Would you trade Romo for the #1 pick?

[ABQCOWBOY]

Originally Posted by KJJ

The plan that others have suggested is to trade Romo for the #1 overall pick then draft a QB to develop. That's NOT my plan! My PLAN is to resign Romo THEN draft a QB to develop that way I have a QB to keep the Cowboys competitive while I develop a young QB who could possibly take over in 3-4 years. You asked me what happens if we can't resign Romo then what do I do. Well naturally if you can't resign Romo then the only thing you can do is go with Orton as your starter and draft a young QB to develop.

Right, that's the only thing you can do but if you don't trade him, you also end up drafting a guy much later in the draft with much less resource. That's not ideal. Also, you didn't answer the questions. In your ideal scheme, you keep Tony till you have somebody to replace him with. How do you manage the cap while your doing that?

That would leave you in the same boat as the Cowboys were in after Jerry released Aikman in 2000. He drafted Quincy Carter the following April and brought in Tony Banks. That plan leaves you stuck! My plan gives you time to find a QB in the next 3-4 years while Romo is still manning the ship keeping the team competitive.

That's essentially where we would end up if we followed your plan. Because we must sign Romo, we will not be able to sign Spencer. That's how it works. Your plan assumes we can sign Romo. That's not a given. We could easily be in a position, in a year, where we have no Romo and no picks high enough to take a QB high. How is that a better option? In your plan, we could still end up with Banks and Quincy, so to speak.

No team has ever lost their starting QB due to not being able to get them signed under the cap. There's all kinds of ways to massage the cap if you want a player bad enough. If Austin is released the Cowboys save at least 5 million under the cap. Every team figures out a way to resign their QB if they're still playing at a high level and they still want them. I don't care what teams have to do there's no way they'll lose their franchise QB due to their cap situation.

Not really true but whatever. At the end of the day, you have to either cut players or extend them and neither is good. What good is Romo if you can't afford to sign players around him?

I don't want to replace Romo with a quality QB because there won't be any my plan is to resign him he's going to be the best option. You keep making it sound like there's no possible way for the Cowboys to have a quality starting QB because of their cap situation. I'm not a cap expert but anytime a team wants' to fit players under the cap they restructure contracts and release players. You can mark my words Jerry will not leave his team in the hands of a cheap scrub QB because he can't figure out a way sign or keep a quality starting QB under the cap.

Been over this. I don't agree.

This talk about trading Romo and not being able to resign him under the cap would not be going on had he played well against Wash and the Cowboys made the playoffs. Book mark this thread because what I'm saying is eventually what's going to happen.

But he didn't so it's pointless. Trust me, I will forget this as soon as I possibly can. There is zero value in this for me. Perhaps you should book mark it.

My plan is to resign Romo and draft a young QB to develop. It's not a hope it would happen if I was running the team because me and everyone I have working with me would figure out a way to make it happen. I'm not going to leave this team without a quality starting QB and I can assure you Jerry won't either. He has to market his team and keep butts in the seats. The Cowboys will not win without a quality starting QB it's a must have.

At any cost, I'm sure. That's not a good plan.

You have no idea about that with Danny White you're beyond speculating. Teams today prepare for life without their starting QB. The Packers drafted Aaron Rodgers in the first round to prepare for life without Favre and it paid off big time. The Eagles started preparing for life without McNabb by drafting Kolb and bringing in Vick. They now have Nick Foles who showed potential as a rookie. Teams draft young QB's all the time to develop for the future. The Cowboys have done very little at QB over the past 7 years since Romo became the starter. They drafted Stephen McGee and wasted 3 years with him when it was clear he was showing very little development. He couldn't even win the backup job after 3 seasons.

How old are you? I absolutely do know that this is what would have happened because Danny White asked to be traded. In today's NFL, he would have become an FA and he would have moved on. In those days, you could not sign with other teams unless the team wants to trade you. Yeah, I do know. How old are you again?

If Jerry had any idea Aikman would be done after the 2000 season no possible way would he have given up 2 #1's for Joey Galloway. If you don't have a QB that trade blows up in your face and that's exactly what happened. If he had any idea Aikman was entering his final season in 2000 he would have saved those #1's to try and find a quality starting QB to replace him. Burning those 2 #1's left him desperate having to reach for Quincy Carter with the Cowboys first pick in the 2nd round in 2001. Had he had those 2 #1's he would have had plenty of leverage to move up 21 spots in the 2nd round to possibly draft Drew Brees. Jerry was so desperate for a QB in that draft that he traded up for Quincy.

