Mark Barron solid starter vs Luke Kuechly, Pro Bowler

[nathanlt]

I don't understand why Mark Barron is such a favorite on this board. Yes, we need a safety. We need new blood. But if a replica of Sean Lee is available to you, pick him and make LB a strength, as it should be in the 3-4.

What is it about Mark Barron that sets him apart as such a clear cut choice? Harrison Smith had more tackles, more passes broken up, and more forced fumbles, although Barron had more interceptions. Harrison Smith could be picked in the 2nd round, and would provide a boost to tackling production.

So with Smith still available in the mid to high second, why trade in your first pick for a safety that's not far better than the next guy? Because your need dictates it? That's how you get a busted draft pick.

If at all possible, always go with a safe pick in the first round, it will pay you back for the next decade.

[Primetime42]

Barron is a pretty safe pick as far as SS's go.

Smith might not be there at 45. Other top DE and LB prospects will definitely be.

[DFWJC]

Mark Barron could someday make multiple Pro Bowls.

Check back in 3 years.

I say that not taking anything away from Kuechly.

[cowboysooner]

Kuechly is a better player, but there is a reason certain positions keep falling to you in the draft.

Inside OL, linebackers and running backs will almost always be there.

[Avery]

Kuechly is KC bound unless Poe is on the board (then prompt the warroom debate).

[InmanRoshi]

I don't know why you would assume Kuechley is an automatic Pro Bowler. He didn't make a lot of cataclysmic plays in college that get people noticed for Pro Bowls. Last year he had no forced fumbles (does it bother anyone that a guy who supposedly made 190 tackles last year can't force a fumble 1 time?). No sacks. He got accredited for these crazy tackle totals (oftentimes tackle stats are highly dubious, IMHO), nearly half of which were assisted tackles (aka "Oh he jumped on the at the end of an 8 yard run, we'll give him an assisted tackle for that"). His best trait is he's good in coverage for a linebacker, which I fully recognize is a valuable skill, but I don't think it's the kind of skill that's going to get him the kind of name recognition that's necessary for Pro Bowls. Also, LBs taken highly in the draft bust at a pretty amazing rate.

I dunno, maybe it's because I'm not really a fan of these run around and chase finesse LBs who rack up these huge tackle numbers jumping on piles after the offense has already made positive yardage, but I'm not that awestruck by him. I'm more of a fan of LBs who who play downhill, can make plays behind the line of scrimmage and are physical and can stack and shed. I'm more of a Seau kinda guy.

[Joe Rod]

I don't know why you would assume Kuechley is an automatic Pro Bowler. He didn't make a lot of cataclysmic plays in college that get people noticed for Pro Bowls. Last year he had no forced fumbles (does it bother anyone that a guy who supposedly made 190 tackles last year can't force a fumble 1 time?). No sacks. He got accredited for these crazy tackle totals (oftentimes tackle stats are highly dubious, IMHO), nearly half of which were assisted tackles (aka "Oh he jumped on the at the end of an 8 yard run, we'll give him an assisted tackle for that"). His best trait is he's good in coverage for a linebacker, which I fully recognize is a valuable skill, but I don't think it's the kind of skill that's going to get him the kind of name recognition that's necessary for Pro Bowls. Also, LBs taken highly in the draft bust at a pretty amazing rate.

I dunno, maybe it's because I'm not really a fan of these run around and chase finesse LBs who rack up these huge tackle numbers jumping on piles after the offense has already made positive yardage, but I'm not that awestruck by him. I'm more of a fan of LBs who who play downhill, can make plays behind the line of scrimmage and are physical and can stack and shed. I'm more of a Seau kinda guy.

My one concern with him is if he can hold up in a 3-4. The games I've seen of him make him look like a much better fit in a 4-3.

[texbumthelife]

My one concern with him is if he can hold up in a 3-4. The games I've seen of him make him look like a much better fit in a 4-3.

He is definitely a 4-3 guy who needs some big dogs in front to eat up blocks. He is perfect Tampa-2 material. He would get mauled in the 3-4.

