Is Passing This Bill the Right Thing To Do?

[ABQCOWBOY]

House Republicans Push Counter-Proposal on Stimulus


Far from rolling over, House Republican leaders are trying to win concessions from President Obama over the massive economic stimulus package and have proffered a bill of their own to put on the negotiating table.

The counter-package, which is separate from a substitute amendment already proposed by House Republicans, would shift focus entirely from spending to tax relief. Though a full House vote on the Democratic package is expected in a matter of hours and President Obama said he's confident it will pass, GOP lawmakers are hoping their proposal at least influences the final product.

In a brief session with reporters Wednesday, Republicans panned the $825 billion proposal under consideration as a "non-stimulus" bill chock full of gift-wrapped spending items.

"People are recognizing very quickly that's it's not one, stimulative, and two, it's full of all sorts of things that are sort of favorite political projects of the Democrat majority," said Rep. Tom Price, R-Ga., chairman of the Republican Study Committee.

"If government spending was going to get us out of this mess, we'd have been out a long time ago, because that's all we've been doing," said Rep. Jim Jordan, R-Ohio. "This is not going to work. That's why we've got a bill we think will work."

Their bill, called the Economic Recovery and Middle-Class Tax Relief Act of 2009, promises a host of tax-cutting measures. It includes a 5 percent "across the board" income tax cut; an increase in the child tax credit from $1,000 to $5,000; a freeze on capital gains and dividends tax rates at 15 percent; and a number of other measures targeted toward businesses.

The Republicans authoring the alternative bill did not have an estimate for the cost of their counter-proposal, but Price said so far the bill has 65 co-sponsors.

Republicans said they're not just trying to make a political point, but put forward a proposal that reflects the wishes of their constituents.

"Bipartisan does not mean that either side should be giving up what their principles are," said Rep. Scott Garrett, R-N.J.

The Democratic bill due for a House vote Wednesday includes about $550 billion in spending and about $275 billion in tax cuts.

Rep. Eric Cantor, R-Va., and Rep. David Camp, R-Mich., have also proposed a substitute amendment to the Democratic bill that would strip almost all of the existing language and add income tax rate deductions, alternative minimum tax relief, small business deductions and other measures.

Rep. Mike Pence, R-Ind., said Wednesday that Republicans are "finding their voice" on the debate and "getting in the fight."

He and House Minority Leader John Boehner dismissed the Democratic proposal as a partisan grab bag driven by "old liberal spending priorities."

"The Democratic bill won't stimulate anything but more government and more debt," Boehner said. "Americans need this bill to work."

Republicans won a few concessions, as Democrats deleted $20 million meant to re-sod the National Mall in D.C., and stripped about $200 million for contraceptive services. But that's not enough say Republicans, who said they felt Obama had reached out to them in meetings a day earlier on Capitol Hill and were hopeful the new president would at least incorporate some of their ideas. Obama said Tuesday that lawmakers should put politics aside and pass a stimulus for the sake of the American economy.

FOX News' Mosheh Oinounou contributed to this report


Well, this is what was voted in. We're screwed. This is going to pass no matter what the American people think. I asked this question yesterday and I ask it again. Is there anybody on this board who believes passing this bill is a good idea?

[Dallas]

No its not a good idea. I think most sane posters understand the politics involved and the lack of anything this stimulus package will give the US citizen.

Absolutely nothing.


My 8 yr old will be there at the end holding the check.

[Rowdy]

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

House Republicans Push Counter-Proposal on Stimulus


Far from rolling over, House Republican leaders are trying to win concessions from President Obama over the massive economic stimulus package and have proffered a bill of their own to put on the negotiating table.

The counter-package, which is separate from a substitute amendment already proposed by House Republicans, would shift focus entirely from spending to tax relief. Though a full House vote on the Democratic package is expected in a matter of hours and President Obama said he's confident it will pass, GOP lawmakers are hoping their proposal at least influences the final product.

In a brief session with reporters Wednesday, Republicans panned the $825 billion proposal under consideration as a "non-stimulus" bill chock full of gift-wrapped spending items.

[View Full Quote]"People are recognizing very quickly that's it's not one, stimulative, and two, it's full of all sorts of things that are sort of favorite political projects of the Democrat majority," said Rep. Tom Price, R-Ga., chairman of the Republican Study Committee.

