That was Tim Duncan. You watch Tim play, and he isn't some other world athlete like a Lebron or Kobe. He kills you with fundamentals. How to get proper spacing, drop-steps, bank shots, positioning. You watch him play and you see him dominate doing nothing flashy, but everything right.

With GSP, you won't see the Wanderlei, Anderson, Fedor, Junior, or whomever. The guy does what he has to do to win.

Compare it to the Cowboys. People get ticked off when we constantly looked for a big play, as Garrett was prone to running a ton of vertical routes. Big plays please the fans. Except when the big plays lose, then people become critical.

You win, however you have to do it. Fans are going to find a way to criticize regardless. It's the nature of the sport, even as weird as it can be sometimes.

[TheCount]

http://i44.tinypic.com/5bsba8.jpg

[Dash28]

Maybe it was just me, but I think GSP opted not to finish both the armbar and the kimura. He was dominating Hardy with no answers. If he truely believes he's a martial artist, then you aren't going to put a guy out for months or the rest of his career.

He may have also been rusty from leave. You don't exactly train that stuff to completion when you spar.



How was he playing it safe? Grappling is as much a part of the sport as anything else, I think. GSP has never been a stand up a box through the whole match kind of guy.
Agree.

[CATCH17]

Has Mir made any comments since the fight?

[MarionBarberThe4th]

Has Mir made any comments since the fight?



Can he even talk anymore after these beatings he keeps taking?

[SDogo]

Was worth watching for Carwin shutting Mir up though

Amen to that!