Don't worry about the salary cap - Page 3 - Dallas Cowboys Forum

yimyammer · 01-13-2013

I sure hope Adam can take me off the ledge because our cap situation really has me concerned

Risen Star · 01-13-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelWinicki

Yeah.

Too bad the team is shackled with the Free and Ratliff contracts but that's water over the dam at this point.

Right. Don't talk about it.

We'll even ignore Brandon Carr is grossly over paid and a waste of key resources that could really fix this team. Claiborne also wasted two prime picks that would have gone a long way into addressing the real critical issues on the roster.

Water under the bridge though. Ignore it. Unless, of course, you want to learn from it and never do it again. That's what the front office needs to do. Recognize that philosophy was fatally flawed from the start and begin to really build this team properly while you still have some years left in your franchise QB.

Risen Star · 01-13-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by yimyammer

I sure hope Adam can take me off the ledge because our cap situation really has me concerned

It should have you concerned.

We hand out bad contracts at an alarming rate. Probably because the two guys responsible for it can't evaluate talent.

CowboysYanksLakers · 01-13-2013

Dallas will find a way to sign FA's that want...

CowboyStar88 · 01-13-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Risen Star

Right. Don't talk about it.

We'll even ignore Brandon Carr is grossly over paid and a waste of key resources that could really fix this team. Claiborne also wasted two prime picks that would have gone a long way into addressing the real critical issues on the roster.

Water under the bridge though. Ignore it. Unless, of course, you want to learn from it and never do it again. That's what the front office needs to do. Recognize that philosophy was fatally flawed from the start and begin to really build this team properly while you still have some years left in your franchise QB.

RS bro do you ever stop complaining about Moe and Carr? I think they will finally spend some of those resources on the line this year. I get your frustration I really do. We've seen you complain all year about it. It's not going to change what happened. I know it's hard to have faith but I think we can have a little faith this offseason. My reason for that is I believe that once the cuts and restructures are done they will sign some good talent man. Don't take it wrong because I don't mean it in a bad way. I just think instead of complaining about it in every thread we look ahead and see what we can do. I am excited about Carr Moe and Church next year and I hope they snag a solid FS in the draft like Matt Elam. I know you don't want to hear it but I am excited for Costa this year and I have high hopes for Parnell. I think we will upgrade the guards in FA.

jterrell · 01-13-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by supercowboy8

We are over the salary cap right now for next year, but with a few restructures and releases we will be right under the cap. But don't think that will stop jerry from signing a few big money free agents.

We can structure contracts for the future much like what Dallas did with Carr last year.
So if big money players are available that can fix the OL or defense, he will.

Stephen Jones says you are wrong.

**big dog cowboy** · 01-13-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by CowboyStar88

RS bro do you ever stop complaining about Moe and Carr?

When hell freezes over.

supercowboy8 · 01-13-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by jterrell

Stephen Jones says you are wrong.

Wrong about what, he hasn't said anything about this. He has said everything i stated that we can sign anyone we want due to structuring contracts like I stated

Hoofbite · 01-13-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by jterrell

Stephen Jones says you are wrong.

About being over the cap right now?

Did he give a number?

Dallas looks to have 55M currently scheduled to be tied up on just Romo, Carr, Ware and Free. Right now, I'm not sure he is wrong.

FuzzyLumpkins · 01-13-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hoofbite

So.....continue shoving money onto future years because that approach has really worked out for Dallas so far.

How about instead of pretending like the team is at some mystical hump and a single player can get them over they just face facts and build the team the way it should be done.

We were in great shape before we got Mara'ed. We always said that about the Redskins too.

We can get at least a million dollars in savings by granting the years salary as SB for the following players:

Witten 5.5m with 5 years left = 1.1; savings of 4.4m
Austin 6.7m with 4 years left = 1.675m; savings of 5.025m
Ratliff 5m with 5 years left = 1m; savings of 4m
Romo 11.5m with 5 years left = 2.3m; savings of 9.2m
Carr 14.3m 5 years left = 2.86m; savings of 11.4m
Ware 5.5m 3 years left = 1.83m; savings of 3.6m
Livings 1.7m 4 years left = .425m; savings of 1.275m
Scandrick 2m 4 years left = .5; savings of 3.5m

I prob missed some and there are guys that would give a savings of just under a mil. This is just to give an idea of what we are dealing with. There are min salaries and similar accounting considerations but this is just the quick and dirty approximation to give a sense of what is possible. Adam is the precision guy.

I agree with Stephen Jones about the chuckle when people talk about being up against the cap.

Champsheart · 01-13-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by CowboyStar88

RS bro do you ever stop complaining about Moe and Carr?

Thats funny, that is all he does is complain, dont know why you would expect anything else.

Hoofbite · 01-13-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by FuzzyLumpkins

We were in great shape before we got Mara'ed. We always said that about the Redskins too.

