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News: Goose: As long as Jerry Jones is a 'part-time GM,' Cowboys won't be SB contenders

Discussion in 'News Zone' started by Risen Star, Jun 24, 2012.

  1. DallasEast

    DallasEast Cowboys 24/7/365 Zone Supporter

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    Your question was already answered by:
    The story, as presented, was as follows:
    If Spagnola's account is accurate, the information, which Rich Gosselin transferred to Jerry Jones, was first derived from other league teams' evaluations, thus making him the conveyor of the information--not the originator.
    If the information is genuine, the data's sources were other team evaluators. I would presume that other team evaluators would include professional scouts within those organizations.

    If the additional data provided more persuasive data than that submitted by Dallas' evaluators, I would assume again that it would be taken into consideration and certainly not dismissed without review.
    I will not converse about summary conclusions. The alleged submission and value of Gosselin's report to Jones was brought into question. That is my only interest.
    Because he is a journalist, with zero aspirations about working within professional football management, who followed the NFL draft for a long enough period of time that he presumably burned out on it and dropped it altogether..?

    :confused:
  2. junk

    junk I've got moxie

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    That's scary. If a newspaper reporter can present a more compelling case than the scouts.....that doesn't bode well for the scouts.

    You are making assumptions though.

    There is nothing in the original paragraph to support any of that. In fact, it states that the scouting report was Gosselin's, not something coming from another team.

    The only confusing thing is why anyone would try to justify this.
  3. DallasEast

    DallasEast Cowboys 24/7/365 Zone Supporter

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    sigh.
  4. junk

    junk I've got moxie

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    Who hired the QB coach? And, let's be honest, that three years of training was what Romo needed to become what he is today.

    Who allowed Romo to remain on the roster and get that training?

    Actually, it went Vinny then Bledsoe. But who decided to go with Romo when he was ready? Oh, it was Parcells. Payton was gone and Jerry was against going away from Bledsoe.

    What does this have to do with Bill Parcells not building for the future?

    So you don't think developing a raw, but talented UDFA is long range planning?

    Bill brought in Jason to complement his previous high pick in Fasano, huh? I feel like I'm stating the obvious, but Witten was drafted in 2003 and Fasano in 2006.

    I hate the idea of a two-TE base offense, but I again fail to see how this wasn't planning for the future.

    Wait, how does getting rid of older players on the back side of their career mean he is only playing for now? Doesn't that imply long term planning?

    :laugh2: Oh, CCBoy. What are you even arguing?

    Tell me what you want to discuss - that Parcells wasn't a long term planner like Zaxor and I were debating before you jumped in and tried telling us Witten was brought in to complement Fasano or the merits of Parcells time in Dallas in general.
  5. junk

    junk I've got moxie

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    :laugh2:

    That's how I feel. How is it in anyway possible to have your draft be influenced by a newspaper reporter? And we're surprised that Dallas struggles to complete year in and year out.

    Yet, here is DallasEast defending it like it is just a normal occurance.

    But.....I'm the one that just doesn't get it. :laugh2:
  6. Bluestang

    Bluestang Well-Known Member

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    Spagnola didn't go into details on whether the report was Gooselin's own "scouting" or his research from other front offices. He just said that Gooselin showed him his report and that he [Mickey] felt that he needed to show it to Jerry Jones.

    Without knowing what exactly was on the report or how the information was gathered the argument becomes pure speculation.
  7. cowboy_ron

    cowboy_ron You Can't Fix Stupid

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    I definately don't give Parcells the credit for Romo...it was Payton....didn't Parcells in fact almost cut Romo twice, with an injury to one of the old men Parcells brought in is what saved him? When he had the opportunity to play he played well above expectations and had the fans behind him at that point. I don't recall any PC's Parcells after that showed support of Romo, only the "put away the annointing oil" jibberish. Parcells didn't want to be proved wrong and he ultimately has....IMO
  8. CCBoy

    CCBoy Well-Known Member

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    You are a waste of time talking to ernestly.

    You really don't care for anything but creating an unnecessary discussion...because you won't adjust with facts presented, give them credability, or measure what is given.

    That is what was once called a panty waste...as your whole intent is to poke fun at another and insult his intelligence.

    The top picks under Parcells were: Marcus Spears, Jacob Rogers, and Bobby Carpenter. Tell anyone how that is leading towards the future...or just keep it to yourself.

    You miss that Danny White made Tony Romo...not Bill Parcells. Jerry brought White onto the staff...not Bill. As well...don't play as if you don't comprehend those elements and go into your patented chorus of 'We are the world' as you continually attempt to do with Hos.

    You are as cooperative in a discussion, as a knot is to a pair of boxers...
  9. CCBoy

    CCBoy Well-Known Member

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    That song and dance only goes over once...as does a triple reverse or hook and ladder show.:rolleyes:
  10. junk

    junk I've got moxie

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    I agree.

    What we should be able to agree on is that it is data that came from outside of the Dallas personnel department and, apparently, had an influence on the decision.

    I still don't think that reflects well on the Dallas front office.
  11. junk

    junk I've got moxie

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    I think that is a stretch. If Parcells wanted him gone, he'd have been gone.

    What "old man" was injured that saved Romo? If anything saved Romo, it was Quincy Carter's antics that ultimately got him cut.