I get the comparisons to Lee, because they're both white and athletic (yes being white has something to do with it whether anyone wants to admit it), but really, they play nothing alike. Lee is far more explosive and aggressive and willing to throw his body around.

[ABQCOWBOY]

I don't think it's this board. Very few liked Barron up until a couple of weeks ago. Virtually every scouting report you read says he's rock solid top to bottom. there are a good 5 or 6 teams that are looking at him and trying to figure out how to get him. It's not this board, it's outside of this board that has lead to this point. I think everybody here just finally stopped trying to argue it and started accepting that fact that people who do this for a living love this guy.

That's what I think it is.

[Teague31]

Bruce Carter

[nathanlt]

I don't know why you would assume Kuechley is an automatic Pro Bowler. He didn't make a lot of cataclysmic plays in college that get people noticed for Pro Bowls. Last year he had no forced fumbles (does it bother anyone that a guy who supposedly made 190 tackles last year can't force a fumble 1 time?). No sacks. He got accredited for these crazy tackle totals (oftentimes tackle stats are highly dubious, IMHO), nearly half of which were assisted tackles (aka "Oh he jumped on the at the end of an 8 yard run, we'll give him an assisted tackle for that"). His best trait is he's good in coverage for a linebacker, which I fully recognize is a valuable skill, but I don't think it's the kind of skill that's going to get him the kind of name recognition that's necessary for Pro Bowls. Also, LBs taken highly in the draft bust at a pretty amazing rate.

I dunno, maybe it's because I'm not really a fan of these run around and chase finesse LBs who rack up these huge tackle numbers jumping on piles after the offense has already made positive yardage, but I'm not that awestruck by him. I'm more of a fan of LBs who who play downhill, can make plays behind the line of scrimmage and are physical and can stack and shed. I'm more of a Seau kinda guy.

Ok, I truly appreciate your comments, I think Kuechly is more likely to go the Pro Bowl than Barron is, but I enjoyed the perspective on finesse versus downhill, although I will point out the sports science piece that shows Kuechly hitting 15% harder than Dwight Freeney. Pretty good for a finesse guy.

[Afigueroa22]

Bruce Carter

'Nuff said.

[speedkilz88]

Bruce Carter
Shiny new toy syndrome.

[nathanlt]

My one concern with him is if he can hold up in a 3-4. The games I've seen of him make him look like a much better fit in a 4-3.

I had not heard about that regarding Kuechly. Thus the question. I can see why Dallas wouldn't take him now, because he doesn't fit the scheme.

On the other hand though, Rob Ryan's defense is 4-3 sometimes and 3-4 in other situations, with Ratliff dropping into coverage, so scheme might not be as much of a factor as it is with other teams.

[AbeBeta]

Bruce Carter

You need 3 solid inside LBs

[DBOY3141]

You need 3 solid inside LBs

Lee, Connor, Carter

[DFWJC]

Shiny new toy syndrome.
Wouldn't Kuechly be the same thing at this stage?

[Wulfman]

I had not heard about that regarding Kuechly. Thus the question. I can see why Dallas wouldn't take him now, because he doesn't fit the scheme.

On the other hand though, Rob Ryan's defense is 4-3 sometimes and 3-4 in other situations, with Ratliff dropping into coverage, so scheme might not be as much of a factor as it is with other teams.

I just wanted to point out that this is a very common misconception. Just because there is a 4-man front does NOT mean they are running a 4-3 defense.

I know there are stat sites out there that go through play-by-play and say the Cowboys used a 3-4 this percentage of the time and a 4-3 this percentage of the time, etc. But they are counting EVERY 4-man front as a 4-3 unless it's some extreme dime package, and that's simply not accurate. The Cowboys actually ran more 4-6 defense last year than they did 4-3. I'll even go so far as to say that if you watch the film and really look at the personnel groups when the Cowboys have a 4-man front, you'd be hard-pressed to find any plays where they ran a 4-3 with 4 down linemen and 3 LBs.

There will undoubtedly be those who debate this, but in watching game film, it's simply true. The Cowboys will run the 4-6 and the 4-2-5, or some variation of them, nearly half of the time. But a guy who is a solid MLB in a 4-3 scheme would not necessarily do well in those alignments.

