Hate to say it but...Raper is the best QB in NFL

[juck]

He wins. He has a Horrid Oline. He still is clutch and cannot be brought down. He extends plays like no other. He is stronger then all others. I hate him as a man but he is the best QB in the NFL right now. Brady is exposed when he gets pressure. Brees is great too, But this guy is just unbeatable at times. That said I really hope they lose.If steelers get 7 my life will be getting harder.lol.

[187beatdown]

He wins. He has a Horrid Oline. He still is clutch and cannot be brought down. He extends plays like no other. He is stronger then all others. I hate him as a man but he is the best QB in the NFL right now. Brady is exposed when he gets pressure. Brees is great too, But this guy is just unbeatable at times. That said I really hope they lose.If steelers get 7 my life will be getting harder.lol.

Are you kidding me?

Brady is the best QB in the NFL hands down and I would love to see your argument against that.

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

:lmao:

[FootballFan1]

He wins. He has a Horrid Oline. He still is clutch and cannot be brought down. He extends plays like no other. He is stronger then all others. I hate him as a man but he is the best QB in the NFL right now. Brady is exposed when he gets pressure. Brees is great too, But this guy is just unbeatable at times. That said I really hope they lose.If steelers get 7 my life will be getting harder.lol.

Even taking Brady and Manning out of the equation, Big Ben the best QB??

Whatever you are drinking, please pass me a glass.

I do think you will get past the Jets, but not GB.

[kristie]

oh great....:laugh2:

[MarionBarberThe4th]

But this guy is just unbeatable at times.


Like, 60% of the time he is unbeatable.

[rkell87]

ill take seven others in a draft right this second including brady who i hate

[Go Big D!]

He wins. He has a Horrid Oline. He still is clutch and cannot be brought down. He extends plays like no other. He is stronger then all others. I hate him as a man but he is the best QB in the NFL right now. Brady is exposed when he gets pressure. Brees is great too, But this guy is just unbeatable at times. That said I really hope they lose.If steelers get 7 my life will be getting harder.lol.

http://www.iamletired.com/forums/images/smilies/BooThisMan.gif

[Shneek814]

I hate to agree but I do. This is a What Have You Done Lately league and he's a winner, especially in the playoffs. He doesn't have the greatest talent but he makes it work. That bomb to No Name Brown the other day was right on the money and at a point when it mattered the most. Call me drunk but as a football player, I would take him over anybody QB in the league right now. This is coming from a Cowboy fan who lives an hour away from Pittsburgh and despises the Steelers and their hardheaded fanbase. I know they get a lot of calls, I know they have a great defense, I know they have a great coach, but when they turn to him to get a game winning drive, he always seems to come through.

[tyke1doe]

Brady
Manning

Roethlisberger

[Hostile]

:lmao2:

Oh wait, you were serious?

[Shneek814]

:lmao2:

Oh wait, you were serious?

He already has more Super Bowls than Manning. It's a fair argument in my opinion. Maybe not the fantasy QB Manning and Brady are.

[juck]

Are you kidding me?

Brady is the best QB in the NFL hands down and I would love to see your argument against that.
Proof is in the pudding. U saw Brady Sunday fold. WHen he gets pressure he crumbles. Raper does not fold.

[juck]

:lmao2:

Oh wait, you were serious?

The guy does not fold. He is gonna have 3 rings very soon. Denial is hard bro i know.

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

Hes not even top 5.

Brady, Manning, Brees, Romo, Rodgers, Vick, Rivers are all better.

[juck]

I hate to agree but I do. This is a What Have You Done Lately league and he's a winner, especially in the playoffs. He doesn't have the greatest talent but he makes it work. That bomb to No Name Brown the other day was right on the money and at a point when it mattered the most. Call me drunk but as a football player, I would take him over anybody QB in the league right now. This is coming from a Cowboy fan who lives an hour away from Pittsburgh and despises the Steelers and their hardheaded fanbase. I know they get a lot of calls, I know they have a great defense, I know they have a great coach, but when they turn to him to get a game winning drive, he always seems to come through.

Exactly. How someone not see this? He has an accurate cannon. He can run. He is almost impossible to bring down. Lookout when the line breaks down which it does 90% of the time cause its backyard football and this man is the best at it. He is a winner. And thats all he is on the field anyway. Only way to stop this dude would be to break his legs. He is a beast.Brady and Manning are wussies. Romo isnt even in the wussie category yet,he folds like a 2 dollar beach chair lol.If u would put Hos behind Pats line or Colts line he would do decent.lol.However name me one QB to take a team this far every year with maybe the worst line in the NFL.

[juck]

Hes not even top 5.

Brady, Manning, Brees, Romo, Rodgers, Vick, Rivers are all better.
Keep thinking that. :rolleyes: As Raper fills his hands with rings. Clutch after clutch play. I hate admitting this cause I hate this guy more then any player ever. But it is what it is.

[juck]

He is currently 9-2 in playoffs. Thats sick.

[RoyTheHammer]

Are you kidding me?

Brady is the best QB in the NFL hands down and I would love to see your argument against that.

Brady isn't hands down better than Manning.

[RoyTheHammer]

Like, 60% of the time he is unbeatable.

Everytime.

[187beatdown]

Brady isn't hands down better than Manning.

I think that Manning will retire as the best QB ever but as far as this year goes I have to give it to Brady.

[RoyTheHammer]

He is currently 9-2 in playoffs. Thats sick.

Hard to overlook that. He's not far off from the elite level. He brings his A game in the playoffs. I'd be willing to bet his postseason QB rating is close if not above Manning and Brady.

He's CLEARLY better than Vick, Romo, Ryan, and Rivers. Not better than Manning or Brady yet though, imo.

All that said.. he's still a loser.

[RoyTheHammer]

I think that Manning will retire as the best QB ever but as far as this year goes I have to give it to Brady.

If you're just going by this season, then yes Brady was better. Didn't understand your first post, my bad.

[Shneek814]

Keep thinking that. :rolleyes: As Raper fills his hands with rings. Clutch after clutch play. I hate admitting this cause I hate this guy more then any player ever. But it is what it is.


If i could stand the guy, I would rather have Roethlisberger than Romo. Also, Rodgers and Rivers and maybe even Ryan. I think they're the future of the NFL. Funny how they all start with R's. Its not funny that Romo is the oldest of them. Right behind them, the next future is Freeman, Bradford, and Stafford. Just my 2 cents.

[juck]

Brady isn't hands down better than Manning.
Brady and Peyton are soft when the pressure comes.

