Opposite Sex Friends

[casmith07]

Just a general question for Zoners to see the responses...a friend of mine and I were talking after contract law yesterday and the question came up: "if you're married or in a relationship, is it okay to have friends of the opposite sex?"

I personally believe Steve Harvey (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuzrWMjdEhU) is correct in this regard and subscribe to his belief.

So, bottom line, Zoners: is it okay to have friends of the opposite sex when you're either married or in a relationship with someone?

Also, are you okay with your significant other/wife/husband having friends of the opposite sex?

[Sam I Am]

No. That doesn't work at all.

The only time I've ever seen an opposite sex friendship (ie, they hang out together a lot) is when the guy was a flamboyant homosexual (ie the feminine side of a relationship) and the woman was a shopaholic.

If the homosexual guy isn't feminine, it won't work.

[Hostile]

It is entirely possible but you have to have two very understanding people. My wife and I discussed this early on in our marriage. In all honesty we agreed to even allow the other to be attracted to someone of the opposite sex. In other words, if I say Kate Beckinsale is gorgeous it does not mean I want a divorce and to jump into bed with her. It means I am not blind. Same thing if she says that of a man. We allow ourselves to look at the opposite sex as long as it is not by braille. In a very short time we learned to trust each other and not to believe attraction means lust.

In other words, yes it can be accomplished but you nor she can secretly be calculating how to cheat, not get cheated on, and not get caught. As soon as you start making moves on the friend of the opposite sex you have sanctified the very essence of this question.

Most of my friends are sports freaks, but I do have some friends that are female. My wife knows I will never cheat on her. Not with them or anyone. I earned that trust. That is the key.

[BrAinPaiNt]

Well you can have good friends of the opposite sex at work but you don't hang around with or talk to besides at work.

I don't know about someone of the opposite sex that say you would go to the mall or a concert with while your spouse was not along...I think that would be different.

[TheCount]

It's definitely possible and Hos has the right idea.

I'd like to add that it makes no sense if you're going to do things with an opposite sex friend that you wouldn't do with a same sex friend.

If you hang out with your buddies while watching a game or going to a bar, etc. then it doesn't make sense for you to go to dinner and a movie with an opposite sex friend.

[CATCH17]

It takes 4 to tango?

[Hostile]

It's definitely possible and Hos has the right idea.

I'd like to add that it makes no sense if you're going to do things with an opposite sex friend that you wouldn't do with a same sex friend.

If you hang out with your buddies while watching a game or going to a bar, etc. then it doesn't make sense for you to go to dinner and a movie with an opposite sex friend.I agree with this. I think I have been to maybe one movie with anyone other than my wife and kids or Mom in the 20 years I have been married. It was with a buddy from work and was a movie my wife was not interested in. The final movie in the Star Wars saga.

I have never gone out to dinner with just one single female friend since being married. It is rare that I would do it with a single guy friend either. Usually if my wife is not along there is a group.

My wife has even met some of my old girlfriends and knows that at least 3 of them are friends of mine on Facebook, including an ex-fiance'. I say again, I have earned the trust. That is the key.

[Yeagermeister]

It is entirely possible but you have to have two very understanding people. My wife and I discussed this early on in our marriage. In all honesty we agreed to even allow the other to be attracted to someone of the opposite sex. In other words, if I say Kate Beckinsale is gorgeous it does not mean I want a divorce and to jump into bed with her. It means I am not blind. Same thing if she says that of a man. We allow ourselves to look at the opposite sex as long as it is not by braille. In a very short time we learned to trust each other and not to believe attraction means lust.

In other words, yes it can be accomplished but you nor she can secretly be calculating how to cheat, not get cheated on, and not get caught. As soon as you start making moves on the friend of the opposite sex you have sanctified the very essence of this question.

Most of my friends are sports freaks, but I do have some friends that are female. My wife knows I will never cheat on her. Not with them or anyone. I earned that trust. That is the key.

My wife and I joke around about this all the time. I refer to Halle Berry as the future Mrs. Yeager to her face and she know I'm joking. She'll do the same with Moose and Darren Woodson (sorry WG) and I don't get bent out of shape over it.

[WV Cowboy]

I suppose there are examples where it has worked, but in my mind it is always a very dangerous and slippery slope to start down.

Something that starts innocently enough can change over time and become a temptation.

And thinking some actress or model is gorgeous is not what we are talking about here.

This thread is about opposite sex "friends".

I think it is a bad idea, .. I would never disrespect my wife by having another woman as a "friend."
She is my best friend, and I have many, many guys that have been a friend to me.
I do not need any other woman as a "friend".

I am almost 57, and have been with my wife since I was 17 and she was 16, .. married over 35 years. Some of the young guys here at work will talk to me or ask how we make it work and why it gets better as time goes on. They ask other advice about women.

I would always tell one of them, if they asked, don't have another woman as a friend. Just my advice.

[Vtwin]

Two of my best friends are females. They are sisters and I have known them forever, much longer than I have known my wife of fifteen years. We hang out a lot with and without my wife. I have spent weekends visiting one or the other when they were away from home for extended periods for work in a fun place to visit. One of them is a friggin Eagles fan! The other a Pat's fan.

Taking one of them to Montreal this weekend to see a hockey game. Took the other one last year. My wife has no interest in going.

It is absolutely possible. If there is trust and commitment. If we didn't have those two things we wouldn't be married.

[WV Cowboy]

Two of my best friends are females. They are sisters and I have known them forever, much longer than I have known my wife of fifteen years. We hang out a lot with and without my wife. I have spent weekends visiting one or the other when they were away from home for extended periods for work in a fun place to visit. One of them is a friggin Eagles fan! The other a Pat's fan.

Taking one of them to Montreal this weekend to see a hockey game. Took the other one last year. My wife has no interest in going.

It is absolutely possible. If there is trust and commitment. If we didn't have those two things we wouldn't be married.

Do you find either of these sisters physically or sexually attractive?

Or would any of us on this board find them sexually attractive?

[Kangaroo]

a lot of people have hit on the subject of yes you can. i have some friends that are female my wife trust me and we never had any issues over it unless you call giving each other a hard time.

Me personally when it comes to female friends I try to do things in a group setting it is just freakin easier to avoid all the other crap that may happen. (yes i am talking of people and rumors etc)

[DallasEast]

I have two female friends whom I have known for over 25 years. My wife asked one of them to be one of her bridesmaids even though she only knew of her through me.

[ABQCOWBOY]

Hell no Cas. I believe that there is something to the whole man/woman chemical thing. I don't care if you believe it's God or Nature or Buddha or whatever, in my mind the simple truth of the matter is that men and woman were hard wired to have a chemical and physical attraction to one another. Working with somebody or being at a bar with somebody who also likes the Cowboys or something like that is not the same as being close friends in my mind. I would classify those folks as acquaintance more so then friend. A working relationship is not the same as a close friend to me. If you spend enough time around a female, it will eventually lead you in a certain direction IMO. It may not be on your part, it might be on hers or maybe the other way around. It might be both but it will eventually happen. It's a nature thing and you can't deny that part of human existence. You can suppress it or avoid it, perhaps control it but it only takes one moment of weakness on either parties behalf and you then have a problem. If you really love your wife or your significant other, why take the chance? IMO, your only asking for trouble.

People can have whatever opinions on this they like. They are certainly entitled but I'm just saying that you can't fight what is designed into all of us. Eventually, it will surface and then, you have to deal with it. Once that happens, it's not a friendship thing. It's one or the other or both pretending it's something it's not. If you don't create distance, then you will either end up with something happening that should not or somebody is going to end up resenting something and it will create drama or worse.

That's just how I see it.

[DFWJC]

It's definitely possible and Hos has the right idea.

I'd like to add that it makes no sense if you're going to do things with an opposite sex friend that you wouldn't do with a same sex friend.

If you hang out with your buddies while watching a game or going to a bar, etc. then it doesn't make sense for you to go to dinner and a movie with an opposite sex friend.
This makes sense.

Also, I would keep "appearances" in mind out of respect for your wife or gf. That alone may exclude more intimate settings--harmless or not.

If everyting is respectful of the spouse, then yes, I do think you can have a friend that is a girl.

[Yeagermeister]

Hell no Cas. I believe that there is something to the whole man/woman chemical thing. I don't care if you believe it's God or Nature or Buddha or whatever, in my mind the simple truth of the matter is that men and woman were hard wired to have a chemical and physical attraction to one another. Working with somebody or being at a bar with somebody who also likes the Cowboys or something like that is not the same as being close friends in my mind. I would classify those folks as acquaintance more so then friend. A working relationship is not the same as a close friend to me. If you spend enough time around a female, it will eventually lead you in a certain direction IMO. It may not be on your part, it might be on hers or maybe the other way around. It might be both but it will eventually happen. It's a nature thing and you can't deny that part of human existence. You can suppress it or avoid it, perhaps control it but it only takes one moment of weakness on either parties behalf and you then have a problem. If you really love your wife or your significant other, why take the chance? IMO, your only asking for trouble.

People can have whatever opinions on this they like. They are certainly entitled but I'm just saying that you can't fight what is designed into all of us. Eventually, it will surface and then, you have to deal with it. Once that happens, it's not a friendship thing. It's one or the other or both pretending it's something it's not. If you don't create distance, then you will either end up with something happening that should not or somebody is going to end up resenting something and it will create drama or worse.

That's just how I see it.

I disagree somewhat. I have a female friend I have know since HS and we have never been anything other than friends.

[bbgun]

This movie dialogue immediately springs to mind.


Harry Burns: You realize of course that we could never be friends.

Sally Albright: Why not?

Harry Burns: What I'm saying is - and this is not a come-on in any way, shape or form - is that men and women can't be friends because the sex part always gets in the way.

Sally Albright: That's not true. I have a number of men friends and there is no sex involved.

Harry Burns: No you don't.

Sally Albright: Yes I do.

Harry Burns: No you don't.

Sally Albright: Yes I do.

Harry Burns: You only think you do.

Sally Albright: You say I'm having sex with these men without my knowledge?

Harry Burns: No, what I'm saying is they all WANT to have sex with you.

Sally Albright: They do not.

Harry Burns: Do too.

Sally Albright: They do not.

Harry Burns: Do too.

Sally Albright: How do you know?

Harry Burns: Because no man can be friends with a woman that he finds attractive. He always wants to have sex with her.

Sally Albright: So, you're saying that a man can be friends with a woman he finds unattractive?

Harry Burns: No. You pretty much want to nail 'em too.

Sally Albright: What if THEY don't want to have sex with YOU?

Harry Burns: Doesn't matter because the sex thing is already out there so the friendship is ultimately doomed and that is the end of the story.

Sally Albright: Well, I guess we're not going to be friends then.

Harry Burns: I guess not.

Sally Albright: That's too bad. You were the only person I knew in New York.

[Joe Rod]

It is entirely possible. I have several close female friends that I have known since I was young. There are no feelings of attraction between us. It isn't that they aren't attractive, just not my type at all.

A few years ago I met one of them when I was in St. Pete on business and we hung out in the evenings while I was there. My wife was fine with it.

[ABQCOWBOY]

I disagree somewhat. I have a female friend I have know since HS and we have never been anything other than friends.

OK, but I don't buy into that Yeags. You are a better man then me.

[zrinkill]

CanadianCowboysFan is gonna be all over this thread like a spider monkey!

[bbgun]

CanadianCowboysFan is gonna be all over this thread like a spider monkey!

His favorite brothel voted him husband-of-the-year.

[WV Cowboy]

I disagree somewhat. I have a female friend I have know since HS and we have never been anything other than friends.

It is entirely possible. I have several close female friends that I have known since I was young. There are no feelings of attraction between us. It isn't that they aren't attractive, just not my type at all.


How often do you hang out with these other women, ... if it is less than once a week or so, ... that is not what we are talking about here.

All of us have female acquaintences, but we don't hang out with them on a regular basis.

[Kangaroo]

How often do you hang out with these other women, ... if it is less than once a week or so, ... that is not what we are talking about here.

All of us have female acquaintences, but we don't hang out with them on a regular basis.

haha I do not hang out with most people once a week unless it is my family

Even male friends between work, kids and extracurricular activities I have something going on

[burmafrd]

CanadianCowboysFan is gonna be all over this thread like a spider monkey!



that is so true.

[WoodysGirl]

I have plenty of male friends where I was friends with them prior to them having a wife or girlfriend. While they were single, we hung out alot. And in many cases, they were my +1 if I needed one.

However, whenever they got a girlfriend or whenever they got married, I would back waaay off in order to respect their relationship. I make it a point to get to know their significant other. We no longer hang out by ourselves for anything more than the occasional lunch and our interactions are much more group oriented.

If I want to remain friends with these guys, then I try to do everything I can on my end to make their lady friend or wife comfortable. I do my part, after that, it's on him.

On the flip side, the guys I've dated haven't always been comfortable with my male friends; partly because of the ish they were doing on the side.

[bbgun]

haha I do not hang out with most people once a week unless it is my family

Even male friends between work, kids and extracurricular activities I have something going on

Even if you're not physically cheating, your better half will think you're emotionally cheating--which, of course, can often lead to the real thing.

[Yeagermeister]

How often do you hang out with these other women, ... if it is less than once a week or so, ... that is not what we are talking about here.

All of us have female acquaintences, but we don't hang out with them on a regular basis.

Not very much but we used to go to the movies together. We are both married now so the only time we really see each other is when we meet for dinner.

[Faerluna]

I disagree somewhat. I have a female friend I have know since HS and we have never been anything other than friends.

I have several male friends that have always been strictly platonic, even when I was single. I guess it doesn't count now, since I live in another state, but at the time, we hung out a few times a week, depending on work, etc. This was all when I was single, though.

[Seven]

Yes. NEVER drink with them.

[Idgit]

The bonds of matrimony are heavy. It takes two strong people to carry them. Sometimes three.

[Vtwin]

Do you find either of these sisters physically or sexually attractive?

Or would any of us on this board find them sexually attractive?

Absolutely. One is married the other is single and has no desire to get married.

Trust and commitment my friend. I take that seriously.

[Sam I Am]

Absolutely. One is married the other is single and has no desire to get married.

Trust and commitment my friend. I take that seriously.

Personally I don't think trust and commitment has anything to do with it. I am committed to my wife, but I definitely find other women attractive. That doesn't mean I'm looking to cheat on her. I don't do that. I believe that makes a true friendship (buddy buddy type) with the opposite sex impossible. You can say "no it doesn't", but if there is a sexual attraction there, it does too.

