Who would be on the Short List for Texas? - Page 3 - Dallas Cowboys Forum

MC KAos · 12-13-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cythim

Did Mack Brown have ties in Texas before becoming the head coach? It looks like he spent most of his time in the ACC area before being hired at UT. I don't think a coach at UT needs ties in the state to recruit, kids want to go there because of the program. I don't think someone being a "Big 10 guy" means anything when looking for a HC for UT. Get back to playing good football any UT has the pick of the state. Taking a Big 10 guy actually might help in nabbing guys from the Ohio area as well.

he was a TE coach under Barry Switzer at OU, i bet he recruited in Texas plenty in his days there

edit: he was the OC, not TE coach.

MC KAos · 12-13-2012

but to your point cythim, i dont think it ultimately matters if the next coach has experience recruiting this area or not

**ABQCOWBOY** · 12-13-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cythim

Did Mack Brown have ties in Texas before becoming the head coach? It looks like he spent most of his time in the ACC area before being hired at UT. I don't think a coach at UT needs ties in the state to recruit, kids want to go there because of the program. I don't think someone being a "Big 10 guy" means anything when looking for a HC for UT. Get back to playing good football any UT has the pick of the state. Taking a Big 10 guy actually might help in nabbing guys from the Ohio area as well.

Yes, he had ties back to Texas with both LSU and OU from the old SW Conference but when he came over to Texas, the situation was much different. He replaced Fred Akers, Dave McWilliams and John Mackovic and the famous Route 66 game. This coach will be replacing, Mack Brown, a guy who will not be fired but instead, will step down if he does leave. That's a very different situation and I do not believe that you can bring in a Big 10 guy to Texas and see success immediately. The expectations are going to be vastly different for the replacement of Mack Brown.

We are already bleeding to ATM and OU. We can't, IMO, afford to allow a guy to come in and take two years to get the recruiting developed. I do not believe that anybody at Texas can just come in and get whomever they want. That, IMO, is what has gotten this program into trouble. That's an attitude of superiority and it's not that easy. HS coaches work with College Coaches they like. I would not expect a Coach who has never had any experience in Texas come in and have the kind of recruiting success Texas is accustomed to. That, IMO, is a disaster waiting to happen. The Fans will not be patient and that coach will fail because of it. It will mean another 2 or 3 years before a new coach is brought in and the program would have to start rebuilding then. The other side of that equation is that no Coach, IMO, who is a high profile guy would come in to Texas expecting to recruit well if they have no relationships here. If you can't recruit, you are not going to be interested in taking the job because if you fail, you then jeopardize your career and if you fail at Texas, where do you go from there and what kind of coaching job can you expect?

I don't agree with anybody who thinks that it would not make a difference. JMO

MC KAos · 12-13-2012

i kind of think mack brown will eventually replace deloss dodds as AD, maybe thats why mack has his full support, he doesnt want to give up that position yet. i wish HE would retire and mack got that job, mack is a super solid human being so i think he would be great running our athletic department, and recruits would know he is still around. as ive said before, id love a super high profile guy, but if not, id be happy with someone like josh mcdaniels.

Chocolate Lab · 12-13-2012

ABQ, why in the world do you keep saying Briles doesn't fit Texas? He couldn't be more Texan.

**ABQCOWBOY** · 12-13-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chocolate Lab

ABQ, why in the world do you keep saying Briles doesn't fit Texas? He couldn't be more Texan.

From a coaching standpoint, his teams are not great defensively. Excellent offensively but not so much defensively. Texas doesn't want that.

From the standpoint of what Texas wants the face of the University to be that representing them, they want a polished guy who appeals to academia and who can continue to show up at sponsored events and draw huge donations. I don't see Briles as that guy or should I say, I don't believe that in the eyes of UT, they see that guy in Briles. Texas is in the business of making money, and Texas Football is at the very top of the revenue stream for Texas. The guy who replaces Mack is going to have to be able to keep the machine going. He's going to have to be able to excite the fan base and Art Briles, while a very good coach, does not strike me as that guy. I don't believe Texas would see him in that light either. Nothing against Briles. Probably more to say about the attitudes of Texas to be perfectly frank.

This is all opinion of course.

Cythim · 12-13-2012

One year at OU and LSU don't give a guy ties to the state. Mack Brown was much more of an SEC/ACC guy.

Chocolate Lab · 12-13-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

From a coaching standpoint, his teams are not great defensively. Excellent offensively but not so much defensively. Texas doesn't want that.

