Gosselin: Don't assume Tony Romo equals Manning in a Giants uniform

[Risen Star]

Rick Gosselin, sports columnist for The Dallas Morning News and SportsDayDFW.com and member of the Pro Football Hall of Fame (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/Pro_Football_Hall_of_Fame) selection committee, answered your questions about the Cowboys and the NFL (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/National_Football_League) playoffs in a live chat Monday. Some highlights:

If Tony Romo (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/Tony_Romo) was in a different situation, say with the Giants (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/New_York_Giants), would he do no less or maybe more than Eli Manning (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/Eli_Manning) has done?

Something's missing with Romo. In the biggest games of his life, Eli Manning has made the plays to win those games. Romo has not. I don't assume that if you put Romo on the Giants he'd be in the title game this week. Manning made the plays these last two weeks to advance the Giants, throwing six TD passes and only one interception. I think a quarterback can elevate the play of those around him. Manning does. To this point in his career, Romo doesn't.

Romo has better stats than Eli.

I'm not with you on this one. Manning passed for 800 more yards and won two more games than Romo. And his numbers came with the NFL's (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/National_Football_League) 32nd ranked rushing offense. This is Manning's second trip to the NFC title game in five seasons. Hard to argue Romo is a better quarterback. Eli has made the plays in the biggest games of his life. I like that in a quarterback.

http://www.dallasnews.com/sports/dallas-cowboys/headlines/20120116-gosselin-don-t-assume-tony-romo-equals-manning-in-a-giants-uniform.ece

[DOUBLE WING]

Hard to disagree with that.

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

Hard to disagree with that.

It's easy to disagree with it. The Giants have one of the best DL's in the game and a very solid offensive line. Romo doesn't have that. No doubt in my mind Romo would win at least one Super Bowl with the Giants. Goose is a moron Romo showed many times this season that he can perform in the 4th quarter. He clearly outplayed Eli in the 1st meeting, but lost due to yet another late game collapse by the defense. Eli threw for 800 more yards, but he also threw for more interceptions and less touchdowns. Romo also had a better QB rating.

[vta]

It's kind of like saying he wouldn't benefit from being surrounded by better players, especially an o-line that can keep him from getting abused. Dumb logic.

[BraveHeartFan]

Rick Gosselin, sports columnist for The Dallas Morning News and SportsDayDFW.com and member of the Pro Football Hall of Fame (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/Pro_Football_Hall_of_Fame) selection committee, answered your questions about the Cowboys and the NFL (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/National_Football_League) playoffs in a live chat Monday. Some highlights:

If Tony Romo (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/Tony_Romo) was in a different situation, say with the Giants (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/New_York_Giants), would he do no less or maybe more than Eli Manning (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/Eli_Manning) has done?

Something's missing with Romo. In the biggest games of his life, Eli Manning has made the plays to win those games. Romo has not. I don't assume that if you put Romo on the Giants he'd be in the title game this week. Manning made the plays these last two weeks to advance the Giants, throwing six TD passes and only one interception. I think a quarterback can elevate the play of those around him. Manning does. To this point in his career, Romo doesn't.

Romo has better stats than Eli.

I'm not with you on this one. Manning passed for 800 more yards and won two more games than Romo. And his numbers came with the NFL's (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/National_Football_League) 32nd ranked rushing offense. This is Manning's second trip to the NFC title game in five seasons. Hard to argue Romo is a better quarterback. Eli has made the plays in the biggest games of his life. I like that in a quarterback.

http://www.dallasnews.com/sports/dallas-cowboys/headlines/20120116-gosselin-don-t-assume-tony-romo-equals-manning-in-a-giants-uniform.ece

With all due respect to Rich you can play this the other way as well. Don't assume you could put Eli Manning in Dallas and he'd still do here what he does there.

[Idgit]

Hard to disagree with that.

Hard to agree with it, actually. Those are stupid reasons to criticize Romo. Tony almost *always* gets his team in position to win games, for one. And blaming the QB for team wins and losses is a logical mistake that belongs more in a sports chat room than it does coming out of the mouth of someone paid for analysis and opinion.