The salient point in this entire response is contained in the first four words. If Jerry had any idea. Well, he didn't and he made the worst possible decision. What you want to do now fits in with those past decisions very well.

Romo has some talent around him at the skill positions but he needs an OL and a running game. Give him a quality OL and some resemblance of a running game and it would take some pressure off him. He's having to carry the team so a lesser QB would have no chance. Your idea of trading Romo for the #1 overall pick then trading down for more picks is a recipe for disaster because Jerry's trade down history has been bad.

I agree. In fact, everybody on this board has known this since forever. Why is it, do you suppose, nothing has been done about it? Could it be that we don't have the cap to be able to afford to bring in good OLs? I think so. What does that tell you about resigning Romo? I'm going to guess a great deal but I'm also going to guess that you completely ignore it.

Some of his worst draft picks were a result of trading down. He's even admitted trading down hasn't worked well for him. Compare his selections when he's stayed pat or traded up compared to when he's traded down. You trade Romo and don't end up with some outstanding players in the draft with those picks you're screwed for years. You can't afford to miss on a pick if you trade Romo. Even if you hit on the picks you still lose games because you don't have a QB.

I have never heard Jerry say this. Be that as it may, this is not a convincing argument as to why you shouldn't trade Romo for the 1st overall pick. What you describe could happen with the 1st pick or the 21st pick. There is no upside there. However, if you don't resign Romo, then you have no picks to work with and you are in a worse position. The lower we pick, the worse the results are historically. Not a shocker.

[cowboysooner]

Just a note: the Manning, Brady, Brees deals put qb's up in the 19-20mm per range up from about 15. Shaub signed for about 16. It will take 16 or 17 to get Tony. Romo has been about a $12mm guy. The cap has been pretty static but the qb inflation is alive and well more than any other spot. I don't know that the guys other than Rogers, Brady, Manning and Brees are going to give positive value for their teams.

I'd rather find a new guy than pay Matt Shaub $16 million.

[perrykemp]

Originally Posted by cowboysooner

Just a note: the Manning, Brady, Brees deals put qb's up in the 19-20mm per range up from about 15. Shaub signed for about 16. It will take 16 or 17 to get Tony. Romo has been about a $12mm guy. The cap has been pretty static but the qb inflation is alive and well more than any other spot. I don't know that the guys other than Rogers, Brady, Manning and Brees are going to give positive value for their teams.

I'd rather find a new guy than pay Matt Shaub $16 million.

Or just pay Romo like the Packers pay Aaron Rodgers... Rodgers made $8.5m in 2012, and is scheduled to make $9.75m in 2013, and $11m in 2014.

As I've stated here before -- clearly the Packers pay their guys under the table :-)

[cowboysooner]

Originally Posted by perrykemp

Or just pay Romo like the Packers pay Aaron Rodgers... Rodgers made $8.5m in 2012, and is scheduled to make $9.75m in 2013, and $11m in 2014.

As I've stated here before -- clearly the Packers pay their guys under the table :-)

Rodgers' agent should be fired. He took a less than Romo-Shaub-Rivers deal while he was on a rookie contract.

[perrykemp]

Originally Posted by cowboysooner

Rodgers' agent should be fired. He took a less than Romo-Shaub-Rivers deal while he was on a rookie contract.

It was his 2nd contract believe it or not. The signed him to a 7 year $65m contract in 2008 half way through his 1st year as a starter for approx $9m/year.

[cowboysooner]

Originally Posted by perrykemp

It was his 2nd contract believe it or not. The signed him to a 7 year $65m contract in 2008 half way through his 1st year as a starter for approx $9m/year.

Yes they got him cheap well before his rookie deal expired.

[KJJ]

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

Also, you didn't answer the questions. In your ideal scheme, you keep Tony till you have somebody to replace him with. How do you manage the cap while your doing that?

I've already touched on that you do what teams usually do you restructure contracts and cut players. Like I keep telling you I'm no cap expert but teams know how to massage the cap to sign and keep players they absolutely must have to stay competitive and that's by restructuring contracts and releasing players. Carrs contract can be restructured that would knock millions off the Cowboys current cap situation. When it comes to a franchise QB a team does everything possible to keep them. You'll never see a team lose their franchise QB due to salary cap issues. The cap has been around long enough that teams know how to get under it.

