The Case For OL

[Hostile]

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury. When was this once proud franchise a dynasty? When we had an OL that was opening holes for our running game and protecting our QB.

2011...5 rushing TDs
2010...10 rushing TDs
2009...14 rushing TDs
2008...12 rushing TDs

41 TDs over a 4 year span.

Contrast that to Emmitt Smith alone over the 4 year span of our Dynasty years.

1992...18 rushing TDs
1993...9 rushing TDs
1994...21 rushing TDs
1995...25 rushing TDs

73 rushing TDs over a 4 year span and this doesn't even allow for the rest of the team.

Fix the OL, open holes for Murray and protect Tony Romo. This team cannot be beat.

[Risen Star]

All true. But I have to ask....

Is this like your FA thread where if we don't address it, you'll still love the decision?

[SilverStarCowboy]

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury. When was this once proud franchise a dynasty? When we had an OL that was opening holes for our running game and protecting our QB.

2011...5 rushing TDs
2010...10 rushing TDs
2009...14 rushing TDs
2008...12 rushing TDs




There are many other circumstances effecting the NFL rushing stats besides Garretts' inability in the RedZone.

:)

[Hostile]

All true. But I have to ask....

Is this like your FA thread where if we don't address it, you'll still love the decision?What?

[Macnalty]

There are many other circumstances effecting the NFL rushing stats besides Garretts' inability in the RedZone.

:)

I agree and most of it involves no push up front in the middle of the OLine. We are so close on the O to getting it right. Wish there was a better alternative than Jones and Konz for Center, I think both are similar in talent to our FA pickups only they play center.

[Woods]

This could end up being a wierd draft.

By that I mean, I could see us drafting DeCastro, Konz, or Zeitler very early.

On the other hand, I could also see us going defense early and often and not drafting for the OL until Day 3.

I agree that DeCastro would be the safe pick in Round 1, assuming he's available. But from reading the tea leaves, I get the distinct feeling the organization prefers to go defense early, at least in Round 1.

In Round 2, we could even go TE or RB, and I wouldn't be shocked anymore.

I still would love to see us either draft an OC outright, or draft a guy like DeCastro and move one of the other guys to OC (like the pick up from Carolina, for example, who has some experience there) or try to also get Blake in the 4th along with DeCastro in Round 1.

I'm personally not as keen on drafting Konz in the teens. Would prefer to draft DeCastro instead.

[Hostile]

This could end up being a wierd draft.

By that I mean, I could see us drafting DeCastro, Konz, or Zeitler very early.

On the other hand, I could also see us going defense early and often and not drafting for the OL until Day 3.

I agree that DeCastro would be the safe pick in Round 1, assuming he's available. But from reading the tea leaves, I get the distinct feeling the organization prefers to go defense early, at least in Round 1.

In Round 2, we could even go TE or RB, and I wouldn't be shocked anymore.

I still would love to see us either draft an OC outright, or draft a guy like DeCastro and move one of the other guys to OC (like the pick up from Carolina, for example, who has some experience there) or try to also get Blake in the 4th.Make no mistake about it, we are going to go Defense heavy in this Draft. I know that is going to happen. I just don't think it is the right way to go.

[Risen Star]

What?

You told us all before FA started that this FA period had to be about an aggressive overhaul of the OL. It was priority #1. All other issues paled in comparison. Which I thought couldn't have been more right.

Then about 5 days later you told us how excited you were about the direction of the team after signing Brandon Carr to 10 million a year and sifting through the couch cushions for Nate Livings and MacKenzie Bernadeau.

All I'm asking now with this draft plan is if they ignore your pleas again, will that fact actually reflect in your perception of the results?

Or were Livings and Bernadeau what you had in mind when this all started?

[visionary]

All true. But I have to ask....

Is this like your FA thread where if we don't address it, you'll still love the decision?

ouch
that will leave a mark ;)

[Woods]

I agree and most of it involves no push up front in the middle of the OLine. We are so close on the O to getting it right. Wish there was a better alternative than Jones and Konz for Center, I think both are similar in talent to our FA pickups only they play center.

I guess if the season were to start today, Costa would be penciled in as the starter, with Killer pushing. Nagy could figure into the mix as well, I suppose.

For me, OC is concerning, and I think we could even find a competent starter at that position Day 2 or early Day 3.

[theogt]

The case for defense:

In 2011, we had a good offense. In 2011, we had a bad defense.

[Risen Star]

ouch
that will leave a mark ;)

Hey, I'm not looking to give him any grief I'm just seriously asking if he'll be consistent this time. If OL is the way to go in this draft and the Cowboys don't go that way, let's not read how excited you are with this draft class.

[Hostile]

You told us all before FA started that this FA period had to be about an aggressive overhaul of the OL. It was priority #1. All other issues paled in comparison. Which I thought couldn't have been more right.

Then about 5 days later you told us how excited you were about the direction of the team after signing Brandon Carr to 10 million a year and sifting through the couch cushions for Nate Livings and MacKenzie Bernadeau.

All I'm asking now with this draft plan is if they ignore your pleas again, will that fact actually reflect in your perception of the results?

Or were Livings and Bernadeau what you had in mind when this all started?
I believe my posts would reflect the fact that I still believe that. I've pimped DeCastro and Konz as being what we need to be in the Super Bowl and win it. I doubt you can find a thread where I've liked any Defensive player at 14.

I also don't believe you can find a single post where I am excited about either Livings or Bernadeau. I expressed excitement over the Free Agency Haul. I certainly do not deny that.

I figured we'd stick with Fiammetta. I actually like Vickers better. The only FB in the NFL I like better is probably Vonta Leach. I am this forums biggest FB shill. Last year my pet cat was Henry Hynoski. We drafted Shaun Chapas, and Hynoski went UDFA to the Giants. Chapas looks like a PS guy. Hynoski looks like a pro. I like Vickers even more than I liked Hynoski. It makes me happy. I won't apologize for being excited about a FB I truly think is a difference maker.

I thought Dan Connors was a lock to the Eagles. He is from Pennsylvania and I read one time that he was an Eagles fan. They have LB needs. I didn't think we had a prayer of landing him. I'll take him over Bradie James or Keith Brooking this year any time. I feel like with him and Carter working with Lee we have the makings of a solid ILB corps. I'd like to add someone in the Draft and I think my mocks have all reflected this.

I didn't think we had a realistic shot at Kyle Orton. If you look back I was talking about Jason Campbell as our best hope at backup QB. I wanted us to take Orton with a waiver claim last year when Denver let him go. We did, but so did the Chiefs and we lost out. I am shocked he agreed to come here as Tony's backup when he possibly could have started for several other teams including Miami, Seattle, San Francisco, or Cleveland for example. Hell, he could have started for the Chiefs again. I won't apologize for being excited that we landed what I think is the best backup we possibly could have.

I know you're not into paying CBs high dollars. I am not on that same train. I really don't care what we pay someone as long as we remain under the cap and improve the team. I do believe Carr will be an improvement over Newman. I didn't dislike Newman, but his time had come and gone. His cost was prohibitive and the results weren't there. I believe Carr's press coverage abilities will allow us to improve defensively. I have nothing against doing that in the D-Backfield. It doesn't bother me. It clearly does bother you. I've never come after you for how you feel about that. Clearly if someone does not agree with you 100% you feel you have to come after them in some other way such as this. That's cool, just don't put thoughts into my head and words in my mouth.

I am excited about the team in 2012. I won't deny it. I think Woicik having a full off season is to our advantage in a huge way. I heard from one guy recently that when he went by VR he was impressed with how many of our guys are there hitting the training hard. It excites me. Football has a way of doing that to me. If you can't be excited unless you get every toy on your list, I can't help you.

I wanted Nicks pretty bad. I liked Grubbs too. I am hopeful the scouting department sees things in Livings and Bernadeau that I am unaware of, but that has never stopped me from wanting DeCastro above all other players in the Draft and I have never moved from my belief that OL has to be our #1 priority. You cannot show me where I have said, "Hey, we're done on OL, let's fix DBs and DL." You can't do it because I have never thought it.

Oh, and not to be too flip about it, but I'd have been excited about Free Agency if the only thing we had done so far was to get rid of a 2nd Kicker. In case you didn't know it, I hate Kickers.

That last part was strictly for fun. Just making that clear.

Yes, I am excited. I am sorry that you aren't. I can't help you there. You have to do that yourself.

[Risen Star]

I guess if the season were to start today, Costa would be penciled in as the starter, with Killer pushing. Nagy could figure into the mix as well, I suppose.

For me, OC is concerning, and I think we could even find a competent starter at that position Day 2 or early Day 3.

Costa, Kowalski and Nagy. If that doesn't give you a panic attack I question your sanity.

[Hostile]

ouch
that will leave a mark ;)On whom? Not on me.

[visionary]

Hey, I'm not looking to give him any grief I'm just seriously asking if he'll be consistent this time. If OL is the way to go in this draft and the Cowboys don't go that way, let's not read how excited you are with this draft class.

read post#7 in this thread :laugh2:
he has already made plans both ways

all hail at the altar of RJ, JJ, and SJ
they can do no wrong
bow thy heads (and have the anointing oil ready) all ye who enter here

[Hostile]

read post#7 in this thread :laugh2:
he has already made plans both ways

all hail at the altar of RJ, JJ, and SJ
they can do no wrong
bow thy heads (and have the anointing oil ready) all ye who enter hereYeah, because me saying I don't believe it is the right way to go doesn't register in your thinking at all.

You amaze me and not in good ways.

[Risen Star]

Hostile, I'm not excited because the clear cut #1 issue we agreed on hasn't been seriously addressed. The same issue you told us had to be fixed or else. We couldn't win without Romo.

Until that issue is fixed with players with a little pedigree, I don't know how I'm supposed to be excited. Orton, Vickers, Connor, Pool were all nice but they don't help address this critical must fix need. I see us still lining up on Sundays and not being good enough in the trenches.

People keep pointing to the draft. The problem with that is you don't know what will be there and you don't want to pick a lesser player when you're on the board. And considering we had 3 OL spots that needed to be upgraded it's highly unlikely to think this team is gonna get that kind of impact from this draft class. We have a hard enough time finding one much less three.

[Bluefin]

Make no mistake about it, we are going to go Defense heavy in this Draft. I know that is going to happen. I just don't think it is the right way to go.

That was also the prevailing sentiment last year.

