Only true shutdown CB is....

[big dog cowboy]

I guess it's not TNew........

Time for the hardware
By Cris Carter (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/expertsarchive?author=Cris+Carter), Yahoo! Sports

DEFENSIVE PLAYER OF THE YEAR

This pick will shock a lot of folks because most of the sentiment has been for Miami's Jason Taylor (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/players/3968) or San Diego's Shawne Merriman (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/players/7188). However, I’m going with Denver Broncos (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/teams/den/) cornerback Champ Bailey (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/players/4655).

After an Un-Champ-like season in which he was frequently targeted and beat by opposing offenses, Bailey has adjusted to the NFL rule changes and emphasis (no contact five yards past the line of scrimmage) and gotten back to dominating one half of the field. He is the only true shutdown corner in football.

[theogt]

...and the divorce rate in the US is 50%.

If enough people say something enough times, it is considered a fact.

[AdamJT13]

According to STATS, LLC., that "shutdown" cornerback has allowed more catches AND yards this season than Terence Newman has allowed in ANY season of his career, including his so-called "terrible" season of 2004.

In fact, Bailey has allowed more catches and yards in ALL of Newman's four seasons than Newman has allowed in ANY season.

[the kid 05]

Champ and Newman are the only shutdown corners.

[theogt]

According to STATS, LLC., that "shutdown" cornerback has allowed more catches AND yards this season than Terence Newman has allowed in ANY season of his career, including his so-called "terrible" season of 2004.

In fact, Bailey has allowed more catches and yards in ALL of Newman's four seasons than Newman has allowed in ANY season.Who do I have to knock off to get access to STATS PASS?

[theebs]

There is no such thing as a shut down corner anymore. There have only been two in the history of the league. Sanders and green. People just refused to test them.

In 2006 and beyond this is a game of open spaces. Corners can just hope to stay afloat. There are no shut down corners. You take any corner in this league and put them in man coverage on a decent wr and they will get beat more than thy make a play.

Game in spaces. Used to be a game in the trenches, now it is about wr screens, 5 wr sets, no huddle, pass interference....etc......

No corner can be labeled a shut down corner, because the game today does not allow corners to dominate. On a good day a corner survives, on a bad day they look like, well Deangelo hall versus Terrel owens from two weeks ago or r.w. mcquarters for the past month.

Just my opinion, but since the game is played in open spaces and the rules benefit the wr, there is no such thing as a shut down corner.

howbout a new term, "keeps his head above water" corner. Newman does that well.

[ChldsPlay]

There is no such thing as a shut down corner anymore. There have only been two in the history of the league. Sanders and green. People just refused to test them.

In 2006 and beyond this is a game of open spaces. Corners can just hope to stay afloat. There are no shut down corners. You take any corner in this league and put them in man coverage on a decent wr and they will get beat more than thy make a play.

Game in spaces. Used to be a game in the trenches, now it is about wr screens, 5 wr sets, no huddle, pass interference....etc......

No corner can be labeled a shut down corner, because the game today does not allow corners to dominate. On a good day a corner survives, on a bad day they look like, well Deangelo hall versus Terrel owens from two weeks ago or r.w. mcquarters for the past month.

Just my opinion, but since the game is played in open spaces and the rules benefit the wr, there is no such thing as a shut down corner.

howbout a new term, "keeps his head above water" corner. Newman does that well.

Teams don't test Newman.

[theebs]

Teams don't test Newman.


He is not ignored the way green and sanders were. Teams used to run their whole gameplan around avoiding these guys.

Ever read or hear anything about Darrell Green. Parcells used to instruct simms no matter what dont throw it at Darrel green when they played washington. Simms in his book wrote a few pages about it, saying the one time he did and gree picked him off and scored!!!

I love newman. He is outstanding. Teams dont avoid him like many of us think they do however. The poor safety play on the other side of the field draws alot of attention and henry's inability to run with speed wr attracts throws.

And this has nothing to do with the game in open spaces. I dont care personally who the corner is, pick one, whoever you think is the best, put him against a decent wr in man coverage and he will get beat more than he makes a play. That is just the nature of the game and how they want it right now.

