Stephon Gilmore (South Carolina) VS Dre Kirkpatrick (Alabama)

[28 Joker]

I totally butchered this post, because I was in a rush. Let me fix it. I apologize.

Let me try to clarify, because I think it's important. If Rob Ryan does favor Kirkpatrick in his scheme, Ryan could leave at any time. Furthermore, Gilmore was a more explosive, more productive player at South Carolina than Kirkpatrick was at Alabama. Gilmore has the talent and skill set to play in multiple schemes and thrive. I think Gilmore could be in play starting at pick 7, imo.

Mike Lombardi (NFL Network) talked about how Gilmore could win at the bottom or top of the route, just like Darelle Revis. Gilmore is a long-armed, big, fast, quick CB who can win on a receiver's cut at the top of the route and go get the ball. Moreover, Gilmore has the length and size to get physical and win at the line of scrimmage, too. Again, Gilmore can win at the bottom or top of the route. That is a key separation between the two players. Gilmore covered Julio Jones and A.J. Green, too. So, organizations have access to that tape, too.

On the other hand, Lombardi compared Kirkpatrick to a player like Asomugha. Kirkpatrick wins at the bottom of the route by getting physical at the line of scrimmage. Lombardi stated that cornerbacks in this class usually don't have the high interception numbers.

That is what I was trying to say. Gilmore can win both ways or play both ways, but Kirkpatrick isn't that type of player according to Lombardi.

Anyway, Kirkpatrick is a good player, but I think Gilmore is the superior player, imo. I think Gilmore's play at South Carolina speaks for itself, and if he played at Alabama or LSU, he probably wouldn't be the late riser that he is now.

If Dallas takes a CB in round 1, it should be Gilmore. It really shouldn't be close, imo. Gilmore could execute Ryan's scheme or the next defensive coordinator's scheme. The Cowboys should take the best CB, and that is Gilmore, imo. Kirkpatrick isn't the cleanest player in the intangible department, either. That may be one reason why he has so many visits scheduled.

I think Gilmore will get serious looks from Jacksonville at 7, Buffalo at 10, Kansas City at 11, possibly Seattle at 12, and possibly Arizona at 13. Dallas should be looking, too. I agree with Chocolate Lab. Gilmore has a chance to go much higher than he is being projected right now.

[RS12]

I would prefer Gilmore to Fitzpatrick. Gilmore a STer too.

[Eskimo]

I would definitely prefer Gilmore to Kirkpatrick.

I'm not convinced Dre is going to stay at CB and that means no way we should touch him in the first round.

[28 Joker]

Originally Posted by RS12

I would prefer Gilmore to Fitzpatrick. Gilmore a STer too.

I really like Gilmore, and I think he would become Dallas' best CB. This guy knows how to read routes and break on the ball. He is a former high school quarterback, too. Gilmore played the slot at South Carolina and even lined up some at safety. His 3.94 short-shuttle was very impressive, and this guy would be Dallas' best slot CB, too.

This guy is a pure cover CB, too. This guy is big and fast and smooth.

If I was in Dallas' war room, and Kirpatrick was rated above this guy, there would be a battle.

Mike Mayock stated that Gilmore was very close to Claibourne, but Claibourne had elite ball skills. That is the slight difference for Mayock.

Gilmore played a little high in his backpedal at South Carolina, but Mayock stated that coaching could fix that technical aspect of his game.

Ironically, Gilmore chose South Carolina over...

Alabama

[poost]

So the question becomes, would you be happy taking Gilmore with the 14th overall pick, or do you think he comes in to play with a trade-down scenario.

[TheFinisher]

Based on talent alone I'd rather have Jenkins. Unlike those other 2, he's got elite movement skills for the position. I think he's scheme versatile and can do pretty much anything you ask of him. He's good enough to play off zone and really excel at baiting and driving on the ball, creating a ton of turnovers, but he's also got the right combination of size/speed/fluidity to man up and be a favorable matchup against any type of receiver you throw at him. Not many corners have that kind of versatility.

[DWAREZ]

Definitely Gilmore, Dre is ok but Gilmore looks like a more complete cb!

[28 Joker]

Originally Posted by poost

So the question becomes, would you be happy taking Gilmore with the 14th overall pick, or do you think he comes in to play with a trade-down scenario.

Gilmore would probably not get passed Tennessee at 20. They would probably jump on him. They love SEC players, too.

Gilmore started 40 games in three seasons at South Carolina (that is every game), and I think a team (at the top half of the draft) that really needs a top-notch, young CB would really like him. Gilmore would be a day one starter for a CB needy team like Jacksonville or Buffalo. Kansas City really likes SEC players, and they will for sure look at him, imo.