Stephen Jones was even asked about the lack of adding defensive help in the post-draft presser. Jones said it was simply how the board dictated they draft.

The team has needs on both sides of the ball, some will go unanswered, there's no way around that.

I hope they follow the board as closely as possible and just focus on adding good players.

[Hostile]

Hostile, I'm not excited because the clear cut #1 issue we agreed on hasn't been seriously addressed. The same issue you told us had to be fixed or else. We couldn't win without Romo.

Until that issue is fixed with players with a little pedigree, I don't know how I'm supposed to be excited. Orton, Vickers, Connor, Pool were all nice but they don't help address this critical must fix need. I see us still lining up on Sundays and not being good enough in the trenches.

People keep pointing to the draft. The problem with that is you don't know what will be there and you don't want to pick a lesser player when you're on the board. And considering we had 3 OL spots that needed to be upgraded it's highly unlikely to think this team is gonna get that kind of impact from this draft class. We have a hard enough time finding one much less three.That is you. Please don't push your feelings onto me and expect me to goose step.

I like those signings. I am going to stand by that if it hairlips the queen and blows panties up all over the forum.

I can be excited and still want what I see as the number 1 problem addressed. I don't have anything against Livings and Bernadeau. I don't have anything against Cox or Barron.

Nothing for me has changed. If the team evaluates needs differently than I do there is nothing I can do about it. I am not going to hold my breath, kick my feet and throw daily tantrums about what I did not get.

If you want to, need to, or have to, have at it my man. I'm not trying to stop you that I am aware of. Just don't put words in my mouth.

Is that too much to ask? I mean seriously man, how daft do you have to be to see me preaching Konz and DeCastro like I am being paid by them to get drafted here and not think I want the Cowboys to see it my way and go OL heavy?

So go pitch your little fits about Carr and Barron, and leave me to my hero worship on DeCastro and Konz and let's not try to one up each other here.

I want OL and I know I am probably going to get it in the 3rd rounds and later. I'll tell you what, if we land someone in the 3rd who can be a steal like Erik Williams was I am going to be jacked up. You can lament not paying millions for Grubbs or Nicks.

Until we completely eschew OL in the Draft I don't see the need for all this panic. I like what we did in FA. I must hate America because of that.

[Hostile]

That was also the prevailing sentiment last year.

Stephen Jones was even asked about the lack of adding defensive help in the post-draft presser. Jones said it was simply how the board dictated they draft.

The team has needs on both sides of the ball, some will go unanswered, there's no way around that.

I hope they follow the board as closely as possible and just focus on adding good players.This is fair, but I am going to tell you what I think. There is not a Defensive player in this draft that will end up being a better pro football player than the guy I have pimped like a fool, David DeCastro. 20 years down the road when all these kids in this class are done people are going to look back at this draft and say he was the best player taken. The only way that is not said is if Luck or Griffin win multiple Super Bowls or Trent Richardson breaks Emmitt's record.

For all the talk about you don't take OGs that high, tell me one player in the 1994 Draft you'd take over Larry Allen in hindsight. Marshall Faulk...maybe.

[Chuck 54]

This is fair, but I am going to tell you what I think. There is not a Defensive player in this draft that will end up being a better pro football player than the guy I have pimped like a fool, David DeCastro. 20 years down the road when all these kids in this class are done people are going to look back at this draft and say he was the best player taken. The only way that is not said is if Luck or Griffin win multiple Super Bowls or Trent Richardson breaks Emmitt's record.

For all the talk about you don't take OGs that high, tell me one player in the 1994 Draft you'd take over Larry Allen in hindsight. Marshall Faulk...maybe.

My problem with DeCastro at 14 is solely about his position and long term value. If he turns out to be the best guard in the league, I believe he'd be a rental for 4 years tops, and then, like the Saints with Nicks, we'd have to let him walk for the same reason we didn't bid on the best guard this year. We just cannot pay a guard that type of money and keep your OT's.

For our team, I am hoping for at least 3 defenders who will be better for our team.

[Hostile]

My problem with DeCastro at 14 is solely about his position and long term value. If he turns out to be the best guard in the league, I believe he'd be a rental for 4 years tops, and then, like the Saints with Nicks, we'd have to let him walk for the same reason we didn't bid on the best guard this year. We just cannot pay a guard that type of money and keep your OT's.

For our team, I am hoping for at least 3 defenders who will be better for our team.Say hello to Leonard Davis.

[rash]

Hos and RS let's have peace :bow:

[Bluefin]

My problem with DeCastro at 14 is solely about his position and long term value. If he turns out to be the best guard in the league, I believe he'd be a rental for 4 years tops, and then, like the Saints with Nicks, we'd have to let him walk for the same reason we didn't bid on the best guard this year. We just cannot pay a guard that type of money and keep your OT's.

Would you really be worried about Jerry Jones paying David DeCastro what it would take to keep him?

How often does the team let deserving players hit unrestricted free agency?

Re-signing is a non-issue, IMO.

[fortdick]

I believe my posts would reflect ....

I can confirm what Hos says. I have read almost all his posts and agree with him 95%. He has been consistent in his advocacy of OL first.

The 5% I don't agree with is FA. I am not pleased with it. I don't think we did much of anything to improve the OL, making it more important in the draft.

People like to say we can take a guard in the middle rounds and he will be serviceable/starter material. Arkin was a 4th round pick, and Nagy in the 7th. As a result, we started anyone but these two. That tells me that we have not paid enough attention to the spot.

Our centers at this point, Killer and Costa are both UDFA's. I really think we need to address this spot, but they didn't in FA.

So, we need to address another in the draft, or face the same results out of the OL next season.

Other than his being pleased with FA, Hos is right on.

[CowboyFan74]

One thing is for certain, fixing the O-line will make our offense our best defense...

[fortdick]

This is fair, but I am going to tell you what I think. There is not a Defensive player in this draft that will end up being a better pro football player than the guy I have pimped like a fool, David DeCastro. 20 years down the road when all these kids in this class are done people are going to look back at this draft and say he was the best player taken. The only way that is not said is if Luck or Griffin win multiple Super Bowls or Trent Richardson breaks Emmitt's record.

For all the talk about you don't take OGs that high, tell me one player in the 1994 Draft you'd take over Larry Allen in hindsight. Marshall Faulk...maybe.

I will go one step better and say that there isn't a defensive player in this draft that would start for us on opening day. DeCastro would do that. Konz may very well start as well.

[Woods]

I will go one step better and say that there isn't a defensive player in this draft that would start for us on opening day. DeCastro would do that. Konz may very well start as well.

Purely speculation on my part, but I think Barron would likely start Day 1 for us.

[fortdick]

Purely speculation on my part, but I think Barron would likely start Day 1 for us.

He is the only one with a chance.

[Sarge]

Purely speculation on my part, but I think Barron would likely start Day 1 for us.

He would definitely start. Like I've said before, he is gonna be the pick and he is gonna start from Day 1.

[Fla Cowpoke]

I gotta side with Hostile.

He has consistently pimped nothing but OL this entire offseason.

The thing is, there are manydifferent ways to complete the offseason from a free agency and draft standpoint that workout great. There are hundreds of combinations that will be decent. And there are thousands of combinations that will suck.

Just because we don't do exactly what he likes doesn't mean he can't see the value on what we have done. We have added 3-4 starters in free agency. If we can get another starter and 2-3 solid contributors in the draft it will be a success.

Also remember that there has been talk about DeCastro possibly playing some Center as well. Bernadeau has been talked about as being a possibility as well. It's not like we need Pro Bowl play at the spot to be much better than we were a year ago.

[VThokie7]

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury. When was this once proud franchise a dynasty? When we had an OL that was opening holes for our running game and protecting our QB.

2011...5 rushing TDs
2010...10 rushing TDs
2009...14 rushing TDs
2008...12 rushing TDs

41 TDs over a 4 year span.

Contrast that to Emmitt Smith alone over the 4 year span of our Dynasty years.

1992...18 rushing TDs
1993...9 rushing TDs
1994...21 rushing TDs
1995...25 rushing TDs

73 rushing TDs over a 4 year span and this doesn't even allow for the rest of the team.

Fix the OL, open holes for Murray and protect Tony Romo. This team cannot be beat.

If we fix the OL, then I think we need to use a 3rd or 4th to grab another RB. Murray was often injured at OU and got hurt last year. And Felix isn't a workhorse.

With that said, I think getting a truly intimidating OL would be great. By stretching drives and keeping the DEF off the field you've already made them better.

[fortdick]

If we fix the OL, then I think we need to use a 3rd or 4th to grab another RB. Murray was often injured at OU and got hurt last year. And Felix isn't a workhorse.

With that said, I think getting a truly intimidating OL would be great. By stretching drives and keeping the DEF off the field you've already made them better.

Tanner is a very good number three RB. I don't really think we need to fill that spot. So, that leaves OL.

[MichaelWinicki]

People keep pointing to the draft. The problem with that is you don't know what will be there and you don't want to pick a lesser player when you're on the board. And considering we had 3 OL spots that needed to be upgraded it's highly unlikely to think this team is gonna get that kind of impact from this draft class. We have a hard enough time finding one much less three.

I'm not sure that's an accurate statement, i.e. the 3 position thing. I would be secure in saying the Cowboys believe the number is less than 3.

[reddyuta]

We can make the playoffs if we REALLY fix the o-line(even with our average defense).

[Sitting Bull]

I'm still on the DeCastro train at #14. I remember Romo getting chased and battered; I remember the deep concern our own team had over protecting Romo with an inexperienced line, starting in week 1 against the Jets and recurring every time we faced a "scary" pass rush. I think we deserve a line that dominates and dictates- keeping our offense multi-dimensional and our quarterback upright.

So we squeezed a little productivity from late round picks and UDFAs. It's not enough. The FAs we brought in are challenging those players for depth roles on the 2012 team. DeCastro would start. Upgrade.

Yes, our defense was bad in several games last year. But we kicked way too many field goals ALL year. People were actually wishing for a lineman-sized RB on this team to convert goal-lines and 3rd-and-1, instead of addressing the line. How many times were we able to run out the clock with a lead and earn a kneel-down victory? Once?

DeCastro is versitile, safe and a day-one upgrade. Can we go another direction and be ok? Sure, but it won't change the need for stud Oline players and I really think he is going to be BPA at #14.

[MichaelWinicki]

Our centers at this point, Killer and Costa are both UDFA's. I really think we need to address this spot, but they didn't in FA.


