Who hits the hardest? Sean Taylor or Roy Williams

[redskins1]

sean taylor or roy williams who hits the hardest..its close,but i have to lean towards sean taylor...reason being roy grabs from behind alot and he gets big hits on people who are not ready to protect themselves,sean has more head to head were the other guy is squared up and sean goes head to head and knocks the runner backwards,i think sean comes with more force..how do you see it?

[superpunk]

Taylor hits like a girl.

Roy rules all things.

Have a nice day.:rolleyes:

[AdamJT13]

The first time I see Sean Taylor hit anyone as hard as I've seen Roy hit people numerous times, I'll let you know.

I'm sure you'll be waiting a long time.

[Bizwah]

Ask Shaun Alexander or Laveraneous Coles who hits harder.

[Ken]

honestly,
Roy hits twice as hard as Taylor.

And much more often.

[BigDFan5]

The first time I see Sean Taylor hit anyone as hard as I've seen Roy hit people numerous times, I'll let you know.

I'm sure you'll be waiting a long time.

Taylor tried to hit someone as hard as Roy hits once, He knocked himself out, remember?

[wxcpo]

Why the hell would a Skins fan come to a Cowboys board and ask such a dumb question. Even IF the answer was Taylor not like anyone here would say so, but in all reality it isn't even close. Taylor tries to hit people as hard as Roy does, but he can't even carry Roy's jock.

[Arch Stanton]

Greg Jones. :lmao2:

[firehawk350]

Why the hell would a Skins fan come to a Cowboys board and ask such a dumb question. Even IF the answer was Taylor not like anyone here would say so, but in all reality it isn't even close. Taylor tries to hit people as hard as Roy does, but he can't even carry Roy's jock.

Haha, i agree with the first part of this post, but you kinda sounded condicatory.. You just said that any response in a cowboys forum would be invalid because your asking on a cowboys forum, but you decided to go ahead and say what every cowboys fan has already said. It's like saying, "this statement is a lie".

[theebs]

THis is because as I have come to believe all redskins fans on the internet are 12 years old, or act like it. Its like that board they have, its ridiculous I never go there, but the 4 or 5 times I have in three years all the topics are like "best wr in the nfc east" best rb in the nfc east etc.....then they get 500 replies like, man brunell is so much better than mcnabb because mcnabb runs too much and eats chunky soup......

These threads are a waste of time like that board. These topics have to be thought of by a 12 year old.

[redskins1]

why does everything has to be based on what team you like,can folks give a opinion based on how they honestly feel,leaving your bias out of it...i can..

[t.o.boys81]

why does everything has to be based on what team you like,can folks give a opinion based on how they honestly feel,leaving your bias out of it...i can..

Don't worry, we're not being biased by saying Roy hits harder than Taylor. We're just telling the truth. There's nothing to it.

[firehawk350]

Ask Shaun Alexander or Laveraneous Coles who hits harder.

Or we can ask Terry Glenn or Randy Moss. Hell, ask TO. Yes, Roy Williams broke his leg, but that wasn't because it was a monster hit. It was because it was a horse-collar tackle. In all fairness, it wasn't illegal at the time, but the point being it wasn't a hard tackle. Just ackward. You can ask the Cards RB too, he ducked (on 4th and 2 with the game on the line no less) avoid a Taylor hit as opposed to fight for the yards and the game.
Or let's turn it around, and ask Santana Moss. Has Roy ever been close enough to hit Santana?

[big dog cowboy]

I've seen MANY running backs that hit harder than Taylor. Stupid thread.

[FLcowboy]

sean taylor or roy williams who hits the hardest..its close,but i have to lean towards sean taylor...reason being roy grabs from behind alot and he gets big hits on people who are not ready to protect themselves,sean has more head to head were the other guy is squared up and sean goes head to head and knocks the runner backwards,i think sean comes with more force..how do you see it?
Your analysis of Roy pulling down from behind is because he was forced to play more coverage support, as opposed to run support. I think this year you won't see Roy playing so deep, and he will be knocking the bejeebers out of running backs, or WRs coming out of the slot with the ball in their hands.

Let's answer this question after this season. If you still want to ponder a question now, will Sean's off-season behavior impact his on-field play, or is all that behind him now with the plea bargain.

[firehawk350]

THis is because as I have come to believe all redskins fans on the internet are 12 years old, or act like it. Its like that board they have, its ridiculous I never go there, but the 4 or 5 times I have in three years all the topics are like "best wr in the nfc east" best rb in the nfc east etc.....then they get 500 replies like, man brunell is so much better than mcnabb because mcnabb runs too much and eats chunky soup......

These threads are a waste of time like that board. These topics have to be thought of by a 12 year old.

And you yourself sound so informed to group every Skins fan into one group. Of course there are the blind homers, you'll get them anytime you go to an opposing fans board. There are plenty of them here. How many times have you heard a case trying to be made, saying that Bledsoe is better then Rothlesberger? Or Julius Jones is an elite RB? Or the Dallas O-line is be dominating this year? I've even heard that somebody thinks that Watkins or Davis = Sean Taylor. One of those things man, you just gotta ignore them and have an intelligent conversation with the better posters.

[DBoys]

:dissskin:


I got 3 hits for you

Shaun Alexander
Lav Coles
SF return guy

All you have is a no pro bowl gun carrying spitter.

[firehawk350]

Your analysis of Roy pulling down from behind is because he was forced to play more coverage support, as opposed to run support. I think this year you won't see Roy playing so deep, and he will be knocking the bejeebers out of running backs, or WRs coming out of the slot with the ball in their hands.

Let's answer this question after this season. If you still want to ponder a question now, will Sean's off-season behavior impact his on-field play, or is all that behind him now with the plea bargain.

Then again, you don't see Sean Taylor pulling down from behind even though he's forced into coverage. Laying a big hit has a lot to do with position, and if Taylor is in better position more often, then you could say that Taylor IS the better hitter.

Good second question though, and my outlook on this is he had it hanging over his head all last season, right? If anything, an unresolved court case would affect his play more then a resolved one, so if anything, we should see an improvement on the mental aspect. If it did affect him, we will probably see a better Taylor. But I don't think it did so we should see the normal progression of a second into third year player.

[RW31]

Sean Taylor

[DGreenFan87]

so obviously my opinion doesn't matter here. yea you guessed it, i think sean taylor hits harder. let the roasting begin.

And you yourself sound so informed to group every Skins fan into one group. Of course there are the blind homers, you'll get them anytime you go to an opposing fans board. There are plenty of them here. How many times have you heard a case trying to be made, saying that Bledsoe is better then Rothlesberger? Or Julius Jones is an elite RB? Or the Dallas O-line is be dominating this year? I've even heard that somebody thinks that Watkins or Davis = Sean Taylor. One of those things man, you just gotta ignore them and have an intelligent conversation with the better posters.

very good point. case in point, every team defends their players. saying that everyone on ES are 12 year olds is immature and stupid because there are people who intelligently back up their opinions and don't always go the homer route. i can honestly say there are intelligent people on this board who aren't homers, but i can also say that i've seen a lot of people just blindly praise your team for no reason. it's how the game is played. both our boards are infested with immature people. deal with it.

[big dog cowboy]

Sean Taylor
what a shock.

:lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

[superpunk]

Then again, you don't see Sean Taylor pulling down from behind even though he's forced into coverage.
Sure you do.

Good second question though, and my outlook on this is he had it hanging over his head all last season, right? If anything, an unresolved court case would affect his play more then a resolved one, so if anything, we should see an improvement on the mental aspect. If it did affect him, we will probably see a better Taylor. But I don't think it did so we should see the normal progression of a second into third year player.

Lord knows it helped Jamal Lewis.

[firehawk350]

:dissskin:


I got 3 hits for you

Shaun Alexander
Lav Coles
SF return guy

All you have is a no pro bowl gun carrying spitter.

Your profile says you live in america, and the FL courts seemed to think Taylor didn't have a gun. So, I would go on a limb and call you either un-american or a liar. Your call.
I've got plenty of hits.
Priest Holmes
TO
Randy Moss
Terry Glenn
Patrick Crayton
AZ RB
Tatum Bell

And pro bowls are a popularity contest. Or do you think Mike Vick is really the best QB in the NFC (2005)?

[MONT17]

Or we can ask Terry Glenn or Randy Moss. Hell, ask TO. Yes, Roy Williams broke his leg, but that wasn't because it was a monster hit. It was because it was a horse-collar tackle. In all fairness, it wasn't illegal at the time, but the point being it wasn't a hard tackle. Just ackward. You can ask the Cards RB too, he ducked (on 4th and 2 with the game on the line no less) avoid a Taylor hit as opposed to fight for the yards and the game.
Or let's turn it around, and ask Santana Moss. Has Roy ever been close enough to hit Santana?


I take it u have never been horse collared... If Roy Williams Horse Colled me like he did TO he would have probally broke both of my legs!!! to understand the power of the Horse collar u have to have it done to you running at full speed while a player whips you to the ground.... Head up tackles sound/look worse than what they are... its mostly pads on pads!!!



when watching the Cowboys and u see a player streak across the screen and lay out the guy with the ball.... u know its only 1 person who has that skill much in the mold of Ronnie Lott he can run full speed towards a moving target and hit it with 95% accurracy!

the most impressive hit I have seen was when he hit Jacobs of the Giants in close quarters and force a fumble on the goalline that was pure explosion!!!

[firehawk350]

Lord knows it helped Jamal Lewis.

The same Lord knows that Irvin's game suffered due to his legal issues...

It's a case-by-case issue and he had the same problem (but worse) last year and I didn't see much in the way of decline in talent

[t.o.boys81]

It's funny listening to all the Redskin fans try to convince everyone that Sean Taylor can hit harder than Roy. Absolutely hilarious!:lmao2:

[AsthmaField]

Look... Sean Taylor is a very good safety. To be honest (and let you know that I am being honest) I think Taylor is better in coverage than Roy. He should be, he's a FS and Roy is a SS. However, the question of who hits harder is only a valid question in the minds of Redskin fans. Everyone else knows that Roy hits harder.

Saying Roy drags down from behind is just a stupid statement. Yes he has pulled players down from behind... so has Taylor and every other safety in the NFL. Roy has had plenty of head on hits too though. Just watch the Boom highlight video that was made about Roy... he blows people up. It's silly to think that because he has pulled down from behind that it means that he doesn't hit hard. One has nothing to do with the other. What do you want Roy to do? When he finds himself trailing the ballcarrier, just let him go because he can't get the killshot from behind? Pffffft. Silly.

I've seen Roy level ballcarriers. I've seen Roy level blockers. I've seen Roy level returners. If you haven't seen the head on hits... you must not be looking too hard. He hit Emmitt so hard on his shoulder pads that he broke his shoulder blade. Emmitt said it was one of the hardest hits he's ever taken... and he's taken a lot. He gave Shawn Alexander a concussion just knocking him out of bounds. He almost knocked Deuce Staley out. He damn near killed a San Francisco kickoff returner in his rookie season. He butted heads with Marshall Faulk and Faulk just dropped the ball. No one touched the ball or really any part of his body except for his helment... but the hit was so hard, Faulk just went limp. I could go on and on. Roy scares people and Redskin fans love to focus on the fact that he pulls down from behind... like everyone else playing defense does from time to time. Funny really.

Redskin fans feel compelled to compare Roy and Sean and want Sean to be better in every aspect. He isn't. He's better in coverage and Roy hits harder.

Sean got absolutely steamrolled by Greg Jones while he was in college... just ran the F*** over. You must not have seen it or you wouldn't be saying anything about Roy pulling down from behind.

They both hit hard... Roy hit harder. They both can cover... Sean covers better. They're both good safeties, so let it go.

[superpunk]

The same Lord knows that Irvin's game suffered due to his legal issues...

You're right.

It was hella tough for Irvin to make many plays while he was suspended.

It'll be interesting to see how Taylor fares under a suspension. Maybe he can put up some killa hits on his couch pillow, or something.

[leotisbrown]

Sean Taylor needed a posse behind him a 50 calibor Desert eagle and a baseball bat before he decide he can be a tough guy.

Roy understand what Texas tough is all about. He come to a fights by himself with only a big sack of brass cannon balls between him and the enimese against him. That's at what we calls being a manly type man of stud power portions-- you wouldn't not knows nothing on that being a Deadskin fans and all-- HA HA HA!!!

Like Grampa Brown always use to said "One riot one rangler."

[CowboysFan02]

sean taylor or roy williams who hits the hardest..its close,but i have to lean towards sean taylor...reason being roy grabs from behind alot and he gets big hits on people who are not ready to protect themselves,sean has more head to head were the other guy is squared up and sean goes head to head and knocks the runner backwards,i think sean comes with more force..how do you see it?

Roy Williams hands down, bigger hitter and more entertaining to watch.

Oh and it seems Ronnie Lott agrees:

:starspin

When I asked him if there is anyone he watches on Sundays that reminds him of himself, he said, "I like to grab my popcorn and watch Roy Williams play the game."
Its about halfway down (http://www.nfl.com/news/story/8564100)

Oh and if you need your Sean Taylor fix just take a look at him disappering behind Crayton in my sig.:wink3:

[jterrell]

Or we can ask Terry Glenn or Randy Moss. Hell, ask TO. Yes, Roy Williams broke his leg, but that wasn't because it was a monster hit. It was because it was a horse-collar tackle. In all fairness, it wasn't illegal at the time, but the point being it wasn't a hard tackle. Just ackward. You can ask the Cards RB too, he ducked (on 4th and 2 with the game on the line no less) avoid a Taylor hit as opposed to fight for the yards and the game.
Or let's turn it around, and ask Santana Moss. Has Roy ever been close enough to hit Santana?
try to take a second and think about this.

How many players in the nfl could have dragged TO down from behind, much less done so with enough force to break his ankle?

RW knocked Warner, McNair, Emmitt and many other players out of games with big hits. Lavar did that as well but Sean Taylor hasn't. His best plays are 20 yards down the field picking off passes when it looked like he was beat. Thats at UofM and for the skabs. What any non-redskin knows is that the Skins just lost their biggest hitter to a division rival.

Taylor didn't even land a blow in the infamous 4x4 dispute, he just waved a gun. He's good at threats and roaming centerfield.

At his size/speed, he is a good player but he's out of position as much as RW and does not have near the impact when he tackles. Taylor is wider and thicker from the waist up but in the legs RW is built like a DT.

[superpunk]

Roy scares people and Redskin fans love to focus on the fact that he pulls down from behind... like everyone else playing defense does from time to time. Funny really.

Including Taylor.