[juck]

If i could stand the guy, I would rather have Roethlisberger than Romo. Also, Rodgers and Rivers and maybe even Ryan. I think they're the future of the NFL. Funny how they all start with R's. Its not funny that Romo is the oldest of them. Right behind them, the next future is Freeman, Bradford, and Stafford. Just my 2 cents.
I know Raper is a u know what. However you dont gets rings for being a nice guy.Romo isnt in the same stratosphere as Raper. the Raper has heart and grit and skill. A real football player.He flips pressure off his shoulder like a flea.

[MarionBarberThe4th]

So Romo doesnt rape people therefore he isnt tough enough?

Mods, please move this to the fan zone for more traffic.

[Shneek814]

So Romo doesnt rape people therefore he isnt tough enough?

Mods, please move this to the fan zone for more traffic.

His size gives him an advantage over other QBs. He will never lose his size but Romo will lose his quickness one day. I think Ben will be better in the long run because he is the better pure passer than Romo.

[juck]

I know Raper is a u know what.Romo is a nice guy, However you dont gets rings for being a nice guy.Romo isnt in the same stratosphere as Raper. The Raper has heart and grit and skill. A real football player.He flips pressure off his shoulder like a flea.

Im saying the person Raper is sucks but on field he is the man. Romo is a great guy but folds on field often.

[Hostile]

He already has more Super Bowls than Manning. It's a fair argument in my opinion. Maybe not the fantasy QB Manning and Brady are.Terry Bradshaw has 4 Super Bowls. Was he a better QB than Roger Staubach? Better than Aikman? Better than Elway? Better than Marino? Better than Brady? Better than Peyton?

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

Hard to overlook that. He's not far off from the elite level. He brings his A game in the playoffs. I'd be willing to bet his postseason QB rating is close if not above Manning and Brady.

He's CLEARLY better than Vick, Romo, Ryan, and Rivers. Not better than Manning or Brady yet though, imo.

All that said.. he's still a loser.

How is he clearly better than Vick, Romo, Rivers, and Ryan?

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

Brady isn't hands down better than Manning.

Yes he is.

[Shneek814]

Terry Bradshaw has 4 Super Bowls. Was he a better QB than Roger Staubach? Better than Aikman? Better than Elway? Better than Marino? Better than Brady? Better than Peyton?

I can't say I was born in 84. Maybe that was a bad reference saying Big Ben has more rings than Manning. Aikman is a big reason for being a Cowboys fan but I dont think he was as good as Marino and he has no rings. I guess it just comes down to what you think a great QB is? Stats, winning %, rings? I dont really think there is a right or wrong answer and that is why we debate these kind of things.

[RoyTheHammer]

Yes he is.

:rolleyes:

[hutch1254]

Terry and Ben have had the privilege to put rings on their fingers because of the elite defenses that both of them have had. Those D teams have carried those Steeler teams to championships. Terry and Ben of course made some plays here and there when they were needed but hands down the D carries the day for those teams. It's the Steeler way and always has been.

Manning has never had an elite D at any point in his career. Brady has had some decent defenses but has won championships with a bunch of no names off the street rotating in and out year after year. Brees is a stat machine with a robot arm after his post San Diego shoulder surgery.

Ben has made his share of poor decisions. However, I think they don't stand out as much because the D he has had has been able to cover up a lot of those turnovers/decisions and make them irrelevant to the outcome of the game. Brady and Manning do not have that luxury and when they do make a poor decision or have a turnover they are especially magnified.

Hell Ben's rookie year the Pittsburgh OC admitted they were trying to limit his throws to 15 to 18 a game because they knew they had a great D and decent run game and could fall back on them. Next thing you know the Seahawks are filing a police report for stolen jewelery at the super bowl.

Pittsburgh plays tough D, keeps games close, limits mistakes and come 4th quarter puts themselves into position to win a FG game. They are not afraid to play a 13-10 game and because they're experienced at it they often seem to land on the winning side.

I might be talking out my backside but that's how I feel.

[Hostile]

I can't say I was born in 84. Maybe that was a bad reference saying Big Ben has more rings than Manning. Aikman is a big reason for being a Cowboys fan but I dont think he was as good as Marino and he has no rings. I guess it just comes down to what you think a great QB is? Stats, winning %, rings? I dont really think there is a right or wrong answer and that is why we debate these kind of things.Peyton Manning comes to the Steelers or Pig Pen goes to the Colts.

You're the Head Coach. Who are you going to start? If you say Ruthlessraper I will be shocked. No QB can do what Manning does. The Steelers are a better team than the Colts. Therein lies the difference.

[Shneek814]

Peyton Manning comes to the Steelers or Pig Pen goes to the Colts.

You're the Head Coach. Who are you going to start? If you say Ruthlessraper I will be shocked. No QB can do what Manning does. The Steelers are a better team than the Colts. Therein lies the difference.

You can't say the Steelers are a better team. They're just a different style of team. RuthlessRaper has never had the offensive talent that Indy has always had. So then it becomes a different argument. Great offense or great defense? Manning is a genius and will be known as probably the greatest ever but it just seems he's on the other side of the peak now along with Brady and Brees. They will still be good for at least 3 to 5 years but I personally dont think they'll be as great as they once were. On the other hand, I think Ben hasn't hit his prime yet. So considering age and I had one to pick one QB to build a franchise around, I would have a tougher decision choosing between Big Ben and Rodgers than Manning or Brady. Call me crazy but I just think they are the better QB TODAY!

[Go Big D!]

How is he clearly better than Vick, Romo, Rivers, and Ryan?

He's not and it can't be substantiated.
It's clearly the case of somebody talking out their backcrack.

[RoyTheHammer]

He's not and it can't be substantiated.
It's clearly the case of somebody talking out their backcrack.

Postseason success. None of those other guys have much, if any.

Raper is 9-2 and has 2 super bowls to his name already.

Don't get butthurt.. its just a message board.

[Go Big D!]

Postseason success. None of those other guys have much, if any.

Raper is 9-2 and has 2 super bowls to his name already.

I've already made a post showing the great QBs that have never been to the SB vs the Brad Johnson's/Trent Dilfers that did.

Sorry that's not a measuring stick of ability. Next.


nice edit there, lol.
but don't flatter yourself. You're just a name on the internet to me.

[RoyTheHammer]

I've already made a post showing the great QBs that have never been to the SB vs the Brad Johnson's/Trent Dilfers that did.

Sorry that's not a measuring stick of ability. Next.

What are Brad Johnson and Trent Dilfers career postseason records?

