View Full Version : Remember "The Flex" defense
tkiehl
03-27-2005, 08:19 AM
The innovative Tom Landry invented this defense.....Landry always came up with 1 or 2 plays in the big games that surprised all!
JackMagist
03-27-2005, 08:32 AM
The Flex was an interesting defense. I don't think anyone ever used it but Dallas because it was so complicated. The D-line was staggered so that every other D-lineman was lined up a yard off the line of scrimage. Usually it was the right DT (Bob Lilly and Randy White's position) that was back. That made them almost like LB's in a down position and it was their job to stop the run up the middle. With the quickness of Lilly and White they would be gone before the guard could get to them. It also allowed for a lot of line stunts on passing downs. Probably Tom Landry and Ernie Stautner were the only two people in the world who fully understood that defense.
MichaelWinicki
03-27-2005, 08:33 AM
The innovative Tom Landry invented this defense.....Landry always came up with 1 or 2 plays in the big games that surprised all!
It seems like Tom Landry has never gotten the respect he deserves... Lombardi, Noll and Shula, and later Gibbs & Walsh always overshadowed him.
MichaelWinicki
03-27-2005, 08:34 AM
The Flex was an interesting defense. I don't think anyone ever used it but Dallas because it was so complicated. The D-line was staggered so that every other D-lineman was lined up a yard off the line of scrimage. Usually it was the right DT (Bob Lilly and Randy White's position) that was back. That made them almost like LB's in a down position and it was their job to stop the run up the middle. With the quickness of Lilly and White they would be gone before the guard could get to them. It also allowed for a lot of line stunts on passing downs. Probably Tom Landry and Ernie Stautner were the only two people in the world who fully understood that defense.
Morning Jack... I believe San Francisco fooled around with it to.
Avenging Hayseed
03-27-2005, 08:36 AM
Correct me if im wrong, but im almost positive that the NY Giants were the 1st to use the Flex. Pretty sure that when Landry was an assistant in N.Y he came up with the flex as a way to stop Jim Brown. But, I do think that to my knowledge only the Giants and Cowboys have used it. When Landry left N.Y that defence left with him....
Avenging Hayseed
03-27-2005, 08:37 AM
Remember seeing something that it helped to free up Sam Huff so he could make more plays against Brown....
Avenging Hayseed
03-27-2005, 08:40 AM
Really shows the Greatness of Landry. The guy knew the game inside and out. Very innovative offensively and on defence. Very few Head coaches are/ were as well verced as Landry on BOTH sides of the ball....
JackMagist
03-27-2005, 09:01 AM
Landry knew the game inside and out to be sure. He even go involved with the soccer style place kickers when they were just beginning to become popular. He worked with Raphael Septien on his kicking technique by applying the principles of a golf swing to his leg motion (Landry was a pretty decent golfer too). BTW Dan Reaves and Chan Gailey's offensive systems are decended from Landry's offensive system and there are still smatterings of it used around the league.
JackMagist
03-27-2005, 09:08 AM
Morning Jack... I believe San Francisco fooled around with it to.Hi Mikey.
I'm sure that there were probably others who toyed with it but I don't think it ever became anyone elses base D (or at least not for long).
Avenging Hayseed
03-27-2005, 09:20 AM
Landry knew the game inside and out to be sure. He even go involved with the soccer style place kickers when they were just beginning to become popular. He worked with Raphael Septien on his kicking technique by applying the principles of a golf swing to his leg motion (Landry was a pretty decent golfer too). BTW Dan Reaves and Chan Gailey's offensive systems are decended from Landry's offensive system and there are still smatterings of it used around the league. 100% CORRECT about Reeves and Gaileys offence decending from Landry. We have not run a decent screen play since Tom left. Thats a longgggggggggggggggggg time...LOL
MichaelWinicki
03-27-2005, 09:25 AM
100% CORRECT about Reeves and Gaileys offence decending from Landry. We have not run a decent screen play since Tom left. Thats a longgggggggggggggggggg time...LOL
What's a "screen"?