[WV Cowboy]

Personally I don't think trust and commitment has anything to do with it. I am committed to my wife, but I definitely find other women attractive. That doesn't mean I'm looking to cheat on her. I don't do that. I believe that makes a true friendship (buddy buddy type) with the opposite sex impossible. You can say "no it doesn't", but if there is a sexual attraction there, it does too.

Agreed, .. but maybe Vtwin makes it work. I said in my original post in this thread that I guess it could happen.

But it is like playing with fire, .. I would advise all males not to try it.

If they choose to, I would say, "be careful my friend", you are treading in dangerous waters.

[Joe Rod]

How often do you hang out with these other women, ... if it is less than once a week or so, ... that is not what we are talking about here.

All of us have female acquaintences, but we don't hang out with them on a regular basis.

When I lived in Florida we would have lunch at least twice a week, usually three times. Evening drinks here and there. When we lived in Virginia, my wife had a male friend that she worked with that she went out to lunch with almost daily. Not much evenings because kids had entered the fray by then.

[jnday]

The bonds of matrimony are heavy. It takes two strong people to carry them. Sometimes three.

Big Love ?

[WV Cowboy]

When I lived in Florida we would have lunch at least twice a week, usually three times. Evening drinks here and there. When we lived in Virginia, my wife had a male friend that she worked with that she went out to lunch with almost daily. Not much evenings because kids had entered the fray by then.

Knowing how guys think, .. did you ever wonder what her friend was thinking when he looked at your wife?

I said in my first post in this thread that I guess it was possible.

I'm just sitting here wondering how many people who have slipped and did something they later regretted started out saying, .. "we're only friends".

It may not be wrong, but it can be dangerous.

[Joe Rod]

Knowing how guys think, .. did you ever wonder what her friend was thinking when he looked at your wife?

I said in my first post in this thread that I guess it was possible.

I'm just sitting here wondering how many people who have slipped and did something they later regretted started out saying, .. "we're only friends".

It may not be wrong, but it can be dangerous.

Nah, never cared, but I certainly get where your concern comes from. We have a pretty serious "get bent" policy with our friends that they are all aware of. Anyone that attempts to get in the way of our relationship in any capacity gets the curb pretty quick, even our same-sex friends. Probably helps that we don't drink, especially when we are out.

[Kangaroo]

Even if you're not physically cheating, your better half will think you're emotionally cheating--which, of course, can often lead to the real thing.

LOL I do not have that issue my wife trust me.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

Even if you're not physically cheating, your better half will think you're emotionally cheating--which, of course, can often lead to the real thing.

emotional cheating is a bogus concept

anyway, because the normal cast of characters is begging for my views on the topic at hand, I will leave them dangling and not say what I think

yes PPgun et al, I know you reall don't care even though you seemed to think about me when typing in this thread

[CanadianCowboysFan]

Knowing how guys think, .. did you ever wonder what her friend was thinking when he looked at your wife?

I'm more offended if someone doesn't find my wife hot

[Cowboyslife]

As long as it's not an EX I would be ok with it.

[bbgun]

I'm more offended if someone doesn't find my wife hot

then post a pic that doesn't require a magnifying glass

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_HTmsWbv5GrY/TMI_mrfyMjI/AAAAAAAAAAQ/PVAeqqVvrs0/S220/Naples.jpg

[ABQCOWBOY]

I'm going with this one bbgun......


http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs44/i/2009/104/3/9/Sweet_Polly_Purebred_by_Huggy_Lugnuts.jpg

[bbgun]

It's not every day you see cleavage on a dog.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

add me as a friend on facebook and you can see pics of her there

[Dallas]

add me as a friend on facebook and you can see pics of her there


I cannot put into words just how much I get creeped out by your comments here at the Zone.

It never fails, ever.

That is some talent you have.

[bbgun]

add me as a friend on facebook and you can see pics of her there

1. I don't do Facebook.
2. I don't want to be friends with you in cyberspace or anywhere else.
3. You could just as easily post them here.

[Dallas]

1. I don't do Facebook.
2. I don't want to be friends with you in cyberspace or anywhere else.
3. You could just as easily post them here.


I can see it now. You and he....Get it?


[/URL][URL="http://threeminds.organic.com/banana_bff.jpg"]http://threeminds.organic.com/banana_bff.jpg (http://threeminds.organic.com/banana_bff.jpg)

Thats a banana and a monkey.

Monkey's like Bananas! :p:

[casmith07]

Hell no Cas. I believe that there is something to the whole man/woman chemical thing. I don't care if you believe it's God or Nature or Buddha or whatever, in my mind the simple truth of the matter is that men and woman were hard wired to have a chemical and physical attraction to one another. Working with somebody or being at a bar with somebody who also likes the Cowboys or something like that is not the same as being close friends in my mind. I would classify those folks as acquaintance more so then friend. A working relationship is not the same as a close friend to me. If you spend enough time around a female, it will eventually lead you in a certain direction IMO. It may not be on your part, it might be on hers or maybe the other way around. It might be both but it will eventually happen. It's a nature thing and you can't deny that part of human existence. You can suppress it or avoid it, perhaps control it but it only takes one moment of weakness on either parties behalf and you then have a problem. If you really love your wife or your significant other, why take the chance? IMO, your only asking for trouble.

People can have whatever opinions on this they like. They are certainly entitled but I'm just saying that you can't fight what is designed into all of us. Eventually, it will surface and then, you have to deal with it. Once that happens, it's not a friendship thing. It's one or the other or both pretending it's something it's not. If you don't create distance, then you will either end up with something happening that should not or somebody is going to end up resenting something and it will create drama or worse.

That's just how I see it.

I agree with this. I'll tell a story. I hope it will shine a light on why I feel the way I do.

Three and a half years ago I met the woman that I hope to marry one day. We've had our ups and downs, but our ups have always drastically outweighed the downs and we've mutually decided that the downs are things that we both want to work on together to strengthen our relationship and become closer to each other.

About a year and a half ago, an old "friend" contacted her through facebook. The reason why I say "friend" is because I believe him to be the kind of man that Steve Harvey was talking about in my OP, or the kind of friend that bbgun detailed in the movie. Soon enough it came out - "so whats up with you and this boyfriend?"

It's the kind of question that when you see it, you know the translation is "when are you leaving that punk so I can get in your pants?"

Needless to say, I discussed it with her and told her that I felt like she should cut him off. She did. But had facebook not existed, he would never have been able to contact her - her cell phone number and e-mail address have changed since she last left home.

But I don't blame that at all. We had a discussion that I think everyone should have when evaluating relationships that exist outside of your own, be it friendships or what have you -- the question is: what positive impact is this person/group of people having on your life or your relationship? If there is no rational answer, then I feel they should be cut off.

Honestly, I would rather sit and watch Housewives of Atlanta with her than hang out with the fellas...that's just how it is, and in a way how I think it should be. On the flipside, though, she would rather sit with me and watch me fume at the TV as Mike Jenkins gets burned again than be elsewhere, and she's the kind of girl that would cheer "home run" at a football game.

I just don't think that there's anything positive to be gained from maintaining friends of the opposite sex. I've even had women get upset with me when I've turned them down for coffee or lunch because I wanted to check with my fiancée first.

Just the way I see it.

I disagree somewhat. I have a female friend I have know since HS and we have never been anything other than friends.

How do you know that they feel the same way? They could be pining away for you secretly, waiting for that one moment when something goes wrong to jump in the saddle.

Not saying that's the case, but that's just how it is.


On the flip side, the guys I've dated haven't always been comfortable with my male friends; partly because of the ish they were doing on the side.

Well...I think this might also be a cultural thing too...seeing as how you and I are cut from the same cloth...you know just how I know that dudes can be extremely grimy. Unfortunately because of what seems like the majority, any man approaching a woman that he knows is in a relationship is viewed to 9 times out of 10 have ulterior motives by the boyfriend of the woman in question. It doesn't help that we have singers leading off their new songs calling themselves "Mr. Steal-Your-Girl."

Even if you're not physically cheating, your better half will think you're emotionally cheating--which, of course, can often lead to the real thing.

Exactly. So why risk it?

I might be cynical about the world, but that's just how I see it. I hope nobody thinks of me any differently because of it. I just strive for chivalry; I think in the 1200s if one knight attempted to steal another knight's maiden, a duel would be in order.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

I cannot put into words just how much I get creeped out by your comments here at the Zone.

It never fails, ever.

That is some talent you have.

if you get creeped out by that comment, that is your problem, I have pics of my wife and family on facebook, OMG

[CanadianCowboysFan]

CA, about someone pining to get you in the sack, you say that like it is a bad thing.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

1. I don't do Facebook.
2. I don't want to be friends with you in cyberspace or anywhere else.
3. You could just as easily post them here.

I guess you don't do facebook because it would look bad for you to have no friends

I could post them here but nah, screw it, if you won't put in an effort and join the largest social network ever, why should I put in an effort and post pics of her.

[bbgun]

I guess you don't do facebook because it would look bad for you to have no friends

I get enough "friend invitations" on YouTube, thank you very much.

I could post them here but nah, screw it, if you won't put in an effort and join the largest social network ever, why should I put in an effort and post pics of her.

bwak bwak bwak

http://www.ilovechickenholiday.com/images/chicken.jpg

[theogt]

I'd bet good money that no one in this thread (1) has been single at the same time as a "friend" of the opposite sex, (2) hung out with that person for extended periods of time just by yourselves, and (3) not had one or the other want it to be more than just friends. If you weren't the one wanting it to be more, the other person was. Guaranteed.

When I got married, all of my female friendships pretty much ended. The reality was, they weren't really friendships to begin with.

[bbgun]

Not sure why any man would want to be actual friends (not just friendly) with women if there's no possibility of sex. Isn't that what guy friends are for?

[Teren_Kanan]

Just celebrated my 5 year anniversary with my girlfriend. Been living together for 3 years now.

I've always had more female friends than male friends. Fact is I don't like guys very much they annoy me. My 2 best friends are guys (guy I've known since 5 yrs old, and my x roomate who I've known since about 13 and met online in Everquest), past that I have about 2 other guy friends that I hang out with maybe once a month. Past that it's all female friends.

I'd rather go drink with females, hang out with females, do anything with females instead of males. I get along extremely well with women, I always have. My girlfriend has known this about me since day 1.

There are plenty of times my girlfriend will come home and I'm in the living room with one of my female friends, smoking.. our herbal remedies, and playing video games. This happens fairly often. There are also times when I'll come home from work at 6am with a female co-worker friend and hang out some in the morning, my girlfriend leaves at 6:30 am to go to work herself. She has no problem with this.

I have a female friend I've gone hot tubbing with at 4am in the morning, just us because her neighborhood has a spa and mine doesn't. My girlfriend was completely aware of it (and has gone with us a few times). The times seem weird but I'm a night owl, there is no sleep for me before 7-8am. I'll go to my GF while she's asleep and wake her up enough to let her know I'm going Hot tubbing with Amber. She's fine with it.

My girlfriend is also aware that I would love to have sex with every single one of my female friends. I'm a guy and I'd have sex with most things with a vagina. I don't hide this fact, I never have.

Co-workers and even a lot of my female friends think it's insane, and that they'd never allow their BF such freedom. I wouldn't be with any women who didn't though.

Me and my GF live in different worlds. She is awake from 6am to 8-10pm. I am awake from 4pm to 6-8am. She doesn't often hang out with my friends cause we hang out too late, I don't often hang out with hers cause they hang out too early. But we know each others friends and get along the few times we hang out.

Sounds crazy yeah? I'd allow such freedoms for my girlfriend as well, without the slightest worry. She hardly hangs out with other men though, aside from co-workers, but if she did, it wouldn't bother me.

Whats the kicker? How can it possibly work? Am I some super saint of a man who would never cheat ever? No, I'm probably just as human as anyone else. The thing is, my girlfriend knows every female I hang out with, and all my female co workers.

I know myself well enough to know that I'd never cheat on my GF with these people, regardless of how much I'd like to have sex with them for one simple fact. It could get back to my GF. I could never live with myself if I put my GF in that kind of pain. I could never sleep with someone my GF knows, sees frequently, or works with me, because it's too risky.

What I DON'T do for very good reasons is hang out with women my GF does not know. I do not go to parties where the majority of people are unknown to me. I avoid hanging out with females not in my social circle. I don't get drunk with people I am not familiar with and trust. I don't drink at bars alone.

I pretty much avoid situations where I could potentially be alone with a female that is outside of my social circle. Someone I could sleep with with 0 risk of it ever getting back to my GF. I've never cheated on her, and I honestly think I could resist that temptation, but I see no reason to put myself in a situation where I will test that theory, because I am human and prone to the same mistakes as anyone else.

It's worked for 5 years and I've never had any sort of moment where I felt there was any risk of anything happening with one of my female friends. My GF has never questioned me about any of it, as I've always been 100% honest with her as to my whereabouts and who I'm hanging out with and what I'm doing.

There is a lot of trust between me and my GF. 5 years now and we have never argued, quite literally. Not even about any tiny thing. No *****ing about the remote controls, no *****ing about who didn't clean what, no complaints about playing video games too long, or spending too much money on hair/nails. We've just never done it.

I don't grasp the concept of jealousy, I never have. She's not a jealous person and neither am I. The type of person who is going to put themselves in a situation where they cheat, is the type of person who is probably going to cheat one day. I don't want to feel like I have to "prevent" my GF from cheating, and I don't want to be with a chick who feels they have to "prevent" me from cheating either. A jealous female is simply not something I would ever tolerate.

Ah well, here's to 5 more amazing years.

[casmith07]

I'd bet good money that no one in this thread (1) has been single at the same time as a "friend" of the opposite sex, (2) hung out with that person for extended periods of time just by yourselves, and (3) not had one or the other want it to be more than just friends. If you weren't the one wanting it to be more, the other person was. Guaranteed.

When I got married, all of my female friendships pretty much ended. The reality was, they weren't really friendships to begin with.

This.

[Teren_Kanan]

I'd bet good money that no one in this thread (1) has been single at the same time as a "friend" of the opposite sex, (2) hung out with that person for extended periods of time just by yourselves, and (3) not had one or the other want it to be more than just friends. If you weren't the one wanting it to be more, the other person was. Guaranteed.

When I got married, all of my female friendships pretty much ended. The reality was, they weren't really friendships to begin with.


Read this after I wrote my wall of text post.

I somewhat agree with you. I have 1 female friend that I hang out with at last once/twice a month that I have already had sex with prior to getting with my GF 5 years ago. My GF knows about this, and has no problem with us hanging out. As I posted earlier, my GF knows that if I were single I'd probably be trying to have sex with every one of my female friends (even My super awesome Lesbian friend).