I think center is more of a problem than what guard is.

Put a decent center out there along with Livings on one side and one of the rest on the other side and you would see better interior offensive line play... No question.

[MichaelWinicki]

We can make the playoffs if we REALLY fix the o-line(even with our average defense).

Others would say that if the team fixes the secondary, the team can make the playoffs even with an average interior portion of the offensive line.

[fortdick]

I think center is more of a problem than what guard is.

Put a decent center out there along with Livings on one side and one of the rest on the other side and you would see better interior offensive line play... No question.

Better than last year could still be poor.

[MichaelWinicki]

I'm still on the DeCastro train at #14. I still remember Romo getting chased and battered; I remember the deep concern our own team had over protecting Romo with an inexperienced line, starting in week 1 against the Jets and recurring every time we faced a strong pass rush. I think we deserve a line that dominates and dictates- keeping our offense multi-dimensional and our quarterback upright.


I think there are clearly 3 big upgrades that could be available for the team at #14. DeCastro over any of the interior lineman currently on the roster. Cox over Coleman. And Barron over Pool at safety.

[jobberone]

I don't want Decastro at 14. I still believe you can get guards later on that are good enough to win with. I have no idea if the two signees are good enough but I suspect they are.

Having said that I agree with Hos that Decastro is going to play a long time at a high level. He will be in the top ten players in this draft IMO. So it wouldn't hurt my feelings to draft him. I'd prefer a pass rusher or DB or DL. I don't know if one of those is anywhere near the low risk Decastro is.

I can almost promise you the Cowboys will be looking for a way to improve its pass rush first followed by DBs second though. But they would discuss some players at other positions and could even draft one. Wouldn't surprise me at all.

[ZeroClub]

One thing is for certain, fixing the O-line will make our offense our best defense...

There is a lot of truth to that.

It is good the defense upgraded with Carr, but it'd be unwise to neglect the offense given just how important offense is in today's league.

[SilverStarCowboy]

I think there are clearly 3 big upgrades that could be available for the team at #14. Cox over Coleman.

Brockers/Poe = Ratliff over Coleman

[Afigueroa22]

I don't want Decastro at 14. I still believe you can get guards later on that are good enough to win with.


I don't want someone who is good enough, I want the best in the game. Yes, our defense is a concern but it's not like the Eagles, Giants, and Redskins run a prolific passing game liks the Saints or Green Bay. What the NFC East has is elite pass rushers. JPP and Demarcus Ware headline that group but we are in the division with the likes of Brian Orakpo, Ryan Kerrigan, Trent Cole, Jason Babin, Osi Umenyiora, and Justin Tuck. I would say that O-line is a VERY pressing need in this division.

[MichaelWinicki]

Better than last year could still be poor.

Could also be better than "poor".

[Canadian BoyzFan]

I believe my posts would reflect the fact that I still believe that. I've pimped DeCastro and Konz as being what we need to be in the Super Bowl and win it. I doubt you can find a thread where I've liked any Defensive player at 14.

I also don't believe you can find a single post where I am excited about either Livings or Bernadeau. I expressed excitement over the Free Agency Haul. I certainly do not deny that.

I figured we'd stick with Fiammetta. I actually like Vickers better. The only FB in the NFL I like better is probably Vonta Leach. I am this forums biggest FB shill. Last year my pet cat was Henry Hynoski. We drafted Shaun Chapas, and Hynoski went UDFA to the Giants. Chapas looks like a PS guy. Hynoski looks like a pro. I like Vickers even more than I liked Hynoski. It makes me happy. I won't apologize for being excited about a FB I truly think is a difference maker.

I thought Dan Connors was a lock to the Eagles. He is from Pennsylvania and I read one time that he was an Eagles fan. They have LB needs. I didn't think we had a prayer of landing him. I'll take him over Bradie James or Keith Brooking this year any time. I feel like with him and Carter working with Lee we have the makings of a solid ILB corps. I'd like to add someone in the Draft and I think my mocks have all reflected this.

I didn't think we had a realistic shot at Kyle Orton. If you look back I was talking about Jason Campbell as our best hope at backup QB. I wanted us to take Orton with a waiver claim last year when Denver let him go. We did, but so did the Chiefs and we lost out. I am shocked he agreed to come here as Tony's backup when he possibly could have started for several other teams including Miami, Seattle, San Francisco, or Cleveland for example. Hell, he could have started for the Chiefs again. I won't apologize for being excited that we landed what I think is the best backup we possibly could have.

I know you're not into paying CBs high dollars. I am not on that same train. I really don't care what we pay someone as long as we remain under the cap and improve the team. I do believe Carr will be an improvement over Newman. I didn't dislike Newman, but his time had come and gone. His cost was prohibitive and the results weren't there. I believe Carr's press coverage abilities will allow us to improve defensively. I have nothing against doing that in the D-Backfield. It doesn't bother me. It clearly does bother you. I've never come after you for how you feel about that. Clearly if someone does not agree with you 100% you feel you have to come after them in some other way such as this. That's cool, just don't put thoughts into my head and words in my mouth.

I am excited about the team in 2012. I won't deny it. I think Woicik having a full off season is to our advantage in a huge way. I heard from one guy recently that when he went by VR he was impressed with how many of our guys are there hitting the training hard. It excites me. Football has a way of doing that to me. If you can't be excited unless you get every toy on your list, I can't help you.

I wanted Nicks pretty bad. I liked Grubbs too. I am hopeful the scouting department sees things in Livings and Bernadeau that I am unaware of, but that has never stopped me from wanting DeCastro above all other players in the Draft and I have never moved from my belief that OL has to be our #1 priority. You cannot show me where I have said, "Hey, we're done on OL, let's fix DBs and DL." You can't do it because I have never thought it.

Oh, and not to be too flip about it, but I'd have been excited about Free Agency if the only thing we had done so far was to get rid of a 2nd Kicker. In case you didn't know it, I hate Kickers.

That last part was strictly for fun. Just making that clear.

Yes, I am excited. I am sorry that you aren't. I can't help you there. You have to do that yourself.


My favorite part about Hos is something that I truly believe in and what bothers so much about some fans. He and I are not to apologize for our views our optimism and our fandom of the greatest franchise in sports.

[Risen Star]

Hos and RS let's have peace :bow:

It was merely a discussion of his inconsistency as I see it. I don't see the need for any drama.

[fortdick]

Could also be better than "poor".

"Below average"?

[Risen Star]

I'm not sure that's an accurate statement, i.e. the 3 position thing. I would be secure in saying the Cowboys believe the number is less than 3.

Hey, if you want to trust those talent evaluators go right ahead. If you watched last season you saw it for yourself.

We had three positions on the OL that were subpar last year. Actually four but the LT is going to the right side to try to salvage him. If they view Nate Livings and/or MacKenzie Bernadeau as the kind of upgrades we need at those spots then I'll have to disagree. Those guys are plan B insurance quality.

[Risen Star]

Better than last year could still be poor.

Yeah, that's what I don't get. Why this "get by" mentality in front of Romo but we need to pay through the nose for cornerbacks?

[Canadian BoyzFan]

Yeah, that's what I don't get. Why this "get by" mentality in front of Romo but we need to pay through the nose for cornerbacks?

Let me guess you wanted Grubbs and Nicks?

[MichaelWinicki]

Hey, if you want to trust those talent evaluators go right ahead. If you watched last season you saw it for yourself.

We had three positions on the OL that were subpar last year. Actually four but the LT is going to the right side to try to salvage him. If they view Nate Livings and/or MacKenzie Bernadeau as the kind of upgrades we need at those spots then I'll have to disagree. Those guys are plan B insurance quality.

I don't think the alternative i.e. keeping Gurode, Davis and Colombo would have made much difference, other than creating an even larger salary cap issue.

If you're saying the team hadn't done a good job of finding/creating interior offensive line help the prior 2-3 seasons then I'm on board with that.

The fact is last season was the result of failures past coming home to roost.

I think Livings can be competent. competent competant guard can be found out of the remaining group. Put a decent center out there and I think you'll see a nice improvement.

[MichaelWinicki]

Yeah, that's what I don't get. Why this "get by" mentality in front of Romo but we need to pay through the nose for cornerbacks?

It's because by a wide margin the pass defense was the worst unit out there.

[Risen Star]

It's because by a wide margin the pass defense was the worst unit out there.

I don't even agree with that. We had like 3 rushing TDs from the backs last year. That's historically pathetic.

[SilverStarCowboy]

Were there injuries to the Olinemen last year, were there any rookies or 1st year starters and is this the same scheme?

These are all relevant questions one would have to ask themselves if they were really evaluating talent on their roster.

Ignoring those important questions would not be prudent for anyone trying to improve a football team.

[burmafrd]

Could also be better than "poor".

wow such high standards

[burmafrd]

I don't think the alternative i.e. keeping Gurode, Davis and Colombo would have made much difference, other than creating an even larger salary cap issue.

If you're saying the team hadn't done a good job of finding/creating interior offensive line help the prior 2-3 seasons then I'm on board with that.

The fact is last season was the result of failures past coming home to roost.

I think Livings can be competent. competent competant guard can be found out of the remaining group. Put a decent center out there and I think you'll see a nice improvement.

I see you still try and twist things. Who wanted to keep Colombo? Who wanted to keep Davis?

The one that I and many others worried about letting go was Gurode and that proved exactly the achilles heel of our O line last year

[Risen Star]

Let me guess you wanted Grubbs and Nicks?

Not and, or. One of the two as well as a FA C. That would have put us in a good position going into the draft.

[Bluestang]

I don't know how you can say that FA didn't address our needs because it most certainly did.

Livings/Bernadeau - Kosier/Holland (Upgrade)

Orton - Kitna (Upgrade)

Connor - James (Upgrade)

Carr - Newman (Upgrade)

Vickers - Fiametta (Upgrade)

Now you can't fix everything in FA but we did alot of good work there especially bringing in young veterans. I would have thought a C was in the mix but after seeing what was available that would have meant he would have been a progress stopper for one of the younger guys.
I'm not sure why some folks are up in arms about not getting Nicks or Grubbs. Grubbs is not suited for a zone blocking scheme and there are stats to prove that because his grades dropped drastically after Baltimore switched to a zone blocking scheme last year. Nicks was way too expensive and everyone knew that was the case after he said he wanted to be the highest paid G in the NFL. We can't afford to tie up that kind of $$ in a non-premium position because he would have hamstrung our other FA aquisitions.
Am I happy with Livings and Bernadeau? I can't say I am jumping for joy but after hearing Broaddus talk about Livings it seems like he was being misused in CIN. Bernadeau offers flexibility because he can play C of needed but it looks like a depth move more than anything. Kosier was physically done as much as a great guy he was he graded out worse than Holland. Holland's ceiling is what it is, he can no longer progress but he filled in nicely for the season until he got injured. I expect him to be back as training camp fodder.

