There just aren't many of them. :laugh2: We are a primarily Java shop. (our primary application is a JBoss cluster) We interview endless amounts of candidates and 98% don't fit and a huge portion don't even seem to be qualified to actually be programmers. We are even willing in some cases to hire someone with lots of aptitude and concept understanding, but maybe not have heavy Java specific experience. Even that is a no-go most of the time. If we were in St. Louis, Detroit, Salt Lake City, etc. I could understand having some troubles finding talent, but we are in New York freaking City! This speaks volumes about not just the American school system, but about the laziness of the coming generation and the lack of push to keep America a technical super power. I was learning to program in BASIC when I was still in elementary. Not in some class at school. I was learning this on my own. Today, kids are more interested in what is on TV or what their friends are doing on Facebook or Twitter, it's very depressing. One last thing. Recruiters should be beaten and stabbed, then shot and killed. They tell applicants to put stuff on their resume that they have no experience with. You see it on their resume, you ask them a question about it. They stare at you blankly. You ask them why it's on their resume. "(insert recruiter's name) said I should put it on there". Our reply? "Thank you, we're done." (call recruiter) "Thank you, we're done." It takes a lot of time to interview candidates. Don't freaking waste our time lying to us. We will find out you are lying.