Anyone catch the Quarterback Challenge this weekend?

[TruBlueCowboy]

It's hard to find news on who won. I heard Byron Leftwich and Carson Palmer had the strongest arms and Joey Harrington was pretty dead-on accurate. Any truth to this news? Anyone watch it? Who impressed you?

[TonyS]

It's hard to find news on who won. I heard Byron Leftwich and Carson Palmer had the strongest arms and Joey Harrington was pretty dead-on accurate. Any truth to this news? Anyone watch it? Who impressed you?

Matt Hasselbeck of Seattle won the whole deal. I just caught the end of it with the QBs having to run down the field while making different kinds of throws.

Hasselbeck looked good. None of the QBs were wowing people with their mobility and they were throwing on the run. Surprised our boy QC didn't get an invite. Probably wanted to give the other guys a chance to win :-)

[Little Jr]

Surprised our boy QC didn't get an invite. Probably wanted to give the other guys a chance to win :-)


There is a lot of accuracy involved. Q would pretty much choke at it.

[Rude]

Saw it, Harrington has a nice arm thats for sure

[Irving Cowboy]

There is a lot of accuracy involved. Q would pretty much choke at it.
LOL. Ain't that the truth....

[billknows]

Brunell could not hit a single pass hahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah hahahahahahahhahahahahahahhahahahahahahaha Redskins and Danny suuuuuucccccckkkkkk hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahaha b hasselbeck looked darn good


Can we please blitz Brunell hahahahhahaahhahaah
Go Cowboys

[big dog cowboy]

It was pretty weak. That isn't a great way to judge a QB anyway.

[Sarge]

It was pretty weak. That isn't a great way to judge a QB anyway.

Agreed - I watched a good portion of it but it was so boring I bailed out.

It would have been fun to see what QC would/could have done here where accuracy was a must.

[BrAinPaiNt]

Carson Palmer beat out Leftwich in the long distance throw on a tie breaker....both had a best of 65 yards.

Hasselhead won the accuracy/mobility and overall title.

Can not remember who can in second overall but Leftwich came in third overall and was dead last in the mobility section.

[ChrisFul]

These QB Challenge things are a crock anyways. Whoever happens to have a couple of good throws or a run or two wins these things. As an illustration, QC was in the collegiate version of the QB Challenge in the spring of 2001, and WON. He beat Drew Brees and a few other guys, who i cannot remember. I do remember that micahel vick was not one of the participants.

[Cajuncowboy]

Carson Palmer beat out Leftwich in the long distance throw on a tie breaker....both had a best of 65 yards.

Hasselhead won the accuracy/mobility and overall title.

Can not remember who can in second overall but Leftwich came in third overall and was dead last in the mobility section.

Leftwich came in last in the mobility section? BEhind Brunell? Does Jacksonville only draft statues? I can't believe that Brunell is more mobile than Lefty. Heck, my grandmother is more mobile than Brunell and she's in a walker.

[Sarge]

Leftwich came in last in the mobility section? BEhind Brunell? Does Jacksonville only draft statues? I can't believe that Brunell is more mobile than Lefty. Heck, my grandmother is more mobile than Brunell and she's in a walker.

Leftwich is seriously immobile. He's lucky he's big.

Guy can throw though that's for sure.

[LaTunaNostra]

Leftwich came in last in the mobility section? BEhind Brunell? Does Jacksonville only draft statues? I can't believe that Brunell is more mobile than Lefty. Heck, my grandmother is more mobile than Brunell and she's in a walker.
This is good news, Cajun.

Brunnell was once one of the most mobile QBs in the league, and one of the most accurate.

The last few years he's been a shadow of his former self. And from the sound of things, he's disappearing by the second.

Anyone who saw the show care to make my day and tell us exactly how bad he looked? :D

[MichaelWinicki]

This is good news, Cajun.

Brunnell was once one of the most mobile QBs in the league, and one of the most accurate.

The last few years he's been a shadow of his former self. And from the sound of things, he's disappearing by the second.

Anyone who saw the show care to make my day and tell us exactly how bad he looked? :D


Didn't watch it.

