The player I'll be rooting for most

[JPostSam]

is chris canty.

greg ellis's sour grapes over his slight position change have just become too much... (he's inviting a trade now, according to the ft. worth star.) i mean, do you know how many players have adjusted to position changes?! on this team alone, you have demarcus ware, marcus coleman, akin ayodele, and several offensive linemen. (and wasn't crayton a qb in college?)

if i remember correctly, ray lewis has had to change defenses, too.

and no, i don't care that ellis was picked #8 overall. roy williams, picked just as high, has had to play a style of defense that doesn't suit him, too, and he has accepted it quietly and done his best to make it work.

besides, changing positions isn't even necessarily a bad thing: matt jones was a first-round pick last year BECAUSE he was changing positions. skipping past hines ward and all the other qbs-turned-wrs, i'll note that the great ronnie lott changed positions as he got older, too. and he kept going to the pro bowl... and the hall of fame.

that's the thing, really: where most people see adversity and hard luck, winners see challenges and opportunities.

...which brings me back to chris canty. the dude was tearing up the college ranks as a senior when, while he was sticking up for a friend, he suffered a terrible eye injury that almost kept him from being drafted. but instead of moaning about "commitment," the kid just came out and played his heart out. and won himself a starting spot.

no, i don't like rooting AGAINST any cowboys players, but i sure will find it very easy to root FOR canty. in fact, i hope he plays so well in that starting position this year that ellis stops making contract demands and starts counting his blessings for being on the team at all.

[Yeagermeister]

The player(s) I'll be rooting for the most is the oline esp Kosier. He has some mighty big shoes to fill plus if the line stinks it up we aren't going anywhere.

[REDVOLUTION]

The player I will be rooting for the most is.......... Terrell Owens.

And its not for typical T.O. bias.
He was brought here to be a game changer and I EXPECT and WANT that from him.
He can change the whole complexion of the game, the game plan against us, the game plan we prepare to implement. Everything.

In other words, I would like Jerry's money's worth LOL

[CrazyCowboy]

I would like to see Canty break out!!

[silverbear]

is chris canty.

greg ellis's sour grapes over his slight position change have just become too much... (he's inviting a trade now, according to the ft. worth star.) i mean, do you know how many players have adjusted to position changes?! on this team alone, you have demarcus ware, marcus coleman, akin ayodele, and several offensive linemen. (and wasn't crayton a qb in college?)

The problem is, Ellis is a pure 4-3 defensive end, and is not nearly as well suited to play the 3-4... he just can't hope to be as effective...

if i remember correctly, ray lewis has had to change defenses, too.

And his play suffered quite badly... you might want to pick another example...

and no, i don't care that ellis was picked #8 overall. roy williams, picked just as high, has had to play a style of defense that doesn't suit him, too, and he has accepted it quietly and done his best to make it work.

Then again, Roy has a long future ahead of him, while Ellis is staring at the end of his career comin' up fast on the horizon...

...which brings me back to chris canty. the dude was tearing up the college ranks as a senior when, while he was sticking up for a friend, he suffered a terrible eye injury that almost kept him from being drafted.

Well, you just lost all credibility with that one... for openers, "the dude" missed most of that season with a knee injury, suffered in either the first or second game... second, the fight in that bar didn't involve any friends of his, and he wasn't any part of it, he just got hit by a flying beer bottle... he was an innocent bystander... third, there was never a point at which it looked as though he wouldn't be drafted, the only question was how far down the draft he'd slide... before his senior season, he looked like a good bet to go in the first round...

I'm a long-time UVa fan, I can assure you my facts are straight, while yours are entirely garbled...

but instead of moaning about "commitment," the kid just came out and played his heart out. and won himself a starting spot.

Gee, you don't reckon that maybe, just maybe, that's because instead of being a proven producer at the NFL level like Ellis, he was a rookie 4th round draft pick just hoping to make the team, do you??

no, i don't like rooting AGAINST any cowboys players,

Having read this little hatchet job on Ellis, excuse me if I find that hard to believe... you're clearly pissed off because Greg is makin' waves, as if you think that players have some moral obligation to be "good soldiers", even if they truly think they're being taken advantage of...

Well, so long as Greg doesn't hold out, so long as he plays as well as he can when the gun sounds, I don't particularly care if he pops off in the press... now, if he crosses over that line, then I'll probably be as angry at him as you clearly are...

but i sure will find it very easy to root FOR canty.

Oh, make no mistake, I'm rooting for Canty big time... like I said, I'm a Cavs fan from way back...

in fact, i hope he plays so well in that starting position this year that ellis stops making contract demands and starts counting his blessings for being on the team at all.

And THAT'S the heart of the matter-- you're all bent out of shape because Greg is makin' waves... which is fine, except you're carrying it a bit too far, at this point...

This notion that players owe teams absolute loyalty is ridiculous, when the teams rarely reciprocate that loyalty (and they shouldn't, personnel decisions should be based on talent and nothing else)... but the thing you're way too quick to ignore is that until the last year or so, Greg WAS the essence of the "good soldier" you apparently believe all players should be... so if he's not any more, don't you think you ought to stop for at least a second and look at things from his perspective, to see if maybe you can figure out WHY he's suddenly the squeaking wheel??

I like Greg, have since he was a rookie, and unlike you, I won't turn on him if he now finds himself in a situation he finds uncomfortable, and is trying to do what he can to get himself into a better situation for himself personally... he's not looking to have the Cowboys cut him, he wants them to try to find a trade, to get something in return for him... given that they're moving inexorably to a system that he really doesn't fit any more, this might actually be in their best interests too-- get something of value for him before his play drops off, and he's not WORTH as much in trade...

