Mort on the Patriots situation...

[trickblue]

I heard Mort on Mike & Mike while driving into work this morning. Here are some of the highlights...


The league informed the Pats that they will begin a review of their video program. It is really an investigation but the NFL doesn't like to use the word "investigation".
I spoke with a half a dozen teams last night. A couple said the penalty was steep. The rest said it wasn't enough.
I spoke with an unnamed Detroit player last night. He said that last year they were moving the ball really well on New England when the headsets went out and it killed the drive. He said it happened again on a drive later.
Marvin Lewis said that the headsets have gone out on him before when they were driving the ball.
Jack Del Rio said the headsets went out on them when they were playing NE in the playoffs.
Many teams have resorted to bringing their own hard-wire headsets when they play at NE.
Several have said that the Pats do mic up their defensive lineman during games. The Pats don't deny it and claim that it's an interactive module they run on their website.
The NFL has had anonymous reports of multiple frequencies being used by the Pats to intercept opponents communications.
Teams were getting really aggravated with the Pats placing a camera man on their sideline during games and video-taping their play calling. The fact that it was so blatant was really causing a lot of grumbling among teams.
Bellichick's obsession with winning has a lot to do with their current situation; and they've won alot. I'm not sure they wouldn't have won anyway, but he wants to take advantage of anything he can.
There are a lot of people out there saying everyone does it. Everyone doesn't do it. Tell Tony Dungy that he does it.
Signal stealing is one thing, blatantly videotaping your opponent is another. I'm sure that other teams do/have done it, but it's only a handful if they do.
I don't think the we've heard the last of this from the NFL offices.

[SultanOfSix]

I'm sure that other teams do/have done it, but it's only a handful if they do.

I've heard many media people state this, and some fans use this notion as a rationalization to diminish what the Pats did (as if it does), but I have yet to hear one media person or fan suggest who are the other (handful or not) teams who have done this.

The rumblings about the Pats doing this has gone on for a few or more years. I have not heard such rumblings for any other team.

[joseephuss]

Thanks, TB. Maybe a suspension will come down the line after they get more information. Maybe right about playoff time.

How would they stop teams from putting microphones on defensive players? It does happen all the time. Maybe the intention is not to steal signs, but it could be dual purpose. I know when I have seen the Dallas Cowboys Weekly show or whatever it is called now, they usually have a player mic'ed up for the game. Any team could use that premise to get the mic out there and then take advantage of it's use. They would just have to ban all use on players.

[dbair1967]

only Belichick and the Pats really know what advantage they've got from it, but obviously it must give them some edge or they wouldnt keep doing it after being instructed not to

I really think their super bowl wins are tainted big time...they clearly were not better than the Rams team they beat and it was debateable whether they were better than Philly..they were obviously the better team when they played Carolina, but they managed each win by only 3pts...the argument can easily be made that they probably wouldnt have won those games (if they were doing this at the time, which is likely)

David

[CrazyCowboy]

Hope we do not do this.......if we did, we stunk at that also since 1995

[DallasEast]

only Belichick and the Pats really know what advantage they've got from it, but obviously it must give them some edge or they wouldnt keep doing it after being instructed not to

I really think their super bowl wins are tainted big time...they clearly were not better than the Rams team they beat and it was debateable whether they were better than Philly..they were obviously the better team when they played Carolina, but they managed each win by only 3pts...the argument can easily be made that they probably wouldnt have won those games (if they were doing this at the time, which is likely)

David
Good point. Obviously, the Patriots fielded very, very good teams each year they won the Super Bowl, but what if they had a slight advantage in playcalling over the Rams, Eagles and Panthers in each game? The difference in a field goal attempt could have been due to an extra third down conversation which may not have possible without stealing a defensive playcall...

[dmq]

My view of the Patriots dynasty has forever been tainted. Somewhere Peter King is crying.

[DallasEast]

The respective franchises...

Dallas Cowboys
1992 season - "We killed the Bills!"
1993 season - "The Bills ain't got nothing on us!"
1994 season - "Miscues and bad calls were barely enough to keep us out of the Super Bowl!"
1995 season - "We can even win with Switzer!"