From the standpoint of what Texas wants the face of the University to be that representing them, they want a polished guy who appeals to academia and who can continue to show up at sponsored events and draw huge donations. I don't see Briles as that guy or should I say, I don't believe that in the eyes of UT, they see that guy in Briles. Texas is in the business of making money, and Texas Football is at the very top of the revenue stream for Texas. The guy who replaces Mack is going to have to be able to keep the machine going. He's going to have to be able to excite the fan base and Art Briles, while a very good coach, does not strike me as that guy. I don't believe Texas would see him in that light either. Nothing against Briles. Probably more to say about the attitudes of Texas to be perfectly frank.

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Hmm, okay... Well, I've never head Briles was abrasive or wasn't big on doing the fundraising thing, like say a Mike Leach or a Gary Patterson. But maybe you're right.

As far as defense goes, it's hard to have great defenses as Houston or Baylor. He'd have a lot better talent at Texas. And as good an offensive coach as he is, I'd think you could get by with scoring 50 a week and letting other teams try to match you for a couple years until the D got up to speed.

I just think he's one heck of a coach, and I know Galloway has said that UT is one of the few places he'd move to from Baylor. (Texas Tech was the other, but the timing was never right on that.)

**ABQCOWBOY** · 12-13-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cythim

One year at OU and LSU don't give a guy ties to the state. Mack Brown was much more of an SEC/ACC guy.

Gives you a heck of a lot more then none at all. He was the OC under Barry Switzer, probably the best recruiter in the history of the game. You don't think that Mack Brown didn't have an edge over a guy who has never worked the SW in recruiting?

Your kidding yourself if you don't think that Mack Brown didn't have serious in roads into recruiting Texas when he first came to UT.

Fact is, this whole statement from you, a ATM guy rings pretty hollow. As I recall, when ATM was looking for a HC, one of the big things about Sumlin I heard from all of you Aggie fans was the fact that he was the best young recruiter in the College Ranks. Now, "It's no big deal if he's a Big 10 guy and has no history recruiting Texas!"

You will forgive me if I don't pay much attention to this line of thinking.

**ABQCOWBOY** · 12-13-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chocolate Lab

Hmm, okay... Well, I've never head Briles was abrasive or wasn't big on doing the fundraising thing, like say a Mike Leach or a Gary Patterson. But maybe you're right.

As far as defense goes, it's hard to have great defenses as Houston or Baylor. He'd have a lot better talent at Texas. And as good an offensive coach as he is, I'd think you could get by with scoring 50 a week and letting other teams try to match you for a couple years until the D got up to speed.

I just think he's one heck of a coach, and I know Galloway has said that UT is one of the few places he'd move to from Baylor. (Texas Tech was the other, but the timing was never right on that.)

I don't think he's abrasive, per say. I just don't think that this is the side of the job that appeals to him. I believe that what Texas would want is a CEO type, for lack of a better description. Now, you have to also consider the fact that this may be part of the problem at Texas. The HC job is becoming less and less about football and more and more about running a successful business. I don't really think that's a good thing but it is how it is right now at Texas.

I do agree with you that Briles is a heck of a good coach. However, you gotta be able to do more then just score because the expectation at Texas is to win NCs and that means beat the SEC and OU on a consistent basis. I believe that scoring 50 on most teams in the country is enough to win but, I don't believe that if you are a team that can score 50 but can't stop anybody, you can beat OU or SEC teams consistently. You gotta be able to do both IMO or you won't be successful at Texas long term.

If it were just a matter of the Defense, then I'd say that he could be a guy but I think it's more then that. I just think that both combined would be reasons Texas would not be interested. JMO

jterrell · 12-13-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

Jerry Gray would be a guy that I would love to see Texas consider but I am not sure that they would. I really like Gray.

Gray can't even seem to get the Tech DC job brother. He has zero shot at UT Head Coach.

UT will hire whoever the big money guys want. And those same big money guys will pay for it. BIG. They can land just about any coach in the country because you can guarantee they'll make whomever they hire the highest paid guy in the country. Their boosters would consider it kmart shopping not to.

Les Miles would be my 1st guess. All that Hebert hate is a good excuse to take an even better job. They'll call Saban though that is for sure. They'll either get him or get him a raise.

Might be an outside shot they'd pursue Art Briles or Gary Patterson. Both guys they can simply money whip and weaken conf opponents with.

jterrell · 12-13-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

I don't think he's abrasive, per say. I just don't think that this is the side of the job that appeals to him. I believe that what Texas would want is a CEO type, for lack of a better description. Now, you have to also consider the fact that this may be part of the problem at Texas. The HC job is becoming less and less about football and more and more about running a successful business. I don't really think that's a good thing but it is how it is right now at Texas.