Next_years_Champs
03-27-2005, 09:34 AM
Morning Jack... I believe San Francisco fooled around with it to.
You are right when Dick Nolan was the head coach in the late 60's and early 70's he used the "Flex". They didn't have much success with it and abandon it after a couple of years. But they did use it for at least a couple of years, Nolan was coach there from 68 thru 75.
Nolan played for Landry and was one of his coaching disciples.
Avenging Hayseed
03-27-2005, 09:43 AM
What's a "screen"? LMBO! Whats a SCREEN? Thats about it too. Havent been able to run an effective screen in so long we dont even know what one is anymore...
Avenging Hayseed
03-27-2005, 09:48 AM
Screen play...........Offensive lineman feign pass protection thus luring defensive lineman up field. Once the defensive lineman are allowed to slip the blocks of the o lineman the o lineman set up down field as run blockers. At this time the r.b slips out between the defensive lineman and our offensive lineman where he recieves a lob pass over the heads of the defensive lineman and makes his move up field with a bevy of lineman leading the way. VERY, VERY efective on 3rd and 8!....LOL p.s ... More agile athletic o lineman are preferable when running this play. Guys that can move, pull, and such...LOL Gailey never had the type o.l to have much success with it here.
Cbz40
03-27-2005, 09:48 AM
As defensive coach for the Giants Landry played a vital role in the development of the 4/3 D. His innovations in this somewhat new D were copied throughout NFL.
As we all know the 4/3 became the dominant defensive scheme used around the league.
The "flex" became a trade mark of the Dallas Cowboys.......The talents of the great defensive players such as Lilly, Jordon,Howley, Lewis, Renfro etc. were exploited to their fullest. Landry and Stotner, being great innovators, developed the "flex" which played to the strengths of the defensive personnel.
jem88
03-27-2005, 10:06 AM
Screen play...........Offensive lineman feign pass protection thus luring defensive lineman up field. Once the defensive lineman are allowed to slip the blocks of the o lineman the o lineman set up down field as run blockers. At this time the r.b slips out between the defensive lineman and our offensive lineman where he recieves a lob pass over the heads of the defensive lineman and makes his move up field with a bevy of lineman leading the way. VERY, VERY efective on 3rd and 8!....LOL p.s ... More agile athletic o lineman are preferable when running this play. Guys that can move, pull, and such...LOL Gailey never had the type o.l to have much success with it here. Watching Danny White swing it out to Dorsett was a true thing of beauty. Marshall Faulk might be the best receiving RB ever (although Thurman Thomas can also make a claim to that) but nobody was more electrifying off the screen than Dorsett.
MichaelWinicki
03-27-2005, 10:38 AM
Watching Danny White swing it out to Dorsett was a true thing of beauty. Marshall Faulk might be the best receiving RB ever (although Thurman Thomas can also make a claim to that) but nobody was more electrifying off the screen than Dorsett.
Absolutely true. The long TD screen to Dorsett against Baltimore (Colts-- for you youngsters) to start the 1978 season was without a doubt one of the prettiest plays ever I've ever seen.
Sarge
03-27-2005, 10:41 AM
The innovative Tom Landry invented this defense.....Landry always came up with 1 or 2 plays in the big games that surprised all!
The Flex D is as memorable to me as the OL standing up right before getting in their stance.
Serious memories.........good and bad.
80% good and the remaining 30% bad.
BadKarma
03-27-2005, 10:48 AM
Wasn't Dallas one of the first teams using the shotgun on long passing downs? I could have sworn I read somewhere that they were using computers too - though I can't imagine the systems at that time being very popular and being very expensive at that.
Cbz40
03-27-2005, 10:57 AM
Wasn't Dallas one of the first teams using the shotgun on long passing downs? I could have sworn I read somewhere that they were using computers too - though I can't imagine the systems at that time being very popular and being very expensive at that.