[Joe Rod]

I had not heard about that regarding Kuechly. Thus the question. I can see why Dallas wouldn't take him now, because he doesn't fit the scheme.

On the other hand though, Rob Ryan's defense is 4-3 sometimes and 3-4 in other situations, with Ratliff dropping into coverage, so scheme might not be as much of a factor as it is with other teams.

I've watched him some and he can't shed blocks as well as Sean Lee in my opinion. He is an excellent tackler and he flows to the football better than most I've seen, but his dynamic plays seem predicated on his being kept clean. I personally worry that Kuechly ends up with a ton of tackles five to seven yards down-field because he is having a more difficult time disengaging from blockers.

I'm sure Kuechly would disagree with me though.

[Dash28]

Wouldn't Kuechly be the same thing at this stage?
Winner!

[baj1dallas]

Ok, I truly appreciate your comments, I think Kuechly is more likely to go the Pro Bowl than Barron is, but I enjoyed the perspective on finesse versus downhill, although I will point out the sports science piece that shows Kuechly hitting 15% harder than Dwight Freeney. Pretty good for a finesse guy.

There's a big difference between hitting a mannequin and hitting a guy who hits you back.

[Mash]

IMHO Kuechly will be just a solid LB....nothing more.

Again just my opinion.....Barron is the safer pick :)

[alpha]

Kuechley is a quality player, but there's a long-standing draft tenet I subscribe to: Don't draft a LB in the 1st round that isn't a pass rusher.

[AbeBeta]

Lee, Connor, Carter

So one really good player. One guy who is decent against the run and an unknown.

I bet the Giants are sure glad they weren't saying "let's see... Tuck, Osi, Kiwanuka. Can't go DE again."

[ABQCOWBOY]

Kuechley is a quality player, but there's a long-standing draft tenet I subscribe to: Don't draft a LB in the 1st round that isn't a pass rusher.

This is actually good advice unless you are a Tampa2 defensive team. They must have a very specific kind of MLB and they must have an exceptional do it all coverage LB on the outside.

[casmith07]

Kuechley is a quality player, but there's a long-standing draft tenet I subscribe to: Don't draft a LB in the 1st round that isn't a pass rusher.

Or isn't the second-coming of Patrick Willis.

[InmanRoshi]

Yeah, Willis and Mayo have been home runs no doubt. There's also been some swings and misses with AJ Hawk, Ernie Simms, Keith Rivers, Dan Morgan. I remember when Aaron Curry was called the consensus "safest player in the draft" (which is a firm lesson that there isn't a truly safe player in any draft). It's strange how those guys seemed to have great instincts in college but it didn't translate to the pros.

[ABQCOWBOY]

Yeah, Willis and Mayo have been home runs no doubt. There's also been some swings and misses with AJ Hawk, Ernie Simms, Keith Rivers, Dan Morgan. I remember when Aaron Curry was called the consensus "safest player in the draft" (which is a firm lesson that there isn't a truly safe player in any draft). It's strange how those guys seemed to have great instincts in college but it didn't translate to the pros.

I think Morgan did, he just had issues with his health and that's enough. I agree with you on the others.

[btcutter]

I think there is a huge gap between Barron and Smith IMO. Barron is far more instinctive.
To me Smith takes too many false steps before diagnosing the play. In college it's fine but in Pros that's completion or TD.
I would nit draft Smith at all.

[tm1119]

Glad the OP can see into the future. Care to tell me the winning lottery numbers as well?

[Deep_Freeze]

I think there is a huge gap between Barron and Smith IMO. Barron is far more instinctive.
To me Smith takes too many false steps before diagnosing the play. In college it's fine but in Pros that's completion or TD.
I would nit draft Smith at all.

Yeah, Smith has alot of developing still left to do, and Barron is just better in the aspect of coverage which is a good thing.

For everyone that keeps thinking Barron is RW31, well Smith is way closer than Barron is to being RW31 as of right now.