Nice post, AF. Why try to reason though, in such a ridiculous thread? It feels like :bang2:.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again - if I could pick one player from another NFC East team, it would be Taylor, regardless of his off the field crap. (Although I'd prefer that he wasn't so bush-league ON the field, either....)

He's a phenomenal free safety. Probably will go down as one of the best. But Roy is in another league as far as hitting goes.

[t.o.boys81]

Taylor is better at spitting in people's faces than hitting hard.

[redskins1]

asthmafield...you bringing it strong..you make some valid points..it just seems like sean taylor blows more runners up head to head,and knock them backwards more than roy...which makes it seems he hits harder...anybody can blow somebody up who is unprotected...sean takes it head on and wins more...thats my point!!!

[DGreenFan87]

Sean Taylor needed a posse behind him a 50 calibor Desert eagle and a baseball bat before he decide he can be a tough guy.

Roy understand what Texas tough is all about. He come to a fights by himself with only a big sack of brass cannon balls between him and the enimese against him. That's at what we calls being a manly type man of stud power portions-- you wouldn't not knows nothing on that being a Deadskin fans and all-- HA HA HA!!!

Like Grampa Brown always use to said "One riot one rangler."
and this site DOESN'T have 12 year old homers. riiiiiiiight. :rolleyes:

and someone please explain to me what "you wouldn't not knows nothing on that" means?? :confused:

[Hostile]

Brian Dawkins needs to be in this equation.

Silly thread just meant to give a couple of jerks reason to go back to a Skins forum and call everyone who answers blind homers. Not a doubt in my mind.

[BigDFan5]

Your profile says you live in america, and the FL courts seemed to think Taylor didn't have a gun. So, I would go on a limb and call you either un-american or a liar. Your call. umm the case never made it into a court room, Taylor pleaded down to avoid the trial. So I guess you are a liar for saying that?





I've got plenty of hits.

Terry Glenn


Link?

[superpunk]

Link?

I've got a killer link of Taylor hitting Glenn out of bounds, late. Is that what you want? ;)

He does that an awful lot. 15 yard penalties are teh awesome.

[Hostile]

asthmafield...you bringing it strong..you make some valid points..it just seems like sean taylor blows more runners up head to head,and knock them backwards more than roy...which makes it seems he hits harder...anybody can blow somebody up who is unprotected...sean takes it head on and wins more...thats my point!!!When did the NFL make a rule about Sean Taylor injuring people? The horse collar tackle has been in the NFL since long before you were a gleam in your mama's eye or a deviant thought in your daddy's head. One guy comes in and uses that tackle with devestating results and the NFL sees fit to outlaw it.

Taylor is a big hitter, but ask NFL players who is bigger. Not a doubt in my mind what the answer will be.

The king of big hitting safeties, Ronnie Lott, annointed Roy the guy he watches for his devestating hits. Excuse me if I give him more credence than I do you.

[5Stars]

Roy is also an upstanding citizen, a God fearing Christian, and a wonderful teammate that take his role seriously...

On the other hand, Taylor is a thug, a spitter, does what he wants regarding his team (not attending NFL mandated conferences)...hangs with criminals, fights with criminals, and is basically a no good for nothing punk!

Any more stupid questions?


Here Gibbs...HERE BOY....GIBBS COME!

:dissskin: Good dog......!

[BigDFan5]

I've got a killer link of Taylor hitting Glenn out of bounds, late. Is that what you want? ;)

He does that an awful lot. 15 yard penalties are teh awesome.

I was kind of waiting for them to post the link of Glenn not being able to catch an uncatchable ball, and then watch them pretend Glenn was scared of getting hit. That one always makes me laugh

[superpunk]

I was kind of waiting for them to post the link of Glenn not being able to catch an uncatchable ball, and then watch them pretend Glenn was scared of getting hit. That one always makes me laugh

Oh right - that too.

Except Taylor never actually hit Glenn on that one.

[BigDFan5]

Oh right - that too.

Except Taylor never actually hit Glenn on that one.

You have to consider the source of who said it. Sometimes you dont have to touch them to hit them ;)

[ThreeSportStar80]

why does everything has to be based on what team you like,can folks give a opinion based on how they honestly feel,leaving your bias out of it...i can..

We should ban you from posting such retarded questions....Until Taylor cracks someone's shoulder blade from a hit holla at me...LOL!

[Hostile]

why does everything has to be based on what team you like,can folks give a opinion based on how they honestly feel,leaving your bias out of it...i can..I'll believe that sermon when I see evidence of you living it.

[DBoys]

Your profile says you live in america, and the FL courts seemed to think Taylor didn't have a gun. So, I would go on a limb and call you either un-american or a liar. Your call.
I've got plenty of hits.
Priest Holmes
TO
Randy Moss
Terry Glenn
Patrick Crayton
AZ RB
Tatum Bell

And pro bowls are a popularity contest. Or do you think Mike Vick is really the best QB in the NFC (2005)?

:dissskin:

[BigDFan5]

:dissskin:

:skins:

[5Stars]

The title of redstink1's post should have read;

Who spits the hardest? Sean Taylor or Roy Williams

:rolleyes:

Then everyone could give Sean "the thug" Taylor his props...

[DBoys]

Your profile says you live in america, and the FL courts seemed to think Taylor didn't have a gun. So, I would go on a limb and call you either un-american or a liar. Your call.
I've got plenty of hits.
Priest Holmes
TO
Randy Moss
Terry Glenn
Patrick Crayton
AZ RB
Tatum Bell

And pro bowls are a popularity contest. Or do you think Mike Vick is really the best QB in the NFC (2005)?

Since when does my being american or not have anything to do with the FL court system? If you want to know the truth America was founded on States rights so your argument has little weight.

A liar? Since when have the court systems become so honest that the verdict is the truth? Last I read Taylor didn't got to trial and took a plea bargain. So the only liar spinning facts is you since he never went to trial and nobody ever said he did or did not have a gun. I can tell you this he did or he would not have to plea bargain.

Pro Bowls are popularity contests eh? How do you think Roy got popular? FROM HIS BIG HITS!

:dissskin:

[DBoys]

The title of redstink1's post should have read;

Who spits the hardest? Sean Taylor or Roy Williams

:rolleyes:

Then everyone could give Sean "the thug" Taylor his props...

:lmao2: :lmao2:

[DBoys]

Roy is also an upstanding citizen, a God fearing Christian, and a wonderful teammate that take his role seriously...

On the other hand, Taylor is a thug, a spitter, does what he wants regarding his team (not attending NFL mandated conferences)...hangs with criminals, fights with criminals, and is basically a no good for nothing punk!

Any more stupid questions?


Here Gibbs...HERE BOY....GIBBS COME!

:dissskin: Good dog......!

Gibbs *****!!!

[sacase]

They always want to Throw out that pro bowl is just a popularity contest. Well that is all well and good but why was Roy voted All Pro?

Ok let's compare the video eveidence:

Sean Taylor:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=r706i4kOCb8&search=sean%20taylor

Roy Williams:
http://www.cowboysvids.com/

If you look at it objectivly you can see that ST hits with nowhere near the viloence that RW hits with.

[5Stars]

Gibbs *****!!!

That's my dog's name....he's a good dog! I taught him this trick....

GIBBS...COME...come boy....

:dissskin:

See how he wee-wee's on that trashy looking helmet?

:star:

[RiggoForever]

They always want to Throw out that pro bowl is just a popularity contest. Well that is all well and good but why was Roy voted All Pro?

Ok let's compare the video eveidence:

Sean Taylor:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=r706i4kOCb8&search=sean%20taylor

Roy Williams:
http://www.cowboysvids.com/

If you look at it objectivly you can see that ST hits with nowhere near the viloence that RW hits with.

That only has his rookie year in there

[sacase]

That only has his rookie year in there

You really don't want to get last years stuff because it only hurts him. He couldn't even bring Witten down and he had a free lick on him. Even KD hits harder than ST.

[Hostile]

That only has his rookie year in thereAfter his rookie year he didn't even make the NFL top 11 hardest hitters, while Roy was #2.

Check out who made quoted comments on this topic.

Link (http://images.nfl.com/photos/img9492533.jpg)

Hardest hitters: an inside look at the guys you don't want bearing down on you

Sporting News, The, Dec 20, 2004

1st & 10

Eagles free safety Brian Dawkins is built like a boxer, has the same quickness and packs a similar punch. Dawkins trains during the offseason with "No Holds Barred" ultimate fighting champion Tim Catalfo. That training has enhanced Dawkins' fierce competitiveness and added to his speed and strength, allowing him to be the hardest hitter in the league.

But there's more to being a big hitter than the willingness and ability to hammer receivers. There's an art to it. The best hard hitters don't overextend themselves in their eagerness to deliver a big shot and then miss. Dawkins delivers monster hits without sacrificing anything.

"Pound for pound, he might be the most violent guy in the league," says Redskins pro scout Mike Kelly. "He can generate such great speed in a confined space. He closes so rapidly and is just so physically strong. His compact size plays right into playing with leverage. He knows how to come up and through a person, bringing his hips."

Dawkins (5-11,205) covers like a cornerback and hits like a linebacker. One of the most vicious of Dawkins' many highlight-reel hits was delivered on Michael Vick in the playoffs two years ago. Vick spun like a top.

Says Bills cornerback Troy Vincent, a former Eagle: "When Dawk hits you, you stay hit."

2 Roy Williams, FS, Cowboys. He is at his best near the line, where he serves as an extra linebacker. He also lurks in the middle, waiting for an unsuspecting receiver. He changes games with big hits. "Sometimes he throws his body in there like he's playing with somebody else's body," Kelly says.

3 Rodney Harrison, SS, Patriots. His quickness allows him to patrol the secondary and punish receivers who don't keep their heads on a swivel. Harrison hits so hard the NIL has made him the most fined player in history. He has had to work on staying within the confines of the evolving NFL rulebook.

4 John Lynch, FS, Broncos. He might have lost a step, but he still hits a ton and has not let offseason neck surgery affect him. His ability to read plays allows him to go alter home run hits. In Week 13, he came flying up and drilled the Chargers' Jesse Chatman, who lost the ball, his helmet and his wits.

5 Ray Lewis, ILB, Ravens. If Lewis gets a run at you, you better duck. Some of his best shots are delivered on the perimeter. Running backs, searching for holes on "stretch" plays, often get blindsided by Lewis at full speed. His ability has slipped a little in the last year, but he still hits with ferocity.

6 Takeo Spikes, OLB, Bills. Spikes would like nothing better than to knock the taste out of your mouth. He has marvelous balance and technique and always attacks at full speed. Spikes welcomed Jaguars rookie wideout Reggie Williams to the NFL with a helmet-dislodging shot in the opener.

7 Donovin Darius, SS, Jaguars. Because the Jaguars put him so close to the line for run support, Darius plays like an extra linebacker and fearlessly gives up his body. The problem comes in coverage; Darius sometimes gets caught out of position in his eagerness to make the big hit.

8 Keith Brooking, OLB, Falcons. He has exceptional timing and what coordinator Ed Donatell calls strong "hit-through" skills. Brooking's explosive hips drive his tackles and allow him to inflict maximum punishment. His best asset is a relentless attitude about nailing the ballcarrier on every play.

9 Adrian Wilson, SS, Cardinals. Wilson has excellent size (6-3, 223) for a safety and takes equal pride in crushing receivers and ballcarriers. After being punished by a Wilson shot last season, then-49ers tight end Jed Weaver landed on his head, and his helmet went rolling off.

10 Chris Hope, FS, Steelers. Scene 1: Hope (214 pounds) flattens Jerome Bettis (252) in a goal-line drill at camp, Bettis doesn't practice for a week because of a sore shoulder. Scene 2: Hope puts a big hit on Miami's Lamar Gordon, who is lost for the season with a shoulder injury.

11 Shaun Rogers, DT, Lions. With his quick first step, explosive burst and size (6-4,345), Rogers can deliver a devastating blow to a quarterback or running back, even from a short distance. Because he's still establishing himself, he's always trying to leave a mark--mostly on his opponents.




The Sporting News must be homers.

[RiggoForever]

You really don't want to get last years stuff because it only hurts him. He couldn't even bring Witten down and he had a free lick on him. Even KD hits harder than ST.

Come on, this hit for example helped us win the game last year.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=wCfb1xerzAY&search=sean%20taylor%20hits

[RiggoForever]

After his rookie year he didn't even make the NFL top 11 hardest hitters, while Roy was #2.

Check out who made quoted comments on this topic.

Link (http://images.nfl.com/photos/img9492533.jpg)

Hardest hitters: an inside look at the guys you don't want bearing down on you

Sporting News, The, Dec 20, 2004

1st & 10

Eagles free safety Brian Dawkins is built like a boxer, has the same quickness and packs a similar punch. Dawkins trains during the offseason with "No Holds Barred" ultimate fighting champion Tim Catalfo. That training has enhanced Dawkins' fierce competitiveness and added to his speed and strength, allowing him to be the hardest hitter in the league.

But there's more to being a big hitter than the willingness and ability to hammer receivers. There's an art to it. The best hard hitters don't overextend themselves in their eagerness to deliver a big shot and then miss. Dawkins delivers monster hits without sacrificing anything.

"Pound for pound, he might be the most violent guy in the league," says Redskins pro scout Mike Kelly. "He can generate such great speed in a confined space. He closes so rapidly and is just so physically strong. His compact size plays right into playing with leverage. He knows how to come up and through a person, bringing his hips."

Dawkins (5-11,205) covers like a cornerback and hits like a linebacker. One of the most vicious of Dawkins' many highlight-reel hits was delivered on Michael Vick in the playoffs two years ago. Vick spun like a top.

Says Bills cornerback Troy Vincent, a former Eagle: "When Dawk hits you, you stay hit."

2 Roy Williams, FS, Cowboys. He is at his best near the line, where he serves as an extra linebacker. He also lurks in the middle, waiting for an unsuspecting receiver. He changes games with big hits. "Sometimes he throws his body in there like he's playing with somebody else's body," Kelly says.

3 Rodney Harrison, SS, Patriots. His quickness allows him to patrol the secondary and punish receivers who don't keep their heads on a swivel. Harrison hits so hard the NIL has made him the most fined player in history. He has had to work on staying within the confines of the evolving NFL rulebook.

4 John Lynch, FS, Broncos. He might have lost a step, but he still hits a ton and has not let offseason neck surgery affect him. His ability to read plays allows him to go alter home run hits. In Week 13, he came flying up and drilled the Chargers' Jesse Chatman, who lost the ball, his helmet and his wits.

5 Ray Lewis, ILB, Ravens. If Lewis gets a run at you, you better duck. Some of his best shots are delivered on the perimeter. Running backs, searching for holes on "stretch" plays, often get blindsided by Lewis at full speed. His ability has slipped a little in the last year, but he still hits with ferocity.

