Interesting Information From Forbes

[Hostile]

Credit for finding this belongs to Hoofbite. He asked me to look at it and post it with some commentary if I so desired. I found it interesting, so here it is.

This is from last August but it lists some information regarding operating incomes for the 32 NFL teams.

http://www.forbes.com/lists/2010/30/football-valuations-10_NFL-Team-Valuations_Income.html

The order is stacked based upon the column at the far right (5th) which is operating income. Per Forbes 2 teams in 2009 operated in the red. This would mean that their operating expenses including salaries exceeded their revenues. We've been told the NFL teams are not losing money. I imagine this could mean these 2 teams had other large investments that cut into the operating income. I do not know what they might be. Dallas is ranked 1st in operating income.

The 4th column is the revenues. Look at the Cowboys. Again ranked 1st in revenues.

What you should notice is the difference between operating income and revenues. That is going to be calculated by subtracting expenses including salaries. Per this chart in 2009 Jerry paid over $276 million in salaries and expenses. That too is the highest in the NFL, which is not surprising given the cost of maintaining that stadium.

The 3rd column is debt value %. That basically means the amount of calculated value tied up in debts.

I am not 100% sure of the 2nd column. I think that is saying that in 2008 the Cowboys would have been 9th in team value and in 2009 due largely to the new stadium they moved to #1. I find it hard to believe we were ever 9th though. Perhaps there is a better explanation of that chart column. I am just not sure how they come by it.

Finally the 1st column is the one we are all familiar with, the estimated value of the team. No surprise that Dallas is in 1st place there.

In analyzing this I ask you to remember that the NFL has revenue sharing and much of the value of the Cowboys is spread to other teams. In other words Based on this Jerry Jones subsidizes other teams. Not surprising, but what should be a bit eye opening is just how much he has to do this based on the other calculations if they are correct.

[jobberone]

The debt to value includes costs for a stadium. The fact it is that low is remarkable given the cost of the stadium. However, the operating income does not include amortization. I don't understand if that includes the amortization for the stadium. I would imagine it does and if that is true then a fair amount of the difference between revenue and income would go to the stadium and not just salaries. I could easily be wrong about that though.

We are still in great shape. Again Jerry is a wizard at business. There is no doubt that success helps the on the field product IMO.

[irishline]

Credit for finding this belongs to Hoofbite. He asked me to look at it and post it with some commentary if I so desired. I found it interesting, so here it is.

This is from last August but it lists some information regarding operating incomes for the 32 NFL teams.

http://www.forbes.com/lists/2010/30/football-valuations-10_NFL-Team-Valuations_Income.html

The order is stacked based upon the column at the far right (5th) which is operating income. Per Forbes 2 teams in 2009 operated in the red. This would mean that their operating expenses including salaries exceeded their revenues. We've been told the NFL teams are not losing money. I imagine this could mean these 2 teams had other large investments that cut into the operating income. I do not know what they might be. Dallas is ranked 1st in operating income.

The 4th column is the revenues. Look at the Cowboys. Again ranked 1st in revenues.

What you should notice is the difference between operating income and revenues. That is going to be calculated by subtracting expenses including salaries. Per this chart in 2009 Jerry paid over $276 million in salaries and expenses. That too is the highest in the NFL, which is not surprising given the cost of maintaining that stadium.

The 3rd column is debt value %. That basically means the amount of calculated value tied up in debts.

I am not 100% sure of the 2nd column. I think that is saying that in 2008 the Cowboys would have been 9th in team value and in 2009 due largely to the new stadium they moved to #1. I find it hard to believe we were ever 9th though. Perhaps there is a better explanation of that chart column. I am just not sure how they come by it.

Finally the 1st column is the one we are all familiar with, the estimated value of the team. No surprise that Dallas is in 1st place there.

In analyzing this I ask you to remember that the NFL has revenue sharing and much of the value of the Cowboys is spread to other teams. In other words Based on this Jerry Jones subsidizes other teams. Not surprising, but what should be a bit eye opening is just how much he has to do this based on the other calculations if they are correct.

Given the way it reads I'm pretty sure the 2nd column is the change in current value of the team from the previous year. In other words the value of the cowboys in 2010 increased by 9% over what it was in 2009.

[Outlaw Heroes]

I understand the second column to be percentage value change in value, year over year. In other words, the second column indicates that the value of the Cowboys, as at August 25, 2010 was 9% greater than the value of the Cowboys, as at August 25, 2009 (implying a value of a little over $1.655 Billion in 2009). It's striking that most of the franchises saw their value decrease between 2009 and 2010, if Forbes can be believed.

I also note that operating income does not take account of taxes. After tax, a number of franchises that are not losing money still appear to be struggling somewhat.

[AdamJT13]

Given the way it reads I'm pretty sure the 2nd column is the change in current value of the team from the previous year. In other words the value of the cowboys in 2010 increased by 9% over what it was in 2009.

You are correct.

Here are the numbers for 2009 --

http://www.forbes.com/lists/2009/30/football-values-09_NFL-Team-Valuations_Rank.html

Two significant numbers -- In Forbes' 2009 estimations, our 2008 revenue was only $280 million, compared with $420 million for 2009. Our EBIDTA in 2008 was $9.2 million (fourth-lowest in the NFL), compared with $143.3 million for 2009 (highest in the NFL).

By the way, our debt-to-value ratio has dropped from 38 percent in 2007 (estimations published in 2008) to 11 percent in 2009 (published in 2010).

[Hostile]

Given the way it reads I'm pretty sure the 2nd column is the change in current value of the team from the previous year. In other words the value of the cowboys in 2010 increased by 9% over what it was in 2009.Okay, that makes perfect sense. Thank you. I had not even considered that.

[jazzcat22]

I don't remember the percentages. But back in the late 70's to mid 80's. Whne it was 100% revenue sharing. Dallas' revenue accounted for something like 30%, if not more of all the NFL's others teams revenue. Expecially from retail sales on cltohing, etc.

Teams like the Bengals, and even the Packers under todays terms [before the mega billion dollar TV contracts, and other deals] would have folded.

this continued even into the 90's after JJ bought the team, even with losing records at the time.

[Quarterback Coach]

Credit for finding this belongs to Hoofbite. He asked me to look at it and post it with some commentary if I so desired. I found it interesting, so here it is.

This is from last August but it lists some information regarding operating incomes for the 32 NFL teams.

http://www.forbes.com/lists/2010/30/football-valuations-10_NFL-Team-Valuations_Income.html

The order is stacked based upon the column at the far right (5th) which is operating income. Per Forbes 2 teams in 2009 operated in the red. This would mean that their operating expenses including salaries exceeded their revenues. We've been told the NFL teams are not losing money. I imagine this could mean these 2 teams had other large investments that cut into the operating income. I do not know what they might be. Dallas is ranked 1st in operating income.

The 4th column is the revenues. Look at the Cowboys. Again ranked 1st in revenues.

What you should notice is the difference between operating income and revenues. That is going to be calculated by subtracting expenses including salaries. Per this chart in 2009 Jerry paid over $276 million in salaries and expenses. That too is the highest in the NFL, which is not surprising given the cost of maintaining that stadium.

The 3rd column is debt value %. That basically means the amount of calculated value tied up in debts.

I am not 100% sure of the 2nd column. I think that is saying that in 2008 the Cowboys would have been 9th in team value and in 2009 due largely to the new stadium they moved to #1. I find it hard to believe we were ever 9th though. Perhaps there is a better explanation of that chart column. I am just not sure how they come by it.

Finally the 1st column is the one we are all familiar with, the estimated value of the team. No surprise that Dallas is in 1st place there.

In analyzing this I ask you to remember that the NFL has revenue sharing and much of the value of the Cowboys is spread to other teams. In other words Based on this Jerry Jones subsidizes other teams. Not surprising, but what should be a bit eye opening is just how much he has to do this based on the other calculations if they are correct.

Pittsburgh number 1 in Super Bowls...Dallas #1 in revenue. Jerry has his wish.

[Hostile]

Pittsburgh number 1 in Super Bowls...Dallas #1 in revenue. Jerry has his wish.Then go be a Steelers fan. Spare us your front runner only fandom.

[cowboyeric8]

Pittsburgh number 1 in Super Bowls...Dallas #1 in revenue. Jerry has his wish.

Go be a Pittsburgh fan than. We don't want you. And if you don't think Jerry cares about winning you are delusional.

[Quarterback Coach]

Then go be a Steelers fan. Spare us your front runner only fandom.

