WashTimes: Police say Taylor did not fire gun...and was also a victim

[trickblue]

Originally Posted by Chocolate Lab

Finally, I heard Leon Simon on Mike Fisher's show yesterday, and he made a good point. He said that not only was Taylor being a hood, but that he was being a very stupid hood. He said that where he came from, if you pointed a gun at someone and were stupid enough to come back later that day and try to beat them up with your fists, you were lucky you didn't get shot when you returned.

Leon is the ultimate bottom-line guy... I miss "The Sports Brothers"... I agree with him...

[ChrisZ007]

Originally Posted by Crown Royal

Yes, I am getting upset. It seems that every other post on the topic is either an opinion that he should see 3-5 years no matter what, and anything less is getting off because he is an athlete. The two posts that I was targeting were the initial 2 responses that claimed he would be cleared because he was an athlete.

I see nothing in the article that shows me any sort of charges will be dropped, and, if he is cleared, I am not prepared to accept that it is because he is an athlete. So what if he is cleared? If so, it is most likely because nothing can be proven, not because of some sort of athlete worship. If anything, prosecutors would LOVE to put him away - imagine something that high - profile on their resumes.

I have no problems with the posts that talk about what he could get, rather those that talk about what he should get.

[View Full Quote]And regarding the Grisham comment, it was not directed at everyone who has posted in this thread. But those it was directed at, it was meant to be insulting.

youre pretty naieve huh?

If you dont think Taylors professional athlete status will have any bearing on how these charges are handled or what the sentence if any might be then you live in a glass bubble.

I personally dont care about Sean Taylor. I do care about the flagrant bending of the judicial system for celebs and athletes. Ive seen this sort of thing enough times to realize that painting Taylor as a victim is only the begining of his acquittal before he ever sniffs a courtroom.

You go on feeling sorry for him.

[Crown Royal]

Originally Posted by Chocolate Lab

I'm scratching my head at the posters rushing to defend Taylor...

Yes, if he didn't do anything like what was reported, he shouldn't be punished. But if he did, he should. How can anyone disagree with that?

And as for his not being convicted implying some kind of innocence... Did O.J. not "get off"? After all, he wasn't convicted, either.

Finally, I heard Leon Simon on Mike Fisher's show yesterday, and he made a good point. He said that not only was Taylor being a hood, but that he was being a very stupid hood. He said that where he came from, if you pointed a gun at someone and were stupid enough to come back later that day and try to beat them up with your fists, you were lucky you didn't get shot when you returned.

I've not defended anyone. I am simply not prepared to label anyone guilty until it has been proven to me.

And regarding OJ - I can't comment. I was in middle school at the time, and just didn't understand the situation well enough to be able to make a judgement on it.

Since then, I have only heard what mediots and people outside the courtroom have had to say. All that I can say is that he was tried and acquitted by a jury of his peers. If he got off, it must be because the prosecution was not able to establish guilt beyond a shadow of a doubt.

[LaTunaNostra]

Originally Posted by SkinsandTerps

The thing about the law in Florida, he would have to be brandishing the weapon when he punched the guy.

Otherwise the 10 year minimum doesnt seem to apply.

LMAO!

Who writes these penal laws? Defense attorneys?

There is always a loophole....and one that defies all common sense.

[playit12]

Originally Posted by SkinsandTerps

The thing about the law in Florida, he would have to be brandishing the weapon when he punched the guy.

Otherwise the 10 year minimum doesnt seem to apply.

Actually he was charged with Assult with a firearm and not battery with a firearm, meaning that he did not have to contact the victim in anyway to be convicted. He simply had to threat violence. Seems contrary to the laymen's definition of assult, but never-the-less it is the law.

And it's a 3 year mimimum thanks to exceptions for crimes considered relatively minor such as agravated assult.

[Crown Royal]

Originally Posted by ChrisZ007

youre pretty naieve huh?