[MichaelWinicki]

I don't even agree with that. We had like 3 rushing TDs from the backs last year. That's historically pathetic.

I grant you that.

Should it be better? Yeah.

But the pass defense was abysmal also.

A new and expensive corner was brought in. I expect an early draft pick will be used on the interior of the offensive line.

You can't fix both areas (totally) in one offseason. I know you would rather dedicate all possible resources to the offense line. I get that. But obviously some disagee with that premise.

[Zaxor]

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury. When was this once proud franchise a dynasty? When we had an OL that was opening holes for our running game and protecting our QB.

2011...5 rushing TDs
2010...10 rushing TDs
2009...14 rushing TDs
2008...12 rushing TDs

41 TDs over a 4 year span.

Contrast that to Emmitt Smith alone over the 4 year span of our Dynasty years.

1992...18 rushing TDs
1993...9 rushing TDs
1994...21 rushing TDs
1995...25 rushing TDs

73 rushing TDs over a 4 year span and this doesn't even allow for the rest of the team.

Fix the OL, open holes for Murray and protect Tony Romo. This team cannot be beat.

how'd that oline look before the all time leading rusher got there and how did they look when a replacement was in there and how did they look after the all time leading rusher left and what was there over all record when the all time leading rusher missed a game...just out of curiosity ;)

[MichaelWinicki]

I see you still try and twist things. Who wanted to keep Colombo? Who wanted to keep Davis?

The one that I and many others worried about letting go was Gurode and that proved exactly the achilles heel of our O line last year

And Gurode promptly went to the Ravens and played like crap.

Like it or dislike it, stick a fork in Gurode... He's done.

[cowboysooner]

I don't wpriant someone who is good enough, I want the best in the game. Yes, our defense is a concern but it's not like the Eagles, Giants, and Redskins run a prolific passing game liks the Saints or Green Bay. What the NFC East has is elite pass rushers. JPP and Demarcus Ware headline that group but we are in the division with the likes of Brian Orakpo, Ryan Kerrigan, Trent Cole, Jason Babin, Osi Umenyiora, and Justin Tuck. I would say that O-line is a VERY pressing need in this division.

You just listed 8 defensive ends as a reason to draft a guard. If this were a division of big boys like the AFC north where you have to run on Cody, Ngata, the Steelers 1st round front, the Browns 1st and 2nd round front or the Bengals deep and underrated dt rotation I'd understand.

There is a huge difference in what Kosier and Nagy were last year and average guards. I can't explain why we did not go sign a center this year to replace Costa because there were some very good players at reasonable prices and some old players that can give you a year for cheap. With Costa, Nagy, and Arkin you are talking about young players who can improve. Drafting 2 cheap positions with your first 2 picks is about the same as taking 9 million in cap space and setting it ablaze.

With the defensive line you have 2 30 year old guys that stink and make $5million, a 30 year guy who desperately needs his snaps decreased, a cheap decent player in his prime that gets hurt every year and a 7th round rotational player headed into his 3rd year. At corner you have 3 guys in a defense where you need 4 or 5. There is Spencer's contract and the need in the NFL to have at least 4 good pass receiving threats and you have 3 and some street free agents at wr 3-5 and te 2. You can't go readdressing a cheap position with a first and second round pick that you have addressed with 2 picks last year and 2 free agents this year. No one would do it.

I'd like to see us have a defensive lineman that caused problems for the Giants' and Redskins' soft middle of their offensive line and not just let Lesean McCoy rattle off zone read handoffs at 6 yards a pop.

[btcutter]

We can make the playoffs if we REALLY fix the o-line(even with our average defense).

There's nothing average about our defense last year.

We may have scored more but that still won't prevent the D from giving up more scores either.

[Afigueroa22]

You just listed 8 defensive ends as a reason to draft a guard.


Actually D.Ware, Orakpo, and Kerrigan are linebackers but I am guessing you mean a guard has nothing to do with either a DE or OLB. The tackles are not always the ones blocking these guys, most of the time but not always. I can remember quite a few times these guys stunted inside to get the sack. Guards don't just open holes or go against DTs, they have to help the tackle on some plays too.

[Manwiththeplan]

I will go one step better and say that there isn't a defensive player in this draft that would start for us on opening day. DeCastro would do that. Konz may very well start as well.

Not true at all, both Barron and Cox and possibly Poe/Brockers would. Kenyon Coleman and Brodney Pool aren't any better than Livings and the guy from Carolina.

[sonnyboy]

The case for defense:

In 2011, we had a good offense. In 2011, we had a bad defense.

Really?

We were 15th in points scored and 11th in yards gained.

We were 16th in points allowed and 14th in yards allowed.

So let me do the math.....hmmm 32 teams in the league. OK by math both units were average.

Now if you drill down a little further within those numbers you'll see that the defense rushed the passer and defended the run far better than it defended the pass.

You'll also see that the team passed the ball better than it ran it. Especially in short yardage and goal line situations as evidenced by our 5 Rushing TDs.

I'm no expert, but I'd say that leads me to believe that the 2012 offseason should be spent upgrading our OL and Secondary.

[jobberone]

I think center is more of a problem than what guard is.

Put a decent center out there along with Livings on one side and one of the rest on the other side and you would see better interior offensive line play... No question.

I view C as the biggest problem on offense right now. I am anxious to see how the guards esp the new ones play.

[Doomsday]

I really want DeCastro but after watching the off season moves in addition to the last 10 seasons, it is hard to believe that Dallas puts a really high priority on the position.

I think Barron is going to be the pick. If so it is hard to argue with it too much considering how poorly the secondary played last season. My only issue is the offensive line play from the Eagles games is sitting in the back of my head saying we have to fix this to be a legitimate contender.

[SilverStarCowboy]

I really want DeCastro but after watching the off season moves in addition to the last 10 seasons, it is hard to believe that Dallas puts a really high priority on the position.

I think Barron is going to be the pick. If so it is hard to argue with it too much considering how poorly the secondary played last season. My only issue is the offensive line play from the Eagles games is sitting in the back of my head saying we have to fix this to be a legitimate contender.


Barron is an in the box Strong Safety it's what he played almost exclusively in College, his skill set is the likes of what we already know does not work in the NFL...ie the Roy Williams experience.

Dallas knows where the league is headed first hand, they doubtfully want to draft another player that won't be able to contribute in 4 years.

[BAT]

This is fair, but I am going to tell you what I think. There is not a Defensive player in this draft that will end up being a better pro football player than the guy I have pimped like a fool, David DeCastro. 20 years down the road when all these kids in this class are done people are going to look back at this draft and say he was the best player taken. The only way that is not said is if Luck or Griffin win multiple Super Bowls or Trent Richardson breaks Emmitt's record.

For all the talk about you don't take OGs that high, tell me one player in the 1994 Draft you'd take over Larry Allen in hindsight. Marshall Faulk...maybe.

I absolutely LOVE Larry Allen. And he helped the Cowboys to their last SB. But the Cowboys did not need a guard the caliber of LA to win the previous 2, nor was he the reason (or even a top 5 reason) for the Cowboys championship.

Faulk (and Warner) were the reasons for the Greatest Show on Turf dominance and run to two SB. Marshal Faulk may be a jerk, but his position (RB) is more determinant of championship contention. Even in today's pass friendly era, Faulk would be more important than any OG. Even if he was the greatest OL in NFL history.

[jobberone]

I don't want someone who is good enough, I want the best in the game. Yes, our defense is a concern but it's not like the Eagles, Giants, and Redskins run a prolific passing game liks the Saints or Green Bay. What the NFC East has is elite pass rushers. JPP and Demarcus Ware headline that group but we are in the division with the likes of Brian Orakpo, Ryan Kerrigan, Trent Cole, Jason Babin, Osi Umenyiora, and Justin Tuck. I would say that O-line is a VERY pressing need in this division.

With limited resources you need to allocate where you are going to spend your money. That's a big part of the game now. You aren't going to run the ball that much but you do need to be able to make short yardage when necessary. If we have guards that can do this and pass block well then we need to spend our money elsewhere. Again it won't hurt my feelings to get Decastro.

[Hostile]

It was merely a discussion of his inconsistency as I see it. I don't see the need for any drama.I don't see where I have been inconsistent. I want 2 OL with our first 4 picks and I have never wavered on that.

[Afigueroa22]

I don't see where I have been inconsistent. I want 2 OL with our first 4 picks and I have never wavered on that.

I would be happy with that draft.

[Afigueroa22]

I absolutely LOVE Larry Allen. And he helped the Cowboys to their last SB. But the Cowboys did not need a guard the caliber of LA to win the previous 2, nor was he the reason (or even a top 5 reason) for the Cowboys championship.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFcWMC9vkZg

[Mr Cowboy]

I don't see where I have been inconsistent. I want 2 OL with our first 4 picks and I have never wavered on that.

I agree with this, I would be prefer to build a domonant offense, and use the rest of the draft to get quality defensive depth. I would rather be dominant on one side of the ball than mediocre on both sides of the ball.

[Hostile]

how'd that oline look before the all time leading rusher got there and how did they look when a replacement was in there and how did they look after the all time leading rusher left and what was there over all record when the all time leading rusher missed a game...just out of curiosity ;)In my opinion, Larry Allen was a dominant force always and would have been even without Emmitt. Erik Williams was until a car wreck. Nate Newton could have been that good on any team. Ray Donaldson was great long before he got here. Tuinei may be the only one who was great mostly because of Emmitt.

[Bluefin]

In my opinion, Larry Allen was a dominant force always and would have been even without Emmitt. Erik Williams was until a car wreck. Nate Newton could have been that good on any team. Ray Donaldson was great long before he got here. Tuinei may be the only one who was great mostly because of Emmitt.

Those lines were so good, there were two reserves who left as free agents and went to 3 Pro Bowls apiece.

Ron Stone and Kevin Gogan.