6 Takeo Spikes, OLB, Bills. Spikes would like nothing better than to knock the taste out of your mouth. He has marvelous balance and technique and always attacks at full speed. Spikes welcomed Jaguars rookie wideout Reggie Williams to the NFL with a helmet-dislodging shot in the opener.

7 Donovin Darius, SS, Jaguars. Because the Jaguars put him so close to the line for run support, Darius plays like an extra linebacker and fearlessly gives up his body. The problem comes in coverage; Darius sometimes gets caught out of position in his eagerness to make the big hit.

8 Keith Brooking, OLB, Falcons. He has exceptional timing and what coordinator Ed Donatell calls strong "hit-through" skills. Brooking's explosive hips drive his tackles and allow him to inflict maximum punishment. His best asset is a relentless attitude about nailing the ballcarrier on every play.

9 Adrian Wilson, SS, Cardinals. Wilson has excellent size (6-3, 223) for a safety and takes equal pride in crushing receivers and ballcarriers. After being punished by a Wilson shot last season, then-49ers tight end Jed Weaver landed on his head, and his helmet went rolling off.

10 Chris Hope, FS, Steelers. Scene 1: Hope (214 pounds) flattens Jerome Bettis (252) in a goal-line drill at camp, Bettis doesn't practice for a week because of a sore shoulder. Scene 2: Hope puts a big hit on Miami's Lamar Gordon, who is lost for the season with a shoulder injury.

11 Shaun Rogers, DT, Lions. With his quick first step, explosive burst and size (6-4,345), Rogers can deliver a devastating blow to a quarterback or running back, even from a short distance. Because he's still establishing himself, he's always trying to leave a mark--mostly on his opponents.




The Sporting News must be homers.


2004 was after RWs 3rd year, not his rookie year. I never claimed ST hits harder, but he hits nearly as hard, is faster and covers more field then RW and forces QBs/offensive coordinators to game plan around him.

[the_h0wey]

sean taylor or roy williams who hits the hardest..its close,but i have to lean towards sean taylor...reason being roy grabs from behind alot and he gets big hits on people who are not ready to protect themselves,sean has more head to head were the other guy is squared up and sean goes head to head and knocks the runner backwards,i think sean comes with more force..how do you see it?

You can't be serious.... I think you just wanted to see what kind of reaction you would get... but really are you serious?

[big dog cowboy]

I never claimed ST hits harder, but he hits nearly as hard, is faster and covers more field then RW and forces QBs/offensive coordinators to game plan around him.
You forgot "and he should be in jail."

[Hostile]

2004 was after RWs 3rd year, not his rookie year. I never claimed ST hits harder, but he hits nearly as hard, is faster and covers more field then RW and forces QBs/offensive coordinators to game plan around him.RF, it is being maintained by your cohorts in here that ST hits harder.

After Roy's rookie year he made the list of the NFL's biggest hitters.

ST did not, despite the fact one of your coaches is the main source. In that video I see good play, but not hard hits deserving of praise that he "blows people up."

If you have footage from last year of a superior hit, introduce it.

I'll show you one from Roy's rookie year (not his 3rd) that will be equal to it or more violent.

As I said before, Ronnie Lott must be a Cowboys homer. I put more stock in his answers than any of you guys coming here to call us homers.

[burmafrd]

Only a moronic skin homer would even ask the question. Who in this league is known for laying the wood- IT AIN'T TAYLOR. WHo is this league does ROnnie Lott thinks plays like him? IT AIN'T TAYLOR. And as for that BS about Taylor just hitting head on- if nothing else shows just how pathetic skins fans are that does. Why don't you go to an eagle board or a giant board or ANY OTHER BOARD and ask that question? I will tell you why- because you would get the same answer you got here. poor pathetic skin homer.

[RiggoForever]

RF, it is being maintained by your cohorts in here that ST hits harder.

After Roy's rookie year he made the list of the NFL's biggest hitters.

ST did not, despite the fact one of your coaches is the main source. In that video I see good play, but not hard hits deserving of praise that he "blows people up."

If you have footage from last year of a superior hit, introduce it.

I'll show you one from Roy's rookie year (not his 3rd) that will be equal to it or more violent.

As I said before, Ronnie Lott must be a Cowboys homer. I put more stock in his answers than any of you guys coming here to call us homers.

Come on Hostile, you have to acknowledge that was a superior hit whether or not you like the guy.

Heres another from 2004 that I'd consider vicious

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpNXkMO0-S0

[BigDFan5]

Come on Hostile, you have to acknowledge that was a superior hit whether or not you like the guy.

Heres another from 2004 that I'd consider vicious

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpNXkMO0-S0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XLgRAFUhGCM&search=roy%20williams

[AdamJT13]

Then again, you don't see Sean Taylor pulling down from behind even though he's forced into coverage.

Of course you see Taylor pulling down from behind -- when he's close enough to pull down from behind, that is. (No free safety allowed more deep touchdown passes in 2004 than Taylor.)

http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/3407/ab0366gi.jpg

http://s2.simpload.com/0611448c8eeb80d1b.jpg

http://media.hamptonroads.com/images/sports/redbig.jpg

http://www.txcn.com/sharedcontent/dws/img/v3/12-27-2004.ns_27CowboysTDCrayton.GEK1GSE5L.1.jpg

http://s2.simpload.com/0611448c9f4002078.jpg

http://s2.simpload.com/0611448c9f769b4e8.jpg

http://s2.simpload.com/0611448c9f8a90e7c.jpg

http://s2.simpload.com/0611448c9f9d8b5eb.jpg

[AdamJT13]

Come on Hostile, you have to acknowledge that was a superior hit whether or not you like the guy.

Please. The ball popping out made that hit seem bigger than it actually was.

And both of the hits you've posted came against unsuspecting receivers (meaning players catching the ball who don't know the hit is coming). Any safety can hit those guys and make it look like a big hit. Show me a video of Sean Taylor taking on a running back head-on, lifting him off his feet and driving him several yards backward in the air, and doing the same thing to several players who were trying to block him.

[peplaw06]

Of course you see Taylor pulling down from behind -- when he's close enough to pull down from behind, that is. (No free safety allowed more deep touchdown passes in 2004 than Taylor.)

http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/3407/ab0366gi.jpg

http://s2.simpload.com/0611448c8eeb80d1b.jpg

http://media.hamptonroads.com/images/sports/redbig.jpg

http://www.txcn.com/sharedcontent/dws/img/v3/12-27-2004.ns_27CowboysTDCrayton.GEK1GSE5L.1.jpg

http://s2.simpload.com/0611448c9f4002078.jpg

http://s2.simpload.com/0611448c9f769b4e8.jpg

http://s2.simpload.com/0611448c9f8a90e7c.jpg

http://s2.simpload.com/0611448c9f9d8b5eb.jpg

http://www.msprotege.com/members/LinuxRacr/Owned/owned4.JPG

[5Stars]

Please. The ball popping out made that hit seem bigger than it actually was.

And both of the hits you've posted came against unsuspecting receivers (meaning players catching the ball who don't know the hit is coming). Any safety can hit those guys and make it look like a big hit. Show me a video of Sean Taylor taking on a running back head-on, lifting him off his feet and driving him several yards backward in the air, and doing the same thing to several players who were trying to block him.

Every defensive player is going to make a good hit now and then...but, Roy has a consistency about how he plays...

These kinds of RedStinks posts are nothing but pee-pee envy!

:starspin

[Hostile]

Come on Hostile, you have to acknowledge that was a superior hit whether or not you like the guy.

Heres another from 2004 that I'd consider vicious

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpNXkMO0-S0That's better than the ones on the video previously posted.

Like I said, I see good football. I don't see devestating hits in that footage. Good hits? Yeah, there are some good ones. I acknowledge that.

Here's one I want you to see. I am no good at posting snippets of videos or doing graphics. So please see Roy's hit on Sean Alexander at about 1:30 of the video. Note that Sean is running forward. Look where he lands from the point of impact.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezFgHGSLhyY&search=roy%20williams

[Bob Sacamano]

Roy w/o a doubt

look at what he did to Lelie, Jimmy Smith, Todd Heap, Laverneous Coles, some of the hardest hits I ever saw, and will ever see

[Bob Sacamano]

oh yeah, Roy dislocated Emmitt's shoulder

[Bob Sacamano]

as I read Redskin fan posts, all I gotta say is, give it up, there's no competition

[Bob Sacamano]

Or the Dallas O-line is be dominating this year?

never heard that

I've even heard that somebody thinks that Watkins or Davis = Sean Taylor.

LINK!

[RiggoForever]

That's better than the ones on the video previously posted.

Like I said, I see good football. I don't see devestating hits in that footage. Good hits? Yeah, there are some good ones. I acknowledge that.

Here's one I want you to see. I am no good at posting snippets of videos or doing graphics. So please see Roy's hit on Sean Alexander at about 1:30 of the video. Note that Sean is running forward. Look where he lands from the point of impact.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezFgHGSLhyY&search=roy%20williams

That's a really powerful hit.

[AdamJT13]

oh yeah, Roy dislocated Emmitt's shoulder

Roy actually broke Emmitt's shoulder blade -- by hitting him from the front.

Emmitt had absorbed thousands and thousands of hits before that. He took one hit from Roy, and Emmitt acknowledged it as the hardest he has ever been hit.

[5Stars]

Roy actually broke Emmitt's shoulder blade -- by hitting him from the front.

Emmitt had absorbed thousands and thousands of hits before that. He took one hit from Roy, and Emmitt acknowledged it as the hardest he has ever been hit.

Roy Williams will knock you back into the middle of last Tuesday!

:star:

[Avery]

This reminds me of those old Nightmare on Elm Street movies, the ones where Freddy dies at the end but you know in your heart of hearts that he's not really dead, just waiting until he inexplicably comes back and we do it all over again. Nothing ever changes, just rinse and repeat.

I could give two shats and a twizzler who hits harder. All I know is that as a Cowboy fan, RW does not leave me sleepless at night that he'll do something stupid whereas ST, well...

[BigDFan5]

Roy Williams will knock you back into the middle of last Tuesday!

:star:

Roy will hit you so hard, your children are born with bruises

[Hostile]

That's a really powerful hit.That's from his rookie year. It isn't his hardest hit IMO. He did to a guy known for his toughness running with the ball. The difference IMO is that Sean didn't just go down from the hit they way you'd expect. He went backwards 2 or 3 yards.

It's one thing to knock a guy backwards who is standing still, a la Parker. It's quite another to have the guy's 225 pounds of forward momentum change directions.

Roy is the bigger hitter.

Check out his tackle on Jeff Garcia in that video too. That's blowing someone up. Again, rookie year.

[5Stars]

Roy will hit you so hard, your children are born with bruises

:lmao:

I'm telling you right now...if Roy hits you, you WILL land in another zipcode!

He's a bad...(shut your mouth)...

:starspin

[Bob Sacamano]

Laying a big hit has a lot to do with position, and if Taylor is in better position more often, then you could say that Taylor IS the better hitter.

I thought it was who was the bigger hitter? thanks for changing the criteria up, and because Roy is scrutinized so much, you hear a little snippet about him being out of position at times, or blowing coverage assignments, hell, if Sean Taylor was as scrutinized, we'd have lots of his weaknesses to talk about too, even though we don't need to, all we need is game-tape and they show that ST makes as many, if not more mistakes than Roy does

[Bob Sacamano]

Check out his tackle on Jeff Garcia in that video too. That's blowing someone up. Again, rookie year.

what about Roy piledriving Pat Ramsey, is that in the video? sorry, too lazy to look at it :)

[Hostile]

what about Roy piledriving Pat Ramsey, is that in the video? sorry, too lazy to look at it :)You need to watch that video. It's football and it's only 3 minutes of terror.

[Bizwah]

Or we can ask Terry Glenn or Randy Moss. Hell, ask TO. Yes, Roy Williams broke his leg, but that wasn't because it was a monster hit. It was because it was a horse-collar tackle. In all fairness, it wasn't illegal at the time, but the point being it wasn't a hard tackle. Just ackward. You can ask the Cards RB too, he ducked (on 4th and 2 with the game on the line no less) avoid a Taylor hit as opposed to fight for the yards and the game.
Or let's turn it around, and ask Santana Moss. Has Roy ever been close enough to hit Santana?

Has Taylor ever hit Glenn?

Taylor can hit hard....but no one hits like Roy. Ask Ronnie Lott (a source better than you or I), he said that Roy is better than Taylor.

[Hostile]

This isn't a devestating hit as far as leaving an opponent woozy. But this is my opinion of impact.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xyj3C47CTIs&search=roy%20williams

2:23 of the video.

Airborn chaos.

[Bizwah]

Look... Sean Taylor is a very good safety. To be honest (and let you know that I am being honest) I think Taylor is better in coverage than Roy. He should be, he's a FS and Roy is a SS. However, the question of who hits harder is only a valid question in the minds of Redskin fans. Everyone else knows that Roy hits harder.

Saying Roy drags down from behind is just a stupid statement. Yes he has pulled players down from behind... so has Taylor and every other safety in the NFL. Roy has had plenty of head on hits too though. Just watch the Boom highlight video that was made about Roy... he blows people up. It's silly to think that because he has pulled down from behind that it means that he doesn't hit hard. One has nothing to do with the other. What do you want Roy to do? When he finds himself trailing the ballcarrier, just let him go because he can't get the killshot from behind? Pffffft. Silly.

I've seen Roy level ballcarriers. I've seen Roy level blockers. I've seen Roy level returners. If you haven't seen the head on hits... you must not be looking too hard. He hit Emmitt so hard on his shoulder pads that he broke his shoulder blade. Emmitt said it was one of the hardest hits he's ever taken... and he's taken a lot. He gave Shawn Alexander a concussion just knocking him out of bounds. He almost knocked Deuce Staley out. He damn near killed a San Francisco kickoff returner in his rookie season. He butted heads with Marshall Faulk and Faulk just dropped the ball. No one touched the ball or really any part of his body except for his helment... but the hit was so hard, Faulk just went limp. I could go on and on. Roy scares people and Redskin fans love to focus on the fact that he pulls down from behind... like everyone else playing defense does from time to time. Funny really.

Redskin fans feel compelled to compare Roy and Sean and want Sean to be better in every aspect. He isn't. He's better in coverage and Roy hits harder.

Sean got absolutely steamrolled by Greg Jones while he was in college... just ran the F*** over. You must not have seen it or you wouldn't be saying anything about Roy pulling down from behind.

They both hit hard... Roy hit harder. They both can cover... Sean covers better. They're both good safeties, so let it go.

