Washington Redskins Picks - Page 5 - Dallas Cowboys Forum

Bob Sacamano · 05-02-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by silverbear

Hey, let's say Carter gets a dozen sacks next year... it's highly unlikely, but let's say it happens...

That brings the Skins all the way up to 25 whole sacks... LOL...

no, no, wait, remember '04?! that's how it's going to be for the Skins, so that adds another 30 sacks alone!

Redskins, Super Bowl bound, #5 ranked defense!!

Danny White · 05-02-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by skinsngibbs4life

ok, honestly man, rivalry aside, thats just f'd up. Who cares what a fan looks like? Why even bring that into a discussion? It's just competly messed up to bash people because of the way they look, and shows a lot about you as a person.

It's funny that you'd bash someone for making fun of the appearance of Redsk*ns fans, when you glorify Joe Gibbs in your signature... a man who has done the exact same thing to Cowboys fans.

You either need to put your hypocricy in check, or lighten up. I suggest the latter.

firehawk350 · 05-02-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by silverbear

Hey, let's say Carter gets a dozen sacks next year... it's highly unlikely, but let's say it happens...

That brings the Skins all the way up to 25 whole sacks... LOL...

Yeah, so if Ware goes down due to an injury, do you subtract X amount of sacks??? No wait, that's a lot of other factors, that's right. The fact is that secondary personnel available affects the scheme a lot and it's not a simple matter of (Carter) 12 + (Daniels) 4 = projected 16 sacks. If Springs is healthy then Williams won't mind sending safeties more often. If Carter gets a lot of pressure, then it will draw attention allowing Rocky to blitz from the weak side. You like to use this oversimplified formula to project Redskins' stats but when it comes to Spears' blistering 2.5 sacks in 2 years, well it's the scheme and he should get a bunch of sacks with a one-gap system... Or the LBs should do better now that they are more creative and everyone will get tons of sacks. Double standard...

Bob Sacamano · 05-02-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by firehawk350

Double standard...

it would be double standard if not for the that every where Phillips has gone, the team saw a sack increase, and I'm talking about a period of over 20 years

firehawk350 · 05-03-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Sacamano

it would be double standard if not for the that every where Phillips has gone, the team saw a sack increase, and I'm talking about a period of over 20 years

What's that? It's a bird! No, it's a plane! No, it's my point going way over your head. Gregg Williams has said a couple of times that injuries forced him to change his scheme. Now, he has more faith in the ability of the secondary to cover for a longer period of time so should go back to the scheme that got something like 41 sacks in 04 with a line that included Wynn and Daniels as corners. So yes, it is a double standard because you sit there and say the scheme was to blame for your lack of pressure and that changing it will help and then say when the Skins do the same thing, go back to an effective scheme they were forced to divert from, it won't help.

silverbear · 05-03-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Sacamano

no, no, wait, remember '04?! that's how it's going to be for the Skins, so that adds another 30 sacks alone!

Redskins, Super Bowl bound, #5 ranked defense!!

Skins fans see last season as an aberration, and point to 2005... the rest of us see 2005 as the aberration, and point to the rest of the Gibbs era...

silverbear · 05-03-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by firehawk350

What's that? It's a bird! No, it's a plane! No, it's my point going way over your head. Gregg Williams has said a couple of times that injuries forced him to change his scheme.

Chuckle... of COURSE that's what he said, what's he supposed to say-- "we really stunk last year"??

So, he stopped blitzing because he needed to cover for the injuries in the secondary... but the Skins STILL ranked 23rd in pass defense last year...

Let's look closer at that number-- they had the fifth FEWEST number of pass attemps against them, and they were middle of the pack when it came to completion percentage allowed... so they weren't thrown on all that much, they didn't give up an inordinately high percentage of completions, yet they were ranked 23rd in passing yardage given up...

Clearly, this means that they were giving up a lot of yards per attempt, which means they were giving up completions downfield, rather than a lot of short stuff... I don't have access to this stat, but I'll bet the Skins ranked very near the bottom of the league in yards per completion allowed... so Williams' attempt to protect his DBs wasn't working too well, was it??

Given that, and given that the Skins were getting NO pass rush (which is one of the main reasons for all those downfield completions anyway), it would seem to make sense for Williams at SOME point in the season to simply say "guess we gotta turn loose the dogs"...

But he didn't... and yet, you Skins fans still think he's some kind of defensive genius?? Frankly, last year he was HORRIBLE... horrible enough that if I was a Skins fan, I'd be suspicious of anything he has to say right now...

Consider this:

In 2004, the first year of the Williams Era in DC, the Skins had 40 sacks, and ranked 7th in the league in pass defense... in 05, they were down to 35 sacks, and ranked 10th... in 06, they were all the way down to 19 sacks, and ranked 23rd in pass defense...

To those not logically impaired, this strongly suggests that the more sacks the Skins get, the better their pass defense functions... which again cries out for the Skins to address that glaring deficiency this offseason...

firehawk350 · 05-04-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by silverbear

Chuckle... of COURSE that's what he said, what's he supposed to say-- "we really stunk last year"??

Which absolutely no one has done on the Cowboys either. It seems like when Parcells walked out of the door, all he heard was scrambling to get to a radio show for whatever player to say it was his fault they sucked...

Quote:

Originally Posted by silverbear

So, he stopped blitzing because he needed to cover for the injuries in the secondary... but the Skins STILL ranked 23rd in pass defense last year...

Let's look closer at that number-- they had the fifth FEWEST number of pass attemps against them, and they were middle of the pack when it came to completion percentage allowed... so they weren't thrown on all that much, they didn't give up an inordinately high percentage of completions, yet they were ranked 23rd in passing yardage given up...

Clearly, this means that they were giving up a lot of yards per attempt, which means they were giving up completions downfield, rather than a lot of short stuff... I don't have access to this stat, but I'll bet the Skins ranked very near the bottom of the league in yards per completion allowed... so Williams' attempt to protect his DBs wasn't working too well, was it??

[View Full Quote]

One feeds off the other, doesn't it? It's like a game of jenga, no matter how good you are, pull out enough pieces and the system will fall apart. Springs, Griffin, Prioleau, Washington; all missed significant time yet what I hear was from you Cowboys fans was "injuries were not a factor!!!" Yet, in 2006, your defense sucked worse over the last month then as did ours, and what went wrong there??? Ummmm, Ellis was out with an injury... In 2005, it was Flo's fault. So one player, an old one at that, goes out and the defense goes in the crapper?? Yet the Skins have multiple injuries on every part of the defense to key players and the defense falls apart and well, it's just that the defense was "figured out" or it's one unit's fault. Just so happens be the unit that hasn't been addressed. I wonder why that is??? Is it because that absolutely no one in Washington, including a DC that was highly sought after for a HC position and a hall of fame coach doesn't know football? Or maybe it's that you REALLY REALLY want it to all be the defense's fault.

Quote:

Originally Posted by silverbear

Consider this:

In 2004, the first year of the Williams Era in DC, the Skins had 40 sacks, and ranked 7th in the league in pass defense... in 05, they were down to 35 sacks, and ranked 10th... in 06, they were all the way down to 19 sacks, and ranked 23rd in pass defense...

To those not logically impaired, this strongly suggests that the more sacks the Skins get, the better their pass defense functions... which again cries out for the Skins to address that glaring deficiency this offseason...

Consider this... In 2004 (our #3 ranked defense) got 20 sacks from the DL. The other 20 are from the LB/DBs. In 2005, the DL got 16 sacks and the other 16 were obviously from LB/DBs. In 2006, the DL got 13 sacks and only 6 were from the LB/CB. So, do you think the lack of pressure was from the DL getting worse, or the LB/CBs getting worse at blitzing or allowing their comrades to blitz by effectively covering?
As a matter of fact, assuming a decent amount of progression by Andre Carter (10 sacks), that number jumps up to 17 assuming everyone else on the DL remains the same.
Based on this analysis, it is up to the FO to get more LB/DBs that can either pass-rush, or allow other members of the LB/secondary to do so. And they have done that by Fletcher (stalwart in run support and pass coverage, allowing Rocky and Marcus Washington to blitz more), Fred Smoot (much better then Kenny Wright), David Macklin (better then Ade Jimoh) and Laron Landry (who can cover or rush the passer).
I'm not saying the line is fine right now, Phillip Daniels makes me nervous, but it wasn't the worst unit on the field.

silverbear · 05-04-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by firehawk350

Which absolutely no one has done on the Cowboys either. It seems like when Parcells walked out of the door, all he heard was scrambling to get to a radio show for whatever player to say it was his fault they sucked...

