Rice told Georgia to avoid conflict with Russia: report - Dallas Cowboys Forum

**BrAinPaiNt** · 08-13-2008

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Wed Aug 13, 6:52 AM ET

WASHINGTON (AFP) - US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice privately warned Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili to avoid a conflict with Russia during her trip to Tbilisi in July, The New York Times reported Wednesday.

"She told him, in no uncertain terms, that he had to put a non-use of force pledge on the table," an unnamed senior US official who accompanied Rice on the trip told the newspaper.

The message was delivered during a private dinner on July 9, the report added.

Publicly, however, during the trip Rice blamed Russia as a source of continuing unrest in the country.

Russia "needs to be a part of resolving the problem and solving the problems and not contributing to it," she said at a July 10 joint press conference with Saakashvili.

Rice's July visit to Georgia came amid increased diplomatic confrontation between the Washington and Moscow over Georgia's desire to join NATO, as well as the status of the separatist provinces of Abkhazia and South Ossetia.

Despite the public bravado, top US officials warned the Georgians not to allow the conflict to escalate through until hours before Georgia launched its attack, the newspaper reported.

The top US envoy for the region, Assistant Secretary of State Daniel Fried, received a phone call from Georgia's foreign minister on Thursday saying their country was under attack, the report stated.

"We told them they had to keep their unilateral cease-fire," the unnamed official told the newspaper. "We said, be smart about this, don't go in and don't fall for the Russian provocation. Do not do this'."

Saakashvili did not inform Washington ahead of the offensive, senior US officials told the newspaper.

"The Georgians figured it was better to ask forgiveness later, but not ask for permission first," an administration official told the newspaper. "It was a decision on their part. They knew we would say no'."

arglebargle · 08-13-2008

Well, that seems to undercut some of the more extremist arguements. Repeatedly warned not to do something stupid, by falling for the Russian provocation. What were the Georgians thinking?? Kudos to Rice on this, they were dead on about the situation. Unfortunately now, a lot of people are just dead.

arglebargle · 08-13-2008

Looks like maybe the Georgians made a calculated gamble, that they would succeed, or that the US would have to back them in any case. Makes you wonder who's wagging who....

yeahyeah · 08-13-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by arglebargle

Looks like maybe the Georgians made a calculated gamble, that they would succeed, or that the US would have to back them in any case. Makes you wonder who's wagging who....

Thats exactly what I have been saying the whole time. Everyone knew what was up. WE told them..the Russkies did too. Stupid is as stupid does.

burmafrd · 08-13-2008

Love how some here are defending the russians no matter what.

ThaBigP · 08-13-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by burmafrd

Love how some here are defending the russians no matter what.

It doesn't sound like wholesale defence of the Russian action to me. Just pragmatic acknowledgement that the Georgians (or at least their President) are terrible at chess. Real chess, where real people die rather than little wooden or ceramic icons of people. I do think when the dust settles we should take Saakashvilli (sp? it's late) to task for his ill-advised actions. But before we do, I want to know the lingering question....were the Russian peacekeepers hit by Georgian fire, or Georgian return fire? If the latter, I drop all blame I may have for the Georgian action. They would have been fired upon first. They say so....it remains to be seen. However, so far human rights groups on the scene have reported that Russian accusations against the Georgians are wildly exagerated. Borderline false provacateur. What else, then, are they lying about? Cease-fires, limits of action and engagement, etc etc.

ThaBigP · 08-13-2008

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008...eorgia.russia1

ThaBigP · 08-13-2008

It still smells to me like this was a setup all along, and not one the Georgians could have probably avoided. The Russians seem to have been determined to manufacture any pretext for this. In fact, Russian denial-of-service attacks against Georgian websites began days in advance of the Georgian offensive. I would not be surprised for us to discover that the Russians started the shooting. In fact, Russian fighters were seen bombing Georgian positions before they moved into S Ossetia.

utrunner07 · 08-14-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by yeahyeah

Thats exactly what I have been saying the whole time. Everyone knew what was up. WE told them..the Russkies did too. Stupid is as stupid does.

A LOT of high up sources and reliable sources are now coming out and saying that it appears the Russians provoked the attack...going as far as shooting at S. Oestiens to make it appear Georgia was doing it....but you go ahead and defend Russia and blame Georgia for this...you have no idea, im not sure you have the cognitive ability to put two and two together to understand it though, so I will refrain from trying to explain it to you.

yeahyeah · 08-14-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by utrunner07

A LOT of high up sources and reliable sources are now coming out and saying that it appears the Russians provoked the attack...going as far as shooting at S. Oestiens to make it appear Georgia was doing it....but you go ahead and defend Russia and blame Georgia for this...you have no idea, im not sure you have the cognitive ability to put two and two together to understand it though, so I will refrain from trying to explain it to you.

........Now that your personal shock and awe campaign has floored me..can you please provide those sources?

burmafrd · 08-14-2008

Don't bother with the genius. Nothing you could come up with would be acceptable to him. He has his mind made up and nothing will change it.

Viper · 08-14-2008

I'll still like to hear an explanation.

Russia warned Georgia, Georgia deserves this.

U.S. repeatedly warned Iraq for 12 years, bad, bad U.S.

utrunner07 · 08-14-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by yeahyeah

........Now that your personal shock and awe campaign has floored me..can you please provide those sources?

Do you watch the news? Read the paper?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2...section=justin

http://english.aljazeera.net/news/eu...316912721.html

http://www.eurasianet.org/department...v060208a.shtml

http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5...tNFmB4QOXKJ42Q

http://www.istockanalyst.com/article/viewiStockNews+articleid_2413551~title_Georgian-TV-Company.html

http://www.kommersant.com/p914485/Ge...Troops_Russia/

http://www.civil.ge/eng/article.php?id=18867

I doubt you will read these as obviously you are going to believe what you want....however if you do there is no way you can say that 1) Georgia was not unprovoked...these articles show they were provoked over months and months and months, and 2) you should have a pretty good idea of why some people think Russian troops in S. Ossetia may have fired the first shots....be careful though its a lot of reading and may require you to think some so don't wear yourself out....

utrunner07 · 08-14-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viper

I'll still like to hear an explanation.

Russia warned Georgia, Georgia deserves this.

U.S. repeatedly warned Iraq for 12 years, bad, bad U.S.

Viper, its not evenly remotely the same...to make a comparison shows your real lack of intelligence...you are not even going to see the staunchest democrats making such comparisons...

What did Russia warn Georgia? Do you know or are you just saying this? You are right, they did warn them but I really want to know if you know what it was they warned them....I doubt you do becuase if you did then you would not be defending Russia.

utrunner07 · 08-14-2008

I don't think a few of you understand who Putin is, what he has done, what he is doing...etc. If you think the president of Russia is in control you are delusional, Putin, the ex-KGB, is calling all the shots and it is amazing to me that some of you could support this guy and not even consider him capable of manipulating the situation as he pleases to make Georgia look like the aggressor...Georgia was defending its own sovereign territory and never encroached on Russian ground nor did they have a history of treating the S. Ossetians poorly (Russians on the other hand, supplied and encouraged S. Ossetian rebels)...yet Georgia is the aggressor? Thats a little absurd and exactly the way Putin has set up the situation...its quiet pathetic that some of you could defend him...