[Flinger]

Mr. Prosecutor, may the Defense offer a rebuttal? The Defense agrees that this proud franchise was once a dynasty. We agree that we did have an OL opening holes for our running game and protecting our QB. We agree that we would like to see that dynasty restored.

However, using the same logic as the prosecutor, according to NFL.com, the Defense gave up:

2011… 347 points and 38 TD’s
2010… 426 points and 51 TD’s
2009… 250 points and 28 TD’s
2008… 365 points and 36 TD’s

1398 points and 153 TD’s given up over a period of 4 years.

1992… 243 points and 29 TD’s
1993… 229 points and 25 TD’s
1994… 248 points and 27 TD’s
1995… 291 points and 32 TD’s

1011 points and 113 TD’s given up over a period of 4 years.

Romo and his Offensive have not been the problem. They have addressed the OL this off season and that will help. But, fix the Defense and the Offense will not be expected to do the impossible every year. Then, other teams will not beat this team...

[BAT]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFcWMC9vkZg

Love that clip. But it does nothing to counter my point, LA's greatness is not in question. We are discussing his position's importance to championship teams.

[BAT]

In my opinion, Larry Allen was a dominant force always and would have been even without Emmitt. Erik Williams was until a car wreck. Nate Newton could have been that good on any team. Ray Donaldson was great long before he got here. Tuinei may be the only one who was great mostly because of Emmitt.

Erik Williams and LA were no doubt great. But even their greatness could not elevate their teams when they blocked for Sherman Williams, Curvin Richards, Blair Thomas or Troy Hambrick.

Even former pro bowlers did not enjoy "greatness" behind Emmitt's OL: Chris Warren, Herschel Walker, Eddie George

These great OL did not become "great" until Emmitt arrived. In Pearlman's Boys Will Be Boys, Tony Wise tried to rally his OL stating that it was not Emmitt who made them great, but the OL. Not one OL bought it. Both Erik Williams and Nate Newton candidly admitted to this years later.

No doubt Emmitt needed his OL, almost as much as his OL needed him. But Emmitt made that OL, that Offense, that team ... achieve a whole other level of success.

[mensaone]

And I been sayin all this time go ahead an finish what we started last year

fix the O line

Draft Decastro

and if no Konz then Brewster or Blake

[mensaone]

There is not a Defensive player in this draft that will end up being a better pro football player than, David DeCastro.


HERE HERE

[Doomsday]

Barron is an in the box Strong Safety it's what he played almost exclusively in College, his skill set is the likes of what we already know does not work in the NFL...ie the Roy Williams experience.

Dallas knows where the league is headed first hand, they doubtfully want to draft another player that won't be able to contribute in 4 years.

I disagree, he has a lot more speed and range than Roy Williams ever had. He might not be a man coverage guy but he can play the ball and has good range.

[TheDallasDon]

I disagree, he has a lot more speed and range than Roy Williams ever had. He might not be a man coverage guy but he can play the ball and has good range.

If we get some pass rush from are Dline and LBrs then the backend would look alot better

[InmanRoshi]

If NFL GMs read this thread they would be laughing their collective butts off.

[Beast_from_East]

Make no mistake about it, we are going to go Defense heavy in this Draft. I know that is going to happen. I just don't think it is the right way to go.

Agree 100% Hostile, the o-line has got to be fixed before this team can take the next step and Livingston and Berdaeu or however you spell his name is like puting a band aid on a severed limb.


If we pass on DeCastoro and Konz and go defense heavy, I guarantee you we will not make the playoffs next season.

Your boy Garrett is not good enough to make chicken salad out of chicken $%^& and if signing 2 JAGs was the plan to fix the oline then it really is chicken #$%^.


My .02

[Beast_from_East]

There is not a Defensive player in this draft that will end up being a better pro football player than, David DeCastro.


HERE HERE


Agree 100%


However, I am also 100% convinced that our idiot HC and GM are going to take a freaking safety over him.


If we pass on DeCastro we will not make the playoffs next year, because those 2 JAGs we signed are not going to get the job done.

[Zaxor]

In my opinion, Larry Allen was a dominant force always and would have been even without Emmitt. Erik Williams was until a car wreck. Nate Newton could have been that good on any team. Ray Donaldson was great long before he got here. Tuinei may be the only one who was great mostly because of Emmitt.

Yet my friend, even so, no matter who we stuck back there the cowboys had no wins when the all time leading rusher didn't play...that oline wasn't able to carry that team even with Aikman, Irvin and the rest of the crew...see the first 2 games of the 93 season...and as Nate himself said they were just ordinary till Emmitt got there than they were great...

let me put it another way since the Cowboys last SB how many SB winners had "GREAT" offensive lines...I grant you they were all solid but how many "GREAT" ones I can't think of any that would put at least 2 of there members in the HOF...

I think a solid Oline is important and it can't be played by chumps...but I think it is less a priority to have great players there because you can get by very well with a solid cohesive unit.

We had little to no continuity last year and little to no experience which equates to no cohesion and as you well know my friend an oline without cohesion cannot long survive the rigors of a NFL season yet ours did a remarkable job when you think about it as a whole...of course lots of credit goes to Tony and playmakers along with the offensive coaches but still a noteworthy effort by the oline.

give it time

[Zaxor]

I will take a gentlemen's bet that DeCastro will be nothing more than solid and will take him at least 6 years before he gets one probowl and he will not be a HOFer and I will go further and say there will be atleast someone in this draft other than the QB's that will be a HOFer.

My reason for saying this is I believe that DeCastro is at or close to his ceiling and he hasn't blocked anybody close(in his college career) to a NFL caliber backup let alone Starter in the NFL and the games that I watched he wasn't all that dominating unless pulling and hitting smaller guys (which he did great).

I realize that I am out on this limb alone on this one it is after all my opinion and others have other opinions just as smelly but thats okay...the best thing about it is we will see if I am wrong heck it won't bother me a bit and I will have to go back and try and see what it was I missed so I can be smarter next time I venture out on a limb and if I am right well I will have the satisfaction that I didn't see gold were there was none.

ooops forgot to state a bet...I will wager you a home grilled steak and a beer (if you are of legal age) should you happen by my way and I want the same in return

[burmafrd]

If NFL GMs read this thread they would be laughing their collective butts off.

Certainly Matt Millen might. oh wait

[burmafrd]

I will take a gentlemen's bet that DeCastro will be nothing more than solid and will take him at least 6 years before he gets one probowl and he will not be a HOFer and I will go further and say there will be atleast someone in this draft other than the QB's that will be a HOFer.

My reason for saying this is I believe that DeCastro is at or close to his ceiling and he hasn't blocked anybody close(in his college career) to a NFL caliber backup let alone Starter in the NFL and the games that I watched he wasn't all that dominating unless pulling and hitting smaller guys (which he did great).

I realize that I am out on this limb alone on this one it is after all my opinion and others have other opinions just as smelly but thats okay...the best thing about it is we will see if I am wrong heck it won't bother me a bit and I will have to go back and try and see what it was I missed so I can be smarter next time I venture out on a limb and if I am right well I will have the satisfaction that I didn't see gold were there was none.

ooops forgot to state a bet...I will wager you a home grilled steak and a beer (if you are of legal age) should you happen by my way and I want the same in return

you are full of crap. All the way. But hey that is your right to be full of crap.

Who did DeMarcus Ware work over in his time in college? EPIC FAIL ON YOUR PART

[Zaxor]

you are full of crap. All the way. But hey that is your right to be full of crap.

Who did DeMarcus Ware work over in his time in college? EPIC FAIL ON YOUR PART

you crack me up...you try so hard...but still come up very small over and over again

[InmanRoshi]

Really?

We were 15th in points scored and 11th in yards gained.

We were 16th in points allowed and 14th in yards allowed.

So let me do the math.....hmmm 32 teams in the league. OK by math both units were average.

Now if you drill down a little further within those numbers you'll see that the defense rushed the passer and defended the run far better than it defended the pass.

You'll also see that the team passed the ball better than it ran it. Especially in short yardage and goal line situations as evidenced by our 5 Rushing TDs.

I'm no expert, but I'd say that leads me to believe that the 2012 offseason should be spent upgrading our OL and Secondary.


Because passing efficiency has the highest correalation to winning percentage.

We were 4th in the NFL in offensive passing efficiency.

25th in the NFL in defensive passer rating allowed.

It's not rocket science.

[InmanRoshi]

If any NFL offensive line or coordinator coach came to their General Manager and said they needed nothing but 1st round draft picks and guys with 30 million dollar signing bonuses to field a good offensive line, he should be promptly laughed and/or fired on the spot. It's absolutely unprecedented in the NFL how much resources you think we have to sink in the OL to field a good unit. Some of you act like we should trade DeMarcus Ware for an interior linemen if we can't get one in the first round.


Apparently some people think Jason Garrett is an absolutely horrible offensive coach. Even the biggest Garrett hater doesn't make such a damning case against him as his fanboys.

[Hostile]

I will take a gentlemen's bet that DeCastro will be nothing more than solid and will take him at least 6 years before he gets one probowl and he will not be a HOFer and I will go further and say there will be atleast someone in this draft other than the QB's that will be a HOFer.

My reason for saying this is I believe that DeCastro is at or close to his ceiling and he hasn't blocked anybody close(in his college career) to a NFL caliber backup let alone Starter in the NFL and the games that I watched he wasn't all that dominating unless pulling and hitting smaller guys (which he did great).

I realize that I am out on this limb alone on this one it is after all my opinion and others have other opinions just as smelly but thats okay...the best thing about it is we will see if I am wrong heck it won't bother me a bit and I will have to go back and try and see what it was I missed so I can be smarter next time I venture out on a limb and if I am right well I will have the satisfaction that I didn't see gold were there was none.

ooops forgot to state a bet...I will wager you a home grilled steak and a beer (if you are of legal age) should you happen by my way and I want the same in returnI'll take your bet minus the beer for me. He will go to the Pro Bowl as a rookie.

[visionary]

In round 1 I will be happy if:

1) the pick is DL (give me Cox in rd 1 and Chapman in rd 3/4 and our DL could be set for a long time and put real pressure on the QB)
2) the pick is OL (second to DL only because there are really really good options available at the top/middle of rd 2, give me Silatolu in rd 2 and Blake in rd 4)
3) trade down
4) Barron

in that order of preference

[burmafrd]

you crack me up...you try so hard...but still come up very small over and over again

got no answer do you? Maybe you ought to think before you post in the future

[burmafrd]

If any NFL offensive line or coordinator coach came to their General Manager and said they needed nothing but 1st round draft picks and guys with 30 million dollar signing bonuses to field a good offensive line, he should be promptly laughed and/or fired on the spot. It's absolutely unprecedented in the NFL how much resources you think we have to sink in the OL to field a good unit. Some of you act like we should trade DeMarcus Ware for an interior linemen if we can't get one in the first round.