[cowboys19]

Teams don't test Newman.

Hotlanta did

[Rack Bauer]

Thanks to the NFL putting dresses on WRs, there are no Shutdown CBs anymore, and there never will be one again.


But Champ Bailey is the best CB in football, and second isn't close.

[Munchis]

I truly believe that Champ Bailey is the best CB to ever play the game......nothing short of a consumate professional. :bow:

Munchis....Out!!

[ThreeSportStar80]

Yeah and pigs fly so what's the point of this thread, Bailey and Newman are the best CB's in the NFL, move on.

[Cowboys&Caps]

I truly believe that Champ Bailey is the best CB to ever play the game......
..............from the many years of watching him in washington?
.

[cowboys19]

I truly believe that Champ Bailey is the best CB to ever play the game......nothing short of a consumate professional. :bow:

Munchis....Out!!


i hope your joking

[JPM]

i hope your joking

No, just dumb.

[Future]

No, just dumb.

or just trying to insight erroneus responses to something he said...

[Munchis]

We should have signed Ty Law or Charles Woodson during the offseason and moved Henry to FS and we wouldn't be in this position right now.

Newman is solid..but he can't do it alone.

Munchis....Out!!

[Silver Bullet]

I know this is besides the point, but seeing Shawne "The Cheat" Merriman's name being tossed out there for defensive player of the year makes me sick. This guy cheated and in no way, shape or form should he be in the pro-bowl or any other mention for players awards for that matter.

Is it just me or the NFL and analysts alike are turning a blind eye to what this guy did!!!

[Aikbach]

Talking head kudos mean nothing to me, it is amazing how much more efficient I am around the house when i avoid ESPN and SI.Com, I feel so less anxious and stressed about the doom and gloom.

Naturally watching the games are disheartening enough for me so I don't need people to tell me how awful they played and then analyze it at nausium with hyperbole, I don't care about player rankings, accalades or personal lifes, only winning.

[InmanRoshi]

When Irvin and Rice went up against Green and Deion, they still got their typical production.

[md2005]

Newman is very good but NOT great. Great players find a way to make BIG plays in crunch time. No one could argue the fact that TNew doesnt make BIG plays. He is rock solid and by no means is this post critical of him, but to say he is great is a huge reach.

[burmafrd]

DEPENDS on what is important. If giving up TDS to get INTS then TNew is not great. THAT is what virtually every other CB, including Champ, does. TNEW does not give up much of ANYTHING.
TO ME, a CBs FIRST RESPONSIBILITY is to prevent completions. TNew does that better then ANYONE in the NFL.
Now Champ is having a great year- he is scoring and making INTS without giving up TOO MANY TDS himself. I think he is at a PLUS as regards TDs scored on vs scored. I have no problem with him as the #1 CB in the NFL. I would love for him and TNEW to be playing together; the poor QB would probably pick on TNEW since it looks worse to get INTd rather then incompletions.

[Double Trouble]

He is not ignored the way green and sanders were. Teams used to run their whole gameplan around avoiding these guys.

Ever read or hear anything about Darrell Green. Parcells used to instruct simms no matter what dont throw it at Darrel green when they played washington. Simms in his book wrote a few pages about it, saying the one time he did and gree picked him off and scored!!!

I love newman. He is outstanding. Teams dont avoid him like many of us think they do however. The poor safety play on the other side of the field draws alot of attention and henry's inability to run with speed wr attracts throws.

And this has nothing to do with the game in open spaces. I dont care personally who the corner is, pick one, whoever you think is the best, put him against a decent wr in man coverage and he will get beat more than he makes a play. That is just the nature of the game and how they want it right now.Green wasn't ignored. He wasn't in the same universe with Deion.

[FiveTime]

I agree with Rack to a point but it goes both ways. Neither corners nor receivers are allowed to "play" as much as they were in the past. I do think that it affects corners more then recievers.

Michael would have had even more scrutiny on him today than he did then but he was very good at doing what he knew the officials would let go. How many time have you heard him explain how he used his elbow or body to push off and not his hands.

