Tyrone Crawford at DT?

[Rack Bauer]

Originally Posted by Galian Beast

Please realize the coverage responsibilities of a 4-3 tampa 2 linebacker are far and away crucial to running the tampa 2 defense, and that a 3-4 outside linebacker who is generally a pass rusher, isn't going to play linebacker, where they are almost always in coverage...

Defensive ends?

Ware
Albright
Wilber
Butler if we re-sign him

Butler would NOT be a DE in a 4-3.

[speedkilz88]

Originally Posted by Rack Bauer

Butler would NOT be a DE in a 4-3.

As a pass rushing specialist he would. He would unlikely be able to play OLB in a 4-3. I believe he's a free agent though so he's likely to leave.

[ThreeandOut]

Originally Posted by Galian Beast

Please realize the coverage responsibilities of a 4-3 tampa 2 linebacker are far and away crucial to running the tampa 2 defense, and that a 3-4 outside linebacker who is generally a pass rusher, isn't going to play linebacker, where they are almost always in coverage...

Defensive ends?

Ware
Albright
Wilber
Butler if we re-sign him

The real need in this defense may be for SOLB. If all the old OLB's in the 3-4 are now DE's, then there aren't many candidates to play SOLB on this roster.

[Rack Bauer]

Originally Posted by speedkilz88

As a pass rushing specialist he would. He would unlikely be able to play OLB in a 4-3. I believe he's a free agent though so he's likely to leave.

Ok yeah I can see him being a pass rush specialist, just not a very good one.

And he can play OLB in a 4-3, I just don't think he can do it on a 4-3 that wants to run the Tampa 2.

[speedkilz88]

Originally Posted by ThreeandOut

The real need in this defense may be for SOLB. If all the old OLB's in the 3-4 are now DE's, then there aren't many candidates to play SOLB on this roster.

Right now it's probably Dan Connor.

[ThreeandOut]

Originally Posted by speedkilz88

Right now it's probably Dan Connor.

But they would probably want to get more athletic at the position.

[InmanRoshi]

I've suspeced Crawford will end up as a 4-3 DT. He's simply not athletic enough to play DE in this scheme. He also played at his best this year when he was used in a 3 tech (see Tampa Bay game against Carl Nicks). I suspect he's not done growing either, and will be around 295-305 when it's all said and done. He's not spent a lot of time in big boy offseason strength programs, and he's got a roly poly body.

[Galian Beast]

People need to let go of their perceptions.

Butler played 4-3 defensive end in college. If he played in our defense, that is what he would play.

The defensive line needs to rush the passer. It's not entirely terrible if it's undersized.

Dan Connor is entirely too slow to play as a linebacker in a tampa 2 4-3. Entirely too slow.

Linebackers in a tampa 2 need to cover, pursue, and tackle. They aren't going to be in on the blitz much (much, being a keyword).

We absolutely need to get a strong side linebacker, we do not currently have that player on the team. I think it would be interesting to see Barry Church in that position.

[InmanRoshi]

Originally Posted by Galian Beast

People need to let go of their perceptions.

Butler played 4-3 defensive end in college. If he played in our defense, that is what he would play.

The defensive line needs to rush the passer. It's not entirely terrible if it's undersized.

Dan Connor is entirely too slow to play as a linebacker in a tampa 2 4-3. Entirely too slow.

Linebackers in a tampa 2 need to cover, pursue, and tackle. They aren't going to be in on the blitz much (much, being a keyword).

We absolutely need to get a strong side linebacker, we do not currently have that player on the team. I think it would be interesting to see Barry Church in that position.

Seriously, where are pulling these 4-3 size protoypes heights and weights from? 1988? Parcells was utterly infatuated with height/weight protoypes, but he couldn't hold a candle to your average CZ poster.

[speedkilz88]

Remember Al Singleton? He was the SLB we got from Tampa Bay in 2003. (Started on that Super Bowl squad) He was 6-2 250 and not exactly a fast cover guy from what I remember.

Greg Spires was their DE (6-1 265) and he only had 3.5 sacks in 2002 for their Super Bowl run.
Warren Sapp only had 7.5 sacks that year.

[jobberone]

Originally Posted by Deep_Freeze

I just don't think he has the edge bend and quickness to play out there, and I figure that is what Jerry is saying and basically repeating what he has heard from the staff.

