It's Official. It's Palin.

Discussion in 'Political Zone' started by Heisenberg, Aug 29, 2008.

  1. VietCowboy

    VietCowboy Be Realistic. Demand the Impossible.

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    I'm certainly not voting for her...
    and I'm a woman...pro-choice.

    So, I agree with what the Canadian said...
  2. masomenos

    masomenos Less is more

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    He doesn't want to penalize the very wealthy and large corporations, he wants to close tax loopholes that allow them to take advantage of the current code. Or to steal a quote from CNN..."Instead of having all of us pay our fair share, we've got over $1 trillion worth of loopholes in the corporate tax code," he said. "This isn't the invisible hand of the market at work. It's the successful work of special interests."

    There are some groups who he wouldn't require to pay taxes, yes but it's the people who almost literally can't afford to. Senior citizens and about 10 million ultra low income families.

    And Obama's ridiculous social programs consists of projects like making sure that children have health insurance. How ridiculous to invest in the future.

    You realize that Obama's tax on capital gains simply puts them at 20%, the lowest rate that existed during the 1990s and the rate that Bush proposed in his 2001 tax cuts? It's also nearly a third lower than what it was under Reagan.

    http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/08/obama-clarifies.html



    I'm sorry, investing in alternative energy is "fantasy land mumbo" because it wont help us today or in the near future? Neither will drilling. It's be discussed in numerous threads on this forum, the at the pump savings are minimal and would be almost non existent without the creation of more refineries. Just because we drill doesn't mean oil prices will fall forever, if it did then there would be no debate.

    http://lots-o-thoughts.blogspot.com/2008/08/how-issue-of-drilling-is-covered-by.html

    And nuclear energy and wind power are far from "fantasy land mumbo".

    Drilling is fine, but like Obama said in his speech last night it's just a "stop gap solution" and other avenues have to be pursued.

    That's fine if you disagree with his policies, but know what they are, don't just call him a socialist and be done with it. What's wrong with his national defense policy? Do you not agree that we should send more troops to Afghanistan in the war on terror?
  3. ConcordCowboy

    ConcordCowboy Mr. Buckeye

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    They wont.
  4. peplaw06

    peplaw06 That Guy

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    I'm sure you were a swing vote too. :rolleyes:

    If you're pro-choice, you were probably voting for Obama in the first place.

    Seriously the VP's views on abortion are about the least relevant stance on any issue in the entire election. The only way she would have any influence on that is if McCain gave her the responsibility of nominating Supreme Court Justices. All it does is give the base a warm fuzzy to hang on to.
  5. CanadianCowboysFan

    CanadianCowboysFan Lightning Rod

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    Under your system isn't the VP position pretty irrelevant anyway unless there is a 50-50 split in the Senate or by chance the President dies?
  6. peplaw06

    peplaw06 That Guy

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    Typically yes. But the VP obviously has more influence in some areas as opposed to others. Abortion isn't one of them. In fact the President has very little influence in the legality of abortion himself. The only way they have any say is in nominating justices/judges. But then again, you can't predict how a justice will opine on abortion 100% of the time.

    The President and VP have a lot more influence in the other issues, through legislating. The Supreme Court has routinely shut down legislation on abortion.
  7. CanadianCowboysFan

    CanadianCowboysFan Lightning Rod

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    agreed but perception is reality in politics and for some reason, it makes a big deal to a great many people whether or not the President is pro or anti choice.

    you are right, once you put a judge on the bench, regardless of what he said before, he/she is free to decide however he/she feels is appropriate.
  8. Mavs Man

    Mavs Man All outta bubble gum

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    I stand by what I said in a previous thread.

    :thumbup:
  9. peplaw06

    peplaw06 That Guy

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    I agree. The social issues by and large aren't going to change every 4-8 years with a change in the Presidency. I wish voters realized that stuff, and that the Pres has more to influence with economics and with his power in commander in chief. Those are the big issues IMO.

    Does it help to have similarities in social issues with your candidate of choice, absolutely. But most people place that at the top of the list when their views on economics and wars should be higher IMO.
  10. VietCowboy

    VietCowboy Be Realistic. Demand the Impossible.

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    I'm a registered independent thank you very much, because there are things I don't agree with on both sides and each candidate and I weigh them accordingly. Granted, my default will always go to a Democrat candidate, but that doesn't mean I won't ever vote Repub. But anyone who tries to take away my right to choose has a lot of ground to recover if they want my vote.

    But yes, while I'm not all over Obama, but if going against McCain, I would have to vote for the O.
  11. peplaw06

    peplaw06 That Guy

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    Good.... weigh your viewS with hers. Not just abortion. But if her stance on abortion alone is the reason you won't be voting for McCain, then like I said I'd wager you were voting for Obama anyway.
  12. BrAinPaiNt

    BrAinPaiNt Hunka Hunka Burning BP Staff Member

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    Seeing as McCain has basically flip flopped to echo similar stances as palin...I guess one could argue she would not be voting for McCain because of his stances as well...not just Palin but the party in general concerning abortion.

    At one time McCain was against abortion except for cases of rape and incest. He changed his tune in order to fall into order with the party.

    So I guess if one is pro-choice, and that is the most important issue they see on the political landscape...it would be kind of idiotic to vote for a republican or would you argue otherwise?

    Now on the other hand...to me abortion has become nothing more than a political talking point to rally a base and I think they (meaning both repub and dem candidates) really do not care one way or the other except to gain party favor and votes.
  13. zrinkill

    zrinkill Diamond surrounded by trash

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    I agree with that in most cases. But I do not think Palin is like that. McCain yes .....
  14. VietCowboy

    VietCowboy Be Realistic. Demand the Impossible.

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    Obama vs McCain is different from Obama vs. Palin. I have many many issues with McCain. Many. If Hillary ran as an independent, just like with Nadar, I wouldn't default to the Democrat candidate...would definitely think about it.

    Man, if huckabee is up there...it would definitely make me think more about it. Probably because I use to live in Arkansas :) Not much more, but maybe like 5 more minutes.

    and yeah, I wouldn't consider myself a swing vote. I'm pretty liberal...like pretty.
  15. Danny White

    Danny White Winter is Coming

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    Her relevance is not for 2008 (unless something happens to McCain) it's for the future when she'll hopefully be one of the leading voices in the party. That's when her convictions will really come into play.

    I'm just happy that my party finally has a glimmer of hope down the line.

    I fully expect that McCain will be calling all the shots over the next four years if he's elected and that Palin will be in the background. But soon, hopefully four years from now, she could be in the driver's seat.

    And if something unfortunate should happen to McCain early in his term, I'm very comfortable with her as President.
  16. NinePointOh

    NinePointOh Well-Known Member

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    I disagree. Her relevance is for 2008, and specifically, November 2008. It's an attempt to try and win over a larger proportion of the female electorate.

    If all McCain wanted was a young running mate who can bring change and make some noise in a few years, why not Pawlenty, who brings much stronger qualifications to the table?

    The risk, of course, is that her appeal to female voters is superficial -- it's not that she stands with them on issues that are traditionally important to moderate and liberal females; it's pretty much just that she's a woman, too. The McCain camp is banking on the assumption that that's the only thing Hillary supporters are looking for.
  17. Danny White

    Danny White Winter is Coming

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    I'm talking about her relevance for myself and for people like me (conservative activists).

    Of course she's relevant to McCain in 2008... I wasn't trying to suggest otherwise.

    Pawlenty would not have had anywhere near this impact with the base... neither would Romney.

    Jindal is the only other person out there right now who could have created anywhere near this buzz among the conservative base.
  18. NinePointOh

    NinePointOh Well-Known Member

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    There are actually quite a few young, conservative "rising stars" in the Republican Party. Other than being a woman, what makes her more buzzworthy than any of the rest of them, particularly the ones with more national name recognition, more of a geographic advantage, or more experience?
  19. Aikbach

    Aikbach Well-Known Member

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    Her relevence to the present is that she signals to conservatives that McCain has made a compromise to be a transitional president, back away from moderation and neo-conservative and back inot the arms of Barry Goldwater/ Reagan conservatism that is more libertarian and paleo in its scope.

    Limited government, strong national defense and tax cuts and pro life, those are the basic sweeping pillars of the heart of the Republican Party and it drifted when it lost fiscal responsibility.
  20. Aikbach

    Aikbach Well-Known Member

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    Indeed, the two governors that have youth and spunk are of course Palin and Bobby Jindal.

    Mike Huckabee maintains a Bible Belt voice and could end up a Senator.

    John Thune is the darling of the Senate.

    Mike Pence is the passionate and polished pro-lifer of the House.


    David Petreaus is speculated to enter politics in the next decade.

    That is the creme of the crop of rising conservative stars on the national scene.

    Interestingly enough the chief talent for the Deomcrats are not as leftward leaning as their past candidates:

    Former Governor Mark Warner of Virginia

    Senator Jim Webb of Virginia

    Congressman Chet Edwards of Texas

    Senator Ford of Tennessee.

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