1. Welcome to CowboysZone!  Join us!  Come on!  You know you want to!

News: DMN: Gosselin: Why Cowboys made a mistake drafting Demarcus Lawrence

Discussion in 'News Zone' started by NewsBot, May 19, 2014.

  1. Zimmy Lives

    Zimmy Lives Well-Known Member

    5,986 Messages
    1,051 Likes Received
    Start? How about not even making the JV. :D
    casmith07 likes this.
  2. speedkilz88

    speedkilz88 Well-Known Member

    20,859 Messages
    1,238 Likes Received
    What are you complaining about? They traded back and got more picks. They went with the shotgun approach. Amazing how that worked out!
    IrishAnto likes this.
  3. adbutcher

    adbutcher K9NME

    10,742 Messages
    413 Likes Received
    Awesome post!
    casmith07 and REDVOLUTION like this.
  4. IrishAnto

    IrishAnto Well-Known Member

    1,091 Messages
    171 Likes Received
    None of whom they picked that's what!!!

    They didn't get man they wanted, traded down and made a mess of the 2009 draft.

    You're assuming those days are completely behind them.
  5. IrishAnto

    IrishAnto Well-Known Member

    1,091 Messages
    171 Likes Received
    Indeed but for whatever reason they didn't pick any of them, traded down and the rest is history.

    Last year despite Sharrif Floyd being the highest rated player on their board when it was their turn to pick, they traded back and went with Frederick.

    That worked well but there's no guarantee it would have worked again this year.

    Who's to say had they not nabbed Lawrence, they wouldn't have butchered the rest of the draft.
  6. Yakuza Rich

    Yakuza Rich Well-Known Member

    12,389 Messages
    1,418 Likes Received
    Not exactly the approach I would want since they didn't have a 1st round pick because of the Roy Williams trade blunder.





    YR
  7. Yakuza Rich

    Yakuza Rich Well-Known Member

    12,389 Messages
    1,418 Likes Received
    Soooooo...

    if they are so terrible at picking players, would that not stand to reason that they should try and acquire more picks?





    YR
  8. REDVOLUTION

    REDVOLUTION Return to Dominance

    25,293 Messages
    1,244 Likes Received
    Awesome sig.... Awesome tag line!
    adbutcher likes this.
  9. speedkilz88

    speedkilz88 Well-Known Member

    20,859 Messages
    1,238 Likes Received
    Agreed there. They should never trade high picks for WRs ever again.
  10. IrishAnto

    IrishAnto Well-Known Member

    1,091 Messages
    171 Likes Received

    As was pointed out above, in 2009 they had 12 picks (not including RW) none were worth anything.

    So that approach doesn't seem to stand the test does it?

    On the whole Dallas seems better able at spotting talent in the top two rounds (everybody should though).

    After that it’s a crapshoot.

    So if we're not one player away form competing, then loosing a 3rd round pick is unlikely to be a major stumbling block to successful rebuilding either.
  11. Yakuza Rich

    Yakuza Rich Well-Known Member

    12,389 Messages
    1,418 Likes Received
    First, the 2009 draft did not feature a first rounder.

    Secondly, you're ignoring playing the odds. There are no guarantees. But....and this is important....if you continue to play the odds correctly over time they will benefit the team.

    Even the best draft teams like the Patriots, Steelers, Eagles and Seahawks have had bad draft classes. The common thread is that they stock up on picks. So they can have a poor draft and continue to stock up on picks the next year and over time they are acquiring new talent.

    Even if DeMarcus Lawrence has DeMarcus Ware capabilities, one injury could derail all of that. I'd rather have that extra pick so we increase the odds of the team finding quality players in the draft.







    YR
  12. IrishAnto

    IrishAnto Well-Known Member

    1,091 Messages
    171 Likes Received
    An injury can derail any players career you don't draft with that uppermost in your mind.

    The teams you mention above all possess impact players and if you grade a player to have that potential especially at one of the coveted positions you take him.

    As you say if you identify players properly and play the odds over time then your chances improve greatly.