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

That's essentially where we would end up if we followed your plan. Because we must sign Romo, we will not be able to sign Spencer. That's how it works. Your plan assumes we can sign Romo. That's not a given. We could easily be in a position, in a year, where we have no Romo and no picks high enough to take a QB high. How is that a better option? In your plan, we could still end up with Banks and Quincy, so to speak.

Your plan leaves the team in the same boat they were in after Aikman was released in 2000 because your plan involves trading Romo. That leaves the team without a franchise QB forcing them to have to take a flier on a QB in this Aprils draft. That would leave them with a young QB who may never pan out and with Kyle Orton who's proven with 3 teams he's not a quality starting QB. It's obvious by you asking the same questions over and over that you don't understand what I'm saying. My plan keeps Romo on the team for at least "3 years" giving us time to draft a couple of young QB's hoping one will develop into his replacement. My plan won't leave the team in a position where they don't have Romo after a year because he'll be under contract for at least 3 years. Can't make my position any clearer than that.

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

Not really true but whatever. At the end of the day, you have to either cut players or extend them and neither is good. What good is Romo if you can't afford to sign players around him?

What good is signing players and building your team around a scrub QB? Neither you, I or anyone else on this board knows how to manage a salary cap and restructure contracts. It's just a waste of time to continue asking me how I'm going manage the Cowboys cap when I'm not part of the organization. You're just looking to argue for the sake of arguing no one here can give you the specifics on what you're asking. Not even Jerry could tell you how he's going to do it until he and Stephen sit down and map out their strategy during the offseason. The team is $20 million over the cap and they'll figure out how to get under it by restructuring contracts and releasing players.

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

Been over this. I don't agree.

Then stop asking me the same questions that I've answered more than once and move on.

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

But he didn't so it's pointless. Trust me, I will forget this as soon as I possibly can. There is zero value in this for me. Perhaps you should book mark it.

I'll be sure to remind you when everything goes down pretty much the way I've outlined it. Romo is not going to be traded for the #1 overall pick and will be the starting QB of the Cowboys in 2013...book it!

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

How old are you? I absolutely do know that this is what would have happened because Danny White asked to be traded. In today's NFL, he would have become an FA and he would have moved on. In those days, you could not sign with other teams unless the team wants to trade you. Yeah, I do know. How old are you again?

I'm old enough that I was following the Cowboys before Danny White arrived in Dallas. Danny asked to be traded because he was unhappy the Cowboys used a #2 pick on Glen Carano a year after he was drafted. Staubach had concussion issues and the Cowboys needed a capable backup plus a QB to groom to succeed Staubach. Roger was 34 years old when White was drafted so the Cowboys prepared themselves by using a #3 on Danny and a #2 on Carano hoping to hit on one.

Danny quickly beat out Carano for the backup job and Carano never saw the field until 1980 and 81 well after White became the starter. Once Danny beat Carano out he knew the starting job would be his once Roger decided to hang it up. Even while Roger was still playing Danny got plenty of playing time due to Staubach's health. Danny had 103 passing attempts during the regular season his first 3 seasons in the league so he was content being in Dallas once he firmly established himself as the backup.

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

I agree. In fact, everybody on this board has known this since forever. Why is it, do you suppose, nothing has been done about it? Could it be that we don't have the cap to be able to afford to bring in good OLs? I think so. What does that tell you about resigning Romo? I'm going to guess a great deal but I'm also going to guess that you completely ignore it.

The Cowboys brought in OL help that improved the team in the past like Colombo and Davis in free agency. Jerry made the mistake of resigning Free who he thought could play. They drafted Smith #9 overall and so far he's been just okay. The Cowboys have ignored the OL in the draft one reason being that Romo has made the OL look better than it is but it's caught up with them and it's greatly affected the running game. The release of Davis, Colombo and Gurode a couple of years ago made the OL worse. The team went with young players and it hasn't worked out. The Cowboys have invested a lot of high picks on defense ignoring the OL until much later in the draft.

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

I have never heard Jerry say this. Be that as it may, this is not a convincing argument as to why you shouldn't trade Romo for the 1st overall pick. What you describe could happen with the 1st pick or the 21st pick. There is no upside there. However, if you don't resign Romo, then you have no picks to work with and you are in a worse position. The lower we pick, the worse the results are historically. Not a shocker.