[joseephuss]

The Giants beat the Cowboys, the Packers and the Patriots in the 2007 playoffs. They also played those same three teams during the regular season and lost all four games(obviously they played Dallas twice in the regular season). What were the biggest differences in the Giants beating these teams in the playoffs that they couldn't beat in the regular season that year? Defense was the main reason. Secondly, Manning cut down on his mistakes. He didn't make any more plays, but he avoided the turnovers.

Eli 2007 regular season(Cowboys twice, Packers, Pats)
65.4% completion percentage
7.4 YPA
7.4% TD
3.7% INT
96.75 passer rating

Eli 2007 playoffs(Cowboys, Packers, Pats)
56.5% completion percentage
7.3 YPA
4.3% TD
1.1% INT
89.45 passer rating

Giants defense regular season against these 3 teams
72.7% completion percentage
9.3 YPA
9.8% TD
2.3% INT
125.00 passer rating

Giants post season against these 3 teams
55.5% completion percentage
5.9 YPA
3.4% TD
2.5% INT
73.62 passer rating

The Giants averaged 25.75 points scored against 37.25 points allowed in those 4 regular season games. They averaged 20.33 points scored and 17 points allowed in the 3 playoff games.

The Giants defense drastically improved from the regular season to the post season when facing these teams. They got roasted by those teams in the regular season. That huge turnaround was the major factor in them winning in the playoffs and getting a championship. Eli Manning deserves some credits for his contributions, but he easily comes in a distant second to the contributions of the defense and especially that defensive line that year. I see many similarities in their current run this season.

[Outlaw Heroes]

Sounds like Goose is making an oblique reference to what one of my friends calls the "special sauce". You know, the ability to be "clutch" when it matters. That "intangible quality" typified in some of the greats like Montana or, closer to our own hearts, Staubach. Only problem is that it doesn't exist. That's voodoo football analysis, Goose. What was it again that Adam called you? Ah yes: "an idiot". Let's stick with that. Works perfectly.

[Randy White]

what I'm about to post doesn't take away from Eli Manning being a terrific QB. That's a non-starter for an argument. He is a terrific QB and deserves to be mentioned amongst the best.

Having said that, hey Rick Gosselin, like many others have said before: STICK TO REPORTING, not giving opinions. When you give opinions you make Skippy Bayless look like a genius.

" Eli Manning has made the plays to win those games. "

Gwj90GMIeu8

Yea, that's all Eli Manning alright..

and here too..


UNDgDyPuLNI


" Look at that little Eli run .... look at how much he elevated Victor Cruz' speed. "

Moron :rolleyes:

[DFWJC]

Having said that, hey Rick Gosselin, like many others have said before: STICK TO REPORTING, not giving opinions. When you give opinions you make Skippy Bayless look like a genius.


So true.
It seems lately that everytime Goose does an opinion piece, I come away respecting him less and less.


Let's put it this way in regards to some the general Romo disrespect around here..........
Just yesterday, Roger Staubach called Romo a "franchise quarterback".
http://cowboysblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2012/01/roger-staubach-on-current-stat.html

[Smashin222]

With all due respect to Rich you can play this the other way as well. Don't assume you could put Eli Manning in Dallas and he'd still do here what he does there.

well said

[DanteEXT]

With all due respect to Rich you can play this the other way as well. Don't assume you could put Eli Manning in Dallas and he'd still do here what he does there.

Got a friend that would argue that til he's blue in the face.

He uses the Lions game to call Romo 'not a smart qb' because he was up big yet still throwing the ball like he was down 3 scores. Then when Brees did the same thing a few weeks ago against the Falcons, I pointed it out. His rebuttal was that was different 'cause Brees was going for the record.

[DFWJC]

Got a friend that would argue that til he's blue in the face.

He uses the Lions game to call Romo 'not a smart qb' because he was up big yet still throwing the ball like he was down 3 scores. Then when Brees did the same thing a few weeks ago against the Falcons, I pointed it out. His rebuttal was that was different 'cause Brees was going for the record.
During that NO/Atl game, I had that same discussion with one my friends that relentlessly bashes Romo.

My main point was that b/c he's a Cowboy fan he doesn't realize that ALL of these QBs have a quarter or entire game. See Eli's 4pick 0 TD game vs Washington--and big game with playoff implications-- for exhibit A.