I guess Dick "Night Train" Lane isn't as good as Taylor either. I mean this Hall of Famer had to clothesline people to tackle them.

[DGreenFan87]

So please see Roy's hit on Sean Alexander at about 1:30 of the video. Note that Sean is running forward. Look where he lands from the point of impact.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezFgHGSLhyY&search=roy%20williams

i'll be the first to admit that RW lays it on pretty hard from watching that video. although i said that i thought ST was the harder hitter, i'm mature enough to be corrected. although many on this board find it necessary to place taylor into the pit of mediocrity, i still think he is a great hitter and if he picked up his technique when hitting he would be a greater hitter. take that as you want to, but RW definitely has the better technique and more experience that ST as a hitter.

you win this time, but we'll meet again!

[Hostile]

i'll be the first to admit that RW lays it on pretty hard from watching that video. although i said that i thought ST was the harder hitter, i'm mature enough to be corrected. although many on this board find it necessary to place taylor into the pit of mediocrity, i still think he is a great hitter and if he picked up his technique when hitting he would be a greater hitter. take that as you want to, but RW definitely has the better technique and more experience that ST as a hitter.

you win this time, but we'll meet again!Sean Taylor is a good football player who can be great. It's there for him. I don't like him, but I admire talent. He has lots of it. I hope he gets his act straight.

[5Stars]

I thought it was who was the bigger hitter? thanks for changing the criteria up, and because Roy is scrutinized so much, you hear a little snippet about him being out of position at times, or blowing coverage assignments, hell, if Sean Taylor was as scrutinized, we'd have lots of his weaknesses to talk about too, even though we don't need to, all we need is game-tape and they show that ST makes as many, if not more mistakes than Roy does

See, the thing is...Cowboy fans can critcize the Cowboy players ...talk about the QB, the Oline...T.O., and try to understand the coach, JJ, and the Cheerleaders...whatever...

But, a RedStink? NOPE! Everyone on their team is the bestest of the bestest, or even BETTER then the bestest! :cool:

That's what fools are made of...

:dissskin:

[Hostile]

This is a great hit and it's clean.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQMZhEvt_1Y&search=roy%20williams

That's gonna leave a mark.

[Bizwah]

i'll be the first to admit that RW lays it on pretty hard from watching that video. although i said that i thought ST was the harder hitter, i'm mature enough to be corrected. although many on this board find it necessary to place taylor into the pit of mediocrity, i still think he is a great hitter and if he picked up his technique when hitting he would be a greater hitter. take that as you want to, but RW definitely has the better technique and more experience that ST as a hitter.

you win this time, but we'll meet again!

I don't think any rational football fan will say that Taylor is mediocre. But this yayhoo that started the thread was picking a fight. We're simply putting him in his place.

[Hostile]

I don't think any rational football fan will say that Taylor is mediocre. But this yayhoo that started the thread was picking a fight. We're simply putting him in his place.:hammer:

Don't blame us for protecting our turf.

[Vintage]

See, the thing is...Cowboy fans can critcize the Cowboy players ...talk about the QB, the Oline...T.O., and try to understand the coach, JJ, and the Cheerleaders...whatever...

But, a RedStink? NOPE! Everyone on their team is the bestest of the bestest, or even BETTER then the bestest! :cool:

That's what fools are made of...

:dissskin:

C'mon now. Fair is fair.

Newman has already been inducted into the Hall of Fame by the way it certainly sounds at times around here.

Both teams have homers. Both teams have intelligent fans. Both teams have their idiots.

Sean Taylor hits well.

Roy hits harder.

JMO. Its not a knock on Taylor at all. Just more of a "wow" factor compliment towards Roy.

[Bob Sacamano]

I don't think anyone said Taylor is mediocre as a football player, just not on Roy's level in terms of hitting, which was supposed to be the basis of this thread

[DGreenFan87]

Sean Taylor is a good football player who can be great. It's there for him. I don't like him, but I admire talent. He has lots of it. I hope he gets his act straight.

I don't think any rational football fan will say that Taylor is mediocre.

Its not a knock on Taylor at all. Just more of a "wow" factor compliment towards Roy.

I don't think anyone said Taylor is mediocre as a football player, just not on Roy's level in terms of hitting.

understood guys. as long as ST is known as being a good player with a lot of potential then im happy. i guess i just took your words defending RW as calling ST bad. of course every fan has to defend the players of it's team (with the exception of TO :p: ).

[Bizwah]

understood guys. as long as ST is known as being a good player with a lot of potential then im happy. i guess i just took your words defending RW as calling ST bad. of course every fan has to defend the players of it's team (with the exception of TO :p: ).

Not a problem.

This gooberhead Redskin1 continually tries to start fights. He's always accusing us of being homers, yet he's one of the worst ones on the board.

We may go a little overboard defending our guy, but you'd do the same thing on a Skins board.

[Jay9508]

sean taylor or roy williams who hits the hardest..its close,but i have to lean towards sean taylor...reason being roy grabs from behind alot and he gets big hits on people who are not ready to protect themselves,sean has more head to head were the other guy is squared up and sean goes head to head and knocks the runner backwards,i think sean comes with more force..how do you see it?You said Roy can't tackle hard when he go heads up with runningbacks/recievers. Didn't he destroy Shaun Alexander, when they went heads up?

[TEK2000]

Ok let me start of by saying both players ARE good hitters.

I have 6 Sean Taylor videos (granted most of these videos all have the same footage in them) and a crap load of Roy Williams footage to draw reference from (see the video linked in my sig as testament to this).

In my opinion, Sean Taylor is a good hitter but one thing he seems to lack is the ability to take people clean off their feet when making a head to head hit (WHERE THE BALL CARRIER SEES IT COMING). As some have stated, its not THAT difficult to get a big hit on a reciever focused on the ball and not knowing that the defender is coming... its another thing to be able to blow people up that see the defender coming at them.

Now, the difference in hitting of these 2 GOOD football players is thes ability to take players on head on and absolutely destroy the other player. In my opinion, Roy Williams sets himself apart by being able to do this.

Lets break down some highlight footage:
We'll take a look at this particular video for our Sean Taylor reference:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3AQYRPW3fTQ

And we'll look at the Roy Williams - Tear It Up video for our RW reference:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lx6AVkihYi8
(good quality version available for download.. see my sig)

The ST video shows some good hits but I don't recognize hits where he takes a player on head to head and is able to CLEANLY take them straight off their feet. For example: The hit on the Broncos running back that made it on Jacked Up... he collides with the RB but then has to drive his feet further to get him to the ground. Its a perfect form tackle but not a devestating hit. This is the type of hit that I see him NORMALLY make on his big hits.
Although, to give credit where its due.. Taylor does have a hit he makes on (I think) Westbrook of the Eagles where he does take him off his feet... but that's the only one I remember seeing. (A side note: the play where ST goes over the top of Randy Moss and barely misses the interception is not really a highlight at all. If Kerry Collins doesn't throw that ball EXTREMELY SHORT where Moss literally has to STOP to try to catch the ball... that's a TD and its a highlight for Moss rather than ST)

The RW video shows Roy trying to be blocked by Todd Pinkston and Pinkston winds up on the ground (yeah... Pinkston is routinely his *****). Shaun Alexander is taken clean off his feet. The 49er return man is DESTROYED and the Carolina return man is sent flying backward into Bradie James.

Not in the video:
Kevin Jones' attempt to block the blitzing Roy:
http://www.bnbathletics.com/downloads/royvsjones.gif
Ashley Lelie is out of the game after trying to block Roy:
http://www.bnbathletics.com/downloads/royblocked.gif


I would really like to see the footage that one of the Redskins fans listed earlier... claiming they had video of him laying hits on 6 or 8 players.
ALSO, I have yet to see a good hit on Terrell Owens by Sean Taylor. I've seen 2 and they were cheap shots.. 1 pushing him while he was out of bounds and the other with ST throwing his elbow into TO's face mask after the play was apparently over.

[dfense]

I've seen Taylor get beat and be out of position or fooled more times than I've seen him hit people.

[Ken]

i'll be the first to admit that RW lays it on pretty hard from watching that video. although i said that i thought ST was the harder hitter, i'm mature enough to be corrected. although many on this board find it necessary to place taylor into the pit of mediocrity, i still think he is a great hitter and if he picked up his technique when hitting he would be a greater hitter. take that as you want to, but RW definitely has the better technique and more experience that ST as a hitter.

you win this time, but we'll meet again!
At least you can admit it.

It also is no slight to be an inferior hitter to Williams. Taylor is a very good hitter, just not better than Roy.

[morasp]

The offseason is just way too long.

[AdamJT13]

http://www.bnbathletics.com/downloads/royvsjones.gif

I laugh every time I see that play. That and the one when Roy makes Jeff Garcia bounce face-first off the turf.

[AsthmaField]

ALSO, I have yet to see a good hit on Terrell Owens by Sean Taylor. I've seen 2 and they were cheap shots.. 1 pushing him while he was out of bounds and the other with ST throwing his elbow into TO's face mask after the play was apparently over.


Yeah, Taylor hits TO WAY out of bounds in this video. Why it wasn't called a late hit is beyond me. It is one of his highlight videos that Redskins fans have made.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HbRKVCtcTI&search (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HbRKVCtcTI&search)=

It isn't even a big hit. Just a late hit out of bounds. You won't even find any Roy videos like that, because Dallas fans don't consider that to be a big hit or even anything positive at all.

This one is very similar and although not quite as late... still is late... and nothing to write home to Mom about.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yb0okfNMug&search (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yb0okfNMug&search)=


This is a video of Taylor trying to tackle Witten. Why a Redskin fan even made this vid is debatable because it makes Taylor look bad. Witten just runs out of his grasp. If it wasn't for other players, Witten would still be running.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KxNpJe8HkWo&search (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KxNpJe8HkWo&search)=

[AdamJT13]

The RW video shows Roy trying to be blocked by Todd Pinkston and Pinkston winds up on the ground (yeah... Pinkston is routinely ...

Pinkston didn't just wind up on the ground. He went skidding across it.

[cowboywho?]

I'm not brothering to read through this whole thread.
How can you tell who really hit harder though? Seems to me the logic way to do this is to tkae test subjects and let sean taylor and roy william hit them. then ask them who hit harder.

[Hostile]

I'm not brothering to read through this whole thread.
How can you tell who really hit harder though? Seems to me the logic way to do this is to tkae test subjects and let sean taylor and roy william hit them. then ask them who hit harder.You volunteering?

[Doomsday]

Lets ask Emmitt Smith who hit him the hardest, that was a pretty viscious hit Roy laid on him.

[jesus88]

:starspin Sean dont compare to Roy in anyway in hitting

[koolaid]

watch roy's highlight real vs sean "jailbreak" taylor's and roy's is much better, love me some good hits

[DWelch1775]

Roy is the hardest hitter, not only on Dallas, but in the league as well. tayler is a great hitter but not better than Roy

[yazzmode621]

(This is ridiculous. You guys say to look at highlights of Williams and Taylor and see who hits harder. Well I keep looking and I keep coming to the same conclusion. Taylor DEFINITELY hits harder than Roy.

Look, I'm not saying Roy isn't a hard hitter, he most definitetly is. He is a lb more than a safety(cant cover and if you think he can then you dont know what you're talking about!). Most of the 'devastating' hits Williams makes are illegal and/or horse-collar tackles! For example, the hit that injured TO was a horse collar tackle. Was it impressive? No. Roy Williams is a big guy. When you horse-collar somoene, you use your weight to take them down. Another example is the hit on Coles you guys love to brag about. IT WAS ILLEGAL!!!!!!!!!!! The NFL fined him for that hit(helmet-to-helmet). You can say Taylor spits on people or whatever(which is stupid and irrevelant) but he doesnt horse-collar and helmet-to-helmet intentionally and on a regular basis like RW.

And Taylor has taken many runners one-on-one and pushed them backwards. Priest Holmes, that big GOAL LINE specialist RB the Vikings had, Lamont Jordan, Ryan Moats, Marcel Shipp to name a few. Not to mention the receivers, FBs, and TEs(Gates included) that he has taken down one-on-one.

No, I'm not a homer. I dont think that every player on the Skins is better than Cowboys players. RW does things better than Taylor, too. RW has solid technique and he is rarely out of position. Those are two things Sean Taylor has yet to master. Taylor takes a lot of bad angles and is out of position. He is improving though.

ST was a top 5 pick and RW was top 10. Safetys rarely go in the top 10, especially top 5. ST had character issues coming out of college. Any player who has that automatically drops down the draft. Jimmy Williams, who is probably the best talented CB in this year's entire draft(preseason top 10 pick), fell into the mid-2nd round because of his character. ST was so good that a guy like Gibbs(who RARELY takes a chance on guys with character issues) spent a top 5 pick on him.

Also, if you watched this year's draft coverage on ESPN, they were comparing all the Safetys to Sean Taylor, not Roy Williams. :)

[BigDFan5]

(This is ridiculous. You guys say to look at highlights of Williams and Taylor and see who hits harder. Well I keep looking and I keep coming to the same conclusion. Taylor DEFINITELY hits harder than Roy.

You should try and watch without the burgandy and gold glasses


Look, I'm not saying Roy isn't a hard hitter, he most definitetly is. He is a lb more than a safety(cant cover and if you think he can then you dont know what you're talking about!).
Actually he covers ok for his position (SS) He is not great but is average there


Most of the 'devastating' hits Williams makes are illegal and/or horse-collar tackles!

LMAO, you do realize the Horse collar was not illegal until Roy started breaking guys with it right?


You can say Taylor spits on people or whatever(which is stupid and irrevelant)

He does thats why it is said.


but he doesnt horse-collar and helmet-to-helmet intentionally and on a regular basis like RW.
Since it was made illegal Roy has not been flagged for horse collaring once. As for intentionally hitting helmet to helmet get out of here with that bull****

And Taylor has taken many runners one-on-one and pushed them backwards. Priest Holmes, that big GOAL LINE specialist RB the Vikings had, Lamont Jordan, Ryan Moats, Marcel Shipp to name a few. Not to mention the receivers, FBs, and TEs(Gates included) that he has taken down one-on-one.

and unfortunately he is STILL not as hard a hitter as Roy.

No, I'm not a homer.
Yes you are


I dont think that every player on the Skins is better than Cowboys players.

Ok List what Cowboys are better than Skins players



RW does things better than Taylor, too. RW has solid technique and he is rarely out of position. Those are two things Sean Taylor has yet to master. Taylor takes a lot of bad angles and is out of position. He is improving though.

Hitting is one of the things he does better. The only advantage Taylor has over Williams is coverage and Taylor is above average there. Everywhere else Roy > Taylor

Gibbs(who RARELY takes a chance on guys with character issues) spent a top 5 pick on him.
That was his mistake, The talent is there. The head isn't


Also, if you watched this year's draft coverage on ESPN, they were comparing all the Safetys to Sean Taylor, not Roy Williams. :)


Because none were comparible to Roy so they took the lesser talented safety :)

[TEK2000]

(This is ridiculous. You guys say to look at highlights of Williams and Taylor and see who hits harder. Well I keep looking and I keep coming to the same conclusion. Taylor DEFINITELY hits harder than Roy.

Look, I'm not saying Roy isn't a hard hitter, he most definitetly is. He is a lb more than a safety(cant cover and if you think he can then you dont know what you're talking about!). Most of the 'devastating' hits Williams makes are illegal and/or horse-collar tackles! For example, the hit that injured TO was a horse collar tackle. Was it impressive? No. Roy Williams is a big guy. When you horse-collar somoene, you use your weight to take them down. Another example is the hit on Coles you guys love to brag about. IT WAS ILLEGAL!!!!!!!!!!! The NFL fined him for that hit(helmet-to-helmet). You can say Taylor spits on people or whatever(which is stupid and irrevelant) but he doesnt horse-collar and helmet-to-helmet intentionally and on a regular basis like RW.

And Taylor has taken many runners one-on-one and pushed them backwards. Priest Holmes, that big GOAL LINE specialist RB the Vikings had, Lamont Jordan, Ryan Moats, Marcel Shipp to name a few. Not to mention the receivers, FBs, and TEs(Gates included) that he has taken down one-on-one.

No, I'm not a homer. I dont think that every player on the Skins is better than Cowboys players. RW does things better than Taylor, too. RW has solid technique and he is rarely out of position. Those are two things Sean Taylor has yet to master. Taylor takes a lot of bad angles and is out of position. He is improving though.

ST was a top 5 pick and RW was top 10. Safetys rarely go in the top 10, especially top 5. ST had character issues coming out of college. Any player who has that automatically drops down the draft. Jimmy Williams, who is probably the best talented CB in this year's entire draft(preseason top 10 pick), fell into the mid-2nd round because of his character. ST was so good that a guy like Gibbs(who RARELY takes a chance on guys with character issues) spent a top 5 pick on him.

Also, if you watched this year's draft coverage on ESPN, they were comparing all the Safetys to Sean Taylor, not Roy Williams. :)

I'm just curious but did you read my post on the previous page and take a look at the videos posted?

Also, NO ONE has said ANYTHING about dragging TO down from behind being a "big hit". That's just IDIOTIC!

[DBoys]

(This is ridiculous. You guys say to look at highlights of Williams and Taylor and see who hits harder. Well I keep looking and I keep coming to the same conclusion. Taylor DEFINITELY hits harder than Roy.

Look, I'm not saying Roy isn't a hard hitter, he most definitetly is. He is a lb more than a safety(cant cover and if you think he can then you dont know what you're talking about!). Most of the 'devastating' hits Williams makes are illegal and/or horse-collar tackles! For example, the hit that injured TO was a horse collar tackle. Was it impressive? No. Roy Williams is a big guy. When you horse-collar somoene, you use your weight to take them down. Another example is the hit on Coles you guys love to brag about. IT WAS ILLEGAL!!!!!!!!!!! The NFL fined him for that hit(helmet-to-helmet). You can say Taylor spits on people or whatever(which is stupid and irrevelant) but he doesnt horse-collar and helmet-to-helmet intentionally and on a regular basis like RW.

And Taylor has taken many runners one-on-one and pushed them backwards. Priest Holmes, that big GOAL LINE specialist RB the Vikings had, Lamont Jordan, Ryan Moats, Marcel Shipp to name a few. Not to mention the receivers, FBs, and TEs(Gates included) that he has taken down one-on-one.

No, I'm not a homer. I dont think that every player on the Skins is better than Cowboys players. RW does things better than Taylor, too. RW has solid technique and he is rarely out of position. Those are two things Sean Taylor has yet to master. Taylor takes a lot of bad angles and is out of position. He is improving though.

ST was a top 5 pick and RW was top 10. Safetys rarely go in the top 10, especially top 5. ST had character issues coming out of college. Any player who has that automatically drops down the draft. Jimmy Williams, who is probably the best talented CB in this year's entire draft(preseason top 10 pick), fell into the mid-2nd round because of his character. ST was so good that a guy like Gibbs(who RARELY takes a chance on guys with character issues) spent a top 5 pick on him.

Also, if you watched this year's draft coverage on ESPN, they were comparing all the Safetys to Sean Taylor, not Roy Williams. :)

:dissskin:

Dumbest post I have read all day

[Bob Sacamano]

Emmitt had absorbed thousands and thousands of hits before that. He took one hit from Roy, and Emmitt acknowledged it as the hardest he has ever been hit.

case closed

[Hostile]

(This is ridiculous. You guys say to look at highlights of Williams and Taylor and see who hits harder. Well I keep looking and I keep coming to the same conclusion. Taylor DEFINITELY hits harder than Roy.

Look, I'm not saying Roy isn't a hard hitter, he most definitetly is. He is a lb more than a safety(cant cover and if you think he can then you dont know what you're talking about!). Most of the 'devastating' hits Williams makes are illegal and/or horse-collar tackles! For example, the hit that injured TO was a horse collar tackle. Was it impressive? No. Roy Williams is a big guy. When you horse-collar somoene, you use your weight to take them down. Another example is the hit on Coles you guys love to brag about. IT WAS ILLEGAL!!!!!!!!!!! The NFL fined him for that hit(helmet-to-helmet). You can say Taylor spits on people or whatever(which is stupid and irrevelant) but he doesnt horse-collar and helmet-to-helmet intentionally and on a regular basis like RW.

And Taylor has taken many runners one-on-one and pushed them backwards. Priest Holmes, that big GOAL LINE specialist RB the Vikings had, Lamont Jordan, Ryan Moats, Marcel Shipp to name a few. Not to mention the receivers, FBs, and TEs(Gates included) that he has taken down one-on-one.

No, I'm not a homer. I dont think that every player on the Skins is better than Cowboys players. RW does things better than Taylor, too. RW has solid technique and he is rarely out of position. Those are two things Sean Taylor has yet to master. Taylor takes a lot of bad angles and is out of position. He is improving though.

ST was a top 5 pick and RW was top 10. Safetys rarely go in the top 10, especially top 5. ST had character issues coming out of college. Any player who has that automatically drops down the draft. Jimmy Williams, who is probably the best talented CB in this year's entire draft(preseason top 10 pick), fell into the mid-2nd round because of his character. ST was so good that a guy like Gibbs(who RARELY takes a chance on guys with character issues) spent a top 5 pick on him.

Also, if you watched this year's draft coverage on ESPN, they were comparing all the Safetys to Sean Taylor, not Roy Williams. :)I'm just guessing mind you, but your favorite style of haberdashery growing up was pointed and had a conical shape to it.

[yazzmode621]

I'm just curious but did you read my post on the previous page and take a look at the videos posted?

Also, NO ONE has said ANYTHING about dragging TO down from behind being a "big hit". That's just IDIOTIC!

Actually a lot of you guys(just read this entire thread) brag about that 'big hit' on TO...

I honestly looked at RW's video and ST's highlight video. Look at Taylor's highlights from both seasons, not just one. Then make a decision. I honestly think Taylor is the better hitter and player.

As for me posting Cowboys players better than their Redskins counterparts...
SS - RW
CB - Terrence Newman
OLB - DeMarcus Ware
DE - Marcus Spears
WR - TO
#2WR - Glenn
LG - Larry Allen...oops my mistake :)

Thats 6(could've been 7!) positions that I feel you guys are better. That 50% percent of the starting lineup. There is no way you could call me a homer. I just call it as I see it.

[Bob Sacamano]

sorry yazz, you're drowning, here's a life preserver

[yazzmode621]

sorry yazz, you're drowning, here's a life preserver

Actually I'm doing fine. Thanks for your help though :)

[Bob Sacamano]

Actually I'm doing fine. Thanks for your help though :)

no, you're not doing fine, other than in a Redskin fan's opinion, I've never seen anyone rank ST ahead of Roy as a vicious hitter

I think you should maybe think about grabbing that life preserver

[BigDFan5]

Actually a lot of you guys(just read this entire thread) brag about that 'big hit' on TO...

I honestly looked at RW's video and ST's highlight video. Look at Taylor's highlights from both seasons, not just one. Then make a decision. I honestly think Taylor is the better hitter and player.

As for me posting Cowboys players better than their Redskins counterparts...
SS - RW
CB - Terrence Newman
OLB - DeMarcus Ware
DE - Marcus Spears
WR - TO
#2WR - Glenn
LG - Larry Allen...oops my mistake :)

Thats 6(could've been 7!) positions that I feel you guys are better. That 50% percent of the starting lineup. There is no way you could call me a homer. I just call it as I see it.

CB Newman over Springs, but you take Rogers over Henry? Your #3 over glenn?

Spears over Carter? ok then Daniels over Canty?

Salvea over Ferg? seriosu?

Who over witten Cooley lol?

Brunell over Bledsoe? no

I mean damn man you were better not making a list lol

[5Stars]

Gibbs...GIBBS...! Come boy...Gibbs...come...!

:dissskin: Good dog! Here is a puppy treat for you...!

That dog of mine is so cool!

:starspin

[BigDFan5]

Might wanna check the rules troll

[BigDFan5]

Actually I'm doing fine. Thanks for your help though :)

Fine? define fine? because in this thread you are over your head, and embarassing the other Skins fans I am sure

[5Stars]

I honestly think Taylor is the better spitter and player..

Fixed....

:star:

[BigDFan5]

Fixed....

:star:


I honestly think Taylor is the better spitter and thug


Fixed the fix

[5Stars]

Fixed the fix

:wink3:

[yazzmode621]

CB Newman over Springs, but you take Rogers over Henry? Your #3 over glenn?

Spears over Carter? ok then Daniels over Canty?

Salvea over Ferg? seriosu?

Who over witten Cooley lol?

Brunell over Bledsoe? no

I mean damn man you were better not making a list lol

First of all, I'd like to congratulate you guys on you're maturity.

Second, I was comparing starters. Glenn is better than Kenny Wright but neither of them are starters.

Shawn Springs is our #1 and Anthony Henry is your #1. I'd take Springs over Henry any day. Henry is way over rated and gets beat deep routinely. Brandon Lloyd had like 150 receiving yards on him. And dont tell me that Newman is better than both of them because if he was so great, howcome he was always covering the opposing teams #2? Shutdown corner alright...Shutdown #2 WR corner!

Yes I'd take 35 yr old Brunell(who you guys like to call ancient) over 33 yr old statue you guys have any day. The Buffalo Bills cut Bledsoe with no proven starter to take his place. The Jaguars traded Brunell after they saw what top 10 overall pick Leftwich could do on the field.
They way you see it ALL the Cowboys players are better than the skins counterparts. I wonder how in the world we were able to beat you guys twice(stomping on you guys one time...)

I'd take Spears over Daniels but NOT over Carter. The last time Carter was healthy for a whole season and playing at DE(his natural position) he had 12.5 sacks.

Seeing as how you guys run the 3-4, you have ONE starting DT. Ferguson. Our #1 DT is Cornelius Griffin, who I'd take ANY DAY over Ferguson.

And yes I'd take Cooley over Witten also. They both have comparable stats but last year Cooley had significantly more TDs than him plus he's a better blocker. No, I'm not saying he's a great blocker but he's definitely better than Witten!

If RW, Henry and Newman are so great then how come you guys were getting toasted by WRs left and right? I mean, 3 ALL-World DBs and yet you guys kept getting burned left and right.

[Renesis]

Long post containg lots of words, links, and this rediculously awesome gif
http://www.bnbathletics.com/downloads/royvsjones.gif

As a Redskins fan, obviously I am biased to some extent, but I came away from this post and watching the videos thinking the following things.

A) That gif hit is utter hilarity, rock on sir.

B) Anyone who thinks Taylor is a bigger hitter than Roy is delusional.

C) I think Sean may be a better athlete(speed, agility, etc) and has vast potential, I can only hope he will grow the **** up and use it.

D) Watching Gardner get the crap get knocked out of him is quite humorous

E) If both Roy and Sean make the Pro Bowl......does the middle of the field even get used?

F) Watching people getting the holy hell knocked out of them in both those videos was immensly entertaining.

[Bob Sacamano]

Shawn Springs is our #1 and Anthony Henry is your #1.

nope, Newman is our #1, so Newman>>Springs, Henry>>>Rogers

Yes I'd take 35 yr old Brunell(who you guys like to call ancient) over 33 yr old statue you guys have any day. The Buffalo Bills cut Bledsoe with no proven starter to take his place. The Jaguars traded Brunell after they saw what top 10 overall pick Leftwich could do on the field.

uh, both Bledsoe and Brunell were jettisoned because both the Bills and Jags, respectively, spent a 1st on Losman and Leftwich

I'd take Spears over Daniels but NOT over Carter. The last time Carter was healthy for a whole season and playing at DE(his natural position) he had 12.5 sacks.

and yet playing at an easier position, rush OLB, where you're not head up on an OT 99% of the time like a DE, he had less sacks?

And yes I'd take Cooley over Witten also. They both have comparable stats but last year Cooley had significantly more TDs than him plus he's a better blocker. No, I'm not saying he's a great blocker but he's definitely better than Witten!

uh, Cooley had 1 more TD grab than Witten, significant, and had a lesser ypc average

If RW, Henry and Newman are so great then how come you guys were getting toasted by WRs left and right? I mean, 3 ALL-World DBs and yet you guys kept getting burned left and right.

uh, Adam, post Newman's season totals last year

[TEK2000]

As a Redskins fan, obviously I am biased to some extent, but I came away from this post and watching the videos thinking the following things.

A) That gif hit is utter hilarity, rock on sir.

B) Anyone who thinks Taylor is a bigger hitter than Roy is delusional.

C) I think Sean may be a better athlete(speed, agility, etc) and has vast potential, I can only hope he will grow the **** up and use it.

D) Watching Gardner get the crap get knocked out of him is quite humorous

E) If both Roy and Sean make the Pro Bowl......does the middle of the field even get used?

F) Watching people getting the holy hell knocked out of them in both those videos was immensly entertaining.

I must say... very nice post!!! Both are great players!!
And I too still bust out laughing watching the Kevin Jones gif.

[yazzmode621]

nope, Newman is our #1, so Newman>>Springs, Henry>>>Rogers



uh, both Bledsoe and Brunell were jettisoned because both the Bills and Jags, respectively, spent a 1st on Losman and Leftwich



and yet playing at an easier position, rush OLB, where you're not head up on an OT 99% of the time like a DE, he had less sacks?



uh, Cooley had 1 more TD grab than Witten, significant, and had a lesser ypc average



uh, Adam, post Newman's season totals last year

If Newman is you guys' #1, then how come he was covering #2 WRs?