I find it a bit hypocritical, bud, your being pissed by Ellis not showing loyalty to the team, even as you show no loyalty to him... apparently, you have no appreciation for the way he's been the team's leading sacker for like five years running...

[pancakeman]

Good post, silverbear.

[Yeagermeister]

Good post, silverbear.
Don't egg him on ;)

[austintodallas]

I'll be rooting for Pettiti to lock down that RT position!

[BrAinPaiNt]

I'll be rooting for Pettiti to lock down that RT position!


Ditto.

We get him locked down, Flo and Rivera Healthy and hopefully Kosier pans out, then we have really helped our offense.

I think our D is coming along and will not be a problem, but if that o-line struggles there goes or offense.

[TheSport78]

i'll be routing for someone (hopefully Watkins by the end of the season) to step up and be the starting FS

[ZeroClub]

I'd like to see every Cowboy play well and take a step up, of course, but I'm particularly eager to see Demarcus Ware's development.

He's had a full season under his belt in this new league and playing a new position. He's gotten stronger. ... I'm just hoping he becomes a true force who clearly justifies comparisons to L. Taylor.

[EMMITTnROY]

i'll be routing for someone (hopefully Watkins by the end of the season) to step up and be the starting FS
you beat me to it.. Pat Watkins is the guy i will be rooting for the most.. I still think that if we get a good/great player at FS, it will mean a world to this defense.. dont get me wrong, i think that we are stacked on defense and that even a Keith Davis, Justin Beriault, or Marcus Coleman can do a decent job.. BUT.. if Watkins can come along and be a good/great player at FS, it will allow this defense to be so much better..

[fortdick]

Ditto.

We get him locked down, Flo and Rivera Healthy and hopefully Kosier pans out, then we have really helped our offense.

I think our D is coming along and will not be a problem, but if that o-line struggles there goes or offense.

Ditto your ditto!

Big Rob has taken a lot of abuse and I think it has been unfair. The Kid won the job in camp, for whatever reason, played every snap, hurt or not, and gave it all he had. He wasn't ready, physically or mentally, to start at the NFL level, but he gave everything he had. I once had a coach (it was baseball, but the theory still applies) tell me, "If you work hard and give 100%, no one will be able to ask more of you." Well Rob did that, yet many people wanted to blame the slide the last half of the season on him. Tucker didn't catch near the flak Rob did, and he was the real problem.

I hope Rob comes out and demolishes the competition in camp and has a great season. He deserves it for all he gave last year and he deserves our respect!

(Off the soap box)

[REDVOLUTION]

I'd like to see every Cowboy play well and take a step up, of course, but I'm particularly eager to see Demarcus Ware's development.

He's had a full season under his belt in this new league and playing a new position. He's gotten stronger. ... I'm just hoping he becomes a true force who clearly justifies comparisons to L. Taylor.

Good post. Whole team=better.

I would like to add to that theme. I would like to see THIS team develop/show/have/execute with that KILLER INSTINCT. On both offense and defense.

Offensively - lets put teams away when the opp is there.
Defensive - lets dominate and give the offense more chances for us and make opposing offenses pay just for being on the field.

[silverbear]

Good post, silverbear.

I'm just gettin' a little exasperated by all the Ellis bashing here lately...

These guys seem to be pissed because they think that Ellis isn't showing any loyalty to the Cowboys, and unwilling to consider that he has been ultra-loyal to the team until the last few months... apparently, they don't feel any need to be loyal to players who have given years of loyal service, so I find myself wondering why they blame Greg for what he's doing...

[silverbear]

Don't egg him on ;)

As if I need egging on... LOL...

[silverbear]

I'll be rooting for Pettiti to lock down that RT position!

I'm rootin' for Colombo to step up and win that job... I like Petitti, but think he'd be better off at guard, much like Kevin Gogan did...

[California Quake]

I agree too. If Pettiti wins the starting job and plays well, that will be a huge boost for the OL. There are still a few question marks on the OL but there is going to be a huge leap in performance from a year ago regarless.

[California Quake]

I agree too. If Pettiti wins the starting job and plays well, that will be a huge boost for the OL. There are still a few question marks on the OL but there is going to be a huge leap in performance from a year ago regarless.

I was referring to Pettiti stepping up at RT, not guard. Pettiti is not built to play guard. I hope no one thinks I wanted him moved to tackle like the guy above me.

[JPostSam]

The problem is, Ellis is a pure 4-3 defensive end, and is not nearly as well suited to play the 3-4... he just can't hope to be as effective...



And his play suffered quite badly... you might want to pick another example...



Then again, Roy has a long future ahead of him, while Ellis is staring at the end of his career comin' up fast on the horizon...



Well, you just lost all credibility with that one... for openers, "the dude" missed most of that season with a knee injury, suffered in either the first or second game... second, the fight in that bar didn't involve any friends of his, and he wasn't any part of it, he just got hit by a flying beer bottle... he was an innocent bystander... third, there was never a point at which it looked as though he wouldn't be drafted, the only question was how far down the draft he'd slide... before his senior season, he looked like a good bet to go in the first round...

I'm a long-time UVa fan, I can assure you my facts are straight, while yours are entirely garbled...



Gee, you don't reckon that maybe, just maybe, that's because instead of being a proven producer at the NFL level like Ellis, he was a rookie 4th round draft pick just hoping to make the team, do you??



Having read this little hatchet job on Ellis, excuse me if I find that hard to believe... you're clearly pissed off because Greg is makin' waves, as if you think that players have some moral obligation to be "good soldiers", even if they truly think they're being taken advantage of...

