View Full Version : People are underestimating our O-Line's potential
The30YardSlant
03-19-2006, 07:02 PM
Consider, Flozell Adams was playing some of the best football of his career before his injury last year, and reports coming out say he has gotton stronger this offseason and is 100% healed. He is a pro-bowler if he can stay healthy.
Larry Allen, who will restructure IMO, is still a top 10 guard in the NFL based on strength alone, he is easily the strongest man in the NFL, maybe in NFL history. He is a fabulous run blocker, questionable in pass blocking now, but certainly better than average.
Andre Gurode/Al Johnson, I cant really defend these guys, just hope one steps up and claims the center spot.
Marco Rivera should be recovered from back surgery a year ago and is still a potential pro-bowler, better than LA at this point.
Jason Fabini is an unimaginable upgrade over Rob Pettiti no matter how you slice it
This O-Line, if it can stay healthy, will hold its own
jja050575
03-19-2006, 07:08 PM
Don't forget Kosier!!
Mansta54
03-19-2006, 07:08 PM
Consider, Flozell Adams was playing some of the best football of his career before his injury last year, and reports coming out say he has gotton stronger this offseason and is 100% healed. He is a pro-bowler if he can stay healthy.
Larry Allen, who will restructure IMO, is still a top 10 guard in the NFL based on strength alone, he is easily the strongest man in the NFL, maybe in NFL history. He is a fabulous run blocker, questionable in pass blocking now, but certainly better than average.
Andre Gurode/Al Johnson, I cant really defend these guys, just hope one steps up and claims the center spot.
Marco Rivera should be recovered from back surgery a year ago and is still a potential pro-bowler, better than LA at this point.
Jason Fabini is an unimaginable upgrade over Rob Pettiti no matter how you slice it
This O-Line, if it can stay healthy, will hold its own
Well said dude. I'm still not comfortable at the center spot though. Johnson scares me..
goshan
03-19-2006, 07:17 PM
It is hilarious how Flozell got better in everyone's eyes after he was injured. Before his injury, the oline was bad and most thought he was overrated.
Allen will be gone.
The oline is still in the bottom half of the league unless everything goes perfectly. Which won't happen.
bobbie brewskie
03-19-2006, 07:17 PM
Well said dude. I'm still not comfortable at the center spot though. Johnson scares me..
Ummm Johnson lost us the raiders game, to backup ur point buddy, it was sad . . .
TheEnigma
03-19-2006, 07:18 PM
Larry Allen, who will restructure IMO, is still a top 10 guard in the NFL based on strength alone, he is easily the strongest man in the NFL, maybe in NFL history. He is a fabulous run blocker, questionable in pass blocking now, but certainly better than average.
Actually, last year, Larry Allen was a much better pass blocker than a run blocker. He was horrendous in run blocking as he wasn't quick enough off of the snap to get a hand on anybody.
TheHustler
03-19-2006, 07:18 PM
Consider, Flozell Adams was playing some of the best football of his career before his injury last year
Not even close.
cowboyjoe
03-19-2006, 07:23 PM
Well, I forget who said it, maybe Norm, but someone on theticket, best I remember. Anyway, he said that Al Johnson was working out hard, he had put on some weight too in offseason. Something, can't remember full details, but Johnson's bench press, etc, was increased. Only time will tell, but if he has gotten more power, and strength, then maybe he can help us.
Mr Cowboy
03-19-2006, 07:25 PM
Be honest, our O-Line is still a problem. Who knows which Flozell will show up this year. LA is a shell of what he once was, and the kid we signed has not been a full time starter. Al is what he is. He is as big and strong as he is gonna get. He has been hitting the weights that past 3 off seasons, and he is not mysteriously going to get bigger and stronger in one offseason without the help of Bond's trainer. Rivera too might be over the hill and hopefully Fabini will be an upgrade at RT, (won't take much).
So there you have it, TO will do us no good if teams rush 9 and get to Bledsoe before he has a chance to look for TO.
The30YardSlant
03-19-2006, 07:32 PM
Not even close.
:rolleyes:
Just..... :rolleyes:
Next?
JackMagist
03-19-2006, 07:33 PM
Well said dude. I'm still not comfortable at the center spot though. Johnson scares me..Yes Center is still a big concern and needs to be addressed. Johnson is weak in the lower body and Gurode is just plain stupid...we need help.
At guard Rivera has a bad back and no matter how much recovery and such you have a bad back is still a bad back. And Larry Allen is old and slow now; not even close to what he used to be. Strength won't do you any good if you can't get to the guy to block him. Maybe Kozy can take up the slack in the Guard house; I hope so.
I am happy with our tackle situation now with Flo coming back and Fabini coming in. But don't forget both are coming off of injuries so our backup situation could come into play and that could use some work.
Paniolo22
03-19-2006, 07:33 PM
Here's the way I see it. With the additions of Kosier and Fabini, I feel MUCH MORE COMFORTABLE with our backups in LIMITED action. I would not be as set if the backups had to start for long periods of time.
It is hilarious how Flozell got better in everyone's eyes after he was injured. Before his injury, the oline was bad and most thought he was overrated.
Allen will be gone.
The oline is still in the bottom half of the league unless everything goes perfectly. Which won't happen.
Well said. Another year on those tires is gonna do nothing positive for Allen. Flozell wasn't that great before the injury. He sure as heck at 50% is better than Tucker though.
I see reason for hope in the Al Johnson situation. It was recently reported on this site that he had been working hard in the weight program and had built on his strength. Plus, another year removed from surgery.
Rivera, how is 3 months of offseason suddenly got his back healed? Back injuries take careers to heal. Remember Don Mattingly? I will cross my fingers though.
I love the Fabini signing, though I think Petitti is the next Fabini. Pettiti wasn't doing bad till he got banged up.
I don't like the money that we gave the guy from Detroit, but I do love the flexibility he provides. I am scared to see what it would look like if Larry left though.
All in all, our line will be better. For one because we had the worst line in the NFL last year(MHO). Fabini and Flo back will make a huge difference in how explosive our offense will become(not to mention TO, but thats probably being discussed in the TO thread.) Bledsoe proved he can get the job done when given time. We don't even need a huge offense because our defense is really coming into its own. I think reasonable pass protection will be provided barring injury. I want to see the run protection. We had no run attack last year. And believe me, we tried. I am hoping TO can make the diffence in this whole offense. A guy you have to game plan for. Leaving Glenn and Witten not to mention Crayton free in single coverage..... You're gonna have to stop bringing the house with how much a team is gonna be burned. If this offense starts to gel ladies and gentlemen, I give you the next Super Bowl winners. The Dallas Cowboys!!!!!
Manster68
03-19-2006, 07:56 PM
Consider, Flozell Adams was playing some of the best football of his career before his injury last year, and reports coming out say he has gotton stronger this offseason and is 100% healed. He is a pro-bowler if he can stay healthy.
I remember posters absolutely shredding Flo a couple of years ago. People realized just how valuable he was last season.
Larry Allen, who will restructure IMO, is still a top 10 guard in the NFL based on strength alone, he is easily the strongest man in the NFL, maybe in NFL history. He is a fabulous run blocker, questionable in pass blocking now, but certainly better than average.
I just don't get the sense that he will restructure. I hope you are right though.
Andre Gurode/Al Johnson, I cant really defend these guys, just hope one steps up and claims the center spot.
Just how much bigger and stronger can Johnson get? The Cowboys, it seems, like it got stuck between a rock and a hard place. The only real valuable center in free agency was Bentley, and he was determined to be a Cleveland Brown. Centers in the draft are not that impressive either. So Dallas just might have to suck this need area up - meaning that I agree with you.
Marco Rivera should be recovered from back surgery a year ago and is still a potential pro-bowler, better than LA at this point.
This is the guy I am hoping has a terrific comeback season. With his contract, Dallas can ill-afford to get rid of him.
Jason Fabini is an unimaginable upgrade over Rob Pettiti no matter how you slice it
I like the acquisition of Fabini, but I would hope people would cut Petitti some slack. He was a rookie for crying out loud. He will get better.
This O-Line, if it can stay healthy, will hold its own
I am also convinced that the Cowboys will draft a tackle or guard with the 2nd round pick. Plus another offensive lineman on the 2nd day of the draft.
theogt
03-19-2006, 07:59 PM
:rolleyes:
Just..... :rolleyes:
Next?I have to agree with him. Flozell was playing some mediocre ball before his injury. After watching Tucker for several games, mediocre ball may look great, but pre-injury there was plenty of gnashing of teeth going on here about Flo's inability to perform at the level we expect of him.
