Romo clutch this year

[DFWJC]

Originally Posted by bula

And what if Bailey had hit the game winner in Baltimore instead of miss.

What if Dez's fingertip hadnt been out of the endzone against the NYG.


Romo sure did his part on those games as well. Should be 7 game winning drives.

Pretty crazy, but you are talking 10-4 right now with just those 2 plays and just a few inches.


Last game probably should not count as a game -winning drive. Game tying comeback? yes.
But the defense (for once) gave us the game winning OT points really.

[Doomsday101]

Originally Posted by KJJ

It was a collective effort by the defense in SB XXVll no one player stood out above the others so Aikman who tossed 4 TD's was named the games MVP.

Main point is in the ultimate team game of football it still takes a team to win it all. So when people put it all on the QB it is hard to take it seriously

[Ring Leader]

Originally Posted by JIMMYBUFFETT

You must not have watched the last two games then! Eli played a ton of defense after throwing 4 picks in the last two games.

Well done JB, well done.

[Doomsday101]

Originally Posted by JIMMYBUFFETT

You must not have watched the last two games then! Eli played a ton of defense after throwing 4 picks in the last two games.

Good point.

[KJJ]

Originally Posted by AmericasTeam31

Perhaps you missed it, but the first link you posted shows the catch as the #6 greatest play of all time in the Super Bowl.

I also found it interesting in the NFL.com video that all the former players on the set disagreed with the selection of the play being #1 over-all, while the mediots were all clamoring about how awesome it was. Who would you rather believe?

And perhaps you missed this list from the same site that you posted on your first attempt to prove your point.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...history/page/6

[View Full Quote]Anyone who tries to tell me that the Tyree catch was a better play at a better moment than Holmes' "catch" (I hate the Steelers, and I'm still not convinced it was indeed a catch) loses a ton of credibility in my book. That catch WON the game, not set up the game winning play, not put them in position for a game winning field goal, it was the game winner. Not to mention that he had a huge catch and run on that drive to put them in position for that play to take place.

It's all based on opinion which play was the greatest in SB history but the consensus is the Eli to Tyree play. Naturally it's debatable it comes down to everyones opinion but the majority feel that play was the greatest SB play. Several things had to happen to pull that play off which is why most consider the Immaculate Reception the greatest play in NFL history. Some of the greatest plays ever had an element of luck to them which added to their intrigue. Eli first had to avoid what appeared to be an unavoidable sack. He was surrounded by defenders and TWO defenders had their hands on him during his escape. One of the defenders was on his back with 2 hands on him and was pulling him down. A sack in that situation would have pretty much killed the Giants chances. That was a 3rd and 5 play with only 1.15 left on the clock. It was a last ditch drive.

A sack would have resulted in a big loss and a 4th and LONG with under a minute left. After Eli escaped the sack he had to then gather himself and make a perfect throw to give Tyree the opportunity to make the catch. He didn't just throw up a prayer like some claim he was throwing to Tyree. It was a decisive throw! It took some incredible poise for Eli to escape the sack, see Tyree down the field and make a perfect throw. No matter how you want to look at it that play ultimately won the game for the Giants because it kept them alive and put them in scoring position at the NE 24 yard line.

The play to Holmes was also a great play and won the game for the Steelers but that play wasn't nearly as hard to pull off as the Eli to Tyree play. It was a much shorter pass and Roethlisberger wasn't fighting off defenders to make the play. To pull that play off Holmes had to make a great catch in the corner of the end zone keeping both feet in bounds. However it still wasn't as remarkable as the catch Tyree made from much further out with a defender draped all over him and the ball pinned to his helmet. Start any poll and that play will easily come out ahead as the top SB play ever.

[DFWJC]

Originally Posted by KJJ

A sack would have resulted in a big loss and a 4th and LONG with under a minute left. After Eli escaped the sack he had to then gather himself and make a perfect throw to give Tyree the opportunity to make the catch. He didn't just throw up a prayer like some claim he was throwing to Tyree. It was a decisive throw! It took some incredible poise for Eli to escape the sack, see Tyree down the field and make a perfect throw. No matter how you want to look at it that play ultimately won the game for the Giants because it kept them alive and put them in scoring position at the NE 24 yard line.

.

Very Romo-like play by Eli!

I do think he was in the grasp though. But you play until the whistle, and that is history.

Great play, but (and I know your post was not for me) I'd still say it was far luckier than great. Nobody catches a ball on their helmet like that. And, is that guy even in the league anymore?