I heard Jerry say in a radio interview that he's gotten too cute with some of his trade downs and they haven't worked out. He talked about it after moving up for Dez saying his trade ups have worked pretty good. Like I said checkout his drafting history of the players he's traded down for vs the players he's either stayed pat and selected or traded up for. If you and everyone else had a convincing argument that Romo should be traded for the #1 overall pick the team would look into it. If they thought trading Romo for whatever they could get would be a smart move they would do it. It's not going to happen because Jerry knows the team won't be competitive without a quality starting QB.

[BraveHeartFan]

Originally Posted by cowboysooner

I heard this question from Bill Barnwell Grantland's lead football writer. He thinks the Chiefs should do this, but should the Cowboys?

I can see the rationale on the Cowboys' side. Clear out the aging but good or great players for draft picks and future cap room (Romo, Ware perhaps Spencer or Miles). Get rid of the bad contracts (Free, Ratliff) play a year with Orton. Find a young qb.

Retool around Dez, Lee, Smith, Carter Murray, Claiborne, Carr.

If there was a QB I was sold on at that #1 pick.

This year there isn't a single QB that fits that bill for me. Sorry.

[ABQCOWBOY]

Originally Posted by KJJ

I've already touched on that you do what teams usually do you restructure contracts and cut players. Like I keep telling you I'm no cap expert but teams know how to massage the cap to sign and keep players they absolutely must have to stay competitive and that's by restructuring contracts and releasing players. Carrs contract can be restructured that would knock millions off the Cowboys current cap situation. When it comes to a franchise QB a team does everything possible to keep them. You'll never see a team lose their franchise QB due to salary cap issues. The cap has been around long enough that teams know how to get under it.

I think you better take a real good look at our cap situation. Right now, I think we are about 134 Million on signed players. The cap is like 122. We have to cut 12 just to get to the limit and that doesn't count the rest of the roster or practice players or drafts. You are dead wrong here. Even if we can keep Tony, that still doesn't do anything for a lot of the other players we need to sign.

Your plan leaves the team in the same boat they were in after Aikman was released in 2000 because your plan involves trading Romo. That leaves the team without a franchise QB forcing them to have to take a flier on a QB in this Aprils draft. That would leave them with a young QB who may never pan out and with Kyle Orton who's proven with 3 teams he's not a quality starting QB. It's obvious by you asking the same questions over and over that you don't understand what I'm saying. My plan keeps Romo on the team for at least "3 years" giving us time to draft a couple of young QB's hoping one will develop into his replacement. My plan won't leave the team in a position where they don't have Romo after a year because he'll be under contract for at least 3 years. Can't make my position any clearer than that.

No, your wrong. My plan would leave us with current and future picks and cap relief. That's a completely different situation then what we had when Aikman left. How is it that you can be old enough to remember Danny White but not remember the situations in the late 90s?

What good is signing players and building your team around a scrub QB? Neither you, I or anyone else on this board knows how to manage a salary cap and restructure contracts. It's just a waste of time to continue asking me how I'm going manage the Cowboys cap when I'm not part of the organization. You're just looking to argue for the sake of arguing no one here can give you the specifics on what you're asking. Not even Jerry could tell you how he's going to do it until he and Stephen sit down and map out their strategy during the offseason. The team is $20 million over the cap and they'll figure out how to get under it by restructuring contracts and releasing players.

Who says we would have a scrub QB? That's your deal. That isn't how it has to be. You are big on asking everybody to explain or look up just about everything. Why don't you try a little harder and explain how we are going to get under the cap. How is that going to work while we are busy paying Romo and developing this mythical QB you keep referring to. If you can't do that, then you need to just round file any expectations of your plan working because without that figured out, you don't have any plan.

Then stop asking me the same questions that I've answered more than once and move on.

That's code for, "I don't have an answer?"

I'll be sure to remind you when everything goes down pretty much the way I've outlined it. Romo is not going to be traded for the #1 overall pick and will be the starting QB of the Cowboys in 2013...book it!

Whatever gets you to sleep at night. This is a what if scenario so I am not sure what you feel as if you can remind me about but whatever. If you are referring to signing Romo, please be sure to remind me about all the players we will lose because of cap implications as well. I'm certain that you won't remind me if in fact, Romo decides to play out the 17 Million option and then hits FA. I'm certain that won't happen.