New England Patriots
2001 season - "Hi, I'm Adam Vinatieri! Glad I got into position for this game winning kick!"
2002 season - ~ The Pats are experiencing technical difficulties. Please stand by... ~
2003 season - "Hi, I'm Adam Vinatieri! Glad I got into position for this game winning kick!"
2004 season - "Hi, I'm Adam Vinatieri! Glad I got into position for this game winning kick!"


.

[Hostile]

The respective franchises...

Dallas Cowboys
1992 season - "We killed the Bills!"
1993 season - "The Bills ain't got nothing on us!"
1994 season - "Miscues and bad calls were barely enough to keep us out of the Super Bowl!"
1995 season - "We can even win with Switzer!"

New England Patriots
2001 season - "Hi, I'm Adam Vinatieri! Glad I got into position for this game winning kick!"
2002 season - ~ The Pats are experiencing technical difficulties. Please stand by... ~
2003 season - "Hi, I'm Adam Vinatieri! Glad I got into position for this game winning kick!"
2004 season - "Hi, I'm Adam Vinatieri! Glad I got into position for this game winning kick!"


.:bow: :lmao2:

[Hypnotoad]

The disrupting of electrical signals on the offensive side of the ball is something completely different than stealing defensive signals. I wonder how many times the patriots defense was miraculously bailed out this way. If Mort found 3 people from 3 different teams whose communications went out while driving the ball, I wonder how many total there are.

And 2 of those happening in the playoffs basically confirms their wins are tainted.

[lurkercowboy]

When you consider how close those Patriot super bowl wins were, it stands to reason that any little advantage gained by these illegal things made a difference.

[adbutcher]

Coming from Mort this is HUGE because we know how ESPN feels about their beloved Patricheats! Also, once you are labeled a cheater it becomes very hard to shake that image.

We all know that karma is ****** and it will do the heart good to see them loose a couple of their next games. It probably won't happen because they are so talented but who knows how good Belicheat / Patricheats are without cheating. I hope they get kicked in the chomps this Sunday!

[Cowboys22]

only Belichick and the Pats really know what advantage they've got from it, but obviously it must give them some edge or they wouldnt keep doing it after being instructed not to

I really think their super bowl wins are tainted big time...they clearly were not better than the Rams team they beat and it was debateable whether they were better than Philly..they were obviously the better team when they played Carolina, but they managed each win by only 3pts...the argument can easily be made that they probably wouldnt have won those games (if they were doing this at the time, which is likely)

David

I don't see how you can say they were clearly better than any team. For all we know, they would have always been just an average team without cheating. They appear to be a good team with good players but those players may just be average if not given the advantage they have had. I continue to say that if you look at the past 5-6 years, the Patriots have a tendency to pull away from teams in the second halfs of games after a pretty even first half. I expect they will be soo closely watched that they will no longer be able to do this so we will see how they play from here on out. If they struggle more than before, we will know for sure they have been cheating all along.

[BARRYRAY]

This is a topic I would like to morph a little, last year when we played the Saints I would have bet the farm they were getting our plays/signals, it was like they were right there for everything and everything they ran worked, I know that their coach obviously knew alot about us, but it was too perfect. I will always believe that, can't prove it. I hope they fry these guys, it taints the game, personally if they prove anymore of this how about suspending the coach for a year and some more penalty against the team. This was intentional and well planned and goes beyond just one signal or one play..

[Nors]

I've heard many media people state this, and some fans use this notion as a rationalization to diminish what the Pats did (as if it does), but I have yet to hear one media person or fan suggest who are the other (handful or not) teams who have done this.

The rumblings about the Pats doing this has gone on for a few or more years. I have not heard such rumblings for any other team.

Nick Saban
Tom Coughlin

Jack Del Rio said stealing signs is prevalent in NFL

The radio accusations are far more damning to me. They prove that I suspend Pioli and BB for a year, maybe more.

[DanTanna]

I heard on ESPN that the exact same camera man was escorted out of the Packers stadium for illegal video taping them when the Pats were there. This ain't a one time deal.

[BBQ101]

Marvin Lewis said that the headsets have gone out on him before when they were driving the ball.
Jack Del Rio said the headsets went out on them when they were playing NE in the playoffs.
Many teams have resorted to bringing their own hard-wire headsets when they play at NE.


Shouldn't the equipment that is used to communicate between qb and coach be controlled by the NFL? I don't begin to state that I understand how all the electronics are setup, but I get the impression that the home team get some control over the setup. This just seems stupid to me.

They changed the rule and now have a new official that oversees the kicking balls throughout the game. This seems like something that should be completely controlled by the NFL with no knowledge of the inner workings divulged to the teams. Just give them their headsets and helmets with speakers and thats it.

If the Pats are able to jam signals and bring other teams communications down at will, that is complete BS. Talk about being able to derail an offense. From the sound of it, the Pats had ways of gaining unfair advantage against the opponents defeense (signal stealing) and offence (electronics jamming).

Jamming signals really is even worse that stealing signals in my opinion. If this is proven, then I want blood!

BBQ

[CaptainAmerica]

Here is what I found interesting about Belichik's comments today. He said they don't use the information in that game. Basically admitting the information secretly and wrongfully gathered is used for future reference.

With that comment in mind I thought back to the Pats/Rams SB and remembered that the Patriots played the Rams in the regular season that year and the Rams won. Of course in the SB, the Patriots made the "defensive adjustments" that allowed them to basically shut down the Rams offense. The media, of course, gave all the credit for that great defensive effort to the Great Belichik.

Is there any doubt Belichik took recorded information from that first game and used it to his advantage in the SB?

[Chocolate Lab]

My view of the Patriots dynasty has forever been tainted. Somewhere Peter King is denying.

Fixed. ;)

It's pathetic that teams had to bring their own hardwired headsets to games. That's just ridiculous that the home team can't be trusted to not sabotage the opposition. This is something you might hear about a lower-level college program, not the National Football League.

I can only hope that the media hammer away on this all year long and don't diminish the seriousness of all this. :mad:

[Royal Laegotti]

My view of the Patriots dynasty has forever been tainted. Somewhere Peter King is crying.


I wish that'd be everyone's view from now on but I have a bad feeling that 2 months from now no one will remember this, especially it the Patties keep on winning.:(

[numnuts23]

http://www.nydailynews.com/img/2007/09/13/alg_spy-vs-spy.jpg

[Royal Laegotti]

http://www.nydailynews.com/img/2007/09/13/alg_spy-vs-spy.jpg



:laugh2:
I think that's the best clothing I've seen Belicheat wear!

[zeromaster]

Shouldn't the equipment that is used to communicate between qb and coach be controlled by the NFL? I don't begin to state that I understand how all the electronics are setup, but I get the impression that the home team get some control over the setup. This just seems stupid to me.

They changed the rule and now have a new official that oversees the kicking balls throughout the game. This seems like something that should be completely controlled by the NFL with no knowledge of the inner workings divulged to the teams. Just give them their headsets and helmets with speakers and thats it.

If the Pats are able to jam signals and bring other teams communications down at will, that is complete BS. Talk about being able to derail an offense. From the sound of it, the Pats had ways of gaining unfair advantage against the opponents defeense (signal stealing) and offence (electronics jamming).

Jamming signals really is even worse that stealing signals in my opinion. If this is proven, then I want blood!

BBQ
Maybe this guy can help you out...
http://wirelessdigest.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/sesame_street_count_dracula.jpg

[adbutcher]

http://www.nydailynews.com/img/2007/09/13/alg_spy-vs-spy.jpg

:lmao2: :bow:

[REDVOLUTION]

The respective franchises...

Dallas Cowboys
1992 season - "We killed the Bills!"
1993 season - "The Bills ain't got nothing on us!"
1994 season - "Miscues and bad calls were barely enough to keep us out of the Super Bowl!"
1995 season - "We can even win with Switzer!"

