Discussion in 'Draft Zone' started by starfrombirth, Mar 21, 2014.
Jerry will draft johnny football, no question in my mind.
In the long run is that a bad idea tho? I dont think it would be. Im conflicted tho. Not on the player but the situation
Ryan Leaf was in a BCS conference and played some pretty tough teams as well. He was hyped pretty good just like Manziel. So yes its hype as regards performance in the NFL.
Sorry but the pac 10 doesnt compare to sec. Never has. Pac 10 has always been offense, disreguard defense. What's hyped Manziel is his play on the field.
McShay said Carr is a fourth round prospect on his board. I'm not really a big fan either.
Not sure Dallas will bite, but starting to believe Johnny Football will fall like chum.
I'm in the same boat as you on this one.
Very conflicted. He could be something special and breathe new life into the franchise.
He could be, like Burma inferred- the next Ryan Leaf without the total crappy attitude.
He has an arm, accuracy, great mobility and a strong will to win.
All good stuff.
He's also tiny, unproven and got some Justin Bieber in him.
I love Romo, but the writing on the wall etches deeper every year and these back surgeries are reasons to be concerned going forward.
I just don't know how I'll feel if they end up drafting him (without trading up, obviously):
Probably concerned, but hopeful for the best. Put that kid into the weight room, get him under Romo's wing ASAP and have their former player who's a counselor now with the team (I can't recall his name) start preparing him for life in the NFL immediately.
System QB if I ever seen one... I like him though.
Manziel is solid 207 lbs muscular. And the number that should be looked at more then his height is his hands. some of the biggest in QBs this yr.
I would love to see Manziel drop to 16.
The phones at Valley Ranch would be going crazy with trade up offers. Hopefully. But no way would I select him.
I couldn't agree more. I think he can be top tier quarterback but he has some flaws that he needs to work on first. I'm not comparing his play to his brothers but I think that throwing him to the wolves behind a porous O-Line could end the same. On the flip side I see a lot of Aaron Rodgers in his game but think he would need to follow a similar path if he's going to end up anywhere close to that.
My take on Carr:
DEREK CARR QB, Fresno State
Strengths: Holds the ball high, quick release, displays accuracy at all levels, fits the ball in tight windows, throws receivers open, plus arm strength, athleticism to escape the rush, quick decision making
Weaknesses: Inconsistent footwork and body alignment, will lock onto receivers, pocket awareness, played in two half-field read offenses, hand size
Summary: Derek Carr is a 3 year starter at Fresno State and two time winner of the Mountain West Conference Offensive Player of the Year award. He threw for over 5000 yards his senior season breaking his own conference record. He was twice voted a team captain of the Bulldogs. Carr played under center in a pro-style offense his first 2 years at Fresno State, one of those as a starter, and his last two years were spent leading an up-tempo spread attack that emphasized getting rid of the ball quickly. Both offenses that he ran employed half-field quarterback reads. The spread offense utilized a high percentage of screens and swing passes which contributed to his 70.1% completion percentage and gaudy yardage totals.
I viewed two games form 2011, his first year as a starter, in which Carr demonstrated an ability to play from under center. The center-quarterback exchanges were clean; he was quick in his setup and consistent on his drops while keeping his eyes down the field. The majority of pass plays that he ran from under center were play action; he does a good job of selling the play fake. In obvious passing situations they moved him into shotgun. In his junior and senior years he operated exclusively out of the shotgun.
Carr has a compact throwing motion; he holds the ball high in his stance and has a very quick release. His release point is at the ear; he puts a tight spin on the ball but his hands are on the smaller side which might cause some cold weather teams to shy away from drafting him. He has plus arm strength and generates excellent torque with his lower body. This is demonstrated by his ability to throw the ball 50+ yards down the field with what appears to be minimum effort. He has drawn comparisons to Jay Cutler and I think there is some validity to that comparison when discussing his arm strength and the velocity at which he can throw the ball. He regularly fits the ball into tight windows. He can make all the throws; displays a nice touch on deep bucket throws but will occasionally hang one. He is proficient in his pre snap reads; does a good job of adjusting his protection and identifying mismatches at the line. Carr is quick through his progressions; gets rid of the ball quickly but he occasionally locks onto receivers with his eyes at the snap. He has quick feet and the athleticism to turn busted plays into positive ones but often lacks awareness of the rush.
Where Carr has troubles is with his footwork and body alignment. When he tries to rush his throw he doesn’t always get a proper alignment between his feet, hips, and shoulders which leads to off balance and off target throws. This is most evident when sees pressure or identifies a receiver wide open in blown coverage. At times I think he has too much confidence in his arm strength; he doesn’t always step or he will short step and doesn’t open his hips enough to generate the needed torque on some deep balls. This is usually the case when he hangs one. When he does this on short and intermediate passes, he will sometimes overcompensate with his arm and badly overthrow a receiver or he ends up he will end up having to throw too far across his body and misses his receiver.
In the Mountain West Conference, Derek Carr did not face top level competition week in and week out. The two worst performances I saw on tape were his bowl games against SMU and USC his junior and senior years which is concerning. Both of these teams were able to generate significant pressure which resulted in Carr trying to rush a lot of throws, and not always out of necessity. Even though both of those games ended in blowouts Carr was competing right up to the final whistle and never exhibited any body language that was of concern. The Rutgers game probably best exemplifies his competitiveness. In a game with 5 lead changes in the 4th quarter alone Carr threw a game tying touchdown pass with 40 seconds left in regulation and then led his team to victory with a touchdown pass on the first play of overtime. Carr elevated his play as the game went on and came up big in several pressure situations.
Derek Carr is a highly competitive, athletic, intelligent quarterback with a strong arm and a quick release. He has the physical attributes to be a top quarterback at the NFL level but he needs to develop more consistency with his fundamentals if he is going to become one. He has shown improvement in this area the last few years and he is an extremely accurate passer when his mechanics are right. Derek would benefit by being drafted by a team that was willing to let him sit for a year or two before making him a starter. I like him in the second round but think he will probably go in the first round to a quarterback needy team because of his upside.
You mean, like Tom Brady coming out...or maybe Matt Ryan.
Yep. Sanchez too....and a long , very long list of others
Tom Brady and Matt Ryan both are much bigger than Manziel and had the frame to put on muscle and they both have. Manziel and Bridgewater are both small boned. They may be able to add some muscle weight but they still have small bones. Manziel almost didn't make it thru last year. He got up holding his collarbone against LSU and i thought he was done. If that was an NFL sized LB that buried him... he would've been done. I know injuries can happen to anyone but some body types are more prone to it than others.
I wax referring to Carr.
Carr is 6,2 and 214, Ryan was skinnier at 6'4 and 217
I'm sorry. I was referencing the mention of bridgewater and manziels size. I actually like carr, just not in the first which is where some draftnicks are putting him now. I heard someone the other day (I forget who) have him going to Oakland with the 5th pick which is what prompted this thread. To me that's just ridiculous.
Guy was awful against USC pass rush and great against air at his pro day. Go figure.
Did you watch the game? D was in his face right off the snap all day. OL couldnt block DL. Supposed you didnt watch what he did at the sr bowl either
Yep gotta have escapability or get rid of the ball quicker beacuse I doubt he inherits a great O Line where ever he ends up. When QBs start hearing footsteps the party is over. This is also a big criticism of Garropolo.
This year, but going on drafts past- not THAT big...
I get your point though- he's not "tiny" like I said.