Dez meets Michael Jordan

[DFWJC]

Originally Posted by J-DOG

. Don't get me started with the killer instinct that Jordan had compared to just about anyone...ever..in any sport.

fify

[Nav22]

Originally Posted by J-DOG

Jordan is the goat...his athletic ability with his creativity going the bucket in his early years in the NBA is so much better then Kobe and Lebron's. Lebron is a physical freak but MJ was freakish also and had better skills entering the league. Don't get me started with the killer instinct that Jordan had compared to Lebron.

LeBron's a better passer than MJ was, a better rebounder than MJ was, and can defend more positions than MJ could. All this while currently scoring more efficiently than MJ ever did with a ridiculously high FG% that has risen each of the last 7 seasons.

He's built like Karl Malone but with MJ's scoring ability and Magic's passing ability. An absolute monster that would've eaten the competition alive if he was playing in the late '80s-early '90s when zone defense was illegal.

But by all means, stick to the MJ-was-God cliches to avoid crediting the younger generation where it's due.

[HoustonFrog]

Originally Posted by Future

I've heard some people say that if he did so, he could still be a solid role player...giving you 11-15 points.

Kidd-Gilchrist said Michael beat him in a 1 on 1 game last week or something...so he can obviously still ball.

Did you know his playing weight was something like 218 and he is at 240 now...was 260. If you look at his playing days he was much leaner and seemed skinny at times...go find baseball photos. Love him. Great article in ESPN last week about him. I loved the competitiveness

http://espn.go.com/espn/story/_/page...-left-building

Originally Posted by Nav22

LeBron's a better passer than MJ was, a better rebounder than MJ was, and can defend more positions than MJ could. All this while currently scoring more efficiently than MJ ever did with a ridiculously high FG% that has risen each of the last 7 seasons.

He's built like Karl Malone but with MJ's scoring ability and Magic's passing ability. An absolute monster that would've eaten the competition alive if he was playing in the late '80s-early '90s when zone defense was illegal.

But by all means, stick to the MJ-was-God cliches to avoid crediting the younger generation where it's due.

And you live in a fantasy where everything new is better. Jordan is the GOAT. Current players say it, older players say it...almost all agree, including guys like Magic Johnson, who just talked about it. Jordan had 9 ALL NBA Defensive First Teams. LeBron has mad skills but until last year he shrank in the clutch. Jordan did it EVERY year and against less watered down competition. His passion was unmatched. Read above. GOAT..no doubt.

Read this..including the part where LeBron has 2 inches and 45 lbs and still only leads Jordan by 1 rebound a game..Jordan had 8 per one season.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/7...s-wrong/page/2

[NIBGoldenchild]

Originally Posted by Nav22

LeBron's a better passer than MJ was, a better rebounder than MJ was, and can defend more positions than MJ could. All this while currently scoring more efficiently than MJ ever did with a ridiculously high FG% that has risen each of the last 7 seasons.

He's built like Karl Malone but with MJ's scoring ability and Magic's passing ability. An absolute monster that would've eaten the competition alive if he was playing in the late '80s-early '90s when zone defense was illegal.

But by all means, stick to the MJ-was-God cliches to avoid crediting the younger generation where it's due.

Dude, what?

Lebron has never dealt with defenders hand checking him either. As much as he cries to the refs now over minimal contact, his whining would've fallen on deaf ears back in Jordan's era. The closest thing to an old school defender Lebron has ever seen is Kobe, who embarrassed him with two blocks last Sunday when he game on the line.

He is twice the athlete Jordan was, but Jordan was three times the competitor. Lebron has proven to be affected by trash talk ON and OFF the court, which has diminished his game when it counts.

[rocyaice]

Originally Posted by Nav22

LeBron's a better passer than MJ was, a better rebounder than MJ was, and can defend more positions than MJ could. All this while currently scoring more efficiently than MJ ever did with a ridiculously high FG% that has risen each of the last 7 seasons.