Apparently some people think Jason Garrett is an absolutely horrible offensive coach. Even the biggest Garrett hater doesn't make such a damning case against him as his fanboys.

and once again you sound ridiculous. But if that is your gig....

[SilverStarCowboy]

Because passing efficiency has the highest correalation to winning percentage.

We were 4th in the NFL in offensive passing efficiency.

25th in the NFL in defensive passer rating allowed.

It's not rocket science.

Rocket Surgery is for girls...lol

When you have a young Oline it's best to let them develope over at least a 3 year period. The young guns we started will get head and shoulders better with the experience they got a year ago. Those kids were thrown into the fire, well they were forged into something, we have to take a look and see what was crafted.

That goes for Costa too.

[InmanRoshi]

and once again you sound ridiculous. But if that is your gig....

I'm not the one saying it's the offense's fault we lost 37-34 to the Giants in a potential NFC East clinching game in December. That's utterly pants on the head retarded.

I truly feel embarrassed for people who think the defensive personnel is remotely passable. It's kinda like saying Andre Gurode is a Pro Bowler when he's now working on two consecutive offseasons of sitting out on the open market without getting a starting job offer from anyone.

[jterrell]

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury. When was this once proud franchise a dynasty? When we had an OL that was opening holes for our running game and protecting our QB.

2011...5 rushing TDs
2010...10 rushing TDs
2009...14 rushing TDs
2008...12 rushing TDs

41 TDs over a 4 year span.

Contrast that to Emmitt Smith alone over the 4 year span of our Dynasty years.

1992...18 rushing TDs
1993...9 rushing TDs
1994...21 rushing TDs
1995...25 rushing TDs

73 rushing TDs over a 4 year span and this doesn't even allow for the rest of the team.

Fix the OL, open holes for Murray and protect Tony Romo. This team cannot be beat.

Those teams also had the best DL group in football as well as a top notch secondary.

You give us the best everything we will win another SB or 3. :)

[jterrell]

I'll take your bet minus the beer for me. He will go to the Pro Bowl as a rookie.

He will likely not go to the Pro Bowl as a rookie. Honestly he'd have to be beyond superb to do so. OGs don't have direct stats or peer respect as rookies. But it won't be 6 years either.

Iupati is pretty good and still hasn't made it. The NFC is stacked at OG.
The AFC is solid but there is a spot to be had.

[Hostile]

He will likely not go to the Pro Bowl as a rookie. Honestly he'd have to be beyond superb to do so. OGs don't have direct stats or peer respect as rookies. But it won't be 6 years either.

Iupati is pretty good and still hasn't made it. The NFC is stacked at OG.
The AFC is solid but there is a spot to be had.I'll stand by what I said. He goes as a rookie.

[dallasfaniac]

I think we need to address the O Line, Pass rush and secondary in the first three rounds of the draft but not necessarily in that order.

Something like

1st (DeCastro, Mercilus or Barron)
2nd (Zeitler/Silatolu, Crick/Irvin/Lewis or Johnson/Hosley)
3rd (Jones/Washington, Ta'amu/Spence or Boykin/Iloka)

[Zaxor]

I'll take your bet minus the beer for me. He will go to the Pro Bowl as a rookie.

I like mine medium my dear friend and you have to show me around tucson :)

[Zaxor]

got no answer do you? Maybe you ought to think before you post in the future

sure I do Burm but you won't like it...but seeing how it is you I will try to explain it in simple enough terms that you can understand it :) some guys like DeMarcus, Miles, Tony weren't big enough or weren't highly recruited or whatever...etc to go to a div I school...but with time developed into good enough players for the NFL...while those guys in Div I were big enough and more highly recruited. The guys in Div I have for the most part every advantage to reach their potential be it coaches, equipment and/or training. so while those in Div II or lower do not have to go against NFL caliber talent those that developed into NFL caliber talent have a greater ceiling...while those in Div I may also improve their ceiling won't be as great not that this is true for every single player of course but for the majority it proves to be true.

[Afigueroa22]

Love that clip. But it does nothing to counter my point, LA's greatness is not in question. We are discussing his position's importance to championship teams.


Yeah I know I just like it too.

[Afigueroa22]

He will likely not go to the Pro Bowl as a rookie. Honestly he'd have to be beyond superb to do so. OGs don't have direct stats or peer respect as rookies. But it won't be 6 years either.

Iupati is pretty good and still hasn't made it. The NFC is stacked at OG.
The AFC is solid but there is a spot to be had.


M.Pouncy made it for the Steelers.

[Zaxor]

another opinion

from Lance Zeirlein in Houston those who know this guy will know he is the know


32. NY Giants
Amini Silatolu
Guard | Midwestern State


Silatolu could end up going much earlier than this. One scout tells me "he is the best guard in the draft... better than the kid from Stanford." Silatolu's power would be a welcome commodity along the Giants offensive line as they look to re-establish their running game.


New offensive line coach Bill Callahan thought so much of this guy that he did a private workout with him after his college pro day. according to DC.com

[fortdick]

another opinion

from Lance Zeirlein in Houston those who know this guy will know he is the know


32. NY Giants
Amini Silatolu
Guard | Midwestern State


Silatolu could end up going much earlier than this. One scout tells me "he is the best guard in the draft... better than the kid from Stanford." Silatolu's power would be a welcome commodity along the Giants offensive line as they look to re-establish their running game.


New offensive line coach Bill Callahan thought so much of this guy that he did a private workout with him after his college pro day. according to DC.com

I have watched some film on both. No comparison. The "kid from Stanford" is head a shoulders better.

[juck]

Hos is spot on. The OL needs the interior fixed with starters. Decastro and konz:D

[jterrell]

M.Pouncy made it for the Steelers.

at center not guard.

[jterrell]

I have watched some film on both. No comparison. The "kid from Stanford" is head a shoulders better.

where'd you get your 'scouting degree" from?

i have no issue with you disagreeing but claiming some sort of authority from watching clips is a joke.

[fortdick]

where'd you get your 'scouting degree" from?

i have no issue with you disagreeing but claiming some sort of authority from watching clips is a joke.

Same place you got yours. Because I don't agree with you, I don't know anything? I can watch film and see what happens on the field. A guy that plays better in Div 1 than the guy in Div 2 is, in my mind, better.

Sorry you had to be rude.

[Hostile]

I like mine medium my dear friend and you have to show me around tucson :)
There is no one better at it. This is my town man.

[visionary]

Same place you got yours. Because I don't agree with you, I don't know anything? I can watch film and see what happens on the field. A guy that plays better in Div 1 than the guy in Div 2 is, in my mind, better.

Sorry you had to be rude.

what he means is that the post you quoted was quoting a scout as saying that silatolu is better than decastro

you may disagree with it but you are not a scout

[fortdick]

what he means is that the post you quoted was quoting a scout as saying that silatolu is better than decastro

you may disagree with it but you are not a scout

And I can quote 10 that says otherwise. The fact that I have seen the difference convinces me.

[gimmesix]

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury. When was this once proud franchise a dynasty? When we had an OL that was opening holes for our running game and protecting our QB.

2011...5 rushing TDs
2010...10 rushing TDs
2009...14 rushing TDs
2008...12 rushing TDs

41 TDs over a 4 year span.

Contrast that to Emmitt Smith alone over the 4 year span of our Dynasty years.

1992...18 rushing TDs
1993...9 rushing TDs
1994...21 rushing TDs
1995...25 rushing TDs

73 rushing TDs over a 4 year span and this doesn't even allow for the rest of the team.

Fix the OL, open holes for Murray and protect Tony Romo. This team cannot be beat.

My case comes down to this, which line is better:

DE Hatcher, NT Ratliff, DE Lissemore/Spears

or

LT Smith, LG Livings/Nagy, C Costa/Kowalski, RG Bernadeau, RT Free

[gimmesix]

I'm also starting to think that all of the offensive linemen I think can really help this team (DeCastro, Glenn, Konz, Silatolu, Zeitler) are going to be gone before Dallas picks at 45.

It's a strong class and because of that, more interior linemen are going to be taken earlier than usual from the teens on IMO.

Our only hope in the second round might be Brandon Brooks.

[BAT]

another opinion

from Lance Zeirlein in Houston those who know this guy will know he is the know


32. NY Giants
Amini Silatolu
Guard | Midwestern State


Silatolu could end up going much earlier than this. One scout tells me "he is the best guard in the draft... better than the kid from Stanford." Silatolu's power would be a welcome commodity along the Giants offensive line as they look to re-establish their running game.


New offensive line coach Bill Callahan thought so much of this guy that he did a private workout with him after his college pro day. according to DC.com
O:D
Nice too know that there others who see this - even better, Callahan is one of them.

[InmanRoshi]

I'm also starting to think that all of the offensive linemen I think can really help this team (DeCastro, Glenn, Konz, Silatolu, Zeitler) are going to be gone before Dallas picks at 45.

It's a strong class and because of that, more interior linemen are going to be taken earlier than usual from the teens on IMO.

Our only hope in the second round might be Brandon Brooks.

Teams will probably be reaching for tackles because there are only 5 or 6 quality ones in the entire draft, and about half the league is looking or a starting tackle. Guys like Jeff Allen and Glenn might get drafted because teams think they can play tackle.

The true interior linemen aren't going to be reached for. There will be several of them to choose from #45 if that's where the Cowboys want to go.

[Hostile]

My case comes down to this, which line is better:

DE Hatcher, NT Ratliff, DE Lissemore/Spears

or

LT Smith, LG Livings/Nagy, C Costa/Kowalski, RG Bernadeau, RT FreeI trust the DL infinitely more, rather the front 7, because the LBs in a 3-4 should be factored into the equation.

[gimmesix]

Teams will probably be reaching for tackles because there are only 5 or 6 quality ones in the entire draft, and about half the league is looking or a starting tackle. Guys like Jeff Allen and Glenn might get drafted because teams think they can play tackle.

The true interior linemen aren't going to be reached for. There will be several of them to choose from #45 if that's where the Cowboys want to go.