I am a guy, there is not such a thing as a women so amazing/beautiful that I would never want to sleep with anyone else. I will pretty much always want to sleep with 80% of the women on this planet, regardless of how good I have it.

[theogt]

Read this after I wrote my wall of text post.

I somewhat agree with you. I have 1 female friend that I hang out with at last once/twice a month that I have already had sex with prior to getting with my GF 5 years ago. My GF knows about this, and has no problem with us hanging out. As I posted earlier, my GF knows that if I were single I'd probably be trying to have sex with every one of my female friends (even My super awesome Lesbian friend).

I am a guy, there is not such a thing as a women so amazing/beautiful that I would never want to sleep with anyone else. I will pretty much always want to sleep with 80% of the women on this planet, regardless of how good I have it.I think you mean, "particularly."

[Teren_Kanan]

Not sure why any man would want to be actual friends (not just friendly) with women if there's no possibility of sex. Isn't that what guy friends are for?

Most guys suck. I tend not to like hanging out with guys. I get along so much better with women.

Donno what it is about most guys. There's just too much testosterone or something. I feel like all guys are pretty much the same. There is something competitive in the air when guys hang out. Even if its just in fun, I feel guys are always trying to 1 up each other in the macho department. Who can drink the most, who can win the most at this game or that. Who's gotten more girls. There are exceptions but it's not that common.

My 2 closest friends are both guys though, and I have a few other guy friends I'd consider close.

[Teren_Kanan]

I think you mean, "particularly."

Lol. My lesbo friend really isn't super attractive. But she doesn't sleep with men and has never been with a man. We talk about chicks all the time. Something about that just makes me want to rule her world.

She says man parts look like a disgusting toe. Lol

[Faerluna]

I'd bet good money that no one in this thread (1) has been single at the same time as a "friend" of the opposite sex, (2) hung out with that person for extended periods of time just by yourselves, and (3) not had one or the other want it to be more than just friends. If you weren't the one wanting it to be more, the other person was. Guaranteed.

*raises hand*

I had a good guy friend that I worked with and we hung out a few times a week, went out to the bars together, had lunch or dinner together, etc. There was never one iota of sexual or romantic interest for either one of us, guaranteed. Yes, he was straight. I just wasn't his type, nor was he mine.

[theogt]

*raises hand*

I had a good guy friend that I worked with and we hung out a few times a week, went out to the bars together, had lunch or dinner together, etc. There was never one iota of sexual or romantic interest for either one of us, guaranteed. Yes, he was straight. I just wasn't his type, nor was he mine.One of two things is happening here: (1) you're lying, or (2) it was him.

Edit: Just realized this was a work relationship. That's not a real friendship. You say you "had" a good friend. I assume he stopped being your good friend shortly after you stopped working with him.

[casmith07]

*raises hand*

I had a good guy friend that I worked with and we hung out a few times a week, went out to the bars together, had lunch or dinner together, etc. There was never one iota of sexual or romantic interest for either one of us, guaranteed. Yes, he was straight. I just wasn't his type, nor was he mine.

Listen to Steve Harvey in the video I posted in the OP.

Your friend was either gay, or you're misled.

edit: I just read theo's post and I concur.

[bbgun]

*raises hand*

I had a good guy friend that I worked with and we hung out a few times a week, went out to the bars together, had lunch or dinner together, etc. There was never one iota of sexual or romantic interest for either one of us, guaranteed. Yes, he was straight. I just wasn't his type, nor was he mine.

Did his name rhyme with Dob Tacamano?

[rkell87]

I'd bet good money that no one in this thread (1) has been single at the same time as a "friend" of the opposite sex, (2) hung out with that person for extended periods of time just by yourselves, and (3) not had one or the other want it to be more than just friends. If you weren't the one wanting it to be more, the other person was. Guaranteed.

When I got married, all of my female friendships pretty much ended. The reality was, they weren't really friendships to begin with.
what does this have to do with actually being friends with the opposite sex while in a relationship?


ill just say that with real trust and love it is possible. ive been with my GF for 5 years, lived with her for 4. we have found it easier with other couples but both of us have single friends of the opposite sex, one even lived with us and she trusted us alone because we are good people and are only friends with good people who share the same values as us, that includes being faithful so it comes easy with us and our friends

[Faerluna]

One of two things is happening here: (1) you're lying, or (2) it was him.

Edit: Just realized this was a work relationship. That's not a real friendship. You say you "had" a good friend. I assume he stopped being your good friend shortly after you stopped working with him.

We no longer worked together but continued to hang out frequently until I got a day job and our hours were different. We have since lost touch.

You can think whatever you want, and I know how typical male-female interaction is, but he was never interested in me and I have no reason to lie.

I don't give a rat's butt what Steve Harvey or anyone else says. There are exceptions to every all-encompassing statement, and this is one of them.

[theogt]

what does this have to do with actually being friends with the opposite sex while in a relationship?


ill just say that with real trust and love it is possible. ive been with my GF for 5 years, lived with her for 4. we have found it easier with other couples but both of us have single friends of the opposite sex, one even lived with us and she trusted us alone because we are good people and are only friends with good people who share the same values as us, that includes being faithful so it comes easy with us and our friendsWell, I didn't mean to say you couldn't ignore it.

[casmith07]

We no longer worked together but continued to hang out frequently until I got a day job and our hours were different. We have since lost touch.

You can think whatever you want, and I know how typical male-female interaction is, but he was never interested in me and I have no reason to lie.

I don't give a rat's butt what Steve Harvey or anyone else says. There are exceptions to every all-encompassing statement, and this is one of them.

Believe what you want. Given the opportunity, I can guarantee he would've tried to make a move. We're men. We're wired that way.

[Faerluna]

Believe what you want. Given the opportunity, I can guarantee he would've tried to make a move. We're men. We're wired that way.

Maybe you guys are, but not this guy.

I knew him, you didn't, and I think that we'll have to agree to disagree.

[theogt]

Maybe you guys are, but not this guy.

I knew him, you didn't, and I think that we'll have to agree to disagree.You've actually never known how any guy thinks, because you're not one.

[MetalHead]

You've actually never known how any guy thinks, because you're not one.
Exactly.

[bbgun]

You've actually never known how any guy thinks, because you're not one.

Pretty sure she suspects we want sex.

[Kangaroo]

Believe what you want. Given the opportunity, I can guarantee he would've tried to make a move. We're men. We're wired that way.

Most maybe but please do not put us all in the same boat

[Faerluna]

Most maybe but please do not put us all in the same boat

Thank you!

[ABQCOWBOY]

Most maybe but please do not put us all in the same boat


So Roo, if you know and accept (I'm guessing that this is your position) that the odds are it won't work out, why take a chance? It would seem that if the odds are not in favor of avoiding bad situations, you would elect to forgo this sort of circumstance.

[Faerluna]

So Roo, if you know and accept (I'm guessing that this is your position) that the odds are it won't work out, why take a chance? It would seem that if the odds are not in favor of avoiding bad situations, you would elect to forgo this sort of circumstance.

Or what if you are just not attracted to the person? Do you guys that say you think that way just bed anything with a heartbeat that says yes?

[ABQCOWBOY]

Or what if you are just not attracted to the person? Do you guys that say you think that way just bed anything with a heartbeat that says yes?

No. I can only speak for myself but I think that a better discription of what you describe would be avoidance of that situation entirely. I don't fool myself about these kinds of situations. I know that the possability of making a mistake is always there, and let me just say that it's not just "guys" that pursue these kinds of situations. I know a couple of things. I know that I am lucky to have a person in my life that loves me. I know that I have everything to lose if I am not vigilant about these kinds of things. I know that even the thought of something going on between me and another women would hurt my wife to the quick. I want no part of that so I don't kid myself about it. I know that all the best intentions could still go down the tubes if I allow myself to be in that position. I don't need it in my life. I hope this makes it a bit more clear.

[rkell87]

No. I can only speak for myself but I think that a better discription of what you describe would be avoidance of that situation entirely. I don't fool myself about these kinds of situations. I know that the possability of making a mistake is always there, and let me just say that it's not just "guys" that pursue these kinds of situations. I know a couple of things. I know that I am lucky to have a person in my life that loves me. I know that I have everything to lose if I am not vigilant about these kinds of things. I know that even the thought of something going on between me and another women would hurt my wife to the quick. I want no part of that so I don't kid myself about it. I know that all the best intentions could still go down the tubes if I allow myself to be in that position. I don't need it in my life. I hope this makes it a bit more clear.
i commend you for knowing yourself well enough to know that you may not be strong enough to resist temptation if immediately present, and commend knowing your wife well enough to know how she would feel under certain circumstances, but your situation does not represent everybody. i will say your relationship sounds typical and anybody would do well to take your stance but that does not mean that people can not/should not have opposite sex friends.

i will say the more opposite sex friends you have the higher the probability is that one of them aren't completely on the same page as you and your other friends

[CanadianCowboysFan]

you could always hang with one to test yourself like Gandhi did when he slept with nude virgins to ensure he had self control.

[casmith07]

Or what if you are just not attracted to the person? Do you guys that say you think that way just bed anything with a heartbeat that says yes?

Generally if someone isn't attracted to someone, they wouldn't be trying to hang out with them.

Look, at no point ever when I'm sitting around do I decide to pick up the phone and see if some girl from the law school wants to hang out. I have done it on one occasion, and it was at the request of my fiancee to invite some of the girls she had met when we all went out together for drinks. We were going to the Maryland seafood festival and she wanted the girls to come so that she would be able to try and make some new friends.

At no time do I have the desire to hang out with other women. I've been told by another woman that she would "do anything for me" as recently as October (a pathetic cry for help from an old flame). My fiancee was furious, as well I would hope she would be.

I just simply do not think there is anything to be gained from having friends of the opposite sex. What does some other man have to offer that I as a boyfriend, fiance, or husband don't have? Think of it in that context - stop thinking of it as being a single person and having friends of the opposite sex - that's customary.

[ABQCOWBOY]

i commend you for knowing yourself well enough to know that you may not be strong enough to resist temptation if immediately present, and commend knowing your wife well enough to know how she would feel under certain circumstances, but your situation does not represent everybody. i will say your relationship sounds typical and anybody would do well to take your stance but that does not mean that people can not/should not have opposite sex friends.

i will say the more opposite sex friends you have the higher the probability is that one of them aren't completely on the same page as you and your other friends


I never said people should or shouldn't. Each person's life is there own and the decisions they make are their own. It's not about weakness or strength. If your single, then I have absolutely no problem with people having opposite sex friends. I just think it's a poor wager if your married. It's about understanding what's at steak. Having said all this, I'm not anybody to pass judgement on anybody. I'm just sharing my own beliefs on the matter.

:)

[theogt]

Or what if you are just not attracted to the person? Do you guys that say you think that way just bed anything with a heartbeat that says yes?If you're not attracted to the person, it's probably because they're much less attractive than you, which means YOU are much more attractive than them. Someone who hangs out with a person who is much more attractive most likely wants it to be more than just friends.

[rkell87]

Generally if someone isn't attracted to someone, they wouldn't be trying to hang out with them.

Look, at no point ever when I'm sitting around do I decide to pick up the phone and see if some girl from the law school wants to hang out. I have done it on one occasion, and it was at the request of my fiancee to invite some of the girls she had met when we all went out together for drinks. We were going to the Maryland seafood festival and she wanted the girls to come so that she would be able to try and make some new friends.

At no time do I have the desire to hang out with other women. I've been told by another woman that she would "do anything for me" as recently as October (a pathetic cry for help from an old flame). My fiancee was furious, as well I would hope she would be.

I just simply do not think there is anything to be gained from having friends of the opposite sex. What does some other man have to offer that I as a boyfriend, fiance, or husband don't have? Think of it in that context - stop thinking of it as being a single person and having friends of the opposite sex - that's customary.
how about a different point of view, stories from leading a different life, common interests, contacts for personal and professional advancement due to different social circles and standing, and on and on the same things that apply to reasons to have same sex friends

[SaltwaterServr]

you could always hang with one to test yourself like Gandhi did when he slept with nude virgins to ensure he had self control.

Ghandi, "48 times this year, and still no self control." :D

[casmith07]

how about a different point of view, stories from leading a different life, common interests, contacts for personal and professional advancement due to different social circles and standing, and on and on the same things that apply to reasons to have same sex friends

Contacts for personal or professional advancement, i.e. networking is an extremely limited relationship. Those relationships exist only in their official capacity, no different from the fellow female Officers that I served with in my old unit. If I was in a bind making a leadership decision would I potentially call one of my old battle buddies? Absolutely. However, the discussion stops there.

I think you and I have a different understanding of the definition of the word "friend."

Common interests is a cop out, in my opinion. If your interests are generally typical for a man or woman, then one could reasonably expect your friends that share those interests to be of the same sex. I'd be rather upset if my fiancee was going over to some guy's place to watch Jersey Shore at 9PM at night because it was a "common interest" rather than hanging with some girlfriends. Plus, like I said before, I would rather sit and watch some nonsense on Bravo that I don't care about with her because she IS my best friend.

[ABQCOWBOY]

how about a different point of view, stories from leading a different life, common interests, contacts for personal and professional advancement due to different social circles and standing, and on and on the same things that apply to reasons to have same sex friends


Would you say that this is the norm or that this is the exception? Again, only speaking for myself but if I had a female friend that I shared so much in common with, I could see feelings on one side or the other developing much faster. I could also place myself in this position if my wife had such a relationship with another person. I would not like it and it would cause problems. Perhaps I am not mature enough, perhaps I simply do not trust enough. Whatever the case, I think that this type of situation would probably end up in trouble more times then not. There are always exceptions but I would feel more comfortable avoiding that as opposed to taking the chance regardless.

[casmith07]

Would you say that this is the norm or that this is the exception? Again, only speaking for myself but if I had a female friend that I shared so much in common with, I could see feelings on one side or the other developing much faster. I could also place myself in this position if my wife had such a relationship with another person. I would not like it and it would cause problems. Perhaps I am not mature enough, perhaps I simply do not trust enough. Whatever the case, I think that this type of situation would probably end up in trouble more times then not. There are always exceptions but I would feel more comfortable avoiding that as opposed to taking the chance regardless.

That female that you share so much in common with probably lays down next to you every night and calls you "honey" during the day.