I'm old enough that I was following the Cowboys before Danny White arrived in Dallas. Danny asked to be traded because he was unhappy the Cowboys used a #2 pick on Glen Carano a year after he was drafted. Staubach had concussion issues and the Cowboys needed a capable backup plus a QB to groom to succeed Staubach. Roger was 34 years old when White was drafted so the Cowboys prepared themselves by using a #3 on Danny and a #2 on Carano hoping to hit on one.

He was unhappy because he wasn't starting and Carano wasn't drafted a year after White. Staubach was not 34, he was 32 when White was drafted in 74. However, White didn't play for Dallas after being drafted. He played in the World Football League and didn't sign with Dallas till 76. Carano was drafted in 77. Now, having responded to all of this, what's your point? Had FA been around when White came to the NFL, he would have been drafted, played out his Rookie Contract and signed elsewhere. Arguing this point is ridiculous. You are arguing to just argue at this point.

Now, are you actually going to tell me how old you are or is that another one of those questions you are going to simply not answer?

The Cowboys brought in OL help that improved the team in the past like Colombo and Davis in free agency. Jerry made the mistake of resigning Free who he thought could play. They drafted Smith #9 overall and so far he's been just okay. The Cowboys have ignored the OL in the draft one reason being that Romo has made the OL look better than it is but it's caught up with them and it's greatly affected the running game. The release of Davis, Colombo and Gurode a couple of years ago made the OL worse. The team went with young players and it hasn't worked out. The Cowboys have invested a lot of high picks on defense ignoring the OL until much later in the draft.

Yeah, and so? Let's say we invested in high picks on the OL right now. Your idea is to sign Romo for 3 years. By the time they are ready to play, Romo will be up again and then what? Also, if you are using all these high draft choices on OLs, where are you going to draft a QB?

I heard Jerry say in a radio interview that he's gotten too cute with some of his trade downs and they haven't worked out. He talked about it after moving up for Dez saying his trade ups have worked pretty good. Like I said checkout his drafting history of the players he's traded down for vs the players he's either stayed pat and selected or traded up for. If you and everyone else had a convincing argument that Romo should be traded for the #1 overall pick the team would look into it. If they thought trading Romo for whatever they could get would be a smart move they would do it. It's not going to happen because Jerry knows the team won't be competitive without a quality starting QB.

I heard that interview and what said was SOME have not worked out as well. However, Jerry gives interviews yearly and some years they support staying put and some years they support trading down and other years, they support trading up. There are examples of Jerry having success when he trades down and examples of him failing. It is not conclusive one way or the other. The one indicator that carries more weight is how high you pick and how many opportunities you have to pick. That's a better indicator.

The team has not yet made any move one way or the other so we really don't know what the team is thinking. I believe that Jerry would rather keep Romo but that might not be possible.

[KJJ]

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

You are dead wrong here. Even if we can keep Tony, that still doesn't do anything for a lot of the other players we need to sign.

We will keep Tony...book it!

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

No, your wrong. My plan would leave us with current and future picks and cap relief. That's a completely different situation then what we had when Aikman left. How is it that you can be old enough to remember Danny White but not remember the situations in the late 90s?

We'll find out who's wrong in the coming months.. Your plan would leave the Cowboys without a franchise QB. Leaving us with current and future picks doesn't guarantee any of those picks will turn out plus the team would be stuck with a scrub QB. You may end up having to give up most of our current and future picks trying to get a franchise QB. I have a very good recollection of the Cowboys situation in the late 90's. The cap was new and a lot of teams including the Cowboys had difficulty staying under it. Teams have learned over the years how to massage the cap.

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

Who says we would have a scrub QB? That's your deal. That isn't how it has to be. You are big on asking everybody to explain or look up just about everything. Why don't you try a little harder and explain how we are going to get under the cap. How is that going to work while we are busy paying Romo and developing this mythical QB you keep referring to. If you can't do that, then you need to just round file any expectations of your plan working because without that figured out, you don't have any plan.

If you trade Romo all you would have is Kyle Orton who equals a "scrub" in my book. Any QB who's dumped along with 2 #1's for another QB and gets sent packing in favor of Tim Tebow and then gets dumped by KC is a scrub. He only accepted the backup job because no one wanted him as a starter because he's a scrub. Trading Romo would leave you stuck with him, a QB you drafted and whoever else you can find who's been kicked to the curb to bring to camp.