[xwalker]

Luke Kuechly
6-3
242
Bench 27

Sean Lee
6-2
236
Bench 24

[texbumthelife]

Luke Kuechly
6-3
242
Bench 27

Sean Lee
6-2
236
Bench 24

Sean Lee's body as a pro and Kuechly's current body are night and day different. This has nothing to do with it. It is their style of play. Lee seeks out contact in order to make the play. Kuechly looks for the easiest possible path. Which is why he seldom make TFL or any other "big" plays.

And FTR, Lee's ability to hold up in the 3-4 was questioned coming out of college and has yet to be fully disproved as well.

[MonsterD]

I don't understand why Mark Barron is such a favorite on this board. Yes, we need a safety.

I don't get it either. Kuechly is another level above Barron, but we can't use Luke.

[28 Joker]

Mike Lombardi just mocked Mark Barron to Buffalo at 10.

[MonsterD]

Mike Lombardi just mocked Mark Barron to Buffalo at 10.

Hopefully that becomes true.

[28 Joker]

Hopefully that becomes true.


I really like Mark Barron, but I must admit this. As the draft approaches, I find myself looking at DeCastro and Brockers and Upshaw. The Cowboys need a center now, and DeCastro could be Dallas' center and provide Dallas with another blue-chip offensive linemen. Only the best interior offensive linemen get drafted in round 1. DeCastro is a solid, safe pick. Brockers has Pro Bowl upside along the defensive line, and he's a plug and play 5 technique who is already a very strong run defender. Brockers could develop into a dominating force along the d-line after he develops his pass rush. Upshaw is the wildcard, imo. I think he should be a better pass rusher than Spencer in the NFL. Upshaw has a high motor, and he's a mean, powerful dude. He comes from a winning program, and I think he will be a better pro than Anthony Spencer. I don't want the Cowboys giving a player like Spencer a lucrative contract extension. Paying Spencer $ 8.8 million to play one year is bad enough, imo. Drafting Upshaw would stop the Cowboys from investing too much money in a player like Spencer.

[cobra]

The selling point on Luke for me is this: take him and pair with Lee and have those two spots set for a long time and jelling. As they get synched, you'll have two tackling machines. What this allows are for the other front 5 guys to become aggressive. The other guys can play downhill more because they know if they miss, one of those two dudes will be there to make the tackle. So to frees up other players to pin their ears back.


But I don't draft Luke because I think Connor will be good and I'd rather use 14 to improve the lines or on Barron.

[Marktui]

I like Barron for these reasons: Alabama ran a complicated defense and he was in charge of getting the secondary lined up correctly. He is physical at the point of attack and is athletic. he does have some coverage ability, is he Ed Reed, no he isn't, but a lot of safeties are not.

LK, I really did not study much because I didn't think we would have any interest in him.

[nathanlt]

I think there is a huge gap between Barron and Smith IMO. Barron is far more instinctive.
To me Smith takes too many false steps before diagnosing the play. In college it's fine but in Pros that's completion or TD.
I would nit draft Smith at all.

Wow, wouldn't draft Smith at all? I thought he would fit the bill rather well as a safety. False steps, huh. I haven't watched endless tape on the guy, so I don't know, don't really have the time to.

[nathanlt]

I like Barron for these reasons: Alabama ran a complicated defense and he was in charge of getting the secondary lined up correctly. He is physical at the point of attack and is athletic. he does have some coverage ability, is he Ed Reed, no he isn't, but a lot of safeties are not.

LK, I really did not study much because I didn't think we would have any interest in him.

Getting people lined up, sounds like leadership to me, that's good. I don't know, for the BPA theory, would he beat out Kuechly?

Also, why didn't you think Dallas would have any interest in him?

[trickblue]

Barron is a really good player, but I don't see him as "impact"... Kuechly is a frickin' BEAST...

All in all, I would prefer Cox (yes, I know the name is funny), but he likely isn't going to be there...

I am also fine with DeCastro...

The only thing I am not fine with is passing on Irvin in the third if he is still there...

[btcutter]

Wow, wouldn't draft Smith at all? I thought he would fit the bill rather well as a safety. False steps, huh. I haven't watched endless tape on the guy, so I don't know, don't really have the time to.