Well, so long as Greg doesn't hold out, so long as he plays as well as he can when the gun sounds, I don't particularly care if he pops off in the press... now, if he crosses over that line, then I'll probably be as angry at him as you clearly are...



Oh, make no mistake, I'm rooting for Canty big time... like I said, I'm a Cavs fan from way back...



And THAT'S the heart of the matter-- you're all bent out of shape because Greg is makin' waves... which is fine, except you're carrying it a bit too far, at this point...

This notion that players owe teams absolute loyalty is ridiculous, when the teams rarely reciprocate that loyalty (and they shouldn't, personnel decisions should be based on talent and nothing else)... but the thing you're way too quick to ignore is that until the last year or so, Greg WAS the essence of the "good soldier" you apparently believe all players should be... so if he's not any more, don't you think you ought to stop for at least a second and look at things from his perspective, to see if maybe you can figure out WHY he's suddenly the squeaking wheel??

I like Greg, have since he was a rookie, and unlike you, I won't turn on him if he now finds himself in a situation he finds uncomfortable, and is trying to do what he can to get himself into a better situation for himself personally... he's not looking to have the Cowboys cut him, he wants them to try to find a trade, to get something in return for him... given that they're moving inexorably to a system that he really doesn't fit any more, this might actually be in their best interests too-- get something of value for him before his play drops off, and he's not WORTH as much in trade...

I find it a bit hypocritical, bud, your being pissed by Ellis not showing loyalty to the team, even as you show no loyalty to him... apparently, you have no appreciation for the way he's been the team's leading sacker for like five years running...



silverbear, if i've given canty too much credit for the whole fight/injury thing, i'll take it back. but the fact remains that he never said that anyone owed him anything. the main point is that he has treated his nfl experience as a gift and an opportunity -- a perspective that ellis, who has already made millions of dollars and who stands to make millions more, would do well to adopt.

no, i DON'T care that ellis is "uncomfortable." i'm not aware of any part of his contract that promises his "comfort" -- are you?

also, since you're giving me flak over the canty bottle incident, let me remind you that ellis's play last season can not be considered to have "suffered badly," as you say, since his sack total matched his career high.

:laugh1:

well... you want me to think about why ellis has suddenly become a "squeaky wheel," as you say. well, considering his statements, i can only conclude that he doesn't think he'll perform well in his new role, and thinks that will harm his opportunity to earn a bigger paycheck in a year or two. trouble is, i don't think highly of any player who doesn't have the attitude that he'll kick butt no matter what -- especially when his head coach has repeatedly insisted that he will be put in a position to make plays.

another troubling thing is that he already HAS the guarantee of a bigger payday down the road: he is under contract for four more years, and is meant to earn more money each year.

so the overwhelming impression that ellis is giving all of us is that he 1) is afraid of his new assignment, which is not even so different from his current assignment, and 2) wants to get some more money now and get out at the end of the season.

so get this straight: i am not "disloyal" to ellis. i just don't sympathize with the way he is going about his business. i expect him to either request his immediate release from his (lucrative) contract from the cowboys so he can pursue other opportunities, or shut up and start working to MAKE himself into the best 3-4 (and nickel 4-3) defensive end that he can be.

see, having the highest sack total on a team that has a pathetic sack total for years does NOT give you the kind of leeway that ellis expects now. and what he is doing definitely IS testing the patience of fans as well as the management. to pretend that it is not is just unexplainable.

but you seem to believe that ellis should be judged differently than you or i would be judged in our own work environments, don't you? you even believe that he should be judged differently from his own teammates. apparently, you think it's okay to defy your coach -- your boss -- and the owner -- your boss's boss -- and expect to be rewarded monetarily for doing so. silverbear, i respect what ellis has done and how he's done it... until now. but apparently, you think the fans should show GREATER respect for a guy who begs off a challenge because he doesn't think he'll be good enough.

sorry, silverbear. i don't.

[Angus]

I am rooting for Jason Hatcher to come along strong and become a force for the defense. If he does, he might make Greg Ellis expendable. Bear, the reason Ellis is catching grief is because football is a team sport and any off key note threatens to ruin the team's music. Sure, Greg deserves praise for past behavior -- if repeated, but he is a grown man who signed a long term contract and took the money for it without assurance that he would always be "the man." I'm sure he is a good man but good men sometimes try to get out of the obligations they freely undertook. Ellis' job is to play where he is needed by the team. It is not the team's duty to play Ellis in a scheme he likes. So, he won't be able to market himself so well if his numbers are down? So what? He should emulate LaRoi Glover who was in the same situation for a year but handled it very professionally, with dignity.

[JPostSam]

I am rooting for Jason Hatcher to come along strong and become a force for the defense. If he does, he might make Greg Ellis expendable. Bear, the reason Ellis is catching grief is because football is a team sport and any off key note threatens to ruin the team's music. Sure, Greg deserves praise for past behavior -- if repeated, but he is a grown man who signed a long term contract and took the money for it without assurance that he would always be "the man." I'm sure he is a good man but good men sometimes try to get out of the obligations they freely undertook. Ellis' job is to play where he is needed by the team. It is not the team's duty to play Ellis in a scheme he likes. So, he won't be able to market himself so well if his numbers are down? So what? He should emulate LaRoi Glover who was in the same situation for a year but handled it very professionally, with dignity.
exactly, angus!

(oh, and above, make that ellis was only one off his career high last year in sacks.)

[SteveOS]

Since Drew will have the ball most of the time, I'll have to root for him on offense.

On defense, I'm rooting for Ware to have a huge year!

[DLCassidy]

I'm just gettin' a little exasperated by all the Ellis bashing here lately...