As for the cap I explained how every team gets under it they restructure contracts and release players. If you know all the details to every players contract on the team and all the cuts that can be made to get Romo signed as well as some free agents then fire away.. Maybe you have some inside info on all the contracts and every trick used by NFL teams to massage the cap. If you think you or anyone else can provide more detailed info than I've provided on what the Cowboys plan on doing to get under the cap let's hear it.

I'm confident Jerry will find a way to pay Romo and make everything work he's been doing this for close to 20 years. As for developing a young QB it's not going to cap strap the team drafting one to develop. If Romo is on the roster by the start of the 2013 season you'll be the one who's dead wrong.

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

That's code for, "I don't have an answer?"

That's a code for "you don't agree with my answers and want to continue arguing." You're asking questions about the cap that not even Jerry or Stephen could tell you right now.

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

Whatever gets you to sleep at night. This is a what if scenario so I am not sure what you feel as if you can remind me about but whatever. If you are referring to signing Romo, please be sure to remind me about all the players we will lose because of cap implications as well. I'm certain that you won't remind me if in fact, Romo decides to play out the 17 Million option and then hits FA. I'm certain that won't happen.

There's not a player the Cowboys could lose that would hurt their chances of winning more than losing Romo. Had they drafted a young promising playmaking QB like a Russell Wilson in the 3rd round last April then they could trade Romo. The Cowboys haven't prepared themselves for life without Romo so they have no choice but to keep him if they want to be competitive.

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

He was unhappy because he wasn't starting and Carano wasn't drafted a year after White. Staubach was not 34, he was 32 when White was drafted in 74. However, White didn't play for Dallas after being drafted. He played in the World Football League and didn't sign with Dallas till 76. Carano was drafted in 77. Now, having responded to all of this, what's your point? Had FA been around when White came to the NFL, he would have been drafted, played out his Rookie Contract and signed elsewhere. Arguing this point is ridiculous. You are arguing to just argue at this point.

I used the word "drafted" but was referring to when White got to Dallas in 76 and started playing for them. At that time Staubach was 34. Carano was drafted a year after White started playing for the Cowboys which put White off. White didn't expect to start when he got to Dallas he was playing behind Roger Staubach. He was unhappy because the Cowboys invested a #2 in Carano which he took as a message that the team wasn't happy with him. All you're doing is making assumptions about what would have happened with Danny White had free agency been around and wanting to argue them. It's a waste of time.

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

Now, are you actually going to tell me how old you are or is that another one of those questions you are going to simply not answer?

How old I am isn't important and I've given "detailed answers" to all your questions but you just want to argue to keep this going.

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

Yeah, and so? Let's say we invested in high picks on the OL right now. Your idea is to sign Romo for 3 years. By the time they are ready to play, Romo will be up again and then what? Also, if you are using all these high draft choices on OLs, where are you going to draft a QB?

If we invest high picks on the OL they should be able to play immediately if we made the right selections. Smith started his rookie year and as bad as our OL is any high pick should be able to see the field some their rookie year. If they're not playing by year 2 we've made a mistake. You can draft someone on the OL in the 1st or 2nd round that leaves a 3rd rounder for a QB. You can use a #1 on the OL and a #2 on a QB and a #3 on the OL. Having Romo under contract for at least 3 years gives you 3 drafts to come up with a young QB who could possibly replace him.

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

I heard that interview and what said was SOME have not worked out as well. However, Jerry gives interviews yearly and some years they support staying put and some years they support trading down and other years, they support trading up. There are examples of Jerry having success when he trades down and examples of him failing. It is not conclusive one way or the other. The one indicator that carries more weight is how high you pick and how many opportunities you have to pick. That's a better indicator.

He may have said "some" but a majority of his trade downs didn't workout. Possibly the worst draft in franchise history in 09 all Jerry did was trade down and got virtually nothing out of 12 picks. His best players have come from either trading up or staying pat.

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

The team has not yet made any move one way or the other so we really don't know what the team is thinking. I believe that Jerry would rather keep Romo but that might not be possible.

He'll find a way to keep Romo because he knows he'll be looking at a 4-12 to 5-11 season in 2013 without him.

[ABQCOWBOY]

Originally Posted by KJJ

We will keep Tony...book it!

People decide to do lots of things in life because of whatever reason. Doesn't mean it's the right thing to do. But by all means, let just run out, buy a special little book for you and write it down. I'll get right on that.