Brunell got injured in Jacksonville, forcing Leftwich, a top 10 pick, to play. They liked what they saw and therefore got rid of Brunell. The Buffalo Bills on the other hand, had a top 5 defense, and still didnt make the playoffs. J.P. Losman, although a first rounder, was not a top 10 pick and had never played a down in the NFL. They let a great QB go for that?

Being a down lineman and a stand up OLB are two completely different positions. You should know that.

I may have been wrong on the significant part but he did have one more TD, like 5 more catches and 20 more yards. He also is the better blocker between the two. So how is it funny that I chose him over Witten?

[TEK2000]

I was going to reply to the yazzz guy but he obviously doesn't know what he's talking about.

He says we got toasted left and right despite the fact that the Skins and Cowboys defensive stats are almost IDENTICAL for 2005.

EDIT: Now he asks why Newman was covering #2 WR's.... I guess Steve Smith is a #2 wide reciever for Carolina. :rolleyes: :confused: :lmao2:

Its either pure ignorance of the subject or a misinformation propaganda campaign the world has not seen since that of the Nazis.

[Hostile]

If Newman is you guys' #1, then how come he was covering #2 WRs?

Brunell got injured in Jacksonville, forcing Leftwich, a top 10 pick, to play. They liked what they saw and therefore got rid of Brunell. The Buffalo Bills on the other hand, had a top 5 defense, and still didnt make the playoffs. J.P. Losman, although a first rounder, was not a top 10 pick and had never played a down in the NFL. They let a great QB go for that?

Being a down lineman and a stand up OLB are two completely different positions. You should know that.

I may have been wrong on the significant part but he did have one more TD, like 5 more catches and 20 more yards. He also is the better blocker between the two. So how is it funny that I chose him over Witten?Newman played on the left side of the field. If the #2 WR lines up over there it's his assignment. Take a look at how many TDs he allowed in 2005.

Think Krispy Kreme for a hint.

[Bob Sacamano]

If Newman is you guys' #1, then how come he was covering #2 WRs?

is Steve Smith a #2 WR?

Brunell got injured in Jacksonville, forcing Leftwich, a top 10 pick, to play. They liked what they saw and therefore got rid of Brunell.

they were going to get rid of Brunell the day they picked Leftwich, if you think otherwise, then you're a fool

The Buffalo Bills on the other hand, had a top 5 defense, and still didnt make the playoffs. J.P. Losman, although a first rounder, was not a top 10 pick and had never played a down in the NFL. They let a great QB go for that?

uh, they invested alot of money and 2 1sts on Losman, so yeah

Being a down lineman and a stand up OLB are two completely different positions. You should know that.

but boths primary responsibilities is to get after the QB

So how is it funny that I chose him over Witten?

cuz all he has on Witten is being a better blocker, although he's not great at it either, sorry, I'll take someone who had one of the finest seasons for a TE in HISTORY over an up and comer

[Bob Sacamano]

Its either pure ignorance of the subject or a misinformation propaganda campaign the world has not seen since that of the Nazis.

I say ignorance, he thinks 1 TD more is significant :laugh1:

[yazzmode621]

Newman played on the left side of the field. If the #2 WR lines up over there it's his assignment. Take a look at how many TDs he allowed in 2005.

Think Krispy Kreme for a hint.

Actually Santana Moss lined up on the right side when we were facing you guys but Brandon Lloyd was lined up on the left side when he had that big game against you guys.

[yazzmode621]

I was going to reply to the yazzz guy but he obviously doesn't know what he's talking about.

He says we got toasted left and right despite the fact that the Skins and Cowboys defensive stats are almost IDENTICAL for 2005.

EDIT: Now he asks why Newman was covering #2 WR's.... I guess Steve Smith is a #2 wide reciever for Carolina. :rolleyes: :confused: :lmao2:

Its either pure ignorance of the subject or a misinformation propaganda campaign the world has not seen since that of the Nazis.

The lack of a casting support caught up to Steve Smith as he was double and triple teamed the entire game. If Newman is truely a shutdown corner, then why did he need help?

[SuspectCorner]

i don't think you hafta be a physics major to realize that roy will is the hardest hitting safety in the biz. i've seen him blow up alotta dudes in his career to this point.

but, by far, my fave example of roys' fondness for "contact" is when he picked off a pass in a cardinals game (the one where witten got his jaw busted) and roy was running the INT back just looking for cards to stick his helmet into.

roy's a bad man. way badder than sean taylor. start these guys at opposing 20's and have them run full speed at each other in a game of human chicken and i guaran-dang-tee ya taylor will pull up with a hammy or some other malfunction. ain't so much fear as common-durn-sense.

roy is a human cannonball. plain and simple. IMO, pound-for-pound, the NFLs top de-cleater.

[Bob Sacamano]

The lack of a casting support caught up to Steve Smith as he was double and triple teamed the entire game. If Newman is truely a shutdown corner, then why did he need help?

Newman was on Smith one-on-one for most the time Smith was in the game

[Bob Sacamano]

Actually Santana Moss lined up on the right side when we were facing you guys but Brandon Lloyd was lined up on the left side when he had that big game against you guys.

yazz, please stop, for your sake

our coaches don't have Newman shadow team's top receivers, if the opposing O doesn't line up their #1 threat on Newman's side, he'll stay where he's at

[Hostile]

Actually Santana Moss lined up on the right side when we were facing you guys but Brandon Lloyd was lined up on the left side when he had that big game against you guys.What does where they line up have to do with where he lines up?

Once more slowly. Terence Newman is our LCB. He plays on the left side unless the WR there goes in motion left and no one is lined up beyond the TE. In which case Newman would shadow the in motion WR by moving to his right.

Get it now, or do I need to take 2 doses of Nyquil to numb my mind enough to explain it even slower?

[Bob Sacamano]

Get it now, or do I need to take 2 doses of Nyquil to numb my mind enough to explain it even slower?

just don't get in a car and drive after that ;)

[yazzmode621]

What does where they line up have to do with where he lines up?

Once more slowly. Terence Newman is our LCB. He plays on the left side unless the WR there goes in motion left and no one is lined up beyond the TE. In which case Newman would shadow the in motion WR by moving to his right.

Get it now, or do I need to take 2 doses of Nyquil to numb my mind enough to explain it even slower?

umm...you said that Newman is the LCB and I showed you clear examples of opposing teams WRs lining both on the left and right side of the field and yet Newman wasnt covering them. See, this is clearly what I'm talking about. I state examples and you guys reply by implying I am slow and/or retarded.

[yazzmode621]

Newman was on Smith one-on-one for most the time Smith was in the game

:lmao2:

No he wasnt. When they were breaking down the game, they showed how you guys were able to stop Smith by double and triple teaming him!

[Hostile]

umm...you said that Newman is the LCB and I showed you clear examples of opposing teams WRs lining both on the left and right side of the field and yet Newman wasnt covering them. See, this is clearly what I'm talking about. I state examples and you guys reply by implying I am slow and/or retarded.I never intimated the 2nd part. This is from AdamJT13 who says it way better than I could.

Newman doesn't follow the opponent's best receiver on every play in every game (no cornerback in the NFL does that). He plays his position and covers whoever lines up against him.

McCardell had one catch for 16 yards against Newman. Santana Moss had one catch for 9 yards (in two games) against Newman. Lloyd didn't catch a pass against Newman. Randy Moss didn't catch a pass against Newman. Roy Williams had three catches for 35 yards against Newman. Kennison had one catch for 22 yards. Those six guys COMBINED for six catches for 82 yards on 14 pass attempts against Newman.

Against Steve Smith, Terrell Owens, Torry Holt, Anquan Boldin, Larry Fitzgerald, Rod Smith and Amani Toomer, Newman allowed a TOTAL of six catches for 84 yards on 15 attempts.There's your 2 examples, virtually completely shut down by Newman.

It sinking in yet?

[AdamJT13]

umm...you said that Newman is the LCB and I showed you clear examples of opposing teams WRs lining both on the left and right side of the field and yet Newman wasnt covering them.

In almost every game, Newman played left cornerback except in the nickel, when he moved to the slot. He defended whomever was lined up against him -- including Santana Moss (1-for-4, 9 yards against Newman), Randy Moss (no attempts against Newman), Steve Smith (0-for-1 against Newman), Terrell Owens (2-for-3, 29 yards against Newman), Larry Fitzgerald (1-for-2, 8 yards against Newman), Anquan Boldin (1-for-2, 16 yards against Newman), Roy Williams (3-for-5, 35 yards against Newman), Rod Smith (0-for-1 against Newman), Torry Holt (1-for-2, 3 yards against Newman), Amani Toomer (1-for-4, 8 yards against Newman), etc., etc., etc.

When Dallas played Oakland, for example, Newman defended Randy Moss on 10 pass plays -- seven times when Moss lined up wide right (to the defense's left) and all three pass plays when Moss lined up in the slot (twice on the right, once on the left). The Raiders never threw a pass to Moss when Newman was on him. Moss was defended eight times by Anthony Henry (when Moss lined up on the left), four times by Aaron Glenn (wide right, when Newman was in the slot), twice by Keith Davis, once by Al Singleton and once by DeMarcus Ware.

[AdamJT13]

No he wasnt. When they were breaking down the game, they showed how you guys were able to stop Smith by double and triple teaming him!

The Cowboys used a mixture of coverages and disguised coverages against Smith. Newman was lined up against him for most of the game (until Smith got ejected), but not all of the game. (Smith's only catch of the game came when Newman was covering someone else.) Smith was double- or triple-teamed some of the time, but certainly not all of the time. Dallas played quite a bit of zone coverage in that game, too, which essentially prevents the defense from double- or triple-covering anyone without leaving huge gaps in the zones. And Dallas often gave a pre-snap look of double-teaming Smith but shifted out of it before or after the snap.

So it's not accurate to say that Newman shut down Smith 1-on-1 every play, and it's not accurate to say that Dallas double-covered Smith on every play, either. In reality, it was a mixture that included both of those, plus other coverage schemes.

[TEK2000]

AdamJT13 :bow: :bow: :bow:

Outstanding breakdown sir! We need to file that stuff in a better thread than this for future reference.

[superpunk]

Seriously -- we need an Adam "Facts of Life" thread stickied for easy access. :)

[Yakuza Rich]

I'd honestly say that Roy hits harder. Mainly because I've seen him knock guys silly on tons of clean hits (non-horse collars) that have either knocked the player out of the game or they simply weren't the same sense.

I'm sure Taylor could do the same, I just haven't seen it as much as Roy.

And don't act like Taylor doesn't horse collar. We've got evidence saying otherwise.

Rich........

[Vintage]

I wish we would move Newman around....if we did, I don't think we'd have lost the first Washington game.

Atlanta moves Hall around to cover #1's....

Why don't we move Newman around likewise?

[superpunk]

I wish we would move Newman around....if we did, I don't think we'd have lost the first Washington game.

Atlanta moves Hall around to cover #1's....

Why don't we move Newman around likewise?

I agree.

Parcells thing is he doesn't want to be dictated how to play by the offense. That sounds all good and all, and maybe with more experience in the defense, it will rock, because I can definitely see the benefits, but last year it did burn us a few times. But who knows how many times it really helped us? I mean, we had the second lowest completion pct allowed in the league. Had to be doing something right.

[Vintage]

I agree.

Parcells thing is he doesn't want to be dictated how to play by the offense. That sounds all good and all, and maybe with more experience in the defense, it will rock, because I can definitely see the benefits, but last year it did burn us a few times. But who knows how many times it really helped us? I mean, we had the second lowest completion pct allowed in the league. Had to be doing something right.

I know.

However, had we won that game, we'd have been 10-6 and in the playoffs.

Possibly even 11-5 if we took the last game seriously and won.

Had Glenn not been on that coverage, and Newman had been, we'd probably have won. Furthermore, how would it be that the offense dictates if we move Newman around.

If we did, they couldn't get Moss on those matchups...he'd be covered by Newman all the time.

As it now stands, anytime they want Moss on Henry or Glenn, they can get it. They get to dictate the coverage; not us.

[Yakuza Rich]

I wish we would move Newman around....if we did, I don't think we'd have lost the first Washington game.

Atlanta moves Hall around to cover #1's....

Why don't we move Newman around likewise?

Atlanta rarely moves DeAngelo Hall around to cover #1's. It's very seldomly done around the league.

And IF Atlanta was doing that, they should stop because Hall isn't 1/10th as good as hyped.


Rich.........

[RiggoForever]

I'm thinking that as part of the combine, there should be a way to rig a dummy, put a prospect in pads and helmet, and tell the player to hit/tackle the dummy as hard as possible in order to measure the force of the blow. That would be the way to truly tell who hits the hardest.

[Hostile]

I'm thinking that as part of the combine, there should be a way to rig a dummy, put a prospect in pads and helmet, and tell the player to hit/tackle the dummy as hard as possible in order to measure the force of the blow. That would be the way to truly tell who hits the hardest.Until that happens I'll go with the articles about hardest hitters and the opinion of Ronnie Lott combined with what is plain as day on the film clips. All of those point to Roy Williams being the harder hitter of the 2. You wanna say ST is the better overall player that's a discussion. No way he hits harder than Roy. No way in hell. One guy said ST "blows people up." Take a look at Roy treating Kevin Jones like a speed bump. Tell me that isn't blowing him up.

[RealCowboyfan]

Naw ask Ammani Toomer, Mark Brunnell, and Rod Gardner who hits:starspin harder.

[RiggoForever]

Until that happens I'll go with the articles about hardest hitters and the opinion of Ronnie Lott combined with what is plain as day on the film clips. All of those point to Roy Williams being the harder hitter of the 2. You wanna say ST is the better overall player that's a discussion. No way he hits harder than Roy. No way in hell. One guy said ST "blows people up." Take a look at Roy treating Kevin Jones like a speed bump. Tell me that isn't blowing him up.

Ok, I'll admit Roys a harder hitter based on those videos. But what would be interesting to see is how Roys hitting power compares with that of linebackers throughout the NFL...since he has been revolutionizing the position into that of an SS/LB hybrid.

Roys a pretty damn good blitzer as well.