These guys seem to be pissed because they think that Ellis isn't showing any loyalty to the Cowboys, and unwilling to consider that he has been ultra-loyal to the team until the last few months... apparently, they don't feel any need to be loyal to players who have given years of loyal service, so I find myself wondering why they blame Greg for what he's doing...

We can all agree Greg has been a good guy. Being loyal to him would mean we as fans want the Cowboys to keep him in a year or 2 if there's a jump ball as to whether he's still worth the money. Good play and good behavior buys you that kind of consideration. But that doesn't mean he gets a pass when he's acting selfish and greedy, blowing off the offseason workouts, asking for a restructured deal, demanding repeated meetings with management and looking to be traded. Especially when he and his agent are trying to buy a ticket out of town with a slick PR campaign in which Greg gets to play victim.

Greg's under contract, a contract he freely signed. The coach and the owner both say he's an important part of the team. He was productive in the scheme last year. So yeah, we don't see where Greg is coming from and it's tough to find sympathy for a whining millionaire.

[Hostile]

Julius Jones. I think how he plays determines how far we can go. If he makes teams respect the run it opens up the passing game. Witht eh pass catchign weapons we have that could be very big.

[JPostSam]

We can all agree Greg has been a good guy. Being loyal to him would mean we as fans want the Cowboys to keep him in a year or 2 if there's a jump ball as to whether he's still worth the money. Good play and good behavior buys you that kind of consideration. But that doesn't mean he gets a pass when he's acting selfish and greedy, blowing off the offseason workouts, asking for a restructured deal, demanding repeated meetings with management and looking to be traded. Especially when he and his agent are trying to buy a ticket out of town with a slick PR campaign in which Greg gets to play victim.

Greg's under contract, a contract he freely signed. The coach and the owner both say he's an important part of the team. He was productive in the scheme last year. So yeah, we don't see where Greg is coming from and it's tough to find sympathy for a whining millionaire.

:hammer:

[dougonthebench]

I'm pulling for all of our Boys.I dont know about all of you,I want to win the Superbowl and soon!!!

[The Answer]

The Answer will be rooting for the entire team as a whole. But as for individual players.....The Answer will be rooting for Bledsoe, TO, and Parcells. Three of the biggest names in professional sports history and all eyes will be on Big D this fall!

~The Answer

[blindzebra]

Simple.

Carpenter, if he has a year equal to what Ware did last year for overall impact, we will have a defense that can be SCARY GOOD.

[5Stars]

Simple.

Carpenter, if he has a year equal to what Ware did last year for overall impact, we will have a defense that can be SCARY GOOD.

That's who I will be rooting also! I lived in Columbus for 4 years and became an OSU fan....

:star:

[followthestar]

Julius Jones will make this offense work as it should, or could, simply by staying healthy. his ethics, talent, and potential are at the top of the charts, and he DOES have the ability and the scheme to put up those 1700 yards he was aiming for last season. i am rooting for him big-time to show everyone (we've only seen glimpses so far) that he is an elite RB.
on the side, i would love to see Columbo manage to return to the form he showed prior to his injury, or close to it. talk about potential!!! if he can overcome what he's suffered and win the starting position, i will be thrilled! i was going to go with Newman, but i expect him to play very well - the others have question marks...

[Tennione72]

Keith Davis and Spears

[Star Struck]

I'm rooting for either Jones or Barber to really step up this year. We need one of them to become strong at that position...

On D, I'd have to pull for Spears (or Canty or Ferguson). Our front line needs to set the pace...

[silverbear]

silverbear, if i've given canty too much credit for the whole fight/injury thing, i'll take it back. but the fact remains that he never said that anyone owed him anything. the main point is that he has treated his nfl experience as a gift and an opportunity -- a perspective that ellis, who has already made millions of dollars and who stands to make millions more, would do well to adopt.

First, props for having the intellectual integrity to admit you might not have had all the facts in the Canty situation... I can respect a man who can admit when he might be wrong...

Second, if Canty ever gets to the point that Ellis has, where he's made millions of dollars, if he gets near the end of his career, you might well find him copping a "veteran attitude", if he feels like his talents are being wasted in whatever defensive scheme he happens to find himself in...

Greg is just trying to get the Boys to trade him to a team that might be able to use him in a way that will maximize his abilities... this is not unreasonable on his part, just as it's not unreasonable for the Boys to keep him around if they think he can play well for them in a more unreasonable role...

no, i DON'T care that ellis is "uncomfortable." i'm not aware of any part of his contract that promises his "comfort" -- are you?

Not really, but unlike you, I don't really care if he's running off at the mouth either-- so long as he's ready to play when the gun sounds... like I've said all along, if he holds out or something like that, then I'll get down on him, but right now all his woofing doesn't add up to jack-- except that it pisses off guys like you...

also, since you're giving me flak over the canty bottle incident, let me remind you that ellis's play last season can not be considered to have "suffered badly," as you say, since his sack total matched his career high.

That's the ONLY stat that didn't suffer... he had the lowest number of tackles of his NFL career...

well... you want me to think about why ellis has suddenly become a "squeaky wheel," as you say. well, considering his statements, i can only conclude that he doesn't think he'll perform well in his new role, and thinks that will harm his opportunity to earn a bigger paycheck in a year or two.

Bingo... I think that most people, if they found themselves in that situation, would be unhappy at the prospect of seeing their earning potential diminished...

Listen, Greg has NEVER trashed the Cowboys over any of this, he says he understands why they're doing what they're doing... he's just saying that he's not a particularly good fit in this system, so it might be better-- both for him and for the Cowboys-- for him to be traded to a club that can use him the way he used to be used by the Boys...

trouble is, i don't think highly of any player who doesn't have the attitude that he'll kick butt no matter what -- especially when his head coach has repeatedly insisted that he will be put in a position to make plays.