Ben has proved he wasn't a one hit wonder.

9-2.

[RoyTheHammer]

The point is, all those guys you mentioned are very good QB's.

But consistent postseason success is definately something that turns very good QB's into greats.

[Go Big D!]

What are Brad Johnson and Trent Dilfers career postseason records?

Ben has proved he wasn't a one hit wonder.

9-2.

No but there's nothing there to say he's clearly better than the others.
By your standards he's "clearly" better than Brees.

[MarionBarberThe4th]

The Colts would be picking #2 or #3 overall if they had Rapeface.

Peyton took a team of scrubs to the #3 seed.

Rapeface couldnt get his team to the playoffs last year.

[RoyTheHammer]

No but there's nothing there to say he's clearly better than the others.
By your standards he's "clearly" better than Brees.

He has a comparable QB rating to the others, and is clutch and wins in the postseason consistently.

That's just what i think puts him above Ryan, Rivers, Romo right now.

Things can obviously change though.

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

:rolleyes:

Let me rephrase that, Brady was clearly better this year.

[Shneek814]

I think alot of people are basing their QB judgement because they hate the guy. I HATE BIG BEN. But Im not blind to the fact that he wins and wins in the playoffs. Consistent playoff success is how a QB is realistically ranked. You think Aikman would be in the Hall of Fame without those three rings? Not even close. He had a great defense too and maybe the best Oline of all time. It hurts me to compare Big Ben and Aikman but I'm not a homer fan and Aikman statistically wasn't a great QB. He just won.

[burmafrd]

That first ring belongs to his D. Remember the rapist set a record for lowest QB rating ever for a SB winner? And his D has bailed his raping rear end out time and again. Now the last SB they won he did have that drive and that was clutch. But a lot of the time that team wins because of its D and not him. They were 3-1 early this season with scrubs as QBs.

[jimmy40]

That first ring belongs to his D. Remember the rapist set a record for lowest QB rating ever for a SB winner? And his D has bailed his raping rear end out time and again. Now the last SB they won he did have that drive and that was clutch. But a lot of the time that team wins because of its D and not him. They were 3-1 early this season with scrubs as QBs.
I guess one of Aikman's rings belongs to Bernie Kosar

[Shneek814]

I guess one of Aikman's rings belongs to Bernie Kosar

I actually compared their stats and Pig Pen is not far from Aikman's numbers and in just half the time.

[Sam I Am]

He wins. He has a Horrid Oline. He still is clutch and cannot be brought down. He extends plays like no other. He is stronger then all others. I hate him as a man but he is the best QB in the NFL right now. Brady is exposed when he gets pressure. Brees is great too, But this guy is just unbeatable at times. That said I really hope they lose.If steelers get 7 my life will be getting harder.lol.

May you burn in hell. Never come back to CZ again or face death by electrocution.

[Doomsday101]

He wins. He has a Horrid Oline. He still is clutch and cannot be brought down. He extends plays like no other. He is stronger then all others. I hate him as a man but he is the best QB in the NFL right now. Brady is exposed when he gets pressure. Brees is great too, But this guy is just unbeatable at times. That said I really hope they lose.If steelers get 7 my life will be getting harder.lol.

Not sure how bad the line is when Ben holds on to the ball forever. It leads to many of the sacks he ends up taking, the upside because he does hold on to the ball it allows his WR to get free.

[juck]

Peyton Manning comes to the Steelers or Pig Pen goes to the Colts.

You're the Head Coach. Who are you going to start? If you say Ruthlessraper I will be shocked. No QB can do what Manning does. The Steelers are a better team than the Colts. Therein lies the difference.
Peyton Manning wouldnt last two games with that crap Oline. Please.Manning is different then Raper. Manning is smarter. Manning also folds. Raper does not.

[juck]

I think alot of people are basing their QB judgement because they hate the guy. I HATE BIG BEN. But Im not blind to the fact that he wins and wins in the playoffs. Consistent playoff success is how a QB is realistically ranked. You think Aikman would be in the Hall of Fame without those three rings? Not even close. He had a great defense too and maybe the best Oline of all time. It hurts me to compare Big Ben and Aikman but I'm not a homer fan and Aikman statistically wasn't a great QB. He just won.
Thank You. Its killing me that this team is probably gonna get their 7th in our stadium to boot. I live here in pittsburgh. I have to hear it everyday of my life since 1978. I hate the Steelers more then any other sports franchise. Either or Raper is the QB I take. The guy is the epitomy of a nightmare for a defense. Fact is right now he is the best all around clutch QB in the last few years.

[Sam I Am]

Peyton Manning wouldnt last two games with that crap Oline. Please.Manning is different then Raper. Manning is smarter. Manning also folds. Raper does not.

DIE DIE DIE!!!!

[Shneek814]

DIE DIE DIE!!!!

Why do you hate him so much?

[Sam I Am]

Why do you hate him so much?

I hate the stealers and anyone who supports them in any form or fashion! :mad:

[mldardy]

That first ring belongs to his D. Remember the rapist set a record for lowest QB rating ever for a SB winner? And the refs bailed his raping rear end out time and again. Now the last SB they won he did have that drive and that was clutch. But a lot of the time that team wins because of its D and not him. They were 3-1 early this season with scrubs as QBs.
Fixed

[CowboysFaninBaltimore]

I got a feeling the Steelers are gonna win every year!

[Vtwin]

Are you kidding me?

Brady is the best QB in the NFL hands down and I would love to see your argument against that.

No way.

Brady is great when everything goes his way. He cannot get it done when he has to pick up any slack like Ruthlessraper.

Romo is a much better QB then Brady all things considered.

[danielofthesaints]

This thread bothers me with its lack of factual evidence. So you say that Big Ben is not soft like the rest of the league under pressure and is in his own dimension of elite QB's. Well then, lets look at his playoff stats then if you want to calculate pressure.

2004: First Round Bye, Won against NY Jets, Lost to NE Patriots in Conference Championship
Total Pass Attempts: 54
Total Completions: 31
Total Pass %: 57.41
TD: 3
INT: 5
Overall QB rating: 67.95

2005: W @ cincy, W @ Indy, W @ Denver, W vs Seahawks (super bowl champions)
Total Pass Attempts: 93
Total Completions: 58
Total Pass %: 62.36
TD: 7
INT: 3
Overall QB Rating: 97.8 ( Had a 22.9 rating in the superbowl)
2007: Lost to Jax in wildcard at home
Total Pass Attempts: 42
Total Completions: 29
Total Pass %: 69
TD: 2
INT: 3
Overall QB Rating: 79.2
2008: Win vs San Diego, Win vs Baltimore, Win vs Cardinals (SB Champions)
Total Pass Attempts: 89
Total Completions: 54
Total Pass %: 60.67
TD: 3
INT: 1
Overall Qb rating: 92.1
2010: in progress

Conclusion: Here is another case of a team being carried by their defense. Roethlisberger is not an elite QB. He is a good QB. He is a QB who's being piggybacked by the Steelers defense to obtain any amount of glory he can get.

