You think the Cowboys signed Henry for the FS spot? [Archive] - Dallas Cowboys Forum

dragon_mikal

03-02-2005, 03:35 PM

He has the size and playmaking ability to thrive at FS. You think Parcells will move him to FS and sign another CB in FA or look to draft one in the 2nd?

All speculation at this point, though it would be interesting.

blindzebra

03-02-2005, 03:37 PM

You don't pay a FS 4 million a year.;)

dragon_mikal

03-02-2005, 03:38 PM

You don't pay a FS 4 million a year.;)

Didn't know that's what they were paying him...

Oh well.

Dale

03-02-2005, 03:38 PM

You don't pay a FS 4 million a year.;)

And that right there is why it's impossible to get a quality corner, in his prime, and convince him to sign on as a free safety. These guys, such as Baxter, aren't dumb. They know the pay day is much greater at corner.

conner01

03-02-2005, 03:39 PM

why would you do that? he's a cover corner,safeties are much cheaper

dragon_mikal

03-02-2005, 03:40 PM

Cowboys Dad

03-02-2005, 03:40 PM

I concur Zeb, I also think that we may see another corner in Dallas if the price is right, or the right one is available in the draft. Even though Freddie Mitchell doesnt know who they were, the patriots proved that you can never have too many decent corners!

ABQCOWBOY

03-02-2005, 03:40 PM

You don't pay a FS 4 million a year.;)

You might if he can produce 10 INTs a season for you but your right. I think they probably sign him to play RCB. However, if a CB falls in our laps in the draft, I wouldn't be surprised to see us draft one and eventually move him.

MichaelWinicki

03-02-2005, 03:41 PM

You don't pay a FS 4 million a year.;)

If that is an accurate figure then yes you would be correct.

Dale

03-02-2005, 03:42 PM

Yea...

Just an idea.

In theory, I think it's a great idea. Certainly if we added another corner of high caliber, the secondary could be potentially great if Henry adjusted to the position change. And theoretically, we could still do it after paying him $4 million a year (if we pay that), but it wouldn't be too wise economically.

blindzebra

03-02-2005, 03:42 PM

I guess I should qualify it by saying unless it's Ed Reed.:D

Paniolo22

03-02-2005, 03:44 PM

You might if he can produce 10 INTs a season for you but your right. I think they probably sign him to play RCB. However, if a CB falls in our laps in the draft, I wouldn't be surprised to see us draft one and eventually move him.
In our lap would probably have to mean late 2nd or 3rd on down. I don't think we want all those millionares on CBs and Safeties.

Jack

03-02-2005, 03:44 PM

And that right there is why it's impossible to get a quality corner, in his prime, and convince him to sign on as a free safety. These guys, such as Baxter, aren't dumb. They know the pay day is much greater at corner.

Ed Reed may change that though. SS and FS are becoming more popular in the league. Plus with all of these rules in the passing game, there are no shutdown corners in the league anymore. At least not like there used to be...

blindzebra

03-02-2005, 03:44 PM

If that is an accurate figure then yes you would be correct.

It's based on the 4 year 12 million with a 5 million SB that was talked about last night.

CanadaBoys

03-02-2005, 03:44 PM

forget dollars.... why would you sign a guy who is turning himself into a shutdown CB and move him to FS?

Especially when he's only been around a few years and has many great years ahead of him.

Now if they signed Baxter or Law I could see it.

Charles

03-02-2005, 03:45 PM

I guess I should qualify it by saying unless it's Ed Reed.:D
or if we were talking SS...unless it's Roy Williams

Portland Fanatic

03-02-2005, 03:48 PM

Unless Sharper breaks lose I bet we use the draft for FS...just don't see many options in FA.

Doomsday101

03-02-2005, 03:48 PM

Ed Reed may change that though. SS and FS are becoming more popular in the league. Plus with all of these rules in the passing game, there are no shutdown corners in the league anymore. At least not like there used to be...

Teams will still look for CB who can cover man on man and the good ones cost big money. With the addition of Henry along with Newman this should allow Roy Williams to once again roam around the line of scrimmage leaving the FS to play center field.

davey999

03-02-2005, 03:48 PM

Keep him at corner and then draft Marlin jackson in the 2nd round to play FS.

Portland Fanatic

03-02-2005, 03:49 PM

Teams will still look for CB who can cover man on man and the good ones cost big money. With the addition of Henry along with Newman this should allow Roy Williams to once again roam around the line of scrimmage leaving the FS to play center field.

What scares me is...who's that FS going to be???

Rack Bauer

03-02-2005, 03:49 PM

You don't pay a FS 4 million a year.;)

If he's worth it, yes you do.

NOt saying Henry's worth it, but if Ed Reed were a FA and wanted 4 million a year, I'd give him 4 million a year.

ABQCOWBOY

03-02-2005, 03:50 PM

I guess I should qualify it by saying unless it's Ed Reed.:D

Your post got me to thinking.

Ed Reed's rookie season:

85 Tckls, 71 Solo, 14 Asst, 1 Sack, 5 INTs.

Anthony Henry's rookie season as a FS:

54 Tckls, 44 Solo, 10 Asst, 0 Sacks, 10 Ints.

dozin_theknick

03-02-2005, 03:50 PM

I think Hunter would make a great FS. Let Frasier play the nickle cb. Any thoughts?

Doomsday101

03-02-2005, 03:51 PM

What scares me is...who's that FS going to be???

I think guys like Hunter can play that spot, they are not being asked to play man coverage he would be playing center field. The other option is pick up a FS in FA. However when you get right down to it, it is much harder to find a quality CB than it is a FS

ABQCOWBOY

03-02-2005, 03:53 PM

In our lap would probably have to mean late 2nd or 3rd on down. I don't think we want all those millionares on CBs and Safeties.

I'd say your right but this is a very deep draft at CB. It's not impossible, especially if we trade down and aquire a 3rd.

Rack Bauer

03-02-2005, 03:53 PM

I think guys like Hunter can play that spot, they are not being asked to play man coverage he would be playing center field. The other option is pick up a FS in FA. However when you get right down to it, it is much harder to find a quality CB than it is a FS

I like Hunter at FS cuz of his coverage ability, BUT one thing you don't want to be "bad" at if you're a FS is tackling, and Hunter isn't a great tackler.

Doomsday101

03-02-2005, 03:53 PM

I think Hunter would make a great FS. Let Frasier play the nickle cb. Any thoughts?

I agree with you but would not be opposed to bring in another FS

Doomsday101

03-02-2005, 03:54 PM

I like Hunter at FS cuz of his coverage ability, BUT one thing you don't want to be "bad" at if you're a FS is tackling, and Hunter isn't a great tackler.

If he can't tackle at FS then you don't want him at CB. CB matched up 1 on 1 is expected to make the tackle the CB also has to come up in run support so once again he has to be able to tackle. FS is not a big hitters spot that is normally the job of the SS a FS should be a ball hawk.

junk

03-02-2005, 03:55 PM

What scares me is...who's that FS going to be???

I am still holding out hope for Dwight Smith. I am hoping with his BB gun debacle, he might come cheaper. I would be willing to pay him more than the average safety as well.

If you are thinking of a cheap option, someone like Izell Reese could be a real possibility.

I still like Hunter as a nickel CB better than a FS even though the message board hoards have wanted him to be a FS as long as I can remember.

ABQCOWBOY

03-02-2005, 03:55 PM

Interestingly enough, Dale was talking about what the Cowboys may think of Hunter at FS a couple of nights ago. Maybe he can sheed light if he's still around.

Rack Bauer

03-02-2005, 03:58 PM

If he can't tackle at FS then you don't want him at CB. CB matched up 1 on 1 is expected to make the tackle the CB also has to come up in run support so once again he has to be able to tackle. FS is not a big hitters spot that is normally the job of the SS a FS should be a ball hawk.

It's less important to be a good tackler at CB then at FS. FS is the LAST line of defense. If he can't tackle then you give up 90 yard TD runs (see Tony Dixon vs packers 2004).

dozin_theknick

03-02-2005, 03:58 PM

"I agree with you but would not be opposed to bring in another FS"

Absolutely, either way, we'll need another body to play FS even if we moved Hunter or signed/drafted someone. We need to upgrade not only starters, but also depth. Scott isn't going to do it, it scares the hell out of me when he's on the field.

Doomsday101

03-02-2005, 03:59 PM

It's less important to be a good tackler at CB then at FS. FS is the LAST line of defense. If he can't tackle then you give up 90 yard TD runs (see Tony Dixon vs packers 2004).