There are only 6 "elite" players according to Charley Casserly:

Luck
Richardson
RGIII
Kalil
Blackmon
Claibourne

After those guys come off the board, it's probably going to get wild.

[pupulehaole]

I would be so happy with Gilmore at 14.

[Deep_Freeze]

Originally Posted by TheFinisher

Based on talent alone I'd rather have Jenkins. Unlike those other 2, he's got elite movement skills for the position. I think he's scheme versatile and can do pretty much anything you ask of him. He's good enough to play off zone and really excel at baiting and driving on the ball, creating a ton of turnovers, but he's also got the right combination of size/speed/fluidity to man up and be a favorable matchup against any type of receiver you throw at him. Not many corners have that kind of versatility.

I guess your talking about Mike Jenkins, but if you look at their combines, Gilmore actually showed more elite movement skills than Jenkins. Jenkins did beat him in straight line speed by 0.02, but in most other things Gilmore did pretty much dominate Jenkins with his advantage in quickness, size, and explosion.

Only reason Gilmore is a late riser is cause of that combine, its gone under the radar how well he actually performed there. With that performance, plus already seen as a late first rounder on film before that performance, makes him move up into consideration alot higher in the draft.

[btcutter]

Originally Posted by poost

So the question becomes, would you be happy taking Gilmore with the 14th overall pick, or do you think he comes in to play with a trade-down scenario.

Don't think he'll be around if you trade down given how valuable CBs are now. He's got ability to recover and play the ball.

Having 4 good CBs isn't a bad thing. It allows us to go man coverage and blitz to your hearts content.

He help us match up better against the Eagles for sure.

[Eskimo]

Originally Posted by Deep_Freeze

I guess your talking about Mike Jenkins, but if you look at their combines, Gilmore actually showed more elite movement skills than Jenkins. Jenkins did beat him in straight line speed by 0.02, but in most other things Gilmore did pretty much dominate Jenkins with his advantage in quickness, size, and explosion.

Only reason Gilmore is a late riser is cause of that combine, its gone under the radar how well he actually performed there. With that performance, plus already seen as a late first rounder on film before that performance, makes him move up into consideration alot higher in the draft.

My guess is that he was talking about Janoris Jenkins who is probably off of our draft boards and off of our collective minds in this draft.

Based on pure numbers:

Gilmore had the better

vertical 36 vs 33.5
40 4.40 vs 4.46
ss 3.94 vs 4.13
3-cone 6.61 vs 6.95
BroadJ 10-3 vs 10-1
Height 6-1 vs 5-10

Both of these guys had solid numbers but Gilmore is bigger and more physical. He also doesn't have red marks for off the field incidents.

If we aren't happy with any of the front 7 players in this draft he would be my pick ahead of the OGs/Cs and the other DBs on the board.

He also gives us insurance in case Mike Jenkins can't play early next year and allows us to let Jenkins walk at the end of the year if we like what Gilmore can do at the #2 CB spot. This would effectively open up $10M/yr of cap space if it works out.

I'd still mostly prefer to trade down from this spot as I consider mid-first round CBs a luxury item.

[Yuma Cactus]

Gilmore over Krikpatrick for sure. For now I am liking Cox, Gilmore and Barron at #14.

[Dash28]

I would be fine with Gilmore at 14.

[Deep_Freeze]

Originally Posted by Eskimo

My guess is that he was talking about Janoris Jenkins who is probably off of our draft boards and off of our collective minds in this draft.

Based on pure numbers:

Gilmore had the better

vertical 36 vs 33.5
40 4.40 vs 4.46
ss 3.94 vs 4.13
3-cone 6.61 vs 6.95
BroadJ 10-3 vs 10-1
Height 6-1 vs 5-10

Both of these guys had solid numbers but Gilmore is bigger and more physical. He also doesn't have red marks for off the field incidents.

If we aren't happy with any of the front 7 players in this draft he would be my pick ahead of the OGs/Cs and the other DBs on the board.

He also gives us insurance in case Mike Jenkins can't play early next year and allows us to let Jenkins walk at the end of the year if we like what Gilmore can do at the #2 CB spot. This would effectively open up $10M/yr of cap space if it works out.

[View Full Quote]I'd still mostly prefer to trade down from this spot as I consider mid-first round CBs a luxury item.

Your probably right, I wasn't thinking about Janoris cause he isn't really a consideration for me at 14. Gilmore is just a safer pick than Janoris, plus like you said the $10 million in cap space is something that is ignored, but has a huge impact on this team next year.

I know most think short term here, but if we could find a replacement for both Jenkins and Spencer in this draft, that would be like $19 million in per year salary savings for us next year to spend on other positions of need.

Just imagine what we could do with that money.