[Sam I Am]

What is that pungent smell in this thread? :laugh2:

[RoyTheHammer]

This thread bothers me with its lack of factual evidence. So you say that Big Ben is not soft like the rest of the league under pressure and is in his own dimension of elite QB's. Well then, lets look at his playoff stats then if you want to calculate pressure.

2004: First Round Bye, Won against NY Jets, Lost to NE Patriots in Conference Championship
Total Pass Attempts: 54
Total Completions: 31
Total Pass %: 57.41
TD: 3
INT: 5
Overall QB rating: 67.95

2005: W @ cincy, W @ Indy, W @ Denver, W vs Seahawks (super bowl champions)
Total Pass Attempts: 93
Total Completions: 58
Total Pass %: 62.36
TD: 7
INT: 3
Overall QB Rating: 97.8 ( Had a 22.9 rating in the superbowl)
2007: Lost to Jax in wildcard at home
Total Pass Attempts: 42
Total Completions: 29
Total Pass %: 69
TD: 2
INT: 3
Overall QB Rating: 79.2
2008: Win vs San Diego, Win vs Baltimore, Win vs Cardinals (SB Champions)
Total Pass Attempts: 89
Total Completions: 54
Total Pass %: 60.67
TD: 3
INT: 1
Overall Qb rating: 92.1
2010: in progress

Conclusion: Here is another case of a team being carried by their defense. Roethlisberger is not an elite QB. He is a good QB. He is a QB who's being piggybacked by the Steelers defense to obtain any amount of glory he can get.

You make it sound like he's "using" his defense for his own personal gain.

Its a team man.

Brady would be nothing without the teams he was around when he won his super bowls (and the cheating that was being done). Seems some fail to remember how good the Pats defenses were.

Is Brady not a great QB? Because since they stopped cheating he's done nothing.

Roughraper has a passer rating that rivals Brady's and Manning's in the postseason, and his winning percentage in the postseason is above even Brady's.

[greg08]

Hes not even top 5.

Brady, Manning, Brees, Romo, Rodgers, Vick, Rivers are all better.
vick is better than ben? what time did you start drinking today?

[Aven8]

I'd take him.

LMAO at all the guys that think Ben is not pretty darn good.

[Sam I Am]

I'd take him.

LMAO at all the guys that think Ben is not pretty darn good.

He sucks, so shutup!

[FootballFan1]

I hate to say it but this post is just over the top ridiculous.

To say that Big Ben is the best QB in the league is ridiculous.

Even taking Brady out of the equation, he is better than Manning??? Hello, are you nuts???

The problem with football fans is they mostly follow their own team and are really clueless about other teams except for what has recently happened. And that I guess is OK, but please it really is a bit over the top.

I am not saying that Big Ben is a lousy QB, but the best????????????

Oh well, whatever.

[Shneek814]

I put him in the elite level as of today. He rapes and he wins ships. Not a lot of people can do that.

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

I put him in the elite level as of today. He rapes and he wins ships. Not a lot of people can do that.

LOL who else has done that?

[Shneek814]

LOL who else has done that?

Lawrence Taylor comes to mind. lol. Kobe Bryant.

[DFWJC]

Good grief...here we go again.

Come on!

[true blue]

Lawrence Taylor comes to mind. lol. Kobe Bryant.
:bow:

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

Lawrence Taylor comes to mind. lol. Kobe Bryant.
Lmao even though I'm a Lakers fan that's pretty funny.

[Go Big D!]

Well here ya go, this will make all the Rapistburger buds all giddy & happy....


you were right. Not only is he the best QB in the league he's already slated for the HoF.

The media tells me it's so. (http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/ben-roethlisberger-hall-of-fame-011711)



Sorry, nyc, it's right there in print :laugh2:

[kristie]

Lawrence Taylor comes to mind. lol. Kobe Bryant.


ahhhhhh..:lmao:

[tyke1doe]

Lawrence Taylor comes to mind. lol. Kobe Bryant.

Kobe found a willing participant, just one not his wife. :o:

[juck]

Raper does it when it counts.

[DFWJC]

Raper does it when it counts.
You can keep you knee-pads out for at least 2 more weeks it looks loike.
slurp-slurp:laugh2:

[brooksey1]

Hes not even top 5.

Brady, Manning, Brees, Romo, Rodgers, Vick, Rivers are all better.

Laughable. He is top 3 with Brady and Manning, Brees is next. He does not have the grace but he makes big plays in big spots, he knows how to win the big one, he has it. Big Ben will be shooting for his 3rd Superbowl Ring in 6 years, not to shabby.

[hornitosmonster]

There are a lot of crackhead Cowboys fans. :lmao2:

[brooksey1]

He wins. He has a Horrid Oline. He still is clutch and cannot be brought down. He extends plays like no other. He is stronger then all others. I hate him as a man but he is the best QB in the NFL right now. Brady is exposed when he gets pressure. Brees is great too, But this guy is just unbeatable at times. That said I really hope they lose.If steelers get 7 my life will be getting harder.lol.

Could have just called him Big Ben, he never was charged with rape. He did it with some chick in a bathroom at a bar. Get over it.

[WV Cowboy]

Could have just called him Big Ben, he never was charged with rape. He did it with some chick in a bathroom at a bar. Get over it.

the thing is she didn't want to do it with him, ... that's rape.

And it wasn't just once, .. two have come forward now and pressed charges, (only to be bought off) and more are saying he did it to them while in college at Miami.

If I was a single guy and had $100,000,000, I would have an actress or a model on a yacht, not a college coed in a bathroom in a bar.

Open your eyes, he raped those girls.

[BanditHiro]

There are a lot of crackhead Cowboys fans. :lmao2:

its just fear and anger...it has made everybody delusional. this is one of the worst case scenario SB match-ups imaginable and so its just hard to swallow.