The difference is that that this guy has starting noticing that it can happen to the best of them. As long it's not 4-5 games a year, it's not the end of the world.

[DanteEXT]

During that NO/Atl game, I had that same discussion with one my friends that relentlessly bashes Romo.

My main point was that b/c he's a Cowboy fan he doesn't realize that ALL of these QBs have a quarter or entire game. See Eli's 4pick 0 TD game vs Washington--and big game with playoff implications-- for exhibit A.

The difference is that that this guy has starting noticing that it can happen to the best of them. As long it's not 4-5 games a year, it's not the end of the world.

My friend isn't a Cowboys fan. Definitely a Romo basher though. Says the Cowboys would have won multiple SB's in the last 5 years with a different QB, compares Romo to Grossman constantly, etc

It gets kinda of funny.

I said the other day that the Cowboys need more talent (the role players and depth portion on the roster) and he goes off about how I'm a typical Dallas fan that thinks you need pro bowlers at every position. I reiterated that I was not talking stars yet he kept on about pro bowlers and such. I've decided he's pointless to talk to about such stuff anymore.

[jazzcat22]

I can disagree with that from the standpoint of a better overall team....and a team with a defense. A true defense.

Also, gosselin is just an avid Cowboys / Romo hater...that's my opinin anyway.

[percyhoward]

Red Zone TD Percentage (2011 NFL Rank)
Giants 9th
Cowboys 20th

How much of that production came from the QB?
Passer Rating in Red Zone, 2011
Eli 75.9
Romo 105.9

How much production came from his supporting cast?
Red Zone Rushing TD
Bradshaw/Jacobs: 16
Murray/Jones: 2

Imagine what the passer ratings would be if the rushing TD numbers were reversed.

Goose got one thing right. There is no way Romo in a Giants uni equals Manning.

[casmith07]

Just remember kids - if Romo wins, it wasn't actually a big game. Only when he loses was it a game of his life.

[casmith07]

During that NO/Atl game, I had that same discussion with one my friends that relentlessly bashes Romo.

My main point was that b/c he's a Cowboy fan he doesn't realize that ALL of these QBs have a quarter or entire game. See Eli's 4pick 0 TD game vs Washington--and big game with playoff implications-- for exhibit A.

The difference is that that this guy has starting noticing that it can happen to the best of them. As long it's not 4-5 games a year, it's not the end of the world.

That wasn't really a big game, just an off day for Eli. He gets a pass, he plays not in Dallas.

[BIGDen]

Man, this writer gets more idiotic by the second. Put Sheli behind our OL and he gets destroyed. Despite the fact that he was running for his life half the time, Romo put up better numbers than sheli AGAIN. Having played one fewer game, Romo threw for more TDs, fewer picks and had a better completion percentage. Romo also had a better QB rating but this moronic clown still thinks that sheli had better numbers? The idea that sheli makes plays and Romo doesn't when it counts is ridiculous. Romo made the throws to Crayton and Fasano in '07, but the passes were dropped. Romo made plays at the end of the AZ and Giants games this year but the kicks were missed and blocked. Romo also made huge throws in multiple 4th quarter comebacks this season (even with broken ribs). Sheli throws 2 terrible passes that were dropped by Patriots defenders at the most critical time in that SB but he "makes the plays" because Tyree miraculously caught an ill-advised duck or Nicks/Cruz outjump DBs when they're double covered. Sheli is playing better than he ever has this year, but Romo is still the better QB. I swear Goose gets worse and worse every day.

[MarkP88]

I'm fine with people saying Eli is better. No matter how you rank them, Eli genuinely IS a great player, and he's gotten better every year. He deserves props. (And being completely honest, I was always more than happy in the 90s to use Troy's rings as evidence that he was better than Young and Favre, so the fact that folks point to Eli's Championship as evidence of his superiority doesn't bother me.)

At the end of the day, who really cares if more people think Eli's the better QB, or if more people think it's Romo? They're both excellent players. The real question is, "can the Cowboys win a Championship with Romo?" And I think anyone who's being honest would answer, "yes, you can win with him, if you put the right team around him."