Only got youtube highlights to go on so take it for what its worth.

Most of the INT's he gets are when the QB overthrows his targets or miscommunications between QB and WR. There's something to be said for being at right place at right time BUT I just didn't see a coverage guy who undercuts the WR for a pick like a playmaker.

I don't see his plays translate as well into the NFL.

[Ren]

Bruce Carter

I hope he turns out half as good as some people seem to have convinced them selves he is. He couldn't even get on the field last year other then ST and Brooking and James wasn't exactly good. I have no idea why some people automatically assume he's not only going to start but he's going to be good, he's done nothing so far to suggest that's the case

[CCBoy]

I just wanted to point out that this is a very common misconception. Just because there is a 4-man front does NOT mean they are running a 4-3 defense.

I know there are stat sites out there that go through play-by-play and say the Cowboys used a 3-4 this percentage of the time and a 4-3 this percentage of the time, etc. But they are counting EVERY 4-man front as a 4-3 unless it's some extreme dime package, and that's simply not accurate. The Cowboys actually ran more 4-6 defense last year than they did 4-3. I'll even go so far as to say that if you watch the film and really look at the personnel groups when the Cowboys have a 4-man front, you'd be hard-pressed to find any plays where they ran a 4-3 with 4 down linemen and 3 LBs.

There will undoubtedly be those who debate this, but in watching game film, it's simply true. The Cowboys will run the 4-6 and the 4-2-5, or some variation of them, nearly half of the time. But a guy who is a solid MLB in a 4-3 scheme would not necessarily do well in those alignments.

Good stuff as always...but a consideration here. Kuechly is so good at coverage plays, he would be on the field as much as would Sean Lee. That is a strong point, although Kuechly is a very good down hill stop from the middle, on running plays. That is very important come Red Zone/short yardage plays. That was a very weak point for Dallas last season.

[CCBoy]

The selling point on Luke for me is this: take him and pair with Lee and have those two spots set for a long time and jelling. As they get synched, you'll have two tackling machines. What this allows are for the other front 5 guys to become aggressive. The other guys can play downhill more because they know if they miss, one of those two dudes will be there to make the tackle. So to frees up other players to pin their ears back.


But I don't draft Luke because I think Connor will be good and I'd rather use 14 to improve the lines or on Barron.

I think of a pair of Chuck Howleys on the field, when dreaming about both Kuechly and Lee.

In a scheme that should be dominated by linebackers, that pretty well sums up getting it right, although...and both Lee and Kuechly would both be three down players for a long time.

[Wulfman]

Good stuff as always...but a consideration here. Kuechly is so good at coverage plays, he would be on the field as much as would Sean Lee. That is a strong point, although Kuechly is a very good down hill stop from the middle, on running plays. That is very important come Red Zone/short yardage plays. That was a very weak point for Dallas last season.

The problem is that he would be playing the same role as Lee, and in that set-up you don't use two of those guys at the same time.

Also, one of Keuchly's few faults is that he does get handled by O-linemen at times, and has shown difficulty in shedding blocks when they get a clean shot at him. It's one of the reasons most analysts I've seen think he'd be much better in a 4-3 scheme as the MLB, as he has an extra body up front to handle the blockers to let him flow to the ball.

Having said that, if we didn't already have Lee, I'd be much more interested in Kuechly. But having already used a high pick on Bruce Carter and having brought in Connor via free agency, there's no way I can justify the pick.

[CCBoy]

The problem is that he would be playing the same role as Lee, and in that set-up you don't use two of those guys at the same time.

Also, one of Keuchly's few faults is that he does get handled by O-linemen at times, and has shown difficulty in shedding blocks when they get a clean shot at him. It's one of the reasons most analysts I've seen think he'd be much better in a 4-3 scheme as the MLB, as he has an extra body up front to handle the blockers to let him flow to the ball.

Having said that, if we didn't already have Lee, I'd be much more interested in Kuechly. But having already used a high pick on Bruce Carter and having brought in Connor via free agency, there's no way I can justify the pick.

