John Garrett going to the bucs***merged*** - Page 6 - Dallas Cowboys Forum

newlander · 01-20-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by RamziD

I know Tim struggled mightily at Minnesota but it's hard to win there: does he have any inroads with the staff or mgmt. here? Curious about

http://http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_Brewster

He played TE and coached TEs both at the college and NFL record. He's someone the players would respect. I know UT fans have been wanting him back in some capacity for years.

....he looks solid. Maybe he has a connection with our staff: if not, I wouldn't look for him. Lord knows in the NFL, like life it's mostly who you know.

theebs · 01-20-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cowboys22

Was just about to post this. They were trying to establish a two TE set and used two 2nd round picks on a TE in an attempt to be able to run that set a lot. Neither pick was sufficiently developed in Dallas yet both went on to have success for their next team. Without knowing any specifics, if you lay that scenario in front of me regardless of position, my first thought would be that the position coach isn't getting it done. I could be wrong and maybe both Fasano and Bennett grew up a bit after being let go by the team that drafted them but it's just a reasonable to believe they may be getting better coaching. Something isn't right when you consider that both were not considered good enough to keep as a 2nd TE yet some other team felt they were good enough to be starters and so far it appears the other teams were right.

That's not an accurate view of it though, all things are not equal.

Two different offenses and different coaches.

Fasano was drafted to be a move tight end and pay in parcells/Payton's offense.

Bennett was drafted to play in Garrett's offense and play on the line.

Two different situations, just repeating two tight end offense does not make it the same.

Bluestang · 01-20-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by theebs

That's not an accurate view of it though, all things are not equal.

Two different offenses and different coaches.

Fasano was drafted to be a move tight end and pay in parcells/Payton's offense.

Bennett was drafted to play in Garrett's offense and play on the line.

Two different situations, just repeating two tight end offense does not make it the same.

Are folks really looking at stats to compare Bennett's role here and the one he played in NY?

He had the same mistakes in NY that he had here....what does that say about the coaching in NY?

percyhoward · 01-20-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by dogberry

Dallas 3 TEs 126 receptions

New England 4 TEs 115 receptions

I noticed you didn't mention touchdowns.

**WoodysGirl** · 01-20-2013

Eric Edholm ‏@Eric_Edholm
Wasn't John Garrett once a scout for the Bucs? I think I did a story on Garrett family once when he was.

theebs · 01-20-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluestang

Are folks really looking at stats to compare Bennett's role here and the one he played in NY?

He had the same mistakes in NY that he had here....what does that say about the coaching in NY?

Mike pope is the most well respected tight end coach in the business.

Eskimo · 01-20-2013

I think Dallas has done a pretty good job of producing TEs that have latched on around the league. Witten, Fasano, Bennett and Chandler were TEs that all started here and have gone on to become decent starters around the league. I don't know if any other team has done as good a job there as we have.

The big problem is that we over-drafted the position because BP got in Jerry's head about never having enough good TEs and taking one in every draft. When you have a guy like Witten and play as much 3-WR formations as we do, it doesn't make much sense to invest a high pick in a guy who will only play 30% of the offensive plays. Ideally that is a guy you develop from a 5th to 7th round pick or as a UDFA. The real fault lies with the GM for making that pick. Instead of wasting high picks if we had just given up a late pick to move up a smidge we could have drafted Max Unger or Iupati (not that I am unhappy with Dez). 2nd to 4th rounds are excellent spots to try and find good interior OL from quality schools instead of drafting injured players, backups/STs and small school unknowns.

theebs · 01-20-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by WoodysGirl

Eric Edholm ‏@Eric_Edholm
Wasn't John Garrett once a scout for the Bucs? I think I did a story on Garrett family once when he was.

He was a pro personnel assistant under Sam Wyche from 92-94.

His first nfl job.

Bluestang · 01-20-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by theebs

Mike pope is the most well respected tight end coach in the business.

I know he is, but Bennett got more opportunities as the #1 TE.

He went through a really bad stretch with no TDs and he also had problems dropping the easy ones.

speedkilz88 · 01-20-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eskimo

I think Dallas has done a pretty good job of producing TEs that have latched on around the league. Witten, Fasano, Bennett and Chandler were TEs that all started here and have gone on to become decent starters around the league. I don't know if any other team has done as good a job there as we have.

[View Full Quote]

It cost an extra 3rd just to move up to get Dez, it would have taken at least a 2nd (Sean Lee pick) to get Iupati that draft. And as I've repeated on here many times Seattle moved ahead of Dallas to get Unger, there is no way to avoid that when it happens. They didn't have a freaking crystal ball to warn them.

theebs · 01-20-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluestang

I know he is, but Bennett got more opportunities as the #1 TE.

He went through a really bad stretch with no TDs and he also had problems dropping the easy ones.

We all know what Bennett is.

It's not a mystery. If pope couldn't get him on track no one will.

Cowboys22 · 01-20-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by theebs

That's not an accurate view of it though, all things are not equal.

Two different offenses and different coaches.

Fasano was drafted to be a move tight end and pay in parcells/Payton's offense.

Bennett was drafted to play in Garrett's offense and play on the line.

Two different situations, just repeating two tight end offense does not make it the same.

All I know is they obviously viewed developing a 2nd TE as important enough to use a 2nd round pick twice within three years. Neither guy panned out in Dallas but went on to look better elsewhere. I fully understand they got more opportunities elsewhere but that's partly the point. Dallas didn't view either as good enough to keep as a 2nd TE but another team used them as a starter. Something is wrong with that scenario and if I'm JJ, I'm looking right at the position coach for answers.

FuzzyLumpkins · 01-20-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by theebs

Yea I agree with that.

It's really about our team just losing. We are all mad about it.

I just am shocked when a tight end coach is causing such an uproar! Even for Dallas this is a new one.

After 04, parcells decided to go in a different direction and he fired Maurice carthon, if I remember correctly he made sure to help him get a new job. It was just a change to try and get better. Pretty harmless.

I remember no one really getting upset except newy and Galloway on espn 103.3

Which really says a lot.

Not much different here.

I think its def that but I also thing that there is more than a little resentment towards them because they are "northern Ivy league types."

rickjameschinaclub · 01-20-2013

I thought the passing game coordinator and TE coach was going to a HC job, you know because he's moving on up.. I never thought he was applying for a demotion...

jnday · 01-20-2013

This is real progress. The process is working.