He's built like Karl Malone but with MJ's scoring ability and Magic's passing ability. An absolute monster that would've eaten the competition alive if he was playing in the late '80s-early '90s when zone defense was illegal.

But by all means, stick to the MJ-was-God cliches to avoid crediting the younger generation where it's due.

Stop it. You do know that the foul calls that Lebron gets now he wouldn't have gotten in the early 90's or 80's right? You look at Lebron too fast and he will get a foul call. Him and his brother Wade.

Lebron is physically more gifted than MJ ever was or anyone for that matter. 6'9, 250, as fast as point guards and passes better than most point guards. Strong as a power forward. There's never been anything like him. MJ was 6'6 216. You can't even compare the two in that regard. And MJ didn't need to run to his competition just to get a ring. He never ran to Hakeem Olajuwon or Patrick Ewing to get a ring.

[Nav22]

And MJ didn't need to run to his competition just to get a ring. He never ran to Hakeem Olajuwon or Patrick Ewing to get a ring.

So YOUR silly ideals of what a "competitor" should do are the standard we're going by? And the standard which LeBron's career should follow? Get off your high horse. He clearly made the best decision for his career given the lack of talent he had with him in Cleveland.

LeBron left and they became the worst team in the NBA... when Jordan left the Bulls, they still won 55 games and were a playoff contender without him in '93-94.

Stop it. You do know that the foul calls that Lebron gets now he wouldn't have gotten in the early 90's or 80's right?

What a downright silly argument. Not that I'm surprised because I hear it from folks who don't know better all the time.

LeBron's built like Karl Malone with terrifying speed, strength, and leaping ability. Oh, and he's also the most gifted player in the league from a skills standpoint as well.

So what evidence do you have that LeBron couldn't handle the hard fouls from the '80s-'90s?

LeBron takes plenty of hard fouls anyways, especially in the playoffs (you'd know this if you actually paid attention)... and takes those hard fouls from guys who were bigger, stronger, and faster than thay were in Jordan's era. The only real difference is that flagrant fouls are handed out like candy nowadays so obviously there are less flagrantly dirty fouls... but that doesn't mean guys like LeBron don't get whacked pretty good on a regular basis. He's taken vicious shots in the playoffs and gotten right back up.

How about the fact that MJ never once had to deal with zone defense in his Bulls career since it was illegal in the NBA until MJ returned with the Wizards? Does that "hurt" Mike's case like the allegedly softer fouls "hurt" LeBron's case? Or does that road only travel one-way in your biased mind?

LeBron's a more efficient scorer than MJ was, a better passer than MJ was, a better rebounder than MJ was, a better 3-point shooter than MJ was, and can defend FOUR positions at an all-NBA level.

LeBron's also regarded as the better teammate between the two. Ask Steve "MJ punched me in the jaw" Kerr.

I'm sorry that you're not able to get past the media's lionization of MJ to take a look at the evidence and form an intelligent, original opinion. Never ceases to amaze me how much the media controls public opinion.
And I'm also sorry if you still don't know how silly it is to judge a player based on the number of championships he's won in a team sport.

[DFWJC]

Really hard to compare different generational players. The only true way to measure is vs their peers in the same era.
I mean, now days there are JAG football plays running balzing 40 times and jumping 40+ inches.

I know, it's all in good fun--or it should be--but you really can't win these types of arguments.

Every generation, players get bigger, stronger and faster. So 30 years ago, who knows, maybe Lebron is not as musular or explosive from all of his lifelong advanced training...or maybe 30 years later Jordan has 25 lbs more muscle and his vertical is 52 inches instead of suppossedly 48. His standing reach was 8' 10" and his highest touh was 12' 5". Sick
Combine that with outerworldy body control and pure lightning quickness and it starts to sound pretty silly to say anyone was a "far" better athlete than him.

[Blast From The Past]

Originally Posted by WoodysGirl

Dez Bryant ‏@DezBryant
So excited I can't tweet right lol....meeting Michael Jordan tonight was the best moment of my life

Me and the Greatest!!!!!!! http://lockerz.com/s/283602594

<a href="http://c0014679.r32.cf1.rackcdn.com/x2_10e76ea2" target="_blank">

Happy for Dez, living his dream!