Just a guess ;)

And furthermore, I don't think it has to do with your maturity nor your trust. I'm of the belief of having respect for your fellow man. I think that one of those respects is prohibiting yourself from being involved with a woman that is seriously involved with another man, and vice versa from the woman's standpoint.

Unfortunately, the majority of men aren't looking to just share a cup of coffee and talk about a good romance novel.

[Kangaroo]

So Roo, if you know and accept (I'm guessing that this is your position) that the odds are it won't work out, why take a chance? It would seem that if the odds are not in favor of avoiding bad situations, you would elect to forgo this sort of circumstance.

Me personally I try to avoid the situation it is easier that way and my life style is I am generally out doing something with a group so it makes it easy to avoid a lot of things. I do not avoid them because I am worried about what might happen or I never do anything.

I find a lot of women un-attrative and have no desire for any reason to bed them even if I was single and I had a chance :ralph:

[ABQCOWBOY]

That female that you share so much in common with probably lays down next to you every night and calls you "honey" during the day.

Just a guess ;)

Exactly right. All though, she's been known to vary on what she calls me, just depending. :laugh2:

I suspect you too are fortunate like that.

:)

[casmith07]

Me personally I try to avoid the situation it is easier that way and my life style is I am generally out doing something with a group so it makes it easy to avoid a lot of things. I do not avoid them because I am worried about what might happen or I never do anything.

I find a lot of women un-attrative and have no desire for any reason to bed them even if I was single and I had a chance :ralph:

This isn't what we're talking about, though I agree with most of this here.

What we're talking about is this --

You're steady with a girl, be it a GF, fiancee, or wife. Where do you stand on opposite-sex friends in that instance. For example, your girlfriend spends time hanging out with some guy. How would that make you feel?

[ABQCOWBOY]

Me personally I try to avoid the situation it is easier that way and my life style is I am generally out doing something with a group so it makes it easy to avoid a lot of things. I do not avoid them because I am worried about what might happen or I never do anything.

I find a lot of women un-attrative and have no desire for any reason to bed them even if I was single and I had a chance :ralph:


Fair enough.

[casmith07]

Exactly right. All though, she's been known to vary on what she calls me, just depending. :laugh2:

I suspect you too are fortunate like that.

:)

I get called a lot of things other than honey, and they aren't always terms of endearment. :laugh1:

[ABQCOWBOY]

I get called a lot of things other than honey, and they aren't always terms of endearment. :laugh1:

I suspected as much. Good for you Cas.

Speaking of which, it's time for me to head upstairs and go to bed.

Everybody, have a good evening.

:)

[Cowboyslife]

I just strive for chivalry; I think in the 1200s if one knight attempted to steal another knight's maiden, a duel would be in order.

I don't think knights dueled back then.

[Dallas]

If you're not attracted to the person, it's probably because they're much less attractive than you, which means YOU are much more attractive than them. Someone who hangs out with a person who is much more attractive most likely wants it to be more than just friends.

Most of my friends are extremely attractive girls. We all pretty much grew up together and our circle is really tight.

I haven't an interest in every "being" w/ any of them. They are all like sisters to me. We vacation together and party together and dinners and movies. Its all strictly platonic. They even call me for advice about guys, because I bring a guys point of view. I do the same w/ them when I want a girls view on something my GF said or is doing.


Does it cause problem w/ the girls I date?


Does it EVER ! :laugh2:

They are my best friends. I won't leave them because of a girls self esteem issues or jealousy problems. I never put myself in position to even be questioned. Everything is out in front ALWAYs w/ who I date. I even introduce them all.

Still.....it causes problems.


It doesn't matter how honest or upfront you are, most girls and most men just don't understand those type of friendships.

I totally understand my GF's having guy friends. I never have an issue w/ them unless they give me something to have an issue over.

Getting that respect returned however has been a VERY real challenge.

But...

My girlfriends have been there through my most difficult times in my life and I them. I would never not be there for them because of my GF's jealousies.

Time to grow up and trust your mates.

It isn't HS or College anymore. As long as your mate isn't giving you anything to be jealous over, its time to come w/ the trust and respect it takes to make a lasting and loving relationship work.

People just need to read each other better. You will certainly know if that person LOVES you and if you don't get those feelings, then it might be time to look at the relationship. Is it healthy? Are you getting out of it what you put into it? Is it pretty much one sided? If so, then you are wasting your time most likely and its better to move on if you feel you have tried and that person just isn't getting it or you feel they just aren't who you thought they were.

[casmith07]

I suspected as much. Good for you Cas.

Speaking of which, it's time for me to head upstairs and go to bed.

Everybody, have a good evening.

:)

'night ABQ!

I don't think knights dueled back then.

Well perhaps they met in a jousting tournament, you get the idea.

It would've been a great disrespect to do such a thing back then. I believe the same holds true now.

[theogt]

Most of my friends are extremely attractive girls. We all pretty much grew up together and our circle is really tight.

I haven't an interest in every "being" w/ any of them. They are all like sisters to me. We vacation together and party together and dinners and movies. Its all strictly platonic. They even call me for advice about guys, because I bring a guys point of view. I do the same w/ them when I want a girls view on something my GF said or is doing.


Does it cause problem w/ the girls I date?


Does it EVER ! :laugh2:

They are my best friends. I won't leave them because of a girls self esteem issues or jealousy problems. I never put myself in position to even be questioned. Everything is out in front ALWAYs w/ who I date. I even introduce them all.

Still.....it causes problems.


It doesn't matter how honest or upfront you are, most girls and most men just don't understand those type of friendships.

I totally understand my GF's having guy friends. I never have an issue w/ them unless they give me something to have an issue over.

Getting that respect returned however has been a VERY real challenge.

But...

My girlfriends have been there through my most difficult times in my life and I them. I would never not be there for them because of my GF's jealousies.

Time to grow up and trust your mates.

It isn't HS or College anymore. As long as your mate isn't giving you anything to be jealous over, its time to come w/ the trust and respect it takes to make a lasting and loving relationship work.

People just need to read each other better. You will certainly know if that person LOVES you and if you don't get those feelings, then it might be time to look at the relationship. Is it healthy? Are you getting out of it what you put into it? Is it pretty much one sided? If so, then you are wasting your time most likely and its better to move on if you feel you have tried and that person just isn't getting it or you feel they just aren't who you thought they were.tl;dr.

If you find them attractive, by definition that means you're attracted to them. End of conversation.

[Cowboyslife]

tl;dr.

If you find them attractive, by definition that means you're attracted to them. End of conversation.

Not necessarily. You can admit that a guy is good looking, doesn't mean you want to do the bumper cars with him. Unless...

[theogt]

Not necessarily. You can't admit that a guy is good looking, doesn't mean you want to do the bumper cars with him. Unless...Can't say I've ever found another man attractive.

Regardless, it's a terrible point. That's like saying a man can find a car beautiful but that doesn't mean he wants to sleep with it. Yeah, well no kidding, it's a completely different scenario.

If a straight man finds a woman attractive, it by definition means he's attracted to her.

[Cowboyslife]

Can't say I've ever found another man attractive.

See, this is where we disagree. Admitting someone is attractive looking doesn't necessarily have to mean that you are attracted to them. Sometimes it could just be used to make a point, which I believe Dallas here is trying to do.

[Dallas]

tl;dr.

If you find them attractive, by definition that means you're attracted to them. End of conversation.


You are truly completely wrong. Saying someone is attractive has NOTHING and I mean NOTHING to do w/ WANTING to "get" w/ them, which is clearly what you meant earlier.

I find many things attractive in life. It's all in ones definition, I suppose.

[Dallas]

See, this is where we disagree. Admitting someone is attractive looking doesn't necessarily have to mean that you are attracted to them. Sometimes it could just be used to make a point about someone, which I believe Dallas here is trying to do.


+5 pts for you for nailing what I meant. :D

[theogt]

See, this is where we disagree. Admitting someone is attractive looking doesn't necessarily have to mean that you are attracted to them. Sometimes it could just be used to make a point, which I believe Dallas here is trying to do.See my edit. A car can be beautiful, but you're not going to take it on a date.

[theogt]

You are truly completely wrong. Saying someone is attractive has NOTHING and I mean NOTHING to do w/ WANTING to "get" w/ them, which is clearly what you meant earlier.

I find many things attractive in life. It's all in ones definition, I suppose.I don't think you "get" this. It's not up for debate. That is the definition of "attractive." If you find someone "attractive" it means that you're attracted to them. This isn't an opinion. It's just a description of what is.

[Cowboyslife]

See my edit. A car can be beautiful, but you're not going to take it on a date.

True, so if your friend bought a Bentley and said to you, "man, aint that one sexy car?!!" You're not going to think he's going to get busy with the fuel nozzle would you?

[theogt]

True, so if your friend bought a Bentley and said to you, "man, aint that one sexy car?!!" You're not going to think he's going to get busy with the fuel nozzle would you?Absolutely not. But if I say, "hey that car is beautiful!" you're going to think that if I had the opportunity and the means, I would own that car.

[Cowboyslife]

Absolutely not. But if I say, "hey that car is beautiful!" you're going to think that if I had the opportunity and the means, I would own that car.

But I don't see that in the definition of attractive. Attractive is anything that is pleasing to the eyes and mind, not anything that you want to do it with.

[Dallas]

Absolutely not. But if I say, "hey that car is beautiful!" you're going to think that if I had the opportunity and the means, I would own that car.

So if I say that girl is beautiful, that means I want to free graze on her open range or I want to purchase her like my last Audi?


If I say Brad Pitt is an attractive dude. I can see why girls like him. That means I WANT to be w/ him?

I guess when you break it down like that theo, I must be gay? :confused:

Huh....I never thought myself as gay before.

39 years and I never knew.

[Teren_Kanan]

Common interests is a cop out, in my opinion. If your interests are generally typical for a man or woman, then one could reasonably expect your friends that share those interests to be of the same sex. I'd be rather upset if my fiancee was going over to some guy's place to watch Jersey Shore at 9PM at night because it was a "common interest" rather than hanging with some girlfriends. Plus, like I said before, I would rather sit and watch some nonsense on Bravo that I don't care about with her because she IS my best friend.

I'd MUCH MUCH MUCH Prefer my girlfriend go to some guy's place to watch crappy TV shows than force me to watch them. It's not even close.

We have shows we both like. We watch them together, it's fun. She doesn't watch shows I love that she hates, and I don't expect her to. I don't watch shows that she loves and I hate, and I don't expect to. So if some straight guy just LOVES Project Runway, then by all means baby, go watch it with him and get it off my TV.

[Cowboyslife]

So if I say that girl is beautiful, that means I want to free graze on her open range or I want to purchase her like my last Audi?


If I say Brad Pitt is an attractive dude. I can see why girls like him. That means I WANT to be w/ him?

I guess when you break it down like that theo, I must be gay? :confused:

Huh....I never thought myself as gay before.

We must be cruel in order to be kind. That's what the poet said. Don't take it too badly :).

[theogt]

So if I say that girl is beautiful, that means I want to free graze on her open range or I want to purchase her like my last Audi?It means if you had the means and the opportunity, you would want to be more than just friends.

If I say Brad Pitt is an attractive dude. I can see why girls like him. That means I WANT to be w/ him?See the car analogy.

I guess when you break it down like that theo, I must be gay? :confused:

Huh....I never thought myself as gay before.

39 years and I never knew.Don't be stupid.

[Dallas]

We must be cruel in order to be kind. That's what the poet said. Don't take it too badly :).

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Y8m29ZLX5ag/SH2H2-nlJsI/AAAAAAAABNI/Y9bq9FfGNvQ/s400/TOUCHE+TURTLE+2.jpg (http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Y8m29ZLX5ag/SH2H2-nlJsI/AAAAAAAABNI/Y9bq9FfGNvQ/s400/TOUCHE+TURTLE+2.jpg) touche' :laugh2:

[casmith07]

I'd MUCH MUCH MUCH Prefer my girlfriend go to some guy's place to watch crappy TV shows than force me to watch them. It's not even close.

We have shows we both like. We watch them together, it's fun. She doesn't watch shows I love that she hates, and I don't expect her to. I don't watch shows that she loves and I hate, and I don't expect to. So if some straight guy just LOVES Project Runway, then by all means baby, go watch it with him and get it off my TV.

You're wired differently from me. There are no circumstances in which I would advocate my fiancee spending time with another man that wasn't a relative. Never.

[Cowboyslife]

It means if you had the means and the opportunity, you would want to be more.

Aren't we forgetting about a little thing called self-control? Are you suggesting that all males are natural born cheaters if they're just simply waved on in?

Wow, this conversation has gone way off the mark, but enjoyable nonetheless, truly.

[Cowboyslife]

[/URL][URL="http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Y8m29ZLX5ag/SH2H2-nlJsI/AAAAAAAABNI/Y9bq9FfGNvQ/s400/TOUCHE+TURTLE+2.jpg"]http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Y8m29ZLX5ag/SH2H2-nlJsI/AAAAAAAABNI/Y9bq9FfGNvQ/s400/TOUCHE+TURTLE+2.jpg (http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Y8m29ZLX5ag/SH2H2-nlJsI/AAAAAAAABNI/Y9bq9FfGNvQ/s400/TOUCHE+TURTLE+2.jpg) touche' :laugh2:

:) Isn't there someplace where I can cash in on those 5 points you gave me just a moment ago?

[theogt]

Aren't we forgetting about a little thing called self-control?No, we're not. No one is forgetting about it.

Are you suggesting that all males are natural born cheaters if they're just simply waved on in?Nope.

Wow, this conversation has gone way off the mark, but enjoyable nonetheless, truly.I can see how you would think this. But that's only because you've completely misunderstood just about every thing I've said.

[Cowboyslife]

You're wired differently from me. There are no circumstances in which I would advocate my fiancee spending time with another man that wasn't a relative. Never.

This, I can totally understand. That would be just weird.

[Cowboyslife]

No, we're not. No one is forgetting about it.

Nope.

I can see how you would think this. But that's only because you've completely misunderstood just about every thing I've said.

If someone had self-control, why then would they want more if the opportunity presented itself and why would they go about seeking it? That's the very definition of lacking self-control.

[Sam I Am]

If I say Brad Pitt is an attractive dude. I can see why girls like him. That means I WANT to be w/ him?

Considering some of the crap I've seen at Argus parties, I would say so! :lmao2:

[theogt]

If someone had self-control, why then would they want more if the opportunity presented itself and would go about seeking it? That's the very definition of lacking self-control.You have a terrible time expressing your thoughts through words.

[Teren_Kanan]

It means if you had the means and the opportunity, you would want to be more than just friends.

