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It's put up or shut up time for Garrett

Discussion in 'Fan Zone' started by tecolote, Dec 7, 2012.

  1. Idgit

    Idgit Ice up, son. Ice up! Staff Member

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    But, all of those teams have performed at or around the level the Cowboys have performed at. We're playing each of them, too, here at the end of the season, so I guess we'll get to see first-hand how the teams all stack up.

    There have been dozens of 'what do you like about Jason Garrett' threads. I've replied in detail in a couple of them, and the results are mostly ignored, honestly.

    I'll say this, though, about evaluating coaching. There are some pretty good coaches in the NFCE right now, and since the teams all play similar schedules, it makes for a pretty good comparison of the four teams. Are you looking at the Giants, Eagles, or Redskins and thinking any of those rosters are significantly worse than our own right now? Or looking at any of those teams and thinking they've achieved more than we have largely because of a coaching advantage? If there were a team in the NFCE with similar roster quality and who was running away with the division, I'd be more inclined to agree that the difference was the coaching. As it is, I think the rosters are all pretty comparable, and we're doing about as well as anybody for what has turned out to be a fairly difficult schedule. What am I not seeing that's convinced so many that the problem is, instead, our head coach, and that he's actually one of the worst in the league?
  2. fifaguy

    fifaguy Well-Known Member

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    My take on the talent issue is that we have quite a bit of it, as evidenced by our having been in a position to win almost every game this season (except in Seattle). The inability of the team to consistently close out games out or to avoid tossing them away late strikes me as a more of a coaching-related issue.
  3. tecolote

    tecolote Well-Known Member

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    I love your posts, I don't agree with some of them, especially when it comes to Garrett, but at the end of the day I hope you end up being right, I would give my left huevo for this team to succeed under Jason. You won't find a bigger Cowboy homer than me.

    Your first point is exactly why I started this thread, the Giants and Redskins are not better teams than the Cowboys and we are right in the middle of a 3 team race, I want Jason to grab this opportunity and don't look back.
  4. Idgit

    Idgit Ice up, son. Ice up! Staff Member

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    Thanks. We're on about the same page. The Redskins game on Thanksgiving is the one game I'd point to where I think Garret's team really came up wanting. We had everything setup. We were at home, had the better roster still, frankly, and we still spit the bit.

    That game was a real chance to step forward. We still didn't do it. Now we need to win at least two out of the next three to even get another shot at a potential pivot game. And this time, it'd be in WAS, at the end of the year, and possibly for all the marbles.

    I do think this team is closer than most posters might. With an important culture of losing to overcome. Garrett's done some good things in that regard, but we've still fallen short. Some of that's coaching. Some of it is other things. But if we're going to start seeing it change, it does need to start happening soon. I'm as tired as anybody of seeing the same pattern continue under a third consecutive coach.
  5. utrunner07

    utrunner07 Active Member

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    Funny how so many on here always blame the coach and never look at the bigger picture...remember when it was all Wade's fault? Stupid is doing the same thing over and over and over again expecting different results...changing coaches seems to get us no where. Its time to change GMs and I am starting to believe that means Jerry needs to remove himself as owner. It will never happen. This team will be mediocre for the foreseeable future, a decade at least. So complain about Garrett and when he is gone complain about the new coach who will get the same results...what a pointless waste this organization has become.
  6. rcaldw

    rcaldw Well-Known Member

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    You are wrong, and I'm not wasting my breath anymore trying to convince blind men what the sun looks like. Your definition of "improvement" is a very simple one. And as much as you profess "an open mind" and "you hope you are wrong", the absolute fact of the matter is that it doesn't matter what is offered as evidence, how reasonable that evidence is, you twist it and turn it so that, in your little world, it makes no difference.

    My response to this is simple. Enjoy your view! And when this team turns the corner, and it will, then you can come back and talk about how you were open minded and wanted to be proved wrong all along. Its the easiest life in the world to live, it is called the life of a passive aggressive. :) ;)
  7. rcaldw

    rcaldw Well-Known Member

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    Yes you have (given evidence) and yes it has been (ignored), and that is why all the discussion about it is pretty much wasted at this point.
  8. tecolote

    tecolote Well-Known Member

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    It was Wade's fault, he was a bad coach, as is Garrett. I agree with Jerry being to blame, but only because he hires horrible head coaches.
  9. tecolote

    tecolote Well-Known Member

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    Yes, my definition of improvement is a very simple one, just win games, that is all I want, we have an opportunity to make the playoffs, that is what I would call improvement.

    I love this team, I think Tony is a top 5 qb, I think Witten and Ware are hall of famers, I put a Romo jersey on my youngest kid in the hospital when he was born, I have a freaking Quincy Carter jersey hanging in my closet, heck, I like Jerry Jones, a lot, I've had 3 dogs named Troy, my fantasy football team is named Red ***** and it sucks, I've not missed a Cowboy game in 20 years, I always think we are going to win, big, but here's the thing, I do not think Jason Garrett is a good coach, and if I end up being wrong about that, I would be the happiest person in the world.

    How's that for passive agresive.
  10. Luckenbach

    Luckenbach Member

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    Halftime Scores:
    Cowboys @ Giants (7-3 Giants) Final Score 24-17 Cowboys
    Cowboys @ Seahawks (13-7 Seahawks) Final Score 27-7 Seahawks
    Bucs @ Cowboys (10-7 Cowboys) Final Score 16-10 Cowboys
    Bears @ Cowboys (10-7 Bears) Final Score 34-18 Bears
    Cowboys @ Ravens (17-10 Ravens) Final Score 31-29 Ravens
    Cowboys @ Ravens (7-3 Carolina) Final Score 19-14 Cowboys
    Giants @ Cowboys (23-10 Giants) Final Score 29-24 Giants
    Cowboys @ Falcolns (6-6 Tied) Final Score 19-13 Falcolns
    Cowboys @ Eagles (10-7 Cowboys) Final Score 38-23 Cowboys
    Browns @ Cowboys (13-0 Browns) Final Score 23-20 Cowboys
    Redskins @ Cowboys (28-3 Redskins) Final Score 38-31 Redskins
    Eagles @ Cowboys (17-10 Eagles) Final Score 38-33 Cowboys

    2 Games out of the 12 we've led at halftime. We won both of them. The Bucs we won by less than 7, and the Eagles led us at halftime in our rematch.

    The point of illustration here is that we are not a dominate team, and that we are a few Romo improvisation plays away from easily a 2-10 record right now. That is the if we had a 'bad day' scenario of course, however the inability to be leading at halftime is clearly either a lack of motivation or a lack of a plan.

    We've scored 79 points in the first half of games. We have had 155 scored on us. That's a 2:1 ratio...

    Most people get a chance at a HC gig because they're a coordinator on a team that has success, we chose red because he pulled a .500 out of a team that he helped get to 1-6.

    His playcalling is the worst I've ever seen, for some reason he takes forever to get Dez involved, and refuses to exploit obvious mismatches until the 2nd half, when we have a 83% chance to be down points. My favorite was Dez vs. some Browns no name CB (Joe Haden was out), Dez gets PI drawn 2 times in a row, we then stop going that direction since we clearly can't complete a pass that way with the CB needing to interfere... must be some form of sportsmanship...

    Garrett has had his chances at making our offense decent. His end arounds and running our scat back right up the middle are cute, but not wanted. I'm simply asking for someone who plays smart football, Garrett is clearly not the answer.

    We've literally won twice as many games by comebacks than we have outright. That means that the game plan has resulted in 2 total wins, while being forced to throw the game plan out has lead to 4.

    All Process and No Progress. Anyone but Garrett for 2013.
  11. Aven8

    Aven8 Well-Known Member

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    Great post.
  12. rcaldw

    rcaldw Well-Known Member

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    It is a love for the Cowboys that I can celebrate! I love fellow fans like you. It is a view of the coach that is misguided, but you have the right to hold it. :)
  13. rcaldw

    rcaldw Well-Known Member

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    And the definition for great posts sinks lower and lower. i.e., if you agree with my view... GREAT POST!

    How about this.... we are a finger tip and missed FG away from being 8-4... isn't that just as reasonable?

    But it doesn't fit the agenda.
  14. Luckenbach

    Luckenbach Member

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    I'm simply saying we've been lucky to get to 6-6. Without the luck we could easily be 2-10, your response is what if we were even luckier...

    We're 6-6 despite Jason Garrett. There is no agenda, that's the problem, reducing penalties is not on the agenda, gaining halftime leads is not on the agenda. I don't feel that asking for less penalties and a few more halftime leads (We're 2-0 in this situation) is asking for too much.
  15. Beast_from_East

    Beast_from_East Well-Known Member

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    Woulda, coulda, but didnt...........you are what your record says you are.
  16. Aven8

    Aven8 Well-Known Member

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    I don't get on bandwagons, or keep this guys, fire this one. I use the eyeball test and experience in coaching football in the jr high and HS ranks to settle my agendas.

    JG is awful. Somebody said it before that he could be worse then Campo, and I have to agree. Campo can coach and has proven it with 30 years in the business. What I've seen with JG is a poorly coached football team that is unprepared week in and week out. If it weren't for Romo, my bet is he would have never been hired.

    Btw I liked the post because he had facts and outlined every game we played.
  17. Misanthrope

    Misanthrope New Member

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    Sure, let's keep firing coaches after 2-3 seasons. That'll work. Just ask the Raiders. :rolleyes:

    Our defense is depleted. Tom Landry couldn't win with that bunch. We'll do well to win another game at this point.
  18. burmafrd

    burmafrd Well-Known Member

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    you are so big on evidence then show what Red Ball has done that has improved this team over the last two years.

    Because it certainly is not showing up on the scoreboard
  19. Coy

    Coy Well-Known Member

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    Campo didn't have half the team Garrett has. Although he was an awful coach I agree with the OP.
  20. rcaldw

    rcaldw Well-Known Member

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    Our current fan base is like a spoiled bunch of kids living in a home where dad has lost his job and crying about not getting the NFL Sunday Ticket anymore (how's that for an illustration! :))

    We are down to our 3rd NT, lost 2 starting ILB's, lost one of our starting safeties, have rotated offensive linemen all season, have missed our starting running back for 6 games, have missed starting WR's at various junctures... it has literally been the most injured team that I can remember in a long time.

    At the same time we have played, by everyone's estimation, the toughest schedule in the NFL.

    Yet, we are still in the hunt playing a big game tomorrow and only a game out of the division lead.

    But Garrett is awful.

    Yea.

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