The shotgun was used quite extensively in the early years of the NFL. Landry re-introduced it in the 70's to give Roger more time to survey the field and of course along with a few innovations .......the shovel pass etc.
BadKarma
03-27-2005, 11:01 AM
The shotgun was used quite extensively in the early years of the NFL. Landry re-introduced it in the 70's to give Roger more time to survey the field and of course along with a few innovations .......the shovel pass etc.
Yeah, CB - the shovel pass to Preston Pearson was one of my favorite plays to watch.
big dog cowboy
03-27-2005, 11:14 AM
The Flex D is as memorable to me as the OL standing up right before getting in their stance.
Some team ought to bring back the O-line standing up routine again. I always thought that was pretty cool.
Cbz40
03-27-2005, 11:20 AM
Some team ought to bring back the O-line standing up routine again. I always thought that was pretty cool.
I agree.......I think it prepares the OL mentally for the next play. We just might see a few less FS penalties. ;)
big dog cowboy
03-27-2005, 11:25 AM
We just might see a few less FS penalties. ;)
No kidding pops. What a concept!!!
Hey, what was the name of the o-line coach back in the day. For the life of me I can't remember and it's making me a little cranky. I know he wouldn't have put up with some of the penalities we have seen the last few years.
ghst187
03-27-2005, 11:39 AM
What's a "screen"?
its the play the iggles run every other play...you know..the only one they can gain any yardage with...
MichaelWinicki
03-27-2005, 12:01 PM
its the play the iggles run every other play...you know..the only one they can gain any yardage with...
Geez... do you think we could do something like that too? Sounds like a good plan to me...
But again, maybe it's illegal to run a screen if your team is from Texas... hmm. Could be illegal. Maybe that's why we don't do it.
CoCo1
03-27-2005, 12:08 PM
Hey, what was the name of the o-line coach back in the day. For the life of me I can't remember and it's making me a little cranky. .
Jim Myers I believe was his name.
acis516
03-27-2005, 12:18 PM
Yes, Landry reintroduced the shotgun formation. And he switched from a running formation to a passing formation.
I believe it was Gil Brandt that started using the computers for draft purposes, and then later they used for gameplanning.
MichaelWinicki
03-27-2005, 12:38 PM
I would love to see any team go with the flex and try it out. Nors talkes about the 3-4 being different and suprising teams with it. Man the flex would just through opposing offenses into a tizzy. I remember when Buffalo played the Cowboys in the early 1980's there was a big article in the sports' section detailing the flex and how it worked. Actually if Nors was a true Cowboy fan that's the defense he should be pushing but since his loyalties lie with New England, well, he of course pimps the 3-4 onto us.
Cbz40
03-27-2005, 12:57 PM
Jim Myers I believe was his name.
Thanks CoCo that's been driving me crazy
MichaelWinicki
03-27-2005, 01:00 PM
Thanks CoCo that's been driving me crazy
You mean that's just one thing that's driving you crazy!
Cbz40
03-27-2005, 01:03 PM
You mean that's just one thing that's driving you crazy!
Well let's not get into those other things..it's Easter Sunday Michael :D
MichaelWinicki
03-27-2005, 01:07 PM
Well let's not get into those other things..it's Easter Sunday Michael :D
You bet!
You know I've got to get down to see you one of these days. Now that I'm pretty much working on my own I can get out a little more.
Cbz40
03-27-2005, 01:10 PM
You bet!
You know I've got to get down to see you one of these days. Now that I'm pretty much working on my own I can get out a little more.
Well what are ya waiting for???? Just do it........I promise I'll get you in trouble. :D
That would be great......
MichaelWinicki
03-27-2005, 01:12 PM
Well what are ya waiting for???? Just do it........I promise I'll get you in trouble. :D
That would be great......