That's not to absolve Tony of his own contributions to the team not achieving their goals, but he can't do it alone. Teams with weak offensive lines, or lines that get worn down (as ours seemed to in '07) don't win in the playoffs. Teams whose defenses can't come up with stops at crucial moments, who can't pick up their offenses now and then, don't win in the playoffs.

I'm sure others have made this point, but put Tony on the 1992-1995 Cowboys, and he has at least one Championship, if not two or the same three Aikman had. Put Aikman on the Cowboys of 2006-present, and he'd have the same zero championships Tony has. It's just one of the things that makes football so compelling -- even more than other sports, it truly is a team game, in which a huge amount of factors must come together for a team to achieve success. What if Troy doesn't have Emmitt? What if Norv is never hired? We could go through those questions for every player.

Just my opinion.

Mark P.

[Outlaw Heroes]

I'm fine with people saying Eli is better. No matter how you rank them, Eli genuinely IS a great player, and he's gotten better every year. He deserves props. (And being completely honest, I was always more than happy in the 90s to use Troy's rings as evidence that he was better than Young and Favre, so the fact that folks point to Eli's Championship as evidence of his superiority doesn't bother me.)

At the end of the day, who really cares if more people think Eli's the better QB, or if more people think it's Romo? They're both excellent players. The real question is, "can the Cowboys win a Championship with Romo?" And I think anyone who's being honest would answer, "yes, you can win with him, if you put the right team around him."

That's not to absolve Tony of his own contributions to the team not achieving their goals, but he can't do it alone. Teams with weak offensive lines, or lines that get worn down (as ours seemed to in '07) don't win in the playoffs. Teams whose defenses can't come up with stops at crucial moments, who can't pick up their offenses now and then, don't win in the playoffs.

I'm sure others have made this point, but put Tony on the 1992-1995 Cowboys, and he has at least one Championship, if not two or the same three Aikman had. Put Aikman on the Cowboys of 2006-present, and he'd have the same zero championships Tony has. It's just one of the things that makes football so compelling -- even more than other sports, it truly is a team game, in which a huge amount of factors must come together for a team to achieve success. What if Troy doesn't have Emmitt? What if Norv is never hired? We could go through those questions for every player.

Just my opinion.

Mark P.

This. All of it.

[Doomsday101]

There is no way to know one way or the other if Romo and Eli situations were reversed. It is a hypothetical question with no real answers just a means for people of opposite view to disagree.

I know team wise the NY Giants are in a better situation by having solid line both on offense and defense. The OLine is pretty much a vet group who have been together for a while and defensive you have 3 guys on their font line who can bring pressure in Pierre-Paul, Umenyiora and Tuck.

Looking at the 2 QB's I think both are quality QB but again the differance starts and ends with the overall play of the team. NY had their struggles yet when they got fully healthy on the defensive front they were able to put the hammer down on opposing offense.

[DFWJC]

It's tennis, not football, folks.
You know, if your team wins you must be the better player.
You know, like Alex Smith is better than Drew Brees. Everyone knows that.

[burmafrd]

behind our O line Eli is on IR after 8 weeks

[BraveHeartFan]

That wasn't really a big game, just an off day for Eli. He gets a pass, he plays not in Dallas.


Also its Romo's fault and he wasn't clutch when he leads the team to scores to take leads and the defense folds like a house of cards right afterwards to cost them the game.

That's still Romo's fault because some how he's supposed to magically make the defense play better simply by the fact that he did his job.

Look at the Giants games, the Patriots game, and many others including going back to the 2008 Ravens game where he not once, but twice, put his team back in position to be able to win the game only to watch the defense crap the bed and let the other team score with the greatest of ease.


But hey Tony is like all other QBs he has his clunker games, like Detriot and the Jets, so because those happen he isn't allowed the credit he's due in games that it's not his fault.

[RXP]

Theres an old saying in football: the QB gets too much credit when they win and too much blame when they lose.

Gosselin is the epitime of this. It's all about the QB and nothing else.

The defense is horrible? It's Romo's fault.
WR's drop passes? It's Romo's fault.
O-Line almost gets the QB killed? It's Romo's fault.
Brady drives for the winning TD? It's Romo's fault.
The HC ices his own kicker? It's Romo's fault
Kicker gets his kick blocked? It's Romo's fault.
Austin loses a ball in the lights? It's Romo's fault.