"If government spending was going to get us out of this mess, we'd have been out a long time ago, because that's all we've been doing," said Rep. Jim Jordan, R-Ohio. "This is not going to work. That's why we've got a bill we think will work."

Their bill, called the Economic Recovery and Middle-Class Tax Relief Act of 2009, promises a host of tax-cutting measures. It includes a 5 percent "across the board" income tax cut; an increase in the child tax credit from $1,000 to $5,000; a freeze on capital gains and dividends tax rates at 15 percent; and a number of other measures targeted toward businesses.

The Republicans authoring the alternative bill did not have an estimate for the cost of their counter-proposal, but Price said so far the bill has 65 co-sponsors.

Republicans said they're not just trying to make a political point, but put forward a proposal that reflects the wishes of their constituents.

"Bipartisan does not mean that either side should be giving up what their principles are," said Rep. Scott Garrett, R-N.J.

The Democratic bill due for a House vote Wednesday includes about $550 billion in spending and about $275 billion in tax cuts.

Rep. Eric Cantor, R-Va., and Rep. David Camp, R-Mich., have also proposed a substitute amendment to the Democratic bill that would strip almost all of the existing language and add income tax rate deductions, alternative minimum tax relief, small business deductions and other measures.

Rep. Mike Pence, R-Ind., said Wednesday that Republicans are "finding their voice" on the debate and "getting in the fight."

He and House Minority Leader John Boehner dismissed the Democratic proposal as a partisan grab bag driven by "old liberal spending priorities."

"The Democratic bill won't stimulate anything but more government and more debt," Boehner said. "Americans need this bill to work."

Republicans won a few concessions, as Democrats deleted $20 million meant to re-sod the National Mall in D.C., and stripped about $200 million for contraceptive services. But that's not enough say Republicans, who said they felt Obama had reached out to them in meetings a day earlier on Capitol Hill and were hopeful the new president would at least incorporate some of their ideas. Obama said Tuesday that lawmakers should put politics aside and pass a stimulus for the sake of the American economy.

FOX News' Mosheh Oinounou contributed to this report


Well, this is what was voted in. We're screwed. This is going to pass no matter what the American people think. I asked this question yesterday and I ask it again. Is there anybody on this board who believes passing this bill is a good idea?

The Bill you are speaking of is the Democratic Bill that will be voted in or are you referring to the Republican counter-package?

[BrAinPaiNt]

At this point no. Even if you believe that we need a stimulus package the current one is load with too much pork and side projects by the dems.

However just because they vote on things right now does not mean this is the final bill that will get passed.

I have a feeling some more things will be removed from this (one thing already has) before all is said and done but sadly there will still be pork in it.

[ABQCOWBOY]

Originally Posted by Rowdy

The Bill you are speaking of is the Democratic Bill that will be voted in or are you referring to the Republican counter-package?

Current Bill being voted on.

[ABQCOWBOY]

Originally Posted by BrAinPaiNt

At this point no. Even if you believe that we need a stimulus package the current one is load with too much pork and side projects by the dems.

However just because they vote on things right now does not mean this is the final bill that will get passed.

I have a feeling some more things will be removed from this (one thing already has) before all is said and done but sadly there will still be pork in it.

I hope your last is true. Unfortunatly, all too often, the moneys appropriated for certain things never even get to the designated objectives. You may get 40 Billion carved out for Bridge improvements but, once those dollars get down to the level at which they can be spent, they are used to pay for some other project. It happens a lot and I'd expect it will happen a great deal on this one to.

I just think this is about the worst case scenario being played out but it's hard to believe that these guys would be that stupid.

[Cajuncowboy]

How come there is no option in the poll for "Hell No"?

If you want to stimulate the economy and are hell bent on spending 800B just give it to the people. The American society has proven it doesn't like to save much so give it to the people. Heck it was our money to start with. And while I am not for giving money to those who didn't pay taxes, even if you did this for every person in the country each person would receive a total of approx. 2631 dollars. A family of four would get 10526.00. While some of that would be spent on paying bills and some would be spent illegally the majority of that would put some big time cash right into the economy.

But then again, as Brain was saying, there has to be pork projects and this wouldn't accomplish that.

[ABQCOWBOY]

Originally Posted by Cajuncowboy

How come there is no option in the poll for "Hell No"?

I was so pissed off while writting it that it was all I could do to type Yes - No.