[Yeagermeister]

Naw ask Ammani Toomer, Mark Brunnell, and Rod Gardner who hits:starspin harder.
Or JJ Arrington....when asked why he fumbled last year he said Roy Williams knocked the crap out of me :D

[Vintage]

Until that happens I'll go with the articles about hardest hitters and the opinion of Ronnie Lott combined with what is plain as day on the film clips. All of those point to Roy Williams being the harder hitter of the 2. You wanna say ST is the better overall player that's a discussion. No way he hits harder than Roy. No way in hell. One guy said ST "blows people up." Take a look at Roy treating Kevin Jones like a speed bump. Tell me that isn't blowing him up.

So...we can trust the opinion of Ronnie Lott on this matter.... (a former football player, after all).

But when Chad Johnson and Michael Irvin (a current player, and a former COWBOY player) say that Hall is the best corner in the game, its hogwash.

Just pointing out the contradiction.

FWIW, whenever I hear a player say "so and so..." I usually tune them out. Rarely do they seem to be good talent evaluators.

Ronnie Lott saying he likes to watch Roy play....that I can believe.
Ronnie Lott saying that Roy is the closest safety to himself talent wise....well....maybe.

[Vintage]

Atlanta rarely moves DeAngelo Hall around to cover #1's. It's very seldomly done around the league.

And IF Atlanta was doing that, they should stop because Hall isn't 1/10th as good as hyped.


Rich.........

Admittedly, I didn't watch many Falcon games...

And admittedly, I wasn't paying that close attention to the Atlanta/Philly game (beer kind of took over)...but from what I remember, Hall was on Owens for most of that game.

[RiggoForever]

So...we can trust the opinion of Ronnie Lott on this matter.... (a former football player, after all).

But when Chad Johnson and Michael Irvin (a current player, and a former COWBOY player) say that Hall is the best corner in the game, its hogwash.

Just pointing out the contradiction.

FWIW, whenever I hear a player say "so and so..." I usually tune them out. Rarely do they seem to be good talent evaluators.

Ronnie Lott saying he likes to watch Roy play....that I can believe.
Ronnie Lott saying that Roy is the closest safety to himself talent wise....well....maybe.

For cornerbacks, I look at how they fare against elite WRs. Newman did pretty damn good when matched up against TO, Moss, and Smith last year (the 3 best WRs in the NFC). He outperformed Hall when it came to shutting down TO and Smith.

I know Moss had some big plays against Dallas last year, but when Newman was matched against him I can't recall any.

[Vintage]

For cornerbacks, I look at how they fare against elite WRs. Newman did pretty damn good when matched up against TO, Moss, and Smith last year (the 3 best WRs in the NFC). He outperformed Hall when it came to shutting down TO and Smith.

I know Moss had some big plays against Dallas last year, but when Newman was matched against him I can't recall any.

I know.

And I am not saying Newman is inferior to Hall. Last year, Newman was clearly superior.

I was making a point about using former/current players and their opinions as proof in arguements about player/talent evaluation.

[superpunk]

Has Chad Johnson ever even matched up against Hall?

And did Irvin ever really say that, Vintage?

[Vintage]

Has Chad Johnson ever even matched up against Hall?

And did Irvin ever really say that, Vintage?

According to a poster at falcons.scout.com

I asked him for a link, he said he would provide me one later, he had to head out.....

As far as his credibility goes, I do trust him. He's provided links to me in the past when I asked for them in our previous arguements.

To be honest, I don't know if Chad has ever been matched up against Hall. But I do remember Chad saying that.

(And couldn't you use that on Ronnie Lott too....? He has never played on the same field as Roy Williams....)

[Bob Sacamano]

But when Chad Johnson and Michael Irvin (a current player, and a former COWBOY player) say that Hall is the best corner in the game, its hogwash.

I was actually reading a piece about TJ Housamadahes (SP) and Chad Johnson in ESPN the Mag, and they were supposedly ragging on DeAngelo, and I wanna see where Irvin said he thinks Hall is the best in the game, it's not that I don't believe you, just it's I never heard it

[CrazyCowboy]

Roy is da man!

[Bob Sacamano]

According to a poster at falcons.scout.com

I asked him for a link, he said he would provide me one later, he had to head out.....


how convenient :p:

[Vintage]

Chad Johnson said it on ESPN's the Hot Seat IIRC, last year.

I remember watching it with my roommate; who is a Falcons fan. From that point on, he firmly believes Hall is the best CB in the league...

As for the Irvin thing.......as soon as I get a link, I will PM you with it.

[Vintage]

how convenient :p:

LOL.

He's been good at providing links when I ask for them. I trust him to show me a link....

[superpunk]

According to a poster at falcons.scout.com

I asked him for a link, he said he would provide me one later, he had to head out.....

As far as his credibility goes, I do trust him. He's provided links to me in the past when I asked for them in our previous arguements.

To be honest, I don't know if Chad has ever been matched up against Hall. But I do remember Chad saying that.

(And couldn't you use that on Ronnie Lott too....? He has never played on the same field as Roy Williams....)

Johnson has never lined up against Hall, unless it was in preseason sometime.

As for Lott, he just said he likes to watch Roy play. Hell of a compliment, more than a judgement of abilities. But when the best ever likes watching you, you're doing something right. I would guarantee Lott and Irvin see much more games than Johnson, as well, since during the season, Johnson is pretty preoccupied throughout the week. So unless Johnson played him, and broke him down all week, how could he make such a statement? If you could find the Irvin link, I'd give that much more credence.

[Vintage]

Johnson has never lined up against Hall, unless it was in preseason sometime.

As for Lott, he just said he likes to watch Roy play. Hell of a compliment, more than a judgement of abilities. But when the best ever likes watching you, you're doing something right. I would guarantee Lott and Irvin see much more games than Johnson, as well, since during the season, Johnson is pretty preoccupied throughout the week. So unless Johnson played him, and broke him down all week, how could he make such a statement? If you could find the Irvin link, I'd give that much more credence.

I am awaiting the link...

As for the Johnson comment, I don't know how he made the comment, why he made the comment, or what he based it off of...but he made the comment.

I've never seen/heard Irvin make that comment.

I was told he did. I asked for the link and am awaiting it.

[superpunk]

I am awaiting the link...

As for the Johnson comment, I don't know how he made the comment, why he made the comment, or what he based it off of...but he made the comment.

I've never seen/heard Irvin make that comment.

I was told he did. I asked for the link and am awaiting it.

Did he say it at the draft?

In any case - I respect that Hall is a good corner. Fact is though, some top-notch receivers had field days against the Falcons, and that's probably not all Hall's fault. The guy had 6 picks this year, albeit against some of the worst QBs in the league, and you gotta respect that.

Newman was just shut down this year. PLus, thus far, he's a bit more durable than Hall.

[SteveOS]

I think they both hit pretty damn hard. If I had to pick one, I'd go w/ RW, not only because he's a Boy, but because he's got the reputation. Give Taylor a few more years, if he keeps bringin' it, he could be scary.

[Bob Sacamano]

I guess it comes down to whoever's vouching for somebody and seeing for yourself

you can take Ronnie Lott's word on Roy, and at the same time, you can also look at the tape and see that Roy hits harder than ST, you can't do both when talking about DeAngelo Hall being the best corner however

[ravidubey]

why does everything has to be based on what team you like,can folks give a opinion based on how they honestly feel,leaving your bias out of it...i can..
How many people has Taylor knocked out of games? Williams has tackled a few from behind, but he's leveled from the front as well. Coles, Toomer, Faulk, Warner, the list goes on. Taylor has hit Patrick Crayton and given Terry Glenn alligator-arms, os h'e no slouch, but Roy injures people-- the horse-collar rule was invented just because of him.

This is ridiculous. Williams is so angry on the field that he lays wood in the pro-bowl.

[sacase]

umm...you said that Newman is the LCB and I showed you clear examples of opposing teams WRs lining both on the left and right side of the field and yet Newman wasnt covering them. See, this is clearly what I'm talking about. I state examples and you guys reply by implying I am slow and/or retarded.

Well the reason you are slow and retarded is that when teams bring out a slot reciever, Newman moves to the slot and Glenn takes the LCB position.

[Hostile]

According to a poster at falcons.scout.com

I asked him for a link, he said he would provide me one later, he had to head out.....

As far as his credibility goes, I do trust him. He's provided links to me in the past when I asked for them in our previous arguements.

To be honest, I don't know if Chad has ever been matched up against Hall. But I do remember Chad saying that.

(And couldn't you use that on Ronnie Lott too....? He has never played on the same field as Roy Williams....) So when Deacon Jones called Reggie White the best DE in the game he didn't know what he was talking about because he had never been on the same field as him?

It amazes me that any opinion is ever valid. There are so many caveats.

[Vintage]

So when Deacon Jones called Reggie White the best DE in the game he didn't know what he was talking about because he had never been on the same field as him?

It amazes me that any opinion is ever valid. There are so many caveats.

Maybe we can pick and choose which one is valid.

Roy's must be valid; since its a Cowboy.

Hall's must be invalid, since Irvin and Johnson didn't say Newman. Furthermore, every analyst has it wrong too.

[Hostile]

Maybe we can pick and choose which one is valid.

Roy's must be valid; since its a Cowboy.

Hall's must be invalid, since Irvin and Johnson didn't say Newman. Furthermore, every analyst has it wrong too.I must be missing the point here somewhere. Where did I call Hall inferior to anyone? Or where did I say some player's opinion on Hall was invalid?

[DIAF]

Roy's the better hitter, by far. But Taylor is a better tackler, I think. I wouldnt mind having Taylor on a squad if he weren't such a punk, that's for sure.

[TEK2000]

Roy's the better hitter, by far. But Taylor is a better tackler, I think. I wouldnt mind having Taylor on a squad if he weren't such a punk, that's for sure.

What are you basing this on exactly?

[Vintage]

I must be missing the point here somewhere. Where did I call Hall inferior to anyone? Or where did I say some player's opinion on Hall was invalid?

I wasn't referring to you, specifically...

But since you missed most of the conversation, I will start from scratch (just a broad generalization, not someone specific I am singling out).

Hall was touted as the best CB in the league by Chad Johnson. I believe it was on ESPN's the Hot Seat when it was said. Furthermore, Irvin apparently said the same thing. I was told this by a Falcon.Scout member who I've asked for a link as proof. I've discusses numerous things regarding the Falcons, and have asked for links in the past, which he has always provided me. I am awaiting the link to Irvin's statement, because I too, want proof (since this is the first time I've heard of Irvin making such statements).

Some People here, and some at the Ranch Report, dismissed this as being a non issue, because Chad Johnson is a player; not a talent evaulator (basic gist of their arguement).

Now, Ronnie Lott comes out and says something about Roy; and its taken as gospel.

(For the record, I do believe Roy is a better hitter than Sean Taylor; and that Newman was a better CB than Hall last year).

I merely just wanted to point out the contradiction involved with both sets of topics. Lott's opinion is regarded well, since he is a former player, Johnson's opinion not regarded well, since he is....well...a player...and he said Hall was the premier CB.

That's it.

It really is as simple as it sounds.

That was all I was trying to say. That I found all of this to be, well...kind of humorous.

[DIAF]

What are you basing this on exactly?

Just from watching them play. Sure, Roy is great near the line of scrimmage, but out in open space, ive seen him miss some tackles, usually the result of taking a bad angle as opposed to not wrapping up(though i have seen him do that too). From what ive seen with Taylor, he's better at it. Taylor can't hold roy's jock near the LoS, though.

[superpunk]

Some People here, and some at the Ranch Report, dismissed this as being a non issue, because Chad Johnson is a player; not a talent evaulator (basic gist of their arguement).


Maybe you're not talking about me, but that is not the basic gist of anything I said. Chad Johnson has never played Hall. Never played the Falcons with Hall on the team. Seeing how Johnson's sunday's are pretty preoccupied, I just question the amount of comparative analysis he has done. Irvin, OTOH, would not have that problem.

But Johnson saying a guy he has never played against or prepped for is the best doesn't hold a ton of water with me.

[Vintage]

Maybe you're not talking about me, but that is not the basic gist of anything I said. Chad Johnson has never played Hall. Never played the Falcons with Hall on the team. Seeing how Johnson's sunday's are pretty preoccupied, I just question the amount of comparative analysis he has done. Irvin, OTOH, would not have that problem.

But Johnson saying a guy he has never played against or prepped for is the best doesn't hold a ton of water with me.

I wasn't talking about you at all....

But I am sure Johnson has watched some Atlanta games in making that comment. What, with TiVo, and other means, he probably has watched Atlanta play enough to know Hall's abilities.

[Hostile]

I wasn't referring to you, specifically...

But since you missed most of the conversation, I will start from scratch (just a broad generalization, not someone specific I am singling out).

Hall was touted as the best CB in the league by Chad Johnson. I believe it was on ESPN's the Hot Seat when it was said. Furthermore, Irvin apparently said the same thing. I was told this by a Falcon.Scout member who I've asked for a link as proof. I've discusses numerous things regarding the Falcons, and have asked for links in the past, which he has always provided me. I am awaiting the link to Irvin's statement, because I too, want proof (since this is the first time I've heard of Irvin making such statements).

Some People here, and some at the Ranch Report, dismissed this as being a non issue, because Chad Johnson is a player; not a talent evaulator (basic gist of their arguement).

Now, Ronnie Lott comes out and says something about Roy; and its taken as gospel.

(For the record, I do believe Roy is a better hitter than Sean Taylor; and that Newman was a better CB than Hall last year).

I merely just wanted to point out the contradiction involved with both sets of topics. Lott's opinion is regarded well, since he is a former player, Johnson's opinion not regarded well, since he is....well...a player...and he said Hall was the premier CB.

That's it.

It really is as simple as it sounds.

That was all I was trying to say. That I found all of this to be, well...kind of humorous.Gotcha.

I wasn't privy to any of that so I couldn't figure out why you were bringing it up.

Hall would be in my top 10 for sure, don't know that I'd call him overall #1, but I would respect Chad Johnson's opinion on it. It's hard to argue with Newman's results, but perhaps Chad's criteria is about how hard it is to get away from him? I have no idea.

[Vintage]

Gotcha.

I wasn't privy to any of that so I couldn't figure out why you were bringing it up.

Hall would be in my top 10 for sure, don't know that I'd call him overall #1, but I would respect Chad Johnson's opinion on it. It's hard to argue with Newman's results, but perhaps Chad's criteria is about how hard it is to get away from him? I have no idea.

Yeah, I really have no clue either.

[DBoys]

Maybe you're not talking about me, but that is not the basic gist of anything I said. Chad Johnson has never played Hall. Never played the Falcons with Hall on the team. Seeing how Johnson's sunday's are pretty preoccupied, I just question the amount of comparative analysis he has done. Irvin, OTOH, would not have that problem.

But Johnson saying a guy he has never played against or prepped for is the best doesn't hold a ton of water with me.

Agreed...

Johnson talks a lot and very little of what he says carries any weight.