If you dont think Taylors professional athlete status will have any bearing on how these charges are handled or what the sentence if any might be then you live in a glass bubble.

I personally dont care about Sean Taylor. I do care about the flagrant bending of the judicial system for celebs and athletes. Ive seen this sort of thing enough times to realize that painting Taylor as a victim is only the begining of his acquittal before he ever sniffs a courtroom.

You go on feeling sorry for him.

I suppose so.

And as I have said, if anything, the prosecutor will WANT to see this thing through because he is a celebrity. See a certain case in Colorado about 2 years ago.

What do you mean 'painting Taylor as a victim?" He doesn't have to be painted as anything. If he was shot at, he was shot at and was the victim in that situation. If the other allegations are true, then he was a perpetrator - which has nothing to do with being a victim. One can be both in the same day.

As for feeling sorry for him - hmmm. I guess that is a sad attempt at some sort of rhetoric, because I have not expressed feeling sorry for anyone in a single post.

[playit12]

Originally Posted by jksmith269

BTW how many people here would NOT confront the people who stole your ATV'S? I know I would go looking for them and want to beat the crap out of them as well. Again who wouldn't? So why is it so wrong for him to? because he rich and that takes away the need to get even with someone who steels from you? He has more than the rest of us? Not me I have 5 kids I would think I have a lot more to think about than him. So what makes him wanting to get even or Revenge any different than you or me?

Wow... that could possible be the worst comment I have seen on this board yet. No way I'd go after them myself. I do not live in Arkansas and I do not have a shotgun rack in my Ford 250.

I don't want to beat them up. I have better things to do with my time and I pay good money for a police force whose job it is to protect me and my property.

Lets not confuse Justice and Revenge. They are not the same thing.

[ABQCOWBOY]

Originally Posted by SkinsandTerps

This is a new wrinkle in this situation.

Taylor stupid as he is, tried to play Vigilante Enforcer instead of initially calling the police. If you know who stole your property call the cops, Idiot.

The thing about the law in Florida, he would have to be brandishing the weapon when he punched the guy.

Otherwise the 10 year minimum doesnt seem to apply.

Florida being tough on laws... please... There is so much crime in Miami it isnt even funny. Police down there are more concerned with putting out another episode of "Cops".

Taylors' father is not the Cheif of police in Miami/Dade. Taylors' Father is the cheif of police in Florida City. Unless the investigation is continuing at this point, it is in the courts hands now.

Even as a Redskins Fan this is extremely stupid.

[View Full Quote]Yet I would hate to see any person get 10 years in prison for a retaliation punch, regardless of whether it is a rival teams' players/fans or even the common man/woman.

EDIT: It seems unclear at this point to whether or not Taylor was brandishing the weapon when the punch happened. That seems like it will be where the defense will focus. If he didnt have the gun on him when he hit the guy it will be a misdemeanor charge for a guy with no criminal history (DUI doesnt even count since the case was dismissed).

Nobody but you said anything about Taylor's father being Chief of Police in Dade County. However, if you don't believe that this will have bearing in how Taylor is handled, your kidding yourself. I spent many years in Florida and it is as much a good old boy network as any place. That's a simple fact.

[playit12]

Originally Posted by LaTunaNostra

LMAO!

Who writes these penal laws? Defense attorneys?

There is always a loophole....and one that defies all common sense.

No loop-hole. Just a different law. The thing about the law is that is very exapansive and often overlaps. It relies on the "common sense" of the prosecutors office to apply the rules that best represent the crime. Of course both the jury and the appealate division act as a check to the prosecutors power in this regard.

[SkinsandTerps]

Originally Posted by playit12

Actually he was charged with Assult with a firearm and not battery with a firearm, meaning that he did not have to contact the victim in anyway to be convicted. He simply had to threat violence. Seems contrary to the laymen's definition of assult, but never-the-less it is the law.

And it's a 3 year mimimum thanks to exceptions for crimes considered relatively minor such as agravated assult.