[Doomsday101]

As is no, I think hearing should be held and problems looked at and funded accordingly if need be and that money should go for specific things not handing out money to be spent however the receipt likes.

[JBond]

Originally Posted by ABQCOWBOY

I hope your last is true. Unfortunatly, all too often, the moneys appropriated for certain things never even get to the designated objectives. You may get 40 Billion carved out for Bridge improvements but, once those dollars get down to the level at which they can be spent, they are used to pay for some other project. It happens a lot and I'd expect it will happen a great deal on this one to.

I just think this is about the worst case scenario being played out but it's hard to believe that these guys would be that stupid.

It took $150,000,000,000 in pork/bribes to get the last one through. This one will be no different.

Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

[dbair1967]

Originally Posted by Cajuncowboy

How come there is no option in the poll for "Hell No"?
If you want to stimulate the economy and are hell bent on spending 800B just give it to the people. The American society has proven it doesn't like to save much so give it to the people. Heck it was our money to start with. And while I am not for giving money to those who didn't pay taxes, even if you did this for every person in the country each person would receive a total of approx. 2631 dollars. A family of four would get 10526.00. While some of that would be spent on paying bills and some would be spent illegally the majority of that would put some big time cash right into the economy.

But then again, as Brain was saying, there has to be pork projects and this wouldn't accomplish that.

AMEN!

[ABQCOWBOY]

House Democrats Rally Ahead of Vote on Stimulus Package



President's plan to revive the economy is all but certain to clear its first hurdle when the House of Representatives votes Wednesday on an $819 billion stimulus package.

FOXNews.com

Wednesday, January 28, 2009


Democratic congressional leaders practically declared victory Wednesday afternoon, as the House of Representatives prepared to vote on the $819 billion economic stimulus package.

The massive recovery package has stirred consternation among Republicans who say their ideas are not being adequately considered. But Democrats have a comfortable majority in the House and stressed that fact in a talk with reporters.

"If there is somebody who is disgruntled, so be it. But we will have an overwhelming vote," House Speaker Nancy Pelosi said. She and more than a half-dozen other Democrats touted the bill and chided Republicans for pushing what they called the kind of failed policies that led to the economic crisis.

"The Republicans are talking about process. I think when you lose the argument on substance, on policy, what do you do? You talk about process and you talk about personality," she said.

Meanwhile, House Republican leaders were standing firm in their opposition to the stimulus plan. Just ahead of the House vote, they insisted that their own plan, focusing on tax relief, would create twice as many new jobs -- 6.2 million -- as the plan Obama is pushing, while costing about half as much.

House Minority Leader John Boehner said Republicans remain "disappointed" in the stimulus plan coming to a vote. He says it includes a "lot of wasteful spending that won't create jobs."

He says the GOP plan for "fast-acting tax relief" would "create jobs and preserve jobs in America."

As the House debated a slew of amendments on the floor Wednesday, White House press secretary Robert Gibbs downplayed the disagreements over the bill.

"Tonight starts the beginning of what we know is going to be a long process," Gibbs said, adding that the White House hopes the bill can be signed by mid-February. "Tonight will be a very important first step."

The House measure had been estimated to cost $825 billion, but the Congressional Budget Office updated the bill's price tag to $816 billion after accountants recalculated the cost. That total rose by $3 billion when the House approved on a voice vote a Democratic amendment for mass transit.

Earlier Wednesday, President Obama tried to assure skeptics who say the package is too costly and contains too many measures that will not stimulate job growth.

He called for "bold and swift" action and said that the stimulus package before Congress will make critical investments in the private sector as well as the national infrastructure.

"We will invest in what works," Obama said, pledging to release information about how the money is spent.

In an earlier appearance, Obama said he's confident the bill will pass but preferred not to speculate on how much Republican support he will get when the roll is called. Obama had said earlier that Republican support would back up his argument that a new style of bipartisan politics is needed in Washington.

Asked whether he was confident of getting Republican support, he replied only: "I'm confident we're going to get it passed."

His program is expansive -- and expensive. Republican support remained in doubt in the hours leading up to the vote.

Senate Republican leader Mitch McConnell also expressed skepticism about the bill pushed by House Democrats.

Senate committees were working on a separate version of the measure that enjoyed only slightly more support from Republicans. Congressional leaders have promised Obama they would send him the measure, which could be the single largest bill ever to go through Congress, by mid-February.