I thought Newman was the best CB in the league last year.

[MossBurner]

Taylor can't hold roy's jock near the LoS, though.
That's completely wrong. Whenever Sean plays near the line of scrimmage, he is always in on the tackle. Check out some of the highlight reels at www.youtube.com (http://www.youtube.com) and see how often Sean blows up RBs and FBs.

These guys come to mind from last season:
Lamont Jordan
Lorenzo Neal
JJ Arrington
Priest Holmes
both Philly RBs

[DBoys]

As far as speed Hall runs 4.41-4.45 40's.

Newman runs 4.35-4.37.

I persoanlly don't think Chad Johnson is in the same league with TO, Smith.

[Mansta54]

Roy is the better hitter and player..PERIOD!!!!!!!

[AdamJT13]

Maybe we can pick and choose which one is valid.

Roy's must be valid; since its a Cowboy.

Hall's must be invalid, since Irvin and Johnson didn't say Newman.

Which is Jim Haslett's opinion -- valid or invalid? He said before the last game of 2003 (Newman's rookie year) that Newman was the best player he had seen on film all season. Not best cornerback. Best player. And Haslett's team had played against Champ Bailey, Donovan McNabb, Michael Strahan, Brian Urlacher, Peyton Manning, Shaun Alexander, Walter Jones, Derrick Brooks, Dwight Freeney, Keith Bulluck and a bunch of other Pro Bowl players.

[BrAinPaiNt]

http://totalworkout.homestead.com/files/chuck2.jpg
Chuck Norris says..."They both hit like girls and I could
beat them both up at once while doing the tango"

[AsthmaField]

I slept on this question and I've reached a decision. Roy hits harder.

[AsthmaField]

http://totalworkout.homestead.com/files/chuck2.jpg
Chuck Norris says..."They both hit like girls and I could
beat them both up at once while doing the tango"



:lmao2:

No body hits as hard as Chucky!

[Vintage]

Which is Jim Haslett's opinion -- valid or invalid? He said before the last game of 2003 (Newman's rookie year) that Newman was the best player he had seen on film all season. Not best cornerback. Best player. And Haslett's team had played against Champ Bailey, Donovan McNabb, Michael Strahan, Brian Urlacher, Peyton Manning, Shaun Alexander, Walter Jones, Derrick Brooks, Dwight Freeney, Keith Bulluck and a bunch of other Pro Bowl players.

I would take a coach's opinion more seriously than a players....


And if you are trying to convince me of Newman, you are wasting your time. The arguement had nothing to do with Newman's abilities/play.

But hey, since you brought it up, show me a link.

[AdamJT13]

I would take a coach's opinion more seriously than a players....

And if you are trying to convince me of Newman, you are wasting your time. The arguement had nothing to do with Newman's abilities/play.

You mentioned Chad Johnson's quote about DeAngelo Hall and brought up Newman. I mentioned a quote about Newman.


But hey, since you brought it up, show me a link.

No link, since it was said on television (by Haslett on the Saints' coaches show, then quoted by Chris Collinsworth during the game). According to several posters on the old version of this board (before this one was created), Parcells also was asked about Haslett's quote during a press conference and replied that Newman wasn't big enough yet (which might be why Newman has since "retired the trophy" in the weight room).

[AsthmaField]

And if you are trying to convince me of Newman, you are wasting your time. The arguement had nothing to do with Newman's abilities/play.

But hey, since you brought it up, show me a link.


Oh... it's on!

[BrAinPaiNt]

No link, since it was said on television (by Haslett on the Saints' coaches show, then quoted by Chris Collinsworth during the game). According to several posters on the old version of this board (before this one was created), Parcells also was asked about Haslett's quote during a press conference and replied that Newman wasn't big enough yet (which might be why Newman has since "retired the trophy" in the weight room).


Didn't Shanny of Denver say something positive about Newman?

I can't remember exactly what it was but it was a compliment of some sort.

[Bob Sacamano]

I can't remember exactly what it was but it was a compliment of some sort.

very specific Brain, GOSH!

[BrAinPaiNt]

very specific Brain, GOSH!

I blame it on age, lack of sleep and Monday. :p:

[AdamJT13]

Didn't Shanny of Denver say something positive about Newman?

I can't remember exactly what it was but it was a compliment of some sort.

Are you talking about what Denver's GM said when the Broncos traded Clinton Portis for Champ Bailey?

http://www.denverbroncos.com/page.php?id=334&storyID=2071

----------------------------------
"We analyzed and broke down some of the other teams that had made big jumps. One of the teams that jumped out at us was the Dallas Cowboys," Sundquist said. "They had played really tough, press man coverage on the outside, and it allowed them to mix some things up on the inside, and use the talent that they had very effectively.

"In the end, Dallas was first in defense. It was the play on Mario Edwards on one side and Terence Newman on the other. So we're looking at that, thinking, 'If we can get that shut-down guy, and then upgrade our nickel spot with Kelly (Herndon) going in there," Sundquist continued. "So we came out of those meetings saying, 'If we can get that one guy on defense, it will improve our overall defense tremendously.'"

The Cowboys invested heavily in defensive backs in the last two drafts, taking safety Roy Williams in 2002 and Newman in 2003. Williams is already a Pro Bowler; Newman appears well on his way to joining his former Big 12 rival.
----------------------------------

[Bob Sacamano]

guys, I finally figured out who Adam really is

he's a Stats INC-certified computer

[BrAinPaiNt]

guys, I finally figured out who Adam really is

he's a Stats INC-certified computer

Adam does not know this, but he is my love child from an affair I had with Barbara Eden of I dream of Jeanie that happened years ago.

I feel bad.:p:

[superpunk]

So Adam has no belly button?

Sad....

[TobiasEagle77]

Roy Williams

Most of the hype around Sean Taylor is because of his physical abilities or what people "expect" him to become, rather than what he's actually done on the field IMO. As overhyped as Roy Williams might be :p: he hits harder than Sean Taylor.

[Yakuza Rich]

Admittedly, I didn't watch many Falcon games...

And admittedly, I wasn't paying that close attention to the Atlanta/Philly game (beer kind of took over)...but from what I remember, Hall was on Owens for most of that game.

Owens played the right side of WR. Sure, he'd move around quite a bit...usually to the slot when he moved....but the right side was his side most of the time. That's where Hall is naturally lined up. And if you look at Owens' numbers from that game, Hall didn't have a very good day. I remember watching Owens make catch after catch against Hall and Madden would praise Hall's ability every time a pass went incomplete and acted like Hall was shutting Owens down. I couldn't believe what I was hearing because I was seeing something completely different.


Rich..........

[DIAF]

That's completely wrong. Whenever Sean plays near the line of scrimmage, he is always in on the tackle. Check out some of the highlight reels at www.youtube.com (http://www.youtube.com) and see how often Sean blows up RBs and FBs.

These guys come to mind from last season:
Lamont Jordan
Lorenzo Neal
JJ Arrington
Priest Holmes
both Philly RBs

It's not completely wrong. Man, why is it with redskin fans if you don't admit their player is the BEST IN THE WORLD they act like you said "He sucks...and he slept with your mom.." ?

Taylor might be great around the LoS. But Roy Williams is absolutely farking AMAZING near the LoS, and Taylor isn't even in the same league at that part of the game. Nothing against Taylor, mind you.

[Gibby!]

You can ask the Cards RB too, he ducked (on 4th and 2 with the game on the line no less) avoid a Taylor hit as opposed to fight for the yards and the game.


LOL!! Thats a really bad example...

[Vintage]

Here, let me help the Redskin fans out, so they don't feel like Taylor is being disrespected....

Taylor PWNs the l337 sauce!1!1!11oneeleven!11!11!11

OMG***BBQ!!!!!!

There.

[BigDFan5]

LOL!! Thats a really bad example...

Especially since that same cardinal RB was put out of a game by a Roy Williams hit lol

[peplaw06]

Hall was touted as the best CB in the league by Chad Johnson. I believe it was on ESPN's the Hot Seat when it was said. Furthermore, Irvin apparently said the same thing. I was told this by a Falcon.Scout member who I've asked for a link as proof. I've discusses numerous things regarding the Falcons, and have asked for links in the past, which he has always provided me. I am awaiting the link to Irvin's statement, because I too, want proof (since this is the first time I've heard of Irvin making such statements).

I happened to watch that Hot Seat with Chad. IIRC, they were talking about his "list" of CBs he makes... a list of who he thinks he's gonna torch. ESPN asked him which CBs he was looking forward to facing this season. That's when he mentioned Hall. From what I recall he never called Hall the best in the league. I don't think Chad would make that call. He doesn't think any of em are good, or good enough to slow him down.

That being said, Chad has probably looked at film of Hall getting ready to face him. They don't play Dallas this year, and I don't remember Newman or Johnson ever facing off, so he may have never even studied film on Newman. So if he were to call Hall the best over Newman, it probably wouldn't hold much weight, because he hasn't compared them. I imagine most NFL guys only watch film on guys they know they'll be facing. It would be a monumental waste of time to watch film on guys you've never seen or aren't scheduled to see.

[peplaw06]

The Cowboys used a mixture of coverages and disguised coverages against Smith. Newman was lined up against him for most of the game (until Smith got ejected), but not all of the game. (Smith's only catch of the game came when Newman was covering someone else.) Smith was double- or triple-teamed some of the time, but certainly not all of the time. Dallas played quite a bit of zone coverage in that game, too, which essentially prevents the defense from double- or triple-covering anyone without leaving huge gaps in the zones. And Dallas often gave a pre-snap look of double-teaming Smith but shifted out of it before or after the snap.

So it's not accurate to say that Newman shut down Smith 1-on-1 every play, and it's not accurate to say that Dallas double-covered Smith on every play, either. In reality, it was a mixture that included both of those, plus other coverage schemes.

Yazz??? Anyone else notice he's been MIA since Adam put him out of his misery? Guess he didn't reach for that life preserver...

[HeHateMe]

sean taylor or roy williams who hits the hardest..its close,but i have to lean towards sean taylor...reason being roy grabs from behind alot and he gets big hits on people who are not ready to protect themselves,sean has more head to head were the other guy is squared up and sean goes head to head and knocks the runner backwards,i think sean comes with more force..how do you see it?

It's close, but Taylor gets the nod? And your moniker is "redskins1"?

I wouldve never guessed you thought so.

It's not even close.

[skinsngibbs4life]

Taylor might be great around the LoS. But Roy Williams is absolutely farking AMAZING near the LoS, and Taylor isn't even in the same league at that part of the game. Nothing against Taylor, mind you.

I think that there is no doubt about that. Taylor still has to figure out how to take a good angle towards the ball carrier. He comes in full speed for a heavy hit everytime around the LoS, but misses a lot. The last play of the chargers game is a great example of that.

[starchild]

I don't know if anyone has mentioned this, but ask Emmit Smith (one of the toughest running backs to play the game...) how hard Roy hits, he broke his collar bone....

[Manster54]

I do not really care who hits harder. Who makes more plays? Who causes turnovers and dictates how defenses will account for that player. I think it is a toss up.

[DocScholl]

Who hits the hardest? Sean Taylor or Roy Williams

Is this even a debate ? :lmao2:

Roy hands down .

[TEK2000]

I do not really care who hits harder. Who makes more plays? Who causes turnovers and dictates how defenses will account for that player. I think it is a toss up.

Boy they must really be disruptive if the other teams DEFENSE has to account for them as well as the offense. ;) :lmao2:
:p:

[CowboyMike]

Okay really sad example, but...

The hit that stands out most in my mind is Roy hitting Emmitt Smith as soon as the ball was handed to him about 5 yards behind the line of scrimmage. The sheer force of that hit broke Emmitt's shoulder blade. So yeah... Roy.

And once Roy decides he's gonna hit you, no matter who, you're going backwards.

[Mansta54]

Okay really sad example, but...

The hit that stands out most in my mind is Roy hitting Emmitt Smith as soon as the ball was handed to him about 5 yards behind the line of scrimmage. The sheer force of that hit broke Emmitt's shoulder blade. So yeah... Roy.

And once Roy decides he's gonna hit you, no matter who, you're going backwards.




Nuff said!!!!!! :hammer:

[The30YardSlant]

As Todd Pinkston once said, "When RW hits you, you stay hit"

[The30YardSlant]

BTW, the best hit of Roy's career was the one he put on San Francisco's kickoff return man in his rookie year. Word has it they actually had to replace the guy's shoulder pads because Roy cracked them.

[EMMITTnROY]

Why in the WORLD is this thread still on here??

ROY WILLIAMS.

end of thread.

seriously, dont post on here anymore..

dont do it..

[Mansta54]

Why in the WORLD is this thread still on here??

ROY WILLIAMS.

end of thread.

seriously, dont post on here anymore..

dont do it..




THE END!!!!! :hammer:

[RealCowboyfan]

Why in the WORLD is this thread still on here??

ROY WILLIAMS.

end of thread.

seriously, dont post on here anymore..

dont do it..

I don't know why would a Deadskin fan come on a Cowboys board talking about who hits harder Roy or Sean.

That's just like going to Pepsi asking them which drink is better Pespsi or Coke.:starspin

[yazzmode621]

Yazz??? Anyone else notice he's been MIA since Adam put him out of his misery? Guess he didn't reach for that life preserver...

I like the life preserver line...it was actually funny. But the reason why I left is because people kept telling me the same thing to my question which still didnt answer it.

btw, Sean Taylor still hits harder. Ask Glenn, TO and Crayton. They still have nightmares of him.

[yazzmode621]

Also, unlike RW, of all the hits that Taylor makes and redskins fans 'brag' about, NONE of them are illegal :)

[yazzmode621]

btw, as good as Taylor is, Pat Watkins is going to be the best FS in the NFL in no more than 2 years...


































































:lmao2: :lmao: :laugh1: :lmao: :lmao2:

[Star Struck]

Nice one!

[Gamebreaker]

Roy is a bigger hitter. Doesn't mean Taylor isn't as good a player or better, but in that aspect of the game, Roy has him beat. Some people need to get that through their heads, no need to rationalize it.

[Bob Sacamano]

Some people need to get that through their heads, no need to rationalize it.

paging yazzmode, mr. yazzmode, you have a telephone call at the front desk

[RedskinNation]

I don't know why would a Deadskin fan come on a Cowboys board talking about who hits harder Roy or Sean.

That's just like going to Pepsi asking them which drink is better Pespsi or Coke.:starspin

a man with a brain...

for the record....Williams is clearly the better hitter....Taylor is clearly the better cover safety.

Then again they DO play DIFFERENT Positions (RW = SS & ST = FS)...so you really are comparing apples to oranges if you want to get "technical".