Analyzing Linebackers for Cowboys needs

[CowboyHawg2012]

If things work out so that at 14, we are looking at linebackers and plan on selecting one, who do think is the best fit?

My thoughts:
-I do not want Ingram, granted, i think he can be a stud and reminds me of dwight freeney(the spin moves he used in senior bowl practices should be illegal) I dont think he is a good fit for 3-4. I dont see him being able to drop into coverage AT ALL, he's got short arms which I think will lead him to struggle against point of attack. like him for 4-3, but not for us
-Honestly Id rather have Dont'a Hightower than upshaw. I think Hightower can be way way more versatile for us, and you know Rob loves to move guys around. Hightower can drop into coverage, play in the middle, bump outside to blitz, or be great in stunts. His versatility is outstanding. another Rolando McClain....upshaw is a stud, but limited to rushing the pasher on the outside, plus we could trade down and get Hightower

[realtick]

Originally Posted by CowboyHawg2012

If things work out so that at 14, we are looking at linebackers and plan on selecting one, who do think is the best fit?

My thoughts:
-I do not want Ingram, granted, i think he can be a stud and reminds me of dwight freeney(the spin moves he used in senior bowl practices should be illegal) I dont think he is a good fit for 3-4. I dont see him being able to drop into coverage AT ALL, he's got short arms which I think will lead him to struggle against point of attack. like him for 4-3, but not for us
-Honestly Id rather have Dont'a Hightower than upshaw. I think Hightower can be way way more versatile for us, and you know Rob loves to move guys around. Hightower can drop into coverage, play in the middle, bump outside to blitz, or be great in stunts. His versatility is outstanding. another Rolando McClain....upshaw is a stud, but limited to rushing the pasher on the outside, plus we could trade down and get Hightower

I like Hightower. This combine is going to be really important for him. There are questions about his overall athletic ability and movement skills.

[supercowboy8]

I agree, hightower to me is the best all around 3-4 solb in the draft. If all the bluechips are gone by 14 or we just get a great offer to trade back i'm all for taking him.

[Balotelli]

Originally Posted by realtick

I like Hightower. This combine is going to be really important for him. There are questions about his overall athletic ability and movement skills.

If he runs a 4.6 and does good in the positional drills, I'd select him at 14. He's the perfect "thumper" type ILB Jerry was referring to and the perfect compliment to Lee.

[supercowboy8]

Originally Posted by Balotelli

If he runs a 4.6 and does good in the positional drills, I'd select him at 14. He's the perfect "thumper" type ILB Jerry was referring to and the perfect compliment to Lee.

If they draft hightower it will be for OLB

[NeonDeion21]

Originally Posted by CowboyHawg2012

If things work out so that at 14, we are looking at linebackers and plan on selecting one, who do think is the best fit?

My thoughts:
-I do not want Ingram, granted, i think he can be a stud and reminds me of dwight freeney(the spin moves he used in senior bowl practices should be illegal) I dont think he is a good fit for 3-4. I dont see him being able to drop into coverage AT ALL, he's got short arms which I think will lead him to struggle against point of attack. like him for 4-3, but not for us
-Honestly Id rather have Dont'a Hightower than upshaw. I think Hightower can be way way more versatile for us, and you know Rob loves to move guys around. Hightower can drop into coverage, play in the middle, bump outside to blitz, or be great in stunts. His versatility is outstanding. another Rolando McClain....upshaw is a stud, but limited to rushing the pasher on the outside, plus we could trade down and get Hightower

For me, I see just the opposite in Ingram. I feel like he fits a 3-4 because he can do multiple things so well. He can rush as a 'backer on one play and on the next play the 5 Tech. I think a defense that really disguises things well like Pittsburgh or Balt would fall in love with him.

[RoyTheHammer]

Originally Posted by supercowboy8

If they draft hightower it will be for OLB

..or ILB, since neither of us is on staff with the 'Boys.

[realtick]

Originally Posted by RoyTheHammer

..or ILB, since neither of us is on staff with the 'Boys.

Loooooool, seriously. I love it when fans speak so stridently like "the Cowboys will do....."

[gmoney112]

Originally Posted by Balotelli

If he runs a 4.6 and does good in the positional drills, I'd select him at 14. He's the perfect "thumper" type ILB Jerry was referring to and the perfect compliment to Lee.

And we're going to use our 2nd round pick last year for quality depth? What.

[supercowboy8]

Originally Posted by RoyTheHammer

..or ILB, since neither of us is on staff with the 'Boys.

The Cowboys are very high on our last years 2nd round draft pick Carter. Give him a full offseason to get stronger and under Ryan to learn the system they think he can do the same thing Lee did.

Jerry isn't going to draft another ILB just to let our 2nd round pick from last year sit on the bench. Carter is not a 3-4 SOLB but Hightower has all the ability to play SOLB in a 3-4.

[cobra]

Originally Posted by CowboyHawg2012

-I do not want Ingram, granted, i think he can be a stud and reminds me of dwight freeney(the spin moves he used in senior bowl practices should be illegal)

He does have a spin move like Freeney, but Ingram is nothing like Freeney. What makes Freeney great is a beyond-elite burst off the ball. It is amazingly fast. Ingram has a bit of a reptuation as the opposite:"Explosion: Very inconsistent coming off the snap as a pass rusher, sometimes pressing his man up the field but often being among the last to move."