We'll find out who's wrong in the coming months.. Your plan would leave the Cowboys without a franchise QB. Leaving us with current and future picks doesn't guarantee any of those picks will turn out plus the team would be stuck with a scrub QB. You may end up having to give up most of our current and future picks trying to get a franchise QB. I have a very good recollection of the Cowboys situation in the late 90's. The cap was new and a lot of teams including the Cowboys had difficulty staying under it. Teams have learned over the years how to massage the cap.

Yes we will. I dare say, over the coming years.

If you trade Romo all you would have is Kyle Orton who equals a "scrub" in my book. Any QB who's dumped along with 2 #1's for another QB and gets sent packing in favor of Tim Tebow and then gets dumped by KC is a scrub. He only accepted the backup job because no one wanted him as a starter because he's a scrub. Trading Romo would leave you stuck with him, a QB you drafted and whoever else you can find who's been kicked to the curb to bring to camp.

How much do you really know about him? You use Tebow as an example of why he is not good yet Orton has a job and Tebow does not. In his last year of actually getting playing time, he didn't have a bad season. 13 Gms 3653 Yrds, 59% Comp, 7.3 YPA, 20 TDs and 9 INTs. That's not elite but it's also not terrible. He may not be a franchise QB but I would guess that with a running game and a decent defense, he could win games for you but

As for the cap I explained how every team gets under it they restructure contracts and release players. If you know all the details to every players contract on the team and all the cuts that can be made to get Romo signed as well as some free agents then fire away.. Maybe you have some inside info on all the contracts and every trick used by NFL teams to massage the cap. If you think you or anyone else can provide more detailed info than I've provided on what the Cowboys plan on doing to get under the cap let's hear it.

You have the numbers, you can look at it and figure out how your going to do it. Every player's cap number is public info. Maybe you are just too lazy to do the work? I've lost count of how many times you've asked me to provide info in this thread. Why don't you do a little of your own homework here? I suspect it's because you can't answer or won't answer because you know what it will spell out. You are going to have to cut players in order to get under the cap. As I said earlier, Spencer is going to be the first example but he won't be the last. So yeah, lets hear it. It's your plan, you explain it. That's how it works. Lets hear it.

I'm confident Jerry will find a way to pay Romo and make everything work he's been doing this for close to 20 years. As for developing a young QB it's not going to cap strap the team drafting one to develop. If Romo is on the roster by the start of the 2013 season you'll be the one who's dead wrong.

Yeah, he's been doing it poorly for years. Can it be done, sure. That doesn't mean it's smart to do it. Romo may well be on the Roster for 2013 but that doesn't mean anything. 2013 is his last year under contract. All that means is that he's played out his 17 million season and will be an UFA in 2014. Wow! How wrong could I have been? Seriously, this is the kind of thing that makes me wonder why I am having this conversation with you. That last comment was not very well thought out by you was it?

That's a code for "you don't agree with my answers and want to continue arguing." You're asking questions about the cap that not even Jerry or Stephen could tell you right now.

That's right, I don't agree but you have every chance in the world to convince me. But before you can do that, you gotta answer the question. You can't dodge it. I don't need the details in a financial report. I just want to understand how your going to get there. You can round the numbers. Just give me the high level details. I find it very funny that you would complain about having to provide info that only Stephen Jones would know. Not a few post ago, you wanted the players that would be drafted by the Cowboys, before the college season is even over, before the combine and before any possible trade had even been made. How's it feel?

There's not a player the Cowboys could lose that would hurt their chances of winning more than losing Romo. Had they drafted a young promising playmaking QB like a Russell Wilson in the 3rd round last April then they could trade Romo. The Cowboys haven't prepared themselves for life without Romo so they have no choice but to keep him if they want to be competitive.

I'm not talking about a player. I'm talking about multiple players and BTW, the flip side of that is that the Cowboys could still lose Romo regardless. Also, there is not a single player they have under contract that could do more to fix the team, if traded. I don't agree with your last statement. It's true they haven't drafted a young QB but that doesn't mean they can't win games or that they have no choice in the matter. That's just your opinion of the situation. It's not reality.

I used the word "drafted" but was referring to when White got to Dallas in 76 and started playing for them. At that time Staubach was 34. Carano was drafted a year after White started playing for the Cowboys which put White off. White didn't expect to start when he got to Dallas he was playing behind Roger Staubach. He was unhappy because the Cowboys invested a #2 in Carano which he took as a message that the team wasn't happy with him. All you're doing is making assumptions about what would have happened with Danny White had free agency been around and wanting to argue them. It's a waste of time.

