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Dont get Lulled to sleep with Coop Health care Diversion Tactics

Discussion in 'Political Zone' started by sbark, Aug 17, 2009.

  1. sbark

    sbark Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

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    from Heritage.org Morning Bell UPdate....

    If the language that comes out of the Senate looks anything like what Schumer is proposing, then there is no real difference between co-ops and the public plan. If, on the other hand, the Senate produces something that; 1) is not funded by the federal government 2) is not “government-run and government-controlled”; but instead 3) is “membership-run and membership controlled” then co-ops would be acceptable.

    The headlines are encouraging: The AP reports, “White House appears ready to drop ‘public option’.” Politico reads, “White House backs away from public health care option.” And the front page of USA Today says, “Obama may drop public option in health care.” These headers all stem from Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius’ comment on CNN Sunday Morning that the public option “is not the essential element” of President Barack Obama’s health care plan. But by Sunday night the White House was already walking back Sebelius’ statement

    ......Liberals have never been this close to passing socialism......they will not go away....they cannot be compromised with, they must be defeated, People who want to remove your freedom cannot be compromised with.......it must be defeated

    They will try to hide health care under diff. walnut shells thruout the summer.......

    In the end.....they will likely use the Nuc' option-----pass it without regard that 82% of people like what they got.........that is when the fireworks will really start.......
  2. zrinkill

    zrinkill Diamond surrounded by trash

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    Same thing I was thinking the other day ....

    I will not believe its really dead until this administration is out of office.

    I actually think its only a matter of time till it gets passed.

    Hopefully I am either wrong about that ..... or I am wrong about what will happen with socialized medicine.

    Unfortunately ..... I do not think I am wrong about either.
  3. JBond

    JBond Well-Known Member

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    Don't worry about me. Once you understand how socialists and fascists operate it is hard to be distracted by their BS. Their play book is old and worn out but they keep going to it. Everyone should take the time to read Rules for Radicals. Followed up by 1984 and Atlas Shrugged.
  4. Doomsday101

    Doomsday101 Well-Known Member

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    The key to me no matter what the administration calls it, it comes down to public or private. I have said before I do not support any Government ran health care system. I think there are things we can do to lower cost which is what the argument was all about to start with and I do not think having a Government ran health care system paid for off the backs of the American middle class tax payer does anything to lower the actual cost
  5. DIAF

    DIAF DivaLover159

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    Uh, no. Politicians fear for their jobs more than they do anything else. Constituents get pissed about their health care, and most DO NOT WANT this reform. That will guarantee this won't pass. Anyone that votes for this against their constituent's will is going to feel it when they are up for reelection. Just look at any of the townhalls given by Arlen Specter for proof.

    I don't get the run to hyperbole so many of you like to engage in when talking about political opinions that differ from your own. These guys aren't comic book villians. It just makes you look silly. Like, Glenn Beck silly.
  6. zrinkill

    zrinkill Diamond surrounded by trash

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    Yes ..... I will give you free healthcare!

  7. sbark

    sbark Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

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    I predict They'll be back at it.....extreme Libs in house are already saying nothing less than Death Care will be acceptable.....

    .If they use the Nuc Option and pass it.....in their "plausible deniability" mode of action----they can then push the message at election time and make the GOP run against "taking free health care away from the poor"......the media will provide cover fire for them.
    ....the GOP has lost many elections haveing to fight this type of propaganda.

    remember the kids going hungry on school lunches programs
    Elderly getting SS cut.......whereas it was just a slow down in growth
    Tried it on S-Chip...until the kid they paraded thru congress was a 80k family

    ....what i do love is the use of Alsinky's tactics & Rules against them
    .......as G.S. Patton would proudly state: I read you book you sob.....
  8. JBond

    JBond Well-Known Member

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    I remember the advertising and billboards well in Missouri. At the time republicans were increasing both benefits, just not a quickly as the left wanted so they called it a cut. Idiots.
  9. Angus

    Angus Active Member

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    I think they have a sneakier plan. Assuming the Senate passes something acceptable but the House keeps the public option, the conference committee to resolve the differences will hold all the cards.

    Reid will appoint the Senate conferees and when the measure comes back from the conference it will contain the bad provisions. That's when the Blue Dogs cave and and debate will be cut off in the Senate.

  10. SuspectCorner

    SuspectCorner Bromo

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    And the 'angry right' continues to sell their own self-interests down the river...

    HMO stocks up on signs public health plan fading

    By Lewis Krauskopf / Reuters.com / Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:16pm EDT

    NEW YORK (Reuters) - The dwindling prospect of a government-run health insurance plan lifted the shares of managed care companies on Monday and relieved investors who feared the companies could not compete with such a plan.

    The S&P Managed Health Care index .GSPHMO of large U.S. health insurers was up 3.8 percent, soundly outperforming a 2.5 percent decline for the broader S&P 500 index .SPX, following comments from the Obama administration that creating a public plan was not essential to a healthcare overhaul.

    Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius said on Sunday that nonprofit cooperatives could also fulfill the White House goal of creating more competition on insurance. Analysts viewed the co-ops as far less threatening to managed care companies, even as details on them remain unclear.

    "This is the best-case scenario," said David Heupel, a portfolio manager with Thrivent Investment Management. It "takes off the table anything really, really onerous for the group, and that's a huge positive."

    UnitedHealth Group Inc (UNH.N) shares rose 3.6 percent at mid-afternoon, WellPoint Inc (WLP.N) climbed 3.3 percent, Aetna Inc (AET.N) increased 5.2 percent, and Coventry Health Care (CVH.N) jumped 5.2 percent.

    The stocks rallied even as billionaire Warren Buffett's Berkshire Hathaway Inc (BRKa.N) late on Friday reported lower stakes in UnitedHealth and WellPoint, the industry's two biggest companies.

    "Investors believe that risk of competition from a government-run plan has declined significantly, and that the co-op option being floated by Democrat legislators will be relatively benign to the HMO industry," analysts at Jefferies & Co said in a research note.

    The S&P Managed Health Care index has risen 18 percent so far this year, with strong gains since July as analysts said investors came to think a public plan was unlikely.

    But their valuations remain low. As of Friday, the managed care index traded at 8.4 times 2010 earnings estimates compared with 11 times for the S&P Health Care Sector index .GSPA and 13.1 times for the S&P 500.

    "The uncertainties of Washington politics make for sleepless nights for even the most convinced healthcare investors," analysts at Leerink Swann said in a research note.

    "Now, with a clearer indication than we have seen previously regarding the likelihood of a public plan, we expect investors to begin to narrow the valuation gap between managed care stocks and the rest of the healthcare sector."

    Investors feared health insurers would be unable to compete with a government run option, and that such a public plan could be a first step to an entirely government-run health system.

    The prospect for a such a plan has sparked intense opposition from Republicans and led to charges that health reform, President Obama's top domestic priority, would amount to a government takeover of healthcare.

    "The public plan option is just too contentious right now and it creates a potential roadblock that is insurmountable between the Democrats and Republicans in both houses of Congress," Stifel Nicolaus analyst Thomas Carroll said.

    The health reform focus shifted to co-ops, which were proposed by Democratic Senator Kent Conrad. He proposed nonprofit, member-operated regional co-ops to compete with insurers. The co-ops would function as a mutual insurance company where policyholders would have some ownership rights.

    Much remains uncertain about the co-ops. A key question is the level of reimbursement to healthcare providers paid by the co-ops, Stifel's Carroll said, which if low could lead to profit margin pressure on private plans.

    "It's going to be this competitive factor that causes managed care companies to bring their margins down," Carroll said.

    Still, he said, "It's easier to compete with a bunch of non-government run, not-for-profit companies, better than it is to compete with a single large government health plan that is basically setting the rules and operating on its own."

    Heupel said the co-op plan does not foreshadow drastic change in the way a public plan did.

    "A co-op plan just doesn't hinder or threaten their ability to continue operating the way they do," Heupel said. "It is by far the lesser of two evils for the managed care industry. It's not even close."

    (Reporting by Lewis Krauskopf, editing by Gerald E. McCormick, Tim Dobbyn and Richard Chang)
  11. sbark

    sbark Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

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  12. burmafrd

    burmafrd Well-Known Member

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    Some one in glass houses should not be throwing stones. I think that will probably fly right over suspects head though.

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