[Doomsday101]

Originally Posted by DFWJC

Very Romo-like play by Eli!

I do think he was in the grasp though. But you play until the whistle, and that is history.

Great play, but (and I know your post was not for me) I'd still say it was far luckier than great. Nobody catches a ball on their helmet like that. And, is that guy even in the league anymore?

Normally it takes a few guys for 1 guy to be called clutch.

[ufcrules1]

Originally Posted by bula

What if Dez's fingertip hadnt been out of the endzone against the NYG.

Romo sure did his part on those games as well.

Yeah, Romo sure did do his part with his 4 interceptions (one of them a pick 6). I think he had a 50 QBR in that game. His comeback was too little too late.

[KJJ]

Originally Posted by Doomsday101

Main point is in the ultimate team game of football it still takes a team to win it all. So when people put it all on the QB it is hard to take it seriously

Naturally football is a team game but football games especially big ones are usually determined by the play of the QB. No single player influences games more than a QB. Everyone has to do their job on a team but it's usually one player amongst those 11 on the field that make the difference and they're named the MVP.

Eliminate that players performance and their team might not have won and in the SB that would probably be the case. Just about every great team in history had a player or 2 that made their team what it was.

[Doomsday101]

Originally Posted by KJJ

Naturally football is a team game but football games especially big ones are usually determined by the play of the QB. No single player influences games more than a QB. Everyone has to do their job on a team but it's usually one player amongst those 11 on the field that make the difference and they're named the MVP.

Eliminate that players performance and their team might not have won and in the SB that would probably be the case. Just about every great team in history had a player or 2 that made their team what it was.

QB is important but without the guy on the other end actually making the catch then it is call incomplete. Yes QB is important but damn a lot of other things must happen. Until the QB throws it and catches it then runs it in it took more than him.

A circus catch is not because the QB was so fricken great it took a guy on the other end to pull it down. QB gets credit sure but it stil took the other guy to make the big play. Romo has hit WR only to see it dropped, the pass was there but now he is not clutch because someone else failed?

As great as Troy was our record when either Emmitt or Mike were missing was not great. QB relies on others more so than any position on the team. He can't block for himself, he can't catch the ball and he can't play defense or special teams.

Montana was great until he faced the 85 Bears who kicked his butt all over the field same with LT and the Giants when they smoked Montana. You are only good when the others around you can help if they can't then that QB is screwed.

[KJJ]

Originally Posted by DFWJC

Very Romo-like play by Eli!

I do think he was in the grasp though. But you play until the whistle, and that is history.

Great play, but (and I know your post was not for me) I'd still say it was far luckier than great. Nobody catches a ball on their helmet like that. And, is that guy even in the league anymore?

It was more Roethlisberger like than Romo like by Eli. Can't recall Romo ever being grabbed like Eli and coming out of it to make a play. Romo escapes with Houdini spin moves slipping the grasp of defenders rather not pulling away from tackles. Lucky can be "great" both the Immaculate Reception and Hail Mary are considered great plays but were 2 of the luckiest plays in history.

To be a "great" play it can't be a routine. Most "great" plays have some element of luck to them because there's a degree of difficulty involved with pulling them off. As for Tyree not being in the league anymore him being an average player to begin with made the play even more unbelievable.

[DFWJC]

Originally Posted by KJJ

It was more Roethlisberger like than Romo like by Eli. Can't recall Romo ever being grabbed like Eli and coming out of it to make a play. Romo escapes with Houdini spin moves slipping the grasp of defenders rather not pulling away from tackles. Lucky can be "great" both the Immaculate Reception and Hail Mary are considered great plays but were 2 of the luckiest plays in history.

To be a "great" play it can't be a routine. Most "great" plays have some element of luck to them because there's a degree of difficulty involved with pulling them off. As for Tyree not being in the league anymore him being an average player to begin with made the play even more unbelievable.

I think Romo has been in the grasp many times. I bet you could find 2-3 good examples just in the last 2-3 weeks.

Anyway, I agree that plays that are labled "great" can be, and often are, lucky. Certainly the helmet catch falls into that category.

As for a great play mostly resulting from what the QB did, I was probably more impressed by Eli's deep, left sideline throw late in the SB last year.

[KJJ]

Originally Posted by Doomsday101

QB is important but without the guy on the other end actually making the catch then it is call incomplete.