The president's first days in office have been dominated by his efforts to drum up bipartisan support for the sweeping plan to help pull the country out of the year-old recession that he inherited from President Bush. The increasingly troublesome economy -- and the federal government's response to it -- is the first major test of Obama's presidency. How he handles the volatile situation, and the effect of his stimulus package on the economy, could set the tone for his first year in office, if not his entire term.

He is casting the measure as the first step toward turning around the moribund economy while laying the foundation for long-term objectives, like developing alternative energy sources and rebuilding the country's highways.

The House measure includes about $550 billion in spending and roughly $275 billion in tax cuts in hopes of spurring the economy and helping those directly affected. Much of the spending would be for items such as health care, jobless benefits, food stamps and other programs that benefit victims of the downturn.

The Associated Press contributed to this report.

[Doomsday101]

Many Republican were not thrilled with the 700 billion dollar bailout as their phones were ringing off the wall by voters in their home state now we are throwing out more money and according to Pelosi this is about being disgruntled? Hey Pelosi if you have the votes then do it and shut your pie hole you can explain yourself to the voters in your district.

[BrAinPaiNt]

It has already had three things removed from it.

What people also need to understand that the dems were going to get this first vote and the republicans are basically getting a free vote.

This still has to go to another group and it will be negotiated some more and chances are we will not know the final bill for another 2 weeks or so.

I also think Obama needs to reign in that motormouth Pelosi as she is not helping him with this stuff. I think he really is trying to get a better relationship between the parties but the nipple head dems like Pelosi have been so spineless and ineffective over the years that now they got some power and want to lay a power trip out there. I have a feeling Obama will have a little word with Nancy and the like before it is said and done...kind of like how he grabbed Biden's arm and gave him one of those stop or I will beat you looks when Biden poked fun of Roberts over the oath.

By the same token...republicans need to learn that they are no longer in power and all things are not going to their way. Good or bad they just are not going to get everything they want. I seen where they have came out with not just changes to the proposed bill but a whole new proposed bill of their own. Hate to be a pecker about it but they know that is not going to happen. They are better off working on the existing one to get the pork out cause this is not going to change to a completely different bill. And an argument can be made by opponents that they had plenty of years to get things right now, for good or bad, America has said it is the dems chance.

Personally I don't have much faith in either so at this point I hope they just get as much pork out of it as possible and I think Obama will, as I noted before, have to have a wood shed moment with Pelosi and some other dems. Because no matter what we want, there will be a big stimilus bill passed and we will all pay for it. Let's just hope, for all of our sakes, that it helps some.

[Doomsday101]

Originally Posted by BrAinPaiNt

It has already had three things removed from it.

What people also need to understand that the dems were going to get this first vote and the republicans are basically getting a free vote.

This still has to go to another group and it will be negotiated some more and chances are we will not know the final bill for another 2 weeks or so.

I also think Obama needs to reign in that motormouth Pelosi as she is not helping him with this stuff. I think he really is trying to get a better relationship between the parties but the nipple head dems like Pelosi have been so spineless and ineffective over the years that now they got some power and want to lay a power trip out there. I have a feeling Obama will have a little word with Nancy and the like before it is said and done...kind of like how he grabbed Biden's arm and gave him one of those stop or I will beat you looks when Biden poked fun of Roberts over the oath.

[View Full Quote]By the same token...republicans need to learn that they are no longer in power and all things are not going to their way. Good or bad they just are not going to get everything they want. I seen where they have came out with not just changes to the proposed bill but a whole new proposed bill of their own. Hate to be a pecker about it but they know that is not going to happen. They are better off working on the existing one to get the pork out cause this is not going to change to a completely different bill. And an argument can be made by opponents that they had plenty of years to get things right now, for good or bad, America has said it is the dems chance.

Personally I don't have much faith in either so at this point I hope they just get as much pork out of it as possible and I think Obama will, as I noted before, have to have a wood shed moment with Pelosi and some other dems. Because no matter what we want, there will be a big stimilus bill passed and we will all pay for it. Let's just hope, for all of our sakes, that it helps some.

Pelosi does not work for Obama, like Obama she is freely elected by people in her district so I doubt he is going to force her to do anything. As for Republican we know we lost and I hope they try to work with this administration but they too are accountable to the people they represent and should vote as such or else they come home with their seat up for grabs as many voters will look to someone else.