It's the thought process of a simpleton.

[BraveHeartFan]

Theres an old saying in football: the QB gets too much credit when they win and too much blame when they lose.

Gosselin is the epitime of this. It's all about the QB and nothing else.

The defense is horrible? It's Romo's fault.
WR's drop passes? It's Romo fault.
O-Line almost gets the QB killed? It's Romo fault.
Brady drives for the winning TD? It's Romo fault.
Austin loses a ball in the lights? It's Romo fault.

It's the thought process of a simpleton.

Excellent points.

[RXP]

Also its Romo's fault and he wasn't clutch when he leads the team to scores to take leads and the defense folds like a house of cards right afterwards to cost them the game.

That's still Romo's fault because some how he's supposed to magically make the defense play better simply by the fact that he did his job.

Look at the Giants games, the Patriots game, and many others including going back to the 2008 Ravens game where he not once, but twice, put his team back in position to be able to win the game only to watch the defense crap the bed and let the other team score with the greatest of ease.


But hey Tony is like all other QBs he has his clunker games, like Detriot and the Jets, so because those happen he isn't allowed the credit he's due in games that it's not his fault.

You beat me by 17 minutes. :)

[MarkP88]

Bottom line, if your QB throws 31 TDs vs. 10 picks, for 4000 + yards, plays through a punctured lung and cracked rib, and then plays the last game with badly bruised throwing hand -- I think to suggest that player isn't damn good, good enough to win with, is just plain dumb.

Again, not to absolve him for his screwups - he's had them to be sure - but there's no reason to denigrate the guy.

Mark P.

[zrinkill]

Gosselin: Cowboys quarterback Tony Romo among all-time elite

July 2010

http://www.dallasnews.com/sports/dallas-cowboys/headlines/20100707-Gosselin-Cowboys-quarterback-Tony-Romo-938.ece

:lmao2:

[Fritsch_the_cat]

My friend isn't a Cowboys fan. Definitely a Romo basher though. Says the Cowboys would have won multiple SB's in the last 5 years with a different QB, compares Romo to Grossman constantly, etc



I would completely ignore any type of football opinion of someone who would seriously say that.

[Doomsday101]

Gosselin: Cowboys quarterback Tony Romo among all-time elite

July 2010

http://www.dallasnews.com/sports/dallas-cowboys/headlines/20100707-Gosselin-Cowboys-quarterback-Tony-Romo-938.ece

:lmao2:

and the kicker I was told that Gosselin is the man with the facts. So was that write up fact or is this one fact? :lmao2:

[ringmaster]

I would completely ignore any type of football opinion of someone who would seriously say that.I'm with you Fritsch the conversation would've ended for me right there too.

[Future]

With all due respect to Rich you can play this the other way as well. Don't assume you could put Eli Manning in Dallas and he'd still do here what he does there.
Eli in Dallas would be exposed for what he is...a BUM.

In 70 more passes, Eli had 800 more yards, 2 fewer touchdowns, 6 more INTs, and one more fumble than Tony. Plus he did it with a tremendous receiving corps and OLine.

Anybody who thinks Eli is a better quarterback is an absolute idiot. The thing that pisses me off most that the media never talks about (and you could say the same for Brees) is how many plays his receivers make for their QB. Look no further than the NYJ game when Victor Cruz takes a 9 yard out to the house for a 99 yard td. Then look at the NYG vs. Dal playoff game when Patrick Crayton drops a perfectly thrown slant route that he probably could have scored on. Tony has never gotten the help that Eli has, and doesn't rely on the chuck-and-pray to establish himself as a great QB.

If Romo plays for NO or NYG we're not talking about whether or not he's elite, we're talking about whether or not he's the best QB in the game.

[RXP]

Eli in Dallas would be exposed for what he is...a BUM.

In 70 more passes, Eli had 800 more yards, 2 fewer touchdowns, 6 more INTs, and one more fumble than Tony. Plus he did it with a tremendous receiving corps and OLine.

