SB Rings and the Hall of Fame - Dallas Cowboys Forum

percyhoward · 02-02-2013

Super Bowl Era Hall of Fame eligible players only (1966-2007) who are not yet in the Hall of Fame. Grouped with team that won SB.

Minimum requirements for each player:

1. a Super Bowl ring
2. a 1st team All-Pro selection (Associated Press)
3. a minimum of five Pro Bowls, OR
a selection to the Hall of Fame's All-Decade Team

*eligible only as a senior nominee

This year's inductees (finalists in bold) will be announced today.

Cowboys (14)
Larry Allen OL
*George Andrie DL
*Cornell Green DB
Charles Haley DL
*Cliff Harris DB
*Chuck Howley LB
*Lee Roy Jordan LB
*Harvey Martin DL
*Ralph Neely OL
Nate Newton OL
*John Niland OL
Jay Novacek TE
*Drew Pearson WR
Darren Woodson DB

Dolphins (5)
*Dick Anderson DB
*Bob Kuechenberg OL
*Jake Scott S
*Bill Stanfill DL
*Garo Yepremian K

Buccaneers (4)
Mike Alstott FB
Lomas Brown OL
John Lynch DB
Warren Sapp DT

Broncos (4)
Steve Atwater DB
Terrell Davis RB
Tom Nalen OL
Neil Smith DE

Packers (4)
*Gale Gillingham OL
*Jerry Kramer OL
Keith Jackson TE
*Dave Robinson LB

Raiders (4)
Todd Christensen TE
*Lester Hayes DB
*Ray Guy P
*Ken Stabler QB

Chiefs (3)
*Ed Budde OL
*Curley Culp DT
*Jim Tyrer OL

49ers (3)
Roger Craig RB
Charles Haley DL
Bryant Young DL

Giants (3)
Carl Banks LB
Sean Landetta P
Michael Strahan DE

Steelers (3)
*L.C. Greenwood DL
*Donnie Shell DB
Jerome Bettis RB

Bears (2)
Jimbo Covert OL
Jay Hilgenberg OL

Redskins (2)
Dave Butz DL
Joe Jacoby OL

Ravens (2)
Ben Coates TE
Jonathan Ogden OL

Colts (1)
*Bob Vogel OL

Risen Star · 02-02-2013

Percy, you can be my lawyer any day.

Good stuff. I don't think first year eligible players should be included though if the point is who gets snubbed.

percyhoward · 02-02-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Risen Star

Percy, you can be my lawyer any day.

Good stuff. I don't think first year eligible players should be included though if the point is who gets snubbed.

Thanks. I just included them to show how the other teams are still being represented. Especially the old Packers and Chiefs, because both of those guys will get in today.

Risen Star · 02-02-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by percyhoward

Thanks. I just included them to show how the other teams are still being represented. Especially the old Packers and Chiefs, because both of those guys will get in today.

Do you think Darren Woodson eventually gets in?

It's Irvin, Woodson and then everybody else on my all time favorite players list.

Doomsay · 02-02-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by percyhoward

Super Bowl Era Hall of Fame eligible players only (1966-2007) who are not yet in the Hall of Fame. Grouped with team that won SB.

Minimum requirements for each player:

1. a Super Bowl ring
2. a 1st team All-Pro selection (Associated Press)
3. a minimum of five Pro Bowls, OR
a selection to the Hall of Fame's All-Decade Team

*eligible only as a senior nominee

This year's inductees (finalists in bold) will be announced today.

Cowboys (14)
Larry Allen OL
*George Andrie DL
*Cornell Green DB
Charles Haley DL
*Cliff Harris DB
*Chuck Howley LB
*Lee Roy Jordan LB
*Harvey Martin DL
*Ralph Neely OL
Nate Newton OL
*John Niland OL
Jay Novacek TE
*Drew Pearson WR
Darren Woodson DB

Dolphins (5)
*Dick Anderson DB
*Bob Kuechenberg OL
*Jake Scott S
*Bill Stanfill DL
[View Full Quote]

Excellent work!

The definition of bias.

percyhoward · 02-02-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Risen Star

Do you think Darren Woodson eventually gets in?

There's no good reason why he shouldn't. But then, I'd have said the same thing about Cliff Harris after his retirement.

percyhoward · 02-02-2013

I got a PM about Jim Plunkett.

Plunkett has two rings, but only made the top 10 rated passers twice.

That kind of thing does happen.

munkee · 02-02-2013

I don't agree that a SB ring should be a criteria for the Hall of Fame. A player can't control who his teammates are nor can they choose their coach.

percyhoward · 02-02-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by munkee

I don't agree that a SB ring should be a criteria for the Hall of Fame. A player can't control who his teammates are nor can they choose their coach.

That's a fair point.

But since rings obviously do matter, they should matter the same for all teams whose players have rings.

Packers LB Dave Robinson will go in as a senior inductee today. Chuck Howley was clearly a better player. Rickey Jackson, Andre Tippett, and Dave Wilcox are all in the Hall of Fame, and none of them has a ring.