And while you cite the comical CYA pronouncements of Williams as gospel, we here on this message board alternate between laughing at those players blaming Parcells, and being annoyed at them...

I make an exception for Julius Jones, because as it happens I also believe that Parcells about to ruined him, and I hope that the new head coach will help Julius get back to the instinctive running style he showed us his rookie season...

None of which changes the fact that Gregg Williams did an AWFUL job coaching the Skins' defense last year... and now, you expect him to stand up and say he basically screwed up??

Yeah, that'll happen... but you should be skeptical enough to see the self-serving nature of his remarks about what the injury situation did to his defense last year...

Quote:

One feeds off the other, doesn't it? It's like a game of jenga, no matter how good you are, pull out enough pieces and the system will fall apart. Springs, Griffin, Prioleau, Washington; all missed significant time yet what I hear was from you Cowboys fans was "injuries were not a factor!!!"

First, you simply didn't have that many injuries... that's a simple statement of fact... so if your defense fell apart because of the few injuries you DID suffer, that's an indictment of the depth of your team, which in turn is an indictment of the managerial approach employed by Danny Boy and Gibbs...

IOW, if the Skins were so short-sighted about throwing big money at free agents that they had no money left to build some reasonable depth on their roster, don't come cryin' to us when a relatively few injuries decimates your defense... a savvy football fan would EXPECT things to go haywire in that situation, and put the blame where it belongs-- the front office...

Quote:

Yet, in 2006, your defense sucked worse over the last month then as did ours, and what went wrong there??? Ummmm, Ellis was out with an injury... In 2005, it was Flo's fault. So one player, an old one at that, goes out and the defense goes in the crapper??

Nope... don't know where you got the idea it did, but you didn't hear it from this ol' Bear...

The loss of Ellis was but one factor in the defensive decline... when Anthony Henry started hobbling, that hurt the pass defense too... opponents figured out what the Boys were doing that was working for them, countered it, and the Boys didn't have a counter to the counter... finally, the coaches got timid, and called a LOUSY game plan...

IOW, it was a combination of a lot of factors that caused the dropoff...

Quote:

Yet the Skins have multiple injuries on every part of the defense to key players and the defense falls apart and well, it's just that the defense was "figured out" or it's one unit's fault. Just so happens be the unit that hasn't been addressed. I wonder why that is???

The Skins rank dead last in sacks, six behind the next worst team, the first team in several years to post fewer than 20 sacks, and you ask why we're laughing about how the Skins have failed to address that GLARING weakness??

A better question might be why AREN'T you up in arms about this?? Don't you have even the most rudimentary understanding of the NFL version of the game of football??

Quote:

Is it because that absolutely no one in Washington, including a DC that was highly sought after for a HC position and a hall of fame coach doesn't know football?

Williams is HIGHLY overrated, and after last year's performance, isn't likely to be too high on anybody's head coaching lists any more-- including the Skins'... as for Gibbs, well, the game finally passed Landry by, and all the available evidence suggests that it's done the same for Saint Joe as well...

At least, his performance as head coach of the Skins this second time around hasn't been anything to write home about...

Yes, I'm saying to you that you probably ought to be asking yourself about now if your coaching staff really has a clue what it's doing...

Quote:

Or maybe it's that you REALLY REALLY want it to all be the defense's fault.

Actually, I'd much prefer it all be Jason Campbell's fault...

But reality is reality, and the reality is it was the Skins' defense that ranked next to last in the league last year... and you seem to think that all you need to do is add Laron Landry and "get healthy", then everything will be all better... presto, instant top 5 defense...

Of course, your defensive depth isn't any better than it was last year, so if you guys get a NORMAL number of injuries again this year, the team will start to struggle again...

Quote:

I'm not saying the line is fine right now, Phillip Daniels makes me nervous, but it wasn't the worst unit on the field.

Ahhh, so you DON'T know a whole lot about football... my bad, I thought I was arguing with a semi-knowledgeable fan, not just another mindless homer...