He got by in college, with skills of taking good paths and beating his opponent to a point to make a play. At the professional levels, there is a transitioning of skills that require strong hand techniques and short/powerful strikes that clear you up. He will acquire this ability just as did Sean Lee. As to playing the same position as Sean, the job title for a 3-4 says two interior linebackers. With a strong nose tackle, neither has to be a Dick Butkus to be interchangeable.

Your premise merits on application of draft principals...incidentally, not forged in stone at that.

You know, I don't get too wrapped up in semantics such as whether David DeCastro would be a better center in the NFL, than offensive guard. Plainly, he would be very strong any place in the offensive line's interior. Same with Kuechly...and comparing upward without transitioning, from collegiate to professional levels, will always reveal desparity at some point, in skillsets exhibited. Play in college is a different world, even on the field.

Today, adjectives are dominant in scouting reports...but base level skills, Kuechly is a good kid. His success will be as much a product of system and coaching no matter where he ends up.

But if I have a chance to really strike gold, and line up two Lawrence Taylors on the field at the same time...I'd have to have more than a tendency of perception to alter that kind of apick. I don't think I would care if they both are described as the same part....and as the saying goes, part is parts, to not consider it.

As to Carter, I wouldn't go counting eggs just yet on performances...Connor is a good depth player. But not in the same level.

[Wulfman]

He got by in college, with skills of taking good paths and beating his opponent to a point to make a play. At the professional levels, there is a transitioning of skills that require strong hand techniques and short/powerful strikes that clear you up. He will acquire this ability just as did Sean Lee. As to playing the same position as Sean, the job title for a 3-4 says two interior linebackers. With a strong nose tackle, neither has to be a Dick Butkus to be interchangeable.

He got by in college in a 4-3 defense, which, as I said, is his best fit. Don't get me wrong, I like Kuechly. I think he's an excellent person and football player, and I expect nothing but success for him at the next level.

But the 'Boys have to look at things from a more specific perspective.

1) This guy isn't the best fit for our defense, and his best position is already taken by Sean Lee.

2) We have a second round pick invested in Carter. The fact that he hasn't shown us he can do what we think he can doesn't mean we can throw him to the curb before he gets the chance. That's a waste of a draft pick.

3) We already have an insurance policy on board who will be a step up from what we had last year IF Carter isn't ready to start right away.

4) We have a lot more needs on this team and there are players available that have similar value as Kuechly, but address those need areas.

Put those together, and I just don't see it.

[Eskimo]

Barron is a really good player, but I don't see him as "impact"... Kuechly is a frickin' BEAST...

All in all, I would prefer Cox (yes, I know the name is funny), but he likely isn't going to be there...

I am also fine with DeCastro...

The only thing I am not fine with is passing on Irvin in the third if he is still there...

TB, I think it's a mistake to pass him up if he is on the board at #45.

That's why I've always thought we should do most of our drafting in the early second. You can get Irvin and a day one starter at OG in the 30-45 range. You could get Zeitler and Irvin. We should also net another second rounder and take a CB (?Brandon Boykin, Trumaine Johnson, Casey Heyward). We may be able to net an extra 3rd and select Broyles and Crick here. Now we still have two fourths to play with.

If we decide to go elsewhere in the second and he is still on the board at the top of the 3rd we should trade up with our 4th rounder to go up and grab him and use him as a pass rush specialist while we try to teach him to be an OLB.

I really think this kid has worked exceptionally hard to turn his life around and this is actually worth more to me then a kid who never did a thing wrong in his life. The difference to me is the drive to overcome the worst kind of adversity - homeless, facing time in jail, sitting on a curb in a city away from his hometown and destitute. And yet he gets his GED, goes through 4 different colleges on his way to WVU and then excels on the field over the course of a 5-year time frame. I'll take my chances on a kid who can overcome all of that. Then you look at the film and see a pure, natural pass rusher. Then you look at his Combine - probably the best set of numbers of any player at any position.

To me the one downside is he is almost 25 so he is a bit old but I can overlook that in the second round.