I'm fully confident that so long as he remains a Dallas Cowboy, Greg Ellis will give his best effort when he's on the field... I'm also confident that despite him skipping these OTAs (which DOES bother me a little), he'll show up to training camp in shape and ready to play...

If that proves not to be the case, if he starts dogging it, then I'll quickly come around to your way of thinking... but until he shows me that, I'm gonna give him the respect he's earned for the play he's given the team in the past...

another troubling thing is that he already HAS the guarantee of a bigger payday down the road: he is under contract for four more years, and is meant to earn more money each year.

Though Ellis has talked about the Cowboys giving him a new deal, I truly think this is more about his role in the defense than financial considerations...

so get this straight: i am not "disloyal" to ellis. i just don't sympathize with the way he is going about his business. i expect him to either request his immediate release from his (lucrative) contract from the cowboys so he can pursue other opportunities,

There is no way the Cowboys will ever release him outright, and he has never requested they do so... he's talking about the Boys looking into TRADING him, getting some value in return...

or shut up and start working to MAKE himself into the best 3-4 (and nickel 4-3) defensive end that he can be.

Ahhh, now we get to the REAL heart of your problem with Greg-- you want him to shut up... it pisses you off that he's runnin' his mouth in the press...

Precisely as I suspected... I'm guessing you get pissed at any player that rocks the boat; well, I've been a Cowboys fan for a loooooong time, and I vividly remember lots of players who caused problems, and still played their butts off for the Boys...

Charles Haley was always starting trouble... Emmitt Smith was a REAL troublemaker when it came time to negotiate a new deal, even missing two games at the start of a season... Hollywood Henderson and Duane Thomas were always stirring the fecal matter, but they always showed up on game day...

So, it's from that historical perspective that I say that I don't give a rat's patootie what a player SAYS, so long as he shows up and plays on game day...

what he is doing definitely IS testing the patience of fans as well as the management. to pretend that it is not is just unexplainable.

I rather doubt that management is nearly as pissed as some of you fans are... they know that they hold all the cards, and they'll do what they think is in their best interest... I suspect they also know that Ellis will show up on game day, no matter what he's saying now...

Nope, it's only guys like you (and to be fair, a lot of others in here) who are showing impatience in this situation... me, I see this as a lot of hot air that ultimately means NOTHING; Greg Ellis will play for the Cowboys this year, then I suspect they'll find a way to get something for him next offseason... and when he plays, Ellis will give us all his best effort...

And that's ALL I care about...

but you seem to believe that ellis should be judged differently than you or i would be judged in our own work environments, don't you?

Actually, I'm saying that Ellis should be judged on what he DOES on the field, not what he SAYS off it... I'm saying I don't care in the slightest what he's saying these days...

you even believe that he should be judged differently from his own teammates.

Where in God's name did you get THAT idea?? I sure as h*ll have never said any such thing... to the contrary, I'd hold any player to the same standards I'm holding Ellis to here-- so long as you do your job on Sunday, and don't break any league rules, I couldn't possibly care less about anything else...

apparently, you think it's okay to defy your coach -- your boss -- and the owner -- your boss's boss -- and expect to be rewarded monetarily for doing so.

How exactly does asking to be traded constitute "defying your coach"?? Bluntly, I think you've had a rather silly, knee-jerk reaction, and you've taken it WAY too far...

In conclusion, you'll have to forgive me if I doubt your claims of respecting Ellis, not when you trash him so bitterly... if you really had any respect for him, you'd give him the benefit of the doubt, you'd wait until he caused problems on the field for the Cowboys before goin' for his throat...

Bottom line, you guys are gettin' all worked up over not much of nothin'... suddenly, you're all acting like you're convinced that if we shaved Greg's head, we'd find 6-6-6 tattooed somewhere on his melon... LOL...

[Bizwah]

I'll be rooting for either (and I stress the word "either") Romo or Henson to show themselves as being the "QB of the Future".

I'm not wishing injury on Bledsoe...I hope he's healthy all season...but I hope he gets quite a run from either of our backup QBs.

Then we'll be well on our way.

[silverbear]

I am rooting for Jason Hatcher to come along strong and become a force for the defense. If he does, he might make Greg Ellis expendable. Bear, the reason Ellis is catching grief is because football is a team sport and any off key note threatens to ruin the team's music.

I've known sports teams that were at each others' throats all season long, and still won... Billy Martin's Yankees come to mind...

Sure, Greg deserves praise for past behavior -- if repeated, but he is a grown man who signed a long term contract and took the money for it without assurance that he would always be "the man." I'm sure he is a good man but good men sometimes try to get out of the obligations they freely undertook.

When Ellis signed that deal, there were no indications that the Cowboys would change their base defense... and he has said all along that he'll honor his contract, so this indictment has no merit...

Ellis' job is to play where he is needed by the team. It is not the team's duty to play Ellis in a scheme he likes. So, he won't be able to market himself so well if his numbers are down? So what? He should emulate LaRoi Glover who was in the same situation for a year but handled it very professionally, with dignity.

He didn't go public with his unhappiness, but do you really know that he wasn't unhappy??

An NFL player has a finite, limited time to make his money, before he no longer has the game to command a big paycheck... I just can't find it in me to be too angry at somebody who's just trying to ensure that he can maximize his earning potential in that short time... not when the guy isn't holding out on the team or anything like that...

All Greg's complaining doesn't mean jack, really... in fact, if he really does hope to be traded, his runnin' off at the mouth is counter-productive, because it's driving down his trade value, making it more unlikely that the Cowboys could receive an offer that gave them a fair return... so it's not a particularly bright move on his part...

But it's really no big deal...