    The key point here is "over time" and in that case one 3rd round pick is unlikely to make or break the odds, especially if they're right on Lawrence.
  13. Kaiser

    Kaiser Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

    946 Messages
    692 Likes Received
    This is a case of Life imitating Art:

    [IMG]
  14. Yakuza Rich

    Yakuza Rich Well-Known Member

    12,389 Messages
    1,418 Likes Received
    You can identify 'players properly' all you want. But, there are too many factors that can derail them such as injuries. You also have to worry about your current players on your roster getting injured as well. Let's say we stay put and keep our 3rd rounder....we may get another DE in the 2nd round and then draft the BPA and let's say that is a RT. Not exactly a position of need. That is unless Doug Free gets injured and now you have a better chance of resolving that issue.

    It also helps to motivate veterans if there is a rookie they drafted that is fighting for their spot.

    Or they could have stayed put, possibly gotten Lawrence (almost every draft expert had a mid-2nd round grade on him) and still have a 3rd round pick.

    Now we've put ourselves in a position where it is absolutely critical that Lawrence works out.





    YR
  15. bkight13

    bkight13 Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

    2,419 Messages
    713 Likes Received
    After the draft is over, does it really matter where they were drafted? If a 7th rounder makes the team and a 3rd doesn't, so what, you win some you lose some. There is a new draft every year, plus FA. Too much time is spent on ruing draft picks and misses.
  16. Kaiser

    Kaiser Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

    946 Messages
    692 Likes Received
    I agree with your approach in general, but in this instance Atlanta was widely rumored to be taking Lawrence a few spots behind the pick Dallas traded up to. The key is what rating the Cowboys had on Lawrence (supposedly in the 15- 20 range of the first round) compared to the others that would have been available had they missed out on Lawrence. Others have pointed out the example of Dallas missing Tony Brackens by a few picks and taking Kavika Pittman as their consolation prize. They were stuck with Pittman at a critical position for several years and it was a serious setback.

    If the mid-first round grade on Lawrence was correct, the trade is a good one. If the drop off to other LDE prospects after him was substantial it validates the trade even more.
    AsthmaField likes this.
  17. IrishAnto

    IrishAnto Well-Known Member

    1,091 Messages
    171 Likes Received
    When it comes to the OL name me the last successful 3rd pick they've spent on the OL (seeing as you've brought up RT)?

    One way or another they're going to have become more successful at developing late round picks and UDFAs.

    As much as I like the recent OL picks in the first round we can't keep on spending high picks to fill spots.

    Again in the long term if they go about things the right way, the lack of a 3rd round pick this year will be largely insignificant.

    Sometimes you've got to make a move for the man you think will have most impact.

    Staying put is not always an option.
    AsthmaField likes this.
  18. Yakuza Rich

    Yakuza Rich Well-Known Member

    12,389 Messages
    1,418 Likes Received
    How many good DE's have they developed outside of the 1st round?

    When I look at our main pass rushing DE's over the years, we have had Greg Ellis, DeMarcus Ware and Anthony Spencer (the last 2 would have been 4-3 DE's).

    Doug Free was a 4th round pick. Andre Gurode was a 2nd round pick.

    I agree, they have to do a much better job of developing rounds 2-6 in the draft. Even if they stockpile picks, they still have to develop those picks better. But, they have had more success with developing O-Line than pass rushers outside of the 1st round. Sad, but true.

    I would rather 'throw numbers at the situation' than thinking we have the right guy and hope he doesn't get injured or catches on quickly enough or doesn't have to play out of position and jives with his position coach, etc.





    YR
  19. REDVOLUTION

    REDVOLUTION Return to Dominance

    25,293 Messages
    1,244 Likes Received
    Agreed.
  20. Verdict

    Verdict Well-Known Member

    3,454 Messages
    171 Likes Received
    If the Cowboys think that Lawrence is going to be a situational player this year (and doesn't start) then you have to wonder what they were thinking when they made the trade up. We could have easily developed a situational defensive end with our second round pick without moving up. It would be hard to say Lawrence was worth giving up a pick for or worth taking that high if that is all they really think he is.

Share This Page