After elite QBs, elite pass rushers are the second hardest thing to find in the NFL. I really only count Ware, Jared Allen, JPP, Von Miller, Woodley, Peppers, Wake, Hali, Freeney and Babin off the top of my head. I know there are a couple knocking on the fence like Aldon Smith. But my point is they are hard to find and I think Irvin has it.

We've drafted exactly one player in 30 years who put up two double digit sack years - two. Sometimes you have to take a bit of a risk.

[CCBoy]

He got by in college in a 4-3 defense, which, as I said, is his best fit. Don't get me wrong, I like Kuechly. I think he's an excellent person and football player, and I expect nothing but success for him at the next level.

But the 'Boys have to look at things from a more specific perspective.

1) This guy isn't the best fit for our defense, and his best position is already taken by Sean Lee.

2) We have a second round pick invested in Carter. The fact that he hasn't shown us he can do what we think he can doesn't mean we can throw him to the curb before he gets the chance. That's a waste of a draft pick.

3) We already have an insurance policy on board who will be a step up from what we had last year IF Carter isn't ready to start right away.

4) We have a lot more needs on this team and there are players available that have similar value as Kuechly, but address those need areas.

Put those together, and I just don't see it.

Biggest needs:

1. Improve function on the defensive side of the ball.

Beyond coaching, one improves by unit - defensive line, linebackers, secondary.

Scheme affects how those three interact. In a 3-4 defense, the linebackers should be the dominant group developed and invested in.

I would be well content, to dominate from three to twelve yards past the line of scrimmage with a rock solid group of linebackers.

Once drafted, cost doesn't enter drama filled status, until later in a player's career. So once upon the roster, a player doesn't push much into current cap considerations. That develops later, as careers develop. So cost is dropped here.

Next, in a 3-4, linebackers should be top of a list. As in a 4-3, defensive line hits prime considerations.

Why have the Giants given very top draft considerations to their defensive line over the past five years? Obviously, their defense rests on their merit, and depth at the dominant point is all important.

They are going for a dominant and game changing element for use...not a cosmopolitan point of view.

Injury is real. So depth in your strength has to be top level.

Myself, being a linebacker, I would gladly set up a rotation of Lee, Kuechly, and Connor. I would use Carter for packages and in special team's play.

But the need for that depth would well play out over an entire year. Last year, Lee had a club for an extended period of time. What if he had been sidelined instead? That goes to point out why just such depth at a team's side of ball is so important.

But at this point, putting in Kuechly would provide a solid base when plugged into current youth and contracts...for many years.

The group of Lee, Kuechly, Connor, and Carter could be around for a very, very long time...and provide high value and return right in the center of the Dallas defense.

To this fan, a line drawn right down the center of the field, on defense, is the most important consideration on the field. This would completely dominate the box area in that view.

With the signing of Brandon Carr, and Brodney Pool, the Dallas once again has reached fully functional. Add in Mike Jenkins, Orlando Scandrick, and Gerald Sensabaugh, and this group is actually pretty stable projecting forward. Improvements here, don't have to come quickly, to still maintain an upward direction.

In a rush for Mark Barron, who exactly are you going to sit here? Don't forget that a Barry Church is already on the roster as well.

For a top notched player, you go ahead and make a move, such as with Morris Claiborne, but with a lower level, such as with Dre Kirkpatrick, Stephen Gilmore, or Jamoris Jenkins...one has to now project into a package role and developing over time.

This season, Dallas has a relatively high pick. Those don't often come to the Cowboys. Given a chance, it needs to hit a homerun, not just a double.

Below Barron, there is nothing on the board that warrants considerations prior to round two...at safety. So, at cornerback or safety, and at pick #14, the value just isn't there. Barron has strong collegiate features, but he still wasn't considered to even be in the arena with a Roy Williams when he was drafted by the Cowboys a little higher in that draft.

With the recent free agency signings of Mackenzy Bernadeau, and Nate Livings...and last year's rise of Bill Nagy, David Arkin, and Kevin Kowalski... the Cowboys have at least a solid look in it's interior line. That is at least five players to fill four slots. Two of those recently given contracts.

2. The strength of the offensive side of the ball, is the skill players. I just showed how the offensive line has been adapted in the past two seasons. A piece added in the draft there, has to be developmental at offensive tackle, or a true upgrade in the interior. Past the first two rounds, that just won't be the case in the interior offensive line.