[silverbear]

We can all agree Greg has been a good guy. Being loyal to him would mean we as fans want the Cowboys to keep him in a year or 2 if there's a jump ball as to whether he's still worth the money.

I believe the Boys will keep him around this year, then look to get as much as they can for him next offseason...

Good play and good behavior buys you that kind of consideration. But that doesn't mean he gets a pass when he's acting selfish and greedy, blowing off the offseason workouts, asking for a restructured deal, demanding repeated meetings with management and looking to be traded. Especially when he and his agent are trying to buy a ticket out of town with a slick PR campaign in which Greg gets to play victim.

Never said anything about giving him a pass, but some folks in here are acting like he's a serial sex offender...

Greg's under contract, a contract he freely signed.

That's a bogus argument, because Ellis had no earthly idea the Boys were gonna change their defensive scheme when he signed that contract... had he known that, I rather doubt he would have signed it... and of course, at no point has he failed to honor that contract... he says he'll honor it this year, too...

So please, spare me the "Ellis signed a contract" argument... at least, until he fails to honor that contract...

[big dog cowboy]

The player I'll be rooting for most
A bunch for me. Can't narrow it to one. Petitti, Kosier, Crayton, Julius - all offense. The D will take care of itself.

[FLcowboy]

Ditto your ditto!

Big Rob has taken a lot of abuse and I think it has been unfair. The Kid won the job in camp, for whatever reason, played every snap, hurt or not, and gave it all he had. He wasn't ready, physically or mentally, to start at the NFL level, but he gave everything he had. I once had a coach (it was baseball, but the theory still applies) tell me, "If you work hard and give 100%, no one will be able to ask more of you." Well Rob did that, yet many people wanted to blame the slide the last half of the season on him. Tucker didn't catch near the flak Rob did, and he was the real problem.

I hope Rob comes out and demolishes the competition in camp and has a great season. He deserves it for all he gave last year and he deserves our respect!

(Off the soap box)


I've been saying that all off season. Petitti may be the biggest surprise of the sophmore class.

[DWelch1775]

Good thread, but it kinda bothers me that you compare Ellis to Williams. Roy is an awesome player and teammate, and i can't really say the same for Ellis.

[vaquerofan1]

Two guys, Jason Whitten and Rob Carpenter. I'd like to see Jason have the kind of year that everyone else in the League will have to recognize him as one of the best TE's, and Carpenter because I think he is the type of player we need on the team.

[Bob Sacamano]

is chris canty.

greg ellis's sour grapes over his slight position change have just become too much... (he's inviting a trade now, according to the ft. worth star.) i mean, do you know how many players have adjusted to position changes?! on this team alone, you have demarcus ware, marcus coleman, akin ayodele, and several offensive linemen. (and wasn't crayton a qb in college?)

if i remember correctly, ray lewis has had to change defenses, too.

and no, i don't care that ellis was picked #8 overall. roy williams, picked just as high, has had to play a style of defense that doesn't suit him, too, and he has accepted it quietly and done his best to make it work.

besides, changing positions isn't even necessarily a bad thing: matt jones was a first-round pick last year BECAUSE he was changing positions. skipping past hines ward and all the other qbs-turned-wrs, i'll note that the great ronnie lott changed positions as he got older, too. and he kept going to the pro bowl... and the hall of fame.

that's the thing, really: where most people see adversity and hard luck, winners see challenges and opportunities.

...which brings me back to chris canty. the dude was tearing up the college ranks as a senior when, while he was sticking up for a friend, he suffered a terrible eye injury that almost kept him from being drafted. but instead of moaning about "commitment," the kid just came out and played his heart out. and won himself a starting spot.

no, i don't like rooting AGAINST any cowboys players, but i sure will find it very easy to root FOR canty. in fact, i hope he plays so well in that starting position this year that ellis stops making contract demands and starts counting his blessings for being on the team at all.

:hammer: very well done

[Bob Sacamano]

I'm just gettin' a little exasperated by all the Ellis bashing here lately...

These guys seem to be pissed because they think that Ellis isn't showing any loyalty to the Cowboys, and unwilling to consider that he has been ultra-loyal to the team until the last few months... apparently, they don't feel any need to be loyal to players who have given years of loyal service, so I find myself wondering why they blame Greg for what he's doing...

I think the premise of the original poster's post was that Greg needs to shut up and adjust to change, I dont' think you can argue with that

[Bob Sacamano]

I'm rootin' for Colombo to step up and win that job... I like Petitti, but think he'd be better off at guard, much like Kevin Gogan did...

:rolleyes:

should we trade a 1st for Kwakou Robinson and making him an OT while we're at it? :p:

[Bob Sacamano]

Never said anything about giving him a pass, but some folks in here are acting like he's a serial sex offender...

c'mon silverbear, if Dallas hasn't acknowledged his request the 1st, 2nd or 3rd time, I think it's time to shut up, this is getting him nowhere, just making him look like a nagging Nancy

"remember BIll, I want to get a bigger contract"

"hey Bill, Greg again, how about that contract?"

"hey Bill...pick up the phone"

"hey BIll, I was in the shower and I thought I heard the phone ring, call me"

"...ah crap *click*

[JPostSam]

An NFL player has a finite, limited time to make his money, before he no longer has the game to command a big paycheck... I just can't find it in me to be too angry at somebody who's just trying to ensure that he can maximize his earning potential in that short time... not when the guy isn't holding out on the team or anything like that...

All Greg's complaining doesn't mean jack, really... in fact, if he really does hope to be traded, his runnin' off at the mouth is counter-productive, because it's driving down his trade value, making it more unlikely that the Cowboys could receive an offer that gave them a fair return... so it's not a particularly bright move on his part...