Robinson: 3 Pro Bowls, 1 AP All-Pro, 2 rings
Jackson: 6 Pro Bowls, 0 AP All-Pro
Tippett: 5 Pro Bowls, 2 AP All-Pro
Wilcox: 7 Pro Bowls, 2 AP All-Pro
Howley: 6 Pro Bowls, 5 AP All-Pro, SBMVP, all-time leader in SB takeaways

Each year, a player has to make the preliminary list, then the semi-final list, then the final list, then be one of the seven players who get voted in.

Howley has never even made it past the preliminary list.

Ring Leader · 02-02-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by percyhoward

I got a PM about Jim Plunkett.

Plunkett has two rings, but only made the top 10 rated passers twice.

That kind of thing does happen.

At first glance, I thought you were describing Eli's career.

Diogenes · 02-02-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by percyhoward

That's a fair point.

But since rings obviously do matter, they should matter the same for all teams whose players have rings.

Packers LB Dave Robinson will go in as a senior inductee today. Chuck Howley was clearly a better player. Rickey Jackson, Andre Tippett, and Dave Wilcox are all in the Hall of Fame, and none of them has a ring.

Robinson: 3 Pro Bowls, 1 AP All-Pro, 2 rings
Jackson: 6 Pro Bowls, 0 AP All-Pro
Tippett: 5 Pro Bowls, 2 AP All-Pro
Wilcox: 7 Pro Bowls, 2 AP All-Pro
Howley: 6 Pro Bowls, 5 AP All-Pro, SBMVP, all-time leader in SB takeaways

Each year, a player has to make the preliminary list, then the semi-final list, then the final list, then be one of the seven players who get voted in.

Howley has never even made it past the preliminary list.

Extreme prejudice is what it is. It doesn't get any more "in your face" than that. Thanks for putting this together.

john van brocklin · 02-02-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by percyhoward

Super Bowl Era Hall of Fame eligible players only (1966-2007) who are not yet in the Hall of Fame. Grouped with team that won SB.

Minimum requirements for each player:

1. a Super Bowl ring
2. a 1st team All-Pro selection (Associated Press)
3. a minimum of five Pro Bowls, OR
a selection to the Hall of Fame's All-Decade Team

*eligible only as a senior nominee

This year's inductees (finalists in bold) will be announced today.

Cowboys (14)
Larry Allen OL
*George Andrie DL
*Cornell Green DB
Charles Haley DL
*Cliff Harris DB
*Chuck Howley LB
*Lee Roy Jordan LB
*Harvey Martin DL
*Ralph Neely OL
Nate Newton OL
*John Niland OL
Jay Novacek TE
*Drew Pearson WR
Darren Woodson DB

Dolphins (5)
*Dick Anderson DB
*Bob Kuechenberg OL
*Jake Scott S
*Bill Stanfill DL
[View Full Quote]

Someone please forward this to the Hall of Fame voters !
How could we have so many more players on this list ?
It's an outrage I tell ya !!!

percyhoward · 02-02-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diogenes

Extreme prejudice is what it is. It doesn't get any more "in your face" than that. Thanks for putting this together.

You're welcome.

There are now 24 linebackers in the HOF. Only 7 of the 24 were named 1st team All-Pro by the Associated Press more times than Howley.

38 of the top 39 vote-getters for the HOF's All-Decade Teams of the 70s and 80s are in the Hall of Fame. The only exception is a Cowboy -- Cliff Harris, who was one of the top 10 vote-getters for the 70s team.

On the HOF's All-Decade Team of the 70s, 37 of the top 39 vote-getters are either Hall of Famers, or have at least been semi-finalists. The only exceptions are two Cowboys -- Drew Pearson and Harvey Martin.

There were 38 players on the HOF's All-Decade team of the 60s. Anybody on that team with a ring who was 1st team AP All-Pro is either a Hall of Famer or has been a finalist. The only exception is Cowboy Ralph Neely.

Biggems · 02-02-2013

I am so sick of the anti-Cowboys voting. Honestly, the only way to rectify this is to have a Cowboy inducted every year for the next decade....We would still be a few short, but at least the HOF would be more credible. As it is, I find the HOF to be a crock, with so many deserving players not in there, not just our players, but other players as well.

great work percy, thanks for the research and post. do you by chance have a top 25 list of "No Ring" players who are HOF worthy?

perrykemp · 02-02-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Risen Star

Do you think Darren Woodson eventually gets in?

It's Irvin, Woodson and then everybody else on my all time favorite players list.

It's been talked about here before, however, Woodson's 23 interceptions over 12 seasons (only 1.9 per season) are probably going to hinder his case. Beyond that he was only named All-Pro 3 times which is borderline for HoF candidates these days.

There is a log jam with some other safeties of the same era who were borderline HoF as well which complicates things as well -- one example Leroy Butler (38 Interceptions, 4 All-Pros) as well as Tim McDonald.