No matter how much we want to say we can fill the spot with Crawford, I don't see him as the answer there, this ain't Boise St where he was probably the most athletic big man on the field. Just cause a guy played both positions in college doesn't make him be able to do that on this level.

The SDE is probably either going to be Spencer or drafted in the first round.

I think Spencer would be better but I think Crawford can play there and will be better than some think. JMO.

[theogt]

Originally Posted by InmanRoshi

I've suspeced Crawford will end up as a 4-3 DT. He's simply not athletic enough to play DE in this scheme. He also played at his best this year when he was used in a 3 tech (see Tampa Bay game against Carl Nicks). I suspect he's not done growing either, and will be around 295-305 when it's all said and done. He's not spent a lot of time in big boy offseason strength programs, and he's got a roly poly body.

Crawford has anything but a roly poly body. He has more a long, lean body type. The real question coming out of the draft was whether he would be too undersized to play 3-4 DE.

Could he get up over 300 lbs.? Yes. Would it be his natural playing weight? Hardly. If you let his body build naturally, he'd be in the 275-285 range.

Nothing "roly poly" about this. He looks like a classic 4-3 LDE.

[MichaelWinicki]

Originally Posted by InmanRoshi

I've suspeced Crawford will end up as a 4-3 DT. He's simply not athletic enough to play DE in this scheme. He also played at his best this year when he was used in a 3 tech (see Tampa Bay game against Carl Nicks). I suspect he's not done growing either, and will be around 295-305 when it's all said and done. He's not spent a lot of time in big boy offseason strength programs, and he's got a roly poly body.

Good descriptive term for Crawford... "not athletic enough to play DE in this scheme".

I agree.

[Deep_Freeze]

Originally Posted by InmanRoshi

I've suspeced Crawford will end up as a 4-3 DT. He's simply not athletic enough to play DE in this scheme. He also played at his best this year when he was used in a 3 tech (see Tampa Bay game against Carl Nicks). I suspect he's not done growing either, and will be around 295-305 when it's all said and done. He's not spent a lot of time in big boy offseason strength programs, and he's got a roly poly body.

Yeah, guess I have been saying this alot, I just don't think he will do well on the edge in the NFL.....would be great if I'm wrong cause we have nothing at DE right now other than Ware, but it is just the truth.

Right now, we just have alot of DTs and not enough DEs at all for the 4-3, heck we were already low in outside pass rushers anyway......the scheme change actually makes the situation even worse.

If this is true and the staff also thinks Crawford can't play on the outside, and we let Spencer walk.....we really have no choice but to use a first rounder on a DE, and I'm one that hates need in the draft so I wouldn't be a happy camper.

[Rack Bauer]

Originally Posted by InmanRoshi

I've suspeced Crawford will end up as a 4-3 DT. He's simply not athletic enough to play DE in this scheme. He also played at his best this year when he was used in a 3 tech (see Tampa Bay game against Carl Nicks). I suspect he's not done growing either, and will be around 295-305 when it's all said and done. He's not spent a lot of time in big boy offseason strength programs, and he's got a roly poly body.

You say this in one post then...

Originally Posted by InmanRoshi

Seriously, where are pulling these 4-3 size protoypes heights and weights from? 1988? Parcells was utterly infatuated with height/weight protoypes, but he couldn't hold a candle to your average CZ poster.

This in another post.

Quit contradicting yourself, Baddie.


Seriously though, Crawford would do fine at DE in a 4-3. He's more athletic then you give him credit for.

Originally Posted by Galian Beast

People need to let go of their perceptions.

Butler played 4-3 defensive end in college. If he played in our defense, that is what he would play.

The defensive line needs to rush the passer. It's not entirely terrible if it's undersized.

Dan Connor is entirely too slow to play as a linebacker in a tampa 2 4-3. Entirely too slow.

Linebackers in a tampa 2 need to cover, pursue, and tackle. They aren't going to be in on the blitz much (much, being a keyword).

We absolutely need to get a strong side linebacker, we do not currently have that player on the team. I think it would be interesting to see Barry Church in that position.

Exactly. In college. He will not be a DE in the NFL. Not a good one. I wouldn't even want him as a "Pass rush specialist" cuz he's not a very good pass rusher.