Dallas Cowboys Could Expedite Success by Trading DeMarcus Ware - Page 6 - Dallas Cowboys Forum

ghst187 · 12-07-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ren

For the right price everyone should be on the table including Ware

exactly! The only player on an NFL team these days that you can't live without is a franchise QB. Everyone else is expendable. The players around guys like Roth, Eli, Brady, Peyton, and Brees in a lot of cases has been mostly average and expendable changing regularly but nearly every year they're right in the thick of the playoffs bc of quality QB play and a good coaching staff.
Additionally, with the salary cap and contracts they way they are these days..you can't afford to pay up out of loyalty, you can't overpay a franchise QB (see Denver this year), and everyone else is expendable

Andrei Kostitsyn · 12-07-2012

Why would we take a cap hit by trading a player? Doesn't the other team now take that hit?

Bigdog24 · 12-07-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ultimategamer5567

Can he get a 1st, 2nd and 6th-round pick? Then, and only then, would I even consider trading Demarcus Ware. Period.

Not even then, Im not a big fan of DWARE but make no bones about it he is the real McCoy. It would take a MIN of 2 First Rounders just to entertain the thought of a trade....I could see teams like the Patriots, NYJets, Seattle or even Atlanta might be interested...but I think he will be a Cowboy for life. The owner Jerry Jones will never part with him even though the GM Jerry Jones should listen to offers.

But the BIDDING starts with 2 First rounders period.

fishspill · 12-07-2012

My concern is the decision makers' use of these extra picks likely won't return the value of the individual you gave up. I have little faith in their talent evaluation.

Eskimo · 12-07-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by fishspill

My concern is the decision makers' use of these extra picks likely won't return the value of the individual you gave up. I have little faith in their talent evaluation.

These are our first rounders since 2002:

Roy Williams (multiple Pro Bowls)
Terence Newman (two Pro Bowls)
DeMarcus Ware (multiiple All-Pros)
Marcus Spears (role player, starter)
Bobbie Carpenter (bust)
Anthony Spencer (very good role player)
Felix Jones (dumb pick but good player who then got the injury bug)
Mike Jenkins (top flight cover corner who messed up his shoulder in 2011, Pro Bowl)
Dez Bryant (about to make first Pro Bowl)
Tyron Smith (? future Pro Bowler, arguably should have been his rookie year)
Morris Claiborne (? future Pro Bowler)

So we have 4 players who have made the Pro Bowl, 1 who probably will this year for the first time and 2 guys who look like they've got a shot at becoming one. We got one pure bust and another dumb pick of a good player who developed new injury problems. We found two role players. I bet if you look around the league not many have done better than this.

I really think it is the 2nd round and 3rd round where we have been weak. We have done pretty well in the first and 4th-7th round overall.

SkinsandTerps · 12-07-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigdog24

Not even then, Im not a big fan of DWARE but make no bones about it he is the real McCoy. It would take a MIN of 2 First Rounders just to entertain the thought of a trade....I could see teams like the Patriots, NYJets, Seattle or even Atlanta might be interested...but I think he will be a Cowboy for life. The owner Jerry Jones will never part with him even though the GM Jerry Jones should listen to offers.

But the BIDDING starts with 2 First rounders period.

Haha. That is never going to happen for players at his age at his position, with his nagging injuries to top it off.

He is/was a great player...but he is not a franchise player at this point. The Colts simply cut Manning...one of the best in the game before his injury.

I think you are joking.

rynochop · 12-07-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eskimo

These are our first rounders since 2002:

Roy Williams (multiple Pro Bowls)
Terence Newman (two Pro Bowls)
DeMarcus Ware (multiiple All-Pros)
Marcus Spears (role player, starter)
Bobbie Carpenter (bust)
Anthony Spencer (very good role player)
Felix Jones (dumb pick but good player who then got the injury bug)
Mike Jenkins (top flight cover corner who messed up his shoulder in 2011, Pro Bowl)
Dez Bryant (about to make first Pro Bowl)
Tyron Smith (? future Pro Bowler, arguably should have been his rookie year)
Morris Claiborne (? future Pro Bowler)

[View Full Quote]

Stop naming names will you...its more fun to say we can't draft anyone worth a crap.

Prossman · 12-08-2012

So we trade the only guy who can pressure the qb....... Yes you could get picks for him but then what... you go try and replace him with a first round pick?

I will reverance reggie white . he plays for the eagles most of his career but their loser owner decides to let White leave. He goes to the packers captures the all time sack record, wins a superbowl and goes in to hall of fame as a packer not a eagle. Its about History, legacy, and us cowboy fans.
Emmitt Smith got the alltime rushing record with a star on his helmet. Jerry made sure of that. Ware will win the alltime sack record as a Dallas Cowboy. Could you stomach ware going into the hall of fame as a giant, 49er or a steeler? I know i couldnt.

burmafrd · 12-08-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eskimo

These are our first rounders since 2002:

Roy Williams (multiple Pro Bowls)
Terence Newman (two Pro Bowls)
DeMarcus Ware (multiiple All-Pros)
Marcus Spears (role player, starter)
Bobbie Carpenter (bust)
Anthony Spencer (very good role player)
Felix Jones (dumb pick but good player who then got the injury bug)
Mike Jenkins (top flight cover corner who messed up his shoulder in 2011, Pro Bowl)
Dez Bryant (about to make first Pro Bowl)
Tyron Smith (? future Pro Bowler, arguably should have been his rookie year)
Morris Claiborne (? future Pro Bowler)

[View Full Quote]

Our firsts are not our problem. Never have been since about 10 years ago. Now before that sure.