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Art Briles would win about 2 games a year more than Mack Brown.

I could coach UT to 8 wins a year. You get all that talent and it isn't really complicated.

Whoever comes in has to win and in order ot do that they'll need to focus on playing actual football. The boosters will buy that for a while at least.

jterrell · 12-13-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chocolate Lab

Hmm, okay... Well, I've never head Briles was abrasive or wasn't big on doing the fundraising thing, like say a Mike Leach or a Gary Patterson. But maybe you're right.

As far as defense goes, it's hard to have great defenses as Houston or Baylor. He'd have a lot better talent at Texas. And as good an offensive coach as he is, I'd think you could get by with scoring 50 a week and letting other teams try to match you for a couple years until the D got up to speed.

I just think he's one heck of a coach, and I know Galloway has said that UT is one of the few places he'd move to from Baylor. (Texas Tech was the other, but the timing was never right on that.)

Tech boosters raised the 4m for Briles buyout but it was going to be a tough sell for Briles to leave the kids he has recruited to re-build... and KK was too good a get to pass up.

**ABQCOWBOY** · 12-13-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by jterrell

Gray can't even seem to get the Tech DC job brother. He has zero shot at UT Head Coach.

UT will hire whoever the big money guys want. And those same big money guys will pay for it. BIG. They can land just about any coach in the country because you can guarantee they'll make whomever they hire the highest paid guy in the country. Their boosters would consider it kmart shopping not to.

Les Miles would be my 1st guess. All that Hebert hate is a good excuse to take an even better job. They'll call Saban though that is for sure. They'll either get him or get him a raise.

Might be an outside shot they'd pursue Art Briles or Gary Patterson. Both guys they can simply money whip and weaken conf opponents with.

Hey, I agree with you on Gray. I like the guy but I doubt he's in the running. As I said earlier, I think Texas would be better served to hire Gray, if they could, as the DC and just keep Mack on for a few more years. When the time comes, then Gray would be in a much better position to become HC. That, to me, would be the best solution all around but nobody pays me squat to make football decisions so, you know, I got that going for me.

The rest I agree with you on except Briles and Patterson. Weakening Conference opponents is not a bad idea but the problem is that Texas wants the Big 12 to be strong because that helps their case where money is concerned. Texas wants the Big 12 to rival the SEC so while I do agree with you that it would help weaken the opposition, I'm not entirely sure that Texas would value that. If they were to hire either one of those guys, I have to believe that it would be because they seriously wanted them and felt like they were the best candidate they could get. Not sure this is what Texas thinks thou.

Cythim · 12-13-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

Gives you a heck of a lot more then none at all. He was the OC under Barry Switzer, probably the best recruiter in the history of the game. You don't think that Mack Brown didn't have an edge over a guy who has never worked the SW in recruiting?

Your kidding yourself if you don't think that Mack Brown didn't have serious in roads into recruiting Texas when he first came to UT.

Fact is, this whole statement from you, a ATM guy rings pretty hollow. As I recall, when ATM was looking for a HC, one of the big things about Sumlin I heard from all of you Aggie fans was the fact that he was the best young recruiter in the College Ranks. Now, "It's no big deal if he's a Big 10 guy and has no history recruiting Texas!"

You will forgive me if I don't pay much attention to this line of thinking.

Mack Brown has an edge because he is a great recruiter, not because of some misconception that he had ties in Texas. His ability as a recruiter and the fact that he was recruiting for Texas were far more important than two years as a coordinator at nearby schools.

Your statement about A&M makes absolutely no sense. What does Sumlin being "the best young recruiter int he College Ranks" have to do with conference ties and recruiting in Texas? Sumlin isn't Art Briles with tons of Texas high school connections, he is a guy who knows how to get high school kids excited about his program. Sumlin could be the same outstanding recruiter in Oregon or Michigan. The need for a strong recruiter is also highly important to A&M because they needed to pull kids away from Texas and OU. Texas will always have their recruits, so long as the program stays relevant. Bring in a guy like Dantonio or Kelly who can win with 3-star talent and recruiting for Texas will be just fine.

You dismissed a great recruiter because he cannot coach defense and you dismissed great defensive coaches because they have no recruitment ties. At some point Texas will have to make a decision and they likely won't be able to get everything they want in one guy.