Sorry Jerry...er, Hos...so sensitive when one calls out the fact that I feel the almighty dollar is worth more to Jerry than the trophy count. You don;t have to agree. (Actually you may be right...maybe it's EGO, the $$$$$$$, and then trophies.)

[Quarterback Coach]

Go be a Pittsburgh fan than. We don't want you. And if you don't think Jerry cares about winning you are delusional.

No...he likes winning...as long as he receives the credit for it. If it goes to anyone else he has them removed (or am I making that up too)

[Quarterback Coach]

Actually I am sorry. I must apologize for my previous remarks. At least Jerry has come out publicly and said he wants the season to start so we can go after #6...

I mean, it's not like he said something like I didn't SPEND $1.2 billion on a stadium to not play...now THAT might make one think that $$$$$$$$ is the key to his kingdom. Thankfully Jerry didn't say something like that huh? Can you imagine if he did????

So as mentioned, I apologize for thinking Jerry cares more about the dollar than winning. His actions and words truly reflect how incorrect I must be...

Kool Aid, kool aid...which 2 posters here ordered the kool aid...

[cowboyeric8]

Again, we aren't forcing you to be here. Go to another team.

[Quarterback Coach]

Again, we aren't forcing you to be here. Go to another team.

No you aren't forcing me to be here...just trying to force me to be a sheep and follow in what YOU think. Sorry...I don't. I think you're wrong. I have what's called an opinion. I voice it...you don't need to listen to it. Keep buying in to Jerry World. That's what he wants. Sorry that I expect more. Actually no, I'm not. I want more...You're happy being a good 9-7 team with a nice little history to fall back on...how quaint. I on the other hand will not allow myself to route for the Notre Dame of the NFL (which is what you tend to do...live that past glory...) I don't need you to agree with me. I can handle people who disagree...you, well...'nuff said.

[speedkilz88]

I think QB was dropped on his head as a child....repeatedly.

[RS12]

Chart shows you what the current labor situation is all about. Jerry at the top of the food chain is tired of giving his money to the Al Davises of the world. He'd much rather that come out of the players pockets. BTW this answers the questions about him being broke.

[Boyzmamacita]

Actually I am sorry. I must apologize for my previous remarks. At least Jerry has come out publicly and said he wants the season to start so we can go after #6...

I mean, it's not like he said something like I didn't SPEND $1.2 billion on a stadium to not play...now THAT might make one think that $$$$$$$$ is the key to his kingdom. Thankfully Jerry didn't say something like that huh? Can you imagine if he did????

So as mentioned, I apologize for thinking Jerry cares more about the dollar than winning. His actions and words truly reflect how incorrect I must be...

Kool Aid, kool aid...which 2 posters here ordered the kool aid...

Is it so hard to believe that Jerry wants to make profit AND win? There's nothing wrong with either of those objectives. And you can't prove that he wants one more than the other.

Chart shows you what the current labor situation is all about. Jerry at the top of the food chain is tired of giving his money to the Al Davises of the world. He'd much rather that come out of the players pockets. BTW this answers the questions about him being broke.

You'll hear a pin drop before anybody responds to that.

[Hostile]

Sorry Jerry...er, Hos...so sensitive when one calls out the fact that I feel the almighty dollar is worth more to Jerry than the trophy count. You don;t have to agree. (Actually you may be right...maybe it's EGO, the $$$$$$$, and then trophies.)It's real simple, I think you are the worst kind of fan that there is. You see only Super Bowl victories as a reason for anyone to be happy as a fan. I want you to go be miserable with Steelers and Packers fans. You add nothing to this forum after your initial hilarity in yelling at Werder. Wear some underwear that actually fits you instead of the diaper.

[cowboyeric8]

No you aren't forcing me to be here...just trying to force me to be a sheep and follow in what YOU think. Sorry...I don't. I think you're wrong. I have what's called an opinion. I voice it...you don't need to listen to it. Keep buying in to Jerry World. That's what he wants. Sorry that I expect more. Actually no, I'm not. I want more...You're happy being a good 9-7 team with a nice little history to fall back on...how quaint. I on the other hand will not allow myself to route for the Notre Dame of the NFL (which is what you tend to do...live that past glory...) I don't need you to agree with me. I can handle people who disagree...you, well...'nuff said.