Not sure. In looking at who is available, I could easily see the interior linemen coming off the board late in the first round and early in the second. With possibly four interior linemen being taken in the first (DeCastro, Glenn, Konz and Silatolu). Even Zeitler might be a consideration there.

[gimmesix]

I trust the DL infinitely more, rather the front 7, because the LBs in a 3-4 should be factored into the equation.

I agree, but I also think the top three among the DL showed their worth. The run defense was solid, Hatcher was outstanding at times when healthy and Lissemore stood out in a limited number of snaps.

I can't really say that about the interior of the offensive line. We know nothing about how Bernadeau and Livings will do, but they didn't prove their worth with their former teams, Costa had few good moments and we really don't know much about Nagy or Arkin, other than the fact both needed to get stronger (same with Kowalski, really).

[cowboysooner]

Teams will probably be reaching for tackles because there are only 5 or 6 quality ones in the entire draft, and about half the league is looking or a starting tackle. Guys like Jeff Allen and Glenn might get drafted because teams think they can play tackle.

The true interior linemen aren't going to be reached for. There will be several of them to choose from #45 if that's where the Cowboys want to go.

Interior linemen are going to fall because quarterbacks, tackles and pass rushers rise. Given the demand in the free agent market for corners and wide receivers they could be overdrafted too. This will push running backs, interior offensive linemen, tight ends and conventional linebackers way down. This happens almost every year. The lack of good tackles in this draft is something we have not paid attention to b/c the Cowboys are relatively set there.

[jterrell]

Same place you got yours. Because I don't agree with you, I don't know anything? I can watch film and see what happens on the field. A guy that plays better in Div 1 than the guy in Div 2 is, in my mind, better.

Sorry you had to be rude.

I dont disagree with you.
I disagree with your method and fake authority.

I believe DeCastro is better but I do not KNOW. I have seen DeCastro play a fair amount. I haven't watched the other kid enough to know him.

Watching actual full games with DeCastro he never gets beat but he also doesn't dominate. Not in Larry Allen pancake two guys fashion. He isn't as impressive in college as Andre Gurode was (IMHO) as a Buff. Gurode used to regularly drive people through the back of the end zone. But Gurode always struggled with mental parts of the game and DeCastro can call the OL plays and adjustments if need be apparently.

DeCastro is a very good player to be sure. But we haven't seen enough OGs go top 15 to say what one should look like.

[Hostile]

I dont disagree with you.
I disagree with your method and fake authority.

I believe DeCastro is better but I do not KNOW. I have seen DeCastro play a fair amount. I haven't watched the other kid enough to know him.

Watching actual full games with DeCastro he never gets beat but he also doesn't dominate. Not in Larry Allen pancake two guys fashion. He isn't as impressive in college as Andre Gurode was (IMHO) as a Buff. Gurode used to regularly drive people through the back of the end zone. But Gurode always struggled with mental parts of the game and DeCastro can call the OL plays and adjustments if need be apparently.

DeCastro is a very good player to be sure. But we haven't seen enough OGs go top 15 to say what one should look like.Not sure what games you were watching then. He does dominate. I've seen him flatten more than one guy on the same play, and he's way more impressive than Gurode was.

[jterrell]

My case comes down to this, which line is better:

DE Hatcher, NT Ratliff, DE Lissemore/Spears

or

LT Smith, LG Livings/Nagy, C Costa/Kowalski, RG Bernadeau, RT Free


Let's see:

Smith(top 10 pick and pro bowl caliber kid at 21)
Livings(Lower end starter but consistently able to play and start 16 games)
C : Best of Costa/Kowalski/Nagy ?? for sure.
Bern/Arkin Top Back up on great OL.
Free: former LT and a guy we had locked in for 6 years at big money.

Hatcher - 1 dimensional guy who struggles to stay healthy
Ratliff - Declining but at times dominate player.
Spears/Lissemore - Either below average starter or very low draft pick with no real pass rush stats.

End of the day the best player in either group is easily Smith. Second most coveted is probably Doug Free. (Age and ability to play both OT spots over Ratliff's former superiority)
Worst player looks like whatever ends up at Center.
Neither OG spots are manned by world beaters but that OG duo is hardly to be bagged upon. The OG and DE groups are about even IMHO. Our OT situation is light years ahead of anything along the DL.

At worst this is a tie. Also you add in Callahan who is one of the most coveted OL coaches in football and I'd lean to fixing the DL all things being equal.

[cowboysooner]

Not sure what games you were watching then. He does dominate. I've seen him flatten more than one guy on the same play, and he's way more impressive than Gurode was.

He is one of the best guards I have ever seen in space, whether pulling, trapping or sealing a linebacker on the second level. He is not as good (or really doesn't have the film) of driving back the NFL level defensive tackle lined up across from him. Part of the problem is the lack of good dt's in the PAC 12. Cordy Glenn manhandled some NFL caliber guys at the senior bowl. I don't see a bunch of film where DeCastro does that.

[BrAinPaiNt]

Not sure what games you were watching then. He does dominate. I've seen him flatten more than one guy on the same play, and he's way more impressive than Gurode was.

Not sure about multiple guys on the same play but I have seen a couple of plays where he pulled and knocked the guy so good the defensive player looked like a tumble weed rolling backwards in the wind. :laugh2:

[InmanRoshi]

He's not as impressive as Gurode was in college. CU won the Big XII, was ranked in the Top 5 in the polls and averaged over 200 yards rushing a game just by running Chris Brown and Bobby Purify behind Gurode on almost every play.

[jterrell]

Not sure what games you were watching then. He does dominate. I've seen him flatten more than one guy on the same play, and he's way more impressive than Gurode was.

I watched ND, OKST and at least a couple more.

Perhaps he was better in the PAC 12 games against those squishy West Coasters:)

My daughter wants to go play basketball for Stanford so I have a soft spot for them.

I watched Gurode absolutely abuse UT in college. It was embarrassing to even be from the state of Texas watching that game.

[cowboysooner]

I watched ND, OKST and at least a couple more.

Perhaps he was better in the PAC 12 games against those squishy West Coasters:)

My daughter wants to go play basketball for Stanford so I have a soft spot for them.

I watched Gurode absolutely abuse UT in college. It was embarrassing to even be from the state of Texas watching that game.

Gurode owned a bunch of NFL dt's from Nebraska too. He was a great run blocking guard.

[Sasquatch]

I watched ND, OKST and at least a couple more.

Perhaps he was better in the PAC 12 games against those squishy West Coasters:)

My daughter wants to go play basketball for Stanford so I have a soft spot for them.

I watched Gurode absolutely abuse UT in college. It was embarrassing to even be from the state of Texas watching that game.

Gurode was a monster at UC. I was so excited when we got him.

[btcutter]

Based on past drafts in the past OL except T tends to get pushed down into the 2nd round while DL tends to get over drafted in the 1st round especially toward end of round 1.

It would be harder to get a quality DL vs OL in the 2nd in general. I don't want us to be reaching for a DL in the 2nd for 3rd round quality.

That being said. We needs to set our board and trust/follow it. Don't talk our way into drafting a lesser players just because....that just spells trouble.

This team has too may holes to be passing on the highest rated player on our board.

[Zaxor]

yeah I was glad we got Gurode also he was such a road grader in college...

and like I said I have seen DeCastro pull and bowl over people 100 or so lbs lighter than himself.... also seen him get no push what so ever on some guys... Good thing about it the draft is a few days away and soon we all will get to see how they all turn out like Hos said its Christmas in April

[jterrell]

Gurode owned a bunch of NFL dt's from Nebraska too. He was a great run blocking guard.

I have never seen a more dominate OG in college. He stood out in games long before he was ever on the radar for me as a potential draftee. I was rooting against CU every time and he was just nasty.

DeCastro I seldom noticed. Eyes were drawn to Luck obviously. I still have the OKST bowl game on tape and when I watched the replay focusing on DeCastro he was never beaten but he also didn't look like a Gurode or Larry Allen. He looked more like Moose Johnson. He was always out on screens or swing passes and tosses. A few times he was out ahead and plays were made behind him but no one went through him ever. Inline he didn't get beaten but generally stonewalled his guy not moving him or allowing him to move.

At the Senior Bowl he couldn't handle edge rushers in drills. But he was again clean in the game. He is a true pulling OG. Probably even a prototypical one for most offenses. I do believe he is a top 15 player but after my positional adjustment I wouldn't draft him til 18-22.

I would take him before Tannehill and any WR in this class however. I'd have to seriously debate either him or Barron.

[cowboysooner]

Based on past drafts in the past OL except T tends to get pushed down into the 2nd round while DL tends to get over drafted in the 1st round especially toward end of round 1.

It would be harder to get a quality DL vs OL in the 2nd in general. I don't want us to be reaching for a DL in the 2nd for 3rd round quality.

That being said. We needs to set our board and trust/follow it. Don't talk our way into drafting a lesser players just because....that just spells trouble.

This team has too may holes to be passing on the highest rated player on our board.

This is why you can end up with a 1st round quality defensive lineman or safety at 14 and a 1st round quality player at guard at 45. It does not work in reverse because 10-12 de & olb will be off the board at 45 and about 2 guards.

If you want a DE after about pick 45, it become drafting an injury risk or character concern for the most part.

[Chocolate Lab]

Gurode owned a bunch of NFL dt's from Nebraska too. He was a great run blocking guard.

Exactly what I was going to say. That was back when Nebraska was good, too. IIRC there was one play where he pushed some guy like 20 yards down the field.

As I think JT is suggesting, a big reservation I have about Decastro is I don't see him as physically dominant. You need more than that in the NFL, but you also need more than just quick feet and pulling ability. You can find good technicians way, way later than #14 overall.

I have a feeling some people are putting a lot of weight in that Stanford degree (and maybe even how it fits in with our genius head coach). If Decastro were from, say, Michigan State, would people see him exactly the same way? I doubt it.

BTW, I would feel a lot better about Decastro if we made him a center, which maybe we would. He seems to fit the profile of a C.

[Hostile]

First play of the video, DeCastro blocks 2 guys and sends the 2nd one to his backside. That player was running towards him and weighs 285 pounds.

The second clip he pushes the USC Trojan 8 yards off the LOS.

The third clip he opens a huge hole that the RB is gone for over 20 yards. I believe that was against Notre Dame, but am not sure.

In the fourth clip he completely takes his guy out of the play.