See the car analogy.

Don't be stupid.

Theo is correct in his definition of attractive. Understanding why a women thinks a guy is attractive, and thinking a guy is attractive, are different things by definition. The argument has basically broken down into semantics.

Also, generalizations exist for a reason, because they represent the majority, but never do they represent everyone. There are men out there who genuinely don't want to sleep with most women they see. The majority of them do though.

As for me? I'm a pig. Based on LOOKS ALONE I would probably desire sex with 70-80% of the women on this planet. But that doesn't necessarily mean I'm very attracted to them. Based on LOOKS ALONE I would probably only be willing to actually date 20-30% of them. My standards for sex and potential girlfriend (based on only looks, mind you) are vastly different.

I can't think of a single female friend in my life that I wouldn't have been willing to sleep with if we were both single. But again, every female friend I've ever had has been fully aware of that fact. I'm extremely flirty regardless, and very sexual in general. Ask any of my female friends to recall a phrase I say often, and most of them will reply "Sit on my face", as it's my favorite thing to say.

If you're a close friend of mine, guy or girl, chances are we've talked about sex more times than we can count. I'm not the type of person who has any kind of secrets. I'll talk about anything. I especially enjoy taboo conversations.

Wanting to sleep with someone, or being willing to, does not mean you are going to attempt it.

[Cowboyslife]

You have a terrible time expressing your thoughts through words.

I'm sorry, the male approach to women is not as cut and dried as you make it appear. There are many reasons why a guy might not approach an attractive woman ever. He could be extremely devoted to that one woman. He could be extremely shy. He could be in a profession that requires cellibacy. He could be a pastor who counsels women from time to time and doesn't let anything interfere in that pursuit etc. etc.

[Cowboyslife]

Theo is correct in his definition of attractive. Understanding why a women thinks a guy is attractive, and thinking a guy is attractive, are different things by definition. The argument has basically broken down into semantics.

Also, generalizations exist for a reason, because they represent the majority, but never do they represent everyone. There are men out there who genuinely don't want to sleep with most women they see. The majority of them do though.

As for me? I'm a pig. Based on LOOKS ALONE I would probably desire sex with 70-80% of the women on this planet. But that doesn't necessarily mean I'm very attracted to them. Based on LOOKS ALONE I would probably only be willing to actually date 20-30% of them. My standards for sex and potential girlfriend (based on only looks, mind you) are vastly different.

I can't think of a single female friend in my life that I wouldn't have been willing to sleep with if we were both single. But again, every female friend I've ever had has been fully aware of that fact. I'm extremely flirty regardless, and very sexual in general. Ask any of my female friends to recall a phrase I say often, and most of them will reply "Sit on my face", as it's my favorite thing to say.

If you're a close friend of mine, guy or girl, chances are we've talked about sex more times than we can count. I'm not the type of person who has any kind of secrets. I'll talk about anything. I especially enjoy taboo conversations.

Wanting to sleep with someone, or being willing to, does not mean you are going to attempt it.

An attractive person can cause sexual attraction, that is true, but not always. And it can mean something as simple as attracting a gaze.

[rkell87]

Contacts for personal or professional advancement, i.e. networking is an extremely limited relationship. Those relationships exist only in their official capacity, no different from the fellow female Officers that I served with in my old unit. If I was in a bind making a leadership decision would I potentially call one of my old battle buddies? Absolutely. However, the discussion stops there.

I think you and I have a different understanding of the definition of the word "friend."

Common interests is a cop out, in my opinion. If your interests are generally typical for a man or woman, then one could reasonably expect your friends that share those interests to be of the same sex. I'd be rather upset if my fiancee was going over to some guy's place to watch Jersey Shore at 9PM at night because it was a "common interest" rather than hanging with some girlfriends. Plus, like I said before, I would rather sit and watch some nonsense on Bravo that I don't care about with her because she IS my best friend.
i assume we are talking about close personal friends that you have known for a long time and have a mutual repect for each other as a person and that happens to be single while you are in a long term commited relationship. you are taking the reasons individually, it would be multiple of those reasons why you or your wife would have a close friend of the opposite sex.

but like you have said there are/can be cultural differences that make opposite sex friends difficult.
Would you say that this is the norm or that this is the exception? Again, only speaking for myself but if I had a female friend that I shared so much in common with, I could see feelings on one side or the other developing much faster. I could also place myself in this position if my wife had such a relationship with another person. I would not like it and it would cause problems. Perhaps I am not mature enough, perhaps I simply do not trust enough. Whatever the case, I think that this type of situation would probably end up in trouble more times then not. There are always exceptions but I would feel more comfortable avoiding that as opposed to taking the chance regardless.
see i cant really say if it is the exception or rule because it varies on both people in the relationship and the friend on the other end. i am not a jealous person, my GF isnt overly jealous but can be sometimes but we have been together long enough and have a trust and our friends are all mutual friends(benefit from being together in highschool) and we are friends with people that have known us both for long periods of time and were there from the beginning of our relationship(her friend first or mine we both have them) so we dont have a problem with our single friends hitting on either of us and my GF has sent me alone to take care of a drunk female friend and she on occasion has had lunch with a male friend while im at work, there is just a trust there.

now i will say we have had friends that were attracted to one of us or the other and we talked about it and we drop those friends and social circle involved with those type people but those have never been 'close' long term friends.

[Dallas]

You have a terrible time expressing your thoughts through words.


ANSWER me like a MAN.


:laugh2: Sorry theo, thought it was funny. Had to include it here in our little thread of love and gay romance. ;)


I am also not some swine you can pick out at your local grocer (sorry teren...oink!). I am grade-A prime awesome man catch.

So my GF tells me....why she respects me and LOVESSSS me so much. :D

[Cowboyslife]

ANSWER me like a MAN.


:laugh2: Sorry theo, thought it was funny. Had to include it here in our little thread of love and gay romance. ;)


I am also not some swine you can pick out at your local grocer. I am grade-A prime awesome man catch.


So my GF tells says....why she respect me and LOVESSSS me so much. :D

You better watch out. Apparently she's going to try to have sex with every attractive guy she sees.

[casmith07]

i assume we are talking about close personal friends that you have known for a long time and have a mutual repect for each other as a person and that happens to be single while you are in a long term commited relationship. you are taking the reasons individually, it would be multiple of those reasons why you or your wife would have a close friend of the opposite sex.

but like you have said there are/can be cultural differences that make opposite sex friends difficult.

see i cant really say if it is the exception or rule because it varies on both people in the relationship and the friend on the other end. i am not a jealous person, my GF isnt overly jealous but can be sometimes but we have been together long enough and have a trust and our friends are all mutual friends(benefit from being together in highschool) and we are friends with people that have known us both for long periods of time and were there from the beginning of our relationship(her friend first or mine we both have them) so we dont have a problem with our single friends hitting on either of us and my GF has sent me alone to take care of a drunk female friend and she on occasion has had lunch with a male friend while im at work, there is just a trust there.

now i will say we have had friends that were attracted to one of us or the other and we talked about it and we drop those friends and social circle involved with those type people but those have never been 'close' long term friends.

I'll answer in bullet points, and then I'm going to bed and will rise tomorrow to continue this interesting thread :)

1. I think that no matter how long someone has been a "friend" when you enter into a serious relationship, they should back off.

2. Culture certainly plays a role in some instances, but to me it's immaterial.

3. Jealousy has absolutely nothing to do with my stance.

'night!

[Dallas]

You better watch out. Apparently she's trying to have sex with every attractive guy she meets.


She's a dj and does 4 shows a week at the clubs. I can't count how many oinkers are sweatin her.

You can't sweat the petty things and you shouldn't pet the sweaty things. ;)

There is always a possibility of infidelity, but I just got tired of worrying about all of that stuff long before her.

I got no reason not to believe I am ALLLL she needs. :D She takes great care of me and I haven't a single red flag waving at me in this relationship.

[Cowboyslife]

She's a dj and does 4 shows a week at the clubs. I can't count how many oinkers are sweatin her.

You can't sweat the petty things and you shouldn't pet the sweaty things. ;)

There is always a possibility of infidelity, but I just got tired of worrying about all of that stuff long before her.

I got no reason not to believe I am ALLLL she needs. :D She takes great care of me and I haven't a single red flag waving at me in this relationship.

I was only kidding. I hope I didn't offend you.

[theogt]

I'm sorry, the male approach to women is not as cut and dried as you make it appear. There are many reasons why a guy might not approach an attractive woman ever. He could be extremely devoted to that one woman. He could be extremely shy. He could be in a profession that requires cellibacy. He could be a pastor who counsels women from time to time and doesn't let anything interfere in that pursuit etc. etc.You've almost completely misread everything I've said. To the point where I'm considering whether it (your misreading) was intentional or not.

[Dallas]

I was only kidding. I hope I didn't offend you.


No no ...I was just making a point not ALL of us poopy guys are as primal as SOME want to make us out to be.

:)

http://bushwarriors.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/black-rhino-photo-credit-renaud-fulconis.jpg sup......beautiful...

[rkell87]

I'll answer in bullet points, and then I'm going to bed and will rise tomorrow to continue this interesting thread :)

1. I think that no matter how long someone has been a "friend" when you enter into a serious relationship, they should back off.

2. Culture certainly plays a role in some instances, but to me it's immaterial.

3. Jealousy has absolutely nothing to do with my stance.

'night!
i agree, and thats how it should be at least in the beginning but once that trust has been established and everyone involved knows they aint breaking that bond then it can be done.

i only brought it up because you made it seem like that could be the case with you when you said it to WG

thats fine but it does(in my view at least) play a part in whether or not an opposite sex friendship can work

good night sir

[theogt]

i agree, and thats how it should be at least in the beginning but once that trust has been established and everyone involved knows they aint breaking that bond then it can be done.

i only brought it up because you made it seem like that could be the case with you when you said it to WG

thats fine but it does(in my view at least) play a part in whether or not an opposite sex friendship can work

good night sirWhether you trust your spouse in a particular situation doesn't make that situation socially normal or acceptable.

I trust my wife to sit in a room full of naked men. Do I want her sitting in that situation? Is it acceptable for her to want to sit in that situation? No.

[Cowboyslife]

You've almost completely misread everything I've said. To the point where I'm considering whether it (your misreading) was intentional or not.

I didn't misread you saying that all guys are going to pursue an attractive woman. My response were only listing examples to prove my point.

Bottomline, you can admit that someone is attractive and have no inkling of trying to hook up with them.

[theogt]

I didn't misread you saying that all guys are going to pursue an attractive woman. My response were only listing examples to prove my point.See, I never said that. Hence, your misreading. I've become persuaded that your misreading was involuntary.

[Cowboyslife]

See, I never said that. Hence, your misreading. I've become persuaded that your misreading was involuntary.

So all that about having the means and lalala was nothing really then?

[theogt]

So all that about having the means and lalala was nothing really then?It was "means and opportunity." And no, it wasn't meaningless.

[Teren_Kanan]

Dallas wrote:

There is always a possibility of infidelity, but I just got tired of worrying about all of that stuff long before her.

I got no reason not to believe I am ALLLL she needs. :D She takes great care of me and I haven't a single red flag waving at me in this relationship.Pretty much sums up my feelings with my GF.

Theogt wrote:

Whether you trust your spouse in a particular situation doesn't make that situation socially normal or acceptable.

I trust my wife to sit in a room full of naked men. Do I want her sitting in that situation? Is it acceptable for her to want to sit in that situation? No.I trust my wife to sit in a room full of naked men? Yes I do

Do I want her sitting in that situation? Sounds really awkward lol, no straight answer available, too many intangibles. Why are there naked men in a room? Is this a male strip club? Go for it baby, have a ball.

Is it acceptable for her to want to sit in that situation? Absolutely! If she could spend time in a room full of naked Brad Pitts, more power to her. I'm sure she'll have a fun time eye balling such amazing man meat.

I certainly know I'd love to be in a room full of naked beautiful women. Sounds like a strip club to me. I have no problem with them, and my GF has gone with me to them. I'd have no problem with her going to a male strip club, not in the slightest.

Wanting to do things, again, does not indicate intent.

As for being socially normal? Social norms tend to be very illogical, and a lot of them need to go away.

Cowboyslife wrote:

Bottomline, you can admit that someone is attractive and have no inkling of trying to hook up with them.

I'll go ahead and concede. But I will argue that it is neither the point, nor does it have any real relevance to the topic at hand. The discussion on the meaning of the word "attractive" is semantics at this point.

[Dallas]

The discussion on the meaning of the word "attractive" is semantics at this point.

:hammer: again

[rkell87]

Whether you trust your spouse in a particular situation doesn't make that situation socially normal or acceptable.

I trust my wife to sit in a room full of naked men. Do I want her sitting in that situation? Is it acceptable for her to want to sit in that situation? No.
so what? you aren't talking about the subject at hand, once again. yes it is socially normal and acceptable for Platonic friends to to hang out with or without there spouse(don't go on a tangent on whether people can be Platonic, they aren't doing it, they aren't pursuing it, its Platonic).

sitting in a room full of naked men has nothing to do with close friends of the opposite sex.

[Cowboyslife]

so what? you aren't talking about the subject at hand, once again. yes it is socially normal and acceptable for Platonic friends to to hang out with or without there spouse(don't go on a tangent on whether people can be Platonic, they aren't doing it, they aren't pursuing it, its Platonic).

sitting in a room full of naked men has nothing to do with close friends of the opposite sex.

Unless they're swingers.

[rkell87]

Unless they're swingers.
touche

[theogt]

so what? you aren't talking about the subject at hand, once again. yes it is socially normal and acceptable for Platonic friends to to hang out with or without there spouse(don't go on a tangent on whether people can be Platonic, they aren't doing it, they aren't pursuing it, its Platonic).

sitting in a room full of naked men has nothing to do with close friends of the opposite sex.You kept making a point about trust. And I was showing that trust was largely irrelevant.

[rkell87]

You kept making a point about trust. And I was showing that trust was largely irrelevant.
imo you failed. and are wrong

[theogt]

Bottomline, you can admit that someone is attractive and have no inkling of trying to hook up with them.You have no "inkling" because you lack the means and opportunity.

[theogt]

imo you failed. and are wrongNo, I showed that trust was irrelevant. That much is certain. Whether you choose to ignore it, is another question. Feel free to do so.

[Cowboyslife]

You have no "inkling" because you lack the means and opportunity.

What the hell is your deal?