    If Parcells didn't want to be "proved wrong", why didn't he go back to Bledsoe after Romo's 3 interception performance replacing Bledsoe against the Giants.

    As far as Parcells comments on Romo:

    http://blog.mysanantonio.com/nfl/2011/09/parcells-romo-can-lead-cowboys-to-title/

    He also wrote the 11 QB commandments for Romo and was still texting him last season.

    http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/more_sports/tuna_on_tony_NeG1ZhqV1CFAD4mrFbAmLM/0

    Yes, it certainly seems like a guy who had it out for Romo and wants him to fail.
  12. gmoney112

    gmoney112 Well-Known Member

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    30 pages and you guys aren't bored yet?:laugh1:
  13. tyke1doe

    tyke1doe Well-Known Member

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    Great post.

    I might add that sources often ask reporters for feed back because they know reporters talk to a myriad of sources and get information that those sources may not be able to get themselves.

    I often have sources ask me "What have you heard?"

    They presume because I talk to a wide variety of people with similar interests, that I might know something they don't.

    If Goose has been covering the draft enough to have a higher percentage of correct 1st round picks, then he's got to be getting that information from someone reputable. He must be getting inside information based on people he's talking to in other organizations.

    Jerry Jones would be a fool NOT to listen to him, especially if much of your staff -except for Bill Parcells - is saying the same thing. Apparently, Goose knows that other teams are interested in Ware more than they are Spears.
  14. junk

    junk I've got moxie

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    What facts? That Bill Parcells drafted Witten to complement Fasano? If you can't get them straight, how am I supposed to address them?

    Not at all. You guys seem to want to throw Parcells under the bus as if his time here was complete irrelevant and didn't do anything for the franchise. I happen to disagree. I think his hiring was probably one of the most significant (and important) events for the franchise since the Jimmy days. s

    I presented my case why I believe that and offered my counter to your argument.

    This doesn't make any sense. So Spears, Rogers and Carpenter were Parcells picks and all the rest were.....someone else?

    He was also around for Newman, Witten, Ware, Ratliff, Austin, Romo and James.

    Even so, missing on drafting picks doesn't mean you don't have an eye for the future. Even though the players you pointed out were busts, Parcells still drafted them and tried to develop them.

    Now if he traded away picks for veteran players, you might have a point. But, the only picks I know of him trading were late rounders for Avieon Cason and Terry Glenn.

    Danny White made Tony Romo? :confused:

    Do you mean Sean Payton?

    I can understand if people want to criticize certain moves of Parcells. He made his fair share of gaffes. You pointed out some....there was also Ryan Young, Marco Rivera, etc.

    But, he took a team that had been 15-33 in the three years prior to his arrival and took them to the playoffs. He changed the direction of the franchise. Was it perfect? No. Was it significant and important? Yes.
  15. junk

    junk I've got moxie

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    It is the offseason. I can't wait for TC to start.
  16. Mr_Bill

    Mr_Bill Member

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    If Rick Gosselin actual wrote that report from his own observations, it would have been an absolute first. I was actually reading his articles at the time, and at no time had he ever written a report that contained a detailed scouting report on any player, college or pro. If he was actually scouting players, you would have thought he would have written at least one article containing such analysis.

    Goose had/has many contacts and sources throughout the NFL and well could have received such a report from one of them. That would also explain why he never wrote about it in one of his articles.
  17. CCBoy

    CCBoy Well-Known Member

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    Sean was involved, as was Bill...but neither did the daily work with quarterbacks. No, I wasn't wrong in approach that I took...

    and that makes you what, 0 for 40?
  18. Dodger12

    Dodger12 Well-Known Member

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    Sean Payton was the QB coach when Romo came to Dallas. I'd imagine if someone is going to be involved with the QB's on a daily basis, it would be the QB coach. Of course, I can't be certain because there seems to be a some confusion when it comes to titles and the respective responsibilities of the people who hold specific titles on the Cowboys.

    Having said that, I'll go back to the burn barrel where I belong...........
  19. Hostile

    Hostile Tacos are a good investment Zone Supporter

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    Sean was the Assistant Head Coach/Quarterbacks Coach and he absolutely has been credited by multiple people within the Cowboys organization for alerting them to Tony Romo. From there the scouting department went to work to prepare a plan as to acquiring him. Tony was not invited to the Combines to work out, but he was invited to throw to the receivers and the Cowboys scouts watched him there and determined few teams had interest, one other who definitely did was Denver with Mike Shanahan who like Sean Payton and Romo also went to Eastern Illinois.

    So this was sort of begun as an alumni thing, but it isn't a case where no one else from the Cowboys studied Romo. In fact, Jim Garrett, Jason's Dad, was one of the Scouts who really liked Romo. For what it is worth.
  20. junk

    junk I've got moxie

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    Wait, you said Danny White was the QB coach who brought in Romo.

    And, yes, I suspect the QB coach (Sean Payton, by the way) probably did most of the daily work with the QBs.

    Well, let's see....in this thread alone, you've claimed that Parcells brought in Witten to complement Fasano and that Danny White was a QB coach who brought in Romo. I don't think I'd try to disparage anyone at this point if I were you.

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