Fifth clip, he pushes his guy back 7 yards and opens a huge hole.

Sixth play, TD through the hole he opened.

Seventh play, pancakes Dallas Kelley of USC.

Eighth play, opens the hole for the score.

Ninth play, blocks 2 defenders and opens a hole for a big gain.

Tenth play, drives the USC DT into the ground.

Eleventh play, stop a bull rush.

Twelfth play, he pulls and seals the contain to break the play outside.

Thirteenth play, levels the first guy and keeps looking for people to hit 20 yards past the LOS.



QM3jPINC0WU

[jterrell]

no clip bro.

[cowboysooner]

You can't take a highlight reel or else its Lake Wobegon where everybody is above average.

He is exceptional with his technique of keeping his shoulders square to line of scrimmage while pulling.

[Zaxor]

BTW, I would feel a lot better about Decastro if we made him a center, which maybe we would. He seems to fit the profile of a C.

I think he will be a far better center than he would guard also CL.

[jterrell]

I think he will be a far better center than he would guard also CL.

He came out of high school as the top-ranked Center in the country, FWIW.

[jterrell]

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/story/17469105/stanford-guard-decastro-has-upside-but-is-he-worth-a-firstround-risk

He said for his team to take a guard in the first round instead of a left tackle, he has to be as good as Steve Hutchinson was coming out of Michigan, and I'm not real sure DeCastro is in that conversation.

So I went back and watched more tape on DeCastro. I got a chance to watch the Stanford-Oklahoma State game last night with an offensive line coach. He pointed out three things that would concern me as it relates to a first-round grade.

The film indicated DeCastro is a physical guy who really likes to punish a defender when he gets the chance, but saying that, he gets himself in trouble with his overaggressiveness. DeCastro was on the ground six times during the game, usually from an overaggressive technique, and as the line coach pointed out, "That could wind up being 8-10 times in an NFL game."

I know David is a smart player and understands he must control his tempo and trust his technique. Easier said than done, especially for first-round picks who line up as starters in Week 1.

Secondly, DeCastro tends to play too high in his pass sets at times, and is susceptible to a bull rush that will push him back into the QB. He must be more consistent dropping his weight, bending his ankles and knees, and winning the leverage game.

Third, there was a play when DeCastro set for pass protection and the defender vacated and was uncovered. As he waited for the blitzer, he was fooled by a head fake and went to the ground.

Again, when thinking about a first-round guard, there really can't be these kinds of issues. During some of his drill work at the combine, he slipped to the ground, which my line-coach friend was quick to point out.


Its Pat Kirwan so take with a grain of salt but he did talk to an OL coach and he did work in NFL front offices officially.

I like DeCastro but just not at 14. I am middle ground between this Kirwan take and those who have fallen in man lust making him their pet cat.

[Verdict]

I think overall we did a pretty good job in free agency plugging holes and allowing us to take the best players available in the draft. The problem (and frustration) that many of us seem to have with it is that the Cowboys have failed to address the center position in free agency(which I think MUST BE ADDRESSED) in the first 4 rounds of the draft, unless we get two other dominant guards in either free agency or the draft.

Reading the tea leaves seems to indicate that the Cowboys think they have fixed the line with two castoffs from other teams that no one had heard of before they signed here. That doesn't mean they wont be the next Kosier, but I think it is a legitimate concern that we haven't fixed our offensive line yet.

I think the Cowboys organization is sniffing glue unless they target DeCastro or Glenn, and whoever they think can start this year as the center (Konz or Blake come to mind). If we get two of those players (DeCastro/Glenn and Konz/2nd best center), I think we can feel better about the state of our offensive line.

The only reason I can see that we would target Barron is in a trade down scenario where we can trade back up and get Barron and Konz, instead of DeCastro and whoever else we would have taken at #2.

Personally, I would rather see them select DeCastro at #14 and trade back up and get Barron(if they are that high on him) or Konz. But that is just me.

Maybe the Cowboys see less drop off between DeCastro and Glenn than they see between Konz and the #2 center or Barron and the #2 safety.

Barron might be the best of this safety class, but in a normal year (with a deeper safety class) he would probably be a second or third round choice.

[mensaone]

I'm also starting to think that all of the offensive linemen I think can really help this team (DeCastro, Glenn, Konz, Silatolu, Zeitler) are going to be gone before Dallas picks at 45.

It's a strong class and because of that, more interior linemen are going to be taken earlier than usual from the teens on IMO.

Our only hope in the second round might be Brandon Brooks.


you don't think C Brewster could not beat out Costa - I got him in the 4



A tall, flexible center who sits into his stance well, displays natural bend and creates pretty consistent leverage for someone his size. Snaps and steps quickly and does a great job in the pass game quickly getting his hands up, gains proper hand placement and is a real sticky player through contact. Is tough to disengage from because of his heavy hands and natural shuffle and slide ability through contact. But, will get overextended at times, lung into contact and stop moving his feet, allowing him to be slipped through contact. Possesses good awareness and feel inside as well, keeps his head on a swivel, consistently picks up stunts cleanly inside and has the range to re-direct in space, maintain balance and stun a blitzing linebacker with a compact/strong punch.

Plays with natural leverage in the run game as well and once he gets his hands on defenders is tough to disengage from, as he can anchor/seal linemen consistently away from the football. Works his legs once engaged and has average natural power when trying to drive defenders off the football. At times takes poor angles when trying to create a snap off the line into contact and will allow interior defensive lineman to get up the field and create havoc behind him. Nevertheless, displays good short area quickness, has the fluidity/footwork to make up for a false step and push defenders past the play. Looks coordinated on the move. Isn't an elite athlete in space, but has some range to the second level, breaks down well and routinely can hold his own in space.

Impression: A seasoned lineman who displays good size, hand placement and bend for the position. Looks like an eventual starter to me in the NFL.

[InmanRoshi]

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/story/17469105/stanford-guard-decastro-has-upside-but-is-he-worth-a-firstround-risk


Its Pat Kirwan so take with a grain of salt but he did talk to an OL coach and he did work in NFL front offices officially.

I like DeCastro but just not at 14. I am middle ground between this Kirwan take and those who have fallen in man lust making him their pet cat.

Looking at the Notre Dame game, I thought he was on the ground 3 or 4 plays there too. Generally I don't find him to be a Larry Allen type of mauler at all, got stood up a few times at the point, but he is extremely good of hitting LBs on the move in the 2nd level on pulls and sweeps.


People want to make comparisons to the 90's Cowboys, but forget that Newton and Tui were developmental guys who didn't hit their stride until their 4th or 5th years in the league. They both looked absolutely awful under Landry and their first year under Jimmy. That's what coaching and strength and conditioning is for. Gesek was claimed in Plan B Free agency. I also note that the Jason Garrett Cowboys will never be a power running team like that. Garrett's favorite run play is the draw from the shot gun. You don't need Larry Allen for that.

[gimmesix]

you don't think C Brewster could not beat out Costa - I got him in the 4



A tall, flexible center who sits into his stance well, displays natural bend and creates pretty consistent leverage for someone his size. Snaps and steps quickly and does a great job in the pass game quickly getting his hands up, gains proper hand placement and is a real sticky player through contact. Is tough to disengage from because of his heavy hands and natural shuffle and slide ability through contact. But, will get overextended at times, lung into contact and stop moving his feet, allowing him to be slipped through contact. Possesses good awareness and feel inside as well, keeps his head on a swivel, consistently picks up stunts cleanly inside and has the range to re-direct in space, maintain balance and stun a blitzing linebacker with a compact/strong punch.

Plays with natural leverage in the run game as well and once he gets his hands on defenders is tough to disengage from, as he can anchor/seal linemen consistently away from the football. Works his legs once engaged and has average natural power when trying to drive defenders off the football. At times takes poor angles when trying to create a snap off the line into contact and will allow interior defensive lineman to get up the field and create havoc behind him. Nevertheless, displays good short area quickness, has the fluidity/footwork to make up for a false step and push defenders past the play. Looks coordinated on the move. Isn't an elite athlete in space, but has some range to the second level, breaks down well and routinely can hold his own in space.

Impression: A seasoned lineman who displays good size, hand placement and bend for the position. Looks like an eventual starter to me in the NFL.

We've got a fourth-rounder from last season currently sitting on the bench. That doesn't mean a fourth-round pick can't come in and start, but if he lasts till the fourth, I don't have a lot of faith in him coming in and starting.

[jubal]

Really?

We were 15th in points scored and 11th in yards gained.

We were 16th in points allowed and 14th in yards allowed.

So let me do the math.....hmmm 32 teams in the league. OK by math both units were average.

Now if you drill down a little further within those numbers you'll see that the defense rushed the passer and defended the run far better than it defended the pass.

You'll also see that the team passed the ball better than it ran it. Especially in short yardage and goal line situations as evidenced by our 5 Rushing TDs.

I'm no expert, but I'd say that leads me to believe that the 2012 offseason should be spent upgrading our OL and Secondary.

Ergo a 8 and 8 season. I saw on another thread that if we stay on the field and running the ball then the other team can't get their elite QB on the field to toss undefended passes to 7 or 8 different receivers,this seems logical to me and I would enjoy the game more watching my team shine than the other team. So I am going for giving my QB more than 3 seconds to get rid of the ball before being hit. The two ol they picked up can rotate in and out for breathers with our first team linemen. The three running backs behind the fb should get them into the secondary after the ol opens a hole big enough to drive a bus through. IMHO!!!:)

[junk]

you don't think C Brewster could not beat out Costa - I got him in the 4



This is a guy with a pretty good resume that isn't rated very high. There must be something people don't like about him. His senior year didn't garner as many accolades as his earlier years.

Any thoughts on him?

[MichaelWinicki]

Other than Kronz, drafting DeCastro and moving him to center or drafting Zeitler and moving him to center I don't have a lot of faith that any of the other potential centers is going to come in and be a starter for the Dallas Cowboys this season.

[mensaone]

This is a guy with a pretty good resume that isn't rated very high. There must be something people don't like about him. His senior year didn't garner as many accolades as his earlier years.

Any thoughts on him?

the only thing I can say is that he went thru that scandal at OSU

lost his coach his QB and other players

probably had another OC

he was top ranked after the 2010 season

[The Realist]

I never really thought about DeCastro at Center.

Very interesting thought though.

Makes the 2 scrub G's we signed much more tolerable.

DeCastro at 14 and I dare Glenn to slide to 45.