FS is the ball hawk and SS is the big hitter, sorry but if you CB can't tackle then your in big trouble. Brock Marion was never a great tackler but was good in coverage and that is what is asked out of FS to provide help over the top not to be a big hitter that is Roy Williams job

Sandman52

03-02-2005, 04:02 PM

Theoretically, and economically, you can pay a FS $4 mil a year as long as you are paying your CB at a low price. Does it really matter if your FS is making CB money and vice versa?

I took this same stance when the idea of moving Flo to RT and playing Rogers at LT was bandied. Many said that you cannot play Flo at RT and pay him LT money. But if your LT is on the cheap, who really cares? In the end it is two players: one at a high price, the other on the cheap.

ABQCOWBOY

03-02-2005, 04:03 PM

Rack Bauer

03-02-2005, 04:04 PM

FS is the ball hawk and SS is the big hitter, sorry but if you CB can't tackle then your in big trouble. Brock Marion was never a great tackler but was good in coverage and that is what is asked out of FS to provide help over the top not to be a big hitter that is Roy Williams job

You've got a skewed vision of what a FS is supposed to be. You're FS doesn't have to be a ballhawk. If he is, then that's great. But you HAVE to be a good tackler if you're a FS. Marion WAS a great tackler.

There's a difference between "Tackling" and "Hitting". I said "Tackler", not "Hitter". Your FS has to be able to tackle. He's the one that has to make the most open field tackles. CBs are usually already on their guy when they catch the ball. It's not hard to tackle a guy when you're already on him. But a FS has to do it in space.

Sorry, but if you think a FS doesn't have to be a good tackler then you've got to go back to school and take "Football: 101".

cowboytillidie

03-02-2005, 04:04 PM

no chance they move him to FS. They want a vet and will wait a couple of weeks, according to my buddy, for the market to settle down and try to get another couple of deals done

Crown Royal

03-02-2005, 04:05 PM

You've got a skewed vision of what a FS is supposed to be. You're FS doesn't have to be a ballhawk. If he is, then that's great. But you HAVE to be a good tackler if you're a FS. Marion WAS a great tackler.

There's a difference between "Tackling" and "Hitting". I said "Tackler", not "Hitter". Your FS has to be able to tackle. He's the one that has to make the most open field tackles. CBs are usually already on their guy when they catch the ball. It's not hard to tackle a guy when you're already on him. But a FS has to do it in space.

Sorry, but if you think a FS doesn't have to be a good tackler then you've got to go back to school and take "Football: 101".

Good post. FS = Last line of defense. This is the guy who plays deep. He had best be able to tackle in space.

That being said....most players on Defense should be able to tackle. ;-)

Banned_n_austin

03-02-2005, 04:16 PM

I think Hunter would make a great FS. Let Frasier play the nickle cb. Any thoughts?

When Hunter was drafted that was part of the reasoning behind it.

He played FS in college and did it well. The Cowboys said that they may look at him there. Then he got hurt playing CB last year. . .

I think he may be good. His tackling is questionable, but that can be coached.

Doomsday101

03-02-2005, 04:16 PM

You've got a skewed vision of what a FS is supposed to be. You're FS doesn't have to be a ballhawk. If he is, then that's great. But you HAVE to be a good tackler if you're a FS. Marion WAS a great tackler.

There's a difference between "Tackling" and "Hitting". I said "Tackler", not "Hitter". Your FS has to be able to tackle. He's the one that has to make the most open field tackles. CBs are usually already on their guy when they catch the ball. It's not hard to tackle a guy when you're already on him. But a FS has to do it in space.

Sorry, but if you think a FS doesn't have to be a good tackler then you've got to go back to school and take "Football: 101".

I played 4 years of FS in college I kind of understand what the job entails, so please save your football 101 for yourself I do understand the position. Yes you have to be able to tackle every position on defense requires that a guy be able to tackle. With Hunter he can't cover worth a damn in man on man coverage but he could provide good support over the top

Banned_n_austin

03-02-2005, 04:19 PM

You've got a skewed vision of what a FS is supposed to be. You're FS doesn't have to be a ballhawk. If he is, then that's great. But you HAVE to be a good tackler if you're a FS. Marion WAS a great tackler.