[rkell87]

No, I showed that trust was irrelevant. That much is certain. Whether you choose to ignore it, is another question. Feel free to do so.
ok lets go with the naked men thing, i trust that my GF wouldnt be in that situation, and trust that she wouldnt want to be. so trust is relevant.

[Dallas]

What the hell is your deal?


Umm do you see the nightmare of a carousel ride you just paid for? I get my shots in and get out. Once vindicated, the rest is just spin to save face.

If you can't dazzle them w/ brilliance......well.....baffle them with BS, right?


;)

[Cowboyslife]

Umm do you see the nightmare of a carousel ride you just paid for? I get my shots in and get out. Once vindicated, the rest is just spin to save face.

If you can't dazzle them w/ brilliance......well.....baffle them with BS, right?


;)

Disagreement is one thing, but right now I feel like I'm taking jabs below the belt from a midget in the ring.

[SaltwaterServr]

http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e42/MihoshiK/spacebattles/74100-grandpa-simpson.gif

[DallasCowboysRule!]

If you weren't the one wanting it to be more, the other person was. Guaranteed.



Fact. I've never had a female friend when one or the other didn't want it to go further. There have even been situations where I was interested in only friendship and seriously believed she felt the same way only to find out some time later that she did in fact want more than just friendship.

[Teren_Kanan]

ok lets go with the naked men thing, i trust that my GF wouldnt be in that situation, and trust that she wouldnt want to be. so trust is relevant.

Can someone put the room of naked me into context for me? Is your GF just going to be sitting in the middle looking around? Or is it orgy time?
When I read it I put it into the context of like a male strip club. Lots of naked men. And I would have no problem with my GF being in one, and no problem with her wanting to be.

[Teren_Kanan]

Fact. I've never had a female friend when one or the other didn't want it to go further. There have even been situations where I was interested in only friendship and seriously believed she felt the same way only to find out some time later that she did in fact want more than just friendship.

Yes but wanting something doesn't necessarily mean intent to get it. I "want" to sleep with several of my female friends, but I wouldn't do it.

I'm not saying you're incorrect, I'm saying that you being right shouldn't matter or stop 2 people from having a platonic relationship, regardless of whether or not they want more.

[Go Big D!]

Yes it is possible. Some of my best friends are guys.
I even sleep with them every 3rd night and have never had sex with any of them :laugh2:

[kristie]

It is entirely possible but you have to have two very understanding people. My wife and I discussed this early on in our marriage. In all honesty we agreed to even allow the other to be attracted to someone of the opposite sex. In other words, if I say Kate Beckinsale is gorgeous it does not mean I want a divorce and to jump into bed with her. It means I am not blind. Same thing if she says that of a man. We allow ourselves to look at the opposite sex as long as it is not by braille. In a very short time we learned to trust each other and not to believe attraction means lust.

In other words, yes it can be accomplished but you nor she can secretly be calculating how to cheat, not get cheated on, and not get caught. As soon as you start making moves on the friend of the opposite sex you have sanctified the very essence of this question.

Most of my friends are sports freaks, but I do have some friends that are female. My wife knows I will never cheat on her. Not with them or anyone. I earned that trust. That is the key.

my husband & i are the same way. :)

[casmith07]

Alright this thread has devolved...I'm going to get it back on track once I get to my laptop.

[Joe Rod]

Fact. I've never had a female friend when one or the other didn't want it to go further. There have even been situations where I was interested in only friendship and seriously believed she felt the same way only to find out some time later that she did in fact want more than just friendship.

This is actually a testiment to why I see no reason to give up my two female friends. I have known them for over twenty years since we were in Grade-School. Both friendships span five years longer than my relationship with my wife. We have been friends while being single and during relationships. They have seen me at my best and worst. We just aren't into each other in that way. One of them flew up after our first child was born to visit and we had her stay over at our rental house the last time we were in Orlando. She is like family to me.

I can understand where people that have no such relationships can be skeptical, but that is only their opinion. Twenty-plus years is long enough for me to feel that I have made the right decision.

[ABQCOWBOY]

Well, I can honestly say that in my entire life, from the time I was a young kid, up to now, I have never been in any sort of relationship, be it girl friend or wife, where putting the Friendship of a female before or even on par with that of my partner, didn't cause trouble. Perhaps I just pick the wrong type. I don't know but it's never failed to create issues. In the past, I have made decisions not to put my relationship before personal friendships and those relationships pretty much ended.

Just how it is for me.

[Doomsday]

I dont really buy into the whole "friend" thing when it comes to people of different sex. Sure it is possible but I would be willing to bet that at least 80% of the time one of the two people has more on their mind then just friendship but doesnt want to admit it.

[casmith07]

Well, I can honestly say that in my entire life, from the time I was a young kid, up to now, I have never been in any sort of relationship, be it girl friend or wife, where putting the Friendship of a female before or even on par with that of my partner, didn't cause trouble. Perhaps I just pick the wrong type. I don't know but it's never failed to create issues. In the past, I have made decisions not to put my relationship before personal friendships and those relationships pretty much ended.

Just how it is for me.

Same here.

[casmith07]

I dont really buy into the whole "friend" thing when it comes to people of different sex. Sure it is possible but I would be willing to bet that at least 80% of the time one of the two people has more on their mind then just friendship but doesnt want to admit it.

Just like Steve Harvey said :)

[bbgun]

I dont really buy into the whole "friend" thing when it comes to people of different sex. Sure it is possible but I would be willing to bet that at least 80% of the time one of the two people has more on their mind then just friendship but doesnt want to admit it.

It would only work if neither or you were in a relationship with someone else at the time. Chances are your bf or gf would find it weird or threatening, no matter how innocent.

[Vtwin]

It would only work if neither or you were in a relationship with someone else at the time. Chances are your bf or gf would find it weird or threatening, no matter how innocent.

Would never have gotten seriously involved with someone who was "threatened" by a long standing relationship. Life is to short to be controlled by petty insecure behavior.

I've got guy friends who used to be close but their wives have such a tight grip on thier sack they can't even hang out with their old friends once in a while. Sad...

[Vtwin]

Generally if someone isn't attracted to someone, they wouldn't be trying to hang out with them.

Look, at no point ever when I'm sitting around do I decide to pick up the phone and see if some girl from the law school wants to hang out. I have done it on one occasion, and it was at the request of my fiancee to invite some of the girls she had met when we all went out together for drinks. We were going to the Maryland seafood festival and she wanted the girls to come so that she would be able to try and make some new friends.

At no time do I have the desire to hang out with other women. I've been told by another woman that she would "do anything for me" as recently as October (a pathetic cry for help from an old flame). My fiancee was furious, as well I would hope she would be.

I just simply do not think there is anything to be gained from having friends of the opposite sex. What does some other man have to offer that I as a boyfriend, fiance, or husband don't have? Think of it in that context - stop thinking of it as being a single person and having friends of the opposite sex - that's customary.


What? That's insane! I go skiing with my skiing frineds and fishing with my fishing friends etc etc etc. Physical attraction has nothing to do with hanging out with someone because you have common interests.

[theogt]

What? That's insane! I go skiing with my skiing frineds and fishing with my fishing friends etc etc etc. Physical attraction has nothing to do with hanging out with someone because you have common interests.You have a female friend with which just the two of you go skiing or fishing?

[ABQCOWBOY]

What? That's insane! I go skiing with my skiing frineds and fishing with my fishing friends etc etc etc. Physical attraction has nothing to do with hanging out with someone because you have common interests.


Unless your fishing weekly or skiing year round, I don't really think that this sort of comparison meets what is being described. These kinds of associations would be much more casual to me. The person I would consider as closer friend would be somebody I'm talking to multiple times a week. Somebody I go out of my way to meet with and enjoy company with often. At least, that would be what I invision as a close friend. Certainly I have close friends that I don't see as often, perhaps we no longer live near one another but we stay in close touch. That's more of what I could see as constituting good, close friendship.

[Vtwin]

You have a female friend with which just the two of you go skiing or fishing?

Yes. Although it is friends as in more than one.

[Vtwin]

Unless your fishing weekly or skiing year round, I don't really think that this sort of comparison meets what is being described. These kinds of associations would be much more casual to me. The person I would consider as closer friend would be somebody I'm talking to multiple times a week. Somebody I go out of my way to meet with and enjoy company with often. At least, that would be what I invision as a close friend. Certainly I have close friends that I don't see as often, perhaps we no longer live near one another but we stay in close touch. That's more of what I could see as constituting good, close friendship.

I talk or see these friends weekly at least. They are close friends that I have known for a long time. Actually had a thing with one of them for a while a long time ago before either of us were married. She's now been married for 18 years and me for 15. My wife loves them both and hangs out with them also. They have the keys to our house. They are my most trusted friends.

I am very lucky to have these relationships.

[ABQCOWBOY]

I talk or see these friends weekly at least. They are close friends that I have known for a long time. Actually had a thing with one of them for a while a long time ago before either of us were married. She's now been married for 18 years and me for 15. My wife loves them both and hangs out with them also. They have the keys to our house. They are my most trusted friends.

I am very lucky to have these relationships.


I doubt I'd ever survive that. My wife would hand me my head.

[theogt]

Yes. Although it is friends as in more than one.If the second sentence is true, then your answer should have been "no." If you have a group of friends that do things together and one member of the group happens to be a female, that isn't the situation we're addressing. You wouldn't go to Vegas for a weekend with just you and one of those female "friends", would you? For good reason that wouldn't be socially acceptable. But if you and one of your guy friends from that group took a weekend trip to Vegas, no one would think twice. Thus, you're "friends" with the males in the group in a way that you can't be "friends" with the females.

[Aikmaniac]

What's funny is while I was at lunch, I saw three different couples come in where the man was middle-aged (50's) and the female was young (late 20's)...all had to be assistants. I immediately thought of this thread.

I talked to my buddy about it and we both agreed that if the wives knew or had met the young, hot assistant after they were newly hired, it would help the jealousy factor...however, how many times do you think it would be ok to take the young assistant out to lunch?

I also noticed that each of these ladies wore what had to be engagement or wedding rings.

[WV Cowboy]

This thing about girls that you knew since childhood, or before you were married are different to me.

At least that is not what I was referring to.

I'm saying something like you got a new job and met someone there, or some girl gets a job where you work, or you meet her at the gym, ... then having her become your new best friend is what I am talking about.

Dangerous.

[casmith07]

If the second sentence is true, then your answer should have been "no." If you have a group of friends that do things together and one member of the group happens to be a female, that isn't the situation we're addressing. You wouldn't go to Vegas for a weekend with just you and one of those female "friends", would you? For good reason that wouldn't be socially acceptable. But if you and one of your guy friends from that group took a weekend trip to Vegas, no one would think twice. Thus, you're "friends" with the males in the group in a way that you can't be "friends" with the females.

Exactumundo, señor.

What's funny is while I was at lunch, I saw three different couples come in where the man was middle-aged (50's) and the female was young (late 20's)...all had to be assistants. I immediately thought of this thread.

I talked to my buddy about it and we both agreed that if the wives knew or had met the young, hot assistant after they were newly hired, it would help the jealousy factor...however, how many times do you think it would be ok to take the young assistant out to lunch?

I also noticed that each of these ladies wore what had to be engagement or wedding rings.

They would be pretty pissed. There's a girl that I went to Airborne School with in 2006. She's a lieutenant in the Army now. Recently I attended her promotion ceremony to 1LT at her request, as a colleague. Afterwards, she began a miniature firestorm of flirtatious comments and such on my facebook page, photo comments, etc.

Needless to say, the fiancée was quite upset. But again, I would hope that she would be.

This thing about girls that you knew since childhood, or before you were married are different to me.

At least that is not what I was referring to.

I'm saying something like you got a new job and met someone there, or some girl gets a job where you work, or you meet her at the gym, ... then having her become your new best friend is what I am talking about.

Dangerous.

There are three women that I know now that I basically "grew up with" since they were the kids of some of my dad's Army buddies.

In a pinch, I would help them as if I were a big brother. I would never plan a trip or hang out with them without inviting my fiancée, either. Just not the way that I operate. I feel that it is disrespectful of me to offer up my time and company to another woman in the same manner that I would offer to my fiancée. Complete and utter disrespect.

[Vtwin]

If the second sentence is true, then your answer should have been "no." If you have a group of friends that do things together and one member of the group happens to be a female, that isn't the situation we're addressing. You wouldn't go to Vegas for a weekend with just you and one of those female "friends", would you? For good reason that wouldn't be socially acceptable. But if you and one of your guy friends from that group took a weekend trip to Vegas, no one would think twice. Thus, you're "friends" with the males in the group in a way that you can't be "friends" with the females.


Man o man. You just dont give up. :p:

I am talking about me and one of my female friends going skiing, fishing or whatever just the two of us, alone, nobody else. I just meant that I have more then one female friend that I spend time with.

One of these female friends has gone to a big city for and extended period of time for her work the last couple years. I have gone out to visit her and have fun in the big city both years. Spent 3 or 4 days there and GASP!!! stayed at the condo she was staying in with her.

Never been big on what is "socially acceptable". I know what is right and wrong and I live the way I choose not some antiquated social convention built on distrust and insecurity.

I am certain I don't dress right either. :laugh2:

[WV Cowboy]

There are three women that I know now that I basically "grew up with" since they were the kids of some of my dad's Army buddies.

In a pinch, I would help them as if I were a big brother. I would never plan a trip or hang out with them without inviting my fiancée, either. Just not the way that I operate. I feel that it is disrespectful of me to offer up my time and company to another woman in the same manner that I would offer to my fiancée. Complete and utter disrespect.

I agree about the disrespect thing. No lady friends for me.

My wife of 35 yrs thinks I hung the moon, .. I love that she thinks that.

I wouldn't ever do anything to give her cause to change the way she thinks.

I would not trade her for anything, any amount of money, or anybody.

[Zaxor]

let me give an example... I have 5 sisters and each of them have had friends some of who I like though I do not find them at all sexually attractive nor they me but we can hang out together and laugh at old times or other things...heck they feel to me like sisters and they sometime introduce me as their adopted brother...there is nothing there

[WV Cowboy]

let me give an example... I have 5 sisters and each of them have had friends some of who I like though I do not find them at all sexually attractive nor they me but we can hang out together and laugh at old times or other things...heck they feel to me like sisters and they sometime introduce me as their adopted brother...there is nothing there

Right, .. understandable.
Not what I am talking about though, .. see below.

This thing about girls that you knew since childhood, or before you were married are different to me.

At least that is not what I was referring to.

I'm saying something like you got a new job and met someone there, or some girl gets a job where you work, or you meet her at the gym, ... then having her become your new best friend is what I am talking about.