[BanditHiro]

Laughable. He is top 3 with Brady and Manning, Brees is next. He does not have the grace but he makes big plays in big spots, he knows how to win the big one, he has it. Big Ben will be shooting for his 3rd Superbowl Ring in 6 years, not to shabby.

because of the stealers defense...you can basically put any of the above average-good qbs in the league and they will have success with the team they have built there. he is a good qb but you are giving him way to much credit

[WackoGirl]

Hes not even top 5.

Brady, Manning, Brees, Romo, Rodgers, Vick, Rivers are all better.

Romo, Rivers, and Vick are not better quarterbacks than Ben

[SultanOfSix]

Rapistburger wins nothing without the D he's had over the years, the refs in the first SB, and the fact that he's on the Stealers.

[tyke1doe]

because of the stealers defense...you can basically put any of the above average-good qbs in the league and they will have success with the team they have built there. he is a good qb but you are giving him way to much credit

First, there's no way to prove that.

Second, who among those above average-good qbs is as strong in the pocket as Big Ben is? Brees? No. Rivers? No. Romo? No. Vick? No.

There's not a good quarterback in the league who makes the plays Big Ben does with guys hanging around him. He's extremely difficult to bring down, and he's always looking to pass first.

Third, the Steelers have always had tough defenses. Yet in the 90s, they couldn't win a Super Bowl because they have an average quarterback. They've won two with Big Ben. Yes, the Steelers defense is great. But that's all the time it seems. You still need the quarterback to score, and that more than the other team scores.

[tyke1doe]

Rapistburger wins nothing without the D he's had over the years, the refs in the first SB, and the fact that he's on the Stealers.

The Steelers, with their great defense, gifted the Cowboys the game with two interceptions by Neil O'Donnel.

The Steelers have always had a great defense. Now, they have the quarterback who can put that defense over the top, i.e., the top to a Super Bowl win.

[Gemini Dolly]

I would rather have Manning, Brady, Brees, Rivers, and Rodgers before Ben. Hes a good QB, but not the greatest.

[Clove]

It's funny cause Aikman was just a winner. He had a great team around him, and elite line and a dominant running back. The thing is, we don't know if Aikman could've put up monster numbers because he was never in that type of offense.

Big Ben is not in that type of offense. Brady and Manning would probably have comparable numbers if they played for Pitilfulburgh, they would probably hate that offense cause they don't get to fling it around all over the world.

I hate to say this, but the Steelers are building a dynasty because they play BALANCED offense. Quick hitting teams never keep up the good work for long, but teams who grind it out, and play hard nosed defense stay on top.

I'm glad everyone's falling in love with the Stat guys, and the huge numbers guys, but those guys don't win Super Bowls consistently.

I never start threads but if I did, I'd ask the question. Which QB would you rather have, -Winner- or -excellent QB who puts up monster numbers-

I'll take the winner. I like to win personally.

[Austin 3-16]

The reason people dont give Ben his due props is cause he isnt a pure breed "stand and deliver" quarterback. The Jets knew they couldnt defend which is why they were so queit during the week.

[burmafrd]

he is tough I will give him that. His lousy O line certainly does not do a good job of protecting him. Sooner or later he will be seriously injured.

[SultanOfSix]

The Steelers, with their great defense, gifted the Cowboys the game with two interceptions by Neil O'Donnel.

I see. It's the Steelers' "gifted" the 'Boys when it suits your argument, but it's not the Cowboys should have been up by three TDs in the first half of the SB because they kept beating themselves.


The Steelers have always had a great defense. Now, they have the quarterback who can put that defense over the top, i.e., the top to a Super Bowl win.

Yes. The almighty great QB who holds the worst QB rating ever in a SB who was truly "gifted" a victory by the refs. Did it even crack 20? Please. Go home with your "clutchiness" argument. It's pathetic.

[DFWJC]

Ben has grown on me some.
He is definitely someone who the stats don't do justice to.

I wouldn't put him number 1, but he is certainly in the top 7 or so....maybe even top 5.

[WV Cowboy]

The Steelers, with their great defense, gifted the Cowboys the game with two interceptions by Neil O'Donnel.



I remember reading that the Cowboys defensive plan was to keep everything in front of them with O'Donnel, and he would make a mistake.

He liked the big play, .. he had beat the Colts in the AFC title game with the deep ball.

Our plan was to not let that happen. Make him be patient and slowly move the ball down the field until he would get impatient and make a mistake.

Which he finally did when they fell behind in the 4th qtr.

Yes, they seemed like gifts, but it was the Cowboys plan all along to force him to get impatient and make a mistake.

He fell into our trap. Good coaching.

[tyke1doe]

I see. It's the Steelers' "gifted" the 'Boys when it suits your argument, but it's not the Cowboys should have been up by three TDs in the first half of the SB because they kept beating themselves.


Suits my argument? My point is that the Steelers have always had good defenses. They just haven't always had the quarterback who could manage the game or make a play when they needed him to. O'Donnell couldn't. Big Ben can.

Second, coaching is a part of winning just as the players are. The Cowboys beat the Steelers because the Cowboys had superior talent. The Steelers didn't have superior talent. And the reason the Steelers were in the game is because the Cowboys got outcoached for much of the game. They let the Steelers back in the game.

I don't understand how that detracts from O'Donnell's gifts to the Cowboys. Did you see those two interceptions thrown directly at Larry Brown? If those weren't gifts, Santa Claus doesn't exist. ;) :laugh2:


Yes. The almighty great QB who holds the worst QB rating ever in a SB who was truly "gifted" a victory by the refs. Did it even crack 20? Please. Go home with your "clutchiness" argument. It's pathetic.

Who cares? He has two Super Bowl rings and made a clutch throw to put his team in another Super Bowl, his third in six years.

If you want stats, go check the ring fingers of Dan Fouts, Dan Marino and Tony Romo. :laugh2:

If you want a quarterback who delivers in the clutch, go look at Big Ben's hands. I think he has an extra one for you to gawk at. :D

[tyke1doe]

I remember reading that the Cowboys defensive plan was to keep everything in front of them with O'Donnel, and he would make a mistake.

He liked the big play, .. he had beat the Colts in the AFC title game with the deep ball.

Our plan was to not let that happen. Make him be patient and slowly move the ball down the field until he would get impatient and make a mistake.

Which he finally did when they fell behind in the 4th qtr.

Yes, they seemed like gifts, but it was the Cowboys plan all along to force him to get impatient and make a mistake.

He fell into our trap. Good coaching.

Had you ever seen O'Donnell throw a pass directly to a defender without a player in the zip code - twice?

Please, you're being overly generous to the Cowboys defense. No way the Cowboys thought O'Donnell (an honorary Cowboy in my book) knew O'Donnell would hit our defensive backs in the numbers - TWICE.