[HoustonFrog]

Originally Posted by Nav22

So YOUR silly ideals of what a "competitor" should do are the standard we're going by? And the standard which LeBron's career should follow? Get off your high horse. He clearly made the best decision for his career given the lack of talent he had with him in Cleveland.

LeBron left and they became the worst team in the NBA... when Jordan left the Bulls, they still won 55 games and were a playoff contender without him in '93-94.

What a downright silly argument. Not that I'm surprised because I hear it from folks who don't know better all the time.

LeBron's built like Karl Malone with terrifying speed, strength, and leaping ability. Oh, and he's also the most gifted player in the league from a skills standpoint as well.

[View Full Quote]So what evidence do you have that LeBron couldn't handle the hard fouls from the '80s-'90s?

LeBron takes plenty of hard fouls anyways, especially in the playoffs (you'd know this if you actually paid attention)... and takes those hard fouls from guys who were bigger, stronger, and faster than thay were in Jordan's era. The only real difference is that flagrant fouls are handed out like candy nowadays so obviously there are less flagrantly dirty fouls... but that doesn't mean guys like LeBron don't get whacked pretty good on a regular basis. He's taken vicious shots in the playoffs and gotten right back up.

How about the fact that MJ never once had to deal with zone defense in his Bulls career since it was illegal in the NBA until MJ returned with the Wizards? Does that "hurt" Mike's case like the allegedly softer fouls "hurt" LeBron's case? Or does that road only travel one-way in your biased mind?

LeBron's a more efficient scorer than MJ was, a better passer than MJ was, a better rebounder than MJ was, a better 3-point shooter than MJ was, and can defend FOUR positions at an all-NBA level.

LeBron's also regarded as the better teammate between the two. Ask Steve "MJ punched me in the jaw" Kerr.

I'm sorry that you're not able to get past the media's lionization of MJ to take a look at the evidence and form an intelligent, original opinion. Never ceases to amaze me how much the media controls public opinion.
And I'm also sorry if you still don't know how silly it is to judge a player based on the number of championships he's won in a team sport.

Your arguments are so of base its not even funny. I disputed and showed articles that disputed 90% of your claims when you take into account their size, etc. But you are probably 25 and don't get it. Magic Johnson just said the other day that he is hands down the GOAT. Almost every NBA vet does. There is a difference between talent when it comes to your size and just purely winning. LeBron isn't even close when it comes to the mental side of it yet. Kobe still schools him. LeBron would cry like a baby vs the old Detroit teams and Knick teams

http://espn.go.com/chicago/nba/story...ah-thomas-says

Magic Johnson recently gave his take on who would win a game of one-on-one between Jordan and James.
"Easy answer MJ all day, every day!" Johnson tweeted, before adding: "If MJ and LeBron played 1-on-1 10 times, MJ would win all 10. MJ is the ultimate 1-on-1 player!"

[BringBackThatOleTimeBoys]

Why is some of the dissing of Michael Jordan reminding me of Kanye West?

[Nav22]

Originally Posted by HoustonFrog

Your arguments are so of base its not even funny. I disputed and showed articles that disputed 90% of your claims when you take into account their size, etc. But you are probably 25 and don't get it. Magic Johnson just said the other day that he is hands down the GOAT. Almost every NBA vet does. There is a difference between talent when it comes to your size and just purely winning. LeBron isn't even close when it comes to the mental side of it yet. Kobe still schools him. LeBron would cry like a baby vs the old Detroit teams and Knick teams

http://espn.go.com/chicago/nba/story...ah-thomas-says

Since we're now resorting to using other peoples' opinions, Scottie Pippen knows MJ's game far better than Magic does and he said LeBron's better.

Jim Boeheim coached them both in the Olympics and he also picked LeBron.