So all I can do is wish you "Good Morning" Barb.

[dmq]

I was not impressed with any of the QB's. Leftwich is big, but his immobility will be a real liability. You better draft lineman every year or else he will get injured. Immobility rumors spread fast in the NFL. Look how fast it spread for Chad.

[BrAinPaiNt]

For People who did not watch the show...maybe they are not getting what was going on in the mobility drill.

The QBs had about 4 different spots on the field they had to throw from and different routes/spots of the WRs.....and it about covered 50-70 yards of the field...as soon as they threw one pass they had to run down the field...stop grab a ball and throw it...then run down the field some more and so on.

This is not like a guy just had to do a boot leg and throw (although there was a roll out on one pass).

Some of the guys were messing up (like Lefty) by throwing the ball and then watching to see how it looked and if the WR would catch it before running to the next place to grab the ball.

Some were just grabbing the ball, throwing it and then start running to the next ball.

This type of drill has NOTHING to do with mobility in the NFL except for footspeed.

Trust me...you will NEVER see a game where the QBs have to go through the drill these guys did to throw a ball....I mean when are we going to see a QB 20 yards or so behind a ball have to run to the center just to grab a ball?

[Bluefin]

These QB Challenge things are a crock anyways. Whoever happens to have a couple of good throws or a run or two wins these things. As an illustration, QC was in the collegiate version of the QB Challenge in the spring of 2001, and WON. He beat Drew Brees and a few other guys, who i cannot remember. I do remember that micahel vick was not one of the participants.

I didn't know there a college version of the QB challenge existed or that Quincy Carter won it.

Some new material for my fellow apologists. LOL

I expect Vick would've won it with ease had he participated.


I was not impressed with any of the QB's. Leftwich is big, but his immobility will be a real liability. You better draft lineman every year or else he will get injured. Immobility rumors spread fast in the NFL. Look how fast it spread for Chad.

Chad Hutchinson actually has pretty good mobility when it comes to executing rollouts and moving pocket plays.

Hutch's problem was his inability to sense defenders and hold onto the ball when tackled.

[LaTunaNostra]

Didn't watch it.

So all I can do is wish you "Good Morning" Barb.
Good morning, Mikey, and a very good one it is, at that.

I just posted a four part story from yesterday's Washington Post (in the the NFL Zone forum) that is a pretty fair overview of how "cash" ISN'T going to "solve cap" in DC. Please check it out when you get time.

It's music to the eyes.

Yours truly,

Regan

[trickblue]

QC was in the collegiate version of the QB Challenge in the spring of 2001, and WON.

So THAT'S where JJ got his scouting report from...

[dmq]

I knew I would get the Hutch has good mobility, but can't sense pressure come back. Maybe you are right, but my idea of mobility is getting out of the way when pressure is coming.

[DallasInDC]

Anyone who saw the show care to make my day and tell us exactly how bad he looked? :D

Brunell did prett good on the arm strength category He came in third with a throw of 63 yards he also threw for 60. On the run and throw category on his first and second attempt he completly overthrew his first three passes that included the 7- yd out pattern, the 15 yd hook pattern between two defenders and a coner route.

He did connect both times on his corner end zone passes hitting the wr both times in the numbers in the little red box which is about 1 1/2 yrds sq. (almost all of the qb's hit this pass)

I was not impressed by Brunnel at all based on this competition. However, as it was mentioned before, you really can't judge a QB by this type of competition. Even with that said, I would loved to see how QC would have fared against his peers.

[Bluefin]

I knew I would get the Hutch has good mobility, but can't sense pressure come back. Maybe you are right, but my idea of mobility is getting out of the way when pressure is coming.

I'll certainly take your version.

Hutch simply didn't know when it was time to scramble and avoid a bad play by staying in the pocket.

Quincy Carter routinely eluded pressure in the pocket, but ended up making a bad mistake anyway by forcing passes instead of scrambling for yardage.

It's been said that 14 of Carter's interceptions came on the run outside of the pocket.