There's a difference between "Tackling" and "Hitting". I said "Tackler", not "Hitter". Your FS has to be able to tackle. He's the one that has to make the most open field tackles. CBs are usually already on their guy when they catch the ball. It's not hard to tackle a guy when you're already on him. But a FS has to do it in space.

Sorry, but if you think a FS doesn't have to be a good tackler then you've got to go back to school and take "Football: 101".

I agree. You have to be a tackler and it's a luxury if you're a hitter.

Rack Bauer

03-02-2005, 04:19 PM

I played 4 years of FS in college I kind of understand what the job entails, so please save your football 101 for yourself I do understand the position. Yes you have to be able to tackle every position on defense requires that a guy be able to tackle. With Hunter he can't cover worth a damn in man on man coverage but he could provide good support over the top

You obviously didn't learn anything. I said they needed to be great tacklers and you go off talking about "hitting". You understand the difference?

And Hunter is by far our second best man 2 man cover guy. By FAR. His problem is route recognition and adjusting to motion/shifting. When he KNOWS what he's supposed to do, he's fine. But he's not a good tackler. You don't put weak tacklers at FS. Period.

DallasDW00ds0n

03-02-2005, 04:23 PM

ahhahaha don't you guys remember when Bill Parcells let Hunter play some FS last year during training camp???!

how could you forget!? they said he was terrrible.
if i can find that article again i will show you...

Doomsday101

03-02-2005, 04:23 PM

You obviously didn't learn anything. I said they needed to be great tacklers and you go off talking about "hitting". You understand the difference?

And Hunter is by far our second best man 2 man cover guy. By FAR. His problem is route recognition and adjusting to motion/shifting. When he KNOWS what he's supposed to do, he's fine. But he's not a good tackler. You don't put weak tacklers at FS. Period.

Save the insults, I think I know a lot more about the position than you do. Look yes he needs to tackle so does a every other player on Defense. but a FS job is to provide support over the top. Hunter is our second best cover man? it says a lot about how poor RCB was last year. Hunter looked like during pre-season when teams are running basic offense nothing special and he could not handle that.

Rack Bauer

03-02-2005, 04:32 PM

Save the insults

You're pretty sensitive if you think my last post insulted you. Seriously.

I think I know a lot more about the position than you do.

Obviously not.

Hunter is our second best cover man

Don't try and simplify what I said. I said when he KNEW what he's supposed to do, he was our second best MAN 2 MAN cover man.

Hell, even Zimmer said he was our best man 2 man coverguy on Hard Knocks (Hunters rookie year).

Hunter looked like during pre-season when teams are running basic offense nothing special and he could not handle that

Yet you want to put him in a position where he'll have to worry about the WHOLE field instead of just the alignment on his side.

Yeah, you sure know a whole bunch about the FS position. :rolleyes:

Banned_n_austin

03-02-2005, 04:34 PM

Dooms, what college did you play at?

And what year?

Doomsday101

03-02-2005, 04:39 PM

Dooms, what college did you play at?

And what year?

Stephen F. Austin late 70's

Banned_n_austin

03-02-2005, 04:40 PM

Stephen F. Austin late 70's

I knew a guy who was a punter there. He went to my High School. His name was Steve Merka.

Doomsday101

03-02-2005, 04:41 PM

You're pretty sensitive if you think my last post insulted you. Seriously.

Obviously not.

Don't try and simplify what I said. I said when he KNEW what he's supposed to do, he was our second best MAN 2 MAN cover man.

Hell, even Zimmer said he was our best man 2 man coverguy on Hard Knocks (Hunters rookie year).

Yet you want to put him in a position where he'll have to worry about the WHOLE field instead of just the alignment on his side.

Yeah, you sure know a whole bunch about the FS position. :rolleyes:

Again with the insults please save your dumb ars remarks and go get a clue while your at it.

Rack Bauer

03-02-2005, 04:44 PM

Doomsday101

03-02-2005, 04:51 PM

YOu've got a serious lack of intestinal fortitude if you think I just insulted you.

I said you don't know as much as you think you know. That's not an insult, that's my opinion.

If you can't handle that, then you probably shouldn't visit internet message boards.

Save it, for someone who cares what you think. You have a difference of opinion fine. As for what board I go to really none of your damn business now is it?