As said its after that. Our Second round picks have been bad in comparison.

As regards picks 4-7 not too bad as long as you do not mention offensive linemen.

ghst187 · 12-08-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by burmafrd

Our firsts are not our problem. Never have been since about 10 years ago. Now before that sure.

As said its after that. Our Second round picks have been bad in comparison.

As regards picks 4-7 not too bad as long as you do not mention offensive linemen.

totally agree. Our OL picks have been pretty bad.
We could've done better with some of our firsts like Felix, could've easily had a much better RB. However, Felix has had his moments and can't say he was a bust. As good a coach as BP was for us, he was a horrible drafter if some of the rumors are true.....such as he wanted Spears at 11 instead of Ware and a number of other moves....trading out of the first and passing on Steven Jackson to take the ND RB in the second was a fail...as were all of his OL picks.

Eskimo · 12-08-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghst187

totally agree. Our OL picks have been pretty bad.
We could've done better with some of our firsts like Felix, could've easily had a much better RB. However, Felix has had his moments and can't say he was a bust. As good a coach as BP was for us, he was a horrible drafter if some of the rumors are true.....such as he wanted Spears at 11 instead of Ware and a number of other moves....trading out of the first and passing on Steven Jackson to take the ND RB in the second was a fail...as were all of his OL picks.

BP's OL draft picks:

Al Johnson - bust at top of 2nd round
Jacob Rogers - bust middle 2nd round
Stephen Peterman - bust middle of 3rd round

BP expensive FA OL:

Marco Rivera - bust

His two good OL moves were getting Kosier in FA for a reasonable price tag and reclaiming Colombo off the scrap heap. Gurode was a C then moved to Guard to get the best 5 on the field but he was performing poorly and BP moved him back to Center and he found success there.

The OL was actually okay when BP left but it was old, expensive, had no depth and started to fall apart in 2008 with Kosier's injury leaving us in the end with only two good years of OL performance 2006 and 2007. 2008 and 2009 were mediocre in performance but expensive before it fell apart in 2010.

**Idgit** · 12-08-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eskimo

BP's OL draft picks:

Al Johnson - bust at top of 2nd round
Jacob Rogers - bust middle 2nd round
Stephen Peterman - bust middle of 3rd round

BP expensive FA OL:

Marco Rivera - bust

His two good OL moves were getting Kosier in FA for a reasonable price tag and reclaiming Colombo off the scrap heap. Gurode was a C then moved to Guard to get the best 5 on the field but he was performing poorly and BP moved him back to Center and he found success there.

The OL was actually okay when BP left but it was old, expensive, had no depth and started to fall apart in 2008 with Kosier's injury leaving us in the end with only two good years of OL performance 2006 and 2007. 2008 and 2009 were mediocre in performance but expensive before it fell apart in 2010.

Our OL hasn't been as bad as advertised for a long time. It's also not as good as it should be, given the quality of coaching and the resources we've spent there. We've whiffed on the higher picks we've spent, and have had little success developing mid-round talent. And we've done all of this while we've had premium OL coaches in the fold.

I think Callahan is a very good coach, and a very good fit with Jason Garrett. And I believe the team likes what it's got in Smith (and Costa, honestly, though that's a lot harder to establish). We've got two OGs we can win with, though both could be upgraded, and a hole at RT and very limited depth across the board.

Arkin doesn't look to be developing at the rate they'd hoped. Kowalski was injured, but he's been a bit of a forgotten man back there. Losing Nagy was a bit of a blow to the development of depth. They seem to like Parnell, but it's time for him to deliver if he's ever going to be more than a swing player. Cook's a backup C/RT who should be a borderline guy to make a roster who's been forced into starting.

There's been some time needed to adjust to new ZBS concepts, and the injuries to the interior line in camp definitely set us back early. This group's been better recently (Doug Free v. CLE and in the first half against PHI2 aside), but at the very least, I'd expect more even depth across the board, even if none of the starters are outstanding. We're still spotty across the board after significant changes the last two seasons.

PullMyFinger · 12-08-2012

Im all for it, hes soft anyways, and never makes a play when we need it (flame away)

fishspill · 12-09-2012

Roy Williams (multiple Pro Bowls) Good player
Terence Newman (two Pro Bowls) Good player
DeMarcus Ware (multiiple All-Pros) Great player
Marcus Spears (role player, starter) Solid, not 1st worthy
Bobbie Carpenter (bust) Yep
Anthony Spencer (very good role player) Good player
Felix Jones (dumb pick but good player who then got the injury bug) Nope. Bust.
Mike Jenkins (top flight cover corner who messed up his shoulder in 2011, Pro Bowl) Also bust.
Dez Bryant (about to make first Pro Bowl) Greatness possible, but his mind will decide his fate. Jury is out.
Tyron Smith (? future Pro Bowler, arguably should have been his rookie year) Jury is out. May be the best we have but terrible the first of the season.
Morris Claiborne (? future Pro Bowler) Jury is out.

So I'd say we don't agree on many of these evaluations. Compared to how others have done? Beats me. All teams miss on evaluations. Even if they were comparable to other teams' success rate I'd not find it acceptable. I expect more than average out of myself and I'm sure all these scouts and player personel guys do too. Their performance isn't likely matching the level they expect of themselves or any fan should find acceptable.

**Idgit** · 12-09-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by PullMyFinger

Im all for it, hes soft anyways, and never makes a play when we need it (flame away)

No need to flame comments that are obviously only meant to get attention and that have been roundly disproven in other threads already. By all means, continue to believe things that are just incorrect, though.