Larry Brown was as surprised by those passes as the Steelers were that O'Donnell threw them. The only thing those two balls need were bows.

Second, the Steelers were never out of that game. O'Donnell delivered that second interception when the Steelers were down 20-17. There was no need for him to push it deep.

Furthermore, you forget we had Deion Sanders. The strategy against the Cowboys would have been different than the strategy against the Colts.

In short, to think that the Cowboys were anticipating interceptions like the ones O'Donnell delivered is to recreate history, IMO. It would be one thing if he forced it into double coverage. But he threw to a WIDE OPEN Larry Brown, as if Brown were the intended receiver. That wasn't game planning. That was Silver Anniversary gift material. :lmao2:

[bbgun]

The Steelers, with their great defense, gifted the Cowboys the game with two interceptions by Neil O'Donnel.

The Steelers have always had a great defense. Now, they have the quarterback who can put that defense over the top, i.e., the top to a Super Bowl win.

Roethlisberger could win his third Super Bowl two weeks from now and the resident yahoos still wouldn't take him over Romo. Pray for them.

[Joshmvii]

Roethlisberger has made some clutch plays, but 100+ first half rushing yards and far and away the best defensive coordinator in football have gotten the Steelers to those 3 super bowls. Plain and simple.

They would've been crushed yesterday the way Roethlisberger played if they had anything less than the defense they have.

[WV Cowboy]

Had you ever seen O'Donnell throw a pass directly to a defender without a player in the zip code - twice?

Please, you're being overly generous to the Cowboys defense. No way the Cowboys thought O'Donnell (an honorary Cowboy in my book) knew O'Donnell would hit our defensive backs in the numbers - TWICE.

Larry Brown was as surprised by those passes as the Steelers were that O'Donnell threw them. The only thing those two balls need were bows.

Second, the Steelers were never out of that game. O'Donnell delivered that second interception when the Steelers were down 20-17. There was no need for him to push it deep.

Furthermore, you forget we had Deion Sanders. The strategy against the Cowboys would have been different than the strategy against the Colts.

In short, to think that the Cowboys were anticipating interceptions like the ones O'Donnell delivered is to recreate history, IMO. It would be one thing if he forced it into double coverage. But he threw to a WIDE OPEN Larry Brown, as if Brown were the intended receiver. That wasn't game planning. That was Silver Anniversary gift material. :lmao2:

I was just telling what I had heard, and it made sense. Still does.

So you think he meant to do that?

Or he made a mistake?

[tyke1doe]

Roethlisberger has made some clutch plays, but 100+ first half rushing yards and far and away the best defensive coordinator in football have gotten the Steelers to those 3 super bowls. Plain and simple.

They would've been crushed yesterday the way Roethlisberger played if they had anything less than the defense they have.

You mean the same defense that gave up 19 points to the Jets in the second half, and had to rely on Big Ben converting passes, including a 3 and 6 to run out the game?

Look, no one is knocking the Steelers D. But you don't just win a game on defense. You have to have a quarterback that can make a play down the stretch. There's no question Ben does that. No question.

The Steelers are the Ravens, but with a proven quarterback. Ask the Ravens how important a great quarterback is to a top-notch defense.

[wileedog]

Roethlisberger could win his third Super Bowl two weeks from now and the resident yahoos still wouldn't take him over Romo. Pray for them.

I'd like to see Romo get a chance with a competently run franchise before making the decision.

[tyke1doe]

I was just telling what I had heard, and it made sense. Still does.

So you think he meant to do that?

Or he made a mistake?

I think there was a miscommunication between his receivers and him.

But those type interceptions aren't the result of game strategy. They were miscues, and, in the Cowboys case, gifts. And we thank O'Donnell for his generosity. :lmao:

[bbgun]

I'd like to see Romo get a chance with a competently run franchise before making the decision.

Oh, me too. In fact, it's long been a dream of mine.

[bbgun]

You mean the same defense that gave up 19 points to the Jets in the second half, and had to rely on Big Ben converting passes, including a 3 and 6 to run out the game?

Look, no one is knocking the Steelers D. But you don't just win a game on defense. You have to have a quarterback that can make a play down the stretch. There's no question Ben does that. No question.

The Steelers are the Ravens, but with a proven quarterback. Ask the Ravens how important a great quarterback is to a top-notch defense.

So true. Big Ben is 10-2 in the playoffs with two Lombardis and presently working on a third. Keep telling yourself he's just a "game manager" who benefits from a great defense. A "bus driver" didn't throw a 58 yard laser to Antonio Brown last weekend with the game on the line.

[tyke1doe]

I'd like to see Romo get a chance with a competently run franchise before making the decision.

I would too. I've always saidd Romo needs to be better protected with the run game. I think Romo could be a very good quarterback, even a Super Bowl caliber one. I mean, I don't think Eli Manning is any better than Romo.

I just feel too much has been placed on Romo's shoulders too soon. There's nothing wrong with being a game manager who can make the occasional big play. I just feel more quarterbacks need to be protected with the running game. There are very few quarterbacks that can win without a running game. Elway, Aikman, Peyton Manning all relied on the running game. I feel that's why Marino doesn't have a ring. No running game.

And when Peyton Manning won it, it was because he finally trusted his running game. Remember the Baltimore Ravens 15-0 game?

Running establishes toughness. I want the Cowboys to get tougher. The Steelers are tough. Tough defense, tough running game, tough quarterback. It's no wonder they're playing their third Super Bowl under Big Ben in six years.

[Joshmvii]

You mean the same defense that gave up 19 points to the Jets in the second half, and had to rely on Big Ben converting passes, including a 3 and 6 to run out the game?

Look, no one is knocking the Steelers D. But you don't just win a game on defense. You have to have a quarterback that can make a play down the stretch. There's no question Ben does that. No question.

The Steelers are the Ravens, but with a proven quarterback. Ask the Ravens how important a great quarterback is to a top-notch defense.

The Ravens might say it's about as important as Trent Dilfer.

My post clearly said Ben has made some clutch plays. He's definitely a good QB. That being said, I still stand by my opinion that he wouldn't have a single super bowl title if he had been playing his career with say, the Colts D. The Colts managed to get one super bowl win and a bunch of playoff games because Manning is great in spite of their horrible defense. Ben has 2 going on 3 super bowl championships because he's a top 15 QB with a legend running his defense.

Without the fumble return for a TD Pittsburgh got against the Jets, the Jets would've won the game. Ben needed a defensive score to outgun Dirty Sanchez.