FuzzyLumpkins
03-19-2006, 08:01 PM
Wow Gurode is now stupid and Rivera = Don Mattingly?
First of all please dont compare anyone to Mattingly who is perhaps the most overrated player in the history of sports. Or the state of medicine in the 80s to that what it is now.
Gurode by all accounts is a very intelligent person. Training instincts when you only have a second to react takes time is diificult when you are learning it from two different positions.
Sorry but that stuff was from the land of the weak.
People should get used to the name Petitti around here. He is gonna be here for a long time. He will learn alot from Fabini
sago1
03-19-2006, 08:04 PM
Last year so many people on this forum believed our OL would be awesome and one of the best in the NFL. Well, they weren't. In fact they were closer to being one of the worst. Now here we go again with many people believing our OL will be just great and we under estimating them. Adams returns and will play at his former pro bowl level, Allen still better then most other LG (if he's not cut), Riveria (turns 34) totally recovers from back surgery & returns to almost pro bowl level; do agree Fabini is big upgrade at RT for us. And we don't know what to expect from Gurode & Johnson--just hope for improvement from at least one. And of course we all hope for no injuries but reality says there will be some.
I'm not trying be negative but face a little bit of reality. What's the old saying--the war is won in the trenches. I like the defensive trench but have concerns whether we've upgrading our OL enough cause I'm afraid we've done just the minimum. I assume we will have some injuries on the OL at some point which is why it necessary to ensure we've got good backups. Currently our backups are Peterman (guess you can include Gurode) and Pettiti. We've go Colombo (don't know how his knee coming along) and do you really want to go to war with Tucker? Teams usually carry from 9-11 OL. I'd like to upgrade our backups just a little more. Don't think I'm expecting too much since I expect opponents to really come after Bledsoe before he can get the ball out. Steelers did it to Manning & teams will try doing it to Bledsoe.
The Oline will be improve without a doubt. With Flo back, hoping he comes back to full strength, it gives more flexiblity to the oline. If Petitti is the RT and needs help we can send Witten or Hannam to that side to chip the ends. Like Parcells said, you can hide one one spot on the oline but you can' hide 2 spots. Last year's problems started when Flo got hurt and we had to help Petitti AND Tucker on both ends.
Viper
03-19-2006, 08:09 PM
Can you have a good line with Bledsoe-so behind center?:confused:
Don Mattingly overrated? Before his injury, he was the best player in baseball. Don't let these bloated steroids stats fool yah.... Believe me, back then I watched every yankee game. He just played on a very bad team(except for Dave winfield) .
Eanwen
03-19-2006, 08:15 PM
I certainly hope the o-line will be better, but in recent years I've been disappointed too many times to believe it at face value. :(
I like the defensive trench but have concerns whether we've upgrading our OL enough cause I'm afraid we've done just the minimum. I assume we will have some injuries on the OL at some point which is why it necessary to ensure we've got good backups. Currently our backups are Peterman (guess you can include Gurode) and Pettiti. We've go Colombo (don't know how his knee coming along) and do you really want to go to war with Tucker? Teams usually carry from 9-11 OL. I'd like to upgrade our backups just a little more. Don't think I'm expecting too much since I expect opponents to really come after Bledsoe before he can get the ball out. Steelers did it to Manning & teams will try doing it to Bledsoe.
Welcome to the new NFL. You should see Washington's depth. It is survival of the fittest you stay health, you will win. Its the wildcard of any NFL season.
dallasfan
03-19-2006, 08:19 PM
Our o-line will be better simply b/c no matter how inconsistent Flozzell is, he's way better than Torrin Tucker, and Fabini is just better than Petitti.
Qwickdraw
03-19-2006, 08:20 PM
I cant believe you left out Kosier.:D :rolleyes:
has been terriable for several seasons now.......false starts.....holding calls inside the 20's.
This line still needs alot of work. Adams is a good tackle....alot better than any backups we had.......but he still needs alot of improvement especially in concentration.
Allen is a huge pylon.......thats all.....if he gets his mitts on you....yes...ur done....but he rarely does...he cant pull.....he is useless in getting to the 2nd level....he is too top heavy....considering what he is being payed.....he might be the most overpaid player in the league considering his production.
Our centers need improvement.......from what Ive seen.....either the line calls are off.....or the blocking system implemented is flawed. We for several years now still cannot stop a zone blitz.