Pat Riley called LeBron the best player of all time.

Every generation, players get bigger, stronger and faster.

It's really not even about LeBron's obvious advantages in regards to size, speed, and strength.

He's simply outproducing Michael.

Shooting 56.5% from the field, well higher than MJ has ever made for a season. He's developed a better 3-point shot than MJ ever had. He's always been a better passer and rebounder than MJ and he can also guard 4 positions, which MJ obviously couldn't.

[HoustonFrog]

Originally Posted by Nav22

Since we're now resorting to using other peoples' opinions, Scottie Pippen knows MJ's game far better than Magic does and he said LeBron's better.

Jim Boeheim coached them both in the Olympics and he also picked LeBron.

Pat Riley called LeBron the best player of all time.It's really not even about LeBron's obvious advantages in regards to size, speed, and strength.

He's simply outproducing Michael.

Shooting 56.5% from the field, well higher than MJ has ever made for a season. He's developed a better 3-point shot than MJ ever had. He's always been a better passer and rebounder than MJ and he can also guard 4 positions, which MJ obviously couldn't.

I already blew up your rebounding myth. MJ had an average of only 1 less rebound a game..for his career and in some seasons bested LeBron's best...all the while being shorter by 3 inches and 45 lbs smaller. That's like saying Shaq outrebounded Jordan...really?

Defense: Jordan was a 9 time First Team All Defensive Player including Defensive Player of the year. Jordan also never got outplayed by a role player in the NBA Finals. LeBron can't defend "all positions" because he has been schooled by older guards like Kobe and many other players. Being big and having an ability to do something doesn't make you better.

Pippen's arguments got beaten to death in the article I posted earlier on here. Also

http://hoopsapedia.webs.com/lebronvsjordan.htm

Pippen clarified, tweeting that he does not believe James has eclipsed Jordan -- yet.

"Don't get me wrong, MJ was and is the greatest. But LeBron could by all means get to his level someday," said Pippen.

Just because a person is a better athlete...bigger and can do a lot with their size...doesn't make them better. You are throwing out b.s. arguments with nothing to back them. Jordan had the mental edge that LeBron isn't even close to yet. It's not fantasy either. Read the ESPN piece I posted. Go youtube his games for an hour. He wouldn't lose. LeBron, until last year, quit in games.

Also

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...ordan-thats-ok

Michael Jordan is on another level than James for five reasons:

1. He had better individual success.
2. He had better team success.
3. He did this even though the rules favored James.
4. He had a bigger impact on the game and the league.
5. He did so against greater competition.

Oh and

James has an advantage in rebounding and assists. Jordan has a better field-goal percentage, a better free-throw percentage and has more steals, blocks and points as well as fewer turnovers

Don't get me wrong..LeBron is awesome and I like watching the guy play but unless you saw how Jordan dominated year in and year out against stiffer competition then making these arguments is silly.

[Nav22]

I already blew up your rebounding myth. MJ had an average of only 1 less rebound a game..for his career and in some seasons bested LeBron's best...all the while being shorter by 3 inches and 45 lbs smaller. That's like saying Shaq outrebounded Jordan...really?

Better is better, no matter how you choose to justify it.

LeBron has the advantage over MJ in the size department? Too bad. That's part of the equation whether you like it or not.

Yes, Shaq was a better rebounder than Jordan as well. As was Barkley, Malone, Ewing, Olajuwon, etc.

Defense: Jordan was a 9 time First Team All Defensive Player including Defensive Player of the year.

Yes, Jordan was an all-world defender for his position.

But so is LeBron, and guess what? LeBron can guard more positions than MJ could. You're blind if you don't see that. When the Heat play the Clippers, LeBron could guard anyone from Chris Paul to Blake Griffin.

Again, better is better. LeBron's size/strength/speed is an asset that he takes full advantage of. MJ couldn't guard 4 positions, period. Advantage: LeBron.

Jordan also never got outplayed by a role player in the NBA Finals.

Stick to real analysis of their games and not apples-to-oranges mumbo jumbo, please.