I barely remember past glory. I was 7 the last super bowl. Don't act like you know me. So since I've known what the heck was going on we have had very little success. Am I happy about that? Heck no, I'm just smart enough to realize there are other factors than just the owner. All teams struggle sometimes, it happens. I'm sorry for not being all doom and gloom and not trolling every post, I like sports, and I like my Cowboys. If I can't enjoy them there isn't much point to be a fan.

[DallasEast]

Will you folks please stop trying to run Quarterback Coach off??? He's like garlic to vampires for this forum. His being here keeps Ed Werder from ever signing up as a member.

Wait.

Who's that joining as a member right now?

Oh. It was only John Clayton.

False alarm. :)

[Wimbo]

So, to greatly simplify... on approximately $8B of revenue, the teams make about $1B after paying salaries. Their business works on about a 12.5% profit margin. The owners want more because with greater operating capital, they believe they can increase the $8B significantly, thus benefiting all owners, players, and personnel. The players just want the owners to give them most of the remaining $1B. Is that it?

[Quarterback Coach]

It's real simple, I think you are the worst kind of fan that there is. You see only Super Bowl victories as a reason for anyone to be happy as a fan. I want you to go be miserable with Steelers and Packers fans. You add nothing to this forum after your initial hilarity in yelling at Werder. Wear some underwear that actually fits you instead of the diaper.

Why thank you. You calling me the worst fan imaginable is nothing short of a compliment. It just goes to prove that you are not willing to ever look at this team past those nice rosey glasses you wear.

And yet again, you exhibit the inability to look at things objectively. Think about it Hos...YOU are the Notre Dame football fan debating that they are still one of college football's premier programs when everything points elsewhere.

[Quarterback Coach]

Will you folks please stop trying to run Quarterback Coach off??? He's like garlic to vampires for this forum. His being here keeps Ed Werder from ever signing up as a member.

Wait.

Who's that joining as a member right now?

Oh. It was only John Clayton.

False alarm. :)

Now that is funny...

[Quarterback Coach]

I barely remember past glory. I was 7 the last super bowl. Don't act like you know me. So since I've known what the heck was going on we have had very little success. Am I happy about that? Heck no, I'm just smart enough to realize there are other factors than just the owner. All teams struggle sometimes, it happens. I'm sorry for not being all doom and gloom and not trolling every post, I like sports, and I like my Cowboys. If I can't enjoy them there isn't much point to be a fan.

Oh God. I'm sorry. "I won't act like I know you." (Don't want to disrespect you or nothing. Would hate for you to pull an AK on me in the hood like Tupac...) Dear Lord in heaven if anyone jumps to conclusions about knpowing me...(in other words get over yourself)

And I respect 95% of what you just wrote. But yes, I blame the owner. His actions speak a whole hell of a lot more than his words.

[Quarterback Coach]

Is it so hard to believe that Jerry wants to make profit AND win? There's nothing wrong with either of those objectives. And you can't prove that he wants one more than the other.

Nothing at all wrong with that. I'm just not going to be stupid enough to think that winning is paramount to him. It's not. Ego, Stadium, $$$$$$$$$, winning.

[Quarterback Coach]

I think QB was dropped on his head as a child....repeatedly.

Nah...just slapped around a little. Made me tough.

[Hostile]

Why thank you. You calling me the worst fan imaginable is nothing short of a compliment. It just goes to prove that you are not willing to ever look at this team past those nice rosey glasses you wear.

And yet again, you exhibit the inability to look at things objectively. Think about it Hos...YOU are the Notre Dame football fan debating that they are still one of college football's premier programs when everything points elsewhere.I would rather look at the world through rose colored glasses and drink koolaid that look through my stomach because my head is up my *** like yours is and drink bile.

[Quarterback Coach]

Again, we aren't forcing you to be here. Go to another team.


No thanks. Appreciate the concern though. That's very nice of you.

[Quarterback Coach]

I would rather look at the world through rose colored glasses and drink koolaid that look through my stomach because my head is up my *** like yours is and drink bile.

Obviously. That is why you choose to defend an owner who single handedly may have taken 2 more rings away from his team, then he allowed it to wallow, and now he has a very nice stadium to call his own. Meanwhile he gets sheep like you to buy in to his snake oil salesman pitch.