Q needs to pull the ball down in those cases and just get whatever he can on the ground.

The staff has been working with him on this or so I've read.

I love Carter's mobility, but he's got to dial things down on the field and quit pressing to make the big play.



So THAT'S where JJ got his scouting report from...

I knew something like this was coming...LOL

[LaTunaNostra]

Brunell did prett good on the arm strength category He came in third with a throw of 63 yards he also threw for 60. On the run and throw category on his first and second attempt he completly overthrew his first three passes that included the 7- yd out pattern, the 15 yd hook pattern between two defenders and a coner route.

He did connect both times on his corner end zone passes hitting the wr both times in the numbers in the little red box which is about 1 1/2 yrds sq. (almost all of the qb's hit this pass)

I was not impressed by Brunnel at all based on this competition. However, as it was mentioned before, you really can't judge a QB by this type of competition. Even with that said, I would loved to see how QC would have fared against his peers.

Thanks, DinDC.

Sure, you can't assess a QB on these fluff competitions that don't even try to mimic real game conditions. But you can watch the way a guy moves and get a feel for his relative agility or accuracy compared to his peers.

Too bad Brunnell didn't fare better on that run and throw category.

He's going to be trying to throw on the run a lot this year.

[Henry]

Good morning, Mikey, and a very good one it is, at that.

I just posted a four part story from yesterday's Washington Post (in the the NFL Zone forum) that is a pretty fair overview of how "cash" ISN'T going to "solve cap" in DC. Please check it out when you get time.

It's music to the eyes.

Yours truly,

Regan

With all due respect, Nunyo's not the sharpest knife in the drawer. When he writes an article about the cap that includes such gems as

However, even if a player is released, his original signing bonus is counted against the team's cap each year until the original contract expires.

it's tough to spend nights worrying about his assessment of a team's cap management capabilities.

[LaTunaNostra]

With all due respect, Nunyo's not the sharpest knife in the drawer. When he writes an article about the cap that includes such gems as

it's tough to spend nights worrying about his assessment of a team's cap management capabilities.

If any team decided to go for it, more power to them. Many teams in the past have made a big money push to go over the top. Not so many from the Redskins' position - most wait til they are a player or two away to start throwing money around. But so what? As Jerry Jones said in the article, sometimes he lost with that approach, and sometimes he won.

The amazing, totally amazing really, aspect of your team's strategy is the denial that down the road, there will be have to be sacrifices made. This is what is so amusing.The franchise denying that it's a two year window, and the fanbase swallowing whole and spitting it out at every opportunity.

The Washington Redsjins alone are going to avoid paying the price that every single other team has, and will have to pay for this pack n pay the roster strategy. It's sheer nonsense to think in your case alone the piper won't have to be paid.

Now if in these next two years, you win it all, sure, paying won't be so awful. You will have a ring to see you thru the lean years.

But if you don't, 2006 and the few years thereafter will be just as hellish for you as it is for the other 31 teams when they miscalculate.

Cash doesn't "solve cap". It just delays it.

Two years.

Two.

[dmq]

One word of note, I thought Delhomme looked terrible during the parts of the show I saw.

[Henry]

LTN,

It's ok. I'm used to it. Cowboy fans have been saying 'two' for the past 5 years. :)

Will the Redskins feel a cap-pinch in a few years? Sure. I think they did in 2001, and they probably will again.

The question is, however, just how bad that pinch will be? Will it be three years of cap hell, as Hostile has asserted, or will it be a year of cutting overpaid underachievers, not re-signing a few marginal players and scouring for vet minimum bargains in the FA market, as we did a few years ago?

I don't know. You don't know. And I'm for darn sure Nunyo Demasio, a first year Redskin beat reporter who until this year covered a west coast NBA team, doesn't know. The cat's gotten more wrong this offseason than Maske did his entire career. And he just keeps on making mistakes in this piece.

It may be music to your eyes, but just keep in mind he's way off key ... again.

[MichaelWinicki]

LTN,

It's ok. I'm used to it. Cowboy fans have been saying 'two' for the past 5 years. :)



And look at the last five years... it's been a train wreck.

