Discussion in 'NFL Zone' started by bula, Dec 9, 2012.
called it :
Grant Paulsen ‏@granthpaulsen
Robert Griffin has thrown the same number of touchdowns as Andrew Luck. He's been intercepted 14 fewer times. #Redskins #Colts #NFL
Just thought I'd throw it out there.
Don't bother, it falls on deaf ears.....or blind eyes, however you want to say it, around here. Apparently, Luck is the only quarterback in the league that can throw INTs and not be looked upon poorly for it. I mean, some of these same cowboys posters were reaming Romo for turnovers, but apparently Luck throwing more of them is cool.
Here's the PFF data on RG3's passes by direction and location on the field.
They have them cataloged by ATT - CMP - YDS - TD - INT - QB Rating
It's not always just about TDs and INTs, you have to look at big picture stuff and it sure looks like Shanahan is limiting alot of downfield throws for RG3. It's good coaching but when the running game is rendered ineffective how will RG3 adjust?
The intermediate middle numbers suggest that the PA is quite effective and LBs are getting fooled. It happened in the Dallas game more than I liked and even DWare was fooled on more than one occasion with the option.
Cam Newton was pretty successful with the option in his rookie year but this year - not soo much...why?
When you run an option play at the NFL you are sacrificing your ball carrier's best attributes - his speed and vision - to hit the holes. That delay is not only allowing the LBers more time to read the play but your putting more stress on your lineman to hold their blocks. The NFL will always focus around players with exceptional speed, that's why coaches will have certain "pet cats" they cling to in order to make them a productive football player. It doesn't always pan out, but that's always been line 1 in the NFL. In college players can get by on pure athleticism, but in the NFL that's never been the case. The good ones are always good students of the game and have understood the mental part of the game.
Yesterday is a good example of why you don't want your QB running around like a ball carrier. The good ones, the elite ones...like Brady, Mannings, and Brees understand that if the play isn't there they need to throw the ball away. RG3 has already been flirting with injury in his rookie season and if he continues to get beat up like this he's not going to last in this league. That's where Shanahan needs to re-evaluate if the option packages in his playbook are really worth the "prize in the sky" if that's going to be the trade off. It's never been about if the option would be successful in the NFL because it obviously has been but the trade off has always been exposing your star player, and in this case your future face of the franchise, to harder hitting men that could cause a season or possibly career ending injury. That's why it's been coached at the NFL level for QBs to have a mental clock and to throw or get rid of the football once they hit their final step in their drop. Coaches don't want to see their franchise QB take one on the chin because he held onto the football waiting for a receiver to get open. RG3 and Shanahan are playing with fire if they continue the road they are on.
Cam Newton has been quite good lately. If he keeps going, he'll crack 90 qbr next week. The concept of his sophomore slump is disappearing, at least somewhat.
Your charts clearly show Luck is forcing the ball in a Rex Grossman like fashion. Tom Brady does not force the ball down field, he hits wide open WRs. Luck's INT's have been terrible and downright Grossmanish in the "**** it lets go deep" attitude of the throws. Luck has nearly the amount of pick 6's (3) that RG3 has INTs. Its been atrocious decision making on his part, which makes sense. Luck had one of the cleanest pockets ever while playing at Stanford, whenever he went deep to a TE in college that TE was wide open by 20 yards because of how dominant the Stanford run game was making the play action pass that much more effective.
Now that he has no run game and a mediocre o-line, his decision making has been terrible and he is forcing the ball into terrible spots, just like Rex Grossman did.
This has been incredibly overblown now. Newton struggled for a few weeks and was mostly, and rightly, criticized for his attitude. However the last few games he has been spectacular.
This is all nice except Brady lost a year of his career with a hit in his pocket, and Peyton Manning has also lost a full year of playing despite being a pocket QB.
RG3 has missed 1 full quarter of play in 13 games this season, both on hits that came on called pass plays. The pistol read option had nothing to do with either injury, the first injury came on the sideline vs Atlanta, and the 2nd injury on a scramble when he should have ran out of bounds as opposed to cutting back towards the middle to gain 3 yards.
The read option has not had any bearing on his 2 injuries.
Being in the pocket DID have bearing on both Brady's knee injury and Manning's neck injury. How often did you ever see Peyton Manning move outside of the tackle box in his career? Yet he still missed a full season last year and is now on a new team
Ah so it's more dangerous for a QB to stay in the pocket than it is to run downfield.
Its dangerous for a QB to be on the field. One good hit on Carson Palmer, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning cost each of them a season of their career, all of which were in the pocket. Palmer was never the same after that.
Joe Theisman's career was done on a play in the pocket.
Aikman's career was cut short (he only played 11 seasons) because of the concussions he sustained while playing as a pocket QB
How often was Matt Stafford injured in his first 2 seasons? Pocket passer. Romo's season ending injury in 2010. In the pocket
All I'm just pointing out here is that Shanahan may want to coach his young franchise QB that he needs to avoid those hits when he's trying to make a play. Like you said, running out of bounds rather than trying to get a few more yards...or throwing the ball away on a 3rd and goal so you can kick the field goal to live another series.
Injuries will happen, however, when the QB takes off to run the helmet-to-helmet rules no longer apply.
RG3 suffered that concussion the ATL game when he tried to force a play that wasn't there on a 3rd and goal. Rather than throw the ball away he tried to beat the defense on the edge and RG3 got clobbered.
Those are the hits you don't want him taking and it could have been avoided pretty easily. The same could have been said about the latest injury. But hey if that's what you like to see on Sundays then by all means...
Forget Luck or Romo, RGIII isn't even in the same category as Micahel Vick. He's more like Vince Young, except he's not gay.
Like so many other gimmick offenses that coaches had to resort to because they had qbs who don't have the proper brains to run a real NFL offense, it will get figured out and the novelty will wear off. Either Akili Smith 2.0 will have learn to play quaterback like everyone else, or the only future endorsement deals he'll be getting will be for Auntie Anne's pretzels, because that's what his legs will look like.
Only skynyrd fans would even put AS 2.0 in the same discussion as Andrew Luck. Luck is scary in that he is progressing exactly as Peyton did his rookie year, but with a much better record. As for OROY, it's no contest. AS 2.0 isn't even a candidate for OROY on his own team. That running back they've got, think his name is Al Morrison, he's been more impressive.
Bottom line, in a few years, the 2012 darft will be remembered for great qbs like Luck and to a lesser extent Wilson, Tannehill and even Foles (maybe), but not for anyone wearing burgundy and yellow. Hell I would even take Kirt Cousins over AS 2.0 because he's a more pure quarterback in the end.
Time will tell, and it usually tells I'm right. You'll see.
See, when people say things like that I never know if I should take them seriously, because it just looks like you're trolling. If you're not then you don't really understand what you're watching and trying to explain it would be a bit pointless.
How many Super Bowl winning QBs need to explain the Redskins offense before random people on the internet quit referring to it as a "gimmick" offense?
This is just getting boring.
Let him run. The hits will continue and it won't be pretty.
He's not playing vs the browns Sunday
Yes, but all of those injuries are isolated incidents that happened after years of playing the position. RG3 has already been sidelined for running multiples times during his first year. Looks like he's about to miss at least a game, too. This doesn't bode well for his career going forward.
You're missing the point. Brady and Palmer's injuries didn't happen because they were older, they would've happened regardless if they were rookies or ten year veterans. No one takes a helmet on the knee like that and plays another game that season. Romeo's collarbone didn't break because he was old.
The argument that Griffin will have a shortened career will have a much better answer after next year. Over the off season he will spend a lot of time improving his slide, and his situational awareness. I think we saw a huge improvement in his use of the sideline after his Atlanta hit. Likewise, assuming this hit ultimately did little damage, it should have shown him the dangers of crossing into the middle of the field.
Let's not forget that he's a rookie, so a lot of these situations are the first time he's seeing the speed and power of NFL defenses. Most people here are expecting a sophomore slump, but I have high hopes that he will use his intelligence, and keep working with KS to improve the offense next year, though he may see his passer rating dip below 100.0 during his "slump".
Improving his slide? I don't think I can live on this planet anymore.
By all means... go away.
I'll get right on that now I have your endorsement.