You used a lot of words that didn't amount to a hill of beans. I had originally said that if White were playing today, he would not have been playing for the Cowboys because of FA. You disagreed but I think we both know that your wrong. Doesn't really matter. I provided you with example proving my point. You can either accept it or deny it. Doesn't change the fact that the proof was provided to you.

How old I am isn't important and I've given "detailed answers" to all your questions but you just want to argue to keep this going.

I think it does. Further, you can provide as many detailed answers as you like but if the answers are incorrect, the details are pretty much usless.

If we invest high picks on the OL they should be able to play immediately if we made the right selections. Smith started his rookie year and as bad as our OL is any high pick should be able to see the field some their rookie year. If they're not playing by year 2 we've made a mistake. You can draft someone on the OL in the 1st or 2nd round that leaves a 3rd rounder for a QB. You can use a #1 on the OL and a #2 on a QB and a #3 on the OL. Having Romo under contract for at least 3 years gives you 3 drafts to come up with a young QB who could possibly replace him.

Really, what do you consider a high pick? How many high picks have come in an immediately played for us at a high level in the past?

Your going to use 3rd round picks to find your QB? You just told me that you considered guys like Orton scrubs. What is the difference between a guy like Orton and a 3rd round pick QB you intend to draft? What about other positions on the team? What are you going to do about them? Are we just drafting OLs and QBs from here on out?

This is why age matters. It appears to me as if you haven't seen enough football to understand that what you outline here is not the way it works.

He may have said "some" but a majority of his trade downs didn't workout. Possibly the worst draft in franchise history in 09 all Jerry did was trade down and got virtually nothing out of 12 picks. His best players have come from either trading up or staying pat.

Yet you believe that we can find a Franchise QB (not a scrub) in the 3rd or 4th round. Sounds like a well thought out plan to me.

He'll find a way to keep Romo because he knows he'll be looking at a 4-12 to 5-11 season in 2013 without him.

Nothing like Blind Faith.

Agree to disagree I suppose. You make sure you come back and look me up in a few years if we have resigned Romo. Please be sure not to forget about that.

[ufcrules1]

Originally Posted by BraveHeartFan

If there was a QB I was sold on at that #1 pick.

This year there isn't a single QB that fits that bill for me. Sorry.

You don't have to take a QB this year.. you could beef up the lines instead and then take a QB in the 2014 draft. Are you not sick of 8-8 every year with Romo?

[ABQCOWBOY]

Originally Posted by ufcrules1

You don't have to take a QB this year.. you could beef up the lines instead and then take a QB in the 2014 draft. Are you not sick of 8-8 every year with Romo?

Would actually be better to work on your OL, DL, and Safety positions this year. Those positions are deep in this draft. I would take a developmental QB this year and in the next draft, I would draft a Franchise guy if at all possible.

[LittleD]

Originally Posted by cowboysooner

I heard this question from Bill Barnwell Grantland's lead football writer. He thinks the Chiefs should do this, but should the Cowboys?

I can see the rationale on the Cowboys' side. Clear out the aging but good or great players for draft picks and future cap room (Romo, Ware perhaps Spencer or Miles). Get rid of the bad contracts (Free, Ratliff) play a year with Orton. Find a young qb.

Retool around Dez, Lee, Smith, Carter Murray, Claiborne, Carr.

Your betcha...Can't take back...

While we're at it we should trade:
Witten
Rat
Ware
Free
Austin
Anyone else over 30 or closing in...

Won't happen but it's fun to dream about.

[DFWJC]

Originally Posted by ufcrules1

You don't have to take a QB this year.. you could beef up the lines instead and then take a QB in the 2014 draft. Are you not sick of 8-8 every year with Romo?

Always negative Romo stuff...and always over-simplified with you.

Here are some QBs this year with better than 8-8 teams.

Ponder 10-6
Dalton 10-6
Kirkpatrick 11-4-1
Flacco 10-6
Cutler 10-6
Schaub 12-4
etc

None of those guys stand to me as clearly better than Romo.


And I'm someone who would trade Romo in the right situation. Also someone who does not put Romo in the "elite" category with Rodgers/Brady/Brees/PManning. I put him below others --especially this year--too. I just don't think every year he's why we are what we are record wise. He's one of the least of our worries, imo. You already know that.

But this is not the place to re-hash that tired, old argument again so we'll again agree to disagree.