Dangerous.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

I take my secretary out to lunch numerous times during the year. She is now engaged but before she wasn't. I never thought anything of it.

My wife has met her and told me she is really pretty but there is no jealousy there.

It was funny though, when I hired her, my wife asked if she was good looking, I said she's fine. Then Ann met her and said, she's really pretty, I went I guess.

Funny story, at an old office, there was a lawyer who had left his first wife for his secretary who became wife number two. She insisted on approving his next secretary who ended up being a real old troll.

[Aikmaniac]

Man o man. You just dont give up. :p:

I am talking about me and one of my female friends going skiing, fishing or whatever just the two of us, alone, nobody else. I just meant that I have more then one female friend that I spend time with.

One of these female friends has gone to a big city for and extended period of time for her work the last couple years. I have gone out to visit her and have fun in the big city both years. Spent 3 or 4 days there and GASP!!! stayed at the condo she was staying in with her.

Never been big on what is "socially acceptable". I know what is right and wrong and I live the way I choose not some antiquated social convention built on distrust and insecurity.

I am certain I don't dress right either. :laugh2:

Consider yourself "lucky" there my man.

Not many relationships would work out in that situation, but, as you said, that's how it is going to be for you.

More power to you.

[Zaxor]

Right, .. understandable.
Not what I am talking about though, .. see below.

gotcha

[Go Big D!]

I dont really buy into the whole "friend" thing when it comes to people of different sex. Sure it is possible but I would be willing to bet that at least 80% of the time one of the two people has more on their mind then just friendship but doesnt want to admit it.

Well it happens. I'm living proof. The guys I referenced earlier, I have no attraction to in the least. And I know the feeling is mutual. Maybe it's because of the environment that we work together, at the fire department, as more of a family vibe. Therefore lacking the sexual tension. Even my husband feels 100% secure about my friendship with them.

[theogt]

I am talking about me and one of my female friends going skiing, fishing or whatever just the two of us, alone, nobody else. I just meant that I have more then one female friend that I spend time with.Really, because earlier you said it was in groups. Now you're changing your story?

One of these female friends has gone to a big city for and extended period of time for her work the last couple years. I have gone out to visit her and have fun in the big city both years. Spent 3 or 4 days there and GASP!!! stayed at the condo she was staying in with her.You're married and you spent a weekend just you and another female at her apartment in another city?

Yeah, that's not normal.

I take my secretary out to lunch numerous times during the year. She is now engaged but before she wasn't. I never thought anything of it.Why would you? It's a work relationship. I've taken my secretary to lunch.

But you most certainly wouldn't go spend a weekend alone in another city with her.

[Vtwin]

Really, because earlier you said it was in groups. Now you're changing your story?

You're married and you spent a weekend just you and another female at her apartment in another city?

Yeah, that's not normal.

.


I did not say that. You may have misinterpreted what I wrote but I explained it clearly in a later post. You aren't really trying are you.


Who are you to determine what is "normal". "Normal" is for the spineless and the sheep. Isn't it time for you to watch American Idol on the DVR?

I've been faithfully married for 15 years and have no intention of changing that. That isn't "normal" these days either, is it?

;)

[theogt]

I did not say that.Yeah, I get that your story has changed several times now.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

Really, because earlier you said it was in groups. Now you're changing your story?

You're married and you spent a weekend just you and another female at her apartment in another city?

Yeah, that's not normal.

Why would you? It's a work relationship. I've taken my secretary to lunch.

But you most certainly wouldn't go spend a weekend alone in another city with her.

sure I would, if her fiance and my wife agreed to it ;)

[Teren_Kanan]

I did not say that. You may have misinterpreted what I wrote but I explained it clearly in a later post. You aren't really trying are you.


Who are you to determine what is "normal". "Normal" is for the spineless and the sheep. Isn't it time for you to watch American Idol on the DVR?

I've been faithfully married for 15 years and have no intention of changing that. That isn't "normal" these days either, is it?

;)

No, being faithfully married for such a length of time is not "normal" anymore.

I get you, and completely agree.
I do have a question though. Your female friends. If you were both single, would you sleep with them if they made an advance, or would you attempt to sleep with them?

I have several female friends that I hang out with. And by that Theo, I mean, Just us, alone, away from my GF, and at odd hours of the night. Sometimes we smoke, sometimes we drink, and as I posted earlier, we've even gone hot tubbing, in bathing suites which means very little clothing !! gasp!

To top it all off, if I was single I'd be trying to get all up in it. A few of my friends it's not even a question. If we were both single, we'd be sleeping with each other. I know this, they know this, my GF knows this. No one has a problem with it, because, I'm not single and I wouldn't do it. It's as simple as that.

But my GF is not insecure, and neither am I. I would allow her to do the same thing with other guys without so much as a worry. Sex with any of my friends wouldn't be worth losing my GF over, ever. I've even slept with a friend I hang out with, prior to getting with my GF.

It's not "normal", but as I said earlier, Social Norms are often based on garbage and unreasonable. Is it rare to find a women who would be cool with what I do? Maybe, but I wouldn't be with any women who had a problem with it.

Know what else isn't normal? 5 years in a relationship without a single argument minor or otherwise.

[Vintage]

(2) hung out with that person for extended periods of time just by yourselves, and (3) not had one or the other want it to be more than just friends. If you weren't the one wanting it to be more, the other person was. Guaranteed.



Yeah, you're full of it...

[CanadianCowboysFan]

I think if North Americans were less hung up on sex, we would enjoy life bettre.

[Teren_Kanan]

I think if North Americans were less hung up on sex, we would enjoy life bettre.

Indeed.

[bbgun]

I think if North Americans were less hung up on sex, we would enjoy life bettre.

"I enjoy sex as much as Joe Namath, only I do it with one girl." -- Roger Staubach

[casmith07]

"I enjoy sex as much as Joe Namath, only I do it with one girl." -- Roger Staubach

/thread :bow:

[CanadianCowboysFan]

except people get too high and mighty over other's sex practices

Ask yourself, was Francois Mitterand, John Kennedy, George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, ike worse presidents because they had affairs while President?

In the end, we worry too much about that stuff, it is a private nature and should remain there.

If Rex Ryan were coaching a European soccer team no way would anyone write or care about his foot fetish issue on the side. It would be a private matter between he and his wife.

[Yakuza Rich]

It's okay if that is the terms of the relationship.

But 99% of the time...it NEVER will work.

Eventually one of the people in the relationship will get jealous and hold that against the other person.

The best I've ever seen come out of that situation was a friend of mine and his girlfriend had that understanding for awhile and then eventually grew apart from each other a couple of years down the road and went their separate ways without any real animosity.

Personally that type of understanding is something I've never looked for in a relationship. To me, too much stress and anxiety. But I've had plenty of friends try to tell me that they think their girlfriend or the person they just started seeing will understand that or they are supposed to try that and it usually winds up in disaster.






YR

[Vtwin]

Yeah, I get that your story has changed several times now.

That's your game eh?

My "story" has been the same since word one son.

[Vtwin]

No, being faithfully married for such a length of time is not "normal" anymore.

I get you, and completely agree.
I do have a question though. Your female friends. If you were both single, would you sleep with them if they made an advance, or would you attempt to sleep with them?

I have several female friends that I hang out with. And by that Theo, I mean, Just us, alone, away from my GF, and at odd hours of the night. Sometimes we smoke, sometimes we drink, and as I posted earlier, we've even gone hot tubbing, in bathing suites which means very little clothing !! gasp!

To top it all off, if I was single I'd be trying to get all up in it. A few of my friends it's not even a question. If we were both single, we'd be sleeping with each other. I know this, they know this, my GF knows this. No one has a problem with it, because, I'm not single and I wouldn't do it. It's as simple as that.

But my GF is not insecure, and neither am I. I would allow her to do the same thing with other guys without so much as a worry. Sex with any of my friends wouldn't be worth losing my GF over, ever. I've even slept with a friend I hang out with, prior to getting with my GF.

It's not "normal", but as I said earlier, Social Norms are often based on garbage and unreasonable. Is it rare to find a women who would be cool with what I do? Maybe, but I wouldn't be with any women who had a problem with it.

Know what else isn't normal? 5 years in a relationship without a single argument minor or otherwise.



Well in my case I have slept with one of them. We dated about 25 years ago for a short time. The same one I visited and stayed with in fact. We often joke that if we had stayed together and got married we would probably hate each other by now. My wife knows all of this. She knows how much I love her (my wife) and how I would never do anything to hurt her or jeopardize our relationship. My friend feels the same about her husband and she has three kids. I am close with her entire family and helped carry her father to his grave. We don't even entertain the thought of fooling around because of respect for our loved ones and the fact that there is so much to lose for both of us. We are not weaklings who cannot control our emotions like some posting in this thread. We have a real bond of friendship that is rare in my experience. To give that up just because Theo thinks it's not "normal" would be just plain weak. If fate was to leave us both alone in this world things might change. To be honest I haven't really even thought about it. I get my physical desires filled and don't need to be thinking about that with anyone other than the one I promised to love honor and cherish.

My friend and I are going to Montreal tonight to see a hockey game. My wife told me this morning that if we are going out for drinks after (duh) don't be afraid to spend the night rather than risk driving home. My wife sees the big picture. I have earned her trust and will do nothing to lose it.

Ironically... If I were to be going to this game with some guy friends I would no doubt end up being dragged into one of Montreal's famous strip clubs. Since I'm going with my female friend we will find some good music somewhere and chill.

Wonder which my wife would find more disrespectful Theo?

[casmith07]

Well in my case I have slept with one of them. We dated about 25 years ago for a short time. The same one I visited and stayed with in fact. We often joke that if we had stayed together and got married we would probably hate each other by now. My wife knows all of this. She knows how much I love her (my wife) and how I would never do anything to hurt her or jeopardize our relationship. My friend feels the same about her husband and she has three kids. I am close with her entire family and helped carry her father to his grave. We don't even entertain the thought of fooling around because of respect for our loved ones and the fact that there is so much to lose for both of us. We are not weaklings who cannot control our emotions like some posting in this thread. We have a real bond of friendship that is rare in my experience. To give that up just because Theo thinks it's not "normal" would be just plain weak. If fate was to leave us both alone in this world things might change. To be honest I haven't really even thought about it. I get my physical desires filled and don't need to be thinking about that with anyone other than the one I promised to love honor and cherish.

My friend and I are going to Montreal tonight to see a hockey game. My wife told me this morning that if we are going out for drinks after (duh) don't be afraid to spend the night rather than risk driving home. My wife sees the big picture. I have earned her trust and will do nothing to lose it.

Ironically... If I were to be going to this game with some guy friends I would no doubt end up being dragged into one of Montreal's famous strip clubs. Since I'm going with my female friend we will find some good music somewhere and chill.

Wonder which my wife would find more disrespectful Theo?

Nobody is dragging you to a strip club against your will. And if your friends can't respect the fact that your wife doesn't like you frequenting strip clubs, then they aren't real friends.

As for the rest of that, that CERTAINLY would not fly in most relationships that I've been a part of or known, including my current one. My fiancée now doesn't want me to have anything to do with any ex-girlfriends, and I completely understand where she is coming from.

The fact that there was a physical history there makes it even worse.

But, to each his own, I suppose. Being a pallbearer and spending weekends together away from your wife are two distinctly different things, in my opinion. If I went to spend a weekend 1 on 1 with another woman not only would I feel guilty and dirty the entire time, but I'd be on the street as well.

[Doomsday]

Well it happens. I'm living proof. The guys I referenced earlier, I have no attraction to in the least. And I know the feeling is mutual. Maybe it's because of the environment that we work together, at the fire department, as more of a family vibe. Therefore lacking the sexual tension. Even my husband feels 100% secure about my friendship with them.

No offense but woman usually are the ones who think it is mutual but usually it isnt. Im not saying it NEVER happens but I am saying most of the time one of two, have more then just friendship on their minds.

To me friendship is a form of attraction and intimacy, I wouldnt marry or even date a woman that I couldnt be friends with. It is a prerequisite of a relationship in my mind. If I get a long good with a woman and have that type of connection than I would want to pursue it further and I think so would most single men looking for a long term relationship. Maybe I have a warped sense of reality, but that has been my experience.

Two questions. Are your male friends married? Do you go out and do things with your male friends without your husband present? Like go to the movies, or shopping or other activities that normal friends would do? The only reason I ask is I think there are different levels of friendship.

One of my best friends has been "friends" with a girl for over 15 years. She thinks they are just good buddies but I know different. He has had a huge crush on her for the ENTIRE time but he knows she has no sexual interest in him at all. He thinks that suddenly she is going to realize what a great guy he is and hopes things will change. Some people are really good at hiding their true feelings trying to hold onto hope, others of us are not wired like that. If I am interested in a girl, I will try to find out if its mutual and if not move on.

[Doomsday]

I take my secretary out to lunch numerous times during the year. She is now engaged but before she wasn't. I never thought anything of it.

My wife has met her and told me she is really pretty but there is no jealousy there.

It was funny though, when I hired her, my wife asked if she was good looking, I said she's fine. Then Ann met her and said, she's really pretty, I went I guess.

Funny story, at an old office, there was a lawyer who had left his first wife for his secretary who became wife number two. She insisted on approving his next secretary who ended up being a real old troll.

Secretaries and Nannies are home wreckers, LOL. (joking)

That is more being friendly then being friends to me. I go to lunch with my fellow co-workers all the time, but I dont call them friends. They are work friends, its not the same.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

Nobody is dragging you to a strip club against your will. And if your friends can't respect the fact that your wife doesn't like you frequenting strip clubs, then they aren't real friends.

As for the rest of that, that CERTAINLY would not fly in most relationships that I've been a part of or known, including my current one. My fiancée now doesn't want me to have anything to do with any ex-girlfriends, and I completely understand where she is coming from.

The fact that there was a physical history there makes it even worse.

But, to each his own, I suppose. Being a pallbearer and spending weekends together away from your wife are two distinctly different things, in my opinion. If I went to spend a weekend 1 on 1 with another woman not only would I feel guilty and dirty the entire time, but I'd be on the street as well.

just don't tell your wife?

[CanadianCowboysFan]

Secretaries and Nannies are home wreckers, LOL. (joking)

That is more being friendly then being friends to me. I go to lunch with my fellow co-workers all the time, but I dont call them friends. They are work friends, its not the same.

well when your wife hires a nanny, she is pretty much accepting you likely will be having fun on the side, that is why so many hire really ugly Fillipinas. :laugh2:

[baj1dallas]

Depends what "friends" means, but if you start dating them and just lie to yourself that you're just friends, then it's doomed. It's a lot easier to just be friends when one or the other are not single.