Sorry that us head up our butt, bile drinkers have the ability to look at things in the real world. My bad. Jerry has been wonderful since he dumped JJ...you are correct.

Blame ME, not Jerry...it's cool.

[Hostile]

Obviously. That is why you choose to defend an owner who single handedly may have taken 2 more rings away from his team, then he allowed it to wallow, and now he has a very nice stadium to call his own. Meanwhile he gets sheep like you to buy in to his snake oil salesman pitch.

Sorry that us head up our butt, bile drinkers have the ability to look at things in the real world. My bad. Jerry has been wonderful since he dumped JJ...you are correct.

Blame ME, not Jerry...it's cool.You wouldn't know real world if it fell out of the sky, landed on your head and wiggled around. I proved it via PMs about your last thread.

Now, please spare us and go root for your Steelers.

[1fisher]

Why did I read this entire thread? :bang2:

[Hostile]

Why did I read this entire thread? :bang2:
I thought it was good info until yell boy joined in with his 2 cents. Which is proof of inflation because it damned sure ain't worth anywhere near that.

[mmillman]

"There is no doubt that success helps the on the field product IMO."

You are indicating that the on the field product has been good recently?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

nice derail QB.

[hornitosmonster]

No you aren't forcing me to be here...just trying to force me to be a sheep and follow in what YOU think. Sorry...I don't. I think you're wrong. I have what's called an opinion. I voice it...you don't need to listen to it. Keep buying in to Jerry World. That's what he wants. Sorry that I expect more. Actually no, I'm not. I want more...You're happy being a good 9-7 team with a nice little history to fall back on...how quaint. I on the other hand will not allow myself to route for the Notre Dame of the NFL (which is what you tend to do...live that past glory...) I don't need you to agree with me. I can handle people who disagree...you, well...'nuff said.

The great thing about being in America and living in a free market is that you can go be a front runner for other teams... bye...

[Everlastingxxx]

nice derail QB.

Well in his defense, his original post was just a short two sentences. It’s just that many people have no tolerance for anyone with a difference of opinion. I also think it’s personal. Some people just don’t like him for whatever reason, hence all the insults.

[Hostile]

Well in his defense, his original post was just a short two sentences. It’s just that many people have no tolerance for anyone with a difference of opinion. I also think it’s personal. Some people just don’t like him for whatever reason, hence all the insults.I don't dislike him. I dislike the fact that he just comes here to stir up crap any more. Read his last 2 or 3 dozen posts and tell me I'm wrong. Hell, just look at the last half dozen threads he has started.

It has nothing whatsoever to do with difference of opinions.

[CM Duck]

Actually I am sorry. I must apologize for my previous remarks. At least Jerry has come out publicly and said he wants the season to start so we can go after #6...

I mean, it's not like he said something like I didn't SPEND $1.2 billion on a stadium to not play...now THAT might make one think that $$$$$$$$ is the key to his kingdom. Thankfully Jerry didn't say something like that huh? Can you imagine if he did????

So as mentioned, I apologize for thinking Jerry cares more about the dollar than winning. His actions and words truly reflect how incorrect I must be...

Kool Aid, kool aid...which 2 posters here ordered the kool aid...

So, basically you are saying it was Jerry and ONLY Jerry that wanted the lockout?

Im asking because you seem to think Jerry is the only owner worried about making a profit.

I guaran-damn-tee your beloved stealers(Rooneys) care about $$$ just as much as Jerry Jones. There is no way this can be true.....:rolleyes:

Also, Im positive Schramm & company worried about $$$$ as much as Jerry.

Im curious to what you will bump your gums about after the Cowboys win a Super Bowl.....

ALL OWNERS CARE ABOUT $$$ AS MUCH AS THEY DO WINNING(even the Bengals ownership, lol). Whether it be making a profit or saving money

[jobberone]

If I were a moderator I would close this thread.

[bsheeern]

Sorry Jerry...er, Hos...so sensitive when one calls out the fact that I feel the almighty dollar is worth more to Jerry than the trophy count. You don;t have to agree. (Actually you may be right...maybe it's EGO, the $$$$$$$, and then trophies.)

Far better ways for Jerry to make money and stroke his ego then buy a football team that was about to hit rock bottom, or according to most, had hit rock bottom.

[Hostile]

If I were a moderator I would close this thread.
Since I started it I suppose I won't be offended. I hate it though because it was good info.