Anybody who thinks Eli is a better quarterback is an absolute idiot. The thing that pisses me off most that the media never talks about (and you could say the same for Brees) is how many plays his receivers make for their QB. Look no further than the NYJ game when Victor Cruz takes a 9 yard out to the house for a 99 yard td. Then look at the NYG vs. Dal playoff game when Patrick Crayton drops a perfectly thrown slant route that he probably could have scored on. Tony has never gotten the help that Eli has, and doesn't rely on the chuck-and-pray to establish himself as a great QB.

If Romo plays for NO or NYG we're not talking about whether or not he's elite, we're talking about whether or not he's the best QB in the game.

Not sure if Eli is a "BUM", but I largely agree with this.

Tony Romo gets less help from his teammates than almost any QB in football. That includes the defense.

[Future]

Not sure if Eli is a "BUM", but I largely agree with this.

Tony Romo gets less help from his teammates than almost any QB in football. That includes the defense.
He'd be a bum in Dallas. He can't deal with consistent pressure, and is too inconsistent with his accuracy to be effective in this offense.

[Fletch]

Fans are going to side either way. Fact is, Romo has not had a decent O-line. Nor a consistent defense. The Giants on the other hand have had both at the same time.

Utter nonsense is being thrown around. Just because Goose is in a position with the media to tell us what he thinks, does not make it set in stone.

Did ANYONE watch how many prayers Eli threw in his last game vs. the Packers? They were all caught by his WR's. And by prayers, I mean prayers. Back foot and all. You have to factor in luck. Eli is a good QB. But so is Romo. And if I was a betting man, I'd give Romo the nod over Eli any day of the week.

[DFWJC]

He'd be a bum in Dallas. He can't deal with consistent pressure, and is too inconsistent with his accuracy to be effective in this offense.
:laugh2:
I won't call Eli a bum at all. But you nailed it as far as how he takes physical pressure. If he gets popped a few times, that guy really crumbles.
That's how he can have a game vs a division rival were he throw 3 picks and zero TDs. Smack him around some, and he cries like a newborn.

[Future]

:laugh2:
I won't call Eli a bum at all. But you nailed it as far as how he takes physical pressure. If he gets popped a few times, that guy really crumbles.
That's how he can have a game vs a division rival were he throw 3 picks and zero TDs. Smack him around some, and he cries like a newborn.
Well if you agree with me he can't take physical pressure, you should agree that he'd be awful maginot line the Cowboys call pass protectors :laugh2:

[CanadianCowboysFan]

Just remember kids - if Romo wins, it wasn't actually a big game. Only when he loses was it a game of his life.

yeah it is a big game until he wins

[BraveHeartFan]

Gosselin: Cowboys quarterback Tony Romo among all-time elite

July 2010

http://www.dallasnews.com/sports/dallas-cowboys/headlines/20100707-Gosselin-Cowboys-quarterback-Tony-Romo-938.ece

:lmao2:


I guess having his clavicle broken due to piss poor blocking and then doing nothing but playing extremely solid, and consistent, this year equals him going from among the all time elite to suddenly he'd struggle in NY.


Love how the media's tune changes as easily and often as people change their underwear.

[juck]

Sheli is an NFL Elite QB Romo is a good QB. Chokes under pressure. That said,Romo with a great defense and good Oline would be fine. Then again most QBs with that are fine.

[Doomsday101]

Sheli is an NFL Elite QB Romo is a good QB. Chokes under pressure. That said,Romo with a great defense and good Oline would be fine. Then again most QBs with that are fine.

Just like like Eli having a great defense and Oline. Eli did not look elite when he threw the 3 ints vs Seattle and then vs Washington. :laugh2:

I guess QB like the beauty of a woman is in the eye of the beholder. :laugh2:

[CCBoy]

Well if you agree with me he can't take physical pressure, you should agree that he'd be awful maginot line the Cowboys call pass protectors :laugh2:

The Maginot Line was a series of tank obstacles placed to defeat a directional frontal attack by an armor unit. They were merely flanked and driven past in France. There are still tank obstacles deployed in Korea today as well. (large concrete barriers that tracks can't pass over or knock down)

[CCBoy]

Just like like Eli having a great defense and Oline. Eli did not look elite when he threw the 3 ints vs Seattle and then vs Washington. :laugh2:

I guess QB like the beauty of a woman is in the eye of the beholder. :laugh2:

Now I guess that puts the proverbial man panties right on Eli....:eek:

[Doomsday101]

Now I guess that puts the proverbial man panties right on Eli....:eek:

I think Eli is a very good QB, I just want to see my guy getting the protection up front and a defense who will step up and shut a team down late in the game.