[casmith07]

just don't tell your wife?

Wrong answer.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

Wrong answer.

'tis the safe answer.

What wife doesn't know won't hurt husband.

[Sam I Am]

'tis the safe answer.

What wife doesn't know won't hurt husband.

What the wife finds out can cost him dearly. Besides, cheating on your wife makes you a scumbag piece of you know what.

They way I see it, if you are interested in someone else, go ahead and file for divorce. You obviously don't truly love your wife anyhow. Just get it over with and move on.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

It's evolution, not really our fault.

Anyway, other than a select few, if you were given a shot to step out and knew under no circumstances your spouse (male or female) would find out, most would. We are programmed that way.

As that song goes, I was smokin and drinkin when she walked by, 2 minutes later I was working on my alibi

[Faerluna]

What the wife finds out can cost him dearly. Besides, cheating on your wife makes you a scumbag piece of you know what.

They way I see it, if you are interested in someone else, go ahead and file for divorce. You obviously don't truly love your wife anyhow. Just get it over with and move on.

Exactly this. Every word of it.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

In today's society, I believe it is darn near impossible to be faithful for an extended period of time. While some are, it is extremely difficult.

Unless the posters here are of a different breed, I suspect half of those pontificating are not as pure as they make themselves out to be (and that is not to say they are bad people).

[Gemini Dolly]

I would never, ever be okay with my boyfriend hanging out with his "opposite sex friend" without me being there. Thats never going to happen. It occurs all the time when friends develop into something more after awhile, so I will never be okay with my boyfriend and his female friend going out for drinks or games by themselves. Same with me. I would never hang out with my male friend alone. But, we do have an understanding that if Tony Romo comes along, IM GONE! j/p ;)

[bbgun]

In today's society, I believe it is darn near impossible to be faithful for an extended period of time. While some are, it is extremely difficult.

Unless the posters here are of a different breed, I suspect half of those pontificating are not as pure as they make themselves out to be (and that is not to say they are bad people).

Um, you do realize what the world's "oldest profession" is, don't you? Screwing around on your significant other is hardly a modern phenomenon.

[casmith07]

In today's society, I believe it is darn near impossible to be faithful for an extended period of time. While some are, it is extremely difficult.

Unless the posters here are of a different breed, I suspect half of those pontificating are not as pure as they make themselves out to be (and that is not to say they are bad people).

In short, I feel sorry for you.

[WV Cowboy]

It's evolution, not really our fault.

Anyway, other than a select few, if you were given a shot to step out and knew under no circumstances your spouse (male or female) would find out, most would. We are programmed that way.

As that song goes, I was smokin and drinkin when she walked by, 2 minutes later I was working on my alibi

In today's society, I believe it is darn near impossible to be faithful for an extended period of time. While some are, it is extremely difficult.

Unless the posters here are of a different breed, I suspect half of those pontificating are not as pure as they make themselves out to be (and that is not to say they are bad people).

I am afraid you have missed out on the beauty of a life-long love affair. Being with the one person that you wouldn't trade for anything, anybody, or any amount of money. (or an hour of sex with someone different :rolleyes: )

Over the past 35 years, I have seen things, I have had things, I have bought things, I have been given things, ... but I would not trade any of those for my wife. Of all that I have experienced over the past 35 years, she is the only thing that I absolutely want to keep.

Anything else I'll just buy another or do without.

Sometimes when I look across the room and see her sitting there talking to someone, I realize, .. she gave me her life.

I choose to remain faithful because what God has blessed us with is way better than some hour or two of infidelity.

Not worth losing what we share.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

Um, you do realize what the world's "oldest profession" is, don't you? Screwing around on your significant other is hardly a modern phenomenon.

are you implying that men only step out with hookers?

The existence of hookers and the modern day puritanical view that you have to stick only with your spouse are not tied to each other other than tangentially.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

I am afraid you have missed out on the beauty of a life-long love affair. Being with the one person that you wouldn't trade for anything, anybody, or any amount of money. (or an hour of sex with someone different :rolleyes: )

Over the past 35 years, I have seen things, I have had things, I have bought things, I have been given things, ... but I would not trade any of those for my wife. Of all that I have experienced over the past 35 years, she is the only thing that I absolutely want to keep.

Anything else I'll just buy another or do without.

Sometimes when I look across the room and see her sitting there talking to someone, I realize, .. she gave me her life.

I choose to remain faithful because what God has blessed us with is way better than some hour or two of infidelity.

Not worth losing what we share.

well good for you but if you can honestly say you have never wanted to, then you are the only guy on the planet

just because I acknowledge that stepping out exists and that it is really a puritannical and unnecessary goal, does not mean I have had intercourse with anyone except my wife since we first did it 20 years ago.

[bbgun]

are you implying that men only step out with hookers?

The existence of hookers and the modern day puritanical view that you have to stick only with your spouse are not tied to each other other than tangentially.

Not at all. Infidelity is as old as time, whether you're paying for sex or "coveting thy neighbor's wife." There's nothing remotely "modern" about succumbing to temptation. Just ask Sodom and Gomorrah.

[zrinkill]

Wow ..... I see the perv is still advocating an immoral lifestyle.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

Not at all. Infidelity is as old as time, whether you're paying for sex or "coveting thy neighbor's wife." There's nothing remotely "modern" about succumbing to temptation. Just ask Sodom and Gomorrah.

Except historically, no one cared about that, it was accepted, hell even your first oh 12 presidents at least did, except maybe for John Adams but he didn't have the opportunity George and Thomas did.

Anyway, one of the ancient leaders of our religious background, one of the pillars of judeo-christian belief, Abraham stepped out, so if can, why can't you? :p:

[CanadianCowboysFan]

Wow ..... I see the perv is still advocating an immoral lifestyle.

not at all homo, just saying judge not lest you be judged, and don't push your puritannical view of morality on others.

[bbgun]

Except historically, no one cared about that, it was accepted, hell even your first oh 12 presidents at least did, except maybe for John Adams but he didn't have the opportunity George and Thomas did.

Anyway, one of the ancient leaders of our religious background, one of the pillars of judeo-christian belief, Abraham stepped out, so if can, why can't you? :p:

I really gotta brush up on my Bible. There had to be a reason God flooded the Earth.

[bbgun]

not at all homo, just saying judge not lest you be judged, and don't push your puritannical view of morality on others.

In CCF's world, puritanical = honoring your vows.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

In CCF's world, puritanical = honoring your vows.

it means being judgmental, which most of you clearly are, but remember you all have skeletons in your closets and those who live in glass houses, probably shouldn't throw stones

in the end, it won't have any effect on you if the guy or girl next door steps out, so why do you care?

[CanadianCowboysFan]

I really gotta brush up on my Bible. There had to be a reason God flooded the Earth.

no religious talk here

[zrinkill]

In CCF's world, puritanical = honoring your vows.

:laugh2:

He is the same guy who thinks its ok to film women through a peephole.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

:laugh2:

He is the same guy who thinks its ok to film women through a peephole.

damn you lie alot

I said I saw the video, never that I agreed it is ok to film through a peephole, big difference but for a troll like you, you can't tell the difference

[zrinkill]

damn you lie alot

I said I saw the video, never that I agreed it is ok to film through a peephole, big difference but for a troll like you, you can't tell the difference

http://cowboyszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=181043&highlight=peephole

Anyone who reads this can see you were a ok with it ..... you even called those who would not watch it "uptight".

But keep making excuses.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

2 points

1- what kind of a sick demented individual cares enough to pull up old threads (hell the fact you remember there was a thread like that is sick enough)

2- how dumb do you have to be to pull up a thread like that to try and prove a point yet fail tremendously

[bbgun]

no religious talk here

Amen to that.

[bbgun]

it means being judgmental, which most of you clearly are, but remember you all have skeletons in your closets and those who live in glass houses, probably shouldn't throw stones

in the end, it won't have any effect on you if the guy or girl next door steps out, so why do you care?

Glass houses? I'm not the one trying to rationalize cheating on my wife.

[Cowboyslife]

What the wife finds out can cost him dearly. Besides, cheating on your wife makes you a scumbag piece of you know what.

They way I see it, if you are interested in someone else, go ahead and file for divorce. You obviously don't truly love your wife anyhow. Just get it over with and move on.

What if you don't ever want to see that mistress again?

[zrinkill]

2 points

1- what kind of sick immoral individual likes watching peeping tom videos and adultery?

2- How dumb do you have to be to think anyone would forget your sick views .... even when you try to deny them?

[zrinkill]

I'm not the one trying to rationalize cheating on my wife.

I think that is point 3.

:laugh2:

[ScipioCowboy]

Ghandi, "48 times this year, and still no self control." :D

And this coming from Mr. Is-it-a-look-up-or-a-look-down-menu?

:laugh2:

[UnoDallas]

yea at one time will living in Dallas area I had loads of gal friends - most we Lesbains - an we had some wild wondeful times together

oh by the way I am straight

but was never againest having a three way

lol - one was a bartender at lesbain bar omg the stories I could tell

[CanadianCowboysFan]

Glass houses? I'm not the one trying to rationalize cheating on my wife.

not rationalizing, just accepting it happens and not judging, doesn't make the person who steps out a bad person, just human

[casmith07]

not rationalizing, just accepting it happens and not judging, doesn't make the person who steps out a bad person, just human

No, it makes them a bad person, and someone that lacks will power or intestinal fortitude to do the right thing.

[SaltwaterServr]

And this coming from Mr. Is-it-a-look-up-or-a-look-down-menu?

:laugh2:

Oh lawdy, I had forgotten about her until now. :lmao2:

[big dog cowboy]

I would never hang out with my male friend alone. But, we do have an understanding that if Tony Romo comes along, IM GONE! j/p ;)
My wife tells me the same thing about Troy Aikman.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

No, it makes them a bad person, and someone that lacks will power or intestinal fortitude to do the right thing.

George Washington, Abraham, John Kennedy, Thomas Jefferson, Dwight Eisenhower, Chief Justice Jackson etc were all bad people?

[WV Cowboy]

just because I acknowledge that stepping out exists and that it is really a puritannical and unnecessary goal

Does this statement mean that you think remaining faithful is an unnecessary goal?

[casmith07]

I think this thread has run its course.

[CanadianCowboysFan]

Does this statement mean that you think remaining faithful is an unnecessary goal?

pretty much as I believe you can still be a good husband and wife even if you do step out, doesn't make you a bad person or incapable of having a good family

[zrinkill]

pretty much as I believe you can still be a good husband and wife even if you do step out, doesn't make you a bad person or incapable of having a good family

:lmao:

[Teren_Kanan]

Posted by Zrinkill:
1- what kind of sick immoral individual likes watching peeping tom videos and adultery?

/raises hand.

There is a whole genre of porn based on this. Even a series called "cheating spouses".

Posted by CanadianCowboysFan:

George Washington, Abraham, John Kennedy, Thomas Jefferson, Dwight Eisenhower, Chief Justice Jackson etc were all bad people?

Everything I've read about them seems to indicate they were very good/iconic people. But how can it be true??? Some of them were admitted adulterers !

Posted by Zrinkill:
Wow ..... I see the perv is still advocating an immoral lifestyle.

Morals. 100% relative. Everyone on the planet has different morals, even if they share a large majority of them with someone else, you will almost always find a spot where 2 people disagree on what is "morally" acceptable.

Posted by bbgun:
I really gotta brush up on my Bible. There had to be a reason God flooded the Earth.

He said "Historically". Bible ≠ History.

Posted by bbgun:
In CCF's world, puritanical = honoring your vows.

Don't get me wrong here. On this point I'm arguing just for the sake of it, but not everyone has the same vows, and not everyone even has vows when they get married. You can get married in a courthouse with no vows if you prefer. in CCF's world, puritanical = the view that everyone should have the same vows/morals based on religious opinions.

posted by CCF:
pretty much as I believe you can still be a good husband and wife even if you do step out, doesn't make you a bad person or incapable of having a good family

Still fighting the good fight eh CCF? I think I like you.

I have to agree here.

There are cultures in this world where infidelity is not looked upon nearly as harshly as our western culture, for good reason. There are plenty of studies and evidence that show in a culture where 100% fidelity is expected, the average relationship lasts a much shorter amount of time, and there is generally far more fighting/arguing in them.

In some cultures (Japan, France, somewhat, and perhaps others I am unaware of), as long as the man is married to them, loves them (even if he has some emotional connection with other women), and plans to keep things stable, they leave him alone to entertain himself with others from time to time. That is not to say these things are 100% acceptable by everyone in these countries, but it's just not viewed as negatively as it is here in America.

To be clear, I am not advocating for EITHER side of the debate. I simply see both sides and don't have a problem with either of them. I've been with my girl for 5 years now and have never cheated, and I don't plan to. I'm with a girl who wouldn't want me to cheat, and so I won't. I love her more than anything so to me it's worth it.

But I certainly feel Love and Sex do not have to be related, and cheating on my GF does not mean I will feel any less love for her than I do now. I can also HONESTLY say that if I found out my GF cheated on me, and there was nothing ongoing (emotionally) with the other man, I could forgive her. I would prefer her never letting me find out, but that's more because we (Humans) are jealous by nature. I'd be more upset with the fact that I found out than the fact that it happened.
I'd have far more of a problem with finding out my GF was emotionally attached to another man, than I would finding out she simply had sex with with someone else.

To each their own though

[bbgun]

Everything I've read about them seems to indicate they were very good/iconic people. But how can it be true??? Some of them were admitted adulterers !

Believe it or not, you can be an effective statesman and a horrible human being at the same time. As Newsweek put it, JFK was pond scum.

Don't get me wrong here. On this point I'm arguing just for the sake of it, but not everyone has the same vows, and not everyone even has vows when they get married. You can get married in a courthouse with no vows if you prefer. in CCF's world, puritanical = the view that everyone should have the same vows/morals based on religious opinions.

You don't think his wife expected fidelity when she said "I do"? Let's ask her, shall we?

[zrinkill]

/raises hand.

Another one ...... :laugh2:

You and canadianboy should start a club.

[Teren_Kanan]

Believe it or not, you can be an effective statesman and a horrible human being at the same time. As Newsweek put it, JFK was pond scum.



You don't think his wife expected fidelity when she said "I do"? Let's ask her, shall we?

Who's wife are we speaking about again?

[DallasEast]

I think this thread has run its course.
Eee yep.