Given the above, I'm feeling that the points that could most be easily addressed with upgrading overall quality, would be the defensive line and linebackers.

This draft is strong in the first two rounds, in candidates for just that type of a pick. In this draft, at defensive tackles/defensive linemen, that presents a top of draft picture of Cox, Worthy, Brockers, Poe, and Reyes.

I'm am sure that this is the picture that is seen by the Cowboys as well.

As to linebacker, the Cowboys have a stable picture...with Demarcus Ware, Anthony Spencer, and Lee and Connor/Carter. A replacement for this group, have to at least project as potential upgrade - or - be able to be developed as a potential replacement at a later date.

The vehicle for change, at least for many fans here, is focused upon pass rushing ability. That implies a specialized player at defensive end or OLB.

The players in this draft, that project most strongly in this feature would be Quinton Coples, Melvin Ingram, Courtney Upshaw, Whitney Mercilus, and Nick Perry.

For this draft, and based purely upon upgrade potential, I think the short list of players that would do just that would be Cox, Coples, Ingram, DeCastro, Barron, and Kuechly at the #14 position. But here, even with Kuechly, I think one has to project that he will be gone before dallas takes the clock as well.

Even so, Kuechly does have merit and contributory relevance as well. He would be a good value, despite protecting selection diversity limited by category. That is the real relevance of BPA...plugged back in, there is merit, as I pointed towards, as well.

[CCBoy]

TB, I think it's a mistake to pass him up if he is on the board at #45.

That's why I've always thought we should do most of our drafting in the early second. You can get Irvin and a day one starter at OG in the 30-45 range. You could get Zeitler and Irvin. We should also net another second rounder and take a CB (?Brandon Boykin, Trumaine Johnson, Casey Heyward). We may be able to net an extra 3rd and select Broyles and Crick here. Now we still have two fourths to play with.

If we decide to go elsewhere in the second and he is still on the board at the top of the 3rd we should trade up with our 4th rounder to go up and grab him and use him as a pass rush specialist while we try to teach him to be an OLB.

I really think this kid has worked exceptionally hard to turn his life around and this is actually worth more to me then a kid who never did a thing wrong in his life. The difference to me is the drive to overcome the worst kind of adversity - homeless, facing time in jail, sitting on a curb in a city away from his hometown and destitute. And yet he gets his GED, goes through 4 different colleges on his way to WVU and then excels on the field over the course of a 5-year time frame. I'll take my chances on a kid who can overcome all of that. Then you look at the film and see a pure, natural pass rusher. Then you look at his Combine - probably the best set of numbers of any player at any position.

To me the one downside is he is almost 25 so he is a bit old but I can overlook that in the second round.

After elite QBs, elite pass rushers are the second hardest thing to find in the NFL. I really only count Ware, Jared Allen, JPP, Von Miller, Woodley, Peppers, Wake, Hali, Freeney and Babin off the top of my head. I know there are a couple knocking on the fence like Aldon Smith. But my point is they are hard to find and I think Irvin has it.

We've drafted exactly one player in 30 years who put up two double digit sack years - two. Sometimes you have to take a bit of a risk.

Good storyline, until the real world sets in again...on a continually hard knocks guy, just don't offer him a drink and set a 'high looks' escourt before him. Before the Secret Service screw up in Columbia, did anyone even know there were hookers there?

[Beast_from_East]

I don't think it's this board. Very few liked Barron up until a couple of weeks ago. Virtually every scouting report you read says he's rock solid top to bottom. there are a good 5 or 6 teams that are looking at him and trying to figure out how to get him. It's not this board, it's outside of this board that has lead to this point. I think everybody here just finally stopped trying to argue it and started accepting that fact that people who do this for a living love this guy.

That's what I think it is.

Yea, I think most fans would want DeCastro but are starting to accept that fact that it is going to be Barron.


Kinda like my Republican friends who all wanted somebody else but are finally accepting the fact it is going to be Romney.

(not making political statement one way or another, just an analogy).