I'll take my chances of Romo getting the job done if given the tools.

[tyke1doe]

Sheli is an NFL Elite QB Romo is a good QB. Chokes under pressure. That said,Romo with a great defense and good Oline would be fine. Then again most QBs with that are fine.

That's what I've been saying.

So here's my question: if a very good quarterback like Eli and Romo needs a good defense line and a good offensive line, then what makes them great?

Can a quarterback reach the "greatness" status without those elements or are quarterbacks doomed to "average" unless they have those elements and win the big one?

Or said another way, it's almost as if you can't call any quarterback great in and of himself, unless he wins inspite of an inferior cast. And the only quarterbacks who fall in that category, IMO, are John Elway and Tom Brady.

[burmafrd]

That's what I've been saying.

So here's my question: if a very good quarterback like Eli and Romo needs a good defense line and a good offensive line, then what makes them great?

Can a quarterback reach the "greatness" status without those elements or are quarterbacks doomed to "average" unless they have those elements and win the big one?

Or said another way, it's almost as if you can't call any quarterback great in and of himself, unless he wins inspite of an inferior cast. And the only quarterbacks who fall in that category, IMO, are John Elway and Tom Brady.


and it is noticeable that the great Elway and the Great Brady did not win SBs without a very good D. And a good O line.

[tyke1doe]

and it is noticeable that the great Elway and the Great Brady did not win SBs without a very good D. And a good O line.

True. But getting there is what sets them apart. Usually, you don't even get to the Super Bowl, much less a championship game, unless you have good to excellent units in two of three phases (offense, defense, special teams) of the game.

[Dallas]

Don't assume Goose is some sort of legit sports columnist in the DFW area because it says so in his opinion pieces.

Shotty shotty work for a long time now Goosiebaby.

Do better or retire and let some young blood in.

[Future]

The Maginot Line was a series of tank obstacles placed to defeat a directional frontal attack by an armor unit. They were merely flanked and driven past in France. There are still tank obstacles deployed in Korea today as well. (large concrete barriers that tracks can't pass over or knock down)
hmm...not sure what this is supposed to mean. Let me clarify...

The maginot line was supposed to protect stuff. It sucked at it.
The Cowboys OLine is supposed to protect stuff. It sucked at it.

That's the comparison.

[RXP]

That's what I've been saying.

So here's my question: if a very good quarterback like Eli and Romo needs a good defense line and a good offensive line, then what makes them great?

Can a quarterback reach the "greatness" status without those elements or are quarterbacks doomed to "average" unless they have those elements and win the big one?

Or said another way, it's almost as if you can't call any quarterback great in and of himself, unless he wins inspite of an inferior cast. And the only quarterbacks who fall in that category, IMO, are John Elway and Tom Brady.


Everybody has to have something. Brady has an outstanding o-line, out of this world TE's and Wes Welker. That's enough for him. Most other QB's would need at least a decent defense. Brady doesn't.

Aaron Rodgers looked pretty average once his WR's deserted him and his o-line suddenly could't block for him.

Even Brees couldn't survive 5 turnovers the other day.

John Elway was always very good but couldn't win the big one until Terrell Davis showed up.

Some QB's need less to win (Brady) than others (Rothlisberger, Aikman). That's what makes some great while others very good.

But they all need some help. Romo doesn't get enough help.

[Doomsday101]

True. But getting there is what sets them apart. Usually, you don't even get to the Super Bowl, much less a championship game, unless you have good to excellent units in two of three phases (offense, defense, special teams) of the game.

and you play the cleveland browns where the RB fumbles as he is about to cross the goal line for the winning TD vs Denver in the AFC Championship game. :laugh2:

Who was that Ernest Byner?

[EGG]

Eli throws a nice deep ball,,, that's the only thing he does slightly better than Romo. Give them the same receivers and protection and you would get basically the same results.