Deion was great; I know that many don't care for him but he played well beyond anyone that I can remember. The only reason Green is brought up in that conversation is because he played well beyond his size and he had a much better image with the average fan. I think that Deion actually got the best of Rice in their matchups. Too bad that he had to blatantly interfere w/ Irvin in the 94 chamionship game to keep Dallas from victory.

The only guy I remember Irvin having a real problem with is the guy (sorry, I should remember the name) from Arizona.

[theebs]

Green wasn't ignored. He wasn't in the same universe with Deion.

I think green was better, just my opinion.

[FiveTime]

...and for Champ; he quietly has, I think, 9 int's. If it wasn't for his last one coming while covering Ocho Cinco he wouldn't be getting as much attention.

[theebs]

When Irvin and Rice went up against Green and Deion, they still got their typical production.

Irvin had some very good games against green. That was atypical though.

As far rice goes, I cant remember off the top of my head how he fared against green, if you say he had good days I believe you.

Having said that I still think those are the two best corners ever.

Everyone loves to put deion on this pedestal? Anyone care to remember what irvin did to sanders when he was in atlanta?

I have a video clip I will upload tonight when I get home from the stadium, of Dallas abusing the great sanders.

Oh and saying rice and irvin, the best and one of the other best to ever play the position against green and sanders really doesnt disspell what I am trying to say. All four of those guys were great.

[Jarv]

I look at shutdown corners guys that play man to man defense and stop the guy they are covering doesn't catch a lot of balls or score.

TNew is stuck in the "cover 2" zone a lot of the time, he must hate it. He covers a WR off the line, then pass's him off to a middle or deep zone and watch the guy make a big catch.

I always liked man to man defense, Adam...Do you know the ratio of our defense's man coverage vs. zone coverage ? How about Denvers ?

Do CB's in man coverage get more chances for INT's than Zone CB's ?

[FiveTime]

Theebs, you a correct in saying that it is unfair to judge those guys vs Rice and Irvin. Please post a link to the Irvin-Deion video; I would love to watch it.

Who was the highly touted corner from GreenBay that Irvin made his ****** time after time in the playoffs?

I don't know that Green faced Rice enough to have a good judgement. Irvin vs Green and Rice vs Deion was a more frequent occurence.

[theebs]

Theebs, you a correct in saying that it is unfair to judge those guys vs Rice and Irvin. Please post a link to the Irvin-Deion video; I would love to watch it.

Who was the highly touted corner from GreenBay that Irvin made his ****** time after time in the playoffs?

I don't know that Green faced Rice enough to have a good judgement. Irvin vs Green and Rice vs Deion was a more frequent occurence.

I will put the link up when I get home!!!


Are you thinking of terrell buckeley? He was small and not near as good as green or sanders.

[FiveTime]

Ahh yes, I think it was Buckley. I didn't mean to infer that he was in the league of Sanders or Green, just an example of a highly touted guy (that was not very good early but came back to be pretty decent) that struggled with the caliber of Irvin or Rice.

OK, who was the corner from Arizona that gave Irvin problems?

[Sarge]

Thanks to the NFL putting dresses on WRs, there are no Shutdown CBs anymore, and there never will be one again..

We have a winner here.

[Vtwin]

The only guy I remember Irvin having a real problem with is the guy (sorry, I should remember the name) from Arizona.

Aneas Williams. (Probably spelled the first name wrong).

He did give Irvin a good game every time. If he played on any other team but the Cardinals he would be mentioned with Green and Sanders too.

[MarkBrunell]

Champ Bailey was Quincy Carters *****. You can't call Champ the best CB ever.

That title belongs to Darrell Green or Deion Sanders.

[burmafrd]

Bet you guys wish you had kept Bailey now.

[FiveTime]

Vtwin, thanks, that was driving me crazy this morning.

Too many beers last night is affecting my memory this morning:D

[Sarge]

Too many beers last night is affecting my memory this morning:D

Rookie...................... ;)

Ah, the days of me and Booze going beer for beer.

Memorieeeeeeeeeeeeees............

[FiveTime]

Unfortunately, I think I have achieved professional status in that category:cool: