Bob Sturm relays argument against Charles Haley for HOF

[WoodysGirl]

Bob Sturm ‏@SportsSturm
Most stunning C Haley talking point on HOF: 3rd in sacks on Dal in 92 (6) and 93 (4). 10 sacks and behind Tolbert and Jeffcoat hurts case.

I think Haley belongs in, just repeating one voter's reasoning in being a bit hesitant to make sure he gets the right 5 in this year.

[erod]

No other player has five Super Bowl rings, and he played a big role in all five of them.

That said, he was a first-grade jerk, and in a year like this with so many deserving players, I'd bet he gets bumped back another year.

[InmanRoshi]

Another great example as to why we need better and more descriptive analytic measures than sacks for pass rushers. It's about like Wins for pitchers or RBIs for hitters.

[Manwiththeplan]

Originally Posted by InmanRoshi

Another great example as to why we need better and more descriptive analytic measures than sacks for pass rushers. It's about like Wins for pitchers or RBIs for hitters.

No, that would cause posters to acknowledge this wasn't Spencer's first good season, so scratch that idea

[Idgit]

I loved the Haley acquisition at the time. But it's another case for me where its teams that win Superbowls and not individuals. The fact that he's won 5 on 5 different teams doesn't mean much to me. Nor does the fact that Allen only had one.

I put Haley's contribution at about the order of players like Woodson and Novacek...very, very important to those teams, and without them we would not have won the big games, but I don't think they're HoF-worthy (with the possible exception of Woody). They (Haley and Woody) deserve the honor of consideration, but they'd fall just short in my book.

[SultanOfSix]

Originally Posted by Idgit

IThe fact that he's won 5 on 5 different teams doesn't mean much to me.

Five on two different teams.

[Zordon]

Sturm is an idiot who didn't start following football until the NHL went bankrupt.

[joseephuss]

Originally Posted by Zordon

Sturm is an idiot who didn't start following football until the NHL went bankrupt.

So you don't agree with Sturm that he thinks Haley is deserving of the HOF?

[Future]

Originally Posted by erod

No other player has five Super Bowl rings, and he played a big role in all five of them.

That said, he was a first-grade jerk, and in a year like this with so many deserving players, I'd bet he gets bumped back another year.

Agreed.

Masturbation habits and being a poor teammate aside, the guy was a nightmare for opposing offenses and has more Super Bowl rings than anyone. He'll get in.

[jbz64]

Originally Posted by WoodysGirl

Bob Sturm ‏@SportsSturm
Most stunning C Haley talking point on HOF: 3rd in sacks on Dal in 92 (6) and 93 (4). 10 sacks and behind Tolbert and Jeffcoat hurts case.

I think Haley belongs in, just repeating one voter's reasoning in being a bit hesitant to make sure he gets the right 5 in this year.

They have to remember that Jeffcoat and Tolbert did not get double or triple teamed like Haley. I believe Haley took us over the hump to become what the Cowboys became in the 90's.

[Wood]

Originally Posted by WoodysGirl

Bob Sturm ‏@SportsSturm
Most stunning C Haley talking point on HOF: 3rd in sacks on Dal in 92 (6) and 93 (4). 10 sacks and behind Tolbert and Jeffcoat hurts case.

I think Haley belongs in, just repeating one voter's reasoning in being a bit hesitant to make sure he gets the right 5 in this year.

Haley was the best I ever saw in Dallas and second best (behind Reggie White) all time. Throw stats out...this guy was terror.

[DrKennethNoisewater]

Haley is deserving, unfortunately this class will be a tough one for him to get in. Ogden, Allen, Parcells, Debartolo, Modell, Strahan, Shields, Brown, Carter, and a few others will keep him out this year.

[Super_Kazuya]

Put me in the group that has Haley just on the outside of the HOF. People either forget or just aren't old enough to know, but when Haley came here he was in no way thought of someone who was Hall of Fame caliber... he was an extremely talented head case, a dominant pass rusher who was okay at best against the run. He did have that breakout season in 1990 (the kind that you would expect to see about 8 more of from a HOF DE, at least in my HOF) but other than that had been good to very good. Then he leaves one team of the decade for the team of the next decade and apparently has "won" his way into the Hall.

Definitely not gonna be upset if he makes it; but he just doesn't pass the smell test to me. Also, his 5 Pro Bowls and 2 All-Pros seem low to me (Reggie White had 13 and 8, for an admittedly lofty comparison, but still the best of the best is what we're talking about here).

[InmanRoshi]

Originally Posted by Super_Kazuya

Put me in the group that has Haley just on the outside of the HOF. People either forget or just aren't old enough to know, but when Haley came here he was in no way thought of someone who was Hall of Fame caliber... he was an extremely talented head case, a dominant pass rusher who was okay at best against the run. He did have that breakout season in 1990 (the kind that you would expect to see about 8 more of from a HOF DE, at least in my HOF) but other than that had been good to very good. Then he leaves one team of the decade for the team of the next decade and apparently has "won" his way into the Hall.

Definitely not gonna be upset if he makes it; but he just doesn't pass the smell test to me. Also, his 5 Pro Bowls and 2 All-Pros seem low to me (Reggie White had 13 and 8, for an admittedly lofty comparison, but still the best of the best is what we're talking about here).

I definitely agree he's not in the no-brainer category, but I think he's pretty comparable to Richard Dent who got in. Mostly I think he's held out because sports writers want to punish him for not "playing ball" with them, and I absolutely abhor the way sports journalists over-inflate their importance to sports and use Hall of Fame nominations to grind personal vendettas.

[burmafrd]

Originally Posted by InmanRoshi

I definitely agree he's not in the no-brainer category, but I think he's pretty comparable to Richard Dent who got in. Mostly I think he's held out because sports writers want to punish him for not "playing ball" with them, and I absolutely abhor the way sports journalists over-inflate their importance to sports and use Hall of Fame nominations to grind personal vendettas.

as far as I am concerned the only people who should vote on the HOF should be PRESENT members of the HOF.

30 years ago I would not have felt this way. Now 99% of the sportswriters are garbage.

I absolutely believe that some of the choices of the last 10 years (Warren Moon for example) got in and should NOT have because of thing besides how good they were as players. And Haley and some others are not in BECAUSE they gave the current vermin incrusted POS mediots what they deserve.