Two can play your game. Watch this:

Unlike LeBron, Jordan never got to the Finals as the leader of a bad team. Didn't make it until 1991 when Scottie Pippen developed into a star.

In fact, Jordan's Bulls teams were so loaded that without him, they still won 55 games in '93-94. Whereas the Cavs became the worst team in the NBA the moment LeBron left.

LeBron can't defend "all positions" because he has been schooled by older guards like Kobe and many other players. Being big and having an ability to do something doesn't make you better.

You obviously don't pay much attention to his game. Kobe??? Hahahaha. LeBron has dominated his matchups with Kobe for several years now. Not even close between those 2 anymore.

Did you know that players guarded by LeBron are shooting under 30% on the season? Read that sentence again.

"Don't get me wrong, MJ was and is the greatest. But LeBron could by all means get to his level someday," said Pippen.

Oh, please.

If you read Pippen's original comments then read his retraction, it's painfully obvious that he only backtracked because the media started to kill him for saying LeBron's better.

Just because a person is a better athlete...bigger and can do a lot with their size...doesn't make them better.

So you're admitting that LeBron is the superior athlete. Good start.

Now once you realize that LeBron's PRODUCTION is also superior to Michael's, you'll slowly start to figure out that it's simply because he's the better player.

Go youtube his games for an hour. He wouldn't lose.

Hahaha "wouldn't lose"?

What happened between 1984-1990? MJ lost over and over and over and over again... because he didn't have a good enough team to get the Bulls to the Finals.

Or rather "Jordan wasn't good enough to carry them to the top". That was the narrative on LeBron for all those years, right?

Team sport. Teams win rings, not individuals. Jordan couldn't win a thing until Pippen showed up, just like LeBron couldn't do it without a strong team in Miami.

The fact that you've resorted to posting Bleacher Report articles to validate your opinion should tell you something.

[NIBGoldenchild]

Originally Posted by Nav22

Now once you realize that LeBron's PRODUCTION is also superior to Michael's, you'll slowly start to figure out that it's simply because he's the better player.

Jordan has higher averages in points, field goal percentage, steals and free throw percentage. His averages in points and free throws is by a large margin. Lebron has higher averages in assist, rebounds, and three point percentage, but none by a large margin. Furthermore, Jordan averaged less turnovers.

Now in the playoffs, Jordan has an even bigger margin advantage in points. Less turnovers, more steals, higher free throw and better three point percentage. All Lebron has is rebounds and assists. So in the playoffs, Jordan has performed better than his regular season production while Lebron has not.

How is lebron's production better again? Because facts don't agree with you.

[Nav22]

Originally Posted by NIBGoldenchild

Jordan has higher averages in points, field goal percentage, steals and free throw percentage. His averages in points and free throws is by a large margin. Lebron has higher averages in assist, rebounds, and three point percentage, but none by a large margin. Furthermore, Jordan averaged less turnovers.

Now in the playoffs, Jordan has an even bigger margin advantage in points. Less turnovers, more steals, higher free throw and better three point percentage. All Lebron has is rebounds and assists. So in the playoffs, Jordan has performed better than his regular season production while Lebron has not.

How is lebron's production better again? Because facts don't agree with you.

LeBron is shooting 56.7% from the field this year, a figure Jordan never came close to reaching. The guy could average as many PPG as he wants. He scores around 27 PPG because he would rather get his teammates involved than to try to lead the league in scoring.

So the PPG comparison doesn't hold water. Kobe averages more points than LeBron does because he takes more shots; it doesn't mean Kobe's the better scorer (because he's not).

Since you're correctly including turnovers, I'll point out that Jordan committed more fouls. So those even out.

Free throws? Advantage MJ, no question.

So I'll give MJ the advantage in free throw shooting and in turning the ball over less.

LeBron of 2013 has the advantages in scoring efficiency, passing, rebounding, defense (since he can guard virtually anyone on the court), 3-point shooting, and committing less fouls.