Rivera is a vet and played well in Green Bay but he was nothing special for us last year....was it his back?.......has he started to decline?......Backs dont heal. Im hoping he does come back to form but im not betting any money on it.
RT is a question mark......Petite did what a late round pick was expected to do....struggle.....Fabini is a upgrade....but what can we expect from him?...I know nothing about him......if he struggles like Rivera did last season than Bleadsoe is in heaps of trouble.
This OL is our weakest link.....the game is won in the trenches....I hope we draft more OL and hopefully hit on a few....but considering Bill track record with drafting OL for us.....that may be asking to much.
Our OL cant be any worse than last year......but if we are hoping for a pre-Adams injury performance from our OL......we will be disappointed again because that wasn't good enough either.
I hope some vets step up....Rivera,Fabini....Johnson...if not....Bill will once again...will play not to lose instead of trying to win because he doesn't trust our offence.
I live in NY and watch Jet games. NY has had a really good offensive line for many years now. The reasons, mostly Fabini and Mawae. I still can't believe Parcells didn't get Mawae. He either doesn't think Mawae can do the job(not likely.) Or he has more confidence in our Center depth chart than we seem to.
FuzzyLumpkins
03-19-2006, 09:10 PM
Don Mattingly overrated? Before his injury, he was the best player in baseball. Don't let these bloated steroids stats fool yah.... Believe me, back then I watched every yankee game. He just played on a very bad team(except for Dave winfield) .
His career best OPS was only a hair over 900 and he never sniffed 1000. His career average was right around 800. Being on a bad team has little to do with ability to bat.
Fact is he was average and considering his position his offensive production was below average.
Go ahead and listen to WFAN and think he is worth anything. Fact is he was an average player on some very bad teams.
jrumann59
03-19-2006, 09:11 PM
Really if you look at it Flozell was very important, I know he isn't the 2nd coming of Anthony Munoz but after he went down our sack total tripled.
You can stat me all day long. You obviously didn't watch much baseball back then.
DLCassidy
03-19-2006, 09:15 PM
Consider, Flozell Adams was playing some of the best football of his career before his injury last year, and reports coming out say he has gotton stronger this offseason and is 100% healed. He is a pro-bowler if he can stay healthy.
Larry Allen, who will restructure IMO, is still a top 10 guard in the NFL based on strength alone, he is easily the strongest man in the NFL, maybe in NFL history. He is a fabulous run blocker, questionable in pass blocking now, but certainly better than average.
Stopped reading right here. Try watching the games.
big dog cowboy
03-19-2006, 09:18 PM
Larry Allen, who will restructure IMO, is still a top 10 guard in the NFL based on strength alone, he is easily the strongest man in the NFL, maybe in NFL history. He is a fabulous run blocker, questionable in pass blocking now, but certainly better than average.
There is a difference between top 10 and better than average. He is not in the top 10 barely better than average. His strength isn't an issue. We will know exactly what his situation is the end of next week. I won't be surprised if he is shown the door.
The30YardSlant
03-19-2006, 09:27 PM
There is a difference between top 10 and better than average. He is not in the top 10 barely better than average. His strength isn't an issue. We will know exactly what his situation is the end of next week. I won't be surprised if he is shown the door.
Name 10 guards better
Shields
Hutchinson
Steinbach (maybe)
Faneca
Waters
Wahle
Rivera (when completely healthy)
Woody (maybe, and hes only a part time guard)
Thomas (maybe)
That's about it as far as great guards go
Is it me or does LA need to be shown the door? Sure he can lift, but this is not cardio. Our line gets worse every year for 3 to 4 years now. Larry is on the bike half of Spring Training. This offensive Line reminds one of reading Relationship Rescue. Maybe its best we move on.
Mr Cowboy
03-19-2006, 10:04 PM
Name 10 guards better
Shields
Hutchinson
Steinbach (maybe)
Faneca
Waters
Wahle
Rivera (when completely healthy)
Woody (maybe, and hes only a part time guard)
Thomas (maybe)
That's about it as far as great guards go
How about the guards on the Broncos, Seahawks, Chiefs, Giants, Steelers, and every other team who has a semblance of a good running game?
Our guards whould be spending time watching game film of the Chiefs run blocking.
vBulletin® v3.6.4, Copyright ©2000-2013, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.