But my wife would want to come to and spoil it. :)
Cbz40
03-27-2005, 01:16 PM
But my wife would want to come to and spoil it. :)
That's OK I'll get her in trouble too........ :D
Seriously....We'll head south of the border and have a good ole time.
Cowboys&Caps
03-27-2005, 01:17 PM
The patriots have run pretty nice looking screen plays the last few years, though they have gotten away from that somewhat with corey dillion being such an able runner, but they had a few really nice ones in the super bowl. BEATING THE EAGLES!!
MichaelWinicki
03-27-2005, 01:18 PM
That's OK I'll get her in trouble too........ :D
Seriously....We'll head south of the border and have a good ole time.
Seriously I might take you up on that... what's the hotel situation like down there?
Cbz40
03-27-2005, 01:20 PM
Seriously I might take you up on that... what's the hotel situation like down there?
Great choices......South Padre ,McAllen, Brownsville.....
I would love to see any team go with the flex and try it out. Nors talkes about the 3-4 being different and suprising teams with it. Man the flex would just through opposing offenses into a tizzy. I remember when Buffalo played the Cowboys in the early 1980's there was a big article in the sports' section detailing the flex and how it worked. Actually if Nors was a true Cowboy fan that's the defense he should be pushing but since his loyalties lie with New England, well, he of course pimps the 3-4 onto us.
I was waiting to see who would throw the first cheap shot at me in this thread. Good job :(
Chief
03-27-2005, 06:30 PM
Absolutely true. The long TD screen to Dorsett against Baltimore (Colts-- for you youngsters) to start the 1978 season was without a doubt one of the prettiest plays ever I've ever seen.
Right on, Michael.
It was 90-plus yards.
The last 10 yards was Dorsett jogging slowly next to Drew Pearson and Tony Hill. There wasn't a Colt defender anywhere in sight.
MichaelWinicki
03-27-2005, 06:49 PM
I was waiting to see who would throw the first cheap shot at me in this thread. Good job :(
I love you Norsey! :)
"The D-line was staggered so that every other D-lineman was lined up a yard off the line of scrimage. Usually it was the right DT (Bob Lilly and Randy White's position) that was back. That made them almost like LB's in a down position"
Parcells was a student of Landry....
MichaelWinicki
03-27-2005, 07:34 PM
"The D-line was staggered so that every other D-lineman was lined up a yard off the line of scrimage. Usually it was the right DT (Bob Lilly and Randy White's position) that was back. That made them almost like LB's in a down position"
Parcells was a student of Landry....
Good, then lets go to back to the flex then and really surprise folks.
Good, then lets go to back to the flex then and really surprise folks.
Miki - you are ahead of the curve. Go for it boy! Flex D in 2005 for Dallas! I personally don't see it but respect you going out on a ledge calling that for Base D in 2005!
Who assumes Lilly, Manster role?
MichaelWinicki
03-27-2005, 08:11 PM
Miki - you are ahead of the curve. Go for it boy! Flex D in 2005 for Dallas! I personally don't see it but respect you going out on a ledge calling that for Base D in 2005!
Who assumes Lilly, Manster role?
Actually Glover would fit that role nicely. He's active, not a plodder.
But alas I don't see that happening. May not ever see it again.
Actually Glover would fit that role nicely. He's active, not a plodder.
But alas I don't see that happening. May not ever see it again.
Yes - Glover can play lots of positions - very adaptable.
I remember seeing a show on Landry and he stated he got the name "Flex" from a fortune cookie. No Lie.
trickblue
03-27-2005, 09:51 PM
That's OK I'll get her in trouble too........ :D
Seriously....We'll head south of the border and have a good ole time.
South of the border to Winky is the Northern NY State line... :D
MichaelWinicki
03-28-2005, 06:30 AM
South of the border to Winky is the Northern NY State line... :D
Yeah... no one of Mexican persuassion south of "our" border. :D
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