Did the game pass Landry by

[Zaxor]

"I don't believe in team motivation. I believe in getting a team prepared so it knows it will have the necessary confidence when it steps on a field and be prepared to play a good game." Tom Landry (http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/tomlandry154667.html)

I never believed it did... I believed he held too much loyality in the end to too many players... But I also believed it had something to with growing old... I don't know if the same passion was there to coach...I am just not sure he had the energy to explain the same things over and over again to a bunch of new kids year in and year out and his assistant coaches were growing old with him.. Plus 29 years of coaching without a break was probably not a good thing...I often wondered what would have happened had Tom taken a 3-4 year break after 25 years of coaching...

anybody else think the game did not pass him by...

"If you are prepared, you will be confident, and will do the job."
Tom Landry (http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/tomlandry154666.html)

[TunaFan33]

Bill Parcells once said "You are what you are"(in terms of records).

I guess Landry's dismal records in his final years spoke for itself-I don't know.

[bbgun]

There was a game in Philly where he forgot the down and distance, and it cost us the game. He was fading.

[Dallas4ever]

I loved Tom Landry as much as anyone but he had fell behind in a league that was changing.

[Tobal]

I think we started having problems in the draft, when Johnson came in he cleaned house. We had very little talent, I have no doubt Landry would have won again. They'd hit on Irvin and Walker was a damn good running back under Tom Landry, no one else got as much out of him. (unless you count the trade)

[ROMOSAPIEN9]

When he named Phil Pozderic the starting QB in 1984, you kinda knew he was slipping.

Still sux the way he was let go, but it was well past due.

[ConcordCowboy]

I loved Tom Landry as much as anyone but he had fell behind in a league that was changing.

Sometimes I get the same feeling about Parcells.

[joseephuss]

I guess it depends on how you define the "game". If it was just Xs and Os, then no. Tom still knew how to draw up plays on both sides of the ball. People say that the Flex became out dated. I don't think so. I just think they didn't find the right personell to run it.

As was already mentioned, Herschel Walker did well in Dallas. Landry did a great job of getting Walker touches while Dorsett was on the team. He got the ball to Walker in imaginative ways. Once Dorsett left, Landry just fed the ball to Walker out of the backfield especially from the "I" formation. Maybe that wasn't such a smart thing. Seems pretty basic, but I didn't see any other team that Walker went to do the same thing, so I will say it was smart. He was under utilized elsewhere, Landry got great use out of his primary talent.

He let his assitants coaches handle things like motivation. Considering the turnover there was on his coaching staffs, you could see where that could become a problem. How many assitants went on to head coaching jobs under Landry? How many left to become coordinators? Lots. That happens when you are successful. At the end, there were few assistants that I felt were high quality. Paul Hackett? Yikes.

If it was about dealing with younger guys then maybe he didn't know how to handle the newer generation. I really don't think so. I think it was more a product of talent on the team. The talent on the team was not based soley on him. Tex and Gil had a lot of input on which players were being brought in to Dallas.

Few coaches have success without talent on the field. That part seemed to pass the whole regime by. They failed to bring in the talent needed as the existing talent level dropped. Dallas would not have been re-built under the old regime. A drastic inlflux of change was needed. It is possible Tom and Tex could have rebuilt the team, but not likely.

I know I would have liked to see Landry combined with the 90s Cowboys offense. His offensive knowledge combined with that line, Emmitt, Troy and Michael would have been a great combination. Let Jimmy Johnson handle the motivation and Tom draw up the plays. Wow!

[CoCo]

When he named Phil Pozderic the starting QB in 1984, you kinda knew he was slipping.



I think you meant Hogeboom.

I think this board has passed you by. :lmao2:

[joseephuss]

I think you meant Hogeboom.

I think this board has passed you by. :lmao2:

Don't laugh until you know the full story. :D

[BARRYRAY]

Well one thing I know he had a great coaches show, it was so much better than BP has, he actually ran the film sometimes two or three times to show what a team was doing or why it was or wasn't successful, the BP show is sooooooo lame, its like they have to preapprove the questions beforehand, he offers nothing resembling commentary about us or the next weeks opponent, I mean couldn't we see a couple of things they do, everybody and their mother has access to everybody's games, its not like its such a big deal. Babe has to stop after the game at a car wash, he gets brown from being so far up BP's @#$@$...Seriously he might have stayed too long but he and Roger look better everyday they just ooozed class. I admired him for making a marriage and family life work while coaching, no easy task and something JJ and BP haven't made work, actually both of their ex-wives opted to become free agents and take the community property buyout and never made it to Dallas

[burmafrd]

the scouting staff really sucked after about 85. And his assistants after that point were not all that great either. I do not think any assistant he had after that point ever did much later. I do not think that Landry was over the hill, but he had no real talent either in the organization or the field. Now in 87 and 88 he started to find talent again, but his coaches were no better.

[Zaxor]

Nice to see so many think it was more the lack of talent than that the game had passed him by...

Funny or as sad as this may sound...

I held and still hold Tom Landry in more awe than I did any Prez of the US since I have been alive

[bbgun]

Let's just say that missing out on Jerry Rice hastened his (and the team's) demise.

[Bach]

I've always loved coach Landry, but there was no doubt we needed a change. Now, the way it happened was all wrong, but I was all in favor of bringing in Jimmy.

And the first thing that Jimmy said was he couldn't believe how slow the team was. We hung onto too many older players, other teams caught up and passed us in the draft and in player evaluations, and we never changed schemes with the times, i.e., the flex defense.

I don't think anyone foresaw the success we'd have with Jimmy, but the team had definitely become old and stagnant and needed a major overhaul.

[Alexander]

Let's just say that missing out on Jerry Rice hastened his (and the team's) demise.