Very true. I always forget the assault doesnt include actually doing anything but brandishing a weapon.

Hmm... Maybe it was a Supersoaker.

Correct me if I am wrong, but believe I have seen cases where someone gets X days in jail and X years on probation/parole and it counts the same. Almost like a work release or halfway house type of situation.

[SkinsandTerps]

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

Nobody but you said anything about Taylor's father being Chief of Police in Dade County. However, if you don't believe that this will have bearing in how Taylor is handled, your kidding yourself. I spent many years in Florida and it is as much a good old boy network as any place. That's a simple fact.

Someone made a comment about his father being the chief of police in this thread and in others. I was just trying to clarify his actual employment status so there was no misunderstanding.

I have a condo near the Seminole Casino in Hollywood (20-25 minutes north of Miami). I spend a good amount of time in Miami and my cousin lives in Kendall. I am in Miami 3-4 months total every year.

I am not that concerned with his preferencial treatment. I am concerned because he is an idiot, and especially as the son of a police chief, should have never been in this type of situation.

[playit12]

Originally Posted by SkinsandTerps

Very true. I always forget the assault doesnt include actually doing anything but brandishing a weapon.

Hmm... Maybe it was a Supersoaker.

Correct me if I am wrong, but believe I have seen cases where someone gets X days in jail and X years on probation/parole and it counts the same. Almost like a work release or halfway house type of situation.

Most states don't have mandatory minimum sentences. They give a great amount of flexibility to the presiding judge or jury in sentencing (usually judge). As an example then, a judge could give Taylor 3 years sentence, but taking in account it was his first conviction, his age, and other mitigating factors, he might decide to suspend the sentence if Taylor does X, Y, and Z. Here those things might be like taking anger management classes, doing 200 hours of community service, talking to middle schools about avoiding violence. Whatever...

However the problem is that the sentences are incosistent from Judge to Judge. You run into issues of fairness when judges make up their own sentence guidelines. Did he get a longer or shorter sentence because he was black, male, or famous?

In response many legislators are passing minimum penalties that must be followed under certain convictions. And that's what applies here. If he is convicted of the crime for which he is charged he must serve a minimum of 3 and a maximum of 5 years in prison.

[ABQCOWBOY]

Originally Posted by SkinsandTerps

Someone made a comment about his father being the chief of police in this thread and in others. I was just trying to clarify his actual employment status so there was no misunderstanding.

I have a condo near the Seminole Casino in Hollywood (20-25 minutes north of Miami). I spend a good amount of time in Miami and my cousin lives in Kendall. I am in Miami 3-4 months total every year.

I am not that concerned with his preferencial treatment. I am concerned because he is an idiot, and especially as the son of a police chief, should have never been in this type of situation.

I'm an FSU Alum. I spent another 6 years there while in the Navy. I know how things work there.

Some things get filed in a certain way. Some things never make it into a report at all. Some things were there but then again, they never were.

I don't dispute the fact that he's an idiot. Goes without saying that he should never have been in this situation in the first place.

I thought the topic here was what, if and how his case will be handled.

My mistake.

[SkinsandTerps]

playit12,

Then in that case, I would expect another high priced team of lawyers to slam the credibility of the victims/accusers, and it seems that their credibility would be questionable at best if they are going out allegedly stealing ATVs.

Famous or not. I dont expect a person to go to jail for 10 years for a punch.

[playit12]

Originally Posted by SkinsandTerps

playit12,

Then in that case, I would expect another high priced team of lawyers to slam the credibility of the victims/accusers, and it seems that their credibility would be questionable at best if they are going out allegedly stealing ATVs.

Famous or not. I dont expect a person to go to jail for 10 years for a punch.

Well I don't expect anyone to get 10 years for a punch either unless it was against a defenseless person and was savage it caused severe injuries or death.

But if he goes away for 3 years (it's lower because of the exception) it will have nothing to do with the punch and everything to do with pulling a gun on another person.

I have no problem with someone going away for 3 years because of that.