SilverStarCowboy · 05-05-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hostile

Rd 5 - 143 - Dallas Sartz, LB USC
Rd 6 - 179 - H.B. Blades LB, Pittsburgh
Rd 6 - 205 - Jordan Palmer QB, UTEP
Rd 7 - 216 - Tyler Ecker TE, Michigan

justcheckinuout · 05-05-2007

I don't see why everyone is laughing so hard at the Skins getting Landry at the number 6 pick and making a boat load of changes to there secondary that gave up a tremendous amount of plays over 20 yards? You have a defense that was 31st and needs to be fixed at the D-line and secondary? So which one do you fix first? Can't do it all in one year the D-line will be addressed in the draft next year-Story over. The Cowboys could use a another stud at corner and other areas (same scenario.) Hard to fix it all in one year but with the trades for the picks next year should fill some empty slots not a bad move by Mr.Jones.

Hostile · 05-05-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by justcheckinuout

I don't see why everyone is laughing so hard at the Skins getting Landry at the number 6 pick and making a boat load of changes to there secondary that gave up a tremendous amount of plays over 20 yards? You have a defense that was 31st and needs to be fixed at the D-line and secondary? So which one do you fix first? Can't do it all in one year the D-line will be addressed in the draft next year-Story over. The Cowboys could use a another stud at corner and other areas (same scenario.) Hard to fix it all in one year but with the trades for the picks next year should fill some empty slots not a bad move by Mr.Jones.

I don't know, maybe it's because this is a Dallas Cowboys site, not a Washington Redskins site and praise for your team is doled out with an eyedropper in these parts just like praise for our team is doled out with an eyedropper in your neck of the woods.

Doesn't that seem just the least bit plausible to you without much thought process at all to come to the conclusion?

Oh yeah, this was your last post here, last March...

Quote:

Originally Posted by justcheckinuout

Who is going to cover Moss,Lloyd,Randal el,Patten,Cooley and Portis?

Answer...everyone.

Holloway805 · 05-06-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hostile

I don't know, maybe it's because this is a Dallas Cowboys site, not a Washington Redskins site and praise for your team is doled out with an eyedropper in these parts just like praise for our team is doled out with an eyedropper in your neck of the woods.

Doesn't that seem just the least bit plausible to you without much thought process at all to come to the conclusion?

Oh yeah, this was your last post here, last March...

Answer...everyone.

Everyone and anyone. Aside from Portis and sometimes Moss-- You have SQUAT!

SilverStarCowboy · 05-06-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by justcheckinuout

I don't see why everyone is laughing so hard at the Skins getting Landry at the number 6 pick and making a boat load of changes to there secondary that gave up a tremendous amount of plays over 20 yards? You have a defense that was 31st and needs to be fixed at the D-line and secondary? So which one do you fix first? Can't do it all in one year the D-line will be addressed in the draft next year-Story over. The Cowboys could use a another stud at corner and other areas (same scenario.) Hard to fix it all in one year but with the trades for the picks next year should fill some empty slots not a bad move by Mr.Jones.

Landry is a good FS pick, but he isn't the coverage saftey of a Reed, Nelson or a Merriweather. DeadSkins already had a simuliar Saftey in Sean "the convict" Taylor. You guys are in deep trouble, don't see any improvement in the Pass Rush, therefore very little improvement in the Pass Defense. IMO, Gibbs should have adressed D-Line instead of picking any other position but I'm not going to criticize the selection of LaRon Landry, he is a quality player and probably the best player left on the board at #6.

What makes me laugh to beat the band is the rest of the DeadSkins 2007 Draft .... throw in Lloyd or who ever else you squandered the Draft on....it is really stupidity of epicable perportions!

Futhermore, Henry and Newman ARE legit, it was the pass rush that made them look mediocre. In todays NFL pass rush makes secondarys, apparently your Coaching staff is obliviouse to that FACT.

justcheckinuout · 05-06-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hostile

I don't know, maybe it's because this is a Dallas Cowboys site, not a Washington Redskins site and praise for your team is doled out with an eyedropper in these parts just like praise for our team is doled out with an eyedropper in your neck of the woods.

Doesn't that seem just the least bit plausible to you without much thought process at all to come to the conclusion?

Oh yeah, this was your last post here, last March...

Answer...everyone.

Well alrighty then!!! Can't wait for the 2007 season to get under way to see what your new coach can do and if Romo is the real deal or can he get over the Charlie brown punt hold? I will just let our playing this season do the talking for us. Thanks for dragging out a old post that has nothing to do with the topic at hand which is the redskins 2007 draft picks.