We can get at least a million dollars in savings by granting the years salary as SB for the following players:

Witten 5.5m with 5 years left = 1.1; savings of 4.4m
Austin 6.7m with 4 years left = 1.675m; savings of 5.025m
Ratliff 5m with 5 years left = 1m; savings of 4m
Romo 11.5m with 5 years left = 2.3m; savings of 9.2m
Carr 14.3m 5 years left = 2.86m; savings of 11.4m
Ware 5.5m 3 years left = 1.83m; savings of 3.6m
Livings 1.7m 4 years left = .425m; savings of 1.275m
Scandrick 2m 4 years left = .5; savings of 3.5m

[View Full Quote]

I knew they could make room, wasn't really that sure on how much so thanks for the info good stuff.

On Romo though, I'm not sure they can make any room with him by simple restructure. His contract is voidable after this next season. I can't imagine the team would be able to push money onto years that may not exist. If they could do it and he did opt out, that would leave tons of dead money wouldn't it? If they are going to work on his number, they're probably going to have get him a new contract and I can't imagine his cap number will be less than 8M which is where it would be in a situation in which they could restructure.

I agree and disagree with Stephen. Yes you can always make room. Moving money isn't a problem so we agree in that regard.

We disagree in just how wise it is to make pushing money down the road your standard operating procedure. He must think it isn't harmful or else they wouldn't do it. I think it creates the potential for harm down the line. Seems like if other teams do not have to operate in that fashion but have the choice to that you can always be outbid and in a case where you are the highest bidder you've only set yourself up for more money moving down the road.

Also, if you always anticipate moving money from the moment the contract is signed when you have contracts that go sour and are forced to cut an underachiever it seems like you'd be stuck with a larger burden in dead money. If only because you've converted a giant base salary into guaranteed money and spread across the remainder. I'm not sure if that is all that accurate in "real life" but as opposed to not converting that base (in reality it would likely be a smaller base salary if it weren't structured to be converted) salary and guaranteeing it, it just seems that way.

One last thing area where I think it can create some problems is when you hit on multiple players in multiple drafts.

As of late, Dallas seems to have done that. Tyron, Dez, Murray, Lee, Carter. These are guys I would think the team would have interest in keeping. Dez is probably gonna be a top dollar contract for his position, Tyron possibly the same if develops into the player he can be. I think Lee is a guy who if healthy would be a top dollar contract and if Carter continues to improve he will likely get to a point where he is just below top dollar. Murray is a RB and they are kind of disposable in a sense but I really believe he could be a dominant player at his position behind a good line.

How it pans out remains to be seen but right now these guys are probably going to cost a little bit to retain. In that sense when guys come off those rookie contracts and your SOP is to make room in order to make moves in the first place, I think you could be in a position now where you are making room simply in order to keep what you have or at least keep as much as you possibly can. So maybe now you aren't even able to make room in order to acquire more talent, maybe you're making room to avoid losing talent.

When you combine the two, I think there's the possibility for cap trouble. You have Doug Free on one end who's probably going to be eating space without even being on the roster and you have contracts in the foreseeable future that are likely going to be significant.

What it really comes down to is cap space is the limiting factor in player acquisition after owner willingness. It doesn't appear there are too many penny pinching owners in the league anymore and even for those who are there's going to be a cash floor coming on board in the future isn't there?

All teams have the ability to "make" cap space but some just have it without doing so. If you have to make room in order to operate I think you have less flexibility in negotiating because a team with tons of cap room can give the same signing bonus and then on top of that hand out a fat base salary for the first year that the cap-strapped team can't match. All teams can make the room but those who are sitting with it to start with can still operate more than a team that's working to get compliant.

I don't really care for the "make room" method. I'd rather the team had space without having to restructure players. There certainly doesn't seem to be any advantage to operating the way Dallas has. Certainly not in terms of outcomes for Dallas. I guess the only real plus to having such a mindset is that you can be sure that your elite players never leave and if you are willing to push enough down the road you can take anyone's elite that you'd like.

dallasfan4lizife · 01-13-2013

he won't do squat in free agency to improve this team.

jerry is such a clueless, incompetent, and narcissistic owner/gm

T-RO · 01-13-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by supercowboy8

This

We can set up salaries in contracts to be higher in 2014, 2015, and 2016.

This thinking has eaten the Cowboys lunch for years. And until recently it's killed the Skins too. Stability in anything requires a budget...and not repeatedly strip-mining the future.

Why do you think there is less money committed down the road? Because at this point we only have a handful of players signed for those seasons. THINK ABOUT IT, PEOPLE.

THINK! THINK! THINK!

dwight · 01-13-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Champsheart

Thats funny, that is all he does is complain, dont know why you would expect anything else.

He doesn't complain. He uses reality when it comes to the Cowboys.

The results have come to past. I like Claiborne but those picks for him could have helped this team out.

Dallas was not two corners away from going to the Super Bowl. The evidence is this past season.