[tyke1doe]

So true. Big Ben is 10-2 in the playoffs with two Lombardis and presently working on a third. Keep telling yourself he's just a "game manager" who benefits from a great defense. A "bus driver" didn't throw a 58 yard laser to Antonio Brown last weekend with the game on the line.

And on the move hits the same AB to cinch the game and a Super Bowl birth.

I think the hatred of Big Ben is due to the fact that ...

1. He has questionable off-the-field behavior (which is a legitimate reason to criticize him) and
2. He's a part of the hated Steelers.

I don't want the Steelers to win another Super Bowl. But I can't deny giving credit where credit is due. Big Ben is a Big Game quarterback. Period. And the Steelers organization has been among the best in the league. They may take a few years to refuel, but they're always contending and always have a great defense.

Mr. Rooney understands the importance of stability, hiring the right coach and getting the heck out of the way until it's time to hoist a Super Bowl trophy.

[bbgun]

And on the move hits the same AB to cinch the game and a Super Bowl birth.

I think the hatred of Big Ben is due to the fact that ...

1. He has questionable off-the-field behavior (which is a legitimate reason to criticize him) and
2. He's a part of the hated Steelers.

I don't want the Steelers to win another Super Bowl. But I can't deny giving credit where credit is due. Big Ben is a Big Game quarterback. Period. And the Steelers organization has been among the best in the league. They may take a few years to refuel, but they're always contending and always have a great defense.

Mr. Rooney understands the importance of stability, hiring the right coach and getting the heck out of the way until it's time to hoist a Super Bowl trophy.

Not to mention hiring a real GM. But I guess that was "incidental" to their success. :rolleyes:

[tyke1doe]

The Ravens might say it's about as important as Trent Dilfer.

And how many Super Bowls have the Ravens been to since Dilfer? :huh:

Let's lay off the Dilfer retort. That Ravens defense was considered one of the best EVA. That Ravens defense won despite Dilfer just like the Cowboys won a Super Bowl despite Barry Switzer. I guess that proves that you don't need a competent coach to win a Super Bowl. :rolleyes:

Be that as it may, the Steelers with (clearing throat) BIG BEN ROETHLISBERGER have kept the Ravens from advancing to the Super Bowl at least two times.

You think if the Ravens had Ben and the Steelers had Flacco that it would still be the Steelers going to three Super Bowls? Pulease. Let's stop the madness.



My post clearly said Ben has made some clutch plays. He's definitely a good QB. That being said, I still stand by my opinion that he wouldn't have a single super bowl title if he had been playing his career with say, the Colts D. The Colts managed to get one super bowl win and a bunch of playoff games because Manning is great in spite of their horrible defense. Ben has 2 going on 3 super bowl championships because he's a top 15 QB with a legend running his defense.

With all due respect, this is a favorite debate strategy of posters, to reference hypotheticals and give them the same weight as actuals. We don't know what Big Ben would have done if he were with the Colts, we don't know what Peyton would have done if he had been a Steeler, etc. People are entitled to their opinions, but when they argue their hypothetical opinions as if they should be given consideration with actuals and facts, well, let's just say that's not hardly a strong comparison.

The facts are Big Ben delivers in the clutch. He has done so repeatedly.

Now, I hope he loses in two weeks. But even if he does, he still has two Super Bowl rings. And his play (the first Super Bowl notwithstanding) helped put his team into those Super Bowls. He did play superbly in a championship in Denver, throwing three touchdowns. He displayed leadership by telling Jerome Bettis "I'm going to get you to a Super Bowl."

Blaming the Steelers victory solely on the defense is silly. It's a team game. And Big Ben plays the role he's supposed to play, getting scores when the Steelers need them the most.

I don't care if a quarterback has thrown three touchdowns in a game then chokes down the stretch. Give me the quarterback who muddles his way through a game but when you absolutely need him to make a play to win a game, he does.

That's the difference between an Aikman and a Marino. Marino has the stats; Aikman has the rings.

And lest someone thinks I'm saying Aikman is better than Marino, I'm not.

But Aikman was selfless. He was willing to share the glory to get rings. From what I've read, Marino was all about the numbers. He wanted to be the man. He didn't want to yield to a running game for whatever reason because he felt he could win it with his arm.

Big Ben doesn't have the stats like Peyton and Brady, but he isn't selfish in the sense he can't give credit to whom credit is due on his team. And that's why he's on the verge of tying Brady's Super Bowl rings.

Again, give me the quarterback who makes the play when you need him to any day over the 4,000 yard 33 TD passer who chokes when the game is on the line.

Without the fumble return for a TD Pittsburgh got against the Jets, the Jets would've won the game. Ben needed a defensive score to outgun Dirty Sanchez.

We don't know that. Again, you're arguing hypotheticals that can't be measured. I could argue as convincingly that Big Ben would have found a way to come back like he always does. Remember, the Steelers merely needed to convert a 3 and 6. They didn't have to score. I'm convinced, based on his past, Ben would have delivered the winning score via TD or putting his team in position to kick the game-winning field goal.

[tyke1doe]

Not to mention hiring a real GM. But I guess that was "incidental" to their success. :rolleyes:

I was going to insert that put got caught up in immediately responding to another post. Yes, I agree. :)

[Joe Realist]

He is not the best, but he is a clutch QB and future hall of famer.

[DallasEast]

He is not the best quarterback in the NFL. That title belongs to Peyton Manning. However, he is one of the best quarterbacks in the league and plays on one of the best overall teams of the past ten years.

[WV Cowboy]

BR is a good QB, .. he is allusive, big and hard to bring down. He extends the play and makes things happen, ... but he is winning because of his defense moreso than what he does most of the time.

Some here are hailing him because of a short rollout pass to AB. True it sealed the game, but whoever called the play is the one to be applauded, not BR. Any QB in the NFL could have made that play, .. it's not like he had to thread the needle to squeeze a game-winner in there.

Other than that pass, he was 9-18 for around 120 yds, threw two picks and led the steelers to zero points in the 2nd half.

Hardly NFL lore.

Pretty handy to have your defense score a TD for you and then win by 5.

Like I said he is good, very strong in the pocket, and a good NFL QB. But those that are saying he is the best in the NFL or one of the best ever because of his rings, .. well I just don't agree.

[Mash]

Hate to say it......but Ben should be ranked equal to Troy Aikman...

The boh had a strong running game....Dallas defense wasnt strong as the Steelers but pretty close IMHO.

and if Ben wins here....he will have 3 SB's just like Aikman.