[LaTunaNostra]

LTN,

It's ok. I'm used to it. Cowboy fans have been saying 'two' for the past 5 years. :)

Will the Redskins feel a cap-pinch in a few years? Sure. I think they did in 2001, and they probably will again.

The question is, however, just how bad that pinch will be? Will it be three years of cap hell, as Hostile has asserted, or will it be a year of cutting overpaid underachievers, not re-signing a few marginal players and scouring for vet minimum bargains in the FA market, as we did a few years ago?

I don't know. You don't know. And I'm for darn sure Nunyo Demasio, a first year Redskin beat reporter who until this year covered a west coast NBA team, doesn't know. The cat's gotten more wrong this offseason than Maske did his entire career. And he just keeps on making mistakes in this piece.

It may be music to your eyes, but just keep in mind he's way off key ... again.

Well Henry, you can use Demasio as an example of a mediot who doesn't know the time frame for paying off a released players' signing bonus, but the article overall was very well done.., but hey, we take the same tact here when a writer says something we like or don't like. And it helps our case when a Gosselin makes a blooper like the Boys have the toughest schedule in the league. :p

The article did mention the "creative use of roster bonuses" your team has been using. Roster bonuses are not typically guaranteed. They only get paid if the player is on the roster at a certain date. But they can be guaranteed. Your FO is keeping salaries down to bare min by using both the signing and roster bonus, the latter which cannot be staggered like a sb, but can be converted to one.

If those roster bonuses are not guaranteed, then you can just cut the guy and you're home free. But something tells me these players agents aren't letting their clients play for league minimums and not getting a guarantee on every bonus possible. The other option is converting the roster bonus into a signing bonus and then prorating it. Which for a guy like Coles, you'd be wise to do.

Those "overpaid underachievers" will have to be paid off if those roster bonuses were guaranteed. The article maintains we're not just talking "marginal" types either.

This season, Portis, Brunell, Springs, Washington, Daniels and Griffin will combine for $13.17 million against the salary cap limit. That figure rises by a mere $10,000 in 2005. But in 2006, a steep increase begins due to roster bonuses. Arrington, Springs, Portis, Griffin, Washington and wide receiver Laveranues Coles, who was inked to a seven-year, $35 million deal a year ago, each has roster bonuses ranging between $2 million and $6.5 million due in 2006.

Clearly the players the FO want to keep will have their roster bs converted to signing bs. So the hit can be somewhat delayed further. But there appears just too much due come 2006 not to consider that year the watershed. Rosters turn over quite a bit from year to year, but will Joe Gibbs have the energy to hang around to see a large number of the players he trained cut loose for another bunch of newbies?

We shall see.

BTW, what's this buzz I keep hearing about Snyder selling the team in a few years anyway? Making a tidy profit then cashing it all in? Any truth to that? He certainly isn't a Mara or Rooney, generations of football families, and he doesn't seem to have the passionate love for all things football Jerry Jones and his son have, but it's a bit shocking to hear he may be in it just for the quick turnover.

[TheSkaven]

Brunnell was once one of the most mobile QBs in the league, and one of the most accurate.

The last few years he's been a shadow of his former self. And from the sound of things, he's disappearing by the second.


This is why I was not on the Brunell bandwagon this off-season when others were clamoring for him. I think he is going to have real problems in Washington. It's an absolute joke that anyone things the Redskins will finish above 6-10 this season.

[Henry]

And look at the last five years... it's been a train wreck.

I totally agree. But not because of the cap. The train wreck has occured at the coaching level. Snyder's lack of patience coupled with the likes of Turner, Schottenheimer and Spurrier. It's been a terrible combination.

For example, the four-year train wreck that was the 1999-2002 Dallas Cowboys was not caused by cap mis-management ... well, not entirely. You suffered one 5-11 season for that (plus bad coaching.) The rest was simply on Jones and Gailey/Campo.

[BrAinPaiNt]

I totally agree. But not because of the cap. The train wreck has occured at the coaching level. Snyder's lack of patience coupled with the likes of Turner, Schottenheimer and Spurrier. It's been a terrible combination.