It all starts with the QB if they don't make at least a decent throw giving the receiver an opportunity to make a play on the ball it goes incomplete.

Originally Posted by Doomsday101

Yes QB is important but damn a lot of other things must happen. Until the QB throws it and catches it then runs it in it took more than him.

Great QB's can make things happen when things aren't going as planned they're called playmakers. QB's have more on their plate than any other player. QB is the most difficult position to play in all of sports. If Peyton Manning was the Jets QB this season do you think they would be out of the playoffs right now?

Originally Posted by Doomsday101

A circus catch is not because the QB was so fricken great it took a guy on the other end to pull it down. QB gets credit sure but it stil took the other guy to make the big play.

The circus catch Tyree made was made possible because Eli was so great at avoiding a sack and making an accurate throw. Only FANS here give Tyree all the credit for that play. The last thing any FAN here wants to do is give Eli any credit it would only make it more difficult to defend Romo in their Romo vs Eli debates.

Originally Posted by Doomsday101

Romo has hit WR only to see it dropped, the pass was there but now he is not clutch because someone else failed?

Crayton may have dropped a pass but in the end Romo still had a 1:50 starting at the Giants 48 yard line to win the game. After he got the Cowboys to the Giants 23 yard line his next 2 passes fell incomplete and his last one was picked off in the end zone. I don't blame him for the pick it came on a 4th and 11 play in desperation time but he did have opportunities and enough time to get it done during that drive.

Eli also had a receiver drop the ball and that drop came in the endzone late in the game with the Giants behind vs the Cowboys Dec 11th of last season. That was a do or die game for the Giants and they needed a TD to take the lead. Although Eli's receiver dropped a TD Eli shrugged it off and the Giants ended up scoring anyway.

Originally Posted by Doomsday101

As great as Troy was our record when either Emmitt or Mike were missing was not great. QB relies on others more so than any position on the team. He can't block for himself, he can't catch the ball and he can't play defense or special teams.

The Cowboys clearly struggled without Emmitt because their offense revolved around him that was a run first team. That was a different era when ground and pound won games. The Vikings run the ball with Peterson who's on pace to break the single season rushing record but they've struggled to win games because Ponder is an average QB who isn't very productive. Even with an elite runner like Peterson you can't win consistently if you don't have a top notch QB who's productive.

Originally Posted by Doomsday101

Montana was great until he faced the 85 Bears who kicked his butt all over the field same with LT and the Giants when they smoked Montana. You are only good when the others around you can help if they can't then that QB is screwed.

The 85 Bears killed everyone that season except for Miami. Marino diced them up on Monday Night. You honestly think Miami wins that game without Marino or do you just want to give all the credit to his receivers? It was much easier for defenses to win games back in the mid 80's. Rules that keep being adopted year after year have opened up the passing game and has hampered the aggressiveness of defenses. The new player safety rules would have taken a big bite out of the 85 Bears defense.

Half their sacks that season would have drawn penalties for late hits and helmet to helmet contact. They would have been flagged for one roughing the passer call after another. Ditka would have suffered coronary that season watching yellow flags rain down on every play his defense made. The Giants D would have had the same problem.

You can't play defense today like you did 25 years ago. The game has changed it's a QB driven league where QB's are protected like never before. Receivers don't worry about being destroyed over the middle as much because of the defenseless player rule. These rules have benefitted the passing game and have hindered defenses.

[KJJ]

Originally Posted by DFWJC

I think Romo has been in the grasp many times. I bet you could find 2-3 good examples just in the last 2-3 weeks.

Anyway, I agree that plays that are labled "great" can be, and often are, lucky. Certainly the helmet catch falls into that category.

As for a great play mostly resulting from what the QB did, I was probably more impressed by Eli's deep, left sideline throw late in the SB last year.

Romo has spun away from being in the grasp but nothing like what Eli got out of. He was being pulled down and tackled from behind hardly ever do you see a QB come out of something as dire as that. I've seen Roethlisberger and Mcnabb during his prime pull off escapes similar but It was not an escape you would think Eli could pull off. That was as close to a sack as you can get. That play had to have been payback from the football Gods for the tuck rule game.

[DFWJC]

Originally Posted by KJJ

Romo has spun away from being in the grasp but nothing like what Eli got out of. He was being pulled down and tackled from behind hardly ever do you see a QB come out of something as dire as that..

That's why he was, by definiton, in the grasp.
It was an illegal play.