Skill set they are different....both are winners tho

Im not a fan of Ben....but he wins....you have to put him up there with Aikman and the likes.

[DFWJC]

:pray:
Please don't win a 3rd.
We'll never hear the end of Ben's greatness....and it will be harder and harder to argue the point.:o:

[SultanOfSix]

Who cares? He has two Super Bowl rings and made a clutch throw to put his team in another Super Bowl, his third in six years.

If you want stats, go check the ring fingers of Dan Fouts, Dan Marino and Tony Romo. :laugh2:

LMAO.

You're complaining about the Cowboys being "gifted" a SB by Neil O'Donnell and when the same "gift" is wrapped for Ben, you say "who cares"?

No wonder you don't know what it means when someone says "suits your argument".

You are clueless dude, just like the mediots. Aren't you one?

No one said Big Ben isn't a good QB, but he's severely overrated by you and your lame "clutchness" measure.

It's a team game.

Other than that pass, he was 9-18 for around 120 yds, threw two picks and led the steelers to zero points in the 2nd half.

Hardly NFL lore.

This.

[TheCoolFan]

Not a great individual QB but he's the best bus driver and one of the best bus drivers in NFL history. That's nothing to be ashamed of. He's just taking advantage of the situation he's in.

[tyke1doe]

BR is a good QB, .. he is allusive, big and hard to bring down. He extends the play and makes things happen, ... but he is winning because of his defense moreso than what he does most of the time.

But when you're in the playoffs, that's when great quarterbacking or clutch quarterbacking matters. Again, look at the Ravens. Flacco plays with a top defense too. But Flacco hasn't taken the Ravens to any Super Bowls yet. And would you argue that Flacco is as talented as Big Ben?


Some here are hailing him because of a short rollout pass to AB. True it sealed the game, but whoever called the play is the one to be applauded, not BR. Any QB in the NFL could have made that play, .. it's not like he had to thread the needle to squeeze a game-winner in there.

Ah, here comes the hypothetical "any QB in the NFL could have made that play." :laugh3:

Other than that pass, he was 9-18 for around 120 yds, threw two picks and led the steelers to zero points in the 2nd half.

Hardly NFL lore.

Pretty handy to have your defense score a TD for you and then win by 5.

Like I said he is good, very strong in the pocket, and a good NFL QB. But those that are saying he is the best in the NFL or one of the best ever because of his rings, .. well I just don't agree.

I know this wasn't directed at me, but I didn't say he was the best ever. I said he was clutch. That he is.

[juck]

I personally hope he is knocked out of the game. I despise the man. But that said he is the best.

[tyke1doe]

LMAO.

You're complaining about the Cowboys being "gifted" a SB by Neil O'Donnell and when the same "gift" is wrapped for Ben, you say "who cares"?

Who's complaining? :huh:

No wonder you don't know what it means when someone says "suits your argument".

But I know what "straw man" means. :lmao2:

You are clueless dude, just like the mediots. Aren't you one?

Weak Internet Debate Strategy No. 7 - Stray from topic and attack poster personally. :laugh2:


No one said Big Ben isn't a good QB, but he's severely overrated by you and your lame "clutchness" measure.

Well, thank you for acknowledging me as the source of the term "clutchness" when applied to Big Ben. I wish I could take credit for it, but I'm not the only one who believes it. Many NFL players and television commentators believe the same.

I just bet it burned you up to see him ONCE AGAIN complete a pass that put the game away and elevated the Steelers to the Super Bowl - AGAIN!

Hate dies hard. Release the hate, bro. Release it. :)

[Arch Stanton]

You are having a giraffe. How did Ben ever lose a game? SMH

[RoyTheHammer]

I personally hope he is knocked out of the game. I despise the man. But that said he is the best.

Please.. he's very good, but not the best. Put Manning on his Pittsburgh teams and Peyton would have about 7 super bowl rings by now..

[mldardy]

Please.. he's very good, but not the best. Put Manning on his Pittsburgh teams and Peyton would have about 7 super bowl rings by now..
:rolleyes:

[RoyTheHammer]

:rolleyes:

Ben has 2, possibly 3 this year.. Manning is a MUCH MUCH better QB than him.

7 may be an exaggeration, but he'd definately have at least 4.

[DFWJC]

Ben has 2, possibly 3 this year.. Manning is a MUCH MUCH better QB than him.

7 may be an exaggeration, but he'd definately have at least 4.
That's sounds about right.

[tyke1doe]

Ben has 2, possibly 3 this year.. Manning is a MUCH MUCH better QB than him.

7 may be an exaggeration, but he'd definately have at least 4.

And you know this how? :confused:
And you can prove this how? :confused:

[jimmy40]

Please.. he's very good, but not the best. Put Manning on his Pittsburgh teams and Peyton would have about 7 super bowl rings by now..Put Manning on those teams and those teams would give up about 70 sacks a season, 55 of them dives by Manning to save his life.

[RoyTheHammer]

Put Manning on those teams and those teams would give up about 70 sacks a season, 55 of them dives by Manning to save his life.

They could give up 100 sacks, they'd still score more. Manning gets the ball out quicker too, so i doubt they'd approach even 50 sacks given up.

Bottom line.. Manning is a much better QB. To call the child raper the best in the NFL is borderline insanity.

[sfasu77]

Hes not even top 5.

Brady, Manning, Brees, Romo, Rodgers, Vick, Rivers are all better.


I'm sorry, but IMO Rapelisburger is a significantly better QB than Romo. All the guy does is win in the playoffs, and he's money in the 4th quarter.

The truth hurts


I would still take Manning or Tom over him.

[Teren_Kanan]

Put Manning on those teams and those teams would give up about 70 sacks a season, 55 of them dives by Manning to save his life.

I'm a HUGE Manning homer. I think he's possibly the best QB to ever play.

Manning is a better QB than Ben. Manning gets the ball out faster too.

This being said. Manning would not do as well with a poor Oline as Ben does. He's just not an avoid the rush type of QB, and he's always had a solid Oline to work with.

I think Peyton would do very poorly compared to usual if he were a Steeler. He would lack the ability to extend so many plays like Ben does, and that's what makes Ben so good, especially in the 4th.

Steelers would still be a great team, but I don't think they'd be as dominant with Peyton behind the wheel. A QB who can avoid pressure and extend plays is the only reason their offense is so dangerous, because their Oline has been awful.

It's sort of like here in Dallas. Romo makes plays with a terrible Oline that a lot of better QB's couldn't. Some QB's are just more gifted at avoiding the rush than others.