DMN Monday Photos

[Eric_Boyer]

Originally Posted by blindzebra

No the rules allow that to happen.

Over the years it went from forearms with closed fists, to pushing with the hands, to locking up on the front of the torso.

It is not holding to be engaged and pushing. Engaged and pulling IS holding. Engaging from the side or back is holding. Engaging past the front of the torso is holding.

What Rogers is doing in that photo is legal BY RULE.

I hate to critique your photo skills again, but how is he pushing when the jersey is being stretched so much?

[blindzebra]

Originally Posted by Eric_Boyer

I hate to critique your photo skills again, but how is he pushing when the jersey is being stretched so much?

He is extending his arms up and out keeping the defensive player away. It's the same motion you push used on a blocking sled.

[Displaced Cowboy]

From the NFL Rulebook

2. A runner may ward off opponents with his hands and arms but no other player on offense may use hands or arms to obstruct an opponent by grasping with hands, pushing, or encircling any part of his body during a block. Hands (open or closed) can be thrust forward to initially contact an opponent on or outside the opponent’s frame, but the blocker immediately must work to bring his hands on or inside the frame.

Note: Pass blocking: Hand(s) thrust forward that slip outside the body of the defender will be legal if blocker immediately worked to bring them back inside. Hand(s) or arm(s) that encircle a defender—i.e., hook an opponent—are to be considered illegal and officials are to call a foul for holding.

Blocker cannot use his hands or arms to push from behind, hang onto, or encircle an opponent in a manner that restricts his movement as the play develops.

They allow an open hand punch but no where does it say they are allowed to grab the jersey.

[BHendri5]

Originally Posted by Duane

Rogers looks pissed as hell. It'll be good to have someone with fire on the line.

He looks like Hulk Hogan

[blindzebra]

Originally Posted by Displaced Cowboy

From the NFL Rulebook



They allow an open hand punch but no where does it say they are allowed to grab the jersey.

Are you an official?

The last line is the KEY, if it restricts movement. It's a term called advantage/disadvantage. What Rogers is doing fits within the rules, the grabbing of the jersey is incidental UNLESS it goes beyond the frame or restricts the defenders movement.

[Eric_Boyer]

Originally Posted by blindzebra

Are you an official?

The last line is the KEY, if it restricts movement. It's a term called advantage/disadvantage. What Rogers is doing fits within the rules, the grabbing of the jersey is incidental UNLESS it goes beyond the frame or restricts the defenders movement.

If my jersey is getting stretched as much as this example shows, my movement is impeded.

[blindzebra]

Originally Posted by Eric_Boyer

If my jersey is getting stretched as much as this example shows, my movement is impeded.

How do you know?

Which way are they moving?

Is it a run play or a pass play?

What happened a split second later?

What you are seeing is, IMO, the moment after impact. Rogers got him with his hands and snapped him back, and that is why the jersey is stretched.

[Eric_Boyer]

Originally Posted by blindzebra

How do you know?

Which way are they moving?

Is it a run play or a pass play?

What happened a split second later?

What you are seeing is, IMO, the moment after impact. Rogers got him with his hands and snapped him back, and that is why the jersey is stretched.

If an official also sees that split second, it is a flag, or certainly could be. We are talking about a rule based on a judgement call.

But you are right, I don't know.

Of course if you flip that coin over it will say you don't know either.

[guag]

Originally Posted by LaTunaNostra

...................

If he was wearing #22 and didn't have the name on the helmet I'd swear that was Emmitt Smith.

[blindzebra]

Originally Posted by Eric_Boyer

If an official also sees that split second, it is a flag, or certainly could be. We are talking about a rule based on a judgement call.

But you are right, I don't know.

Of course if you flip that coin over it will say you don't know either.

A good official does not call something in a split second, especially in football, where most penalties do not stop play. A good official lets the play happen. Then decides if it had an effect.

In basketball the definition of a foul is: illegal contact that hinders normal offensive or defensive movement. So by rule, you may have something that is technically a foul, but it did not hender and is therefore incidental contact.

[Eric_Boyer]

Originally Posted by blindzebra

A good official does not call something in a split second, especially in football, where most penalties do not stop play. A good official lets the play happen. Then decides if it had an effect.

I agree. The problem is you deemed the play legal without any clue where the ball is.

As far as we know a running back just broke wide and the defender is trying to chase but has his jersey grabbed.

Originally Posted by you

Actually, that's legal as long as you are locked up like that, but you can't do that from the side or go past the front of the torso.

[blindzebra]

Originally Posted by Eric_Boyer

I agree. The problem is you deemed the play legal without any clue where the ball is.

As far as we know a running back just broke wide and the defender is trying to chase but has his jersey grabbed.

But it is legal in a split second. Read the rules that DCB posted, they say illegal contact must immediately stop and the hands must move inside the front of the torso. So even if the grab was illegal, if he released the jersey a split second later, there is no penalty.

The way the NFL officials interprete the rules, that play is legal, unless he pulls, encircles, or redirects the defenders movement.

[boysfanindc]

It looks like the only way he is impeading his movement is preventing him from falling on his ***.