But it's really no big deal...

silverbear, the one blowing this out of proportion is you when you make comments like the serial sex offender thing. i didn't say that dallas should cut him, or fine him, or anything like that. and i didn't say he was a bad guy. all i said was that i'm losing some respect for the player, and instead of making me root for him to be proven right in his fears (which, after all, would mean poor results for the team), i'm now hoping to see ellis's replacement as a starter (canty) play so well that ellis realizes he is no longer the big dog who can make demands.

it doesn't bother me that he has voiced his concern. i don't think he should sit in the corner with a muzzle on or anything like that. and i can appreciate when a guy says, "i love this organization, and i respect what the coach is doing, but i don't think it's for me." it's just that he has to decide whether he believes that so strongly that he is willing to refuse to be part of it, or whether he can swallow those doubts for long enough to give it a shot.

i agree that, if he does in the end play his heart out on the field, he deserves fans' support. i'm just saying that, for now, i'd prefer to hear a different tune. you know, something like, "it's a big challenge for me to adjust, but i'm going to give it 110% and see what happens."

as summeris funner points out, ellis has made his case, and parcells has said, "no, you'll play a slightly different role, and it'll keep you fresh to make big plays and prevent you from getting worn down as you feared you would; this move will help prolong your career." so for ellis to keep making the same point is just tedious. that's why i said he should demand his release or shut up -- meaning, accept the role and move on.

[JPostSam]

Though Ellis has talked about the Cowboys giving him a new deal, I truly think this is more about his role in the defense than financial considerations...

you can't separate the two. if he thinks he'll do poorly and the cowboys will dump him, he thinks he'll get a worse deal from someone else afterward. but he could just as easily think that the cowboys would be happy with him doing what they ask of him, and that they would honor their contract with him -- which, as i have pointed out, already specifies higher pay in the coming years.

I'm guessing you get pissed at any player that rocks the boat

nope. but when a guy says the same thing over and over again, despite the coach's insistence that the player will be fine, it makes him a malcontent.

Emmitt Smith was a REAL troublemaker when it came time to negotiate a new deal, even missing two games at the start of a season...

i didn't like that, either. but the situation was very different. emmitt didn't say he was being robbed or that he wasn't being given the opportunity to play up to his abilities. if i remember correctly, he was negotiating a NEW contract, not trying to get out of an old one. it took a long time for both sides to agree on the numbers. that doesn't qualify as a "REAL troublemaker" at all! again, i didn't like that. but it was very different from the ellis situation.

...and regarding the different standards for ellis and the rest of the players, what i mean is this: you seem to think that a rookie, in ellis's shoes, would have to stay quiet and suffer, because he hasn't "paid his dues," so to speak, and hasn't earned the right to speak up, while ellis has. that, by definition, is inequality.

so, for the umpteenth time, i'll say this: ellis made his point. he should either let it rest, or demand a trade. because he isn't going to be cut during the season, meaning he won't lose any money this season. and if he plays well, he'll only make more money next year -- with the cowboys.

ellis has to decide whether to put everything he has into the role that parcells has chosen for him, or nothing.

...now let's get to training camp already!!!

:laugh1:

[silverbear]

:rolleyes:

should we trade a 1st for Kwakou Robinson and making him an OT while we're at it? :p:

Haw Kwakou even signed anywhere??

You talk like no borderline defensive lineman has ever benefitted from a switch to the offensive side of the ball...

As for your rolling your eyes at my suggestion that Petitti could make a fine, Kevin Gogan-esque guard, exactly what part of that suggestion do you find dubious?? To me, they look to have much the same kind of skillset, and inside at guard, Petitti wouldn't have the problem with speed rushers...

Mind you, I'm not saying that Rob can't develop into a serviceable tackle, I like the guy... I just think he'd make a TERRIFIC guard...

[silverbear]

c'mon silverbear, if Dallas hasn't acknowledged his request the 1st, 2nd or 3rd time, I think it's time to shut up, this is getting him nowhere, just making him look like a nagging Nancy

"remember BIll, I want to get a bigger contract"

"hey Bill, Greg again, how about that contract?"

"hey Bill...pick up the phone"

"hey BIll, I was in the shower and I thought I heard the phone ring, call me"

"...ah crap *click*

My whole point is who gives a rat's patootie if Ellis is squawking, so long as he shows up and plays??

I know I don't...

[silverbear]

silverbear, the one blowing this out of proportion is you when you make comments like the serial sex offender thing.

A little hyperbole, to make a point... that point being that some of y'all are overreacting badly to this whole "crisis"...

i didn't say that dallas should cut him, or fine him, or anything like that.

Did I say you said any such thing?? In fact, I haven't seen anybody say that...

and i didn't say he was a bad guy.

The way you talked about him in that first post, it's clear you don't think he's a GOOD guy... it's clear you're pissed at him...

all i said was that i'm losing some respect for the player, and instead of making me root for him to be proven right in his fears (which, after all, would mean poor results for the team), i'm now hoping to see ellis's replacement as a starter (canty) play so well that ellis realizes he is no longer the big dog who can make demands.

Oh, you think Canty playing well would make Ellis behave and make nice?? Somehow, I doubt it; if Canty plays well, that would mean even less playing time for Greg, which would make him even more happy, even more anxious to find another place to play...

and i can appreciate when a guy says, "i love this organization, and i respect what the coach is doing, but i don't think it's for me." it's just that he has to decide whether he believes that so strongly that he is willing to refuse to be part of it,

Wow, I don't remember him refusing to be part of it... perhaps you could show me the quotes to that effect??