[realtick]

Originally Posted by cobra

Ingram has a bit of a reptuation as the opposite:"Explosion: Very inconsistent coming off the snap as a pass rusher, sometimes pressing his man up the field but often being among the last to move."

That's weird? I told supercowboy8 the very same thing months ago (during the college season) and he responded by showing me a video Ingram running a fake punt back for a TD.

[supercowboy8]

Originally Posted by realtick

That's weird? I told supercowboy8 the very same thing months ago (during the college season) and he responded by showing me a video Ingram running a fake punt back for a TD.

I think that video showed much more than just him dropping back in coverage and making a INT during a fake punt.

Ingram doesn't have Freeney explosin but he does many different jobs than just pass the rusher which is all Freeney does. Ingram lined up at DE, DT, and OLB and was asked to play the ball first then go after the QB, which is reasons why he didn't show much burst in some films yuou may have seen.

But if you have seen him play you will see when it is a obvious passing down Ingram lines up at DT and gets great explosin then uses his great spin move and gets to the QB.

What does a SOLB do, he has to read the play and hold his ground incase it's a run, if it's a pass depending on the formation and play call your coach called in you may have to cover the TE or RB. IF the coach says go get the QB Ingram has great explosion.

Ingram would be a good 3-4 SOLB because he can drop back into coverage, something he has done at SC playing SOLB. Ingram can hold his ground and make the tackle on the RB which he has done as SC when playing DT. Ingram can get to the QB and cause pressure and get sacks which he has done at SC playing DE and DT.

Ingram will be a top 12 pick because of his great versitlity, power, and speed. Teams love to have a lpayer that can do so many different things so well. But I guess I don't know anything since I like a player that will go top 12. But I do agree Ingram is nothing like Freeney. Freeney is to small to play DT and stop the run. The colts have been one of the worse run stopping defense in the NFL for years. Also Freeney can't play 3-4 OLB and drop into coverage, which he never does.Freeney is a one trick pony who does that one trick very well. He can rush the QB and get to the QB. Ingram can do alot of things very well.

[realtick]

Originally Posted by supercowboy8

Ingram doesn't have Freeney explosin but he does many different jobs than just pass the rusher which is all Freeney does. Ingram lined up at DE, DT, and OLB and was asked to play the ball first then go after the QB, which is reasons why he didn't show much burst in some films yuou may have seen.

Hmmmm, so was Ingram the Gamecock on the DL that was asked to play "the ball?"

Lol, not likely. The criticism that was given in that link is the same as mine is and was months ago; Ingram is very inconsistent getting off the LOS. I gave you a clip back then that included time stamps of all the times Ingram was literally the last one off the line at the snap. He wasn't popping his head up trying to locate the ball, he was simply slow off the snap.

Beyond that, I don't know how much of a issue it will be in the pros anyways because I highly doubt he'll be playing on the line as much as he was in college. Is he slow off the snap while standing up as a 34 OLB is a valid question though. IMO, I think he should drop 10-12 lbs, which will help with his quickness and explosiveness.

All this talk about his versatility is really a moot point IMO because he's likely going to play one position in the pros (34 OLB). Some teams may occasionally put his hand down on the line in a nickel or dime package, but if he's going to be an everydown player, he's likely going to have to play standing up on the outside.

I happen to like Ingram but I'm not in love with him as a prospect. I don't think he's an overly physical player at the point of contact the way a guy like Courtney Upshaw is. In fact, from what I've seen of Ingram (playing primarily on the line) he's more of a pursuit player or one that waits to cleanup after others' pressure. He's not this brute force imposing his will on o-linemen.

What does a SOLB do, he has to read the play and hold his ground incase it's a run, if it's a pass depending on the formation and play call your coach called in you may have to cover the TE or RB. IF the coach says go get the QB Ingram has great explosion.

Ingram would be a good 3-4 SOLB because he can drop back into coverage, something he has done at SC playing SOLB. Ingram can hold his ground and make the tackle on the RB which he has done as SC when playing DT. Ingram can get to the QB and cause pressure and get sacks which he has done at SC playing DE and DT.

Naming things he accomplished in college at entirely different positions and roles doesn't necessarily mean it will happen for him as a pro playing as an OLB.

BTW, the word is "explosion" or "explosive."

Ingram will be a top 12 pick because of his great versitlity, power, and speed. Teams love to have a lpayer that can do so many different things so well. But I guess I don't know anything since I like a player that will go top 12.

I love this form of arguing. So you make an unsubstantiated truth claim (as you love to do) "Ingram will be a Top 12 pick."

Then you follow it up with a rhetorical quip based off of your assertion and act like it's a fact, "But I guess I don't know anything since I like a player that will go Top 12."

BTW, do you really believe Ingram will be playing some DT in the NFL at 6'1" 270ish?

[jterrell]

Hightower has never been a pass rusher.
That's a fairly big leap to make from ILB in college to OLB in a 3-4 in the pros.
Also may be a tad slow and stiff for an OLB.

Looks to be the top ILB available though.

A much better fit next to Lee than Carter who seems a coverage oriented guy.

Upshaw, Ingram, Curry, Perry. To me those are guys we check out.