For example, the four-year train wreck that was the 1999-2002 Dallas Cowboys was not caused by cap mis-management ... well, not entirely. You suffered one 5-11 season for that (plus bad coaching.) The rest was simply on Jones and Gailey/Campo.


I think the cap mess was really the reason for the cowboys poor play.

Jones kept wanting to grab that brass ring one more time with Troy and Emmit....Irvin was out so he thought all he needed was one guy to help named Galloway so he gave up too much to get him.

He was (at the time) wanting to win now and gambling with the future...neither paid off and that was the basic reason we were hurting for so long.

[ABQCOWBOY]

Hasselbeck and Green really looked good I thought. In fact, Green can flat out throw the football. I agree with many that this is not a true dipiction of what happens in the NFL but it was easy to see that Green has excellent mobility IMO. He moved around with ease and threw the football accuratly.

Palmer has the strongest arm. He out distanced Leftwich by a bit on the final throw off but the kid can also gun it. In fact, he's going to have to work on touch just a bit. It looks as if his arm might be too strong. He aims, just a bit on the short stuff and the touch passes. Could have been nerves because I have seen him throw these with success while at SC but still. BIG arm but will need to learn how to use it.

Of the young guys, I thought Harrington looked best. Surprised not to see Car. Thought he would have been there or perhaps I just missed him.

[Henry]

LaTunaNostra,

This is actually getting interesting. I think I've de-railed this discussion long enough, so I'm posting my reply to you in the NFL Zone thread.

H

[LaTunaNostra]

LaTunaNostra,

This is actually getting interesting. I think I've de-railed this discussion long enough, so I'm posting my reply to you in the NFL Zone thread.

H
Cool, Henry!

You didn't hijack the thread tho, I did. :p

[Henry]

I think the cap mess was really the reason for the cowboys poor play.

Jones kept wanting to grab that brass ring one more time with Troy and Emmit....Irvin was out so he thought all he needed was one guy to help named Galloway so he gave up too much to get him.

He was (at the time) wanting to win now and gambling with the future...neither paid off and that was the basic reason we were hurting for so long.

I agree BP, but I don't think all three 5-11 seasons were a product of Jones' brass ring grab. The first one, yes, but the other two were simply bad coaching and/or management. That was my point.

[BrAinPaiNt]

I agree BP, but I don't think all three 5-11 seasons were a product of Jones' brass ring grab. The first one, yes, but the other two were simply bad coaching and/or management. That was my point.


I would say the last one was pure coaching...but I think the first two 5-11 seasons were a result of JJ screwing and learning the hard way.

[Doomsday101]

I think being is salery cap hell had a lot to do with the 5-11 season, Dallas was only able to pick of FA who were at the end of their careers or looking to come back from major injury. We were spending only vet. minimum to get these guys. I also think that Dallas felt Troy Aikman could play a bit longer and when he couldn't Dallas had no one waiting in the wings. Campo took the abuses some deserved and some outside his control

[Skeptic]

Leftwich came in last in the mobility section? BEhind Brunell? Does Jacksonville only draft statues? I can't believe that Brunell is more mobile than Lefty. Heck, my grandmother is more mobile than Brunell and she's in a walker.

That's a pretty freakin' dark sig for a football board, bud.

I'll never forget either, but it's another thing to be constantly reminded.

[TruBlueCowboy]

So THAT'S where JJ got his scouting report from...

LMAO Good one! :D

I had no idea Quincy won the college Quarterback Challenge either.

[TruBlueCowboy]

Thanks, DinDC.

Sure, you can't assess a QB on these fluff competitions that don't even try to mimic real game conditions. But you can watch the way a guy moves and get a feel for his relative agility or accuracy compared to his peers.

Too bad Brunnell didn't fare better on that run and throw category.

He's going to be trying to throw on the run a lot this year.

I agree that it doesn't mean much compared to a real game situation but you can still guage a quarterback's athletic skills at these events. It's almost giving us the fans a chance to view our favorite athletes in a combine type situation.