See, you're capable of a little hyperbole for effect your own self...

i agree that, if he does in the end play his heart out on the field, he deserves fans' support. i'm just saying that, for now, i'd prefer to hear a different tune. you know, something like, "it's a big challenge for me to adjust, but i'm going to give it 110% and see what happens."

I'd like to hear that too, but I'm not gonna get upset if I don't... I just don't see this as any big deal... more to the point, I don't think the Cowboys are overly bothered by it, either...

as summeris funner points out, ellis has made his case, and parcells has said, "no, you'll play a slightly different role, and it'll keep you fresh to make big plays and prevent you from getting worn down as you feared you would; this move will help prolong your career." so for ellis to keep making the same point is just tedious.

Yeah, I'll agree with you on that... but it doesn't merit the firestorm of criticism he's come in for from the fans on assorted message boards...

I'm not saying Ellis is right, far from it... I'm just saying that we shouldn't be metaphorically tearing him a new anal orifice because he's a bit upset, and giving voice to his displeasure, because ultimately, all his woofin' don't mean jack...

Another point just occurred to me as I was typing this-- a lot of the people who are so outraged at the way Ellis is behaving these days are people who were quite happy when the Cowboys signed Terrell Owens... now, maybe you're not one of them, but if you are, I'd like to ask you why is Ellis' moaning and whining so unacceptable to you, yet you're willing to sit still for bringing in a guy who did FAR worse last year when he was unhappy??

If you're not one of the TO backers, I'll pose that question to anybody who fits my indictment... to me, backing TO while rippin' on Ellis is downright hypocritical, because Ellis has never been anywhere NEAR the "cancer" that Owens has been in the course of his career...

[silverbear]

nope. but when a guy says the same thing over and over again, despite the coach's insistence that the player will be fine, it makes him a malcontent.

Oh, there's no doubt about it, he IS a malcontent right now... but you don't seem to be willing to even contemplate the possibility that he might have a legitimate beef...

And really, his complaining is no BFD (Big Flippin' Deal, to keep it PG)...



i didn't like that, either. but the situation was very different. emmitt didn't say he was being robbed or that he wasn't being given the opportunity to play up to his abilities. if i remember correctly, he was negotiating a NEW contract, not trying to get out of an old one. it took a long time for both sides to agree on the numbers. that doesn't qualify as a "REAL troublemaker" at all!

That's putting himself ahead of the team (if you remember back that far, the Boys went 0-2 prior to his finally signing)... exactly as you say Ellis is doing now...


...and regarding the different standards for ellis and the rest of the players, what i mean is this: you seem to think that a rookie, in ellis's shoes, would have to stay quiet and suffer, because he hasn't "paid his dues," so to speak, and hasn't earned the right to speak up, while ellis has. that, by definition, is inequality.

It is, but it's also reality... there isn't a coach out there who won't let a proven producer get away with a bit more attitude than a rookie... Jimmy Johnson was quite candid about how he'd let his playmakers get away with more than his fringe ballplayers...

so, for the umpteenth time, i'll say this: ellis made his point. he should either let it rest,

I personally haven't heard a thing from him since minicamp, have you?? In fact, even during minicamp he begged off on doing interviews until the last day... seems like he wants to get this thing out of the public eye, too...

or demand a trade.

He's REQUESTED that the Cowboys look into trading him... I'd think you'd find that more acceptable than "demanding" that they do so... that would make him more of a troublemaker, IMO...

[JPostSam]

Another point just occurred to me as I was typing this-- a lot of the people who are so outraged at the way Ellis is behaving these days are people who were quite happy when the Cowboys signed Terrell Owens... now, maybe you're not one of them, but if you are, I'd like to ask you why is Ellis' moaning and whining so unacceptable to you, yet you're willing to sit still for bringing in a guy who did FAR worse last year when he was unhappy??

If you're not one of the TO backers, I'll pose that question to anybody who fits my indictment... to me, backing TO while rippin' on Ellis is downright hypocritical, because Ellis has never been anywhere NEAR the "cancer" that Owens has been in the course of his career...

actually, silverbear, i REALLY didn't want us to sign TO; i don't like what he represents as a person. i mean, he's not a criminal or anything like that, but his actions on and off the field aren't the kind of things that i want to be associated with as a cowboys fan.

now that he is a part of my favorite team, though, i am hoping that he plays very well and behaves himself for as long as it takes to find and/or groom some young wide receiver talent.

and before you ask, no i don't think there's any comparison between terrell owens and greg ellis. in fact -- to wind this down and let this thread die -- i think that the ellis thing will die down IF: the cowboys win, and ellis makes enough plays to feel like a part of that success.

[silverbear]

actually, silverbear, i REALLY didn't want us to sign TO; i don't like what he represents as a person. i mean, he's not a criminal or anything like that, but his actions on and off the field aren't the kind of things that i want to be associated with as a cowboys fan.

now that he is a part of my favorite team, though, i am hoping that he plays very well and behaves himself for as long as it takes to find and/or groom some young wide receiver talent.

and before you ask, no i don't think there's any comparison between terrell owens and greg ellis. in fact -- to wind this down and let this thread die -- i think that the ellis thing will die down IF: the cowboys win, and ellis makes enough plays to feel like a part of that success.

OK, we seem to be in complete agreement on this point... like I said, I had no idea if you were one of the TO supporters or not...

[5Stars]

CALL DENVER and ship Ellis outta here! Kick him to the curb! If he don't want to be here? poof! be gone sucker!

Ship him off on the next train...let him see if the grass is greener out there. :cool:

The Boyz need players that want a ring...not a player that has more money then he can spend already!

Put Ellis on the first Dog (Greyhound) outta here...then let the chips fall where they fall...

Problem solved....

:star: