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Melvin Ingram is a beast

Discussion in 'Draft Zone' started by supercowboy8, Jan 8, 2012.

  1. supercowboy8

    supercowboy8 Well-Known Member

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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UuL8H2U-SA

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbfNWIyflVM&feature=related

    he will be a top 15 pick and should be ours.
    He played 8 positions in highschool including QB, RB, WR, and was even a Safety and kicker. He plays 3 different positions at SC now. DT,DE, and OLB. He is a athletic freak that can get pressure, stop the run and cover. If you want a day one replacement for Spencer this is the guy.
    He has great speed, will drop about 10 pounds and not lose any strength. He will be a combine monster and shoot up the draft board, I hope we can get him.
  2. cobra

    cobra Salty Bastard

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    I don't know anything about the guy, but I watched some clips and he seems to be hella slow off the ball. Like a full second slower to react than everyone else. Is that accurate?
  3. supercowboy8

    supercowboy8 Well-Known Member

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    no I don't know if you were watching the right guy. Scouts all say he has great burst off the line. At 6'2" he has great size t coil up and get that burst off the line. If he is slow and can still make that many plays in the backfield then what could he do with alittle more coaching him to get off the line faster.
    I don't see him being slow off the line at all.
  4. supercowboy8

    supercowboy8 Well-Known Member

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    per scout.com via ESPN


    Pass Rush Skills "First-step quickness is a notch below elite. A bit inconsistent with snap awareness. Shows above average body control and torso flexibility. Good athletic ability and change-of-direction skills for his size (see double move for sack 6:22 remaining 4th QTR vs. ALA 2010). Displays excellent closing burst to the QB  particularly for a 270-pound athlete. Shows ability to turn speed into power. Still developing instincts as a pass rusher. Often times he will win with first-step quickness or knock OL back on heels with initial pop, but then fails to capitalize. Needs to become more decisive and confident with counter moves. "

    Versus the run Has more game experience on passing downs but flashes upside in this area. Uses his leverage effectively and is a bit stronger at the point of attack than expected. Flashes the ability to anchor versus the double team. Also does a nice job of keeping his feet moving versus the zone run. Shows above average discipline and works hard to maintain outside contain. Has very good range versus the run. Can really turn on the jets when pursuing from the backside. He can improve his tackling skills. Awareness is adequate but can still improve. Flashes some power at the point of attack but leaves his feet and will fall off too many attempted tackles.

    Versatility "Began career at LB and has been in a rotation at DE the last two seasons (2009-'10). Will be a fulltime starter at DE in 2011. Has the potential to play DE in a four-man front, as well as OLB in some 3-4 schemes (Ravens, Steelers, etc.). Has some experience rushing the QB from inside, as well. "

    Instincts/Motor "Never see him take a play off. Will pursue hard from backside and gives great effort when on the field. However, he has basically been a pass-rush specialist who is on the field approximately 15 snaps a game, so 2011 season (first as fulltime starter) will provide a better indication of motor and stamina. Instincts are still a work in progress. Does a nice job of finding the ball when he's on the move but sometimes will be late to diagnose when working in the phone booth. Snap awareness needs to be more consistent, especially as an edge rusher. "
  5. Eskimo

    Eskimo Well-Known Member

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    He definitely has to be on our radar for that #14 pick. Every pick will start to have some questions at that point. He fills two huge needs for us at OLB (if we let Spencer walk) and as a pass rushing complement to Ware.

    I would still put Kirkpatrick (if he falls which is unlikely) or DeCastro (decent chance he falls to us - OGs always fall) over him as they are more elite talents.
  6. Woods

    Woods Active Member

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    How about Ware, Spencer and Ingram?

    In case DeCastro and the CBs are gone, assuming we don't trade down.

    It would bolster our LBs core for sure.
  7. supercowboy8

    supercowboy8 Well-Known Member

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    I'm not so high n Kirkpatrick, his hips are much to stiff to be a press man cover CB in the NFL. looks like a great zone cover 2, tampa 2 CB where if he press he then has help behind him and then can play off in zone and see the play in front of him.

    As for DeCastro, I love the guy and am all for fixing this OL I just don't see Jerry doing it. I think we go heavy after either Nicks or Grubbs and also I think Center is a much bigger need. \But the main reason I think we don't het DeCastro is that I have read and heard KC and Arizona is really interested in him and will take him in the 1st round.
  8. supercowboy8

    supercowboy8 Well-Known Member

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    That would mean we would have to resign Spencer $$$ so you have no reason to pick Ingram in the first round. Also where can three OLBs play?
  9. kevinhickey

    kevinhickey Member

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    I didn't see much during his bowl game.
  10. Eskimo

    Eskimo Well-Known Member

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    Oh well, that'll be a shame if DeCastro is gone. I can't justify trading up from the mid-first round for a Guard. I''d consider it at Center or LT but not OG or RT.

    To be honest, I'm not a big fan of paying a big FA salary for an OG. We went down that route with Bigg Davis and it didn't turn out all that well for us. I just don't think OGs usually make enough of a difference to be worth a premium salary although there are odd exceptions like Larry Allen and Steve Hutchinson and I don't think either of the players you mentioned are as good as those 2 guys.

    I actually think that if DeCastro is gone we should drop down in the draft to the 20s and pick up an extra 2nd rounder. Then maybe we can draft two OGs with the four picks we have in the first 3 rounds. According to Wes Bunting, this is a very deep draft for OGs with several good prospects in the first 3 rounds available. We should also then have picks freed up to try and find a CB and an OLB/DE as well. We can hopefully then patch up the rest of our holes in FA.
  11. Noryb

    Noryb Member

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    Is it me or does his arms look short?
  12. supercowboy8

    supercowboy8 Well-Known Member

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    you must not have watched.
    he had 4 tackles and 1.5 sacks
  13. supercowboy8

    supercowboy8 Well-Known Member

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    look normal to me, just gotta wait for the combine for this measurement.
  14. VACowboy

    VACowboy Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

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    I still want someone to tell me why Ingram is better than Mercilus. Nothing I read agrees that Ingram is a physical freak. Mercilus, neither, but his production is hard to ignore. I've seen neither of these guys play, but frankly, judging from what I read, I don't want either one at #14. That goes for Gilmore and Dennard as well. If DeCastro is gone, I'm looking hard for a trade down. If it comes to that, I'll settle for the 16, 22.5 and 9 guy and a late second round pick.
  15. MichaelWinicki

    MichaelWinicki "You want some?" Staff Member

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    Agreed on Ingram and Mercilus.

    Potentially nice players, but not dominant players.

    I don't think either one is superior to Spencer.
  16. Woods

    Woods Active Member

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    I think RR could definitely use three rushers on passing downs. I think in Ryan's schemes he could find a use for three good LBs plus Ware and Lee.

    It's not my top scenario. I prefer DeCastro or a top CB. But I wouldn't be upset with Ingram.
  17. TheCount

    TheCount Pixel Pusher

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    Yeah I noticed that too, bit slow, seems more like a DE to me, even if he is by athletic but lack of elite speed may not be so bad at strong side OLB.

    The whole physical freak thing is so overplayed though.
    Ast year, there were a few members promising than Robert Quinn would jump out of the stadium, do 60 reps and run a 4.2. He didn't live up to the hype.
  18. kevinhickey

    kevinhickey Member

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    I will keep track of him at the combine to see how he performs. I'm a little spoiled after watching Ware play; I would love for Dallas to uncover, another pass rushing freak.
  19. Eskimo

    Eskimo Well-Known Member

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    The problem with Spencer isn't his overall level of play which is pretty good.

    The problem is that he is a bad pass rusher. He is not a good speed rusher, he doesn't bullrush at all, he is not good with his hands and he doesn't have a good inside counter. He has no instincts to get by pass blockers. He is too slow twitch and doesn't have good moves.

    We are desperate for a second pass rusher to complement Ware. In 2008 and 2009 when our defense was playing better (at least some of the time) Ratliff was the guy who complemented Ware. Unfortunately, Rat can't get by anymore and is getting stoned at the line and no one else is stepping up for him.

    If we were to bring back Spencer, we have to bring in someone else to help get after QBs in the nickel.

    Under these circumstances, we are just better off parting with Spencer even if it means accepting a lesser overall player who is a better pass rusher. I think it is worth it to pay that premium in FA and I also believe it is worth it to draft someone with our first round pick who projects to be a double digit sack guy. We apparently were thinking along these lines last year and had Aldon Smith ranked ahead of Tyron Smith according to some media sources.
  20. Gaede

    Gaede Well-Known Member

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    I like Ingram alot.

    He does, at first glance, appear to be slow off the ball. But it looks like he's asked to either drop or rush on alot of plays--and I think that his slow step is merely him diagnosing the play and deciding which duty to fulfill. The most impressive thing to me, is that once he decides to do one or the other, he gets there extremely fast--despite the initial hesitation. This tells me that Ingram has both excellent awareness and explosion

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