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Is it OK to hope the President Fails?

Discussion in 'Political Zone' started by ABQCOWBOY, Mar 3, 2009.

  1. ABQCOWBOY

    ABQCOWBOY Moderator Staff Member

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    I have always been taught to respect the President of the United States regarless of political agenda. I teach that to my own kids. The school of thought there is that if the President succeeds, then the country succeeds.

    I was listening to the John Gibson show on my way to lunch and he possed a question. If you believe that President Obama is changing our society into a Socialistic Model, is it wrong to hope he fails? I don't know if it's possible to get away from the Conservative/Liberal mind sets that exist on this board but the question is at least worth thinking about.

    To be honest, I never allowed myself to believe that the President of the United States may not have the best interests of the country at heart. Some may believe that Socialisam is what's best and so you can argue that Socialisam represents what's best for our country. I am not saying that President Obama is a Socialist. I am not saying he isn't because in truth, I don't know. However, I will definatly conceed the fact that we are leaning more and more towards a Socialistic, or probabably a more accurate discrition would be Faciast, form of Government. I am concerned.

    The question I put to the board is, if President Obama's intent is to lead us into a Socialistic form of Government, is it OK to hope he fails?

    I am going to post this as poll. All opinions on this are welcome. I believe that it might help to discuss this question openly. I suspect that many conservatives might be questioning this idea as it is because I find myself questioning it. I believe that many Liberals may secretly think that this is what we Conservatives are hoping for and this only deepens the resentment towards Conservative Politics.

    We still live in a free Country so I think that it is completely appropriate to discuss something like this amoungs ourselfs.

    Please be respectful in the discussion.
  2. JBond

    JBond Well-Known Member

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    His sprint to socialism is going to end in failure. He must be stopped in my opinion. If that means he fails with his socialist agenda then so be it. He fails.
  3. Joe Rod

    Joe Rod When Keeping it Real Goes Wrong

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    As long as you live in this country you have that right, but I can't bring myself to hope for failure from the President so early on.
  4. iceberg

    iceberg detoxed Zone Supporter

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    This is a tough one. On one hand people voted Bush out of office after what seemed to be a violent 8 years of animosity towards him. It was their civil patriotic duty to say how bad of a President he was.

    I didn't want to do that because I wanted to respect the office, like you suggest. But Bush was wrong, his failed policies are wrong, and his spending us into debt was wrong.

    Obama and the Dems said so time and time again. Yet, they're doing the same things but for their own projects, so it's ok.

    If the spending Bush was doing was wrong, then it's wrong to keep doing it ESPECIALLY after your entire platform was saying it was wrong. But what do we hear now? Well Bush did it, shut up.

    But I'm not the one saying I liked Bush doing it. I'm not the one to say how bad his policies were, promise change, then do more of the same hiding behing BUSH DID IT!

    but all Bush did was wrong, how can that *ever* be a validation of their moves today?

    We can't keep going back to Bush as our scapegoat. Whatever he did is done and over, move on or fix it but stop blaming Bush for failures of our current policy. Obama is choosing to outspend Bush after spending a year saying Bush's spending was bad. Change has been replaced with WELL BUSH DID IT! and now even speaking your mind has people look down upon you.

    I can't answer the poll as stated. If spending was Obama's only "fault" I can't get too mad at that. But Obama wants the government to control everything when so far it can't even control itself. I was not born into this system, hundreds of thousands of Americans didn't die so we could swap it around, and our own constitution is now being massively open to an interpretation I don't think any of us have seen before.

    And they do appear very socalistic in nature. This isn't bad on it's own but what concerns me is that those making the changes refuse to call it for what it is. Change to socialism.

    Why can't they call it what it is if that's really how they feel? *THAT* i have major concerns with. If you want to be communist fine - put up that argument and work for it.

    But don't tell me you're not what you are so you hope we don't notice what you're doing *is* in fact what you are.

    So if Obama's plans are in fact to take us down socialism, yes. I hope he fails as far as a President can fail almost to a point of regardless of what it costs this country short term. We're already too focused on the short term ME ME ME and that to a large degree is why we're in this mess.

    If you don't want to work to improve your life, your life sucks. I can and never will absolve anyone (myself even moreso included) of personal accountability. Yes crappy things in life will happen to me. I can't control that.

    But I can control how I handle them. I can decide to work to make it better not whine for someone else to fix my booboo. We've got a generation of heads filled with the idea that nothing is their own fault.

    Someone else is to blame.

    Someone else is to fix it.

    I do not want that to be our government who can't even handle the responsibilities it has today but yet seeks to put more and more on it's already convoluted corrupt plate.

    If Obama's plans are not socalistic then no. I don't want him to fail. But so far I do see very socalistic plans and ambitions and I hope that does indeed fail.

    Not because I want Obama to fail, but because I don't want our proud country to suddenly be a socalist nobody who never taught people to stand up and lead and are far too willing to let the loudest control things.

    It's time for those who truly love American and our history to stand up and tell those who want to whine for a living to SHUT UP and treat them like trolls - ignore them. When they get hungry, they'll do something about it. We keep tossing them fish, they'll keep whining.
  5. Vintage

    Vintage The Cult of Jib

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    No. You have the right to freedom of thought. If you want to hope the President fails, then by all means, do so.

    Why you'd want the President to fail is beyond me. I always want the new President to become the best President we ever had, if for no other reason than to see our country succeed continually.

    There are things from every Presidency I disagree with/will continue to disagree with. There are parts of a President's plan (as with any President) I disagree with and hope never come about. That's different.

    As a whole - I want Obama to be the best President ever. And the next President, I hope he/she is the new best President. And so on and so forth.

    And despite the rhetoric on both sides, I suspect this is the overwhelming opinion of a majority of people on these boards.
  6. nathanlt

    nathanlt Well-Known Member

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    If Hitler were president, would you want him to fail?

    Obviously, everyone would.

    So, this proves we do draw the line somewhere before a worst case scenario of Hitler in power.

    The only question is, do Obama's policies warrant a hope that he fails??

    For me, YES!
  7. BrAinPaiNt

    BrAinPaiNt Brotherhood of the Beard Staff Member

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    Double edged sword I guess.

    You would hope the President does well and therefore the country does well.

    However there are times you hope a President fails in getting some of his policies passed. Or fails doing some things.

    So I guess as a whole I don't want a President to fail. But there are without a doubt areas, policies or view points that I hope they would fall short in.

    Hope that makes sense.

    Love,
    Fence Sitter who believes there are shades of gray instead of
    only black/white and does not believe everything is you are with us or against us.

    :D
  8. ABQCOWBOY

    ABQCOWBOY Moderator Staff Member

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    :laugh2:

    Hard to be pissed with you.

    :laugh2:
  9. theogt

    theogt Surrealist Zone Supporter

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    What a screwy poll. It asks two different questions.

    Of course it's wrong to hope the president fails.
  10. vta

    vta The Proletariat

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    I think thats the whole point of this two party system.
    In order for one to gain power, the other has to fail.

    If there isn't one, unified political apparatus, then by default you're going to have to hope one fails, so the other rises.

    It's not an ideal situation, obviously, but it is the situation we're in.
    I don't think it's wrong at all, especially if that President has policies that you don't believe are good for the country.
  11. DFWJC

    DFWJC Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

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    Clarify success or failure.
    I gnerally hope he succeeds because he is my President--and if that means the country will prosper economically, still have a stong defense, be a place were we are not penalized for our success, and were people here illegally are not afforded greater rights than those here legally.

    If his "success" means turning us towards indefinite socialism, or a place where those who bust butt but still pay for those not here legally, or a place where we are unprotected from our enemies due to a weak military,then of course for the long term good of our coutry, I hope he fails miserably.

    We'll have to let it play out.
  12. theogt

    theogt Surrealist Zone Supporter

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    There's one goal. There are just different ways that people think of how to get to that goal. It's wrong to hope that the other party fails to achieve that one goal, just because you thought you method was better.

    If you're goal is to have a Republican in office, regardless of how the economy and life is, then you're just a hack. And that's wrong.
  13. iceberg

    iceberg detoxed Zone Supporter

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    this is not standard repubs vs democrats anymore. it's morphed into far more. you can get mad at bush for the war, many did. but it was a response, for good or bad, to a direct attack on the US. it was also an effort to stabilize the region, for good or bad.

    those actions to a recognizable degree, are consistant with traditional american behavior from how many of us were raised into this country.

    but now we have people who's actions are in direct contradiction of their words and they get very mad when asked to clarify.

    that bothers me.

    we have people who think the government needs to control peoples lives to a stronger more managed degree.

    that bothers me.

    we have a president who can look the country in the eye and say there is no pork in this bill, but there's so much of it you can't even see the necessity that could be burried in there.

    that bothers me.

    i do not want to live in a socalist country. i want to work for what i get in life from nothing to everything - or where ever my own efforts and talents take me.

    i know not everyone has the same skillset. i know some people will work all their lives and never get beyond paycheck to paycheck.

    and i know that's not always fair either. but we now seem to be handicapping success to bring up failure. we reward it with billions of dollars THEY LOST along the way through THEIR OWN choices, along the way, and i have to pay for it.

    that bothers me.

    we all have give and take to do when the other side has their turn driving. we all have our whining and moaning we'll do along the way as well and catfights about which policy or process is better overall. but today we seem to be so tunnel visioned into each other being the enemy, it's hard to tell who really is anymore.

    and that bothers the holy hell out of me.

    we have a lot of problems to fix and fear as a tool or weapon won't cut it. people swim in fear because that's what they're given by our leadership. honesty is strictly taboo and i think what most of us would welcome overall. but an honest politician just isn't to be found.

    maybe we do need to reset things in our government. regardless of which direction we go from this crossroads in our time it will be a long and painful haul that regardless of the promise and desire for quick fixes, it simply won't happen. the problems we face today won't be over by our favorite tv shows season end. electing someone screaming CHANGE won't make it go any faster, just another direction it would seem.

    is that direction giving power to the people? the states? rewarding people who pay for the country we have? no. in fact the forgotten man is the one who needs to scream STOP!

    not change, not yet we can, but stop.

    if our government is going to have to have an enema, then yes - i want obama to fail IF HE IS making us socalistic. i do not want to collapse the levels of society success has built because who does that help the most? those who can't or won't build it themselves.

    i will fight and i would give my life for this country if ever called upon to do so. too many people just like me, and let's face it, far better than me, have already done so to keep the simple dream alive of we control our own roads.

    our own destiny.

    if you laugh at the very notion of such a thing, then you just proved my point. our apathy is killing us.

    and that bothers me.

    i'm at my own crossroads here in wanting to support the president but troubled by his attempts, it would seem, to take away everything i have worked for to "spread the wealth". so the only thing i can do is find more intelligent ways to speak out against what he is doing, if i feel that is necessary and proper, than to make up lies after lies and shout OBAMA SUCKS like the left loved to do and far too many on the right are now doing.

    it's easy to scream out in frustration and accept a hand up if offered. most of the time you don't look at who is offering it or where it's going - help is here, let's go. thinking is becoming a lost art, it would seem. but i'll keep trying to think and keep trying to understand and most of all try to keep my patience in *how* i voice my concerns.

    trust me, i'm going to voice them. but if i can't support the president, i will still try to respect him just the same. the left never did that.

    and that bothered me. : )
  14. ABQCOWBOY

    ABQCOWBOY Moderator Staff Member

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    The question is, If President Obama's intent is to lead us into a Socialistic form of Government, is it OK to hope he fails?


    It is not directly related to Republican or Democratic control in either the White House or Congress.
  15. JBond

    JBond Well-Known Member

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    Why is wrong to hope Obama is not able to carry through with his socialist agenda? Ice hit it on the head. America has spent treasure (financial and in lives) to ensure we are a free capitalistic Republic. Some lousy community agitator from Chi town should not be allowed to undo all the hard work Americans have put in for generations. Especially when he gained that power through lies and deceit.
  16. Vintage

    Vintage The Cult of Jib

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    This.
  17. iceberg

    iceberg detoxed Zone Supporter

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    the question isn't specific enough to cover the concerns around the question.

    i don't want our president to fail.
    our president is making us a socalist country.
    i don't want to be a socalist country.

    you got some decisions to make that will sound bad to a generation who refuses to think but react. if you react to what rush said, rush is ignorant and anti american.

    if you think about what he said, it opens up a lot of doors.

    we established long ago mobs do not think, they react. people do a majority of the time as well. so which is the proper move when you're standing at a crossroads - react, or think?
  18. Vintage

    Vintage The Cult of Jib

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    That's not the question of the thread title nor the question listed on the poll.
  19. iceberg

    iceberg detoxed Zone Supporter

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    this is why we're far more vunerable from within that an outside attack.

    we'll wind up destroying ourselves and the enemy never has to fire another shot.
  20. iceberg

    iceberg detoxed Zone Supporter

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    which is why i won't answer it as it sits. : )

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