How did they miss out on Jerry Rice when the 49ers took him a pick before we were on the clock?

If we are guilty of missing anything it was because we did not trade up to get him.

[joseephuss]

I've always loved coach Landry, but there was no doubt we needed a change. Now, the way it happened was all wrong, but I was all in favor of bringing in Jimmy.

And the first thing that Jimmy said was he couldn't believe how slow the team was. We hung onto too many older players, other teams caught up and passed us in the draft and in player evaluations, and we never changed schemes with the times, i.e., the flex defense.

I don't think anyone foresaw the success we'd have with Jimmy, but the team had definitely become old and stagnant and needed a major overhaul.

I think Jerry Jones gets a little undue criticism for how the regime change occurred. How was he supposed to handle it? The media got a hold of the news before he could do anything. He wanted Jimmy Johnson. It wasn't as if he could let Landry stick around and mentor Jimmy or anything. It sucked, but it happened.

You are right that the change needed to happen. That and some luck. Luck that Dallas happened to have the #1 overall pick when Aikman was coming out. Just one more win or a loss by another team and Aikman isn't a Cowboy. Luck that the Vikings made such a dramatic trade. JJ and JJ created their luck and I couldn't see Tex and Tom pulling off the same trade.

[Doomsday101]

I think Jerry Jones gets a little undue criticism for how the regime change occurred. How was he supposed to handle it? The media got a hold of the news before he could do anything. He wanted Jimmy Johnson. It wasn't as if he could let Landry stick around and mentor Jimmy or anything. It sucked, but it happened.

You are right that the change needed to happen. That and some luck. Luck that Dallas happened to have the #1 overall pick when Aikman was coming out. Just one more win or a loss by another team and Aikman isn't a Cowboy. Luck that the Vikings made such a dramatic trade. JJ and JJ created their luck and I couldn't see Tex and Tom pulling off the same trade.

I have been saying that for a long time regarding Jones and the Landry situation. To this day I think Bum Bright who was the owner and employer of Landry should have gone to Tom and told him what the situation was and allowed Tom to step down. Bright choose not to and took the money and left Jerry with the problem.

[joseephuss]

I have been saying that for a long time regarding Jones and the Landry situation. To this day I think Bum Bright who was the owner and employer of Landry should have gone to Tom and told him what the situation was and allowed Tom to step down. Bright choose not to and took the money and left Jerry with the problem.

Very good point.

[Juke99]

Did the game pass him by?

I don't think so.

I think a coach is either flexible or he isn't.

Shula was a tough son of a gun but he was also flexible...he adapted his style to his players.

Guys like Landry and Parcells on the other hand, generally speaking, are fixed in their styles. They fit the players to their system.

So for instance, Landry kept running the Flex in an era when pressure defenses became the rage, ironically, partly due to Landry's influence on offense philosophy ie, multiple offenses etc....defenses became offensive in their approach, partly to take the game away from the offense. Yet Landry wasn't going to move away from the flex.

So I don't see it as the game passing him by...I see it more as a case of his disinterest in changing what he firmly believed in.

I think Parcells is much the same way.

With regard to botching the down and distance vs Philly...he didn't botch it during the game...he botched it when asked in a press conference after the game.

Quite honestly, he often botched stuff...he sent in the wrong players for the goal line formation on the last play of our first championship game vs Green Bay...Bob Hayes ended up having to block a LB...ooops...with disasterous results.

If Landy had done that in his last year, everyone would have called him senile.

I don't think the game passed him by.

[Zaxor]

Did the game pass him by?

I don't think so.

I think a coach is either flexible or he isn't.

Shula was a tough son of a gun but he was also flexible...he adapted his style to his players.

Guys like Landry and Parcells on the other hand, generally speaking, are fixed in their styles. They fit the players to their system.

So for instance, Landry kept running the Flex in an era when pressure defenses became the rage, ironically, partly due to Landry's influence on offense philosophy ie, multiple offenses etc....defenses became offensive in their approach, partly to take the game away from the offense. Yet Landry wasn't going to move away from the flex.

So I don't see it as the game passing him by...I see it more as a case of his disinterest in changing what he firmly believed in.

I think Parcells is much the same way.

With regard to botching the down and distance vs Philly...he didn't botch it during the game...he botched it when asked in a press conference after the game.

Quite honestly, he often botched stuff...he sent in the wrong players for the goal line formation on the last play of our first championship game vs Green Bay...Bob Hayes ended up having to block a LB...ooops...with disasterous results.

If Landy had done that in his last year, everyone would have called him senile.

I don't think the game passed him by.

Yeah that is sorta what I meant...though I couldn't spell it out so clearly like you did...again, with good and heady young players I still think his Flex would work or would have worked...

and you are right Tom did botch things up...Don, Roger and Danny have all said that...i.e. Tom would send in 74 Z Left go and they would change it to want he really wanted to call like 74 Z Right go...but I doubt Tom was unique in that...

But I am glad to see you also thought the game did not pass him by...when I use to hear those talking heads say that I use to get so mad cause to me it sounded very insulting towards Tom Landry

[jman]

I have been saying that for a long time regarding Jones and the Landry situation. To this day I think Bum Bright who was the owner and employer of Landry should have gone to Tom and told him what the situation was and allowed Tom to step down. Bright choose not to and took the money and left Jerry with the problem.

Almost accurate. Bum Bright gave Tex the unenvyable job of firing Landry the year before Jerry Jones bought the team. Tex said he just could not bring himself to do it and let him coach that last year, I believe, knowing the team was going to be sold and the job would be taken out of his hands.

So one way or the other, Landry would have been gone. Like you said, Bright took the money and history took care of insuring Jones took the blame for firing the only coach that the Cowboys ever had.