New England Patriots
2001 season - "Hi, I'm Adam Vinatieri! Glad I got into position for this game winning kick!"
2002 season - ~ The Pats are experiencing technical difficulties. Please stand by... ~
2003 season - "Hi, I'm Adam Vinatieri! Glad I got into position for this game winning kick!"
2004 season - "Hi, I'm Adam Vinatieri! Glad I got into position for this game winning kick!"
.

Nice.

I get over most everything in life. I still get angry about 1994.
2002. Very clever.
:lmao2:

[Eddie]

When home teams would open and close wind tunnels during FG's ... does that count as cheating?

I remember distinctly how teams would complain about playing in Detroit, and how the home team would control the opening and closing of wind tunnels during FG attempts.

[jimnabby]

Here is what I found interesting about Belichik's comments today. He said they don't use the information in that game. Basically admitting the information secretly and wrongfully gathered is used for future reference.

With that comment in mind I thought back to the Pats/Rams SB and remembered that the Patriots played the Rams in the regular season that year and the Rams won. Of course in the SB, the Patriots made the "defensive adjustments" that allowed them to basically shut down the Rams offense. The media, of course, gave all the credit for that great defensive effort to the Great Belichik.

Is there any doubt Belichik took recorded information from that first game and used it to his advantage in the SB?

Uh, yes, there is doubt. Their recordings tell them about the other team's DEFENSIVE signals, which should allow them to make OFFENSIVE adjustments. He probably did use recorded information to his advantage, but not on that side of the ball.

[L-O-Jete]

When home teams would open and close wind tunnels during FG's ... does that count as cheating?

I remember distinctly how teams would complain about playing in Detroit, and how the home team would control the opening and closing of wind tunnels during FG attempts.

The Gints do this too. Who can forget the snowplow coming in for the GW field goal...

[REDVOLUTION]

Here is what I found interesting about Belichik's comments today. He said they don't use the information in that game. Basically admitting the information secretly and wrongfully gathered is used for future reference.

With that comment in mind I thought back to the Pats/Rams SB and remembered that the Patriots played the Rams in the regular season that year and the Rams won. Of course in the SB, the Patriots made the "defensive adjustments" that allowed them to basically shut down the Rams offense. The media, of course, gave all the credit for that great defensive effort to the Great Belichik.

Is there any doubt Belichik took recorded information from that first game and used it to his advantage in the SB?

I am not buying that he didnt use it in same game. Teams could change things up for second meeting and Bullicheat would have nothing.

He is trying not to diminish Sunday's win. Damage control.

[Doomsday]

I heard Mort on Mike & Mike while driving into work this morning. Here are some of the highlights...


Many teams have resorted to bringing their own hard-wire headsets when they play at NE.


That statement right there tells it all. Seems like everyone in the league knew the Pats have been cheating, they just finally caught em. Its one thing to try to read lips etc. its entirely different to sabotage youre opponents equipment and to go to the lengths they went to steal signals. If they doing that it wouldnt be too shocking if they were bugging thier opponents locker room as well.

[utrunner07]

If all of what he said is true or even 1/4 of it, this better not be the last we hear of it. If that stuff is true Belicheck should be kicked out of the league the superbowls should be given away, and they should have to fire their entire coaching staff, maybe even forfeit the season. I thought that the penalty they recieved was almost fair, maybe a 1 or 2 game suspension would have made it fair, but now that all of this is coming out...its a joke of a penality...

kick belichech out...

[TunaFan33]

Here's my take on Goodell's ruling:

Yes, Belicheat has finally been exposed-However, with the punishment being KINDA LIGHT, I'm wondering if OTHER teams have been cheating in this same magnitude as well(i.e. Pitt in '05).

Seriously, if it ever comes out that MANY teams are doing this(or heck, if the refs are involved), it could seriously DAMAGE the credibility of the entire NFL.

As for Belichick-we should have KNOWN something was fishy in NE-for one, he proved in Cleveland he, like Norv Turner, is a coordinator, NOT an HC. Pt being you are who you are-you just don't go from being a ****** coach to being a Lombardi type overnight.

[jazzcat22]

Hope we do not do this.......if we did, we stunk at that also since 1995

That's because Rowdy was in charge of it....:lmao2: