Discussion in 'News Zone' started by chicago JK, Jun 29, 2004.
SBK must have made up this list.
Good question. In this case, they over exxagerrated Newman's contribution, the kid is good and he will possibly be great, but he did not show me anything near what those guys were saying he did this past season. I saw him get beat at times and I saw him (and this really irks me)too many times be in position to knock down a pass or intercept it, but he would let the WR catch the pass and then tackle them, if it was the scheme to let the receivers do that then that is a weak scheme in my book. I like aggressiveness, attitude, swagger, arrogance at the corner spot. I've played all the skilled positions or Glamour positions if that what people would like to call them and Corner is one that you have to have a tougher mental make up than any of the others, then I would say comes RB, because you have guys hitting you and talking trash and spitting and kicking you and kneeing you, trying to make you quit. Man I could go on. But Newman did a heck of a good job, for a rookie better than any rookie I have seen in a long time. I thought Jammer was going to do that but he held out and that hurt him.
Now on that same tip, those very same posters will dismiss any little contribution that Carter made. They conveniently forget all the past crap he has been thru, they constantly compare him to aikman(but yet they say there is no comparison and that you cannot compare the two). They somehow do not remember that it took aikman inot his 4th season before we won a superbowl with him, they do not want to admit that we needed the necessary players around aikman to win, they constatnly bring up stats, but will admit that stats do not tell the complete story. Stats are too easily manipulated by the total team play.
You cannot rush the maturation process of a young QB, Marino's do not come along every year. Every ball club's organization is not like the way the Patriots is being run now, as a matter of fact the Patriots organization was not always ran as excellent as it is now, just as the Cowboys was not always ran as poorly and coached as poorly as it was when Campo was the HC.
I back QC, so because the kid has talent, he was dealt a bad hand and even thought the pressure got to him some back int 2002, he bounced back. He kept his nose clean, he kept his head up, he refocused, and he got back to work. He set a goal for himself and one way or another he will reach that goal. I'm the type of person that loves a challenge, I love being an underdog and I back underdogs, (not all) some underdogs do not have the talent or the fight to achieve the goals that they may have set for themselves.
It is like I see a part of myself in Carter, he could have quit and gave up but he did not, he has the media and fans all seemingly against him and he is still there in their face scrapping,that's my mentality, that is how I am. I'm an in your face person all day long and all night. Carter is right there taking on the challenges, You and I know he hears it and he reads it everyday, and he could quit and just give up, no one would say anything, nor would they hold it against him. We have vinny and we have Henson, that would satisfy the majority, I guess. Some that criticize Carter probably would make the statement that he never gave it his all, but that would be a footnote, unless he went somewhere else and started winning championships.
I've said all along by his 4th season we will know for sure, but now you have these late blooming QBs doing their thing, so you never know what is going to happen.
I try to focus on the mental makeup of a player, if that is possible thru the media, interviews etc. Or by talking with them, as I got to talk to QC, Roy , at last years Training Camp.
I look at all the players the same, I really do, well our current players anyway. I know the things QC needs to put together just as I know what Tnew needs to do.
If they were all on Tnew, and I saw the good things he did as I did, and feel he would get better then I would be backing him just as hard as I back Carter, that goes for any other player also, except Hambrick, because he let his mouth flap too much, especially about Emmitt.
I'm less offended by Newman NOT making the list than by Sumari Rolle being near the top. That guy's not even in the top 20.
Or Jammer who did not look that good, Newman far outplayed Jammer
That may very well be true, I cannot disagree with that at all. I had him listed in the top 15 at least.
Good, Now I know.
Pretty much negates anything you have to say when you insult the guy first.
So a guy like Bill Parcells would not be considered an expert?
How about Bradshaw or any of the other guys on the Fox show who make lists like these? Are they not experts?
When your sarcasm sounds so close to your usual comments, it would be well advised to make some reference to the alledged sarcasm.
I find this to be a very curious rebuttal. Full of beans comes to mind.
Actually the expression is couldn't care less. If you could care less then you care. You are trying to say you don't in this comment.
Two issues here.
First, the word you were struggling for is know.
Second, this is an arrogant statement. Even if it is your opinion.
There is a slight difference. They are most times in the stadium and in the lockerroom after.
You played pro ball? For whom, and how many years were you in the league?
Except for a few misguided people who still don't get it when they see Quincy throw picks, most here don't agree with you. Your thick skin is probably a welcome aspect to your fandom and opinion.
I will be very watchful for those who have defended this one player if he fails this year and is finally held up without excuses. It will be interesting to see how people like you react.
My opinion is very feww corners on that list played the zero blitz as we did last year. Watching a rookie on an island and have the success he had was pretty inspiring.
Is he there yet?
But after this year, he will be at or near the top on all lists when discussing cornerbacks.
Because he doesn't make many mistakes in his game.
Unlike someone else who will remain nameless.
I'm wondering whether that was a fantasy football rating or was it an actual football player rating as in those are the top 25 guys in the league?
I think TD3 just gave the mother of all butt kickings...
Excuse my French but bullsh*t! TNew certainly deserves to be in the top ten. That rookie shut down receivers like a ten year pro last season.
As far as the PFW ratings, I posted the same thing in my 2004 PFW NFL Preview and AdamTj13 replied that the reason TNew isn't on the list is because they go by scouts, coaches and other sources and sometimes they don't have enough info on new players to make an accurate appraisal.
I don't know why they couldn't find enough info on TNew because they managed to rank Byron Leftwich, Domanick Davis, Jordan Gross, and some other rookies.
gracias to SENSELESS for the info
1. Champ Bailey 6'0 192 Broncos 95.00
2. Chris McAllister 6'1 206 Ravens 91.90
3. Ty Law 5'11 200 Patriots 91.70
4. Charles Woodson 6'1 200 Raiders 90.60
5. Patrick Surtain 5-11 192 Dolphins 89.40
6. Samari Rolle 6'0 175 Titans 89.10
7. Sam Madison 5-11 185 Dolphins 88.60
8. Antoine Winfield 5-9 180 Vikings 88.20
9. Ronde Barber 5'10 184 Buccaneers 88.00
10. Terence Newman 5'11 188 Dallas Cowboys 87.70
11. Troy Vincent 6'1 200 Bills 86.00
12. Aaron Glenn 5'9 185 Texans 85.30
13. Mike McKenzie 6'0 194 Packers 85.00
14. Nate Clements 6'0 209 Bills 84.80
15. Bobby Taylor 6'3 219 Seahawks 84.20
16. Shawn Springs 6'0 204 Skins 84.00
17. Brian Kelly 5'11 193 Buccaneers 83.10
18. Marcus Trufant 5'11 199 Seahawks 82.50
19. Fred Smoot 5'11 174 Skins 82.00
20. Dre' Bly 5'9 185 Lions 81.50
21. Charles Tillman 6'1 207 Bears 80.90
22. Will Allen 5'10 196 Giants 80.60
23. Ahmed Plummer 5'11 191 49ers 80.50
24. Fred Thomas 5'9 184 Saints 79.50
25. Quentin Jammer 6'0 204 Chargers 79.30
Yes, we already discussed this in a thread a few weeks ago.
There are only a few 2003 rookies included in the rankings at any position. The rest are simply listed as "top veteran prospects." That does NOT mean those players are ranked below every player who is on the list. Does anyone think NFL scouts and GMs would rank Carson Palmer (listed as a "prospect") behind Tim Couch (No. 27)? Charles Rogers and Andre Johnson (listed as "prospects") behind Deion Branch (No. 30)? Terrell Suggs (prospect) behind Dhani Jones (No. 21) and Eric Barton (No. 24)?
Most of the top players from the past few years were included as "prospects" instead of being ranked going into their second season -- Lavar Arrington, Julian Peterson, Keith Bulluck, Keith Brooking, Michael Vick, Chad Pennington, Deuce McAllister, Ed Reed, Todd Heap, Koren Robinson, Chad Johnson, Marcus Stroud, Kris Jenkins, Casey Hampton, Al Wilson, Shaun Alexander, Flozell Adams, Darrell Jackson, John Abraham, Leonard Little, Anthony McFarland, Chris Hovan, Chris Samuels, Shaun Ellis, LeCharles Bentley and Bryant McKinnie, to name quite a few.
I don't think it's a matter of not finding enough information, it's either not seeking enough information or not receiving enough information. It would all depend on how they did the poll. Also, note that the only 2003 rookies who are on the list at their position (Leftwich, Davis, Boldin and Gross) are on offense, while none of the 2003 defensive rookies are ranked.
Yes, it does seem like they left out defensive players. I haven't looked through all the rookies but I know that Suggs and Seattle's defensive backs were left off the list.
Paying attention CowboynIRAQ, based on this ranking Newman whould have started on all but Miami.
Nice job BZ.
Don't you know that CowboynIRAQ knows more than NFL coaches and general managers?
Look at how much of a blow out Bailey has, I just think that if you get beat by Pinkston, you should never be considered the best CB in the league (Surtain got smoked as well and well as Webster who isn't even on that list. I still think that Newman is too high, even though I have nothing wrong with him. Vincent and Taylor have to be better than him, according to Adam's stats they are pretty damn good.
But are about as useful as preseason college football polls.
BTW, C Woodson is going to have to prove to me he deserves that ranking after last year and his injuries. Personally I hope he proves me wrong as I thought he was one of the best at one time.
If Woodson is healthy, he is better than Law IMO.
But their stats aren't as good as Newman's stats.